Mini 1732 - Super Smash Bros. Project M(afia) - D7!

[smiffle]

wait a minute... this isn't melee???
/confirm for a game that's not melee
hope my tech game still works

ninjas

[smiffle]

theyre both good games, i wouldn't go as far to say one is better than the other, but w/e
to each their own

[smiffle]

Wow, this game has bad form. No one talking about my "every VT should cliam" claim? For shame!

Vote: Lickety

why should everyone do that? is there strategic value or something?

[smiffle]

Wow, this game has bad form. No one talking about my "every VT should cliam" claim? For shame!

Vote: Lickety

why should everyone do that? is there strategic value or something?

No, its a bad play. Interesting that you comment on it so after the fact.

VOTE: smiffle

im confused, you vote me for voting you for suggesting something that no one should do but you did anyway?

[smiffle]

Wow, this game has bad form. No one talking about my "every VT should cliam" claim? For shame!

On this topic, does anyone have a triforce? This a highly important question.

i don't have one, but I can give one to someone.

that means you aren't vanilla

[smiffle]

shouldn't sheik have a triforce as well? she is basically zelda

[smiffle]

spoilers

[smiffle]

i could go into depth, but basically sheik is like Zelda's alt character for melee, and a separate character entirely in pm.

[smiffle]

if Dav is town, then why is my vote shit? riddle me this

[smiffle]

let me rephrase: why does Dav think my vote is shit?

[smiffle]

oh, makes sense

[smiffle]

Actually your vote is quite good. Saw vc.

if its not bad, then whats good about it?
should i know the answer to this question myself?

[smiffle]

cool, im glad we had this mutual feeling

[smiffle]

if Dav is town, then why is my vote shit? riddle me this

I like my vote currently.

but why?

[smiffle]

p-much yes

[smiffle]

if Dav is town, then why is my vote shit? riddle me this

I like my vote currently.

but why?

Because it created a BW on me that at least one scum is on.

i don't know about that...

hey, everyone vote lickety so he can find scum more easily, lol

[smiffle]

Is that manzelda???

Okay I read this as Mandela for a second and now I'm just thinking "Nelson Manzelda" and giggling like an idiot

I need sleep I'm actually going now

Nelson Mandela 4 smash confirmed

[smiffle]

if Dav is town, then why is my vote shit? riddle me this

I like my vote currently.

but why?

Because it created a BW on me that at least one scum is on.

i don't know about that...

hey, everyone vote lickety so he can find scum more easily, lol

What if I'm jester or something?

considering whats led up to this, id say thats a crock of shit, and you're just toying with the idea because you're scum

[smiffle]

Pretty early to be sure, wouldn't you say?

BTW how the heck would you know I'm scum with no meta on me based on the way I have played so far?

pretty early to spout bs too, oh wait, its never too early for that

meta sucks. try playing au natural with no dumb outside influence.
i only use it if im absolutely conflicted over something, or i need to confirm something someone else has claimed about an individual

[smiffle]

Pretty early to be sure, wouldn't you say?

BTW how the heck would you know I'm scum with no meta on me based on the way I have played so far?

pretty early to spout bs too, oh wait, its never too early for that

meta sucks. try playing au natural with no dumb outside influence.
i only use it if im absolutely conflicted over something, or i need to confirm something someone else has claimed about an individual

Good so this is either an alt or you have played on another site. glad you have some experience.

what is up with the stupid bait question?
are you trying to gain an edge or something? or is it just to see "lets see how much i can trick this dumbass, hehehe, baiting iz kewl"
and thats the second instance of dumb baiting you've tried pull so far, and its only page four.

[smiffle]

wait, it gets better

VOTE: GuiltyLion cuz I think their throwing us a line.

says the guy baiting shit left and right

[smiffle]

@lick w/e man, all this bait, and lots of biting go hand in hand, but why open your game with that?
it just doesnt seem smart to do so
what is your "perfectly good reason"?

[smiffle]

hold up, so you tried having all vt's claim their role in order to get scum votes on your wagon?

[smiffle]

truthfully, i just thought it was dumb you brought it up in the first place, and then brought it up a second time after that

if you weren't trying to get scum to vote for you, what was the point of the bait?

[smiffle]

considering the fact that mario hasnt done shit except walk into the thread, see an argument, and take a side at his digression, i can see why tails finds him scummy

[smiffle]

w a g o n s h i f t

[smiffle]

i nominate MarioManiac4 for this years scummy award

he deserves it. he just fucking deserves it.

[smiffle]

Read somewhere that proof-reading your posts would make people take you more seriously.

I thought that MS' "BTOOM" thing was a dayvig of sorts. Was wondering how Ascetic relates to the % mechanic, since according to OP there are no standard kills.

I'm pretty sure it's super straight forward. Percentage hits, but nothing else does.

Come on Dav, you have to know how an ascetic works.

[smiffle]

And where is smiffle exactly?

what do people think of day chat for Scum here?

I'm here for you. Come to papa my little scum.

No, but seriously, what is this:

People I like as Town here:

Dave
Ms OR GL
MM

Lickety, why are your reads kind of jank? Dav's meh, Mario's voting me, but I kinda got a thing for his claim, and Ms is dicking around with his mini wagon on anyone tails votes for, but he's barely pushed anything unlike tails. Idk about Gl. I should probably close reads his posts more closely.

[smiffle]

But idk because usually it's "all actions hit except kills" but it's unclear if the whole % thing is classed as kills or not

anywho

let's move on

Pretty sure it said percent leads to death, but w/e

Moving on to you, Dav, who're your top three scum reads atm.

Mine are Lickety, who I'll cover more in depth later.

You

And possibly MS, but who knows about him. My mind is hazy.

[smiffle]

People who target me get no result or their action fails
Pedit: You really don't

But I do have a guess.

Cool!
Wouldn't even mind you revealing your guess. After all, NoNormalKills.

Scum could have daychat. Also could not

Useless spec is useless.

And just to be clear, your role is "3-shot ascetic with a twist?"

[smiffle]

All VT's should claim BTW.

I'm VT.

No, its a bad play. Interesting that you comment on it so after the fact.

ofc I'm trolling. Why do you ask?

What if I'm jester or something?

Pretty early to be sure, wouldn't you say?

BTW how the heck would you know I'm scum with no meta on me based on the way I have played so far?

Stop saying I'm obvtown unless you don't care if I get NKed early.

You can't be serious with this. I'f I am not playing a game solvey playstyle I don't know what is! I'm actually trying to play as obtown as possible.

That last quote is pretty clearly contradictory with the others, but IMO it reads like Lickety's trying to get noticed contradicting himself. If we lynch him and he's a jester, would that end the game? If so, I'd rather that people with percentage abilities pseudo-vig him.

Either way though, I'd rather lynch this today:

if Dav is town, then why is my vote shit? riddle me this

'cause you saw an opportunity to vote and you grabbed it. It doesn't look like you genuinely found it scummy. You didn't prod or poke or ask questions about it before voting, you just voted.

I don't buy this. Davsto has been around long enough that I'm pretty sure he's seen townies vote without asking questions. It reads like he's trying to capitalize on smiffle for not following the hypothetical Big Book of Rules For Good Little Townies. Combine that with the fact that Davsto didn't prod or poke smiffle before voting him (or even during or after, for that matter!) and I really have a hard time thinking that this is something Davsto honestly believes.

VOTE: Davsto

Someone's town af.

What does lickety have to gain by contradicting himself other than trying to get himself lynched? Are you implying that any votes on him are bad choices as well?

Lol @ the Dav vote, I kinda like it, but it's probably based off more than early votes atm.

[smiffle]

when someone who has % gains % they die.

So if someone is hit twice, they die.
Good to know.

[smiffle]

Looks like professor Homeboy is finally playing. Or is the ease off from pressure feeling pretty good right now?

Yeah, I do feel pretty good. There is no pressure on me btw, just some shitty votes.
How does the imminent pressure on your slot feel?

I'm assuming pretty bad. Speaking of assuming, wth was up with the immediate assumption Dav was a killing role after he mentioned kills?

The leaps and bounds in your logic are... lets just say "hard to follow"

p-edit at lickety, when did I promise a case? I'm just here to ask you some insightful questions, and go over some of the things you said, pal.

[smiffle]

I read my ISO. I am actually really scummy right now. I have reasons, but I don't think people are picking up on them?

You are one funny guy Lickety.

[smiffle]

well you (obviously) but Lickety is rubbing me the wrong way too and I think you're both scum but I really don't see you both being scum.
Don't currently have a third. Will have no time to stuff tomorrow morning so expect some more in a longer while.

"Hmmm, they're both scummy, but their both trying to put one another on the guillotine, so idk."

Please, don't discredit your own reads any further. Just tell it like it is.

[smiffle]

Lickety 204 - takes Ascetic role claim at its word

Lickety 206 - accuses Davsto for accepting Ascetic role claim at its word

This is another glaring contradiction from Lickety in addition to the ones you guys have caught. I'm inclined to believe he's intentionally planting them at this point. Definitely agree that he should be vigged/%'d, and I have a townread on All Alone for approaching it with that mindset.

Tails and Metal Sonic votes on him are bad but I don't think

both

are scum.

Is one more scummy than the other? (please say Sonic)

Gl, specifically, what about Davsto do you like or not like atm. He's pretty ambivalent with his reads...

[smiffle]

I wanna say that LQ is scum but honestly I still prefer whatsisname I'm voting (sue me) and I still think there's a chance that LQ is just dim, to put it politely. He seems genuine in believing I should be able to summon more about that ascetic.

Hey, considering that All Alone pointed out the terrible reason you voted me to begin with, why are you still on my wagon?

[smiffle]

Xtomx, is this a stupid question?

Nah, but do you scumread Lion? Sounds like it to me.

[smiffle]

Oh yeah, and one part of my role is miller. On top of the usual guilty investigations thing, it seems like I'll show up as having visited a random person who died each night.

Sleepwalker is a role I haven't heard of in a long time. Miller-sleepwalker sounds pretty believable actually, although it's an odd combo.

Why Lickety is scum and you should vote him:
1.) He's hedging his bets. (MS or GL? Seriously? You couldn't just say you had 4 scumreads? You had to limit the amount you had? Seems fake.)
2.) He's fishing and only focused on roles and mechanics. No scumhunting from him whatsoever. This is metagaming at its finest. It's filler.
3.) He's spreading suspicion everywhere and keeping his options open. Look at the last 2 pages and see how many people he's called suspect.

Now lynch the obv. scum.

For me, 1st reason translates into: he just has plain bad reads.
2nd reason is actually quite valid, he's so far planted his vote on me, and hasn't done shit except say how bad my reasons for voting him are, and try to bait anything that's everything. He keeps doing a ton of useless spec too. Trying to outguess the mod or w/e. I have strong bias on meta gaming people, so that's the nullish part of the reason.
3rd reason sounds like you think he's opportunistic, but that's basically your first reason. Point out to me multiple instances of him being opportunistic than maybe that'll support what you're saying.

[smiffle]

I wanna say that LQ is scum but honestly I still prefer whatsisname I'm voting (sue me) and I still think there's a chance that LQ is just dim, to put it politely. He seems genuine in believing I should be able to summon more about that ascetic.

Hey, considering that All Alone pointed out the terrible reason you voted me to begin with, why are you still on my wagon?

I tend to trust myself more than I trust others whose alignments I am unaware of. Not because I think I'm "better", but because I know my reads come from a town perspective. I have no idea on All Alone's motives.

So you're defending your reason for voting me on the first or second page of the game? There's pretty much nothing redeeming about it at all.
Don't push that town perspective bs on me. I didn't ask you to trust All alone and unvote, I only want to know why your still voting me in this instance of time and space.

[smiffle]

It's also that I know he's capable of better than this so him starting awkwardly like he has is concerning.

So it's one part meta, one part gut, and one part he's been popping into the thread to say some stuff then leaving?

[smiffle]

1.) Want to know a secret? In my first 16 games I was lynched day 1 8 times.

Why drop the self meta? No one cares.
Are you trying to say you're just inherently scummy, thus implying I should unvote you for being so? That's the worst defense I've ever heard.

[smiffle]

I wanna say that LQ is scum but honestly I still prefer whatsisname I'm voting (sue me) and I still think there's a chance that LQ is just dim, to put it politely. He seems genuine in believing I should be able to summon more about that ascetic.

Hey, considering that All Alone pointed out the terrible reason you voted me to begin with, why are you still on my wagon?

I tend to trust myself more than I trust others whose alignments I am unaware of. Not because I think I'm "better", but because I know my reads come from a town perspective. I have no idea on All Alone's motives.

So you're defending your reason for voting me on the first or second page of the game? There's pretty much nothing redeeming about it at all.
Don't push that town perspective bs on me. I didn't ask you to trust All alone and unvote, I only want to know why your still voting me in this instance of time and space.

Probably because you didn't exactly have a strong start.

Pot

meets

Kettle.

[smiffle]

I want a single read by the time the (real) day is over. I'ts 5pm now.

I already said All Alone is a townread. Liking Mario as town too. If you want weak scumleans, I'm thinking at least one of Davsto, Metal Sonic, or Tails is scum, but I'm not gonna advocate to lynch any of them yet. I prefer watching and evaluating early wagons rather than being on them.

IMO it's a lot easier for scum to dress up a bunch of bs on someone and "sort" them as town or scum. I get that fence-sitting and not expressing oneself makes you less transparent, but I refuse to give strong reads when I don't fully believe in them. People will keep scumreading me for it in the early game, I'll use that assess whether their intentions are honest or not, and I'll prove them wrong as the game goes on.

Alright, alright, I kind of like these reads...
I want more, so much more from All Alone.

For that second paragraph, you're basically saying: instead of doing some good ol scumhunting, I'm going to watch this one from afar for the meantime while you guys juke it out and look scummy for it in the process?

It's not early game anymore. We've come pretty far, but w/e... your reads are pretty good, but I expect you to get your head in the game.

What do you think about this Xtomx?

[smiffle]

1.) Want to know a secret? In my first 16 games I was lynched day 1 8 times.

Why drop the self meta? No one cares.
Are you trying to say you're just inherently scummy, thus implying I should unvote you for being so? That's the worst defense I've ever heard.

Well apparently you missed the freaking huge-gigantic-over-the-top banner I flew so high they would see it from a half mile, but if you want to interpret that as me saying, "I'm always scum therefore I'm always Town" go right ahead.

So you're really saying you just want to bite the bullet and get lynched because you don't care?

The real flaw is in your strategy, my friend.

[smiffle]

It's also that I know he's capable of better than this so him starting awkwardly like he has is concerning.

So it's one part meta, one part gut, and one part he's been popping into the thread to say some stuff then leaving?

That's not really it.

Yes part meta, he's made a few bad posts, and it's the best i've seen so far to go on. This ultimately more of a 'do stuff' push, but if stuff doesn't transpire i'm going to assume this is his scumgame.

I'm not loving what Tails is doing, i'm not townreading Sonic but other than that i'm basically town reading/leaning the significant posters thus far.

P-edit: smiffle, #282 is probably Lions best post of the game so far, no problems with that one.

Wait, so Xtom, you want him to do more, but he defends himself saying that doing less is how he usually plays, but you're fine with this?

And by saying you have no problems with his post, does that mean you agree with a majority of the reads on it?

[smiffle]

Thanks for the clarification Xtomx.
I would follow this up by asking for some reads, but I can tell you need some time to be certain, just like GL.

Question to the world: Where is Asp...?

Also, does Nana have any reads? lol

[smiffle]

10 cents say Gendaberry reads All alone town. lol.

Metal Sonic's "lazy fuck" jab was kind of uncalled for, but w/e.

Lickety, just to be fully clear, you're voting Mario because he didn't want to give you his reads?

[smiffle]

not the most immature either, fortunately

/off topic, but I will pay money to the person who searches night and day for the most immature thing Ms has ever said.

(actually, I'm broke. No money, just brownie points.)

[smiffle]

talk about a NY times bestseller. I'd read that shit cover to cover.

[smiffle]

Vote Lickity

Srs vote.

Hey Alone!

hehehe

(psst tails, what's your read on All Alone?)

(don't tell anyone, but I actually read all alone as town.)

(psst tails, I just iso'd you, you should step outside the lickety, mario box and interact with other players as well)

(psst tails, so far the only town read I've seen in your iso is me, and that's not very reassuring)

(psst tails, you've barely acknowledged your partner in crime, Ms, even though they've sheeped every single vote you've made in the entire game)

[smiffle]

(psst, ms, you're right, and I'm a dumb-ass)

But seriously, what is up with Nana? Will she only respond if we vote her?
The vote count blatantly states she has a vote, so it has to be triggered by something...
Is she like an auto-hammer? lol, puns

[smiffle]

So, Asp needs to get shot by the vig real soon.

Seems like GL defaulted to a pretty poor vote on Davsto,

Eh, I missed that triforce bit from Davsto the first time around. I remember his vote being poor but I just reread his ISO and overall it's not as bad as I thought it was gonna be. But he still hasn't done much scumhunting and I want to see what happens to the gamestate when I put my vote here.

Wtf is this? An experiment? "Let's all vote Dav and see what happens, hur dur." This isn't AP chemistry. Plus now you just sound really uncertain of your vote. The vote that you appeared to put down because you wanted to see what would happen if you put a naked vote in the thread on page 17. What did you want to see happen? What were you even expecting?

Half of this reason is moot now:

Reasoning for my davsto vote is simply that he's voting for a townread and that another townread is voting him.

Other than the fact that this is a really weak reason, it's now half a weak reason, which isn't even a reason at all. That just makes it sheeping at this point.

On a side note, in 387, it sounds like you're trying to read lickety as town, but then you threw a giant fence on those reasons and proceeded to sit on it:

I don't see it as town, I just don't see it as particularly scum either. If we all played like you and Tails right now, we'd run up a wagon on 'obvscum' LQ, then if/when he flipped town (which is likely given sheer probability), we'd be left with virtually no significant information.

That last part is also untrue, as practically everyone in the game has already made substantial interactions with Lickety, or they've given an actual read on him, except for maybe you.

[smiffle]

Lickety's wagon has four votes on it right now, (I'm pretty certain), despite that, it kind of lost some steam ever since Lickety decided to lay off a bit. I don't know what to think about his, "hey guys, I'm going to try and save myself by painting myself as town." approach. It could be for either right or wrong reasons. However, I do get some bad vibes off his unvote, that was probably performed due to pressure. I really wish I could be voting both Lickety and GL at the moment.

[smiffle]

I don't like the sudden movement of some players to throw doubt on the Alive townread or to scumread ALL the players on Lickity. Alive is the towniest person in the game besides me. As for the Lickity wagon scumreads, that's the only thing that makes me think Lickity might be town.

I saw Liskety's recent stance on all alone and it reminded me of this. Lick's stance is for the wrong reason, but I was going to mention how Dav's recent unvote and vote on GL has made him seem a little more townish. Alone's vote on Dav is pretty much old news for an even older reason anyway. I'd say Alone is only a tad town at this point.

I like how you responded to my quiet message, I think you might've doubled your post count in recent pages, and the posts are decent too.

I sense the slightest distancing from this post towards a person who's been nothing but devoted to you for the majority of the game:

Sonic, I wouldn't worry about me if I were you. I have this handled.

There's not really anything to conclude from it, just that your relationship with Sonic is looking a bit one-way.
(like it's always been, hehehe)

[smiffle]

An experiment? "Let's all vote Dav and see what happens, hur dur." This isn't AP chemistry. Plus now you just sound really uncertain of your vote. The vote that you appeared to put down because you wanted to see what would happen if you put a naked vote in the thread on page 17. What did you want to see happen? What were you even expecting?

Yeah, it is an experiment. I didn't ask for anyone else to vote him. I am uncertain of my vote, and I will happily admit this!

I wanted to see Davsto's reaction ("your vote on me is bad, therefore I will vote you"), as well as the reactions of others. You've correctly identified it was a naked and weak vote. Does that make me scum?

You still haven't answered my question. What was the point of your vote on Davsto? Did you really just want him to OMGUS vote you? Why would you go headfirst into a situation like that just to see what happens? Does his vote on you affirm your scum read on him? It's not making sense to me.
There's ulterior motive written all over that vote, and it rubs me in the worst way possible.

That last part is also untrue, as practically everyone in the game has already made substantial interactions with Lickety, or they've given an actual read on him, except for maybe you.

Show me where Klick, ASP, Wanderer, Gendaberry have made "substantial interactions" with Lickety. Theoretically that can be an entire scumteam just lurking this out on the sides while town rips itself up in the process. And then you have some players like Xtomx who just throw out a townread on LQ but that's it, as well as players like MM who claimed LQ was a townread but then decided to vote him for no logical reason a few pages later.

I'm just annoyed that somehow LQ, who is a player who has proven himself consistently hard to read correctly and has been mislynched on D1 many times, is becoming the main focus of the game so far. I'd rather poke around and figure how to read the other players before we go driving up a lynch on one that I haven't sorted yet.

To be perfectly honest, I unconsciously put the inactives/lurkers in the vig-kill pile, except for maybe Genda. Once some of them get replaced, (which will probably happen soon), and they've started to actually play, then will you have a clear read on lickety? Time will tell. I can explain the Lickety votes to you right now: I've never played a game with Lickety before, and, since meta is terrible, looking up his meta would be an enormous waste of time. I can tell you this: he's scummy in this game right now, and that's all that matters.

p-edit: speak of the devil

[smiffle]

I just read everyone's iso because I had a hard time remembering which posts went with which players reading it all in game-context.
I have a townread on smiffle and I don't know why people are scumreading him (btw smiffle, you don't have a vote out atm)
I'm not really sure what to think about LQ and GL. I'm troubled by GL's defending of LQ in his 387, even though GL isn't saying LQ is town, he also isn't saying he is scum, but it still is a fairly defensive post overall regarding LQ and that doesn't work with his prior attitude towards him (which was rather critical, as if he was scumreading LQ)
LQ looks scummy to me, but I don't think the 2 are scum together (I believe I read this somewhere already as well, don't remember who said it, Davsto?) Is it possible we're in a multiball?

Wanderer, check yourself before you wreck yourself, my first vote's been pinned on Lickety this whole time.

Now that you mention it, multiball might be entirely possible. It's still much too early to say.

[smiffle]

Hey wanderer, you should vote.

Xtomx is quick to pull a trigger I see.

[smiffle]

Xtomx, who were you voting before you voted wanderer? I forget.

Mod

pretty please may we have a vote count?

[smiffle]

Aside from Wanderer being high af, lol,

241 and 271 asking different players for reads, 343 asking another player for more reads.

Asking for reads is not scumhunting. It's busywork.

This makes me want to ask tails for a reads list.

[smiffle]

Lion, the vote still doesn't make a whole lot of sense, but I see we are at an impasse, so meh. Your strategy is really time-based and dependent on the collective town. I can't wait for everyone else, so I make my own decisions and roll with them.

You're promising a whole lot. I hope you deliver.

To follow this up: now that you have your vote on Dav, now what? Are you going to push him?

[smiffle]

All alone, what's your read on Gl?

[smiffle]

Take it easy, bro

Glad to see you're making amends to end your lurking.

[smiffle]

Nothing really inspiring for me to comment on in the first place.

I may be sheeping Xt if they catch scum early this game but will have to feel it out first.

Too early to say a lot on wanderer. They're attempting to enter the game on a good note, but it was really enh... Xtomx called scum and voted that asap, I say wait till the guy even gets a vote on the board before judging him that harshly.

@Lickity: Why are you refusing to answer my questions?

Really? What questions am I avoiding answering?

The problem with this post and the fact that GL didn't make a stance on me is that they weren't even going to provide reads until I asked them for one read and then they preceded to give a read on almost half the game. I feel GL is prolly avoiding pressure but don't know if this means he is Town or Scum here.

I'm a bit slow to offer a lot of meaningful thoughts until I have them, but I have tried to answer every question/argument thrown my way. If you feel I'm avoiding pressure, feel free to give me more of it.
Currently do not want to lynch {All Alone, smiffle, Metal Sonic, probablyyyy Xtomx} today. MM is mostly in that bloc too although his posts today have been ridiculous.

That's my point exactly. You've responded to everything, even minor stuff. I see that as not wanting pressure on you.

Not lynching Xt is pretty obvious and the fact that you even have doubt about this is a little off putting.

I see that as just being thorough.

The last sentence is a bit incoherent, but it seems you're concerned that he has doubt on Xt because he's your town read...
Not much there.

That's my point exactly. You've responded to everything, even minor stuff. I see that as not wanting pressure on you.

Walk me through this one. I'm responding to things people ask me or things people say about me, therefore that's scummy? Would I look more town to you if I just lurked it out?

I'm glad your asking about this because it would be highly Sus if you didn't. Basically I'm saying that because you have responded to everything means that you are not wanting to look rebellious (terrible word here, but I hope the point is known).

Also, I'm not really saying it is Scummy, just something to be aware of. I do actually have you as a Town lean currently.

I just ask about this because I think it should be covered. It may just be a playstyle thing and not indicative of alignment but it help to know this stuff since it could be means for a meta read if you do it as only Scum or only Town.

Again, GL is just being thorough. He even said in a response to me that he's trying to answer all the questions to the best of his ability at this point in the game. I don't really see that as a scum read, let alone a base for a meta read.

Your line of questioning is pretty meh...

[smiffle]

I'm having trouble interpreting All Alone's post, instead of someone translating it to me, it would be cool if he could show up and make an actual post instead of the same repeated thing tacked onto a bunch of quotes.

[smiffle]

@Smiffle, would it be better if I ask obvious questions to ask? If I do that you might say that they are obvious questions so they are meh. I take an alternative approach and I think you think in terms too black and white tbh. It makes it seem like if I ask a question that doesn't have to do with immediately solving who Scum/Town are that its a bad question, and its really not.

I will also say that me, as a person, do not like doing the run of the mill type stuff. I rather be a little weird than be perfectly normal and that is reflected in my play in the game of mafia as well.

Last thing to say here. I like asking unpredictable/not normal questions because its a lot harder for Scum to know how to answer them.

PEdit: OK, so it looks like since someone agrees with you it makes them town. Noted.

Weird an unexpected questions are fine if they catch scum off-guard. It really depends on how you interpret the answer/ what you expected the answer to be.
That exchange of posts just seemed bland and dead-end. They don't strike me as odd, nor do they look like anything that could result in you finding something alignment indicative.

Being direct with people is good too, ya know.

[smiffle]

Why am I discussing strategy/theory anyway?

Now that's a good question.

[smiffle]

I admit, it was a bit derailing, but w/e

Back to the game, looking at some of Dav's recent posts: why is he all touchy-feely? F.I.: he was all like: "it makes me nervous when people get my meta wrong." or "there was this one vote that made me worried." I think there are other instances of this, but no one actually cares, Dav, unless you do something about it.

It's not even AtE, it's just him being awkward at explaining himself. Why is he even explaining himself?

[smiffle]

It's not even a meta question, it's just a question of "what reason does he have to be weird right now?"

inb4 dav ur weird

[smiffle]

Dav's kinda passive right now, I want to see him actually do some shit.

[smiffle]

Dav's kinda passive right now, I want to see him actually do some shit.

oh wait, lots of people in this game are passive. w/e

[smiffle]

Dav's kinda passive right now, I want to see him actually do some shit.

oh wait, lots of people in this game are passive. w/e

mafia scum is shitting on me atm by being slow

[smiffle]

Dav's kinda passive right now, I want to see him actually do some shit.

oh wait, lots of people in this game are passive. w/e

mafia scum is shitting on me atm by being slow

[smiffle]

fuck

mod, plz clean up

[smiffle]

No thx

Thnx mod, ur bae

[smiffle]

Nana is being prodded.

lol wut

[smiffle]

Yeah, Lickety's taking the backseat approach to this game atm, and it's probably due to pressure.

[smiffle]

Sooooooo, does this mean Nana isn't a mod alt? Or is von just fucking with us.

[smiffle]

#whenyourscumreadcallsyoutown

It's a pretty weird reason for Lickety to town read me. Out of context, it looks like he's reaching for this townread on me in attempt to salvage the game for him.
But he's done a boat-load of weird stuff this game, so I don't even know.

[smiffle]

Could be a mod alt but a co-mod or a friend.

Or a scum controls it?

yo, that's a thought and a half

[smiffle]

Actually...
Wouldn't they be using it more?
Controlling an entirely different entity in a game has to be useful in some way or another.

[smiffle]

Dav enters the game again and doesn't do shit.

Also, Nana is lurking: "Last visited:Sat Oct 24, 2015 11:24 am"

Even though he'll deny it, GL scumreads Wanderer.

Lickety says some shit about him being honest and supports it with his janky vote on MarioManiac earlier in the thread, which was literally this:

VOTE: Mario

TRANSCRIPT OF TODAY:
Mario: MS, Tails and smiffles are scum
Lickety: What are your reads?
Mario: ...
Lickety: VOTE MARIO

I still don't even know about Wanderer, although GL is pretty damn convincing.

Apparently, a bunch of people know firebringer, thus a bunch of people have experience with him, thus he has experience with a bunch of other people. Can't wait to see the reads once he actually shows up.

/non-related: P.S. my tech game in melee is rusty af, and I have to play in a tourny in November. I can't wait to get creamed.

[smiffle]

Did anyone have anything directed towards me that I need to address?

hey, hey, hey, hey, what are your reads?
Who are you going to vote?
Are you a cpu?
If not, who do you main?

[smiffle]

Oh yeah, and one part of my role is miller. On top of the usual guilty investigations thing, it seems like I'll show up as having visited a random person who died each night.

Sleepwalker is a role I haven't heard of in a long time. Miller-sleepwalker sounds pretty believable actually, although it's an odd combo.

Why Lickety is scum and you should vote him:
1.) He's hedging his bets. (MS or GL? Seriously? You couldn't just say you had 4 scumreads? You had to limit the amount you had? Seems fake.)
2.) He's fishing and only focused on roles and mechanics. No scumhunting from him whatsoever. This is metagaming at its finest. It's filler.
3.) He's spreading suspicion everywhere and keeping his options open. Look at the last 2 pages and see how many people he's called suspect.

Now lynch the obv. scum.

For me, 1st reason translates into: he just has plain bad reads.
2nd reason is actually quite valid, he's so far planted his vote on me, and hasn't done shit except say how bad my reasons for voting him are, and try to bait anything that's everything. He keeps doing a ton of useless spec too. Trying to outguess the mod or w/e. I have strong bias on meta gaming people, so that's the nullish part of the reason.
3rd reason sounds like you think he's opportunistic, but that's basically your first reason. Point out to me multiple instances of him being opportunistic than maybe that'll support what you're saying.

Lick, it should read like this.

[smiffle]

@Smiffle, what's your read on me rn?

I don't know about the Genda push, Lick. It's good to see that you're actually scum hunting right now, but ennnnhhhhhh... it's in the wrong place, and it's a bit out of the blue. Plus it looks a bit like omgus considering they voted recently, also, looking at your response to their vote, why did you just brush them off only to come back and vote them? Who does that?
Quick note: Miller-sleepwalker claim makes the mod look like a sadist. Lets say every night, just for spec, Gendra visits a person who dies. She appears guilty from investigations, and she'd be seen at the spot of the crime. Now that's a bastard role if I ever saw one. Considering this is a bastard game, I'm slightly inclined to believe her.
Considering all this, your push on her has reasons, but I don't think they're really good ones. You do look scummy for it, but not overly scummy.

p-edit: Fuck it, Lickety, you made me write all of this only to unvote her. What's up with the quick back-down? You wanted to come out here with a confident push, but you were pretty quick to retract it after Xtom and Genda shot it down...

[smiffle]

Oh wait, Genda's a dude. srry fam

[smiffle]

There's always multiple ways to deal with everything. Why didn't you just get back to Genda on his vote like you said you were going to do instead of responding with a vote of your own?
There's an alternate way to deal with something...

[smiffle]

It'd be arbitrary to ask Genda's read on Lickety, so instead, Genda, what's your read on Xtom for his indifference toward your role at first, and eventual defense?

[smiffle]

Even though it doesn't matter, I calculated our activity constant and found it to be: 30.89
553^2/(5*1980)=30.8898

This town is actually pretty active.

[smiffle]

We just need to hear more from everyone in general.

(actual posts, not spam)

[smiffle]

Hmmm, kay.

But does that translate into you reading him town?
Also, what do you think of the wall above?

[smiffle]

[smiffle]

I don't know about Nana being obviously non-town, but I can understand the uncertainty about her role. So far, Nana, Popo, and Genda's role appear to be bastard parts of this game.
Going into a bastard game, there's always the question of "how bastard" the game is, and Nana is currently the uncertainty I see regarding this.
It's good that MM finally had the balls to vote the slot.

[smiffle]

All alone, what's your read on Gl?

GuiltyLion is probably town IMO. I like his vote on Davsto as well as his post about Wanderer, and I don't really think it's contradictory or scummy for him to "defend" Lickety while having a null read on him. If there's a huge wagon on someone and you don't have a read on them, you better be doing something to get a read on them, and questioning the people pushing the wagon is a reasonable way to do that. That makes more sense to me than any scum motive for his play today regardless of Lickety's alignment.

As far as Lickety goes, I'm increasingly okay with lynching him today. Part of that is I looked up jester games on this site and found that jesters never once ended the game when lynched, and part of that is that jesters are really rare on this site, even in bastard mod games, so most likely he's probably just scum. Davsto is still my top scumread though.

Awesome.

[smiffle]

Dav, what is that even a picture of? An underground tunnel?
To stop you from defending everything anyone asks you, what's your read on Firebringer's entry to the thread?

[smiffle]

Does anyone other then Dav have any sort of read on Firebringer?
He has, so far, brought no fire to this thread.

[smiffle]

Let's try this again, Dav.
Do you happen to have a read on Metal Sonic by any chance?

[smiffle]

Cool, cool, Fire, have you finished reading by any chance?

[smiffle]

Like a good neighbour, vonflame is there: with a votecount, plz.
I'm starting to forget who's voting whom.

[smiffle]

More like golddigger.

[smiffle]

i missed the claim. hes very likely town due to that.

I know, and its a PL if the claim is bogus right?

Mixed feelings on this one.

What kind of feelings are mixed?

[smiffle]

Unvote
Vote Mario

@Lickety: Do you still have a Wanderer townread?

This vote is a bit out of the blue for me, was it catalyzed by him trying to push Nana over practically nothing?

Also, what does "field test" mean in regards to Genda? And why is that post even directed at Alone?

[smiffle]

Holy shit, Asp, I hope you feel better.

[smiffle]

Did anyone else find Xtom's defense of Genda suspicious? I thought it was kind of weird how he was defending him without even having seen his claim, and then defended him even more when he had.
Maybe I'm just paranoid, I had pretty much no problem with Xt until that point.

[smiffle]

i missed the claim. hes very likely town due to that.

Honestly, the whole thing felt unnecessary coming from Xt. Why defend a lurker who you had barely any, if not no interaction with when somebody votes them out of the blue? He hadn't even read his claim. But his very first post, his very first post regarding this:

between the 4 lurkers i kinda think gendas posts arent that bad? i'd be ok wagoning any of them, though

This post reads with uncertainty regarding Genda's posts (question mark?), indifference towards whether or not he'd even be up to lynching them, and basically setting himself up for a swing either to defense or a vote in the posts proceeding this one.

It's barely enough to warrant a vote on Xt, but ennnhhhhhh...

[smiffle]

he explicitly told me ganondorf was safe to claim

But doesn't that do against his rule in the op about the mod never lying to us?

[smiffle]

Von is an upstanding guy, I don't think he'd screw-up that badly.

Why would he tell you it's a safeclaim when that's in direct violation of his policy? If Sonic has dibs that anyone who claims Ganon is scum, then wouldn't he be lying that that's a safeclaim?

[smiffle]

This game is bastard. I make no guarantee for game balance, role balance, or your sanity.

However, the mod will never lie to you.

[smiffle]

Von

you'd never lie to us, right buddy?

[smiffle]

rechecked my pms and it's not so explicit as i thought, but he made it sound like what i had was ok to claim.

So, just to be clear, he specifically said the flavour you received on your role pm was safe to claim?
If you were actually throwing in the towel on this game, and calling for a lynch on yourself, why didn't you just claim your flavour straight out instead of asking for a safeclaim?

[smiffle]

Hmmmmm...
Xtom, before we consider actually lynching you, could you give us a run down of reads on every player in the game?
It's a lot to ask, but I really want to be certain that this is the best option.

[smiffle]

Why the firebringer townread?

[smiffle]

Xt, when did you investigate Ms, as in, what specific time/day? I really need specifics here in order to get a clearer picture.

[smiffle]

I'm still hesitant on this lynch for some reason, but I can't put my finger on it.
Here's a post for Sonic:

What makes you say that?

He tried to fish for triforces earlier, and as noted only 3 flavored have triforces (even I know this), one is super bad villain

When I probed him, he couldn't answer, meaning he is bad

Guilty lion noted he was a ganon and even I know he is main evil

Flavor is not necessarily indicative of alignment. Villains can be town, and heroes can be scum.
For example, Bowser could be town, just like Mario could be mafia.

My role corresponds fairly to my flavor so yeah we'll have to expunge xtomx at some point in time


Play wise he is also following his scum meta. I have a lot of games with xtoxm already (<3) and yeah I can differentiate. Heavily leaning scum or 3rd party since he doesn't look like working with lickety and co

Did you alter your claim in anyway to try and push Xt's lynch better? I'm actually expecting this is some kind of gambity roleclaim-push you're making. Since you and Xtom have been at odds for a while, specifically you.

oh so xtoxm is ganondorf, he's scum

as guilty lion suggested


i am zelda, and i have ~abilities~

i have info that link and ganon are both scum and need to die

Where does your claim of being able to roleblock people fit into this?

@tails

Do you have hitstun? I feel that we should coordinate people to roleblock because it's only a half roleblock

[smiffle]

@Alone, concerning Dav, what do you think about him getting on the Xtom wagon recently?
I still don't know what you and tails are planning, but w/e

[smiffle]

That sucks, and is pretty dumb.

Sonic, I wish you could've responded to my post.

[smiffle]

-deleted-

(it was not game related)

-Vonflare

[smiffle]

banter, banter banter,
Genda claims miller-sleepwalker-dead-person-visitor
Banter banter banter
MarioManiac tries to make a dumb push on Nana because who knows?
Lickety dayvigs him for lolz.
Turns out he was Sk.
Banter Banter banter, questions, reads, more banter
Xtom claims survivor.
Sonic pushes his lynch with a claim of his own.
Banter and questions
Sonic gets replaced.

Started from the bottom now we're here.

[smiffle]

Fire, why are you reading me as scum?

[smiffle]

You seem to be sitting in that sweet spot a scum would want to be.

You don't seem ultra townie where you would get an extreme amount of attention, but you aren't anti town either.

You are right in middle. You have been pretty neutral throughout the game in your tone and posts, which scum tend to do as they try to get the vibe of the game and apply pressure where they see opportunities.

You push for people to contribute to get town cred, but have left yourself pretty closed of from rest of everyone with your own readability.

Thats my analysis of you.

But where am I being as opportunistic as you say?
What about me is currently neutral, (other than the fact I'm not voting atm)?
And why do you say I'm closed off to people's reads when almost everyone has said a read on me?

[smiffle]

Wanderer, are you voting Xt because it's a policy lynch?
You scumread Lickety earlier, correct? Why did you never follow up with a vote on him?

[smiffle]

I'm conflicted on Xtom. On one-hand, I think leaving him alive for a later default-lynch is a fine option, but on the other hand I approve of lynching him right now to just remove the potential obstacle entirely. I'm also up for a scum lynch instead of a third party lynch. Leaving Xt alone for now is fine with me only if I think we have a good shot of hitting scum with our lynch. Instead of defaulting to him now, default to him later. The results from that lynch will probably be more telling than everyone ganging up on him today due to the field of players being narrowed.

[smiffle]

Tails, why are all of your scumreads people who have lurked or been generally quiet in comparison to the rest of the thread?

[smiffle]

But what will we have learned from Xt's lynch if we lynch him today?
Could the town use his vote to help with lynchs?
His lynch does seem like an easy one for scum to default to, but it'll probably always be that way as long as he's in the game...
I still want some time to think about this, but I see Dav and Licks' points.

[smiffle]

Good job, Lickety.

Tails has convinced me.

[smiffle]

I Iso'd wanderer considering they're the current hot-topic of today's lynch.

i am a neutral survivor. ive approached the game in a town way and have every intention of continuing to do so.

lynch me if you want

/shrug

my ability is real and still means something, presumably.

bastard game yeah but. making someone a survivor and then telling someone else they are not town. what is the point. at least give me a safeclaim if ur gonna do that shit

just lynch me tbh

This AtE really makes me want to lynch you. Also because we're already at 30+ pages I really don't feel like looking for *actual scum* over a claimed survivor who is a PL anyway.

I find this post funny only because she's commenting on apathy with apathy of her own. Also, she hasn't done much scum hunting aside from shooting some questions at both Lickety and GL earlier toDay, and maybe some kind of interactions with Xt earlier.

Can we just freaking lynch now?

Chill wanderer, there's still some time left.

Overall, her Iso was dotted with some instances of scumhunting, but they never really went anywhere as far as a vote. She recently latched onto the Xt claim apparently due to it being a PL, and that's been their first vote the entire game. There isn't much of anything in her Iso, other than her claiming she's stoned, so I'm perfectly fine with this lynch.

VOTE: Vote: Wanderer-nl

[smiffle]

Lickety, why don't you just dayvig Xtom so we can get to lynching actual scum?
Why waste a day's lynch on him?

I think I need to re-read day 1 a little more closely, but I'm a bit V/la for this weekend. Just wanted to let you guys know.

Also, Grib comes out strong af. I'll wait a while before judging him town or not, but I have good vibes.

[smiffle]

So, from his lack of response to my earlier post, Lickety doesn't have any bullets at the moment, otherwise vigging Xt would be the obvious thing to do.
That would eliminate any fear of ika being lyncher and such, and we could use this day correctly etc, etc.

@Lickety, do you get something from hammering today as well? (a direct answer would be nice) I'm considering restacking the votes so you can if that's the case. Otherwise I'm feeling like Xt's meal tonight will be rope, but we'll see... Ika claims he's straight-up mafia, but I don't know. The one thing I'm having an issue with is the disparities between MS and Ika on the basis of what they claimed with their roles. Here's the post with the questions I had for Ms about his role just before he was replaced:

My role corresponds fairly to my flavor so yeah we'll have to expunge xtomx at some point in time


Play wise he is also following his scum meta. I have a lot of games with xtoxm already (<3) and yeah I can differentiate. Heavily leaning scum or 3rd party since he doesn't look like working with lickety and co

Did you alter your claim in anyway to try and push Xt's lynch better? I'm actually expecting this is some kind of gambity roleclaim-push you're making. Since you and Xtom have been at odds for a while, specifically you.

oh so xtoxm is ganondorf, he's scum

as guilty lion suggested


i am zelda, and i have ~abilities~

i have info that link and ganon are both scum and need to die

Where does your claim of being able to roleblock people fit into this?

@tails

Do you have hitstun? I feel that we should coordinate people to roleblock because it's only a half roleblock

With the new information of him having an all-out cop ability, (not merely a triforce cop???), I just don't know. The reason most people, (probably including me), are letting it slip is because it's a bastard game and shit happens. I would be more up in arms about his claim if this weren't a bastard game, but the thing that scares me is I'm considering letting this shit slide.

[smiffle]

Before anyone hammers, Genda, were you aware of these posts? I iso'd tails to try and glean something off of his death, and aside from looking at his interactions, this is what I pulled up:

@Alive: I want to field test Genda tonight. You in?

On an unrelated note, I should probably stop posting so much before Sonic figures out who I am.

I don't think much more needs to be said about this considering the flip. GL sounded like he was thinking of voting Alone a couple pages back, so he might want to take note of this.

Also while looking at his iso, I remembered Grib said something about him siding with Tails about their read on Lickety, when in fact, Tails' read completely shifted towards the end of the day:

PoE for me. Lickity essentially being close to conf. town and the Xtoxm reveal just blew this game wide open.

Dayvigging third-party doesn't really prove anyone "close to conf. town" imo, but w/e. The only reason I wanted to bring this up is because Grib also mentioned this:

Also, it might just be me, but with the way yesterDay played out, it

really

looks like Tails was shot for tunneling into Lickety and then townreading him later in the Day.

So far, this is pretty much the only Grib post I'm having some issues with. It's just Wine, but I don't even care.

Grib's push on Lickety is super-fucking edgy, but it's really cool at the same time. (translation: his push makes him look hella town)
Lickety dismissing the pressure from Grib to claim more about his role is kind of null, although the Lylo defense made me raise an eyebrow.
Also, him voting Fire seems a bit like a spur of the moment "oh, fuck you too" kind of thing, (despite it saying the complete opposite of that), but it has basis nonetheless. Fire was probably just a spark, (hehehe).

[smiffle]

What are people scumreading Wanderer on?
I have very Null on Wanderer, just wondering whats so scummy that their is wagon forming for.

PoE for me. Lickity essentially being close to conf. town and the Xtoxm reveal just blew this game wide open.

Oh, whoops, sorry for the misrep, GL actually recommended Xt to investigate Alone or Fire; he wasn't considering voting them. My bad.

[smiffle]

ugh, leftover quotes. I'm a mess.

[smiffle]

11 alive, 6 to hammer. Current (unofficial) votal:

o~o~o~o~o

Xtoxm (4): ika, LicketyQuickety, Firebringer, Nana

Firebringer (3): Grib, GuiltyLion, Davsto
Davsto (1): All Alone

Abstaining (3): Xtoxm, smiffle, Gendaberry
o~o~o~o~o

Don't really like Davsto's jump onto Firebringer, but if he were scum, I dunno why he wouldn't take the easy way out and play 'follow the Cop'. If Xtoxm does flip groupscum, I'd probably want to kill Davsto, or at least have ika check him.

Oh yeah, and GL voted like a minute before you did btw.

[smiffle]

What are people scumreading Wanderer on?
I have very Null on Wanderer, just wondering whats so scummy that their is wagon forming for.

PoE for me. Lickity essentially being close to conf. town and the Xtoxm reveal just blew this game wide open.

So, uh, Lickety, are you going to unvote or stay on the wagon?
What's the plan, stan?

[smiffle]

Alright, there is something fucked-up with Mafiascum right now.

[smiffle]

It keeps recycling that one quote where tails says he thinks you're conf town.

[smiffle]

Oh, thank god.

[smiffle]

IDK, I'm floating my vote right now. We are nowhere near the hammer and I rather keep thing up in the air a bit right now to keep Scum guessing.

As far as your comment on Gribs comment on why Tails was NKed I have an alternate reason: They were likely not a NA target so its a safe kill.

NKA is mostly wine, but at least that reason sounds plausible.

[smiffle]

On a side note, Dav's avy inspired me.

[smiffle]

s h o t s

[smiffle]

Before anyone hammers, Genda, were you aware of these posts? I iso'd tails to try and glean something off of his death, and aside from looking at his interactions, this is what I pulled up:

@Alive: I want to field test Genda tonight. You in?

Do you mean only this one or the others too?

Yeah, I was aware of it. Not really much to say about it though, I'm assuming he was asking for someone to test my claim during the night.

Nvm.

Genda, what's your read on Fire atm? He's being all uptight around Grib just because he's poking him a little, plus his posts are getting consistently filled with more aggro.

[smiffle]

Not your posts; smiffle's.

You read his posts and some of them made you scumread him. It'd be helpful to see them, along with your interpretation.

I'll grab the popcorn.

[smiffle]

Genda, what's your read on Fire atm? He's being all uptight around Grib just because he's poking him a little, plus his posts are getting consistently filled with more aggro.

I thought I mentioned Fire already? I scum read him to an extent due to the outbursts and being aggro because it seems pretty fake to me. It's not that strong of a read though, mostly because I recognize that I'm biased against that kind of stuff because I couldn't see myself doing it.

Actually, your stance on fire makes a whole lot of sense from the "reading his emotion" standpoint. Thnx Genda.

His stubbornness towards Grib's push and his weak push on me made me want to call him blatant scum from the get go, but I just realized my views of his fiestyness clouded my read a bit, so I rethought it after your post. I'm taking his "personality" claim at face value right now and I'm thinking he just has a volatile personality. However, that still doesn't explain why he's giving Grib such a hard time. Grib is literally asking the most simple questions and he had to repeat himself just to get a half-assed answer after a slew of posts with Fire explaining why Grib's post made him so angry. When Grib pressed him for reasons to back up his past case on me, he never delivered. This is not the first time this has happened. See exhibition A, where I asked him for specific examples of my posts that he never responded to:

You seem to be sitting in that sweet spot a scum would want to be.

You don't seem ultra townie where you would get an extreme amount of attention, but you aren't anti town either.

You are right in middle. You have been pretty neutral throughout the game in your tone and posts, which scum tend to do as they try to get the vibe of the game and apply pressure where they see opportunities.

You push for people to contribute to get town cred, but have left yourself pretty closed of from rest of everyone with your own readability.

Thats my analysis of you.

But where am I being as opportunistic as you say?
What about me is currently neutral, (other than the fact I'm not voting atm)?
And why do you say I'm closed off to people's reads when almost everyone has said a read on me?

At this point, I'm thinking his case is pretty baseless, and since Lickety doesn't want to do anything about moving off the Xt lynch, I'm going to put my vote on a slot that's actually really scummy atm.

VOTE: Firebringer

[smiffle]

It was addressed to me. One of the main reasons I'm not on the Xt wagon at the moment is because Ms/Ika's slot is collectively claiming that he's an alignment cop, a roleblocker, and that he has information on his pm of two flavours being scum, one of those including the flavour Xt claimed: Ganon. I'm finding that a bit hard to believe atm, but a voice tells me "it's a bastard game and the roles are total jank." I'm also having a bit of trouble understanding why he would cop check Xt if he already knew he was scum. That just seems like a waste to have a claimed alignment cop come out on day 2 to tell us that a guy who claimed scum is actually scum. In other words, I don't like his push, and I'd rather leave Xt for lickety to take care of if he gets his vig shots back or whatever.

[smiffle]

Checking in.

The redirector is dead, correct?

If so, Dav feels like a strong lynch today.

[smiffle]

Soooo... Dav can commute, and everyone on the FB wagon currently is a town read. There will be numerous questions for Dav when he comes back.

VOTE: FireBringer

There are at least two main reasons I'm down with lynching Fire: the first is because twice, on two different occasions, when Grib and I asked him to support his read on me with some textual support, let alone a rephrasal of his read pertaining to the current gamestate, he never delivered. I also sensed that a lot of his posts are aggressive, and I know he described that as his personality, but some of them sound like hair-trigger AtE, especially his counter to Grib's read/questions:

Spoiler: His reaction

What threat?
You aren't a threat.

"I'd argue this is your only post with useful content"

This is angry firebringer talking now, from him to you:

Go screw yourself,
Thank you.

-Firebringer.


Also, not answering any of your questions.

I don't know what to think of Grib, I want to lynch honestly regardless of alignment just by that previous post.

Just pissed me off so much.
I am still feeling the anger coming up from my chest. Just ugh...

I am going to go for bit to cool off, maybe run or something.

In summarization, all of this looks like Grib made him angry, and instead of actually doing anything about it, he proceeds to let everyone know just how angry Grib made him feel when he could've simply answered the questions and told Grib why he's wrong, (or right, for that matter). Compliancy, once in awhile, is actually a good thing for the town, (and yes, he eventually answered the questions, but they were half-assed at best)

Reason 2.5 is just some of his early fluff posting which didn't really do anything for anyone at all.

[smiffle]

But dude, I was already voting you yesterday, what makes you think I wouldn't touch-base with you today?
Dav looked like a pretty good lynch, but by the time I got home, he commuted. You can bet your biscuits I'm going to push him hard af tomorrow.
And yes, these points existed before, it's not like I'm going to pull brand new reasons out of thin air like I'm a magician or something.

[smiffle]

^^no need

Basically I have a day commute. I didn't want to be a distraction, so what I did was ~~disappear~~ during the day so I could sit back and scumhunt without having to get super interactive.. I have some notes on my laptop (which I'll shove on when I have the opportunity) which I made during the day.

I was also told that I would be commuted at night too. Considering I was affected by something, I assume that's a lie.

The reason for you backing out on the entire day is weak; self preservation would've been a bit more direct. I really want to see these notes, however, my hopes aren't too high. There wasn't a lot to take note of considering the blinding speed of Fire's lynch. We still fucked up on that one.

Also, Genda, did you try roleblocking Dav again last night?
You say you were targeted? So, on top of your commute, you have the ability to watch yourself?

lol at everyone voting Dav. You guys do realize the dude can just commute if things get too hot to handle? Then he wouldn't be here to answer our questions.

Here we go.

Once again, All Alone's play has been lacklustre. After an atrocious, borderline reasonless push on me for all of the last two days, he has to go and hammer Firebringer with a naked vote. Need to keep an eye on this guy.
Okay, what the fuck is it with Nana/Fire? I feel like it's not Masons, but Fire controls them both. In fact, I've thought this from the start basically, since Nana was "lurking" until Firebringer replaced in, at which point she coincidentally became active. Unsure as to what happens with them after one dies though.
Fire's doing his traditional "yada yada it was all your fault woe is me" thing he does when he's hammered. Dude really needs to learn how to actually explain reads and shit.
Now, here's a thought. Why is it that if Nana dies Fire becomes Mafia, but if Fire dies Nana becomes Survivor? Is it possible that, actually, she's lying to save face and actually she becomes Mafia? If so, are the Mafia aware of this? Because there's a chance they are and thus those on the Fire wagon should be scrutinised.
Wait a second, upon Fire's flip, he has two colours, green and purple. The former has been shown to be town colour, and the latter third-party? In fact, it seems to say he would go from Survivor -> Town. Is it in fact possible that they switched the alignments around; that Fire is Survivor -> Town whereas Nana is Town -> Mafia? Either way, Nana is a prime target.

VOTE: Nana

Dav, so I take it your two scum reads are All Alone and Nana? About the fire controlling Nana thing, I don't think there's a whole lot of correlation between Fire entering the game and Nana's posting more. Fire replaced Klick, who site flaked before the game even began. Klick posting as Nana earlier wouldn't make any sense when he hadn't even confirmed.
You mentioned scrutinising the wagon on fire yesterday, does this mean you're planning to do VCA? If so, I need to grab even more popcorn. Also, just for clarification, at that point yesterday, just before Fire's lynch, were you reading him as scum?

If there is, as you say, the possibility of Nana being mafia, (which All Alone seems to believe too?), then I'm perfectly fine with a Nana lynch today. Mostly because I don't want to deal with the ambivalence about her alignment. Either way, she claimed scum, so it wouldn't be much of a loss. However, can we please

not

have another quick lynch. (I'm looking at you, Alone)
I'm going to put Nana at L-1, but I think we can all be responsible individuals and not end the day super early.

VOTE: Nana

[smiffle]

VOTE: Dav

I don't think I need to explain this one.

No, please do. Atm it looks like you're piggybacking off a multitude of reasons that the thread has provided, and that's no reason to coast a vote, let alone phone it in.

We still have an entire day left...

[smiffle]

[smiffle]

Nah, but seriously: Grib, who are you planning to vote?
You sounded at a loss for scum reads in your penultimate post.

[smiffle]

I don't really care for this game anymore.
I think scum are in All Alone and Davsto.
The rest just don't know what they are doing.

Go ahead and lynch the survivor.

By saying this, are you also stating that the push from All Alone to get Davsto lynched has been bussing this entire time?
What makes you believe this? Do you have any textual support?

[smiffle]

Speaking of Gendaberry, Genda, I want to get your role clear in my mind. You say you're a miller-sleepwalker who visits a person who dies each night, but you're also a roleblocker? Is there anything else you're going to surprise us with? Just for posterity, who were you planning to vote yesterday? I see you never gave your 2 cents regarding that.

Dav, to save us trouble, how many commutes do you have? Not how many do you have left, but how many do you have total?

All Alone, where do you stand on the Davsto Lynch? I know your read on him, but from the point of view of actually getting him lynched, do you have a plan?

Lickety, what do you make of Dav's role being the entire X-shot commuter type thing? Your post above pointing accusatively to the mod announcements of Dav's commute doesn't make a lot of sense. Actually, it makes basically no sense, "hey, this guy has a commute, let's lynch him." What am I supposed to glean from this?

I might as well ask ika too, but ika, from a game spec point-of-view, would an X-shot commuter scum-role make sense in this game based off the roles that have flipped thus far? Guilty Lion mentioned yesterday that an X-shot commuter wouldn't make sense for this reason:

K I'm gonna treat you as town for now then because if X > 1 then that's a broken role for scum to have.

Do you agree with this? I'm really skeptical myself, but that's probably because I suck at analysing game set-ups. Guilty Lion, how did you make this conclusion?

[smiffle]

Alright, I was a bit confused because you said you would treat him as town for yesterday's reason, but it sounds like your read now is largely based on the number of commutes he potentially has. Also, are you saying it's futile to attempt a lynch on him today if he enters the game and says he has more than one commute, or were you planning to only let it slide yesterday?

[smiffle]

The only reason I'm asking is because, to be perfectly honest, you role looks really scummy, but I keep telling myself it's a bastard game, and I keep letting it slide saying "yeah, it's a bastard game, there might be roles like this." I'm trying to not dismiss this anymore and put it under further scrutiny.

What provoked you to RB LQ last night? Was it his lack of posting/explantation yesterday, or something else?
Why would you roleblock someone who was attempting to lynch the same person who you had planned to push?

[smiffle]

I see, I kind of like that plan, but I fail to see how Dav not using his commutes would make him look town compared to the inverse, ("not using his commutes makes him look scummy"). Considering your last two posts, you seem to be saying that if Dav is actually town, then forcing him to use his commute now will prevent potential scum Dav from using it during a threatening time like LYLO/ MYLO, but if he were scum, wouldn't he want to actually be in the game during MYLO/ LYLO? Why would he even want to use his commute during that time if it only increases the town's numbers?

I want Dav to speak his mind on the plan you've presented, and I really want him to answer my earlier question about his number of commutes.

[smiffle]

Internet went down due to a windstorm Thursday night, (fucking time-worner). I'll be able to read up and check in later this weekend, but probably not today.

/dodge

[smiffle]

Catching up and stuff.

Lickety made a pretty good point about roles that can evade death in 1367, and despite him supporting his argument with role specific info that only he knows, I don't see a reason to really dispute his claim. It seems fair to assume that's his actual ability, since I vaguely remember him saying he didn't want to claim an ability that would be helpful to town in MY/LYLO.

After Dav dances around with him telling us his number of commutes istead of just giving a straight answer like I asked for, he tries to defend himself with saying: "guys, I can help catch scuuummmmm."

If you people are gonna get distracted by me again rather than finding actual scum I'm just gonna commute again, you realise that? The longer I stay in the game, the longer I can help find scum, and if that requires day-commuting then I'm sorry but it'll just have to do.

This might be a valid defense if he actually did

any

scumhunting whatsoever. After he and licketey throw a couple jabs at eachother over the subject, he ends up saying this:

Well if you're basically gonna argue that I should be lynched because I'm not super-crazy-awesome pushing every scum then I'm just gonna facepalm really.

It's quite interesting to see the people who keep pushing for and voting me even though they know it's impossible to actually lynch me. Gives quite an interesting insight. Pushing me even though I'm impossible to lynch is a great way to look like you're doing something while in reality nothing you do will forward the gamestate. All it'll do is waste my commute shots.

He wasn't taunting you because you haven't been amazing at catching scum, he was taunting you because you haven't even tried catching scum. What we'll really plan on doing tomorrow is getting the collective town together at a designated time and vote in rapid succession so "pushing" you won't be an issue. We wouldn't be wasting your commutes because a) GL brought up a fantastic counter-point to the actual usefulness of your role to town, i.e. day commutes don't do shit for town, and b) you're scum, so it wouldn't be much of a waste and more of "lets make sure he never does this again" type-thing.

Day continues, yadda yadda yadda, Dav tries to deflect something by blaming it on the mod, more banter, Dav gets salty from GL putting him at L-1, he commutes, and now we're here.
Dav obviously has more than one commute, but the only real question that matters now, regarding his role, is if he has a third. If we coordinate our votes tomorrow and nab him before he commutes, then it should be a sure way to lynch him.

[smiffle]

Man, I hate being late to the party. Dav sat at L-1 for the longest time until Ika unvoted him, but either nobody had the cajones to hammer, or nobody was even around to do the deed.

In the words of the late great Dav:

No, fuck that shit.

nah, i kid.

[smiffle]

What provoked you to RB LQ last night? Was it his lack of posting/explantation yesterday, or something else?
Why would you roleblock someone who was attempting to lynch the same person who you had planned to push?

I was scumreading LQ pretty hard beforehand. From the way LQ talked about his role, I assumed that if he was town then blowing a roleblock on him wouldn't hurt us much. If he was telling the truth, it didn't seem like he had any extremely helpful night actions that I could fuck up by roleblocking him. With his recent claim, it looks like I was right on that end.

I'm sorry for backpedaling, but what was the reason, or set of reasons you were scum reading LQ for earlier? I can't remember any specific push you made on him atm. inb4 I should close read the earlier part of the game again.

Also Genda, who do you think Dav's scumbuddy is?

[smiffle]

Soooo... Dav can commute, and everyone on the FB wagon currently is a town read. There will be numerous questions for Dav when he comes back.

How did you work out that Dav's disappearance was due to a day-commute on D3? He hadn't returned yet, and he didn't claim that ability until D4. There were other plausible explanations for him disappearing (with all the heat on him, I'd just assumed someone had dayvigged him) and day-commuter isn't exactly a common role, so I'm really curious how you knew his role.

Dav commuting was kinda obvious at the time, or at least, that was the only explanation I saw to him completely dropping out of the game.
It was a bit of an assumption, but it's similar to how I've been assuming you're a roleblocker ever since tails flipped. If someone had dayvigged him, we would've seen a flip, and I don't know about you, but commuter is very common to me.

[smiffle]

In a similar vein to what All Alone just pointed out:

lol at everyone voting Dav. You guys do realize the dude can just commute if things get too hot to handle? Then he wouldn't be here to answer our questions.

implies knowledge that Dav has multiple commutes before this was ever explicitly stated in the thread.

I have a few other things that I want to point out in smiffles ISO that makes me believe they could be partners, but I've been lazy and had another game at deadline yesterday so I haven't gotten around to it yet. I'll try to do it today on my lunch break or tonight. The only reason I'm uncomfortable with this line of thinking is because it's based on a scum!Davsto assumption, and the more assumptions you build into a case then the less likely it is to be true.

Funny how you mention assumptions. I realized later that I was basically being a dumbass by assuming he had more than one commute. That's why I made it a point to push for him just straight up telling us earlier today. Which he didn't do.
(but also secretly, I didn't want another quicklynch because I actually wanted him to answer my questions which he barely did.)

[smiffle]

Alright here are things in smiffle's ISO that I don't like, if we are to assume scum!Davsto:

in 246, Lickety's townread on Dav is "jank" because "Dav's meh"
in 247, smiffle says Dav is his second scumread after LQ
but, one RL day later,
in 421 my vote on Davsto is poor and he really digs into me, says he wishes he could be voting me alongside Lickety.

all because I sheeped a mutual townread (All Alone) onto someone he was supposedly scumreading.

now in 423, Dav seems more townish to smiffle as soon as a legitimate wagon has formed on him.

468 and 470 is more soft distancing on Davsto, possibly even coaching "why is he explaining himself?, what reason does he have to be weird?"
and then 473 is literally "here's this kinda scummy thing Dav is doing [being passive], but lots of people are doing it". Like what's the point of that comment other than to soften people's reasons for scumreading Dav?

590 and 594 is just asking Davsto for reads on random players, Firebringer is an especially safe one because he had just entered and hadn't really drawn a lot of attention yet, at all

1277 - "Dav feels like a strong lynch for today" *doesn't vote Dav*

1293 - "you can bet your biscuits I'm going to push him hard tomorrow" [on Dav]
but then:
1331 - accepts everything Dav says, votes Dav's scumread Nana.

I'm not about to dissect this post and defend everything individually, but I will say this: my read on dav really vacillated a ton during the entire course of the game thus far. At multiple points in the game, I found myself questioning my read on him, a) because he seemed to be playing really really poorly, and b) because a fair amount of the stuff people pushed him with didn't really stand out to me as him being genuinely scummy, in fact, most of Dav's posts had me doing facepalms. I asked him for reads so I could get a better read on him, though they didn't help too much. I was also surprised firebringer entered the game and immediately did nothing, actually, surprised is probably the wrong word. I wanted to solidify either a town or scum read on him with something he actually said, but he just kept dropping in to defend himself from bogus with bogus and then leaving immediately after.
Now that Dav is acting legitimately scummy for multiple reasons that have played out toDay, I'm throwing in the towel on his case and saying we lynch him first thing tomorrow.

[smiffle]

Do you mean town block as in we place all our votes on the exact same person? What exactly did you have in mind?

[smiffle]

Lickety, who are you planning on voting today?

[smiffle]

Guilty, how does the presence of Trackers support Genda's claim? I don't see the correlation since he claimed he would always visit a player who dies during the night, and trackers confirming this doesn't do much. It's still a basket of Wifom.

As you already know, I'm strongly scumreading Dav atm. Other than that, I want to sort things out in the thread further before I commit to another solid scum read.

Genda, I think I might've already mentioned this in a previous post from today, but could you please summarize your read on Lickety? Right now, all I see is an OMGUS vote, and it's not a very good one. I'm trying to see where you're coming from with your current read on him. Could you also give a quick summary of your scum read on Davsto. It would be pretty helpful.

Lickety, since you're voting Genda, and you're scumreading him and Dav, do you have an explanation as to why you think Genda is bussing Dav?

[smiffle]

Pre flip associations are bad, but Genda already has a claim that no one is questioning, the Scum read on Dav is icing on the cake.

What makes my read on Dav worse then everyone else's?

OMG this is such a Scummy response.

That looks kind of knee-jerk to me. Same as the OMGUS. I'm just not sure it's scum knee-jerk as opposed to defensive town.
Lickety, what's driving this lynch for you so much? In other words, what's the main reason you're voting Genda?
I suppose this question can apply to Genda too, but his general read and vote are kind of bad. I see the logic, but it's really meh to me.

Ika, do you believe Genda's claim in this setup? How do you think Genda stands compared to Dav? Also, what're your thoughts on lynching today? Yes, no, maybe-so?

[smiffle]

And I feel like a complete idiot for alt-slipping, but it was bound to happen sooner or later.
I hadn't played this game in months, and I didn't want to be rusty on my first game on my main, yadda yadda, excuses.

[smiffle]

At least I survived longer than tails/Bulbazak, lol.

[smiffle]

time to lynch Dave now? We should coordinate so he can't commute.

I wish Von put it as gravedigger

From what he says, I gather he has no more commutes:

You're lucky I have no commutes left after this. If I did, I would just ask vonny to auto-commute me at L-1, like I did today, so it would be fruitless anyway.

I'm not so sure about the whole "commute at L-1 thing" though. If he's lying to us about his number of commutes, at that point he's practically conf-scum, so it'd basically just him buying time with a broken scum-role. I'd say coordination with the last two votes in quick succession is probably fine for a precautionary measure, but enh...

Yo, wrote some stuff over last day. Didn't do much but here ya go. This is all sorta live reaction stuff shoved in a text file.

Seriously? Me leaving with snark is a scumtell? I'm always snarky. That is possibly the weakest excuse to scumread someone I've ever seen in Mafia. Like, seriously, ever. That is pathetic.
There's a good chance GuiltyLion is scum. I've shown suspicions of him at points in the game; he was just raring for a chance to get me out of the game, a lot less pressure on him.
Seriously smiffle? Creep up and try and get me lynched before I notice? You know when you're having to actively conspire to get me lynched that you're doing something wrong. You're lucky I have no commutes left after this. If I did, I would just ask vonny to auto-commute me at L-1, like I did today, so it would be fruitless anyway.

For Davsto, he pretty much doesn't do anything at all apart from talk about theory? He's had a few non-theory posts but not many, and despite claiming that he's gathering reads while he was off on his commuting adventure, he came back to say that he actually doesn't have any then commuted again.

Theorycrafting is my thing, don't diss it.
Also, I did come back with some reads after commuting, don't flat out lie just to capitalise on the wagon on me.

Well that and when I roleblocked him a few nights back, no kill happened. There's a flipped doctor so it's not 100% accurate, but it certainly makes scum Dav a lot more likely.

I have several qualms with this post.
On top of his crumby bits of defense made for a dead player, his read on Guilty is really,

really

, old news that Dav probably could've at least written a bit more about before opening the day up with what appears to be a pretty janky read. At least point put some instances of him being scum, or sus posts, or anything tangible for that matter into your read. It sounds like you're going off slight tunnel-vision you've had from day-1 at this point because you're out of other options. Also, my plan was in the event you had a remaining commute today that you would use it first thing with no provocation, but since you told us you have no more commutes, I guess we can take the time to thoroughly lynch you instead having a quicklynch.

On the subject of mass claim: my view is basically the same as All Alone's:

At what point do you guys think we should massclaim to try to break this game?

Not today unless there's a reason to believe that massclaim would change today's lynch from being Davsto. And I really doubt massclaim will give us a better setup-spec suspect than the guy who was blocked by a conftown roleblocker on a kill-less night.

Without further adieu,
VOTE: Davsto

[smiffle]

Ika, I'm trusting that you're town since you seem to have literally survived a NK, but do you really think Lickety is Dav's scum buddy judging from that botched vote?

Also Lickety, what lead you to believe Ika is third party? That was kind of out of the blue, although I remember you casting some doubt on him a while back after you mentioned reading his ISO. What gives?

[smiffle]

I'm perfectly fine with it. It has to happen eventually.

[smiffle]

So basically I'm Toon-Link, a modified triggerable bomb that blows up if I receive two hit stuns in the same night, instantly killing whoever targeted me with the hitstun.

All Alone is next.

[smiffle]

Good game everyone, I enjoyed it immensely. Hats–off to Von for modding a very enjoyable game.. Tbh I wasn't really expecting any other outcome today. I knew from the start of today I was through, I just didn't want to spoil anyone's fun by scum claiming.
Most, if not all, will be explained shortly after the flip when Von posts the roles.

[smiffle]

What twist! kudos to ika, I never expected that he was a lyncher, but now it all makes sense.

Welp, I have to say, I went into this game with my doubts for winning, and I wasn’t disappointed. I’ll finish off my thoughts with a recap after I re-read a bit of the game, as well as a short player commentary. Although, I will say I’m surprised that I lasted this long. Congrats to town, and Ika. Thanks again for modding Von!

[smiffle]

Whee! Well played everybody (especially ika) and of course a special thanks to smiffle for putting up with the incompetent me as a scum partner and doing well despite it.

Don't be so hard on yourself Dav! We did ok considering we were a two-man team in a really swingy game filled with lots of third-parties. It was fun to work with you as a team.

[smiffle]

Yeah, Dav, I just wanted to note that the split kill system was ultimately devastating to us. It might’ve worked if we had one more member on our scum team, but even then… I think the intention of this mechanic was to allow the mafia to disperse their kills throughout the game, and possibly have some leeway when it comes to end game if one of the scum was RB’d during a NK or etc, but this could’ve been achieved better if we had only one more scum member. The bastardness of the mechanic was to be expected though, I mean, it was a bastard game after all.

Killing all the third party early was sub-optimal for us. They were clearly the counter-weight for our small team, and having a large third-party counter-weight rarely works in the mafia’s favor. It’s like being between a rock and a hard place, where you know you’ll do worse with them dead, but you can’t let them live either, (cuz, ya know, minimal town-cred for lynching third parties and policy lynches yay!) And Guilty’s absolutely correct when he says that the early SK kill is what really set us behind from the get-go.

[smiffle]

Hey, I reminded myself of this in the scum PT.
Post-game, I kind of wanted a reveal from Nana, but I know she has to do it on her own accord because site-rules and stuff.
Just a note.

[smiffle]

EBWOP: what I meant to say is that Firebringer controlled both his slot and Nana.

Oh! I didn't notice that. Thanks Dav! I'll throw some credit to fire for masking that actually. Well-done.
Lol at how bastard this game was. Control of two slots is OP, but awesome at the same time.

[smiffle]

I advocate for a bastard game secretly filled with a bunch of double slots just for lolz.

[smiffle]

Or a three person wifom set-up with conf self-targetable Doc, cop, and one scum. but the doc and the scum are really mod-alts.

[smiffle]

Oh wait, I meant doc and cop, just to screw with the scum.

[smiffle]

Huge wrap-up post incoming.

[smiffle]

So, this is my wrap up post. I’ve reviewed the game a bit, but I really tried to read what exactly it was that I was doing this entire game so I can learn off of it for future games. I also do a bit of player critique just to let people know how well they did and what they can improve on and such. You can dis-regard it if you want, but it’s really just there to provoke discussion and review of the game. I think reviewing a good-game is an important part of learning in mafia, so feel free to join in on the discussion.

Early on in the game, I wanted to approach it with a different tone in my posts, (i,e: aggressive and quick), but I soon realized I couldn’t keep up the façade. However, I just wanted to be a bit jovial early game by joking around. Originally, I didn’t realize I had taken Licketey’s bait, but I realized I could roll with it because I could strong-arm him with the support and votes my read on Licketey eventually produced. Somewhere along the way, I gained his town-read at the same time. After his wagon lost steam, I backed out a little bit, but I was actually quite surprised on how well I was received entering the game. I usually don’t have that luck in early game. I made sure to try and capitalize off people’s mis-reads A LOT during this game, thus my surprise when I was finally caught. Especially on day one, I’m throwing sus here and there while still making it seem like my main view was on Licketey, when it really wasn’t. I tried to keep reads from townies thrown at other townies indirectly with some general questions here and there, but really my main goal on day-one was dividing the town. Everyone knows breaking-up the town early-on proves really beneficial for the scum later on in the game, so that, plus the inactivity later-on really helped me a lot. (I don’t think anyone noticed this, but in post 1364 there was a mini SHROOPS, see if you can find it!)
On a side note: Sorry if I was a bit foul-mouthed at times early-game, but I really didn’t give a shit.

After day-one, I really tried to let the town do its thing by lynching the third parties and such in order to buy a bit more time for Dav and I to make Night Kills. I also kept pushing for the mislynchs, and just brushed over them once they were done. I think I set up a defense for each one if anyone questioned me about why I voted or such, but I never really needed to use that. As the game went on, and Dav and I just couldn’t get our solid night-kills through, I lost hope of our win. My focus shifted to survival, and prolonging the town’s misguidance. Eventually, that led to a semi-pop corned claim-game, and I was the obv scum in that moment.

Tails/Bulba

, I killed you early mainly for revealing in the thread that you’d be testing Genda’s claim. I wanted Genda’s role to remain uncertain for a potential mislynch later-on, (and that worked out quite nicely), but had you not said this, and had you not slipped, I probably wouldn’t have killed you. Your reads were pretty off too, so I wanted to benefit off the potential wifom that would run though town’s mind when they looked at your flip. I try to mix things up every now and then. You were also a good choice to NK because you hadn’t fully established your position in the town, making you an unlikely choice for doctor. It was a safe kill overall. I know you’re a really experienced player, but don’t take this critique too seriously, I’m just explaining my thoughts on you while I was in the game.

Guilty Lion

, I was hesitant about his strength as town in this game early on, (with all the “I’m going to wait a while before I give my reads” thing), but he actually really pulled through with his scumhunting later in the game. He was, without a doubt, my top choice for a scumkill those last two nights. Well-played move on his part to commute the second night, but I was still grasping for straws at that point in the game. He also masked his role really well. Von can confirm this if he wants to, but I sent him a pm stating that I was going to claim an absorber variant, and I wanted his thoughts on it. Then you claimed and that plan was shot down. Shaky beginning, but strong finish. I misjudged you when I was going over my NK options; thinking your vote could be swayed here and there with a little coaxing, but you really stood your ground, and that’s what I love about good town players, (and you did it in a non-stubborn manner too! Bonus points!).

Lickety

, I knew I had to enter the game from an angle, you ended up being my angle, and it really worked out for me later in the game. Your entry to the game was a bit awkward to me, even if I was town, I would’ve questioned it. That’s why I mainly choose you as a way to get myself grounded in the game as people’s town read by striking at the weak and/or odd parts in your stances. As the game progressed, I was surprised you came out of my tunnel town-reading me, but that really worked-out in my favor long term. Sniper-shot btw on the SK, like, holy-fuck that shit was out of a western. I didn’t want to compliment you on it at the time because I was scum-reading you, but that shit was cool. Your reads throughout the course of the game were really malleable, so I made sure to plant the seeds of doubt in your head about Genda early on. There were some early posts I forgot to write down the numbers to in which I did specifically this. You were already slightly reading Genda as scum day 1, so by the time post 1166, (the post that I think is what eventually led to Genda’s death), rolled around, you saw it as a completely plausible option that Genda was scum. I’m not sure if this eventually led to you seeing Genda as the scummy option on that day we lynched him, but I think it contributed. The only reason I wanted to point out this instance of manipulation is because I thought it was cool. Nothing more. Your end game was strong, but you were misguided a lot during the previous days. If we ever play again, I know I’ll thoroughly enjoy it, and who knows, we might even be on the same team.

Xtoxm

, it was a stroke of bad luck for MS to claim you as scum day 1. I questioned you somewhat about your reads and you helped me out by starting the lynch on Wanderer. Thanks. You actually weren’t half-bad day-1, other than the Guilty scum-lean, so it was kind of a shame to see the town just straight-up policy lynch you day 2. Being scum, I just went with it because it was bound to happen sooner or later, but I built up a counter wagon on Firebringer day 2 because I wanted to hedge him as a mislynch later-on.

Wanderer-nl

, you entered the game a bit late due to personal time-constraints, and you entered the game at a bit of an odd angle. I just went with this and ended up lynching you day one. You seemed a bit scatter-brained while you were here on day one, but it really would’ve helped had you taken initiative and dived right in.

Grib

, solid town play out of a replacement slot, but your early reads from just replacing in weren’t the best. I made sure to capitalize off that to full extent. To do this, I town-read you really from the get-go, and made sure that we were a bit buddy-ish, but not too buddy-ish. I forget my train of thought that concluding you were likely to be doctor, but I really wish I remember it now. Being spot-on with the doctor read surprised even me. One of the reasons I choose you as a night-kill was because I feared that your incorrect reads would eventually wear-off and become correct ones on me. Solid town-play though.

Smiffle just posted in the mafia PT that he thinks Grib is likely a doctor.

HARD READS

Only the hardest. I think I just spent a lot of this game pondering who could be what power-role.
I worked a lot with Dav to really try and figure out the game before town had the chance.

All Alone

, nice work on reading Dav early and relentlessly pushing him throughout the game. That’s where you really stood strong. Unfortunately, you did join in on the other wagons a little too much. If you had kept rooting for people to lynch Dav with the convicted read you had, then you would’ve really taken the cake. Strong early reads, but you were really compliant during the game. I think this was in-part because you town-read me, but just a bit of defiance would’ve really stolen the town game for you. Solid play overall for coming out on-top in the end-game. Well-done.

Davsto

, I really tried to create synergy between the two of us at different points in the game, and I really tried to keep your options open with the town against you by little bits of stalling, but eventually it just made more sense to bus you. It was a fun team though, I enjoyed it. The one thing I regret is that I wanted to strike up a rolling discussion with you in the scum PT, but it never seemed to happen. I’m just one for long discussions of thoughts on the game to see if my partner and I are on the same page. I wish we could’ve chatted more in general, more communication would’ve helped us a ton in the game thread. Bussing me that early on probably wasn’t the best idea. Unfortunately, scumreads piled onto you early in the game, and then it started to go down-hill from there. But, let me say, the most underated thing for scum to do is actually attempt to save their buddy from being lynched, it was really hard to do while maintaining a good-read status in the thread. I resorted to stalling your death mostly, but alas… The beginning of the game is crucial for establishing a good relationship with town, but even I fall down when it comes to this, so I don’t blame you at all for eventually getting lynched. I’m sure our play would’ve been really really solid had there not been so much pressure on you from town.

Firebringer

, you came into the thread and pointed a single finger at me, your main scumread. The only thing you fell down on was pushing me. Dang, you were in control of two separate slots! You could’ve totally used that to your advantage to make me look bad, but you didn’t. I’d just recommend pushing a little harder with a bit more content, and you would’ve been golden.

Mario, all I can say is Rip. Spot-on Day-vig shot by Lickety. That shit was fire.

Gendaberry

, you made correct moves as town with the

It’s a shame that MS was banned and everything, but I don’t disagree with the mods for imposing the retroactive ban. It was just really poor timing for us being on day 1. While Sonic was in the game, he actually made some pretty lasting impressions on the scum team discussion which you might read in the scum PT. Dav and I really worked on figuring out the game before the town knew so we could better predict it’s actions, and, for the most part, I’d say we were pretty spot-on. Let me just say, when ika entered the game, playing his town game as lyncher just made it the perfect strategy. However, I did think he would gambit a bit more and continue what Sonic started, but he never did. Well played third party role. I remember playing with ika as scum, (I think), in the Taylor Swift U-pick, and the town was really strong that game, but I’m going off on a tangent, nvm. On a side note, I loved Ika’s fearlessness during the endgame. He just went straight for the hammer, no regrets, even if it was obvious at that point.

I’m sorry if any of my feed-back offended you or anything, but I think it’s just a healthy thing to do after the game to really analyze what went wrong, and what went right.
If any of you are ever interested in playing another game with me again, (or you put me on your blacklist by being thoroughly disgusted), then my main account in Lucian Roy.
Again, Great-game everyone, and good work on the setup Von. The game was really enjoyable, and I look forward to a game you mod that isn't bastard.

[smiffle]

Also, I think this was mentioned minimally, but rip PM. Ironic timing that the project ended right around Genda's lynch. I see he had no qualms about making that joke. (I was hype for Lynn)

Oh, and I guess sm4sh had a direct today. More FE characters. yay. (Bayonetta does look kind of sick, though).

[smiffle]

Yeah, that was some spooky timing on pmdt disbanding

Who do you main in pm, von? I'm just curious because I was thinking that at least one of the roles in the game was your main. Also, what inspired you to choose the characters you used in the setup? btw, I was expecting the Link, ganon, and zelda thing to go town, neutral, and scum to complete the trifecta, but I liked the twist.