(1765) Star Wars: The Force Awakens [D5]

[Keyser Söze]

I have a bad feeling about this...

Let me sink my teeth into Page One.

the fuck is pre-game talk?

Seriously?

Trollie is a 2012 account with modding experience. There's no way he doesn't know what pre-game talk is.

This. I'm unsure if this is scum indicative but it is unsettling. This isn't a newbie game.

he was faking a townslip than actually made one..

Yes, it taps into the unsettling/unnatural behaviour of RVS that I find uncomfortable.

Wagon on Tails is sketchy.

"Sketchy" on page one? It's page one, it's RVS, sketchy/weak is acceptable.

On another note, RC and Anen are town. Aero can also be town for s's and g's.

3 easy town reads dished out - noted.

[Keyser Söze]

Going back here:

That concept was in the latest PM. If that should confirm anything at all, it's that Trollie has NO access to any pre-game talks.

I'm not sure it confirms anything regarding TheTrollie - in my eyes it's pure WIFOM atm.

And I'm sure his getting an extra vote to put him in the lead had nothing to do with it...

Can I have names here please - are you saying 'scum' are already consciously defending/counter-attacking on page one?

[Keyser Söze]

Do you think so?

Not understanding this question to RadiantCowbells... are you challenging him? If so, tell him why he could be wrong. [I see his observation, a conclusion and a vote.] It feels like you are saying he is categorically wrong.

[Keyser Söze]

Because Camn's is RVS. Lone Wolf's is not. He went for the larger potential wagon that could protect Trollie.

1) 3 easy town-reads
2) over-reading votes
3) scum-reads based on pre-flip associatives

Not seeing the connections/supporting evidence to be making such strong opinions so early.

VOTE: Tails

Talk me through them - I can't see how you got there

[Keyser Söze]

Tails wagon is still fairly awful.

And yes, that's exactly what I'm saying.

Show me "fairly awful" - why can't there be a wagon on Tails?

2 early players were on Trollie: me and RC. Anen starts a wagon on me. Lone Wolf jumps on for 2. Aero had voted RC. Camn shows up and adds a second vote. Lone Wolf switches to make it 3. My wagon didn't have the traction, and his vote on RC had nothing to do with the Trollie statement, as he'd have voted him in his previous post. He took 2 minutes to vote RC, which is enough time to look at the votes and switch to a larger wagon.

Ok, I can see your Trollie-LoneWolf scum narative - however, I am personally uncertain if scum would try to protect their partners on page one/RVS.

And quick unexplained reads never have been and never will be scummy.

There's always reasons behind them.

If I tell you is another matter entirely.

Well when we see flips I want you to explain these reads in full.

On that note: Snarky is town. Keyser is town for lols. And Venmar has a cool hat.

Ok, second offense of unsupported/unexplained town reads. This is ironically going in your favour now - scum-Tails doesn't even make a half-ass'd-attempt at explaining his naked reads. I.e he will choose when the time is right to explain <<< not succumbing to pressure.

UNVOTE: Tails

[Keyser Söze]

RC are you scum?

Is RadiantCowbells scum, Aeronaut? Where are you going with this question?

Why did this have to start on such a busy weekend...

There's not much I want to say before reading other than that I'm town so that's boring but good! And Tails' avatar is really cool, I didn't know gifs were possible.

VOTE: Amihan

Pretty much everyone who claims town in the first two pages turns out to be scum, in my experience.

Yes, another "uncomfortable" opening post. Why does town-Amihan need to announce to the thread that he is town? Why would scum-Amihan put himself in the shit by acting like a noob? Like TheTrollie's intro something doesn't add up (unsettling/unnatural intro) - but I feel it's too early to throw a vote on it. I want to hear more from them. Null on the avatar comment.

[Keyser Söze]

If that should confirm anything at all, it's that Trollie has NO access to any pre-game talks.

^^^
Still troubled with this...

.

But those highlighted parts stood out for me. Firstly,

not reading anything... but having time for those comments

, including talking about avatars. Secondly, that "I'm town" felt "off".

Part non-alignment indicative reason

here

...

I get the "I'm town" uncomfortable feeling though.

Mild FoS: Aneninen

[Keyser Söze]

VOTE: Camn

Start talking, sweet cheeks.

Camn needs to post more, pronto.

Not understanding the focused interest with the Camn slot. Why are you expending energy into a slot who can't reply? Does Camn's page one RVS vote on you trouble you?

[Keyser Söze]

VOTE: Aeninen

Show me how you got there.

RC, you need to change your vote to Trollie.

Fine.

VOTE: Trollie

VOTE: Radiant Cowbells

Explain this vote here please - do you think scum-RadiantCowbells was pressured/too easily persuaded into voting TheTrollie by Tails? (note: it was page one, it was RVS).

Oh nothing, just the end of the world!

*laugh track*

Oh, hey! Have you done your research?

This is so out of place for you as town.

I agree that I can not pin-point the mindset of RadiantCowbells' posts.

Wow lots of bad votes.

Tell me what a bad vote is during early Day One play. No one should be in a position to say whether one vote is categorically good or bad - challenge that person's opinion (do not post an unexplained position). Is Tails town, Extrapolated Eagle?

[Keyser Söze]

I haven't thought it through yet.... But it is kicking around in my head

it might be worthwhile to stage an early massclaim

of what the map does for us. To help whoever HAS the map decide on where to PUT the map.
Don't get crazy yet... I haven't really considered the ifs.

My immediate response to this is...

HELL NO

. Any indication/reveal of character/role/power is anti-town/scummy. [Note: Would scum-camn try to pass this of as a Day One plan and feel the wrath of town...]

In fact ,where is he? He dropped that post and vanished, which is double suspect.

Yes, a good tactic for scum is to wait for the storm to pass, then come back when another player is under fire.

Don't worry though, I'll repost his intro every page until he comes back:

the fuck is pre-game talk?

Additional thoughts.... FYI, Keyser, Cowbells and I, we have been in a few games lately. So that is what's what.
Incidentally, he is probably scum this game and we should Lynch him. But not till later.

Explain this post please. What/who/where/why/when. I see "scum" and "lynch" in the same sentence but not a name.

Also...I totally approve the Aneninen hate.
All his posts are terrible.

Why do you think they are "terrible"?

Well yea, gut reads are important, but if you're going to never back up your reads with anything of substance, then you're scum in my mind.

Not just scum... bad/anti-town can also withhold their thought-process.

Wait, can you tell me where you're getting this scum-tales meta? Because otherwise it kind of looks like you're conforming to what RC says.

I was not basing by opinion on Tail's-meta (I have never played with him before/read his previous games). I was saying: would have scum-Tails at least have tried to explain his empty reads to me, so that I stopped focusing on him. Tails didn't - but presented even more empty town-reads I found this amusing ("ironically going in your favour now"). This was not me "conforming to what RC says".

[Keyser Söze]

Camn, should I not find it odd and scummy that you are unwilling to engage me here when I'd expect the first thing you'd do as town is to engage me?

It almost feels like you suggested that you be bussed in pregame but your team was on the fence about it so you guys decided that you'd stay away from me while you get your team to pressure me and lock me down.

And that's exactly what Aeronaut feels like he's doing.

I don't know what this is - it feels like you are creating a whole scenario to get

into the game

.

What do you think about Aeronaut?

The way he's posting really feels like he's not genuinely trying to sort me and is just pressuring me for ulterior motives.

Let's go back and look at Aeronaut's RadiantCowbells interactions:

Spoiler: Aeronaut on RadiantCowbells

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

Wassup!

RC are you scum?

Again, camn?

What is it RC? use your words.

Why are you still voting your RVS vote?

RC, this isn't going to be one of those games where you're allowed to get away with posting naked votes without reasoning. Sorry.

Questions like

''RC are you scum?''

and

"Why are you still voting your RVS vote?"

are admittedly blunt in terms of probing.

[Keyser Söze]

I strangely am town reading Bulge for his one post.

Really? His post is the definition of null.

I'm surprised Bulge hasn't dayvigged me yet.

Again, what is this?

I don't think his answer has anything to do with flips.

Flips meaning town or scum, AKA it has everything to do with it. When someone flips these empty reads will carry more weight - of which I expect full breakdown/explanation later.

For me, it's strange that you ignored my answer in 35 where I changed my mind on that topic.

I am not interested in your position at B, C or D. It is at position A (your original/natural reaction) that I found suspect.

Camn, I think that you're town. Who should I be voting?

This again stinks - but camn-RadiantCowbells are unlikely scum-partners. Both town or one scum-one town, IMO. RadiantCowbells whole entrance into the game has been focused on himself - reads based on his preconceptions of the reactions he would have with the players he knows (post 66, post 76, post 90).

Does RadiantCowbells do this as scum or town?

Note for later:

RadiantCowbells has decided to enter this game through camn

.

[Keyser Söze]

Because I said so.

Because I'm obv. town

+1-Up
You do convey great confidence which I like

Leaning Town

As for

SS

, I feel like it's risky for scum to claim a hated townie; (correct my if I'm wrong and this is common or something, but I've never seen it.). If he was scum, I feel like once someone voted snarky and nothing happened, then people would know he lied immediately. Don't see a lot of scum motive in that.

Yes, scum do not give town a reason to lynch them - they're more interested in survival. Thus, SnarkySnowman is afforded a Day One-benefit of doubt, that he should take advantage of by scum-hunting hard til his keyboard bleeds.

(I assume Pigeon Boy means EE).

MISSING

Have you seen this pigeon anywhere?
Last seen as Aneninen's avatar.
Often confused with Eagle Boy.

Scum Lite™ Pt. 2: The RadiantCatagory

{RadiantCowbells}

Lean Scum

{Extrapolated Eagle, camn}

RadiantCowbells below camn? I don't want to bring pre-flip associatives into play, but if there is scum in RadiantCowbells-camn I see it in the RadiantCowbells camp.

Camn

is reacting strangely with RC right now, in my opinion.

"strangely"? I believe RadiantCowbells' whole entrance into this game deserves that title if anyone.

EE pretty much overreacted, calling me dense/scum/etc. because I apparently just am too dumb for this game.

Yes, I didn't like Extrapolated Eagle's heated reaction:

Screw you all I did was state opinions.

Look at the freaking post, dude. Do I have to write my thoughts out in plain and simple terms? Are you like not capable of reading something and drawing a correlation between the word "nasty" and "scummy"?

Emotion is hard to sift as town/scum though. I want to see him break down a read with 5% emotion, 25% composure and 70% clarity.

I.e I want to see him break down this wall :

I like Tails, he's my strongest town lean atm
I liked the bulge for his vote on aneninen
Trollie started nasty but he's a bit nullish compared to how bad some people look
RC is way out of place probably scum this game
Amihan did a similar thing to trollie and no one jumped on her for it, more likely to be scum there
I liked key a little bit, he's the town side of nullish
Snowman is probably maybe town as well

[Keyser Söze]

Comfortable.


Same-wavelength. More please.


Who are you guys?


Not scum-reading, but not quite on the same page.


Uncomfortable.


Fist of suspicion.

[Keyser Söze]

VC please.

[Keyser Söze]

Well it's usually better to be blunt to RC because that's really how he usually is;

The other thing I noticed is that RC didn't respond to most of these prods

, even though he later tried to say "Aero isn't really trying to sort me".

Yes, the interactions between you and RadiantCowbells have admittedly not been 'clean' - I see a game of tug-of-war (not, let-me-find-out-who-you-are:

HOWEVER

, this could be due to personality versus personality.)

Do you think we're both scum?

This did cross my mind (i.e scum theatre) - but I'm not going to push it.

@Key what is it that we're not on the same page about?

I will answer this tonight.

Could you share thoughts on key, pls?

He's kind of hard for me to read

atm.

Please quote any of my posts which you are finding "hard" to read.

I'm not a fan of Snarky voting Trollie earlier

TheTrollie's opening post was unsettling - I can see why/how SnarkySnowman voted.

I don't think he actually has that much confidence on either of his reads

It's page two, day one - I don't think this is alignment indicative (reads won't be strong).

and it reads like he's exaggerating them for the purpose of overselling it because this is RVS and that's what people do to be funny or personable. But even though the votes and reasons look like subtle trolling, at the same time it also feels like he's subtly testing the waters and framing it in a way such that he can choose to pretend either of them was serious and continue on from that later when they likely weren't at the time. The "takes 2 less votes to lynch me" line also points to this kind of scum-beneficial trolling.

I did not see the 'hated townie' as a scum-troll-gambit. Speaking from experience, town-SnarkySnowman does play with a sledge-hammer. I'll dip into his scum-meta later.

That's a lot to go through on my phone but what stamds out is that

I don't like the path he took early on to bring Trollie to "uncomfortable"

.

Show me where I have expressed TheTrollie as a 'comfortable'/town read? Please quote any of my posts which support your above opinion.

1 post + time = uncomfortable

.

[Keyser Söze]

Although, I don't get your readlist; it doesn't seem to
match your catchups.

It was half read-list/half action-list.
"Comfortable" = they do not require my immediate attention.
"Same-wavelength. More please." = similar opinions expressed but require more input.
"Who are you guys?" = please post.
"Not scum-reading, but not quite on the same page." = good and bad. Require attention to figure out positions.
"Uncomfortable" = made a stink.
"Fist of suspicion" = require

immediate

sorting.

i.e they are

not

firm categories of me saying SnarkySnowman=town or RadiantCowbells=scum, but they do indicate alignment-leans.

Also, this should be answered:

I am not interested in your position at B, C or D. It is at position A (your original/natural reaction) that I found suspect.

And will you stick to A even after E, F, G, H, Q, Z, ß?

I will evaluate A, E, F, G, H, Q, Z, ß all individually and as a body

Anyways the point wasn't that you're hard to read. I feel okish about you as town for the moment,

I was trying to get reads out of ami and maybe a response that helped me baseline them for how they react so I could read them better

Well that's the thing -

engage me directly

, not via asking someone else for their read on me If you are expressing a position you should be able to defend/explain it. I'm going to dip into your town/scum-meta too.

[Keyser Söze]

If that should confirm anything at all, it's that Trollie has NO access to any pre-game talks.

^^^
Still troubled with this...

.

Key

a Sedona, pls explain?

In reference to Aneninen:

Aneninen concluded outright that you had "NO access" to pre-game chat. IMO, your comment confirmed nothing (you could have been playing dumb or honestly clueless ("pure WIFOM" for a "paranoid" townie). I.e I thought it was suspicious that Aneninen ruled out all other options.

TheTrollie (1): Tails
RadiantCowbells (2): TheLoneWolf, Extrapolated Eagle
Amihan (1): SnarkySnowman
Aneninen (3): The Bulge, camn, Aeronaut
RadiantCowbells (1): RadiantCowbells
SnarkySnowman (1): Amihan

Not Voting: Venmar, TheTrollie, Aneninen

I am not voting, but where am I?
Also, there are two wagons on RadiantCowbells.

[Keyser Söze]

@Key what is it that we're not on the same page about?

Re-reading your ISO, we do actually hold similar positions on a various items:

- Aneninen's post 14 (post 61)
- wanting Tails to explain his reads (but not out-right agreeing with your "you're scum in my mind" comment).
- similar confusion on camn's "he is probably scum this game and we should Lynch him" post.
- Extrapolated Eagle's emotional "overreaction" was alarming (post 72)
- read/stance on SnarkySnowman's intro post 110

+1

I believe I was originally not 'comfortable' with you due to your interactions with RadiantCowbells (pre-flip associations )

I'm going to review my read on RadiantCowbells next.

[Keyser Söze]

I feel a great disturbance in the Force: RadiantCowbells

VOTE: Camn

Start talking, sweet cheeks.

This is not a RVS vote. This feels like RadiantCowbells with an ulterior motive (aka scum finding an awkward entrance into the game via a player).

Wagon on Tails is sketchy.

How can RadiantCowbells hold this position by post 17?

Continuation with the latch-onto-camn narrative:

Spoiler:

Camn needs to post more, pronto.

Again, camn?

Camn, do you ever roll town?

I think Camn is scum but I know that you're scum.

Moves vote to Aeronaut:

VOTE: Aeronaut

Camn, should I not find it odd and scummy that you are unwilling to engage me here when I'd expect the first thing you'd do as town is to engage me?

It almost feels like you suggested that you be bussed in pregame but your team was on the fence about it so you guys decided that you'd stay away from me while you get your team to pressure me and lock me down.

And that's exactly what Aeronaut feels like he's doing.

I expect you to talk with me! jeez.

Camn finally posts:

I'm just hungover!
God!

Well, fine.

After all this 'theatre' RadiantCowbells is now happy with camn's simple "I'm just hungover!" explanation.

Camn, I think that you're town.

Besides the fact that she didn't immediately engage with me, she's been actually pretty towny, which makes me think that she's town.

This isn't a player simply changing his read (non-alignment indicative)... this is RadiantCowbells with a manufactured entrance and fake read, which inevitably ends with a predictable town-read on camn (reasons?>>>

"actually pretty towny, which makes me think that she's town"

= generic/easy town read).

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

[Keyser Söze]

after Cowbells look at Trollie.

TheTrollie

the fuck is pre-game talk?

We've gone over this one post a hundred times. I would categorize it under "WTF" given TheTrollie's join date.

2 unexplained town-reads of Tails and RadiantCowbells (post 166).

RC is town
Tails is probtown

EE & Aero could easily be scum

Suspicious of Snarky and Amihan

Show me how you got to these reads. You've just got into the game but still managed to rattle off more reads than anyone else

I am going to say that I read Camn as town, but I can see some scumplay about his/her (ill check after i post this and note for next time) play, I just don't think its actually coming from scum motives. That may change as I get a better read. Keeping an eye out.

This is a fence-sit, but in this case not scum-indicative as TheTrollie is still in the process of catching up. I.e his position on camn will be weak/incomplete.

1. I am town
2. I am usually right

Does this mean I'm not gonna get

an actual answer

from you on why you are voting SS?

...and how about an explanation on your reads (post 166)

idk...maybe you are scum actually but

I need u to get off me

and start talking about other people so I can figure it out

so go do that

TheTrollie wants breathing space - null (as stated above TheTrollie is still in catch-up mode).

The flip...

idk...maybe you are scum actually

The flop...

camn im ignoring you now because i think you are town

OK -

I need TheTrollie to fully catch-up so I can gauge the sincerity of his reads - WITH REASONS

(they feel vapour thin atm).

[Keyser Söze]

Unvote:
Vote: RadiantCowbells

Tails I think you've been buddied by scum a bit too easily.

I was about to let RC have a pass and just let him know, but him calling the Tails wagon suspect so early pinged my gut.

can't pass this up

VOTE: camn

<3

@TheLoneWolf - what's your current read on RadiantCowbells?

[Keyser Söze]

I think that Adenine's scum.

I'll try to make a case on him.

^^^
Yes please. I will sort Aneninen next too.

Does town-RadiantCowbells making these posts:

Who should I be voting?

why haven't you given me someone to vote?

[You usually don't

ask someone

for who to vote for, you

tell people

who to vote for.]

fuck you too

ill iso the fucker now

@TheTrollie - do you know TheLoneWolf? That is alot of aggression out of nowhere.


Makes me want to go back here>> (TheTrollie-TheLoneWolf associatives):

Get everybody and their stuff together

ok

3

2

1

VOTE: Tails

The Trollie I know doesn't think that fast RC

Unvote:
Vote: RadiantCowbells

Ok...

15 and 18 both protect you.

"Protect"? My problem with this theory is that it is page one. Does scum-TheLoneWolf "protect" his scum-partner on page 1, with posts 15 and 18...? No, I think scum-TheLoneWolf would sit back if his scum-partner was under fire (and not proxy OMGUS).

Also the voting pattern. Both of those votes target those voting Trollie.

Yes, TheLoneWolf is voting for both the people attacking TheTrollie - but as I said earlier, it would be a bold move by scum to defend scum so early. I see it more as a S-T/T-T/T-S scenario.

[Keyser Söze]

Aero is not town aligned.

VOTE: Aeronaut

I have a guilty on you.

I have seen both town and scum RadiantCowbells fake a guilty result - but this is usually when his back is against the wall or he is being ignored. Does scum-RadiantCowbells make this play now? It doesn't matter, we have guaranteed scum in RadiantCowbells/Aeronaut.

VOTE: Aeronaut

I believe that is L-1.

[5: RadiantCowbells, TheLoneWolf, Extrapolated Eagle, camn, Keyser Söze]

VOTE: camn

Static scum discussion points.

Cool. Camn is conftown imo now.

How can you rule out scum-distancing? (Please note: I currently town-read camn).

A few posts later...

VOTE: camn

I fucked up. I thought Camn was town.

Camn is scum. Camn & partner were told my role in their results last night and now I need a protective role on me tonight.

Why did you investigate your town-read...?

Camn is town.

Reck likes to screw with people. I wouldn't be surprised to see a number of non-normal elements in this game.

@xRECKONERx

- are bastard results possible in this set-up?

Dont care. I back townies.

Do you back your 'town-reads', or do you back "townies"?

[Keyser Söze]

UNVOTE: Aeronaut

[Keyser Söze]

Why is your vote not on camn, TheTrollie?

A guilty is a guilty.

[Keyser Söze]

Why is your vote not on camn, TheTrollie?

A guilty is a guilty.

VOTE: camn

My bad

[Keyser Söze]

If I die, then the town skips a day, and there's two nights in a row.

xRECKONERx, you are evil. 5 scum

plus

this

anti-town PR?



There is too much risk in the Aeronaut lynch.

We go here for D2: VOTE: camn

[Keyser Söze]

This is turning out to be the craziest game I've ever played I've never seen anything like this before.

Ha ha- I will actually counterclaim Aeronaut

ON FLAVOR

.

>I< Am Leia Organa.

Dont believe me? I wrote it in my first post.

Spoiler: bolded for emphasis

O

mg we started finally.

R

ight now I'm in vegas...

G

oing home this morning.

A

fter my flight I can sort out the rvs.

N

ot now tho.

A

ching head.

VOTE: radiantcowbells

on principal.

He is no jedi.

Can you confirm you have a different power...?

i dont have time today for this. literally can consider me

v/la until tomorrow

You might want to cancel your vacation, come back online.

[Keyser Söze]

I'd be happy to be leashed and to help out town here

, at least for a day or two. The truth is this game has been exponentially frustrating for me and i'm so fucking done with scummy-RC doing scum-things.

Scum is scum - no leashing, no deals.

Aeronaut you would've been left alive as our dog if you had shot Snarky and gone the Vigilante route

Alas

^

This.

Lynching because

"he was seriously town"

? Goodbye. There is no pro-town bone in your body
We are lynching Aeronaut today or tomorrow.

Not surprised.

I'd still prefer to lynch him at this time but I wouldn't mind leashing

if I can think of a good target

.

The answer to this should be TheTrollie or camn.

Do you believe TheTrollie's roleclaim/investigations? Vote camn. If not, TheTrollie should be your #1 lynch candidate right now.

[Keyser Söze]

Camn is confirmed either SNOKE or KYLO REN from my results last night

To confirm:
How do you know the scum-flavours/role?
Is this speculation or is this from your role pm/investigations?
Can you paraphrase the "results".

[Keyser Söze]

@xRECKONERx

- The Bulge should be replaced now IMO, his sole contribution to this game was a single vote. Feed him to the Sarlacc

[Keyser Söze]

^thats the most questionable post ive read so far.
and ive read one page.

Really?

Normally this would be the best time to go the blood for the blood god route but given Aero's reaction to RC's play he can't be trusted to act sensibly toward his win con.

Less kills, more townies alive, etc.

I wanted to lynch group-scum today but this is an excellent point, we could narrow down the NK's to a single kill.

Let's keep Aeronaut away from L-1 for now though. SnarkySnowman keeps promising his thoughts then disappears. Venmar too, when he re-appeared he was shot down by RadiantCowbells.

[Keyser Söze]

This is not speculation, it is inherent to my role/results. I have intel based on the mechanics of my role, and my results last night that Camn can only be one of those two.

I am not saying I trust Aero but since I know for a damn fact that Camn is one of the two most likely most powerful scum PRs that is where the lynch NEEDS to be today.

Thanks [I have more faith in TheTrollie's roleclaim and execution of his roleclaim the best -

I think it's a game-breaking move if camn flips Kylo Ren/Snoke

].

Yes, we are only lynching in camn/Aeronaut today. We can weigh up the benefits/risk/information from each lynch today.

[Keyser Söze]

:/ you dont think him trying to excuse lynching aero based on him being "irrational" rather than him being scum is questionable?

Aeronaut has already admitted in being scum.

If Aeronaut's alignment was still up for question, you would have a point.

[Keyser Söze]

i dont like people talking shit about my friends :c

Well, this is where bias has entered your judgement - Aeronaut is self-confirmed scum.

[Keyser Söze]

Can we go back here please (D1):

*hears Aneninen's cries of ecstacy in the dead thread*

Oh, it's L–1.

Okay.

I'm Neighbour with someone.

If I got the Map I could learn the alignment of my Neighbour.
But, we did a little trick. We tried to post our Map condition at the same time. I was slow because I was from mobile. My Neighbour posted it first.

So, unless the scum-PR contains a fake for the Map condition, my Neighbour is town.

I haven't read anything of the last pages, by the way.

If I die, we have a conf-town. (Unless there's a fake message at the scum-PR about the Map.)

Oh, and my name.

Jessika Pava.

Suit yourselves what to do.

Mobilpost.
Thanks for the derphammer.

It is Lonewolf by the way.

Either Camn or RC must be scum or both

What was the consequence of this?
Is the TheLoneWolf's alignment confirmed in anyway?
The set up does not sound like a mason set-up (i.e town confirmed together)

@TheLoneWolf- did you have day/night chat?

[Keyser Söze]

Back to my D1 scum-read of RadiantCowbells:

Spoiler: Scum read

I feel a great disturbance in the Force: RadiantCowbells

VOTE: Camn

Start talking, sweet cheeks.

This is not a RVS vote. This feels like RadiantCowbells with an ulterior motive (aka scum finding an awkward entrance into the game via a player).

Wagon on Tails is sketchy.

How can RadiantCowbells hold this position by post 17?

Continuation with the latch-onto-camn narrative:

Camn needs to post more, pronto.

Again, camn?

Camn, do you ever roll town?

I think Camn is scum but I know that you're scum.

Moves vote to Aeronaut:

VOTE: Aeronaut

Camn, should I not find it odd and scummy that you are unwilling to engage me here when I'd expect the first thing you'd do as town is to engage me?

It almost feels like you suggested that you be bussed in pregame but your team was on the fence about it so you guys decided that you'd stay away from me while you get your team to pressure me and lock me down.

And that's exactly what Aeronaut feels like he's doing.

I expect you to talk with me! jeez.

Camn finally posts:

I'm just hungover!
God!

Well, fine.

After all this 'theatre' RadiantCowbells is now happy with camn's simple "I'm just hungover!" explanation.

Camn, I think that you're town.

Besides the fact that she didn't immediately engage with me, she's been actually pretty towny, which makes me think that she's town.

This isn't a player simply changing his read (non-alignment indicative)... this is RadiantCowbells with a manufactured entrance and fake read, which inevitably ends with a predictable town-read on camn (reasons?>>>

"actually pretty towny, which makes me think that she's town"

= generic/easy town read).

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

If camn flips scum, does RadiantCowbells entrance into the game make him scum or town?

- Does scum-RadiantCowbells make an awkward entry into the game, with a uncomfortable scum-read/town-read flip-flop on his scum-partner?

The change from having a scum-read to town-read was

too easy

.

However, if we flip this round - why would scum-RadiantCowbells want to draw associations with scum-camn so early?

[Keyser Söze]

Here's the thing:

IF Camn is scum...
Trollie is scum.

No. Scum-TheTrollie does not make a bus-play

on D2

If TheTrollie is telling the truth about the Snoke/Kylo Ren investigation, scum-TheTrollie would not bus

(probably) the most powerful

scum role in the game.

[Keyser Söze]

Let me sort some of this out

Waiting...

I'm going to have to look over this. Will post soon.

Waiting...

RC is probably scum if camn is scum, I think. I'm pretty sure they both have the same alignment.

How did you get to

"probably scum"

and

"scum"

?
Show me

"I'm pretty sure they both have the same alignment."

What are your thoughts on Aeronaut?

[Keyser Söze]

IF Camn is scum...
Trollie is scum.

neat.
if i catch up and disagree im gonna have words for you.

you should probably talk about why your terrifically confident meta-read on her earlygame has devolved into "well here is this relation between these two players" because that seems very un-RC-esque of you.

I like this alot.

This is RadiantCowbells shitting on TheTrollie's GUILTY-investigation (he wants us to keep our attention focused on his indirect-"guilty" of Aeronaut and not on TheTrollie/camn):

I don't give a flying fuck who confirmed what.

He could be your partner planning to push a mislynch then say that there was obviously a framer as some shit. I'm not going to be a part of this shit.

I put myself first.

No.

I think it's plenty likely that

scum decided to throw a fake guilty

and hope that they could NK and have Aero talk his way out.

We lynch Aero today.

Your bud threw out a fake guilty

.
Stahp, you're scum. You're not a beloved anything.

I have no idea what's going on with the Camn guilty thing but I frankly don't trust it at all

.
If we don't lynch Aeronaut today, then when?

You think Trollie is my buddy?

Thats a silly thought.

Letting you live is a silly thought.

No.

Fuck off venmar.

We are lynching Aeronaut today; no questions

.

Thus, this is RadiantCowbells:
- discrediting TheTrollie
- scum-reading TheTrollie
- trying to keep the focus on his NOT TOWN guilty result on Aeronaut


However...

Gorkington enters the scene, talking alot of sense...

Support/trust grows for TheTrollie... (camn and Aeronaut are todays' definitive lynches)

RadiantCowbells senses the tide is turning...

he needs to change his position:

Here's the thing:

IF Camn is scum...
Trollie is scum.

[Keyser Söze]

Jesus, Trollie.

It is a given that I am not scum.
You throwing around the word "confirmed" doesn't change that, from my perspective.
And someone calling me scum is not really worth refuting.
OTOH, saying that you got mod-provided info about data I received in the night? THAT is worth setting the record straight about .
This outburst, though? Either you are town after all, and just totally misinformed. . . or Aero's partner, and desperately chainsawing. If you had real results, there are certainly actual protown ways to handle them, but that's for postgame.

I do not understand this

"meh"

reaction.

TheTrollie is calling you scum. He says he has results on you. Why are you not challenging him with pressure? He's either lying or telling the truth. You were more passionate/enthusiastic pushing his lynch on Day One


If someone fakes a guilty on me I would be like this (tearing their case apart):





But this is you right now:

[Keyser Söze]

...moreover, RadiantCowbells was adamant scum were throwing out a fake-guilty on camn (RadiantCowbells was playing the 'I've got a NOT TOWN guilty' PR card) even though RadiantCowbells wasn't even a 'cop'. I could understand town-paranoia if Radiant Cowbells actually had a cop-investigative role (i.e a counter-claim scenario versus TheTrollie) - thus, RadiantCowbells should have shown less resistance/opposition to TheTrollie's claims. The only thing he wanted was Aeronaut to die ASAP (the Serial Killer, an enemy to both town AND group scum).

[Keyser Söze]

also hold up, was rc fakeclaiming a guilty on aero or what?
am i missing something?

RadiantCowbells' first claim (cop-type):

Aero is not town aligned.

VOTE: Aeronaut

well you're not town so you're either scum or 3p.

RadiantCowbells' final claim (tracker):

Nope, you killed Tails.

No, I'm saying that I tracked you to the dead guy.

And you claimed a non visiting role.

[Keyser Söze]

Lonewolf venmar p much conftown imo

Show me how you got to

"p much conftown"

.

[Keyser Söze]

I think that it is much more likely Trollie is misinformed.
As I have mentioned, I think this is a complicated setup, and I don't think that follow-the-cop is the way to play it.
Part of the reason I keep pointing out the possibility of simple misinformation is to avoid a reflexive Trollie lynch after my flip.

These points interest me.

However, there is a strong reliance of there being a scum-miss-information power role.

Would xRECKONERx weaken our cop even more (even though we are already up against 5 scum) with an added miss-information PR? The mod has already confirmed there is no bastard element.

[Keyser Söze]

UNVOTE: camn

I want to hear more about TheTrollie's character.
Character claim please.

[Keyser Söze]

May I remind you all that we already had a MILLER flip - MILLER + Cop investigates guilty, cop's ID gets reported to scum faction is a

pretty damn weak investigative cohort in the game

.

Good point - I forgot Tails flipped

Miller

Doctor.

I want to hear more about TheTrollie's character.
Character claim please.

I've really liked Key but this is just blatent fishing.

I've already told you shitloads more than I wanted to about my role.

How can I be "fishing" if you've 'already told us shitloads' I am not role-fishing - I was interested in your character (flavour). A simple name will do.

[Keyser Söze]

Will catch up this weekend.

@xRECKONERx

- VC please.

[Keyser Söze]

ok, full claim time.

The name of my role is Ben Solo. Apparently my role is the inverse of Amman's; I'm third party, but under a few different conditions I could join The First Order [which I assume is group scum], which would change my role to Kylo Ren. I don't know exactly what powers I'd get for doing that.

My role as it stands only has a nightly kill, and something i'd forgotten that basically lets me pick a player each day that I can see if they have any non-scum PTs. If they are, I get to view secretly/ anonymously into that PT for the remainder of the day. I did this yesterday with Aneninen.

Trollie seems really sketchy as fuck to me today, so I was just looking through my role to see if anything contradicted what he has been spewing about lynchers and whatnot, and then I remembered I could use this.

You had one chance to roleclaim.
Townies don't lie.
This is a pure survival scum gambit.

[Keyser Söze]

I am Rey,

I can force sense for Kylo & Snoke, both mafia, but when I hit them, they are made aware of my presence and identity.

Camn came back as one of those two, and got a result this morning telling her about the fact that I am Rey.

Can we lynch camn now?

I actually like the flavour/character of this claim - it makes sense.


From the film... Snoke: "There has been an awakening... have you felt it?"

[Keyser Söze]

I won't be online til tomorrow gents, let's use the time wisely.

No quickhammer.

[Keyser Söze]

i dont buy it, i don't buy that aero just forgot some crucial part of his role

fuck dat

This. His roleclaim was the only thing that was going to keep him alive and he f****d up. You don't miss out role clauses like these. These role clauses are only manufactured later to escape a lynch.

I.e survival scum gambit.

[Keyser Söze]

I am happy to end this day gents. We can sort camn/The Trollie tomorrow. A guilty is a guilty but when scum admit to being scum you don't keep them around in hope of them carrying out town-motivated night actions.

Intent to hammer.

[Keyser Söze]

VOTE: Aeronaut

[Keyser Söze]

VOTE: Trollie

Definitely a slip.

Also I am a hated townie just fyi. Takes 2 less votes to lynch me.

Mm, I'm in favor of a massclaim. Since I claimed most of it earlier, I'll full claim now.

Oh my! I'm C-3PO, Human-Cyborg relations! And like I said, it takes 1 less than the majority of votes to lynch me because I'm a hated townie.

want to try that again?

Regarding Hated Townie, is it usually a standard amount of votes?

[Keyser Söze]

Camn's death = TheTrollie sorted IMO.

Gonna unpick yesterday - both wagons on First Order scum.

I have had access to a Night 0 Census. I have been told that there are

8

Town Win Cons in the game and

5

non-town win conditions.

Based on Venmar's info: that is 3 scum win-cons down, 2 to go.
Survival Traitor - Amihan
First Order - Aeronaut
First Order - camn
?
?

[Keyser Söze]

Radiant Cowbells' tracker investigation.

[Keyser Söze]

theres a part of me that feels like c3p0 is too fake sounding to actually be a fakeclaim :/

I was thinking I couldn't remember much of C-3PO in The Force Awakens film, but Aneninen flipped

Jessika Pava

im still feeling massclaim/popcorn.

Can I catch-up first (currently in another game approaching deadline).

in all seriousness though, i want to gamebreak this shit.

I think we need to anyway - with a possiblity of misslynch + 1/2 NK(s), it could be lynch scum or lose tomorrow.

[Keyser Söze]

Hi gents, I still won't be able to get into this game til tomorrow.

I am BB-8.

3-shot watcher (flavor: VIDEO UPLINK - I can hack into the security system and a monitor player with a camera)

N1: saw camn visit RC
N2: watched Venmar. No one visited.

[Keyser Söze]

Keyser:do you detect map movement as well or just PR use?

PR use only (there is no mention of map movement in PM) - Camn targeted RC N1. It wasn't a kill (as I would have seen a doctor target RC too). It wasn't a block (as RC received his tracker report).

I think scum had an investigative power.

At the time I thought it was a protective power (theory: Camn/RC scum team). If RC had roleclaimed like any other normal person I would have believed him straight away. No point fake-claiming a guilty on Aeronaut as a gambit The Tracker result from the start would have been suffice.

I targeted Venmar N2 because I thought he would have been a likely scum kill target (scum having a scum census makes less sense). Moreover, why would scum reveal this info? Information is power.

[Keyser Söze]

(1) town players do not forget whether they are L-1 or L-2 Hated
(2)the slip was not that you changed your response, the slip was that you played it off as accidentally hitting the wrong number on the keyboard when that is 100% not what happened, otherwise you wouldnt have pluralized "votes"

This.

I think the plural point is actually more damming than the L-1/L-2 slip.

[Keyser Söze]

If I get the map I can take a second census, but then the map is redistributed randomly.

second census - to confirm the alignment status of the traitor?
Finn, first Order >>> Resistance.

I doubt there would be any recruitment scum roles.

[Keyser Söze]

....
you targeted venmar over rc?
what?

Yes, RC was not my town-read. I did not like the

execution

of his roleclaim. Neither his

opposition/refusal to acknowledge

TheTrollie's guilty on camn.

N2: I wanted TheTrollie/camn/RC to resolve itself, which it did.

[Keyser Söze]

I did not expect to be alive today.


I targetted Venmar again - no one visited him.

@Extrapolated Eagle

- who did you roleblock?

[Keyser Söze]

I seriously thought I was going to be N3's NK. Outside of me, I think Venmar's role has the best chance of being NON-affiliated with any scum faction. Why would xRECKONERx give scum a scum-censor? It feels more logical to put it in the hands of a TOWN/Resistance player up against multiple scum (3 scum flips so far, out of possible 5). I did not expect the Gorkington NK (I town-read him but felt he could have been a SK-type role). I thought scum were going to target me > Venmar > TheTrollie > Gorkington > TheLoneWolf > Extrapolated Eagle.

[Keyser Söze]

Do not

use WIFOM to attack:

Key didn't get shot because he's scum,

Neither WIFOM to defend yourself:

If I'm scum you're saying that I either left a CLAIMED WATCHER OR ROLEBLOCKER alive and killed a one shot vig instead

Otherwise what you say loses all credibility.

I blocked wolf.

What is your current TheLoneWolf-read?

[Keyser Söze]

Yeah Key scum is very clear now.

Nothing is clear. You keep saying everything is simple and clear, and that the game "is way too easy" - it isn't mate.

You're just dismissing examining the night kill because you made it.

Show me where I 'dismissed examining the night kill'. This is a miss-rep, I intend to go over D1 - D3 and N1 - N3

thoroughly

.

[Keyser Söze]

If Eagle is Scum then he is a roleblocker right?

If Eagle is scum he could be scum-anything.

IF Eagle scum is a roleblocker who does it make the most sense for him to roleblock if he's going to leave them alive?

Again... Eagle is not a confirmed roleblocker.

Keyser did NOT claim to be roleblocked.

Therefore, if Eagle is scum, then Keyser HAS to be as well.

You are basing your argument on Eagle being the scum-roleblocker as a fact, which it isn't. Me not being roleblocked does not confirm me as scum, I do not understand why you are pushing this as conclusive proof.

Ok, let's see your analysis.

I'll do my Night 3 speculation this weekend.

The Gorkington NK admittedly made no sense to me (there were 3 more likely NK's IMO).

I'll address and tear apart your "Venmar+Keyser potential team" theory this weekend too.

[Keyser Söze]

I'll be online tonight or tomorrow morning.

[Keyser Söze]

because its takes a lot more effort for scum to do that sort of thing

Effort is not alignment indicative.

I told you I would catch up soon - I don't give a f**k what alignment you are right now,

but just unvote now please

. This could be LYLO.


I will address your flimsy night action speculation and weak role confirmation plea (which has nothing to do with alignmnet, you were not town masons) - as soon as I get home.

However, I cannot believe you voted. You haven't even heard what Venmar, Eagle and my slot has to say with 10 days left to deadline. If you are town you will be miss-lynched tomorrow (if there is a tomorrow).

[Keyser Söze]

Which SCUM pairings make sense to kill Gorkington?

This is already a non-argument. Scum are not found based on what scum pairings make the most sense. It would be an easy game otherwise. Let's just lynch the scummiest player. Your motivation to point our attention/focus to only this (instead of concentrating on both day/night phase play) is tactically short-sighted. I have seen many town miss-lynched based on flimsy night action speculation.

The two most POWERFUL ROLES-Watcher and roleblocker are the only kills that make sense because night play is important.

I agree that mine and Eagle's active power roles are the most important/dangerous to scum. But scum/SK could have a ninja-power to counter the tracker/watcher powers (the same way the cop had counter-powers to weaken it) but again this is a speculation.

LoneWolf+EAgle (since you can't implicate yourself) has to kill YOU Keyser, right? OR at least roleblock you. But neither happened.

I know what I am. I do not know what Eagle is. He may not even be a roleblocker. Him not roleblocking me does not mean I have to be scum. All we have seen is him 'roleblock' players who have died/non-active powers. Thus, no active/alive proof.

Eagle+Keyser- the two powerful roles- get to choose who to kill. On the offchance Gorkginton's map ability gave him another kill or something, thats the kill that makes sense.

We do not know why Gorkington was killed. Even if he was a 2 or 3 shot vig I doubt he would have targeted me, so this is unsupported paranoia.

Also Keyser has been soft pushign Venmar as confirmed town ebcause of census ability since yesterday and watching him for less than plausible reasons over obvious watch targets. Keyser's N2 Watch is in particularly questionable.

Is Venmar scum, LoneWolf? I am 'pushing' no one as "confirmed town". I am expressing why I think Venmar is town. The only confirmation bias/confirmed town pushing I see is your buddying with the Trollie slot and your attempt to use your neighbour role to confirm you as town. You pushing it as a trump card this late is laughable. It didn't mean s**t 3 days ago, and it doesn't mean s**t now - if it did, in my eyes scum would have killed you already - thus, you're still in my uncomfortable pile.

No way they let a Watcher live who could force a 1v1 situation in LyLo. No way they would give him free information.

Never rule out the impossible. Scum make calculated risks and decisions to make sure the focus is not on them the following day-phase.

His claim is also the shoddiest given his watch targets. Even his result on camn visiting RC screams inside info of what the scumteam actually has been doing with their Powers that haven't been reavealed.

Read the D2 day-phase, due to The Trollies' guilty result and my investigations on camn via RC's slot destroyed my town-read of camn. That was town-me working on the information infront of me. Not scum-me protecting camn. This is not "inside info" - I have been very clear with my thoughts/feelings in the day-phase.

also I want to bring back my point about the # of investigative roles claimed
me cop
RC tracker

does a key watcher in addition seem weird to ayone else?

I would expect usually two investigation roles in a normal set-up, but with 5 possible scum versus 8 townies, I expected an over-powered town.


Note:
The tracker/watcher had limited shots.
The cop could only investigate KyloRen/Snoke(?)
The doctor was miller.
We had a hated townie.

All roles with limitations.


Be online later.

[Keyser Söze]

I blocked wolf.

oh btw reason is i was roleblocked last night

What's the likelihood there is a scum roleblocker AND town RB?

Yes,

this doesn't make sense

- why would Extrapolated Eagle block TheTrollie but then claim he roleblocked TheLoneWolf? That either means there is 1) a scum roleblocker ontop of the town roleblocker 2) Extrapolated Eagle is the scum-roleblocker and messed up his claim 3) TheTrollie is lying about being roleblocked.

[Keyser Söze]

@TheTrollie - who did you try to investigate lastnight (no result)?

[Keyser Söze]

But Keyser has been avoiding this thread and hasn't even pretended to add anything useful for at least a week now

"avoiding the thread"

-

false scum narrative

. I have been on unofficial V/LA since March 28th.

I'm voting Keyser for a combination of role claim (botched fakeclaim imo) and his dayplay today.

The only

"botched fakeclaim"

is Extrapolated Eagle's where he said he blocked you, but TheTrollie was roleblocked too/instead.

I.e the shit does not lie in my play or claim, but Eagle's which I want clarity from.

I'm willing to lynch Dwlee on the same grounds as Snarky, just bad and if town will lose us the game inevitably.

so I should probably vote actual scum this time

VOTE: Keyser

You voting early in possible LYLO shouts bad-town or desperate scum.



What is the VC? (deadline).

[Keyser Söze]

Hi guys, I was on VLA, but back in the country now.

I won't be online til later today.

[Keyser Söze]

I'm only 3-shot Watcher.

Speak soon.

[Keyser Söze]

Keyser:do you detect map movement as well or just PR use?

PR use only (there is no mention of map movement in PM) - Camn targeted RC N1. It wasn't a kill (as I would have seen a doctor target RC too). It wasn't a block (as RC received his tracker report).

I think scum had an investigative power.

At the time I thought it was a protective power

(theory: Camn/RC scum team)

. If RC had roleclaimed like any other normal person I would have believed him straight away. No point fake-claiming a guilty on Aeronaut as a gambit The Tracker result from the start would have been suffice.

I targeted Venmar N2 because I thought he would have been a likely scum kill target (scum having a scum census makes less sense). Moreover, why would scum reveal this info? Information is power.

FOUND A GEM

Also this is proof that Keyser knew there was two scum teams.

I didn't know until just today


but Keyser has known there were two man scumteams all along.

Both because of the size of his theory (2 people)

AND

because he thought they woul dhav ea PROTECTIVE ROLE.

Whos mind thinks scum have a protective role? They only need one if multiple factions exists.

Yeah

I'm so ready to vote now

especially since Keyser doesn't have a gulty result on Venmar which would've been the ONLY thing to make me hesistate

That was set-up speculation by me based on my role, my scum-reads and the information infront of me.

It was not me knowing there was multi-scum. Many people speculated there was multi-scum.

How could I have a guilty result on Venmar?

If you are town you need to unvote NOW.

[Keyser Söze]

A combination of poor effort/newb-decisions from me in the mid-to-late stages ruined the chance of an Underworld Scum WIN - sorry Extrapolated Eagle/Dwlee99.

I fully enjoyed the first 2 days though, scum-hunting First Order Mafia.

Congratulations TOWN, excellent reasoning versus two powered scum teams.

Thank you to xRECKONERx too - an entertaining/challenging set-up, with quality/well-written flavour content.