Mini 1768: Detective Conan Mafia (Game Over: Town Wins)

[Tails]

Vote Garmr

It's the overreaction, kiro.

[Tails]

hey Tails! how's my loathsome copy?

It's giving me bedroom eyes.

do you think that garmr is fake overreacting, or do you think that scum are more likely to overreact?

I really don't see why town garmr would have reacted with a vote to what was essentially a light prod. I would expect something along the same lines to feel Soren out. The vote shows that he was self-conscious.

[Tails]

Sometimes I just feel like being a troll. I blame Scourge for appealing to the non-trollish part of me.



There. Fixed.

[Tails]

I actually have Garmr as a Town read. Why? Because he reminds me of myself! See, in my Newbie and off-site games, I was consistently called scummy for "overreacting" while really just doing my best not to go down.

Except Garmr is more experienced and a lot more capable of keeping a clear head. Soren got under his skin with that one post. Garmr would have shrugged it off otherwise.

Now, Scourge on the other hand.... Scourge I don't like. I get a sense that he's sort of riding Nick's coattails, which isn't terrible, especially considering the quality of Mr. Wright's posts, but it's something to watch out for, and worth my vote for now.

Explain this more.

[Tails]

Why is there so much sonic in this game?

Because ever since sonics recent games sucked cough sonic boom cough the characters from the show have failed to find work.

WILL TROLL FOR FOOD

[Tails]

Please tell me Chicken is in the Barn too.

[Tails]

Barn is scum if Garmr is town.

[Tails]

I can't. I'm a horrible shot.

[Tails]

@Garmr: I think you would have done some light poking first. Soren's post could absolutely come from a town mindset just trying to comprehend your actions. Questioning him and trying to get his mindset would have been more productive than voting him and being antagonistic. Furthermore, you know this. I've seen you break out the subtlety before. You felt threatened and overreacted. You being scum is not a far off conclusion.

That being said, Barn's defense of you is making me uncomfortable.

[Tails]

@Garmr: I remember blacklisting you for a bit after you threw Fire and Ice. I still think your play is better than you're trying to present it.

[Tails]

That's only a scum post if Phoenix is scum with one of Garmr/Soren and doesn't want to get involved in the fight. I think it's more likely town, though.

[Tails]

If both are town and Phoenix is scum, he would have said town/town or let it go on.

[Tails]

Unvote
Vote Barn

I get not liking accounts with a similar style to what I've chosen to adopt here (occasionally), but I've been putting in some pretty good input as of late. You're just choosing to address policy matters over gameplay in order to avoid actually producing content.

[Tails]

@Garmr: It sounds like someone trying to get out of RVS and develop a read on another player. At most it's null.

[Tails]

And everybody is seriously missing that scum does not say what Phoenix did.

[Tails]

Okay. I think it's scum driven. You?

[Tails]

you're referring to how scum phoenix would have called it tvt? if so, i don't really agree... i think phoenix's post could have come from either alignment. scum like to call things TvS.

I think he would have either voted one, distanced from the fight, or defend whoever was town here (this is where tvt comes in if they're both town). What he did does not benefit him at all as scum. It makes a lot of sense coming from someone who doesn't have any outside information.

[Tails]

@turtles of despair You're not trying to get a read on me. I have more votes than everyone else and so far you've just tried to justify your position on the wagon

What do you think of my votes on you after realizing this was a misunderstanding on your part?
~Bee

It sounds like you think he is town.

[Tails]

@Scourge: I don't think I've played with anyone in the Barn hydra before. They were essentially posting a throw away line targeting the type of player I modeled this alt after. Given you have experience with MS, you know exactly what I'm talking about here.

[Tails]

i'm not really convinced on nick's alignment, but i was wondering who you think the scum on that wagon are.

Barn for sure. Not sure on Turtle's alignment. Seeing how that plays out. Other than that, I need a vc to see who else is on the wagon.

[Tails]

I have a little over 3 years of experience.

[Tails]

Why does it matter where she's played?

[Tails]

What's your problem with

splinter

sonic?

[Tails]

I'm really not seeing the connection.

[Tails]

VOTE: Phoenix Wright

impersonating a

prosecutor

is a serious crime, Mr. Wright.

VOTE: ARS

I don't see how that's scummy.

[Tails]

Barn and Garmr are being weird

Weird how?

[Tails]

I'm really not liking the pirate.

[Tails]

Their focus is on piddly stuff and not on what matters. I still have no idea why they're pushing Radical Rat, even though I've asked them multiple times. It just feels like they're still playing RVS instead of looking for scum.

[Tails]

Not to mention how bad an idea double lynching on d1 is.

[Tails]

Not to mention how bad an idea double lynching on d1 is.

Ye must have barnacles for brains, or are accustomed to makin' non-scurvy pirates walk the plank on Day 1.

So without any information gathered from deaths and interactions, we are supposed to kill 2 people of unknown alignment and lose 1 town to scum nk? You're right. That's a much better idea.

[Tails]

If we had the capabilities of a double lynch, I'd much rather save it for d2 at the earliest, when we actually had more information to go on.

[Tails]

But Pirate's hunger for a double lynch doesn't match her also wanting a Turtle's lynch. The priorities are wrong from a town perspective.

[Tails]

Unvote
Vote Pirate

[Tails]

Tails

: you're the one who asked Sonic to explain. how do you feel about his unvote after not finding much of a case?

As an action, null. But I think his overall play leans towards town.

[Tails]

Tails, in 300 you said that Yarrgami wanted to lynch Turtles. she doesn't, and she pointed this out to you. why are you voting her when the contradiction you found wasn't a contradiction?

I may be wrong there (got mixed up in the pirate lingo), but that's not why I'm voting them.

[Tails]

Might also be a roommate situation.

[Tails]

@Pirate: Why are you so sure that Sonic's actions mean scum instead of just new? I'd imagine you would be taking that into account.

[Tails]

YOU IDIOT!!! OF COURSE THAT MEANS MAFIA WILL KILL YOU TONIGHT SO THAT I CAN BE MISLYNCHED TMR???

This does not match Kain's previous held stances.

[Tails]

Also that wasn't a hammer.

[Tails]

I unvoted Barn. Phoenix was the L-1 vote.

[Tails]

Garmr, does your ability prevent us from lynching Barn at all today?

[Tails]

NM voted before Turtles.

[Tails]

Vote Barn

[Tails]

[Tails]

I'm thinking that might have been a bus vote.

[Tails]

[Tails]

Barn now. Kain later.

[Tails]

I'm alive! Woot!

Vote Kain

This Soren wagon is yicky.

[Tails]

(arguably, Turtles' double vote is, but it's not nightkillable)

Why isn't Turtles nkable?

[Tails]

I want to talk to the Pirates. Bring in the Pirates!

[Tails]

Okie. Your logic still sucks.

[Tails]

tails why is the Soren wagon yicky?

A super quick wagon builds up based on super easily pushable BS. The wagon is easy for scum to push, and given that it built up really quickly, chances are they did. Everyone is forgetting that Barn had ample opportunity to claim but didn't. They're instead focusing on Soren's hammer, which is bad, but not scum indicative. Soren's response to you also is not scum indicative. In fact, it points in the opposite direction. Scum would be pandering to you, not telling you to go screw yourself. There's just no benefit to scum Soren for any of these moves.

do you have a strong case for Kain being scum? because he's super mislynchable honestly and i cannot figure out how to read him when all his weird behaviour is just how he plays all the time.

I have a few things that I think point in that direction. Is it super strong? No. But it's stronger than the Soren case.

[Tails]

To be fair, Scourge, I really expected more from you when dealing with the Soren situation. Your handling of it seems lazy.

[Tails]

I'll tell you more later after I talk to the pirate. I will say that his vote history is horrible.

[Tails]

However, if you want a suspicious vote on the Soren wagon, look at Sonic.

[Tails]

You seem really focused on the easy target, and I just don't feel your pushes have much depth. I got a going through the motions vibe.

[Tails]

Keep in mind, this is just in regards to Soren. I keep thinking you're not looking too far into it.

[Tails]

Did the wagon building up that quickly not worry you at all?

[Tails]

@Pirates: I was talking about Kain, not you. How do you feel about him?

[Tails]

Tails did you happen to check out the really fast votes on Barn on day 1? i would have expected you to bring some of those up.

You mean the real fast votes that only happened once the vc was reset? And still it took awhile for people to decide to vote that way? Yeah...Real mysterious...

[Tails]

I need to stop. My Bulba snark is acting up.

[Tails]

Because that wagon didn't come out of nowhere. The original Barn wagon was a slow burn. That was just rekindling it after Garmr reset the VC. I was surprised that it took as long as it did to get the wagon back up.

[Tails]

You gave me what I wanted pirate. I think I have something that points to Kain-scum, but I think I need some time to make sure I'm right.

Unvote
Vote Radical Rat

[Tails]

Sonic's vote on Soren is opportunistic, and he's overjustifying his being on the wagon.

[Tails]

Soren was an easy vote to push, and you used easy and stale reasoning to push it. Moreover, you forced your arguments in order to justify why you were voting there.

[Tails]

Unvote

I'm thinking this puts more points in the Kain scum pile. Going to sit more on this, but yeah.

[Tails]

Well.

That was an unexpected flip.

Soren, why did you hammer that? We were all waiting on a claim, and by hammering you prevented us from saving Barn's life.
I'm sorry, but no matter how you slice it, ending the day prematurely before the main wagon can even speak in their own defense, is scummy. VOTE: Soren


As for Garmr's kill, I don't think we can really read into it. I'll take the blame for him being targeted though, as I pointed out they'd be confirmed Town if Barn flipped Town. I told the Mafia they couldn't mislynch him, so they NKed him.

Guess that means no Doc too.

Phoenix, I want you to take a look at this.

And as for the quotes you selected, they're very paint by numbers and was not really adding anything of value. It would be easy for scum Sonic to say.

[Tails]

????

Just going to leave this here in case I'm killed tonight.

[Tails]

Pirate, I want to know why you think a double voter is scum.

[Tails]

Looking back, the RB claim is well supported.

[Tails]

Vote Frozen Angel

[Tails]

i wanna know why you think a double voter can't be scum?

It's overpowered unless town is uber powered.

[Tails]

Vote Frozen Angel

i'll sheep you on this if your reasoning for it is what i think it is.

I don't feel like voting anyone else, and I can't remember a thing she's done.

[Tails]

nobody has voted him so i want to put some pressure

Umm...

Unvote
Vote Pirate

[Tails]

Kain

Explain this one.

[Tails]

Kain

Explain this one.

Don't think he would troll as scum.

That's a horrible explanation.

[Tails]

There's a cat on your head.

[Tails]

There's an ointment for that.

[Tails]

I want to know how Kain thinks Sonic is being opportunistic.

[Tails]

Did the wagon building up that quickly not worry you at all?

3 votes isn't some massive wagon

even if it was a massive wagon what was so horrifying about it ? if you beleive scum were in the voters , then how exactly you were thinking a quick hammer would have happened? and even if a hammer was about to happen and you had soren as scum , then it was bussing, why is that insta lynch bad? unless your branching around?

When multiple votes join in a wagon in that short of a time, I get nervous. This was especially true given what Soren was being pushed for. I'd have expected more resistance if he was scum. As for my read on him, I admittedly don't have much of one. I just didn't find his quickhammer the day before to be that scummy.

[Tails]

Barn had been the defacto wagon for awhile, there had still been some time since he had been placed at L-1, and he chose to prodge. What more did you expect Soren to do other than just go through the motions?

[Tails]

Why 3p instead of mafia?

[Tails]

@Pirate: When exactly did NM target you?

[Tails]

So...PR.

[Tails]

Unvote
Vote Kain

YOLO!

[Tails]

Unvote
Vote Kain

YOLO!

fa is most likely scum, it is just a matter of finding her partners.

I'm starting to feel pretty solid on Kain.

[Tails]

I am Spartacus!

[Tails]

Curses! Foiled Again!

[Tails]

Vote Phoenix

Pirate, follow me. It's Phoenix/Kain.

[Tails]

hard defense of FA for no reason > pushing for a policy lynch today after the hammer > trying to tie other players to FA before the flip and before she outed herself

Phoenix is scum.

[Tails]

Read Phoenix's ISO from the start of the FA wagon on. It's obvious.

[Tails]

I'm talking about yesterday. He started trying to push wanting policy lynch NM yesterday after the hammer. He then switched from that to trying to tie NM to FA BEFORE she even admitted to being scum. I'm just saying what happened in order, but let's just summarize it as lining up lynches and call it a day.

P-edit: I think he was desperate there, which explains why he changed tactics dramatically.

[Tails]

And I think your Turtles point is dumb. Absence means squat in terms of one day. And I still think town would have to have a lot more than a 1-shot governer to deal with a scum double voter.

[Tails]

Frozen angel is town, guys. That's what my gut tells me

Hard town read. Phoenix is lying about his reasons for townreading FA. If it was just because of her reaction, he would have told us in the next post instead of saying he couldn't answer the question (indicating a role based result).

When she flips, we should lynch not Mafia. This quick hammer stuff needs to stop

not mafia is town though i think......

I thought he was scum even before this hammer. And no offense, but I don't really trust your reads

Goes after NM based on policy. This is right after FA obviously hammered herself, so this is blatantly untrue.

Wow... I'm still new here, but I'm pretty sure you're not supposed to give us hints like that about your scum buddies, right? Correct me if I'm wrong

Said right after FA admitted she was scum. NM was on the wagon. See where this is going?

I think not mafia is town though

Why?

He's dropped the policy angle on NM, but NM is still scum. Guess what he's using to tie NM to FA (and if you guessed FA's hard bus reasoning, ding ding ding! You're a winner!).

P-edit: I'm feeling really good about a Phoenix lynch. That claim is BS.

[Tails]

I'm suddenly also feeling really paranoid about Scourge...

[Tails]

As for Turtles, games are inherently scum sided to start with. Balancing involves giving town enough power to counteract scum's natural advantage plus whatever roles they have. Giving scum a double voter drastically increases that advantage, meaning that town needs an incredible amount of power to even stand a chance. Just 1 governor isn't going to do it. I guess it's possible, but I'd rather start at the position of not screwed instead of scum having an incredible amount of power and us having almost total power to compensate. And besides the double voter point, I've seen nothing given to even suggest why Turtles is scum.

[Tails]

And let's not even get started on Turtles being a target of convenience at this point. It's been that way since the end of d1.

[Tails]

preview: once again, you're attributing WAY too much power to a scum double voter, and you're townreading him way too much. NOTHING has suggested that the slot is town either, and you've yet to bring anything up to the contrary.

And you've yet to bring up anything that makes him scum outside of the double voter thing and Garmr's flip. Burden of proof is on you, dude.

[Tails]

So in the end, you have no reason why Turtles is scum. Yet when I say that I see reasons to see he's not scum, you criticize me. Yeah...

[Tails]

So in the end, you have no reason why Turtles is scum. Yet when I say that I see reasons to see he's not scum, you criticize me. Yeah...

That's not at all what Scourge said. She said it's process of elimination, which IS a reason for Turtles to be scum.
And while I agree that a mafia double voter seems kinda sketchy, I don't see it as turning scum into an omnipotent force of destruction like you're claiming.

My null read on Turtles has yet to move, but my scumread on you grows stronger by the second.

Except PoE isn't a reason to call my stance on Turtles, which is legitimate, crap. It's just as valid, given that Scourge doesn't have a case. PoE is not a case. It's just "Well, I'm just down to this person because I've ruled everyone out.". And if that's Scourge's only reason, then he can't then get all huffy that I'm ruling Turtles out as scum based on setup spec. If Scourge had other reasons, that'd be different. Otherwise, this goes down to a difference of opinion, which I would think Scourge would see and go "Well, whatever." and just leave it at that. Otherwise, it falls to him to convince me

why

Turtles is scum outside his say so.

[Tails]

PoE is a personal evaluation. It does zero good in trying to convince someone that they're wrong. In this case, BoP falls to Scourge. My ruling out Turtles as scum due to role reasons is just as valid as Scourge ruling him in based on other reads.

[Tails]

I'm sorting comics.

[Tails]

How do you have Kain as null?

[Tails]

And you don't have a read on him at all, given that he has posted in the game?

[Tails]

I know, right?

[Tails]

@Phoenix: Why weren't you suspicious at all of Sonic's roleblocker claim d2?

[Tails]

Pirategami: Do you honestly think that town has both a roleblocker and a JK?

[Tails]

Would it be any different if you didn't know who I am? And if it was a big deal, why didn't you request for me to replace in with my main?

[Tails]

Do you honestly think that town has both a roleblocker and a JK?

That's essentially a counter claim in a mini. Normal mode of thought is that Sonic is scum or there's something screwy going on.

[Tails]

Pirategami: Do you honestly think that town has both a roleblocker and a JK?

I am getting around to that but I prioritize in thread play over set spec since the pple who do set up spec tend to get it wrong.

town role pm>>>>town motivation>>>>town posts

How about: town JK sees roleblocker claim>>>>town response is to see that as impossible given role>>>>suspicion ensues

Phoenix did none of that. What now?

[Tails]

So the mod responded to my pm about if my night action when through. They said that they derped :/

Spoiler: non-sequiter

[Tails]

Pirategami: Do you honestly think that town has both a roleblocker and a JK?

So, having a roleblocker and a JK on Town is crazy OP.
Having a double voter on mafia is crazy OP.

So... if both are true, your set up spec makes everything check out for Turtles to be scum, and Phoenix and I to be Town, no?

Unless... your read on someone who's been absent for over half the game is strong enough to make you SURE Turtles is Town...

The only way Turtles can be scum is if both you and Phoenix are town and telling the truth, which I think is unlikely. I'm fairly sure Phoenix is scum here.

And if both of you are town, this game is just stupid.

[Tails]

Okay, let's take another route. My role in conjunction with Sonic's counters Phoenix. There is no way he's town.

[Tails]

you can't say anything with 100% certainty with setup spec until you've seen everything the scum has, Tails. mods can and will give similar or duplicate roles to players! i personally haven't played in games like that yet, but i've seen them.

you're arguing for Turtles town based on his power being OP, and you're arguing against other players being town because they'd be too OP for town. stop with this nonsense, it's grating.

These are legit reasons for why I'm reaching the conclusion I am. Good game design vs. incredibly poor design. You're arguing for poor design because PoE i.e. "I has good feels about everyone else. Who cares what actual game info says.". At this rate, if I actually came out with a cop innocent on Turtles, you'd argue against it because it doesn't fit your view of the game. I am looking at it from a pure game design standpoint, using information that is both public and private, and I'm telling you that Phoenix's role does not make sense as town unless the mod made the worst designed game in the history of mafia scum. And the only reason that Turtles will be scum is if she did exactly that. So I'm going to err on the side of not complete stupidity and say that Turtles is town and Phoenix is freaking scum.

[Tails]

I also feel like you're cherry picking here.

[Tails]

I mean, it's down to either a bad case of confirmation bias, or you're just scum just trying to hard push this through.

[Tails]

so, Tails, Turtles is a double-voter whose double-vote doesn't work in lylo. can you tell me how OP that is for scum? hint: it isn't at all, and so doesn't stop him from being scum, so he should really be a null read for you at

best

, and definitely not discounted for scum.

Double voter is still a powerful role for scum. The caveat for Lylo is something I'd expect either way.

[Tails]

what do you think about the scenario of having both Phoenix and Turtles as the scum?

If that's the case, town is almost all PRs.

[Tails]

Look, I'm the doctor. There's no way town has a doctor, roleblocker, AND a JK. And if there is, I'm never ever ever going to play another Jeanne or Varsoon game.

[Tails]

Oh, and add Titus to that list, because I joined this game because she said it was good.

[Tails]

And at this point, I'm really starting to see where Fire is coming from.

[Tails]

why are you assuming Sonic is town

The way the claim worked out yesterday fits him being town. It's how I got a townread on the neighborhood too.

why are you assuming scum doesn't have some Strongman shots

They might, but I'm starting to find it unlikely given how things have played out.

Point is, I don't see town having 2 protective roles. I don't see town having 2 blocking roles. And I definitely don't see town having the separate component roles plus the combination. Phoenix's role doesn't fit from a town design perspective. He's scum.

[Tails]

Look, if I'm wrong on Phoenix, which I'm not, then I'll join you on Turtles tomorrow. But I'm not budging from this slot, because I'm essentially on conf. scum.

[Tails]

And for completion: Ran Mouri, Doctor. I protected Turtles n1 and Pirategami n2.

[Tails]

Pirates, I'm getting why Fire is frustrated. I have scum trying to slip away from me here. I've got them dead to rights. I need some more help.

[Tails]

Apparently they didn't. Look over Phoenix's posts.

[Tails]

And personally, if I was a town protective role, and my target died, strongman or roleblocker (Sonic) would be my first thought. And if the roleblocker claimed otherwise, I'd consider the strongman before claiming. Phoenix did not do that. Then he took it back later. Point is, I've not seen what I'd expect to see from town with his claimed role.

[Tails]

That was my point before I felt forced to claim. Phoenix's actions do not match up with his claimed role. He showed 0 suspicion of Sonic d2, even though he should have seen that as a counter claim i.e. scum claim (such as how I felt about his role in relation to mine), and then after he claimed a protection on NM, he didn't even consider a strongman and tried to lynch Sonic with the lying reasoning (something I would have also expected more from him as town a day earlier). Only later does he decide to "ask" the mod. Wouldn't that be something he'd do right away before outing if he was town?

[Tails]

@Pirates: The more I play this game, the more I get angry at just the game in general. And I'm hoping beyond all hope that this game follows some form of sanity, because if not, I'm done.

[Tails]

But he should have been at least suspicious of Sonic's roleblocker claim. He wasn't.

[Tails]

Just to make sure I'm understanding this, you guys think I'm scum because I don't know how setups work? That's basically what it sounds like.

I think you're scum because you haven't been reacting how I'd expect you to as town. And also, there's no way your role is a town one.

[Tails]

Tails, want to just lynch Turtles today?

No. If it's Phoenix or Turtle, and Phoenix is conf. scum, then I'm freaking not voting Turtle.

[Tails]

Did anyone else notice that Tails disappeared as soon as all the attention went onto me and turtles?

I was reading a book.

[Tails]

turtles, i'm not going to do it when you've responded to every single post i made. you KNOW what my case is, you were there while i was posting it.
you can't demand anything from me.

All I've gotten from you is PoE. I'm concerned.

[Tails]

Did anyone else notice that Tails disappeared as soon as all the attention went onto me and turtles?

I don't blame him.

This game is a shit show.

And he isn't getting his lynch on you right now.

He turned it into one lol

Spoiler: flip

[Tails]

You keep saying I'm confirmed scum but you don't have anything to back that up. Stop embarrassing yourself

Doctor, JK, Roleblocker. Not all of those claims are town. And I'm going to put my money on the claim that is countered by two others.

[Tails]

Tails look at beeboy's posts today since i started pushing and tell me that they're coming from town.

I think they're reasonable and could come from either alignment.

[Tails]

Did anyone else notice that Tails disappeared as soon as all the attention went onto me and turtles?

I don't blame him.

This game is a shit show.

And he isn't getting his lynch on you right now.

He turned it into one lol

Spoiler: flip

What does that mean?

I just flipped you the bird.

[Tails]

I'm 100% town from my perspective. Your claim counters my claim, so right off the bat that screams scum to me. Then we have the roleblocker claim, which you did nothing to refute yesterday, which further counters your claim as town. That's pretty cut and dry to me.

[Tails]

I'm going to bed. I expect Phoenix votes from Turtles.

[Tails]

Unvote

I'm on Scourge. Phoenix and Sonic need to block in {Fire, Soren, Kain}. Scourge should probably track one of the roleblockers. If there's a kill, we're getting some conf. town. If there's not, we still get some information from Scourge, and we're still in the same good position. We need to sort the last 3 fast. Phoenix and Sonic can try to plan in thread if they want (could give us multiple conf. town), or they don't have to if they're paranoid. I'm done fighting about this.

[Tails]

@Soren: I feel really bad, but only because I felt forced to claim. I missed any crumbs you were throwing. All you had to do was tell me it was more than PoE, and I probably would have not pushed my Turtles point as hard.

[Tails]

And yeah, this definitely throws a lot of what I'm saying out the window. I could be right, and Phoenix could still be scum, but it's a lot less certain now. If I'd known that a day or two ago, I'd have kept my role to myself and stayed on you in secret.

[Tails]

Yeah, Scourge should claim the result. That might be the person we want unblocked.

[Tails]

Vote Turtles

Don't really know if this is needed or not...

[Tails]

I wish I knew if they followed Sonic's plan. There's only 1 choice if so.

[Tails]

I really don't think so.

[Tails]

I'll explain after Scourge and Sonic talk.

[Tails]

And that's why I thought Firebringer was unlikely. Sonic just cleared him.

[Tails]

Vote Soren

[Tails]

n1 - Turtles
n2 - Pirategami
n3 - Scourge

[Tails]

Fire. Is. Confirmed. Town.

Seriously, the amount of wanting to lynch outside of the lynch dictated by night actions is disturbing. At least Fire wants to lynch someone who hasn't been cleared.

We are lynching Soren today. And I will be suspect of anyone who refuses to do so.

[Tails]

Let me break this down even further: The only way Fire can even be scum is if he's ascetic. And an ascetic does not make the Phoenix kill. That is someone vulnerable to blocking. That leaves Soren, Pirategami, Sonic, Scourge, and myself. And as we're ruling out the claimed PRs for now, that leaves Soren and Pirategami as the lynch. Seeing as I think Pirategami is town due to play, I think this is a no brainer.

[Tails]

I want a Soren lynch, but Mollie is playing pro-scum right now.

[Tails]

And you want to talk play? Fire-scum kills either Pirategami or me.

[Tails]

Soren should end it. In the event he does not, Sonic should be on Pirategami.

[Tails]

No. I'm saying your lynch should end the game.

[Tails]

I protected Scourge.

I'm starting to think it's either Sonic or Scourge. The kills still don't make sense coming from Kain or Fire. I should be dead in those instances.

[Tails]

To be fair, I requested it as well, and it was the only move that made sense.

If it's Sonic, he had a built in excuse for the kill. If it's Scourge, then the target claims are BS and easily fakable, since all his results match where we told Phoenix and Sonic to go. My problem with that one is that he'd bus Turtles, but it could have been a very sound decision. It could be Fire or Kain as an ascetic, but again, I just think the kill choices would have been different. And as for me...I'm kinda screwed by this endgame. And it depends on if you guys think I'd set up an endgame so inadvantageous for myself when I could have let Pirategami, Fire, and Scourge ignore the results of yesterday and eat each other alive.

Safest lynch is Sonic. If he's scum, then we win. If scum is ascetic, then his role is more a hindrance than a help. Scourge is potentially more useful, and I'd like to gamble and hope he's town here. And no matter what, I'm the largest thing standing between scum and their goal, as scum can't perform an action and kill on the same night.

[Tails]

Nope. If they're ascetic, and they'd have to be since both you and Phoenix blocked them, Scourge would be unable to track them. Which means that he'd be blind to you if you're scum. I'd be trapped by my claim as scum, which means that Scourge could easily catch me, or I'd be forced to out myself. An ascetic would be forced to kill me to keep Scourge in the dark. All in all, you're the best kill, as you still pose some semblance of a threat to town. Going into night with Fire, Kain, Scourge, and myself means that Scourge either confirms me as town or confirms one of us as scum. Either way, we're in a much better informed Lylo. Granted, Scourge-scum would enter holding all the cards, but that's something to ponder about later.

[Tails]

Vote Radical Rat

[Tails]

Wait on what?

[Tails]

Should the same not be true for a JK and a Doctor, since a JK is essential a hybrid RBer/Doc? Yet you never brought that bit up.

That was why I claimed. I saw my role as a counter to his, but initially didn't want to claim, because I felt I could get him lynched without it. When I saw that was impossible, I saw no choice but to claim. The only reason why I didn't push that further was Scourge outing herself and her guilty on Turtles. Otherwise, I would have pushed the counter claim point until one of us was dead.

[Tails]

Actually, that's another reason why I'm really doubting Scourge is scum. She could have sat back and let that happen.

[Tails]

????

I do want to know what this is about.