Mini 1820 — Lazy Summer Mafia (Game Over)

[Manuel87]

VOTE: Naomi-Tan

No vote in your first post this seems fishy

[Manuel87]

Considering that Mafia has daytalk i think Infinity and RB could be scummbuddys trying to fake a towny conversation.

[Manuel87]

Considering that Mafia has daytalk i think Infinity and RB could be scummbuddys trying to fake a towny conversation.

This is a scum slip town has no way of knowing scum have day talk.

You should consider reading the rules and setup.

[Manuel87]

Considering that Mafia has daytalk i think Infinity and RB could be scummbuddys trying to fake a towny conversation.

This is a scum slip town has no way of knowing scum have day talk.

Now the question is whether

this

is a faked townslip or not...

Neither because you could have missed the rule with either alignment

[Manuel87]

Also manuel throwing shade and not adding anything useful is bleh. Though it could be town paranoia.

You gave each other a lot of towncredit and ppl started to follow with that.
Seenig that some ppl didnt read the daytalk rule i was right in mentioning it.

About being pressured i didnt really feel any of that since alle of the votes were RVS votes :/

UNVOTE: Naomi-Tan

Its a little early for reads but right now i think Rem is town and and Raskolnikov feels scummy
As mentioned i didnt really like your interaction with RB so ill keep that in mind.
Naomi-Tan is confusing but i dont see her as scummy right now.

[Manuel87]

@Naomi: Well its weekend you cant expect much content right now.

I still dont see Rems reaction to my post as a possible townslip since you could have made that mistake with either alignment.
But i understand Aristophanes argument that the reaction itself could still have been faked since its more likely for town to push in that situation because scum should know that we know they have daytalk after town mentions it.
But thats a little deep for a townslip in my opinion.

@Raskolnikov: Do you think DGB is scummy or did you just want to get her attention by voting her?

[Manuel87]

I have to say i like your enthusiasm and starting conversations is always a good thing so keep it up.

I liked your readslist i have some reads i disagree on but i can understande them.

I get what you mean but i think its to early to really give Rem that much towncredit for that.

[Manuel87]

I have to say i like your enthusiasm and starting conversations is always a good thing so keep it up.

I liked your readslist i have some reads i disagree on but i can understande them.

I get what you mean but i think its to early to really give Rem that much towncredit for that.

Which ones do you like? Be specific.

I liked her readslist because it reflects her personality if that makes sens. Or in other words its close to the reads i had expected from Naomi.

Savage is replaced and Slandaar, JJD, Draynth have no content so far so nothing to add to that. But i dont think pressuring one of them will help us.

I already mentioned i didnt like the interaction between you and Infinity since you showered each other with towncredit really early in the game for a move that could have easily been made up.

I kinda agree on Raskolnikov, IPS and Rem but the "will be a while before im willing to think otherwise" part is odd

Not sure about Aristophanes right now so no comment about that at the moment

[Manuel87]

I'm not using it to make excuses, so how is that scummy?

My reasoning is, well, reasonable for this early on d1, and IPS called it out as scumy. Same with vibes.

Vote me for my reasoning if you think it's bad, not for my idea about the game.

Actually you did use it as an excuse after IPS explained his scumread on you.

VOTE: Infinity 324

@IPS: Why do you think i havent delivered anything of note yet?
Also can you pls explain your townreads?

[Manuel87]

I'm not using it as an excuse to scumhunt less than I otherwise would, I'm just going with what I got.

But thats not the reason why IPS was scumreading you. Your answer has nothing to do with that or what rb was saying.

[Manuel87]

Do you agree with what IPS was saying?

Not really i just didnt like your response to his reasoning.

I wanted to stay on the manuel wagon for pressure

I think i mentioned that before but why should i feel pressured by RVS votes? If i get killed by that i am happy to get into a new game.

Actually I guess he's not voting for Infinity. But YOU voted for Infinity based on something Slander said that you've now learned is complete BS.

Not really he voted him for his response to Slandaar. When Infinity asked what he could have asked, LQ and Slandaar gave different arguments.

Asking for a link to why rb would think you would call it out would have been something.

Slandaars reasoning is actually fine compared to LQs so why do you think it is BS?

Will check on some old ISOs of Naomi and then LQ to see how they played in other games.

UNVOTE: Infinity 324

For now i got what i was looking for with the vote

[Manuel87]

VOTE: Naomi-Tan
Isoed her last game till Day1 ends and some posts into her 2nd last game. Her playstyle is totaly different in my opinion.
She already made an excuse for that but that excuse is invalid as she hasnt really been pressured since page 3 and still keeps up that silly i am so innocent and silly act.

She got really defensive when Slandaar asked her about that and still didnt answer his question but accused him of throwing shade at her instead.

@Raskolnikov: In my opinion stalking ppl for activity and pointing it out as soon as you find someone that is active in other games is even more scummy.
You had been scumread by some ppl and instead of addressing that you disappeared yourself and came back by throwing shade at ppl that also were inactive.

[Manuel87]

rb what is your opinion on Naomi right now?
Also if you havent done so yet you should probably read the Iso from her last game Mini 1625: Redemption (Game Over)
If we exclude Naomi Infinity and you we have 10 players. We have Aristo, DGB and Darynth that can be considered lurking or not playing.
So saying 5-6 weak players means you consider almost everyone else playing somewhat weak is that correct?

[Manuel87]

@Raskolnikov: In my opinion stalking ppl for activity and pointing it out as soon as you find someone that is active in other games is even more scummy.

2 things Manuel.

1. Rask basically wrote my scum meta to a T there. I didn't realize it was what I was doing, but so be it. His scumread is perfectly legitimate and natural if you ask me.

2. I dislike the shade you're throwing his way in that post. You don't ask him questions, just lob things at him that he can't really defend against. Why is that your approach here??

1) Him having a good case against you has nothing to do with what i didnt like about his approach.

2) Call it throwing shade if you want to i just stated my opinion. If you say he cant defend against that doesnt that mean you think that i am correct?

Also saying xyz is aktive in his other games could be considered as the same you are accusing me of (throwing shade you cant defend against)
Its my approach because i didnt like his approach as i stated in my post he should have contributed instead of stalikng inaktive players.

[Manuel87]

Manuel Flipflopping his Naomi read cause of a meta ISO looks shitty to me.

I probably had the same townread everyone else has. Silly town that gets really emotionel.
She has shown low confidence in her reads in the other game too, but there was nothing close to that silly all over the place acting she is showing this game.

When i saw your comment on the LAMIST thing i kinda had to agree that she was overdoing it ever since ppl started reading her town.
She also got really defensive when Slandaar asked her about that so i decided to check her ISO?

I didnt really flipflopp because of the ISO i was doubting her so i checked it to confirme my doubts.

So what didn't you like about his approach again? I'm not following.

I dont like activity stalking like i said in my response to Raskolnikovs post.

[Manuel87]

In my opinion activity stalking means you are looking for someone you can throw shade on.

Posting in other threads or being online doesnt necessarily mean you are lurking.
Take me for example yesterday i had the gamethread opened the whole day at work but i couldnt read anything because of meetings and other stuff.
Now take the same situation while you are active in 2 or 3 games. You want to read everything before you write a response to something at least i would want to.
That takes time now you have 3 games to catch up on and you may not manage all 3 games so instead of playing all of them halfassed you decide to concentrate on the ones further into the game.

True ppl could actually just be lurking but i like that players get replaced after their 3rd prod so i doubt ppl would deliberately get prodded just to lurk for a little longer.

Thats also why i only play one game at a time because there are days i cant manage to read at all.

[Manuel87]

Town: Naomi
Townlean: Rask, Infinity
Scumlean: Aristo

Rest I have to re-read/need more content. Preferably more content. I hate policy lynching but I'd rather do that than lynch a scumlean from the active player pool.

rb what is your opinion on Naomi right now?
Also if you havent done so yet you should probably read the Iso from her last game Mini 1625: Redemption (Game Over)
If we exclude Naomi Infinity and you we have 10 players. We have Aristo, DGB and Darynth that can be considered lurking or not playing.
So saying 5-6 weak players means you consider almost everyone else playing somewhat weak is that correct?

These two back to back in reference to myself is really funny to me XD just like him asking rb his opinion on me right after he said his opinion on me is kinda helirious

First he posted while i was writing which is easily recognized by the timedifference of 1 minute.
Second him reading you town is not what i was asking him he dodged the question the same way you try to make it look silly.

Pls explain why you think i am flipflopy i think i explained my vote on you. You couldnt deny the fact that you play different from your last towngame.
Or are you just copying what JarJar said before i explained?

[Manuel87]

Ah I see what happened there, Yeah I saw you unvote and vote on the same page and thought your unvote was a vote, so it looked like you voted for infinity then when that trained stopped you jumped to me. but as it was an unvote not a vote and naomi is being silly. unless in 234... one sec... hmm there is sort of a pattern.

Rb started on infinity and there you joined in with a comment reinforcing what rb was saying but not adding anything. then again with my train, picking up the pressure while slandaar went back to lurking. its not a strong case and it was just a gut feeling but it does kinda pan out a little when you look into it. though its not as strong as the last thing I said.

I voted infinity because i wanted to see how rb would react when Infinity got some votes on his head.
After rb unvoted there was no reason to stay with that vote.

Ninja post by Manuel87; His opinion of me being town is an opinion if you want the reason he thinks that feel free to dig into the topic. Additionally, if he did post that while you was typing why didn't you read it? like it comes up and stops you posting you could of stopped and edited before posting just like im doing here. Regardless its still funny having those back to back.

As i said my question wasnt about him reading you town but his opinion on you so him posting that didnt change much for me thats why i went with the post anyway.

Can you explain the first part of this quote because i dont undderstand what you are talking about.

[Manuel87]

Do you also find that people who say that early game reads are weaker are more often scum?

No but you said all reasoning earlygame is weak which i disagree on.
Also your answer didnt really adress what IPS said.

Sometimes, even RVS wagons make people scared of being lynched, or at least they know their actions are being scrutinized.

Ok might be possible if the pressured person is new to mafia and has a weak mentality.

VOTE: Naomi-Tan
Isoed her last game till Day1 ends and some posts into her 2nd last game. Her playstyle is totaly different in my opinion.
She already made an excuse for that but that excuse is invalid as she hasnt really been pressured since page 3 and still keeps up that silly i am so innocent and silly act.

She got really defensive when Slandaar asked her about that and still didnt answer his question but accused him of throwing shade at her instead.

Have you read naomi's scumgame?

I have read a little into it. The playstyle is different from this game but its similar in the sense that she fakes the "oh i am so nooby pls excuse all my mistakes"

Manuel Flipflopping his Naomi read cause of a meta ISO looks shitty to me.

I probably had the same townread everyone else has.

Probably?

I didnt see many reads yet and the only reason why i would see Naomi-Tan as town was given read so thats probably what other ppl townread her for.
Also the answer i expected from rb when i aksed him about Naomi that he didnt really answer.

In my opinion activity stalking means you are looking for someone you can throw shade on.

Posting in other threads or being online doesnt necessarily mean you are lurking.
Take me for example yesterday i had the gamethread opened the whole day at work but i couldnt read anything because of meetings and other stuff.
Now take the same situation while you are active in 2 or 3 games. You want to read everything before you write a response to something at least i would want to.
That takes time now you have 3 games to catch up on and you may not manage all 3 games so instead of playing all of them halfassed you decide to concentrate on the ones further into the game.

True ppl could actually just be lurking but i like that players get replaced after their 3rd prod so i doubt ppl would deliberately get prodded just to lurk for a little longer.

Thats also why i only play one game at a time because there are days i cant manage to read at all.

I understand why you think the argument is weak, why does that make it scummy?

I think the bolded part explains your question its my personal opinion as i stated in my first post in response to Raskolnikov i dont like activity stalking since it doesnt help town its just throwing shade on other ppl.

Actually, this is quite a good point. Manuel, what do you think about the rest of rask's argument?

His argument is Aristos scumplay is really good protownfaking. so yeah should we lynch him for being a good player? i dont think so.

[Manuel87]

It feels like we are getting nowhere right now and arguing with Naomi is pointles because she will just throw another made up argument at you that gets proven wrong and is excused because she is just silly Naomi.

So ill give my reads instead.

Town:
Slandaar: Solid posts even though he had to deal with Naomis accusations. Not much content for now and might be sheeping me but nothing that made me think he is scum so far.
JarJarDrinks: His way of engaging different ppl seems towny to me. Would like to get a full readlist from him as it seems to be totaly different from mine.

Townlean:
DrippingGoofball: Kinda reminds me of NotMafia from my last game. Would like to hear why she thinks Slandaar is scum.
kraska77: Not much content yet but she pointed out some things i also noticed and i liked her posts so far.

Null:
LicketyQuickety: A lot of posts with no value his Iso didnt really give anything at all. Null for now but i would like to get a readlist from him.
Rem: Liked her early game but then just repeated her 2 reads from earlygame and now will probably be replaced.
Iprobablysuck: I think ppl overreacted to the question about the Naomi wagon. Other then that nothing that makes me theink he is scum. Also probably replaced soon.
Aristophanes: Liked the argument about Rems Twonslip. Else just not enough content to go on but i think it was awkward how he aknowledged Raskolnikovs scumread on him so easily.

Scumlean:
Raskolnikov: His only post with value is him talking about how he stalked DGB and Aristo instead of participating in discussions himself even though he got scumread by some ppl. His case on Aristo is basically that Aristo is a really good scumplayer. I didnt see any posts from him that made me think ok maybe he really is town.
rb: Constantly going back to the one thing IPS said about Naomi just so ppl will not forget that it was sooo scummy. Other then that not really scumhunting. He voted Infinity without giving his own reason and unvoted him the same way while using LQs unvote as a reason.

Scum:
Infinity 324: Always talking about other games like when he and rb gave each other towncredit really early into the game or when he throws shade at IPS instead of focusing on the ongoing game first. Later he discredits early game to justify weak reasoning. Votes Naomi and in the same post litterly says dont worry i just want to see what you will do if i put some pressure on you.
Naomi-Tan: I dont buy the silly innocent girl act. She made so many mistakes and it still gets excused as her just being silly town. Checked her Iso from last game there wasnt anything close to the way she is acting right now. Her argument against Slandaar and me had absolutely no value which is shown by the fact that noone even tried to agree with her except for Infinity (my other scumread)

[Manuel87]

Kinda wish I didn't see who I replaced but oh well.

Can you explain why you said that please?

[Manuel87]

Kinda wish I didn't see who I replaced but oh well.

Can you explain why you said that please?

Well there is three logical explinations; Either A) they thought they was acting scummy and is a town role or B) They know them and think there a better player than them or C) They thought they was pro-town and losing a pro-town player isn't great for the game.

Thank your for answering a question not direkted at you

[Manuel87]

Kinda wish I didn't see who I replaced but oh well.

Can you explain why you said that please?

Because when I re read I'm gonna try and look at all of Rem's post and be bias and think they're towny when some of them could be scummy but I'm always gonna look at it from a town pov I wish I could of just re read and come back to give myself an answer so I could help explain the thought process around the posts.

OK so it was an intended townslip you would say?
Because thats how it lokked to me when i though about it yesterday and it kept bothering me thats why i asked if i understood it correct.

@Naomi: Can you stop answering questions directed at other persons please?
If you direct a question at someone there is a good chance you intend to get something out of it from that specific person not from someone else.

[Manuel87]

Kinda wish I didn't see who I replaced but oh well.

Can you explain why you said that please?

Because when I re read I'm gonna try and look at all of Rem's post and be bias and think they're towny when some of them could be scummy but I'm always gonna look at it from a town pov I wish I could of just re read and come back to give myself an answer so I could help explain the thought process around the posts.

OK so it was an intended townslip you would say?
Because thats how it lokked to me when i though about it yesterday and it kept bothering me thats why i asked if i understood it correct.

@Naomi: Can you stop answering questions directed at other persons please?
If you direct a question at someone there is a good chance you intend to get something out of it from that specific person not from someone else.

I don't know if you want to call that a townslip or not it was just me making a statement if you want to take it as a town slip power to you!

The thing why i was thinking about it a lot is that the only value of that statement is to tell us you are town.
Other then that there was no need to post it.

You are Townreading Naomi so what do you think about her case on me and her interaction with Slandaar?

[Manuel87]

Ok, seems pretty weak but I'll accept it. What do you think about how transparent she is and how she makes such a big deal out of trying to get the game moving?

Wil need to read again i dont remember seeing that but i might have missed it. But its a good point ill check on that when i got some time.

Why can't it be town who actually believes if you post in one game but not others that is scummy?

Well that could be but as town i would rather look at the game itself instead of looking at inactive players because as i said their activity in other games doesnt necessarily mean they are trying to lurk in this game.
As i said its my opinion this doesnt ultimately mean he is scum but i wouldnt do what he did as town i would rather try to contribute in the game itself.

No, his argument is that aristo's read on naomi changed to too confident too quickly.

Thats only a small part of his argument you are talking about and i dont agree with that argument.
He was asked about his opinion on Naomi and he answered with what probably everyone thought at that time.
Since then my opinion on Naomi has changed because i think she tried to hard to keep that act up.
But at that point i agreed with him.

Ok these reads seem pretty genuine, but some need more explaining. Why did you put slandaar at town, DGB at lean town, and IPS as scum?

Slandaar wasnt afraid to confront someone that was townread by a lot of people and handled the whole you should replace out situation well.
He made a good argument in post 281 (the one about questioning rb) that was kinda ignored
DGB is more of a guts read since she reminds me of NotMafia not sure about that one myself to be honest probably should rethink that read.
I had IPS in Null.

[Manuel87]

You're sheeping Scumdaar onto KTS now? The beautiful wagon is gone?

Not sure who this was directed at; Im just going with how I feel and right now I just feel a little lost I want to push the people I have issues with but I'm uncertain if there scum and I feel that If I push them and it spirals into a 1v1 of a greater intensity than I have already done then tomorrow scum will easily push for my defeat. I also feel this could be the case if RB or Infinity flips scum as I felt consistently that they are both town and that flip will make it look like I was in a team with the other (and as the final of my called trio would be harder to lynch I feel scum would put me to the block second leading town) I think I need to read over the game again today or tomorow (though likely monday as Im more busy today) As I feel that its best that I reafirm my reads again and refresh myself reading through and trying to be unbiest so I can get a more clear read. but for now.. I just feel kinda lost..

Cant beliefe something like this still is considered town on the single excuse of just being bad at mafia.
I mean this whole post is about her not wanting to do anything that can make her look scummy.
She doesnt want to make her own case but rather sheep someone so that player has to take the blame if its a misslynch.
Then she goes on to make excuses for her townreads to flip scum. Noteable she also read JarJar and Raskolnikov town but didnt mention them here.

[Manuel87]

Ill probably go through everything that I have missed, but MariaR want to give me a quick summary of events?
I see RB was raging a bit, but nothing else.

I'm a sub in myself if you asked me for a sum I couldn't tell you all I know is Infinity/ RB slot had a really big fight Namoi and Slannder want to lynch each other and KTS is being KTS

The fight was between LQ and rb.
Slandaar doesnt want to lynch Naomi as far as i know.
KTS replaced a slot that was scumread by some people, posted a catch-up wall and after that he didnt do much other then trying to buddy with rb (Fire Assassines slot)

[Manuel87]

Naomi-Tan

- Top townread. Probably don't need to explain much here as I think most people are townreading Naomi

Even if most people townread her you should explain that read.
Or are you saying you townread her because most ppl townread her?

Manuel87

- null. Man his scumreads are so bad. Other than that I think he seems to be scumhunting and interacting in a town manner. need more here.

You say i am scumhunting and interacting so what more do you need? You dont have to agree with my reads i change my reads because of arguments not because some people think differently.

You have a way worse read on rb/FA yet he is a townlean read and i am null? I would like an explanation because i read your argument as "he is town but his reads are bad so he is null".

[Manuel87]

hiplop (repl. Aristophanes*): Having started with some good content at the start of the game they entirely vanished later on. This makes me think they wanted to get a soild townish cred early on and then skirt the rest of the day which seems pretty suspicious. Combined that with what Rask said and him pretty much admitting he was playing to his scum meta makes me believe that this slot is very much a scum slot. and the new guy coming in and RVSing at this stage in the game seems tasteless like; If new people are coming in at this stage there is SO much to go on that I at least expected a cursory effort. This reeks of someone who doesn't care who gets lynched right now and its that kinda attitude that makes me think there scum.

Next level lurking to even replace out of the game to keep the act up.

Manuel87: yeah Im pretty sure there Scum at this stage, Looking over there stuff. They jumped on the infinity bandwagon when it looked like that might happen then did the same when he noticed weakness in myself. At that stage he was reading me as town until Slandaar posted my meta, and then he voted me when I refused to comment on stuff that was ages old. Then there is all the missleading things I mentioned in my first conspiracy vote. It seems to me that Manuel is looking for weakness and then jumping on it like a wolf and then says stuff to make them look worse. Like he has been voting me for nearly 400 posts because of meta bearing in mind my last town game he is basing this off of is a; Jul - Aug 2013 game so about 3 years old.

Yes i jumped on a huge 2vote wagon on Infinity to see how rb would react after that. Also Infinity is still in my scumreads so whats bad about voting them?
I realized that your play got to much "oh i am so silly guys pls excuse everything i do *kya*" after JJD mentioned it and you dodged Slandaars question about your playstyle (yes you still didnt really answer that question) all that is explained in the same post i voted you.
Also i did what Infinity suggested and read one of your scumgames from your wiki (the first one in the list from 2012). You show a similar playstyle to this game and compared to the first towngame in your wikilist its completly different your are way more laidback and more focused on answering questions directed at you.
You dont even disagree with my metaread on you but try to disreagrad it as to old to hold any meaning.
In my opinion your playstyl now is far more immature than 2 years ago so how can you explain that?

[Manuel87]

Okay his question was; Do you think your playing like your town meta; my responce is, its been 3 years since I played town I have no idea! Which is just an expansion of when I said I don't really care cause I'm not looking it up. I don't need to disagree beacuse I'm not looking to find it out I Know my alignment I don't need meta to confirm it. Also you change a lot in a 3 year cycle maybe im more bouncy now and thats just a thing that happened. You really don't know me and using meta to try and know me while being like; SHE WAS DIFFERENT THREE YEARS AGO GUYZ really doesn't build a case and is just pointless shit stirring. as for why I am like I am, maybe I realised Im not that great at this stuff and Know better than I did then and am more self aware, remember there was a 3 year gap where I didn't play this time skip was where I was finding myself. I am a much happier and brighter person than I was then and live happier now.

First no that wasnt his question.
Second you didnt answer the question.

using meta data from other games is a good way to determine stuff, this is why I edit all my games into my wiki page so people can look over my meta.

Do you feel you're playing similarly to your recent games?

Just putting this out there; I find Slandaar really scummy right now; they lurked until we put votes on them and came back with; more content on monday. then when they returned on monday they havn't really mentioned the rest of the game and just tried to shade me :I

Why are you lying?

[Manuel87]

Even if most people townread her you should explain that read.Or are you saying you townread her because most ppl townread her?

Just saying that most people are probably seeing what I'm seeing but since ur scumreading her, I'll expound:

Naomi is playing a way where she doesn't care about how her posts look. Something is on her mind and she just spews it out. There's just no carefulness that you almost always see from scumposts.

Not sure who this was directed at; Im just going with how I feel and right now I just feel a little lost I want to push the people I have issues with but I'm uncertain if there scum and I feel that If I push them and it spirals into a 1v1 of a greater intensity than I have already done then tomorrow scum will easily push for my defeat. I also feel this could be the case if RB or Infinity flips scum as I felt consistently that they are both town and that flip will make it look like I was in a team with the other (and as the final of my called trio would be harder to lynch I feel scum would put me to the block second leading town) I think I need to read over the game again today or tomorow (though likely monday as Im more busy today) As I feel that its best that I reafirm my reads again and refresh myself reading through and trying to be unbiest so I can get a more clear read. but for now.. I just feel kinda lost..[/quote]
In this post she is caring a lot about looking scummy

You say i am scumhunting and interacting so what more do you need? You dont have to agree with my reads i change my reads because of arguments not because some people think differently.

You have a way worse read on rb/FA yet he is a townlean read and i am null? I would like an explanation because i read your argument as "he is town but his reads are bad so he is null".

What more do I need for what? I have you as null.

But who a person reads is certainly alignment indicitive so if you were acting how you were AND had reads that matched mine, I'd probably townread you for it.

[/quote]
So you think scum would not have their scummbuddys in their readlist?
Since i am pretty sure you dont actually mean that you have to explain to me why you would think i am scummy because of my reads.
Because if i understand you correct you think my reads are scummy so please explain to me why you think so.

[Manuel87]

I reread and still townread Naomi.

So it took you 27 minutes to reread 158 posts and you still had sparetime to think about what you were reading afterwards?
I have to say i cant believe that you actually read the posts looking for something but rather just skimmed over it.

[Manuel87]

Intent to hammer KTS

I liked Rasks post about what KTS claim means for town at this point. Seeing Raskolnikov more towny right now.
As for KTS after that post i think he panicked a little because his i dont care attitude wouldnt work after that.
Before that all his answers were like "i dont care", "so just kill me" or "i am so good" after that his act dropt a little and he contributed a bit.
Combined with the fact that none of my scumreads is voting him atm i guess there is a good chance he is scum.

[Manuel87]

Intent to hammer KTS

I liked Rasks post about what KTS claim means for town at this point. Seeing Raskolnikov more towny right now.
As for KTS after that post i think he panicked a little because his i dont care attitude wouldnt work after that.
Before that all his answers were like "i dont care", "so just kill me" or "i am so good" after that his act dropt a little and he contributed a bit.
Combined with the fact that none of my scumreads is voting him atm i guess there is a good chance he is scum.

im not voting him because there was others who was on him that want him gone more than me that removed the vote to prevent lynching. I went to thinking that slot was town after re-reading this behaviour only seems disruptive rather than scummy imo. but thats just my thoughts I could be wrong in which case im sure the people playing will go to town on me tomorow... or they may do so for me just town reading them when they was town being like, only scum could know that. but Its just how I feel this is just A class trying to get yourself killed and there isn't much i can do on that.. So.. I guess one way or another Im not gonna be great but eh.. I'll just keep trying and hope that I can talk myself out of this mess I'm in right now. Jeez.. sleepy posting again and being totally defeatist..

Another post of excuses.
If he is scum you are 100% too i hope people will realize that.

[Manuel87]

Intent to hammer KTS

I liked Rasks post about what KTS claim means for town at this point. Seeing Raskolnikov more towny right now.
As for KTS after that post i think he panicked a little because his i dont care attitude wouldnt work after that.
Before that all his answers were like "i dont care", "so just kill me" or "i am so good" after that his act dropt a little and he contributed a bit.
Combined with the fact that none of my scumreads is voting him atm i guess there is a good chance he is scum.

im not voting him because there was others who was on him that want him gone more than me that removed the vote to prevent lynching. I went to thinking that slot was town after re-reading this behaviour only seems disruptive rather than scummy imo. but thats just my thoughts I could be wrong in which case im sure the people playing will go to town on me tomorow... or they may do so for me just town reading them when they was town being like, only scum could know that. but Its just how I feel this is just A class trying to get yourself killed and there isn't much i can do on that.. So.. I guess one way or another Im not gonna be great but eh.. I'll just keep trying and hope that I can talk myself out of this mess I'm in right now. Jeez.. sleepy posting again and being totally defeatist..

Another post of excuses.
If he is scum you are 100% too i hope people will realize that.

You are prolly not going to get any decent content out of KTS, so if you are going to hammer, you might as well.

Probably but he still has the chance.
Also calling intent also allows others to unvote if they arent 100% sure about their vote.
I will wait a little longer so people have the chance to react to the intent but if noone unvotes or he doesnt give a good defense i will hammer today.

[Manuel87]

If he is scum you are 100% too i hope people will realize that.

No Fn way. There's no way in heck that scum sticks their neck out for a teammate playing the way KTS is playing.

If he flips scum then I guarantee you that scum is already on the wagon.

Apparently the mod believe getting yourself killed isn't against a win con for both scum and town. now ima just sulk as it is apparent we are stuck with a non-contributor actively trying to die.

LAMIST post while trying to get her scumbuddy replaced because else he is about to die.

[Manuel87]

You know whats weird... Manuel didn't vote after the hammer vote was dropped... like.. he could of over lynched but choose not to put his vote down.. like.. he didn't wanna be on the flip list...

PEdit; They was literally trying to kill themselves... that goes aganist both roles imo..

Are you actually serious? Thats one of the the worst arguments i have ever read.

Also he never voted himself so no he never tried to kill himself.

[Manuel87]

please kill me.

So how is that literally trying to kill yourself?

[Manuel87]

please kill me.

So how is that literally trying to kill yourself?

He is literally asking to die, combine that with there activity over yesterday and he was begging for death, there is no two ways to it! he wasn't even trrying to not be scummy and was saying shit to make people less tollerant of themselves.

Pedit; Well there not going to be on the list of people who lynched them, if they think there scum then they should add themselves to the list of people who lynched when we read back we'll not notice it unless we remember this conversation.

He could have killed himself quite easily but he didnt.
I hope this flips scum so i can read you town and ignore you for the rest of the game.

[Manuel87]

my bad i meant flipps town

[Manuel87]

If he is scum you are 100% too i hope people will realize that.

No Fn way. There's no way in heck that scum sticks their neck out for a teammate playing the way KTS is playing.

If he flips scum then I guarantee you that scum is already on the wagon.

Apparently the mod believe getting yourself killed isn't against a win con for both scum and town. now ima just sulk as it is apparent we are stuck with a non-contributor actively trying to die.

LAMIST post while trying to get her scumbuddy replaced because else he is about to die.

If he is town this argument is reversed 180° thats why i would townread her.

[Manuel87]

Well i actually believe that she tried to get him replaced and mod said no.
She wouldnt try that as scum so either she LAMIST that really good or she is town if he flips town.

[Manuel87]

Also voted kts and wasn't around for the claim/lynch.

Just checked (even though some people hate activity stalking), he was active on the site between the claim and end of day.

This doesn't even matter, me and Hiplop both replaced in as requested by Marquis in site chat.
That will tell you, both our motivations are just trying to help out someone in need to fill some slots that we were requested personally to fill.

So activity elsewhere, means absolutely nothing with regards to hiplop, even if he is scum here.

Replacing in and not playing properly is far from helping it just ruins the game for the other players and if thats what you intend to do and i dont think Marquis would want that.
So if you say you wanted to help Marquis this means your reasoning here looks pretty scummy because its just an excuse for lurking as scum.

Also you say yout tried to be the voice of reason but as mentioned before all you said was if its true that he is town we shouldnt lynch him. A rather weak argument and it doesnt really look like you really wanted to keep him alive as you didnt say anything after Raskolnikovs argument.
I thought rb was scum an his interaction with LQ was

Rasks argument was good as i said before but now that KTS flipped town i wouldnt give him towncredit for that but it doesnt necessarily mean it was scummotivated as his argument was still legit.
Would put Raskolnikov at Null at the moment.

Have to admit that DGB looks scummy her argument to join the lynch on KTS was bad and she hasnt really contributed.
Would consider voting her but we have a lot of time so i dont want to L-1 her right now.
If she is town she should start explaining herself becasue it feels like she is about to die.
It would be pretty sad to lose another townplayer because she doesnt really care.

MariaR when do you think your catchup readlist is finished?

[Manuel87]

I agree that some reads are hard to explain because your not sure about them yourself but that doesnt mean readlists help scum more then town.
Asking about those reads helps town understand the thought process of the other player and judge his interactions during the game.

Also you just used the argument you dont like about readlists against Slandaar i am confused.

[Manuel87]

just because I said I don't LIKE reads lists doesn't mean I think readlists are scummy

What is this referring to?

[Manuel87]

I agree that some reads are hard to explain because your not sure about them yourself but that doesnt mean readlists help scum more then town.
Asking about those reads helps town understand the thought process of the other player and judge his interactions during the game.

Also you just used the argument you dont like about readlists against Slandaar i am confused.

To the last line of this because that's how I took it but it's also mostly a statement for everyone

I didnt say nor mean that readlists are scummy. I said its confusing that you would use the exact argument you used in your example for why you dont like readlists against Slandaar.
You said a thought process like that only helps scum so why would you use it in this case?

[Manuel87]

I keep getting lynched everywhere lately

It has made playing mafia super boring

You should try to actually play the game could help to make it fun.

[Manuel87]

I'm a 1-shot watcher

Only works on a specific night

Can't tell if this is a slip or just playing dumb cause we all know what this night is

She probably just forgot, it's NAI anyway

Watcher claim is enough reason to leave her alive for a day imo. Watcher is a super powerful role. If she doesn't get a result and she doesn't give us a reason to make us think she's town by tomorrow, we can lynch her then. Thoughts?

If she forgot it is not NAI. Scum would know what setup we have if they make a fake claim so they dont scumslip.
I guess this is scum that uses the fact that we misslynched a PR after his claim and now feel uneasy to do the same again.
That being said we can wait for her read tomorrow but i think in this setup PR claims are just to easy to fake as we dont even know how many there are.

Fire Assassin can you give us your reads? Because you called Infinitys scumreads fake or horseshit so i guess you disagree on them right?

[Manuel87]

The tone is off in that he reads as someone who is confident in his reads but also realizes he has to make shit up, so he says the player is LAMIST then pretends his read on KTS is strong, and then the argument looks fake too, and when other people start commenting on Naomi being town, he just backs down all the sudden with a horrible progression to it that just reads like he read the room and was like "Okay, pushing this isn't going anywhere'

Wow so much made up stuff and false arguments in such a little post:
When did i ever say i have a strong scumread on KTS?
Also i messed up i meant i hope KTS flips town. That was already mentioned why didnt you quote that?
How was that argument weak? Or do you really disagree that considering you believe she actually contacted the mod about replacing KTS:
if KTS had flipped scum her post about replacing could have been scummotivated
and as soon as he flipped town she was confirmed town?
You think i backed down from my Naomi read because she was townread? That argument is laughable at best.
I think you should stop making stuff up or read the thread carefully.
Also Naomi was hardcore LAMIST.

[Manuel87]

If you think I am making stuff up, doesn't that imply I am scum?
Or you just saying I can't read?

Also cut that shit out with LAMIST, thats fucking MU shit.

I am still scumreading your slot and since you dont answer any of my questions i dont see why i should change that read.
Instead of answering questions you make stuff up that is simply not true. After that gets pointed out and you get questioned again you dodge the questions again by asking questions that have no meaning instead.

VOTE: Firebringer

[Manuel87]

If you think I am making stuff up, doesn't that imply I am scum?
Or you just saying I can't read?

Also cut that shit out with LAMIST, thats fucking MU shit.

I am still scumreading your slot and since you dont answer any of my questions i dont see why i should change that read.
Instead of answering questions you make stuff up that is simply not true. After that gets pointed out and you get questioned again you dodge the questions again by asking questions that have no meaning instead.

VOTE: Firebringer

Your questions on me was reads and I have given you many reads if you read my posts, so what question am I dodging exactly?

Also you saying my questions are pointless seems odd because you basically were sitting on either that I wasn't reading or making it up and are still sitting in that same position but voting me like you are confident.

Can you pick one? I am fine with either.
Don't read = discredit
Making it up = you "scum read"

Seriously, either works

You didnt give any reads all you did was quotes some of my posts and say they look scummy and then some made up arguments

The tone is off in that he reads as someone who is confident in his reads but also realizes he has to make shit up

Show me where i did.

so he says the player is LAMIST then pretends his read on KTS is strong

Already mentioned that i never had a strong scumread on KTS. Can you show me why you would think i had?

and then the argument looks fake too

What argument that 3 of my scumreads were not on the wagon? also a fakt you can check that easily
Or that Rasks argument was legit?

[quote="In post 1678and when other people start commenting on Naomi being town, he just backs down all the sudden with a horrible progression to it that just reads like he read the room and was like "Okay, pushing this isn't going anywhere'[/quote]
Already mentioned by Infinity but Naomi was read town since page 5 or so by most of the people with the same reasoning. Also you think my reasoning for reading her town after the townflip is bad or made up?

The tone is off in that he reads as someone who is confident in his reads but also realizes he has to make shit up, so he says the player is LAMIST then pretends his read on KTS is strong, and then the argument looks fake too, and when other people start commenting on Naomi being town, he just backs down all the sudden with a horrible progression to it that just reads like he read the room and was like "Okay, pushing this isn't going anywhere'

Wow so much made up stuff and false arguments in such a little post:
When did i ever say i have a strong scumread on KTS?
Also i messed up i meant i hope KTS flips town. That was already mentioned why didnt you quote that?
How was that argument weak? Or do you really disagree that considering you believe she actually contacted the mod about replacing KTS:
if KTS had flipped scum her post about replacing could have been scummotivated
and as soon as he flipped town she was confirmed town?
You think i backed down from my Naomi read because she was townread? That argument is laughable at best.
I think you should stop making stuff up or read the thread carefully.
Also Naomi was hardcore LAMIST.

You didnt answer any of those questions insted you commented on the last part that wasnt even a question but a fact.

[Manuel87]

Manuel and slandaar claim roles please.

PR
Even though i think this is meaningless.

[Manuel87]

GL town