Newbie 1732 [Game Over!]: InnocentVille

implosion
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Post Post #675  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 1:22 am

(that should be L-2, for reference)

AstralFlare
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Post Post #676  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 2:18 am

In post 625, shannon wrote:I will only move off TNE if we get to a situation like yesterday, where we're at deadline and need to get the lynch. If I am tonight's NK, lynch TNE tomorrow.

In post 673, shannon wrote:Alright, no point hanging out on a case where I'm not going to get anything.

VOTE: Cass


?

I'll get around to everything else later

Drone
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Post Post #677  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 2:34 am

That's a quick wagon what was forged here.
Seeing that answers from tne's impossible so we're moving to Cass?

Let's do this: I'd wait for AF's thoughts on this and Cass' defence.
And join the wagon depending on Cass' defence.
FoS; Cass

Cass
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Post Post #678  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 5:06 am

This is interesting. I am going to defend myself, but I don't want to rush it and I have too little time now to do it justice - so don't quicklynch me, mkay? (In fact only consider lynching me if you are pretty sure I am scum, a mislynch now will lead to a highly dangerous situation on day 3.)

I'd also like to her AF's and PP's thoughts on this wagon against me, and on Implosion's case against me.
Can't bake an omelette without killing a few people.

Cass
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Post Post #679  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 5:14 am

Two things I can say quickly:

- Implosions case on me (wich I will respond to in detail, I promise) reads null to me. A townie would do that just the same way as a scum. As scum he needs me off his case and dead. As town, he needs to not be lynched and I was aggressively attacking him.
- Drone's reaction is very much what scum would do (my assumption here is he's scum and thus knows I'm not) - testing the waters to see if this one is going to take off fast, positioning to help with that.

UNVOTE: Implosion

VOTE: Drone

Not because Implosion looks better, but because Drone lookes worse.
Can't bake an omelette without killing a few people.

shannon
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Post Post #680  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 5:23 am

In post 676, AstralFlare wrote:
In post 625, shannon wrote:I will only move off TNE if we get to a situation like yesterday, where we're at deadline and need to get the lynch. If I am tonight's NK, lynch TNE tomorrow.

In post 673, shannon wrote:Alright, no point hanging out on a case where I'm not going to get anything.

VOTE: Cass


?

I'll get around to everything else later


It is what it sounds like, I've basically given up on getting anything useful from TNE. I agree with Implosion's comment that she's deliberately trying to be inscrutable. The problem with that, for me, is that I can't see the town motivation for it. Scum already know who the townies are, so why bother trying to obscure one's towniness from town? Only makes sense if you're scum.

I really want to know @Chrimi if you're sticking with your BP claim?

Chrimi
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Post Post #681  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 7:57 am

In post 680, shannon wrote:I really want to know @Chrimi if you're sticking with your BP claim?

1. Town has no reason to lie.
2. Scum knows that town has no reason to lie.

Yes, I'm sticking with my claim, because it's true. This should be NAI for you.

Chrimi
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Post Post #682  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 7:59 am

In post 681, Chrimi wrote:
In post 680, shannon wrote:I really want to know @Chrimi if you're sticking with your BP claim?

1. Town has no reason to lie.
2. Scum knows that town has no reason to lie.

Yes, I'm sticking with my claim, because it's true. This should be NAI for you.

Well, it should be NAI, except that I'm conf-town at this point.

shannon
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Post Post #683  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:13 am

Do you think there's any reason scum would have targeted you last night?

shannon
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Post Post #684  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:18 am

Also FWIW there's a way you're not conf town, if we're in 1 then no townie would claim a PR to counter you and there's no way that scum would say 'nuh-uh, we're both goons'.

PenguinPower
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Post Post #685  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:52 am

In post 672, Chrimi wrote:The wagon on implosion is scum driven. Your un-CC'd claim says to get off of it and do something more useful. Like this.


Why do you say that? Who is scum that is driving the wagon? Pretty sure Cass didn't start the wagon.

In post 673, shannon wrote:Alright, no point hanging out on a case where I'm not going to get anything.

VOTE: Cass


Why Cass? What makes her scummier than implosion?

In post 684, shannon wrote:Also FWIW there's a way you're not conf town, if we're in 1 then no townie would claim a PR to counter you and there's no way that scum would say 'nuh-uh, we're both goons'.


Wouldn't that same logic apply to setup B as well?

I was seeing the Cass slot as scummy on D1; but, if I take the slot back to null once Jibs replaced out and attribute my feelings to his playstyle, I don't see what Cass has done that has led people to think that she is scum. TNE is getting a pass based on meta, even though her playstyle for both scum and town looks to be the same. There was an intent unless a decent response was given, but that wagon fell apart despite TNE's response of:

In post 663, thenewearth wrote:I'll answer them if I think they're worth answering, thanks


Not sure I understand that...

Absent TNE, I still think that implosion/drone are scummier than Cass right now. Most recently, I don't like this:

In post 674, implosion wrote:Drone's intent to hammer post is fine. Doesn't make me feel strongly either way.


Why was that fine? Didn't Chrimi already have an intent to hammer in place? You have seemed to be protecting the Rocnix/Drone slot for most of this game.

@mod: Can we get a vote count?

Drone
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Post Post #686  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:57 am

@cass
This is not a solid defence, this is you continuing to jump from vote to vote, which makes you look worse. Even if your vote on me is an omgus, and it is.
The fact Implosion back then voted me right after you was what gives you both the description of "opportunistic". This vote jumping is my case against you now.
Vote: Cass

Btw, Shannon's pointing out that Chrimi's claim is false is what I've been thinking. Although low chances, there is a possibility there is a doc instead of a jk and he just chose the right target. Or there is a jk but no BP.
I wanna get back to one of the first questions been asked after your claim. Why would mafia target Chrimi? And @Chrimi do you know you've been targeted?
There is still the chance mafia didn't target anyone at all.

Drone
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Post Post #687  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:05 am

@pp
It is Cass' jumps from wagons to wagons.
Failing to give a solid defence, and constant attempts to build a case on revolving Rocnix, whom I cannot explain.
I, on the other hand, don't need Jibs to point out weaknesses, it's exactly what I did. And there are things to question about Jibs.
Also, it kinda looks like, when I look back now that me saying 0x40's wagon was directed by scum at some point, made Cass uncomfortable. She countered me with the opposite possibility and blamed me directly for it, ignoring Implosion's same action.
She moved to Implosion right when there was a wagon on him, she did bring a case on her own, opportunistic is the word.

Drone
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Post Post #688  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:06 am

Ebwodp:
She didn't bring *

thenewearth
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Post Post #689  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:10 am

I'm very ok with cass vote but hoooooollllyyy shit this is a fast wagon

nope

shannon
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Post Post #690  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:46 am

*sigh* I know it's not the done thing but everyone knows I'm town so I've got a target painted on my back, and by the look of things everyone also knows I'm a PR. Since any close-reading scum will have deduced my role from the combination of my questions and their own role combo, I'm going to be up front so that town gets at least one piece of info before this potential speed lynch (it's my bed time so my last post for tonight).

I'm jailkeeper and I jailed TNE last night.

This should explain:
1) Why I'm suspicious of TNE, her PR fishing, and her lack of engagement with my questions
2) Why I'm suspicious of Chrimi's claim for BP

From my POV, the options are:

1) Scum targeted Chrimi and she really is BP - in this case we have a roleblocker and goon, so my role is of little use given that everyone has worked out that I'm a PR
2) Chrimi is scum and fake claiming
3) Chrimi is town and fake claiming

and/or

5) TNE is scum - knows I'm on to her and was going to off me, so I haven't lost anything by claiming
6) TNE is town and I saved her

So for lynches:

TNE first - if TNE flips town, I will be very surprised if Chrimi is town. If scum, yay! Double yay if she's a roleblocker.

Chrimi first - If she's a BP, I still don't get why she claimed. If she's scum, yay! If she's vanilla town, I don't get why she claimed and her doing so has pretty much resulted in me outing my role, so yeah. (If she'd stayed quiet I could have gambited as a cop, but I didn't get that option. And Chrimi seems fairly experienced, moreso than me, so I think she would know that. The whole thing seems like a gambit to get the PR to state their role in order to be believed.).

The more I think of it, Chrimi needs to be today's lynch.

VOTE: Chrimi

If she flips scum, come back to Cass tomorrow. If she's town, lynch TNE. That's the best I've got.

Chrimi
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Post Post #691  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:54 am

shannon, you're dumb. You don't lynch the un-cc'd claim.


If I'm scum, then scum has two goons. Do you know how many setups are possible with 2 goons?

Four. Out of those four, claiming BP would get you CC'd in THREE of them.

Therefore, claiming BP at this point as scum has a 75% chance of getting me KILLED.

I'm conftown. We just went over this in the last newbie I completed, except Wake88 was the BP, where I had to explain this several times to scum before I ended up lynching them.

In post 1115, Chrimi wrote:
In post 1097, LmkGuy wrote:
In post 1080, Zaicon wrote:
Vote Count 2.2


Chrimi (3): Wake88, Accountant, BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee (2): rb, Chrimi
mzs (1): RachMarie

No Vote (2): LmkGuy, mzs

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch!

Deadline is Sunday, August 21, 2016 at 4:00 PM CST, which is in (expired on 2016-08-21 16:00:00).


So it would now be:
Chrimi: LmkGuy Accountant, BBT
BBT: rb, Chrimi, wake
mzs: Rach
No vote: mzs, pls correct me if I am wrong

This is wrong. Wake88 moved onto Accountant, not BBT. So it's:
Chrimi: LmkGuy, Accountant, BBT
BBT: rb, Chrimi
Accountant: Wake88
mzs: Rach


@Wake: Why Accountant over BBT, out of curiosity?

@LmkGuy: The main case behind lynching me seems to be that Day One, I said (as a gambit and before there were any claims) that if I survived until Day Two then I must be scum. If you don't remember much of day one... Why am I a scumread?

@BBT: I've decided to answer one of your earlier questions in a better way, since you aren't asking anymore and seem intent on tunneling without reasons.
BBT wants to know why Wake88 was conf-town as soon as he claimed, and here's why.
1. The only way Wake88 would be scum is if it was Jailkeeper - Vanilla - Goon
2. If Mafia only has a goon, then from their POV there are four situations possible: Cop, Doctor + Tracker, Bulletproof + Tracker, Jailkeeper;
3. So scum!Wake88 claiming 1-shot without knowing what setup it is would be basically a 3/4 chance of fucking suicide.

So there you go, Wake88 has been conftown since the moment he claimed. That's why, obviously, they shot his vest rather than me. Case closed, can you move your vote somewhere useful now?

Chrimi
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Post Post #692  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:55 am

In post 691, Chrimi wrote:shannon, you're dumb. You don't lynch the un-cc'd claim.

EBWOP: shannon, your vote is dumb.

Trying to not be a total asshole this time around. :shifty:

Chrimi
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Post Post #693  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:58 am

And oh my god why the fuck did you just claim Jailkeeper? That means you're the protective role that could have kept me alive... And instead you're going to throw that away, get NK'd tonight, and try and get me lynched today?

Award for most anti-town player goes to: shannon

Chrimi
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Post Post #694  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:00 am

gg scum, you managed to get the jailkeeper to claim without even lifting a finger.

Fucking facepalm. I take back trying to be nice and say your vote was dumb.

Chrimi
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Post Post #695  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:02 am

I mean fuck, you jailed TNE and there was a NK, and you're trying to lynch the claimed BP instead of TNE?

God fucking dammit I hate everything so much

@IC implosion: please explain things to shannon i need to go hang myself or something

Chrimi
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Post Post #696  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:03 am

In post 695, Chrimi wrote:I mean fuck, you jailed TNE and there was a NK,

EBWOP: there was no NK*

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

Chrimi
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Post Post #697  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:05 am

I mean fuck, the chance that you hit the scum making the NK is 50% compared to the 9% that you JK'd the person about to be killed. You should be hell-mary trying to get something out of TNE. I hate everything

Chrimi
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Post Post #698  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:08 am

In post 697, Chrimi wrote:I mean fuck, the chance that you hit the scum making the NK is 50% compared to the 9% that you JK'd the person about to be killed. You should be hell-mary trying to get something out of TNE. I hate everything

I thought about this wrong and those percentages are completely wrong and that point is invalid

But you're still trying to kill the fucking un-cc'd bp so

On another note, scum have a roleblocker and can now prevent shannon from jailkeeping, so now both your PRs are useless. GG

Chrimi
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Post Post #699  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:11 am

In post 690, shannon wrote: If she's vanilla town, I don't get why she claimed and her doing so has pretty much resulted in me outing my role, so yeah. (If she'd stayed quiet I could have gambited as a cop, but I didn't get that option. And Chrimi seems fairly experienced, moreso than me, so I think she would know that.

Excuse me? I didn't force you to claim. I think you claiming at this point is the stupidest fucking thing that could've happened to us today. Me claiming didn't result in you outing your role, what the actual fuck. You still could've even faked Tracker if you really wanted to gambit or do some shit.

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