Mini Normal #1838 - Game Over

[PenguinPower]

if he flips scum, it's an excuse to push on anyone who defended him or didn't vote for him.

You sound worried. It would be a good thing if he flips scum.

[eagerSnake]

I'm not going to, though.

[Lil Uzi Vert]

Not worried, I just believe Snake. The time he claimed and the way he did it makes sense.

[eagerSnake]

P-edit @Eager: Not really, no. Feel free to vote implosion or nn30 if you want. It's also not a logical fallacy, you're significantly less likely to be town because of it.

Welcome to the world of significantly less likely.

I'm probably not voting nn30, implosion is a tough read too

[Shadow_step]

VOTE: Shadow

If both of you are town we are seriously fucked.

Jeeeez this is terrible. When did I say all my reads are based in Eager's interactions with them?

It seemed implied and either way, I never said that was my reason for voting for you.

Then what is the reason Sherlock?
Did you iso me? You think I'm scum and ccing eager under no pressure when I didn't need to ?

I think you're gambling scum who failed to plan out a distraction.

Jesus Christ, stop playing you're fucking terrible. Gambiting mafia lmao

You're the one that's terrible my friend. The only case you have on Eager is that you cannot fathom that both you and him were given the same role. You either refuse or won't take into consideration a town motive for lying. If Eager had not claimed, your read on him would be null. You have no backup plan if he flips town and if he flips scum, it's an excuse to push on anyone who defended him or didn't vote for him.

Its a straight up CC. There is no way town have the same two roles. Never mind having two ascetics which is insanely bastard. That's two slots on which the town PRs are wasting their NA on. You can check previous games.

[eagerSnake]

They're not wasting NA's if they are aware of our modifier

[Shadow_step]

You don't take that into consideration when you balance a game.

[eagerSnake]

I would, because I know proper play for Ascetic is to claim at daystart

[Shadow_step]

It simply doesn't work that way.
It us up to a player's discretion what he does with a neg role and the mod simply cannot assume that the player will claim it day 1 so it wouldn't make much of a diff and let me put another one in there.

[nn30]

I have exactly 0 trust in your ability to scumread. Between 614 and 628 you imply (Penguin) or directly state (7 other names) feel scummy. That's 8/13 town members. Your list in 1013 has 3 people (myself included) who I feel are towny.

I didn't respond to your line of questioning towards me originally because without an "@nn30" somewhere in the post I'm likely to skim it and assume it was addressed to someone else.

The fact that I failed to reply to you is not enough of a reason to scum read me.

As far as my read of implosion, I still don't town read him but I found his responses to my lines of questioning satisfying (for the time being). Plus he dropped off the face of the map, nobody else seemed interested in talking about him, so I moved on.

More of nn30 not actually caring about what I'm saying and just giving a response for the sake of it.

Does anyone want to go read #797?

P-edit @Eager: Not really, no. Feel free to vote implosion or nn30 if you want. It's also not a logical fallacy, you're significantly less likely to be town because of it.

If I didn't care what you said, I would have just ignored you.

I don't have a read on you at the moment. That means you could be town. If you have me as your top scum read, which runs counter to what most of the town feels, something is off in your reasoning.

Your 797 comes after my 617, so I'm giving you no originality credit acknowleding that you have too many town reads.

I've addressed the rest of your problems with me from that post in previous posts, but here I go again.

I scumread implosion, his responses to my push felt satisfying, nobody was interested in him (until you showed up waaaaay later)so I moved on.

I missed your prod to speak with you. I apologize. In the future please include an @nn30.

My top scum read was never implosion. I have not posted such a list. Stating that my top read was implosion is putting things in my mouth, and I don't like that.

I latched onto Shadow and Gamma because I felt they were scummy. By no means was my approach "lets throw some shit at the wall and see what sticks lul."

If my 690 was about volume (which presumably makes you think I'm scum making up content) why would I admit to that in my own post? I included the "this is more circumstantial and definitely weaker" line because I'm trying to be transparent in my reads. I was not admitting to "volume over quality" as you suggest.

I don't know wtf shadow was thinking. The I've harped on how poor the play was from town!shadow for a few pages, so I'm not going to do that again here. The play was bad from a scum!shadow too but I'm willing to bet he's a gambling / gambit kind of guy. This is why I continue to scum read him.

I said I'm obv town because of the vast number of people who have town read me so far. Self vouches, as you point out, tend to feel scummy. I didn't self vouch on page one with no context - I self vouched well into a game where a significant number of people had town read me. You're looking at this play in a vacuum and not in the context of the game we are currently playing.

Satisfied?

[eagerSnake]

Oh well, I can't blame you Shadow_step. I'd be suspicious of you too if you had claimed first, and would likely have tunneled you the same. It would certainly be tough hurdle to overcome, albeit a big pay-off if I was able to overcome it.

[eagerSnake]

It's much easier from my shoes because I can see there's not much scum motive in what you're doing

[nn30]

It's much easier from my shoes because I can see there's not much scum motive in what you're doing

I admire your ability to continue townreading him after he has scumread you so hard.

[Grendel]

Wow. so I don't have time to read the nearly 20 pages that popped up over night.

I'll have to come back to this later when I have more time to burn. :/

[nn30]

Wow. so I don't have time to read the nearly 20 pages that popped up over night.

I feels you.

[eagerSnake]

I'm the one that's been defending myself against getting the same modifier as someone for 20 pages

[eagerSnake]

We should give everyone a chance to catch up

[eagerSnake]

Dierfire, Grendel, Zoronos are the people who haven't really taken a firm stance on this

[implosion]

@eager - I'm not sure you understand what buddying means. Most of what you posted was criticism. Also, why do you keep repeating that I'm happy about the conflict? I've been around for very little of this little scum theater.

@town? - eager has been coasting, and the only thing in the way of my gut scumlean was the fact that he had an uncc'd claim. A cc from an obvious town player was more than enough reason to vote him. Either way, how can so many of you accept eager's piss-poor "town" performance without resistance? I mean, eager has bragged twice now about how shitty town is playing by not calling him out for his lazy vote. You're all just taking the insult with pride, it would appear. The only positive thing I can say about this development is my wagon. It decreases the likelihood that eagerSnake, MariaR and implosion are ALL scum. I'll have to try to knock at least one out of the running.

If scum want to chainsaw me up to L-1, that's fine, but don't let them hammer without warning. I'll try to be back again tomorrow to check on things.

p-edit - S_s's play and tone were very aggressive early on.

I find the first bolded so, so hard to believe. You had a scumlean on him and the thing holding you back from that was an uncced ascetic claim. When (1) tons of people have been explaining why it makes sense for him to claim it as a mafia ascetic (so the claim itself isn't a strong reason to townread him). And more importantly (2), being an uncced ascetic isn't a particularly townish thing... like, I can understand this if he were an uncced cop or doctor or tracker or generally an uncced power role, because making a power role claim puts you in the limelight and makes you suspicious if you don't die the next night. But I find it hard to believe that this was the only thing holding you back from scumreading him or more specifically that it would hold you back from scumreading him.

Second bolded part feels super contrived. Calling an L-2 wagon on herself positive as if to shout "hey, i don't really care if i'm lynched bc i'm not scum" from the rooftops with no regard to how harmful it would be if we lynch her and not eagerSnake in the event that she's town and he's scum (which, to be clear, I do not believe but she does). Giving the positive that you've eliminated one out of 200+ possible scumteams further evidences that she doesn't actually feel like the wagon on her is a good thing, she's just BSing to try to look like town-who-doesn't-care-if-they're-wagoned. If she were town she would be concerned about the wagon on her competing with the wagon on eagerSnake, or if she was genuinely glad about it would have more to say about it than "these three people aren't all scum" which is so likely to be true a priori as to have evidence in favor of it be utterly meaningless (reducing an 0.5% chance to an 0.1% chance is not meaningful, and that would require insanely strong evidence to do). We'll see what she has to say when she gives more analysis on it.

Posting from work because I really needed to get this off my mind while it's fresh. Will have more to say on the es-ss fiasco later. But it's gonna be more of what you've already heard.

[eagerSnake]

Thank you. I was hoping someone would point out how bad that post was better than I could

[eagerSnake]

Also calling it 'scum theater' implies that there is 2 scum involved, which in this scenario would mean S_S and I are performing scum theater. Basically setting herself up to lynch him tomorrow when I flip

[Gamma Emerald]

Also calling it 'scum theater' implies that there is 2 scum involved, which in this scenario would mean S_S and I are performing scum theater. Basically setting herself up to lynch him tomorrow when I flip

WHAT
You could have phrased that better.

[eagerSnake]

Yeah I know lol... basically she knows she will be going after him for the counter-flip tomorrow when i flip town so her scum mindset is already prepped to go after him, and she slipped that thought by saying it is 'scum theater.' she doesn't really believe it's theater at all, and calling it that makes no sense

[Zoronos]

Dierfire, Grendel, Zoronos are the people who haven't really taken a firm stance on this

Pretty sure my stance on this should be obvious by now.
Curious what Grendel and Bored (specifically Bored) have to say.

You got any other thoughts on Bored? (There's something I saw when I was reviewing Bored that I'm surprised nobody else has brought up but w/e)

[eagerSnake]

Not really, I've pretty much said my peace