Mini Normal #1838 - Game Over

[Gamma Emerald]

So now that you say that, I'm leaning less scum on you, and more scum on PP. Guess you were right about that unwillingness to follow not meaning anything.

[Gamma Emerald]

So now that you say that, I'm leaning less scum on you, and more scum on PP. Guess you were right about that unwillingness to follow not meaning anything.

@Dier
UNVOTE:

[Dierfire]

@Gamma Emerald

I can see how you might say that, however, it is my personal policy to suspect whomever performed the suspicious action more than the person the action was performed at.

I have listed suspicious actions from both of you with regard to the other.

[Gamma Emerald]

Wait.
My vote wasn't on Dier was it. It was on boring.
VOTE: boring

[Gamma Emerald]

@Gamma Emerald

I can see how you might say that, however, it is my personal policy to suspect whomever performed the suspicious action more than the person the action was performed at.

I have listed suspicious actions from both of you with regard to the other.

Okay. Is there a way to rectify this without flips?

[Dierfire]

I promise that I will continue to evaluate and update throughout the game. I like to think that I am not inordinately susceptible to confirmation bias, and I always read and try to understand the perspectives even of players that I find suspicious.

[Gamma Emerald]

Do you have any scumreads outside us and Eager?

[Dierfire]

No, I've no other players that I'm reading as Mafia at this time.
I'm reading as Town: Prism, Shadow_step, nn30, Zoronos, implosion, and Grendel (strongest reads are Shadow_step and Zoronos)
I'm reading as Null: Lil Uzi Vert, MariaR, and boring (first two I haven't made much effort to read, boring I've read but not found anything especially indicative of alignment)

[Dierfire]

With that, I'm going to sleep. I'll be back tomorrow.

[Zoronos]

So, catching up a tad. That Dierfire interaction is really dense and I'll work on unpacking it in the morning. Some of the thoughts I liked, and some seem off track.
So, for the sake of clarity Dierfire, your scum reads are Eager, Gamma, and Penguin? You are further of the opinion that Gamma and Penguin's set of disagreements around the competing trains was theater / scum distancing and that they could be scum together?
Am I understanding this correctly?

[Zoronos]

No point asking Eager for a full claim, he will probably claim a strong pro town role to draw a CC, so that his buddies can kill that player. No thanks.

We should absolutely ask for a full claim; if a PR dies to kill a scum, yay we killed a scum. There's basically no PR I wouldn't trade for a dead scum, especially a D1 dead scum.
I'm not nearly as LOCK SOLID SCUM KILL KILL as you are, and I think you need to appreciate that a lot of other players in this game aren't either. Trying to ram the lynch through as fast as possible is a bad plan.

[Zoronos]

p-edit: @Zoro. I gave you what I have to give. I can't say where I was going next with my train of thought on PP because as I said, I was distracted by Grendel. I guess you're just going to have to be dissatisfied. Did you have any other questions that I can help you with, or is that the extent of your questioning?

So, are you still of the opinion that Penguin is scum?

Let's take it on faith that Eager is scum for the purpose of this exercise - We've had a couple trains at -1 at this point after the counterclaims (yours and Eagers). We didn't see any intent to hammer on either train. So, based on what you've seen so far, who do you feel is his most likely scumbuddy? (again, we're assuming that he's scum for the purpose of this exercise. Benefit of the doubt and all that). Are his partner's on you to counterwagon? Bussing him? Talk to me about the flow of events in the game and how that relates to the scum gameplan.

[Prism]

@Dierfire I promised to review it awhile back but yeah, it's been pretty low priority. I'll get to it when I have time if it's still relevant.

I still don't buy the case on boring, well I don't buy it enough to believe she's the correct lynch for today.

@LUV: Can you explain in your own words, ie. minimal "I agree with X" even if it's true, what's wrong with the case on boring?

[Shadow_step]

No point asking Eager for a full claim, he will probably claim a strong pro town role to draw a CC, so that his buddies can kill that player. No thanks.

We should absolutely ask for a full claim; if a PR dies to kill a scum, yay we killed a scum. There's basically no PR I wouldn't trade for a dead scum, especially a D1 dead scum.
I'm not nearly as LOCK SOLID SCUM KILL KILL as you are, and I think you need to appreciate that a lot of other players in this game aren't either. Trying to ram the lynch through as fast as possible is a bad plan.

I'm not trying to ram an eager lynch. The counter wagon on boring is bs and there is no real case on the slot.

[nn30]

Yay my first time being MLed as town

This is another scum flailing lie, he got mled in the last game we played together.

Can you link me to this game?

[eagerSnake]

This is another scum flailing lie, he got mled in the last game we played together.

This is a lie.

[eagerSnake]

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=67948

This is the game he is referring to in which I:

eagerSnake - Endgamed Day 4 - Town Bulletproof Cop

[eagerSnake]

UNVOTE: PenguinPower
VOTE: eagerSnake

I want a full claim from eagerSnake.

Yeah... That's not how this works...

Interesting, though.

[nn30]

Yay my first time being MLed as town

This is another scum flailing lie, he got mled in the last game we played together.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=67948

This is the game he is referring to in which I:

eagerSnake - Endgamed Day 4 - Town Bulletproof Cop

@Shadow - any rebuttal?

[Shadow_step]

Hmm I got my facts wrong. Eggman and eager were both useless I thought eager got lynched for the cult win.

[podoboq]

Official Vote Count 1.31

Lynching

With 13 votes in play, it takes 7 to lynch.

boring (4): MariaR, implosion, nn30, Gamma Emerald
eagerSnake (4): Shadow_step, boring, PenguinPower, Dierfire
implosion (1): Prism
Shadow_step (1): Lil Uzi Vert

Not Voting (3): Zoronos, Grendel, eagerSnake

V/LA: none

Deadline: (expired on 2016-10-18 15:22:00)

[eagerSnake]

VOTE: Unvote

For now to see where things go

@Mod: I unvoted in 1294

[Lil Uzi Vert]

@Dierfire I promised to review it awhile back but yeah, it's been pretty low priority. I'll get to it when I have time if it's still relevant.

I still don't buy the case on boring, well I don't buy it enough to believe she's the correct lynch for today.

@LUV: Can you explain in your own words, ie. minimal "I agree with X" even if it's true, what's wrong with the case on boring?

I already touched on it earlier and while I don't town read her I don't find the cases against her very strong. She's basically being scum read for people viewing the tone of her posts as happy about the conflict between Shadow and a Snake yet there is no evidence to show that she is. People also seem to forget that she wasn't fond of Snake's play this game and probably had a slight town read on him so her voting for him shouldn't be that surprising.

[nn30]

@Dierfire I promised to review it awhile back but yeah, it's been pretty low priority. I'll get to it when I have time if it's still relevant.

I still don't buy the case on boring, well I don't buy it enough to believe she's the correct lynch for today.

@LUV: Can you explain in your own words, ie. minimal "I agree with X" even if it's true, what's wrong with the case on boring?

I already touched on it earlier and while I don't town read her I don't find the cases against her very strong. She's basically being scum read for people viewing the tone of her posts as happy about the conflict between Shadow and a Snake yet there is no evidence to show that she is. People also seem to forget that she wasn't fond of Snake's play this game and probably had a slight town read on him so her voting for him shouldn't be that surprising.

Up until the CC Snake was her 2nd highest town read. That's more than a 'slight town read' IMO.

[Shadow_step]

Voting unvote isn't the correct format of unvoting.