In post 34, eagerSnake wrote:Boring has nothing to say because they said it all in their day chat
In post 36, Grendel wrote:@Boring You don't even have a witty one-liner to go with your vote... that's really... boring...
In post 68, eagerSnake wrote:I usually try to form a good town-block and then consider the best scum-hunter of the block as the wise elder
In post 91, eagerSnake wrote:Well nn30 is probably town.
We've too many players who fall into your "unacceptable RVS vote" category for them all to be scum. How'd you come to the conclusion that this one in particular is scum?
In post 136, PenguinPower wrote:
Since everyone else is playing...I don't want to be left out.
1.) Town. I'm always scumread, so being scum is hard.
2.) Never been mislynched. Come close several times, but never.
3.) Undefined.
4.) Below...for username reasons and whatnot.
5.) On a scale of Little Penguin to Emperor Penguin, about a Macaroni Penguin.
In post 143, Shadow_step wrote:In post 140, boring wrote:We've too many players who fall into your "unacceptable RVS vote" category for them all to be scum. How'd you come to the conclusion that this one in particular is scum?
Also, what do you think of Implosion sheeping you with what amounts to a naked vote?
gut
Why, do you have a problem with my push?
I don't care about Implosion as long as he helps me lynch scum.
This appears to be an insider-only train of thought. Are you planning to share with the rest of the class once you get an answer from Grendel?In post 180, Gamma Emerald wrote:Okay looking back at that no-claim thing mafia did it more it seems. I'm not quite sure what this means for Eager so I'll wait for Grendel's opinions on the matter.
In post 179, MariaR wrote:VOTE: Zoronos
Best vote atm I haven't liked any of his posts to put it in a simple answer.
In post 189, Gamma Emerald wrote:In post 188, boring wrote:In post 179, MariaR wrote:VOTE: Zoronos
Best vote atm I haven't liked any of his posts to put it in a simple answer.
This is a train that I can ride for a while. Have you ever worn a jacket so small that you can't button it up or move your arms properly? That's what he brings to mind.
VOTE: Zoronos
Mind explaining this metaphor?
it's a fun ice breaker, sure, and I think we can appreciate the effort you put in. I know part of my aversion lies in how weirdly you interpreted my answers. I can elaborate in a PM after the gave ends, if you'd like. Either way, there are very different, very plausible other explanations for people's responses that went unaddressed/unconsidered. So while you're free to form your reads however you want, it may not be helpful to the rest of us in our search.In post 241, Grendel wrote:
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I have legitimately caught scum with RQS. I've legitimately identify'd town too.
I don't understand how people will treat gut, and tone like proper scum hunting methods, but will absolutely crap on RQS when is an excersie, that in my opinion, combines those things plus a decent degree of logic, and is an easy way to get a whole rosters worth of reads in sometimes just a few pages. Even if my reads were totally wrong I at the very least got to know a little more about who I'm playing with. I don't consider RQS to be a waste of time.
Utterly baffled by the general "lol no" response I'm getting this game.
I'm pretty sure I've addressed this at length, but I can answer again. I think he's telling the truth, and I think that unless his only role modifier is ascetic, he made a mistake announcing it so quickly. Factor in his town block nonsense, and I have him as strong town with questionable judgement.In post 280, Shadow_step wrote:@Boring, since you are around, what is you read on Eager atm, regarding his claim and stuff?
In post 331, implosion wrote:boring wrote:Gamma is acting exactly like he did in our last game.
Can you quantify exactly what you find similar?
In post 343, Shadow_step wrote:In post 329, boring wrote:Gamma is acting exactly like he did in our last game. I tunnelled him for it because he's easy to mislynch. I'm also doubting my scum read on Zoronos. He's just barrelled on without a single adjustment to his behavior. It's not something I'd expect from someone I'm scum-reading for being fake. They're each either cleverer at playing scum than I'm willing to entertain at the moment, or they're not scum.
UNVOTE:
Join me on Penguin please.
He nicely ignored my question.
In post 485, Gamma Emerald wrote:Wait wtf I forgot I changed my mind on implosion; make my read on him null-town
As for ShadowStep, I want him to not be as tunnely.
In post 488, Prism wrote:Hey everybody, I'm thrilled to join the game and can't wait to jump in.
That said, this is my busiest weekend of the year which makes it difficult to do so. I'll try to do a more comprehensive read on Sunday but for now I'm frozen in time at Page 12. In the meantime I'm going to VOTE: boring whose #196 left me wondering if she was trying to find inconsistencies or trying to find scum.
Even blind acorns find nuts on occasion!In post 504, Grendel wrote:In post 476, boring wrote:Grendel - His line of speculation appears faulty, but not scummy. Probably town.
But Boring, if you feel my logic is off base the why are you sharing my top scum read?
If I'm really off my game and I started the Penguin wagon wouldn't that give you pause?
Does this seem uncomfortable to anyone else?In post 607, Grendel wrote:In post 582, eagerSnake wrote:In post 579, Zoronos wrote:The dichotomy between Boring and Maria here is interesting; Maria is hard to sort because she is content light (apparently purposefully), and Boring is hard to sort because some of her content makes me go "Yup, that's scummy def" and some is "Well, that is pretty darn reasonable".
Throw Grendel in there and lol
You suspensions of me actually strength my town read on you. The Scum!Eager I played with was totally okay with being a strong tr of mine. Your paranoia here makes me all the more sure you are town.
I mean, if you are scum you a mighty fine actor lol.
In post 614, Prism wrote:I don't think Penguin is undeinably rocksolid town but comparing him to people like Implosion, boring, LUV, Gamma, Maria, or even Grendel he might as well be the Pope.
In post 619, Grendel wrote:boring wrote:Does this seem uncomfortable to anyone else?In post 607, Grendel wrote:In post 582, eagerSnake wrote:In post 579, Zoronos wrote:The dichotomy between Boring and Maria here is interesting; Maria is hard to sort because she is content light (apparently purposefully), and Boring is hard to sort because some of her content makes me go "Yup, that's scummy def" and some is "Well, that is pretty darn reasonable".
Throw Grendel in there and lol
You suspensions of me actually strength my town read on you. The Scum!Eager I played with was totally okay with being a strong tr of mine. Your paranoia here makes me all the more sure you are town.
I mean, if you are scum you a mighty fine actor lol.
Why and to what extent?
I noticed how Eager wasn't content for me to scratch him behind the ears with a town read this game and thought it was townish. And decided to mention it while it was still on my mind.
In post 625, Grendel wrote:In post 623, boring wrote:In post 619, Grendel wrote:boring wrote:Does this seem uncomfortable to anyone else?In post 607, Grendel wrote:In post 582, eagerSnake wrote:In post 579, Zoronos wrote:The dichotomy between Boring and Maria here is interesting; Maria is hard to sort because she is content light (apparently purposefully), and Boring is hard to sort because some of her content makes me go "Yup, that's scummy def" and some is "Well, that is pretty darn reasonable".
Throw Grendel in there and lol
You suspensions of me actually strength my town read on you. The Scum!Eager I played with was totally okay with being a strong tr of mine. Your paranoia here makes me all the more sure you are town.
I mean, if you are scum you a mighty fine actor lol.
Why and to what extent?
I noticed how Eager wasn't content for me to scratch him behind the ears with a town read this game and thought it was townish. And decided to mention it while it was still on my mind.
It read to me like "greetings, fellow town-player. You are definitely town, and not scum. I am also not scum. You can see it clearly printed on my nametag. I will now go and do town things. Because I'm town."
I was open to the idea that I'm just being paranoid, which is why I opened the floor, rather than just sticking it into my notes.
You're free to over analysis me as much as you want.
I do think its kind of funny that I just got finished saying how I town read Snake's paranoia, and suddenly you are acting paranoid of me too.
In post 638, nn30 wrote:In post 636, boring wrote:Of course I am, eager. I've miraculously drawn scum for the fourth game in a row to stroke your ego, and justify the fear vote you planned since the sign-up thread.
You don't even have to scum hunt. Just park a vote, make a shitty claim, and fake a hammer for lolz (because you got fuck-all info from it).
Okay. This feels forced. And also out of left field.
In post 642, Shadow_step wrote:In post 121, Shadow_step wrote:This game just got easy .In post 122, Shadow_step wrote:Kidding lol
Hello eager, do you have any early reads?
Anyone else can also answer this.
Eager is probably a goon and would be doing most of the kills and hence might have the biggest chance of getting caught so he claimed to have ascetic.
I'm town ascetic.
First thing I did after reading Eager's claim was confirm with the mod that he sent me the right role PM.
In post 654, eagerSnake wrote:Lol. Why are you waiting until now to bring up that you're Ascetic?
Why aren't you considering the possibility of 2 Town having Ascetic?
In post 1049, eagerSnake wrote:boring has experience on another site
In post 1068, implosion wrote:In post 1037, boring wrote:@eager - I'm not sure you understand what buddying means. Most of what you posted was criticism. Also, why do you keep repeating that I'm happy about the conflict? I've been around for very little of this little scum theater.
@town? - eager has been coasting, and the only thing in the way of my gut scumlean was the fact that he had an uncc'd claim. A cc from an obvious town player was more than enough reason to vote him. Either way, how can so many of you accept eager's piss-poor "town" performance without resistance? I mean, eager has bragged twice now about how shitty town is playing by not calling him out for his lazy vote. You're all just taking the insult with pride, it would appear. The only positive thing I can say about this development is my wagon. It decreases the likelihood that eagerSnake, MariaR and implosion are ALL scum. I'll have to try to knock at least one out of the running.
If scum want to chainsaw me up to L-1, that's fine, but don't let them hammer without warning. I'll try to be back again tomorrow to check on things.
p-edit - S_s's play and tone were very aggressive early on.
I find the first bolded so, so hard to believe. You had a scumlean on him and the thing holding you back from that was an uncced ascetic claim. When (1) tons of people have been explaining why it makes sense for him to claim it as a mafia ascetic (so the claim itself isn't a strong reason to townread him). And more importantly (2), being an uncced ascetic isn't a particularly townish thing... like, I can understand this if he were an uncced cop or doctor or tracker or generally an uncced power role, because making a power role claim puts you in the limelight and makes you suspicious if you don't die the next night. But I find it hard to believe that this was the only thing holding you back from scumreading him or more specifically that it would hold you back from scumreading him.
In post 1068, implosion wrote:Second bolded part feels super contrived. Calling an L-2 wagon on herself positive as if to shout "hey, i don't really care if i'm lynched bc i'm not scum" from the rooftops with no regard to how harmful it would be if we lynch her and not eagerSnake in the event that she's town and he's scum (which, to be clear, I do not believe but she does). Giving the positive that you've eliminated one out of 200+ possible scumteams further evidences that she doesn't actually feel like the wagon on her is a good thing, she's just BSing to try to look like town-who-doesn't-care-if-they're-wagoned. If she were town she would be concerned about the wagon on her competing with the wagon on eagerSnake, or if she was genuinely glad about it would have more to say about it than "these three people aren't all scum" which is so likely to be true a priori as to have evidence in favor of it be utterly meaningless (reducing an 0.5% chance to an 0.1% chance is not meaningful, and that would require insanely strong evidence to do). We'll see what she has to say when she gives more analysis on it.
Posting from work because I really needed to get this off my mind while it's fresh. Will have more to say on the es-ss fiasco later. But it's gonna be more of what you've already heard.
In post 1070, eagerSnake wrote:Also calling it 'scum theater' implies that there is 2 scum involved, which in this scenario would mean S_S and I are performing scum theater. Basically setting herself up to lynch him tomorrow when I flip
In post 1078, Zoronos wrote:In post 476, boring wrote:Shadow_step - Has an aggressive town persona. A hint of grandiosity. I haven't seen this behavior before with scum.
eagerSnake - He's got a most-likely-town claim. If he's still alive tomorrow, he'll probably be bumped way down because he's pretty useless
These were Boring's top two town reads at one point. She flipped on her second top town read as soon as her first CC'ed him on a modifier, without further investigation. I find that questionable.
I am further surprised that not a single person brought up that she was willing to trash her town reads that quickly. But w/e.
Anyway, I want to hear what Boring has to say once she comes back; my gut wants her to be scum (hello conf-bias) but I can't justify just throwing down the hammer without giving her a chance to say her piece.
In post 1167, Gamma Emerald wrote:Boring I'd like your input on what I said about Eager and Maria(now including Implosion!) argued(the duplicate town roles thing).
In post 1181, Zoronos wrote:@boring
Anyway, here's my take on your play so far:
You've been in the middle of two trains - PP and Eager. Never the head of either - the player leading the charge for the lynch. While you were on PP, you didn't talk about him much at all or advocate for that train to move forwards. You mostly seemed to be talking to Grendel. (I kind of liked your evaluation of Grendel's conciliatory post to Gamma, actually 623).
However that suspicion also never seemed to get pushed based the suspicion phase.
At the time of the CC, you had Eager as your number 2 town read, after SS at number one. That suggests, to me, that you didn't have a lot of skepticism about his claim. Furthermore, I find "He survived the night, he must be scum" to be a really awful way to evaluate PR's (since it depends on the playstyle of the scum team on whether they are risk averse or not, which is hidden information). It makes it really easy for scum to try to lynch PR's by building up mistrust.
So, when you immediately flipped on him as soon as the CC happens, that seems scummy to me. You didn't take the time to re-evaluate the read or look for other indications on whether he was scummy. Just 'Oh counterclaim yup top scum' and a vote. There wasn't evidence of skepticism or evaluation. If someone counterclaims one of my top town reads, I am always going to try and think carefully about why my town read might have been wrong, or if something else is afoot.
So, I don't think you've done a lot of active scum hunting, haven't been an evangelist for the trains you've been on, and I question your sudden certainty on Eager-scum. Those things add up to my gut thinking you're playing a happy coincidence of two town having the same role modifier, and you get a free mislynch.
However, the logical case hasn't caught up to my gut and I am wary of just interpreting events into conf-bias land. So I'm not entirely convinced that you're the villain quite yet - at least not until we've had a chance to chat a bit more.
In post 622, boring wrote:In post 614, Prism wrote:I don't think Penguin is undeinably rocksolid town but comparing him to people like Implosion, boring, LUV, Gamma, Maria, or even Grendel he might as well be the Pope.
How on earth is PP less scummy than me? Do you have any decent reasons? Or is it just that I actually bothered to elaborate on my Zoro read like ten pages ago?
Either way, it's lovely to know that someone who apparently exists solely to swipe at low-hanging fruit is totally cool with you.
In post 1219, MariaR wrote:Anyone on eagers wagon who can answer this:
Why does scum eager claim day 1 when he'd be the most powerful maf role?
In post 1238, nn30 wrote:From before the CC:
Boring was doing little / no scum hunting. She joined the Zoronos wagon (3rd there). Aside from questioning his logic once or twice, she loses interest in Zoronos fairly quickly. She joins the Penguin wagon (also 3rd) and aside from her rainbow read list (putting Penguin as her top scum read) she spends the next 15 posts without engaging with Penguin again.
After the CC:
She votes Eager with little to no thought about the CC (literal minutes between SS announcing and her voting Eager). She drops Eager (previously a 2nd to top town read) to her biggest scum read with little to no explanation, thought, consideration... nada. This feels very opportunistic.
Also, this:In post 1037, boring wrote:@town? - eager has been coasting, and the only thing in the way of my gut scumlean was the fact that he had an uncc'd claim. A cc from an obvious town player was more than enough reason to vote him.
She is specifically referring to the period of time before the Shadow CC that she had a scumlean on him. This directly contradicts her read list from that period of time (where snake was her second to top town read).In post 1165, boring wrote:...
If you bothered to open an ISO, you'd see that I've been pretty clear about my feelings regarding eager's claim. That being, he was an uncc'd town claim, which left unchallenged, left him as a prime night kill target (because of the probably confirmed town status). As I also stated several times, if he lived to tomorrow, I'd re-evaluate. So for Day 1, uncc'd regardless of how untown he seemed, I didn't feel like I had much choice but to accept him as confirmed town.
...
Further contradiction. He's probably confirmed town without a counter claim - yet in 1037 (when there was still no CC) she has a scumlean on him.
Fishy. Fishy fishy.
I had a slight scum read on Boring before the CC. The most quantifiable thing is that her read list felt hinky to me (like she was posting it instead of actually scum hunting). There was also a gut feeling, which is more difficult to quantify.
Snake also pointed out that he parked his vote on Boring the entire day - and nobody nibbled - meaning 0 scum tried to hop onto the wagon and test the waters (implying that Boring herself is scum, causing the lack of interest in her wagon). I like this logic a lot.
Fin.
In post 1272, nn30 wrote:In post 1037, boring wrote:@town? - eager has been coasting, and the only thing in the way of my gut scumlean was the fact that he had an uncc'd claim. A cc from an obvious town player was more than enough reason to vote him.
She is specifically referring to the period of time before the Shadow CC that she had a scumlean on him. This directly contradicts her read list from that period of time (where snake was her second to top town read).In post 1165, boring wrote:...
If you bothered to open an ISO, you'd see that I've been pretty clear about my feelings regarding eager's claim. That being, he was an uncc'd town claim, which left unchallenged, left him as a prime night kill target (because of the probably confirmed town status). As I also stated several times, if he lived to tomorrow, I'd re-evaluate. So for Day 1, uncc'd regardless of how untown he seemed, I didn't feel like I had much choice but to accept him as confirmed town.
...
Further contradiction. He's probably confirmed town without a counter claim - yet in 1037 (when there was still no CC) she has a scumlean on him.
Fishy. Fishy fishy.
In post 1238, nn30 wrote:Snake also pointed out that he parked his vote on Boring the entire day - and nobody nibbled - meaning 0 scum tried to hop onto the wagon and test the waters (implying that Boring herself is scum, causing the lack of interest in her wagon). I like this logic a lot.
Fin.
In post 776, eagerSnake wrote:Mainly wanted to see if anyone would react to my obviously parked vote or not
.. no one really did
In post 820, eagerSnake wrote:Wish I could give you more than the fact I've been parked on boring all game and scum haven't even taken a nibble at it, so that also makes it more likely boring is scum
In post 1238, nn30 wrote:I had a slight scum read on Boring before the CC. The most quantifiable thing is that her read list felt hinky to me (like she was posting it instead of actually scum hunting). There was also a gut feeling, which is more difficult to quantify.
In post 1272, nn30 wrote:In post 1266, boring wrote:So, you haven't been paying attention like, at all? Hopefully when this trip is over, I'll have time to go through and show you point-for-point where you've clearly glossed, ignored, and misrepped. I realize this isn't the first time you've gotten totally confused in this game, but geez.
It's like you're pretending to be Zoro, except Zoro actually brought up some valid concerns (unfortunately for me).
Anyway, my request stands. Please wait for me to come back and post if y'all get to the point of intent to hammer on me. Or just lynch eagerSnake. Either one works.
Well that's one way to deflect.
In post 1364, Gamma Emerald wrote:So I never really voted for this reason, but I should address it anyways I feel.
Boring has a point about finding someone's play scummy even though they are likely town. There have been point where I've said "dude that's scummy" to people I townread.
In post 1367, Gamma Emerald wrote:In post 1365, boring wrote:In post 1364, Gamma Emerald wrote:So I never really voted for this reason, but I should address it anyways I feel.
Boring has a point about finding someone's play scummy even though they are likely town. There have been point where I've said "dude that's scummy" to people I townread.
I've forgotten. Why are you voting me, again?
Because your read on Shadow is faulty and I don't like your turnaround on Eager.
Basically everyone else's reason.
In post 1375, nn30 wrote:@Boring - still not buying it.
If you were conflicted about your read on Eager, why the hell was he your second to top town read?
In post 1437, Zoronos wrote:@Boring - You didn't answer the question I posed last night. The short version was "Who is your best non-Eager scum read, if you want you can assume Eager is scum for the sake of this exercise."
In post 1444, MariaR wrote:Hm I see your point but I don't see any other better lynches then LUV and that clearly isn't happening
In post 1451, eagerSnake wrote:What about nolynch?
In post 1456, nn30 wrote:In post 1455, eagerSnake wrote:But yeah I think you're scum even more after that last post
VOTE: boring
I only recently learned this myself. I'm going to assume you don't know it (though I plan to read through your old games for no lynch discussions now).
No lynches in games with odd numbers of people give an advantage to scum. Assuming lynches don't hit scum for the rest of the game we'll get to LYLO with one less total lynch attempt than if we had just lynched on day one.
Games with even numbers of people don't have this problem. The impact of a no lynch with an even numbered game does not "steal" a lynch from town.
In post 1460, Zoronos wrote:In post 1452, boring wrote:In post 1437, Zoronos wrote:@Boring - You didn't answer the question I posed last night. The short version was "Who is your best non-Eager scum read, if you want you can assume Eager is scum for the sake of this exercise."In post 1444, MariaR wrote:Hm I see your point but I don't see any other better lynches then LUV and that clearly isn't happening
I would like to lynch eager today, but if it's absolutely not going to happen, I'd be willing to settle for LUV. He's the most probable scum when I look outside the CC-related wagons. By that, I mean it seems like regardless of eager's flip, LUV could be scum. I admit that part of my reasoning is that he keeps trying to push S_s, which is making zero sense to me. That, and his eagerness to accept bizarre theories just to keep the S_s suspicions going.
This is kinda reasonable...
Talk to me some more about his contributions. I am going to ignore last night's "wtf is this" bullshit-a-thon for this purpose. Those posts were bad and dumb we both agree, talk to me about his posts from before then.
Also, which alignment do you think is more likely to go off on crazy conspiracy theories, town or scum?
In post 1463, implosion wrote:On the other hand, I hate to beat a dead horse of almost-everything-boring-says-sounds-scummy but I really dislike boring's reaction... again.boring wrote:So, rather than lynching scum (or at the very least learning from a town flip), you're suggesting we give them a free night kill, and start this mess up again tomorrow? We're better off lynching today. Even if it turns out to be me (though I'd hardly call that "plan A").
This is such an incredibly tepid response for someone who has been pushing eager so consistently since shadow claimed. Compare penguin's reaction, and Zoronos's reaction, and even nn who remarks that it's worth looking at his old games based on this. boring's reaction just reeks of scum who doesn't know how people are going to react and wants to test the waters before committing to saying something like "oh my god, only scum would possibly suggest a no lynch, can we please lynch him already." Which I would expect from town-boring here (obviously not in those words but etc).
That paragraph from boring does not read like town talking to their top scumread. It does not read like town with a strong investment in lynching the person they are talking to. I could buy it as town talking to someone that they're trying to make up their mind on. But I can't buy it as town talking to their top scumread. It just sounds like detached, rehearsed advice.
In post 1489, Gamma Emerald wrote:In post 1487, boring wrote:As far as who is more likely to come up with (and follow) crazy theories, I think it's pretty individual. Some people have wild imaginations and are prone to conspiracy. Some people aren't. I can see such a person coming up with something crazy as town or scum (perhaps more likely as town, but how would they know it's crazy as scum if they think it's perfectly sane when they're town). I think scum (or insanely conf.biased town) is more likely to pretend to buy into someone else's crazy theory hoping it'll stick.
What I get from this is you scumread LUV for following my moon logic?
I can understand being wary of me, PP, and implosion, but why Dierfire? He's been pretty darned towny since he started contributing.In post 1552, Zoronos wrote:Don't have a lot of time today but here's my current scum suspicions / thoughts:
Boring, PenguinPower, Implosion, Dierfire.
In post 1559, Zoronos wrote:In post 1556, Shadow_step wrote:Town doesn't react the way he did to my claim. I think the site meta and all was BS.
It was implied knowledge. He knew both of us were town.
Town doesn't react the way he did to my claim. I think the site meta and all was BS.It was implied knowledge. He knew both of us were town.
Except he was town, ergo town does react the way he did to your claim. You can't just claim that which is provably true isn't true.
If you *think* town doesn't react that way, your impression of how town plays is wrong and you're conflating scum reaction with NAI reaction.
In post 1577, implosion wrote:@Prism - You were after implosion yesterday. His tunnel timing me seems less than a coincidence,
I'm curious what you mean by this; it seems like it could mean pretty much anything. My best guess is that you mean to say that I brought up a wagon on you as a counterwagon to eagerSnake? And it sounds like you're trying to imply that that was a scummy thing to do? Which I find deeply confusing. So I'd like some clarification.
I'd also like some clarification on how you (seemingly, I may be misinterpreting things here) are simultaneously criticizing me for tunneling you on d1 and for not having strong reads on d1.
In post 1592, Zoronos wrote:Boring - Her posting was mostly defensive, we went over this in detail yesterday about why he read flipped. She didn't seem to do any work to suss out which of Eager and SS were the correct lynch, she just followed her top read SS to turn on her second to top read. I was in the middle of inquisiting this a bit when the hammer came down, but there we are.
In post 1607, Shadow_step wrote:I think gamma is scum because he was believing any vague stupid theories and voting people for shallow reasons without even thinking about it.
In post 1600, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:Why Dierfire? To me, he's trying really hard to sort out who he feels is suspicious and none of the cases he presented so far have read like scum trying to push a mislynch.
In post 1601, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:Wait, what? I didn't read you as town there. I was saying you're terrible because the case you had on Eager was terrible. As for considering town possibly lying, I had two reasons for town reading Snake, one was the time and the way he claimed and the other was I thought he was hiding the fact he had an actually useful PR and was intentionally acting the way he was so scum won't have a reason to kill him at night.
In post 1616, Zoronos wrote:Looking at the lynch yesterday, he provided no arguments for why Eager specifically was scum in the pair, didn't make any strong efforts to decide between the two competing claims, and didn't seem to examine the alternative trains. He just parked and went effectively afk other than an occasional 'this needs rope' style comment.
That to me suggests scum happy to take an easy lynch. He doesn't make an effort to sort out the alignments of all three players being discussed (boring, Eager, SS) because he doesn't care.
In post 1660, Dierfire wrote:@boring
You seemed to suggest that you would be able to make useful information from the wagon on you (1037). You've made defenses against the arguments offered by nn30 and implosion (1614); would it be accurate to say that you found implosion the more suspicious of the two (for reasons given in 1609)? Would it be accurate to say that you found implosion the most suspicious of all those players who voted for you?
Also, I'm not seeing that Lil Uzi Vert voted for you. I assume therefore that you find Lil Uzi Vert more suspicious than the most suspicious player who voted for you (presumptively implosion, otherwise specify the player)?
In post 1663, Zoronos wrote:I don't actually really want to lynch Gamma for being the top scum (despite my vote being there), I was mostly frustrated and exasperated with his persistent uncooperative anti-team-play bullshit.
In post 1679, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:You sound like you were having doubts about Eager being scum and if so, why didn't you state you were when I declared intent?
In post 1671, PenguinPower wrote:In post 1616, Zoronos wrote:Looking at the lynch yesterday, he provided no arguments for why Eager specifically was scum in the pair, didn't make any strong efforts to decide between the two competing claims, and didn't seem to examine the alternative trains. He just parked and went effectively afk other than an occasional 'this needs rope' style comment.
That to me suggests scum happy to take an easy lynch. He doesn't make an effort to sort out the alignments of all three players being discussed (boring, Eager, SS) because he doesn't care.
No, I cared. I just legit thought that Eager was scum. You should probably put your vote back on me with how strongly you think I'm scum.
VOTE: Gamma
Unlike you, this vote is because I think he's scum.
In post 1688, PenguinPower wrote:In post 1685, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:Never said you were my strongest scum read and I'm not refraining from anything. I'm taking my time and reevualting.
I was one of two of your scumreads in 522 which haven't changed, and I've only grown since then. According to you.
You seem to like to stay in an unvote state...it's kind of nice not to take a stance on anything, right? Gotta keep those options open until you can hammer town.
Actually, while looking back at vote counts at yours, Zoronos was in an unvote state in every. single. one. He has lots to say, but not much to do.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Zoronos
In post 1743, Grendel wrote:Nope.
VOTE: Gamma
I guess I'll explain tomorrow when I put a case up. I have to get off soon.
In the meantime you can explain why you were so quick to sheep your tertiary scum read.
In post 1770, Gamma Emerald wrote: And as I said, me pre-defending myself on ties to Eager clears me.
In post 1782, Grendel wrote:
So what about you though. Do you see the validity of what I'm saying?
In post 1799, Zoronos wrote:Actually, hey Boring who do you think is the scum and why?
That's because it is wishy-washy. I'm afraid to risk another TvT day when there are 2-3 other scum running around. His posts feel scummy. His big-picture is scummy. When it comes to inferring motivation, I'm falling a little short. He could be trying to stir up trouble and get some easy mislynches. I'm pretty low-hanging fruit right now, and everyone knows it. But, I have to ask myself whether I'd still see him in a scummy light if he was tunneling someone else instead of me? Am I having a knee-jerk reaction?In post 1810, Zoronos wrote:You say "On the other hand, he might not be scum" which is kinda true for every player in this game. Which side do you think is more likely? My apologies, but having an on-the-other-hand makes this read seem a bit wishy-washy.
In post 1823, Grendel wrote:In post 1816, boring wrote:That's because it is wishy-washy. I'm afraid to risk another TvT day when there are 2-3 other scum running around. His posts feel scummy. His big-picture is scummy. When it comes to inferring motivation, I'm falling a little short. He could be trying to stir up trouble and get some easy mislynches. I'm pretty low-hanging fruit right now, and everyone knows it. But, I have to ask myself whether I'd still see him in a scummy light if he was tunneling someone else instead of me? Am I having a knee-jerk reaction?In post 1810, Zoronos wrote:You say "On the other hand, he might not be scum" which is kinda true for every player in this game. Which side do you think is more likely? My apologies, but having an on-the-other-hand makes this read seem a bit wishy-washy.
Well... do you think you're having a knee-jerk reaction?
I'm okay with LUV getting lynched, but my top priority right now is Gamma.
In post 1850, Zoronos wrote:Literally nobody likes my case on Penguin? He has done absolutely fucking nothing all day D2, and basically did nothing D1, but "Nah, that's cool, let's just ignore him"?
You people.
In post 1830, Zoronos wrote:In post 1816, boring wrote:That's because it is wishy-washy. I'm afraid to risk another TvT day when there are 2-3 other scum running around. His posts feel scummy. His big-picture is scummy. When it comes to inferring motivation, I'm falling a little short. He could be trying to stir up trouble and get some easy mislynches. I'm pretty low-hanging fruit right now, and everyone knows it. But, I have to ask myself whether I'd still see him in a scummy light if he was tunneling someone else instead of me? Am I having a knee-jerk reaction?In post 1810, Zoronos wrote:You say "On the other hand, he might not be scum" which is kinda true for every player in this game. Which side do you think is more likely? My apologies, but having an on-the-other-hand makes this read seem a bit wishy-washy.
Your partial validation of my observations helps. I know Prism was after him a while back, and I'd like to see an update on implosion from him. Dierfire also appears to have a problem at least with this approach, but I'm not sure if he's inferring alignment with it. His perspective could also help. I think the three of you are town. I also think nn30 and Grendel are town. So their views won't hurt either.
I feel like you didn't really answer my question.
When you say you're afraid you don't want to risk another TvT day is that because your read on Implosion is just a slight lean versus a full blown This Is The Scum Vote It Now? Or something else?
In post 1870, Zoronos wrote:
@zoronos - I've found my scum, made my case, and I've staked out a few more options. Sure, I have one more scum read than there are scum, but I'm working on it. I've hunted down some town too, whom I'm using as a gauge for my own reads.So I don't know where you get off saying I've not been hunting. Especially with all your largely voteless posturing. Vote LUV, and find out how much hunting I've done.
In post 1930, Gamma Emerald wrote:In post 1929, nn30 wrote:@Gamma - please explain why you chose to investigate Implosion over other people.
I actually wrote this down to decide who to use my ability on.Who to cop in Mini 1838.
Night 1
Thoughts on me + Eager(anyone saying me and Eager were likely scum together is clear)
Clear: Shadow, Prism,
Not clear: Zoronos, nn30
Opinions on ascetics
Eager is wrong: Shadow
Both are right: Maria, Eager, implosion
Shadow is wrong: LUV, nn30
I’ll cop implosion because he was the strongest fighter for the two ascetics idea
In post 1972, PenguinPower wrote:In post 1971, nn30 wrote:Penguin - I don't have any specific thoughts other than that a meta-diving him on his scum games reveals similar play style to this version of Pengin.
This is funny. Sorry, just want to call this one out for endgame (and as a blatant lie). None of my scum games have been anywhere close to this one. Feel free to meta me, anyone.
In post 1985, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:Hm, Shadow seemed like he had more to say about Gamma's claim. Want to hear more from him.
Why am I being scum read again? Anyone actually buy the cases boring and Prism are presenting?
In post 1618, boring wrote:Spoiler:
Since I have time for ISO diving, I thought I'd dredge up these gems.
VOTE: LUV
Now, since we have plenty of time before EOD, I'd "luv" it if you could explain how/why you so drastically flipped script with your intent and hammer. From here, it looks like you magically went from suspecting Shadow (while agreeing that there couldn't be two ascetics) to deciding "yolo! I'm going to hammer the other guy". As far as I can tell, all that happened in between was your trip down the rabbit hole with Gamma.
In post 1988, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:Oh and by the way, I'll be playing from here on forward. Don't think I'll have enough time to do an entire reread of Day 1.
In post 2008, nn30 wrote:Town would be attempting to work with me and get me on their side. Because. Ya know. We need to work together to find scum.
You guys are doing that thing again where you're projecting based on personality. Some people manipulate through cooperation, others, through hissy fits (AtE). Unless you guys know how Penguin plays, you have no way of knowing whether these weird tantrums are AI/NAI. Better to look at motivation.In post 2019, implosion wrote:Scum would be attempting to work with you and get on your side. Because. Ya know. They need to not die to win the game.
It helps you sort between personality and pathology. It's easy to say that meta is crap when you don't know any of the players (or you want them to not meta-read you), but it has its value.In post 2010, Zoronos wrote:I think we're in meta land again kinda.
In post 2039, Zoronos wrote:re: LUV
as I said earlier today, my boring suspicion remains moderate to high, so I'm vaguely uncomfortable with any train of which she is the voice.
Which I guess is a long way of saying, help me work through my boring read.
My boring read is stronger than my 'dumpster a person who is noncontributory / nonsensical' stance at the moment, so I'm not super comfortable swinging that direction. I get where you're coming from, but my hackles are too far up at Boring at the moment.
In post 2042, Zoronos wrote:In post 2041, boring wrote:In post 2039, Zoronos wrote:re: LUV
as I said earlier today, my boring suspicion remains moderate to high, so I'm vaguely uncomfortable with any train of which she is the voice.
Which I guess is a long way of saying, help me work through my boring read.
My boring read is stronger than my 'dumpster a person who is noncontributory / nonsensical' stance at the moment, so I'm not super comfortable swinging that direction. I get where you're coming from, but my hackles are too far up at Boring at the moment.
How about this: Help me lynch LUV. Then Day 3, you and I (and implosion too, if that's what we're into) can go into couples counseling together.
I don't think I'm ready for that level of commitment yet.
In post 2046, nn30 wrote:In post 2029, boring wrote:In post 2008, nn30 wrote:Town would be attempting to work with me and get me on their side. Because. Ya know. We need to work together to find scum.You guys are doing that thing again where you're projecting based on personality. Some people manipulate through cooperation, others, through hissy fits (AtE). Unless you guys know how Penguin plays, you have no way of knowing whether these weird tantrums are AI/NAI. Better to look at motivation.In post 2019, implosion wrote:Scum would be attempting to work with you and get on your side. Because. Ya know. They need to not die to win the game.
Which brings us to why meta is important.It helps you sort between personality and pathology. It's easy to say that meta is crap when you don't know any of the players (or you want them to not meta-read you), but it has its value.In post 2010, Zoronos wrote:I think we're in meta land again kinda.
What's the motivation for PP calling me a liar?
In post 2115, Zoronos wrote:In post 2113, boring wrote:Scum!LUV has nothing to lose with a last-minute claim. Scum!Zoronos has no reason to counterclaim so quickly without first testing the waters. If it comes down to who I trust more, Zoronos or LUV, I'm picking Zoronos.
However, the roles are different, and serve different functions. I've only been playing mafia for 4 months. What are the chances that both are telling the truth?
I've been playing mafia for ~3 years, granted mostly not on these boards. In a game this size, as a setup designer, I would never combine Doc, Cop, and Jailer. That seems crazy to me personally. Even with two 'millers' (our ascetics) as negative utility. But that's just my instincts as a mod kicking in, and I've never modded on this site.
Which is probably best illustrated by my immediate urge to cause bullshit and yell my role. Which maybe was a poor choice on my part but oh well. People can call me bad in post game, I don't care.
btw this would be the place to follow up to my D1 spat with you on "How PR's should play"
In post 2122, PenguinPower wrote:He saying unless we're in a multiball setup since he jailed me, and there was only one NK, I would be a SK.
In post 2139, Zoronos wrote:I am a little astounded at how little anyone has to say, but okay.
Little Uzi Vert
Boring, I was probably wrong about you. Oops.
In post 2150, Zoronos wrote:also, trying to NA resolve it assumes scum have no roleblocker, strong man, or similar, which is not a great gamble to take.
LUV is the correct lynch here. If you thought he was scum before the counterclaim, then nothing has changed from prior unless you think his like 2 posts he made before disappearing oozed towniness.
In post 2159, Prism wrote:To clarify, if he's scum and boring isn't, he just lets us transition. If he's scum with boring, boring is the one who should have cc'd instead. Maybe another wagon like PP could have happened instead but practically half the town wanted boring and still do.In post 2157, Prism wrote:There is 0 reason, as scum, for Zoronos to cc there when a lynch on boring was the next likely candidate (in which case she would have done it)
In post 2170, Gamma Emerald wrote:The thing is, I rephrased it in a way that doesn't directly implicate boring, and then she agreed.
In post 2237, Zoronos wrote:In post 2232, boring wrote:I admit that nn30 hasn't been the greenest player lately, but the only reason I see to actually vote him right now is Dier's VCA, and while it seemed pretty well done, I can't see myself voting based on VCA alone. (and that, gentlemen, was a run-on sentence)
Now PP, you presented a compelling argument, but I find that I need more than he's scum. Are these just gut reads? Is there anything more?
@Zoronos - What are you thinking?
I am thinking a number of things.
Overnight my suspicion basically went to the people that seemed the most skeptical of LUV's fake claim (since scum know he's faking), or that were way over the top non-skeptical.
I was also looking at voting position on the wagon. I find that scum love to be on scum lynches, so I was looking for bus votes on the tail end of the wagon.
I am momentarily distracted by NN leaping to what seems to be superior knowledge about what went down at night, since blaming me for 'Why did you not jail Gamma!?!!' could easily be scum superior knowledge that a) they know they didn't roleblock me, ergo they know I didn't or b) they did roleblock me and feel like blaming me for that.
But I totally didn't jail Gamma. I figured the obvious kill was me, so I jailed offensively again since it was the only chance I felt to stop the NK. No sane scum team would go to the dome on Gamma unless they had a roleblocker or strongman (which I couldn't stop anyway), so either they had it and there's no point trying to counterplay that, or they were just going to kill me. In both cases jailing gamma just stops a clear coming back and doesn't save anyone.
Ergo, they either out-meta'ed me, or they have the roleblocker / strongman / whatever.
I also had a moment of doubt about whether he was actually cop based on some ~events~ from yesterday, but I guess that doubt got resolved.
In post 2255, Zoronos wrote:VOTE: Grendel
In post 2256, Zoronos wrote:^
That's the dude I jailed. I could see him on the most possible scum teams, he didn't seem to have any skeptiscm on LUV's claim (instantly jumped to clearly scum) and his vote on LUV was in prime bussing position.
In post 2278, Prism wrote:VOTE: boring
I do not get the boring townreads at all. Boring was coming off a borderline disastrous Day 1 where she got herself into a 1v1 with someone who flipped town, then had someone who hard scumread her nightkilled. It makes a lot of sense to bus Day 2. Reading boring does nothing to convince me that this isn't the case. The Day 1 pushes people are widely citing are offhanded comments here are there while she pushes someone else. Her end of day suggestion to go on LUV over eager was in #1452, when the vote was 5 eager 3 boring with Eager yet to vote. It was already locked between her and Eager and whether or not she'd lose seemed up in the air. A lot of these newfound townreads on boring are just reflexive reactions to the LUV flip, and at least one of them is coming from scum. I still think Maria dying wasn't a coincidence.
In post 2278, Prism wrote:Then there's this:It's unhelpful to block Gamma last night, and thus Zoronos isn't going to do it. She acknowledges this. If a random town knows it scum knows it. Why did she expect a Gamma death?In post 2240, boring wrote:I was expecting you to be dead today too, since going for Gamma would be a huge gamble, but here we are. I agree that it would have been unhelpful to block Gamma on his last productive night. I'm thinking that roleblocker is more likely, by the way.
In post 2284, implosion wrote:We also need to think about when we're going to massclaim. If anything, the death of the cop over the jailkeeper lends credence to scum not having a roleblocker; if they did they could kill the jk and block the cop indefinitely, which is safer than the alternative of leaving the jk alive and possibly getting roleblocked at 1 scum left.
You're incorrect. It was the beginning of Day 1, and I was questioning you. My line of inquiry was trying to solve you as a played. You had voted brazenly which I thought was preemptive. I also wanted to understand why you were willing to just accept that your scum read was voting your other scum read without flinching on either. I concluded by your answers that you were town with an over-inflated ego. If it weren't for the fact that I'm still not sure about there being 2 ascetics, you'd still be squarely in that peg.In post 2294, Shadow_step wrote:When I attacked LUV on day 1, boring had a "problem" with it.
In post 2296, nn30 wrote:In post 571, Grendel wrote:This is hard.
I'm beginning to wonder if I should look outside of these two for a bit.In post 573, Grendel wrote:I guess I'm not reaching a conclusion tonight.In post 573, Grendel wrote:I guess I'm not reaching a conclusion tonight.
These three quotes occurred 30 minutes apart. This is either really detail oriented scum who is methodically leaving breadcrumbs, or towny. This post feels towny to me.
In post 2306, nn30 wrote:Anyone with experience reading the musings of dead scum want to chime in here? I don't have any game experience to fall back on - I'm deferring to the help of my town. I trust Prism, Boring, Implosion with answering this as I think they're least likely to be scum (and to mislead me with their answer).
In post 2308, nn30 wrote:I want people to chime in here who have experience in the site and either confirm or deny that scum have left breadcrumbs in their games.
He's not the towniest player in the game, but he's not in my bottom two. So probably not as things stand. (you don't have enough gym badges to stop me from turning a yes/no question into a full sentence)In post 2320, nn30 wrote:@Boring - thanks for the insight. Gun to your head - is Grendel scum?
In post 2330, Grendel wrote:Consider how much I value meta, do you really think I'd soil my ability to self meta in future by using it as scum?
In post 2339, implosion wrote:Oh man, I didn't even see that boring described her own play as "hard bussing from day one." I'd love to hear a justification of how listing him as your fourth-strongest scumread, saying you'd be willing to settle for lynching him if you couldn't lynch eager, and then justifying that read further when asked about it amounts to "hard bussing" because I can't see anything else on d1 that you said about him.
In post 2389, Dierfire wrote:@boringIn post 2384, boring wrote:Dierfire, why does basically everyone have you as null? It's mighty shady at this point in the game.
Ha ha, I agree; I find it a bit strange that so many players don't have a read on me. Or did you mean that you're suspicious of me because other players are reading me as Null? I'm not so skilled that I can control how other players read me.
In post 2387, implosion wrote:boring wrote:Implosion, as usual, you seem to be arguing semantics and personality in lieu of actual scum-hunting.
I fail to see how literally anything that I said in 2334 has anything to do with either semantics or personality. At all. Almost all of the points there weren't even about your play. You continue the trend of responding to my points by sidestepping them, in this case just completely mischaracterizing them. Unless you're referring to me criticizing you for describing your play as hard bussing, in which case your response here:In post 2341, boring wrote:In post 2339, implosion wrote:Oh man, I didn't even see that boring described her own play as "hard bussing from day one." I'd love to hear a justification of how listing him as your fourth-strongest scumread, saying you'd be willing to settle for lynching him if you couldn't lynch eager, and then justifying that read further when asked about it amounts to "hard bussing" because I can't see anything else on d1 that you said about him.
I started suspecting him middle/end of day 1, and posted as much especially toward the end of the day. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but the end of a day isn't called a different day. You may have also noticed that I was V/LA half of day 1, and a leading wagon, so there was a bit of distractiin flying around.
is yet again an utter sidestep to the point I'm making. You started suspecting him. You never pushed him on d1. You only cited him as a backup if you couldn't get your preferred lynch on eager. And yet now you're trying to call yourself obvtown because you would have had to have "hard-bussed d1" which you wouldn't do. Which is a load of bs. You didn't hard bus. You didn't even bus. You plainly distanced from him and then bussed him when he became the obvious direction to bus in on d2 after his terrible end-of-day that would leave almost anyone suspicious of him.
That's not just a semantic difference. That is you saying you did things that you just very blatantly did not do and claiming that you are town for doing those things that you did not do. That's ridiculously scummy.
In post 2413, nn30 wrote:@Boring - you're only poking at one aspect of his case against you (you saying you hard bussed LUV) but ignoring the rest of the case.
Please respond to the rest of the case (your interactions with and LUV's actions towards you).
In post 2434, PenguinPower wrote:You're starting to get a little flippant in your posting, which I appreciate - if you were town.
In post 2434, PenguinPower wrote:Grendel's latest post reinforces my read on you, btw.
Still clumsy. First, I've not been flippant at all. Second, who is deliberately flippant the point that they would choose describe themselves as such?In post 2454, PenguinPower wrote:In post 2452, boring wrote:This comment worries me. I know this is an argument being used by someone(s) to townread you. Your attempt to apply it to me feels ham-handed. It's as if you're trying to reinforce this perception of you, rather than determine my alignment.
I'm me, and you're you. I've been flippant since my first post in this thread. You haven't been, so the change is noteworthy to me.
In post 2452, boring wrote:Please elaborate.
In post 2560, Dierfire wrote:@PenguinPower
I'm surprised that boring didn't answer this, but I can find one--me! I've included several quotes below.Spoiler: Quotes
If his intent to hammer was designed to lock LUV into a claim, why would he immediately believe it?In post 2085, Shadow_step wrote:I want to lock LUV into a claim, I think he is also scum.
If our most easily mislynched players were in a position to be conf. town, that's an enormous stroke of good luck. This comment reads to me like one of frustration, which makes me question whether it's a scum slip.In post 2092, Shadow_step wrote:Brilliant, all the lynch baits got all the good PRs :/
In post 2572, Prism wrote:Why am I so high on this given that you thought my points about you were nonsense, and my reads are close to the reverse of yours?In post 2567, boring wrote:1) It appears that people are using their claim list as a scum-to-town reads list, in which case, here's mine: Penguin, Shadow (already claimed), Dierfire, nn30/Grendel, Prism, Implosion/Zoronos (already claimed).
In post 2639, Shadow_step wrote:I'd prefer boring right now.
She tries to throw shade on PP without committing to a stance. Asks for town consensus about PP claim.
In post 2579, Shadow_step wrote:@boring #2571
How does believing a claim make me scum? what is your argument here? I don't get it at all.
In post 2085, Shadow_step wrote:I want to lock LUV into a claim, I think he is also scum.
In post 2092, Shadow_step wrote:Brilliant, all the lynch baits got all the good PRs :/
In post 2691, Shadow_step wrote:You have played a lot of game as scum. Have you killed people town reading you on the first chance you got ?
In post 2698, nn30 wrote:@Boring - what do you think of Dier right now?
In post 2699, Prism wrote:-I don't get most people's reaction to Grendel, the past few pages of his are all over the place and it reads as trying to dodge autoloss at any cost.
In post 2705, Zoronos wrote:Shadowstep and Dier over Grendel?
I am going to speculate that this means you think Grendel is town?
In post 2724, Shadow_step wrote:I'm waiting for that case on me.
In post 2729, Shadow_step wrote:I've responded to the first part which you never replied to.
If I'm an ascetic RB, this setup is ridiculously scum sided, so that whole argument is balls.
Next
In post 2730, Shadow_step wrote:In post 2728, nn30 wrote:@Boring - I'll add something to that as well.
I can't find the article on the wiki, but basically there was a theory article that suggested that scum like to find a tunnel and stick with it for the day.
It's safe to say that Shadow has been tunneling me 1) all day and 2) with dubious reasonings. I feel like I could have 1) done anything or 2) not done that very same thing and Shadow would scum read it either way. The dubious reasons for tunneling me suggest that his mind is immune to being changed, regardless of logic. His goal is to distract and put on a show, which he's done.
Tunneling you for dubious reasoning? Seriously!![]()
VCA is dubious ?
POE is dubious?
You voting me day 1 which is dripping with scum motivation is dubious?
I swear if you misrep and lie one more time I will fucking tunnel you to the ground.
Actually, it looks like I missed the entire second half of that page (around post #2656-#2674). That actually explains a lot (I couldn't figure out when Grendel had voted Dier).
In post 2751, Shadow_step wrote:I clearly asked you if you understood what I said because I didn't get what the hell you were talking about and I still don't.
I was saying why a scum Grendel wouldn't kill Maria n1 itself. Who is the "you" you are referring to idk.
I don't find your explanation plausible, and I disagree. Sorry, not sorry.In post 2752, Shadow_step wrote:You said it was a slip. I explained how it wasn't. So again, how does me believing his claim make me scum?
Actually if I was his buddy I would know its fake and it would warranty the complete opposite reaction if anything.
In post 2753, Shadow_step wrote:In post 2734, Shadow_step wrote:In post 2731, boring wrote:In post 2729, Shadow_step wrote:I've responded to the first part which you never replied to.
If I'm an ascetic RB, this setup is ridiculously scum sided, so that whole argument is balls.
Next
What are you even talking about? The first part includes responses.
Why do you really think If I'm an ascetic RB, this setup is ridiculously scum sided is relevant to anything I've said? I don't think you're necessarily ascetic or RB. I just think you're scum.
I can't even be ascetic mafia goon, too scumsided.
So let me get this straight. You're case against me is that I CCed Eager a useless role at night(according to threat to mafia) by a role I didn't have ?
So apparently I can get fucked any night if someone bothers to check me.
Yeah okay. Brilliant case. You want a scummy?
Just say "yes this is my case" for my sanity.
Anyone scum reading me should consider this.
It's impossible for me to be mafia ascetic anything because of the minimal amount of power town has and ascetic can counter both.
In post 2746, Zoronos wrote:Hi we're murdering Dierfire or Grendel.
Preferably Grendel.
Shadow_step is aggravating, annoying, and generally useless as shit, but he's not on the plate today. We all know your point on him, save it for tomorrow or later.
Getting into this shit with him is helping nobody. Yes, he's belligerent and unhelpful. The rest of us know those are scum tells. He's still likely town for the movement, so let us collectively move on.
In post 2765, PenguinPower wrote:Suggestions on who everyone thinks I should investigate - should I not die - would be nice. Probably won't listen, but info is always good.
In post 2778, Grendel wrote:General question.
Would who you lynch next according to what Dier had flipped?
Like if he flipped mafia then x would be the next to go,
or if he flipped town then y would be the next to go.
In post 2813, nn30 wrote:2/3 of the people I'm confident in want Grendel, hence my vote.