Mini Normal #1838 Mafia PT

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Post Post #125  (ISO)  » Thu Oct 27, 2016 3:01 pm

In post 122, podoboq wrote:
In post 120, boring wrote:@mod, is there any way we can know the order in which actions are resolved? If Zoronos jailkeeps Gamma, and we kill Zoronos, will Gamma still be blocked from investigation?

In the event that a Jailkeeper targets a Cop, and the Mafia kills the Jailkeeper, the Cop will still receive no result.

This page on the wiki is helpful for determining the standard resolution of night actions.


EDIT: On reflection, Natural Action Resolution isn't relevant in this context. An ability happens irrespective of whether or not the person using it will survive the night. For example, a Cop still receives a result even on the night that they'd die. Think of it like throwing a grenade. The grenade will go off whether or not you shoot the person who threw it.


Thank you!

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Post Post #126  (ISO)  » Thu Oct 27, 2016 3:13 pm

Okay, Prism, I'm a little confused about the first post, but I think you're just running over permutations there.

So Gamma is for sure our NK. That makes sense.

I get that PP is unlikely to believed despite a claim. That is, unless he has a claim and a really good story to go with it. However, in all likelihood, with a Cop, Jailer, and two ascetics, we've had all of our PRs outed.

I think I'd rather neo nn30, but Grendel will do , I guess.

I agree too that we have to kill Zoronos tomorrow night no matter what.


Now here's our next set of issues to solve:
1) We're going to be asked to mass claim tomorrow. What are we claiming?
If one of us claims a minor PR, we'll be accused of lying because we didn't counter-claim the investigative or protective claims earlier (though I may have a tiny cover because I questioned Zoronos on his jailkeeper CC to the doc claim, that may not convince the rest that my ignorance is believable). If we say we're vanilla town, (as I've observed in the past) we may be accused of being scum "playing it safe".

2) Who should do the NK?
I'm thinking it's you again. I can totally see Zoronos jailkeeping me, since I'm likely to be afforded a temporary reprieve by LUV's lynch. I think you're off the radar entirely, so him jailkeeping you would be a [lucky] shot in the dark.

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Post Post #127  (ISO)  » Thu Oct 27, 2016 3:38 pm

Also, assuming we can pull off lynching D3, Zoronos N3, that leaves

Grendel, me, you, Dierfire, implosion, shadow, and nn30 D4.

If we don't start undermining one of them D3, I'll be the lynch D4. I think we need to aim for nn30 or shadow. I think we'll really need to start utilizing this PT better to coordinate our sneakiness, hopefully manipulating them to build the cases on each other.

N4, we'll have to kill implosion.

D5, unless one of us is dead, we'll be at LYLO. We need to leave someone behind to be a good mislynch target. I'm thinking that will have to be Grendel. Though, honestly, it would take a miracle for me to survive LYLO. However, we can at least hope to tarnish someone else along the way enough to get a mislynch D6.

Now, one thing I always try to do, is to pick a target and adjust my play to meet the expectations of one or two key players who will be making pivotal decisions at LYLO-ish times. It apparently looks insanely scummy to spectators, but all that matters is what the target thinks.

I singled out Shadow at the beginning, thinking I could ride him to LYLO, but he's lost all credibility. Implosion and nn30 would be my next prime personalities, only, I rode Shadow too hard, and now they don't like me. I'm thinking we should leave Shadow alone, let him get to LYLO (because he's my ride), and try our darnedest to mislynch nn30 D4.


I know I'm projecting far in the future, but if we're going to spin a web, we have to start as early as possible.

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Post Post #128  (ISO)  » Thu Oct 27, 2016 4:38 pm

You're right and I was just running through the permutations.

I agree that me making the night kill is probably our best best.

Kill: Gamma Emerald

As far as the Neo target goes that was just my first instinct-if you think nn30 is better I'll trust your judgment as I haven't much thought into it.

Shadow is at least going to 5 way and probably to 3 way, maybe Dierfire would make it instead depending on how his read on me grows.

I'm probably just going to claim either VT, depending on how many other PR claims we have it might be a good idea for me to claim One Shot Bulletproof.

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Post Post #129  (ISO)  » Thu Oct 27, 2016 4:40 pm

We need 3 mislynches to win, and I agree that 2 of those mislynches are PenguinPower and Grendel. The third is really up in the air.

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Post Post #130  (ISO)  » Thu Oct 27, 2016 7:58 pm

Neo: nn30

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Post Post #131  (ISO)  » Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:32 am

This is a courtesy message. Right now I have that the Neapolitan target is nn30, that Gamma Emerald is the factional kill target, and that Prism will be committing the kill. If any of this is incorrect, or you would like to change your decisions, let me know by the deadline. If I receive no correction, your actions will be registered at the deadline.

Deadline: (expired on 2016-10-29 08:44:00)
eagerSnake - "Fwiw mod steals pagetops while driving. Still think they wouldn't put in 2 people with ascetic?"

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Post Post #132  (ISO)  » Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:49 am

In post 131, podoboq wrote:This is a courtesy message. Right now I have that the Neapolitan target is nn30, that Gamma Emerald is the factional kill target, and that Prism will be committing the kill. If any of this is incorrect, or you would like to change your decisions, let me know by the deadline. If I receive no correction, your actions will be registered at the deadline.

Deadline: (expired on 2016-10-29 08:44:00)

It's perfect, thank you!

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Post Post #133  (ISO)  » Mon Oct 31, 2016 12:32 pm

boring: Your target, nn30, is a Vanilla Townie

Day 3 has begun.
eagerSnake - "Fwiw mod steals pagetops while driving. Still think they wouldn't put in 2 people with ascetic?"

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Post Post #134  (ISO)  » Mon Oct 31, 2016 2:59 pm

I don't think it's a good idea to let them lynch nn30 today. Not until we're ready for me to be the next days' lynch. Better PP or Grendel.

If we need to work on Shadow earlier than planned, I'll be happy to help. nn30 gets too uppity about how he's read, and so I think if Shadow makes an argument about you, he'll latch onto it.

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Post Post #135  (ISO)  » Mon Oct 31, 2016 7:13 pm

Honestly, the best thing to use against nn30 is the fact that he's generally unwilling to do his own legwork. He instead insists that the "opponent" dig up proof for him to attempt to dismiss. When it comes time, it should be easy to use to our advantage.

I'm just kind of holding my breath for implosion and dierfire's entrances.

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Post Post #136  (ISO)  » Mon Oct 31, 2016 11:51 pm

The ball's in your court today, you're honorary scum leader. I'm running a risk with that vote on you, I had a much larger case but it's obviously not a good idea to go ham on you here. My post is just enough so that no one can claim I wasn't pushing you, and no more beyond that. My goal for the day is to let you parry that and hopefully get a Grendel/nn30 lynch instead as I've left room open for myself to vote outside you.

Implosion's entrance is what makes or breaks the day, if he agrees with me and tries to wagon you (which seems likely based off his scumread prior) we'll be in a bad spot. If he doesn't and goes on anyone else, even me, we'll be golden for quite awhile. I'll throw my weight in a different direction if I need to.

Shadow continues to pay dividends.

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Post Post #137  (ISO)  » Mon Oct 31, 2016 11:54 pm

Oh holy shit they're both at L-2 this is great, come on Implosion.

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Post Post #138  (ISO)  » Mon Oct 31, 2016 11:57 pm

Any other pushing on you I'll do I'll be sure to keep simple and place in the middle of a wall so that no one will actually read it until I go back and quote it. Any pushing on anyone else I'll put somewhere more prominent in the posts, ie. beginning, end, or their own.

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Post Post #139  (ISO)  » Tue Nov 01, 2016 8:13 am

Sounds good to me. Honestly, Dierfire remains the biggest threat to either of us. I wish there were fewer PRs, so we could kill him sooner.

I could go for nn30 or Grendel. Actually, I think I might try to pioneer PP first. It will look townier to go off in my own direction (something you can use to hop off me) and it'll test the waters against him.

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Post Post #140  (ISO)  » Tue Nov 01, 2016 9:58 pm

Implosion's smelled blood, oh lord.

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Post Post #141  (ISO)  » Tue Nov 01, 2016 10:10 pm

I might finish my long-promised ISO on Dierfire early because god knows we can't afford Zoronos giving town another clear. I can handle all of Dier/PP/Grendel but I really, really don't want to go against nn30 at any point. I've gone too far in in my townread on him.

Shadow is going to have to be one of the mislynches if you go down today.

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Post Post #142  (ISO)  » Wed Nov 02, 2016 8:13 am

I'm sorry. If I was firing on all thrusters this game, (that slip wouldn't have happened in the first place), I could probably wiggle out of this without too much trouble. I just don't have the time or energy to really go at it.

Anyway, "bus" me as hard as you need to. I'll fling attitude at you, but I'll avoid any real blows. Before I'm lynched, I'll give you an outline of what I see as the remaining players' exploitable weaknesses. Maybe it'll help.

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Post Post #143  (ISO)  » Wed Nov 02, 2016 8:20 am

Also, I'm going to try to buddy nn30 as much as possible (if he doesn't hop on the semantics train with implosion). If it works, you'll have a fair excuse to turn on him.

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Post Post #144  (ISO)  » Wed Nov 02, 2016 6:47 pm

I'd keep the interactions with the unconfirmed towns pretty minimal-if you want to implicate nn30, any convincing should be aimed primarily at implosion (ie. like a paragraph each). I wouldn't appeal more than a short sentence or two to nn30.

If you really want to help clear me further, the answer is probably to give less attitude rather than more. Having a post, friendly in tone, 1-2 paragraphs long basically being like, "Hey Prism, I don't know for sure but I'm leaning that you're town because of this, and if you are this is a really bad situation that's just going to lead to a mislynch, thing is I'm town too so let's go to couples counseling, I think you're off track, I realize the LUV lynch doesn't make me 100% town, but I really didn't have to do that, I think we should go on _ or _ instead. Sorry for being snappy earlier, I know it's not helping" would be nice. Simultaneously, don't overdo it and overact.

The intuition behind this is that scum need the votes of their partners less. Giving me attitude is interacting with me for the sake of doing it-you're either dismissing me hoping no one will listen or interacting with me for the sake of it. We want to make it seem the former.

Imagine a hypothetical world in which I'm town and you're scum with someone else. You're seeing me tunneling you, and people are coming around and starting to listen. The snappy dismissals aren't working, and you're not confident in your partner's ability to carry the game without you, so you're really trying to live, and that requires not getting in a shitflinging fest with town-me, especially not that people are coming around. Scumreading me and trying to get me lynched is kind of suicidal at this juncture (and, outside of our hypothetical, just makes it look even more like distancing). At the same time, townreading me full-on just kind of seals your fate and removes your options. You've got to work your way out of this one somehow-and this is my suggestion for how this hypothetical scenario would look.

Again, a suggestion as always, you've still done great and we've gotten unfortunate on many levels.

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Post Post #145  (ISO)  » Wed Nov 02, 2016 6:48 pm

In post 144, Prism wrote:Giving me attitude is either trying to dismiss me and hope no one follows, or interacting with me for the sake of doing it-you're either dismissing me hoping no one will listen or interacting with me for the sake of it. We want to make it seem the former.
EBWOP

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Post Post #146  (ISO)  » Wed Nov 02, 2016 7:01 pm

Also, on the bright side, Grendel is paving the way for a mislynch on him followed by a mislynch on Shadow.

On the downside, Zoronos is going to get a jail, and I hope and pray to god he doesn't announce it.

If at any point you're granted the chance to quickhammer, I'd do it depending on who it is. It's definitely a worthwhile trade (ex. think how much better we'd be off if we'd have had LUV quickhammer Gamma vs. hoping he dodged a lynch he wound up not being able to)

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Post Post #147  (ISO)  » Wed Nov 02, 2016 11:34 pm

Sorry, I posted before I read. I'm really going to be pretty absent for a few days. I'll try to come back friday and sunday.

I don't think buddying nn30 is an option anymore. I figured treating you the way I treat implosion was your best cover. I can try to appease you if you'd like.

The shot I fired at Dier was serious by the way, it's not only the best argument against him at the moment, but it's something I used against my own scum buddy in my last game (which you could pull up for meta after I'm dead which "searching" for my last buddy).

I'm going to need a tiny smidgen of concession to make my attitude change on you somewhat believable. Maybe since I implied that I was insulted, you could offer some kind of comment that would let me agree to disagree with you.

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Post Post #148  (ISO)  » Thu Nov 03, 2016 1:40 pm

Will do so.

If you want a claim, I would either claim bulletproof (One shot, but idk if you'd have any incentive to out that as town) or VT.

BP makes sense as town to balance out JK (throws uncertainty as to why kill failed) and there's a chance you'll draw a cc. If you do, I can spin it to be either a preplanned fakeclaim (as there's daychat) or claim it myself on a consecutive day.

If there is a bulletproof in the game it would likely be Grendel.

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Post Post #149  (ISO)  » Thu Nov 03, 2016 4:40 pm

I won't claim. Honestly, I don't know if I'll be lynched. Shadow and Zoronos seem against it, and I'm not sure Grendel will go for it. If someone can be convinced to hop off, I might make it.

I'll give it a try.

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