Mini Normal #1838 - Game Over

[podoboq]

Official Vote Count 3.09

Lynching

With 9 votes in play, it takes 5 to lynch.

boring (4): Prism, implosion, nn30, PenguinPoqer
Grendel (2): Zoronos, Dierfire
nn30 (1): Shadow_step
PenguinPower (1): boring
Shadow_step (1): Grendel

Not Voting (0):

V/LA: Zoronos

Deadline: (expired on 2016-11-14 13:30:00)

[Dierfire]

There's a lot of material that I want to read again. When I'm finished (probably tomorrow), I'll decide whether I want to give hammer intent on boring.

[nn30]

I'm conflicted about my boring read and I'm more confident about you(nn) flipping scum so.

You've yet to tell us why you're so confident.

[nn30]

So, something was bugging me earlier, and I want to go back to it quick.

If your theory is correct, this could be Boring teeing up my mislynch after Grendel flips red.

NN - If you believe this, it predicates on Grendel actually being red.
If you believe Grendel is red, and boring is using a red flip to try and mislynch you, then *Grendel is still red and should get lynched for being red*.

Here, have a 'Zor thinks you're not busing Grendel probably' certificate. You can use it to convince someone that I don't think you're busing and we shouldn't lynch you for it.

(I want to be clear; I'm not saying I think NN's scum. I don't. It's just a common mistake; going second intention when we can go direct)

Hey Zoro - thanks for the card and good point.

For the time being I think it's prudent to have a Grendel v. Boring discussion.

For the purposes of this, I'm removing Boring from L-1.

UNVOTE: boring

@Implosion / Prism - what do you think of the Grendel as scum? He's been pretty hard for me to decide on (obviously). I have an opinion that hinges on his answers to a couple questions of mine from a page or two back (2380) so for the moment I'll keep them to myself.

[boring]

@Boring - you're only poking at one aspect of his case against you (you saying you hard bussed LUV) but ignoring the rest of the case.

Please respond to the rest of the case (your interactions with and LUV's actions towards you).

I didn't see anything regarding my interactions with LUV that I didn't address. Please point them out, if you feel they were skipped.

As far as LUV's lack of vote on me (is that the "LUV's actions towards you" you are talking about?), fucked if I know. Scum have daytalk. Penguin suggested that LUV is incapable of buddying, but really, it doesn't matter. He's capable of following instructions, right? Do you think he thought up the doc gambit all by his lonesome? Doubtful. Scum team had some reason for coaching LUV's actions (and I do believe there was some coaching beyond the gambit, at the very least, instructions to lie low until the early wave against him passed).

[boring]

@Prism, thank you for understanding, somewhat. Please, do me a favor and give me a tl;dr of the items you feel I've left unaddressed. I'll do my best to go over them one-by-one.

We have plenty of time, so there's no need to rush my lynch. (well, I'd understand PP's urgency, but most of the rest of you can afford the time).

[nn30]

@Boring - you're only poking at one aspect of his case against you (you saying you hard bussed LUV) but ignoring the rest of the case.

Please respond to the rest of the case (your interactions with and LUV's actions towards you).

I didn't see anything regarding my interactions with LUV that I didn't address. Please point them out, if you feel they were skipped.

As far as LUV's lack of vote on me (is that the "LUV's actions towards you" you are talking about?), fucked if I know. Scum have daytalk. Penguin suggested that LUV is incapable of buddying, but really, it doesn't matter. He's capable of following instructions, right? Do you think he thought up the doc gambit all by his lonesome? Doubtful. Scum team had some reason for coaching LUV's actions (and I do believe there was some coaching beyond the gambit, at the very least, instructions to lie low until the early wave against him passed).

I mean, I've never been part of a game with day chat. My assumption is that it's used for things like "you push this guy, I'll push another guy, make sure to disagree so we don't look like we're working together." I'm also making the assumption that micro-management isn't happening via day chat (like someone telling LUV to buddy you), but I could be wrong.

If you were on the sidelines right now (rather than the leading wagon) what would you think of LUV going through great efforts to avoid your wagon day one? By great efforts I mean stealing my (probably bad) reasons to scum read shadow.

[nn30]

(I want to be clear; I'm not saying I think NN's scum. I don't. It's just a common mistake; going second intention when we can go direct)

I literally just won a scum game off of this mistake. I can talk about it now that the game is over. Just wanted to add that in there.

[Grendel]

I see several people I want to respond too. But I don't have time to night to answer them all, so I'm just gonna answer a couple.

@Grendel - You make some interesting points about Shadow, which I'll get to in a minute.

1) What reason did you originally have for scum reading me?

2) What are your feelings on the Boring case?

1) I already explained this. I viewed your sk tangent as a legitimate scum slip. Also went into today thinking that there must have been scum off the Eager wagon, so PoE. Your reaction to my vote on you at the start of today was pretty bad too.

At one point I thought you might be scum for jumping on several of my scum reads through yesterday. Mainly thinking of Gamma/Pengiun then. But you did have me as a top town read throughout much of the game so that would be a decent reason why.

2) I think that boring is town, but a lot of it is based off of gut, and notes I took yesterday. I don't think I can lynch her.

That reminds me, I've yet to revaluate most the roster. I usually do that during the night cycle, not sure why I've been so lazy about it this game.

It's nice how Grendel wants to lynch me out of setup spec when he himself condemns me for it.
If I was maf RB I wouldn't kill GE I could just keep blocking him and kitll Zoro.
Killing GE gives town a confirmed town aka Implosion. Why am I making it harder for myself

Maybe because I find the set up speculation your putting forward is really scummy?

I find it incredibly unlikely that you can be town, and scum has a strongman. That combination would give scum three unblockable kills. I thinks its more likely that you are scum, and the scum have a strong man then you being town right now.

The reason you're arguing this instead of something that makes more sense is because your modifier incriminates you by making you, as a role blocker, have priory over the jailkeeper.

A cop is a bigger threat to scum then a jail keeper. Especially if the jail keeper in question has scum, you, as a top town read. Like Zoronos would never think to lynch you in a hundred years.

[PenguinPower]

He's capable of following instructions, right? Do you think he thought up the doc gambit all by his lonesome?

In my experience with him. No, and No. He would need message-crafting level coaching to buddy someone; not just guidance to buddy.

You're starting to get a little flippant in your posting, which I appreciate - if you were town. Grendel's latest post reinforces my read on you, btw.

[nn30]

2) I think that boring is town, but a lot of it is based off of gut, and notes I took yesterday. I don't think I can lynch her.

What do you think of the case on her though? Obviously you believe it to be incorrect - why though?

[Shadow_step]

It's funny, nn calls Penguin scum but is absolutely okay with being on the same wagon as him.

[Zoronos]

on

Let's be frank, any scum lynch will have scum on the train bussing.
The line *I* draw is "is my scum read the person leading the train". I know that's why I refused to hop on the LUV train yesterday.

Do you think Penguin is leading this train? (Let's be fair, I haven't been paying much attention the past 2 days, so I just don't know at this point.)

[Shadow_step]

on

Let's be frank, any scum lynch will have scum on the train bussing.
The line *I* draw is "is my scum read the person leading the train". I know that's why I refused to hop on the LUV train yesterday.

Do you think Penguin is leading this train? (Let's be fair, I haven't been paying much attention the past 2 days, so I just don't know at this point.)

He isn't leading it, but I don't expect scum to buss today. With one scum down and 3-4 conf townies. Unless the lynch of the buddy is inevitable I don't expect scum to buss.

At this point it might be as easy as a grendel/boring scum team. Grendel is trying to lynch me because he doesn't want to buss boring.

[Zoronos]

That's a fair point.
But my gosh I go on vacation and nobody posts.

Also I feel maybe you're a bit overconfident here shadow. Also I'm maybe missing where all the other conf towns are coming from.

[Zoronos]

1) Will you point to the LUV v. Penguin interactions that you are referring to? I have PP as my top scum read right now and, if I'm wrong, I'd like to know why.

nn, what caused you to change this read?

[nn30]

It's funny, nn calls Penguin scum but is absolutely okay with being on the same wagon as him.

You're doing a wonderful job of dodging questions.

[nn30]

1) Will you point to the LUV v. Penguin interactions that you are referring to? I have PP as my top scum read right now and, if I'm wrong, I'd like to know why.

nn, what caused you to change this read?

It hasn't.

Nobody pointed out why I'm wrong.

I'm bouncing between Penguin/Grendel/Boring primarily as scum reads and another much weaker one on Shadow (which exists primarily because of how brazen he's behaved this game - not necessarily scum but definitelt unhelpful town at a minimum.)

The read hasn't changed. The discussion has merely moved onto other people.

[Shadow_step]

You've done a wonderful job at pretending there isn't a case on you.

[nn30]

You've done a wonderful job at pretending there isn't a case on you.

Sigh...

Like nn30 is ob town after that. Unless he is a very good scum player. I'll have to check his games to make sure.

Soooooo... How does someone go from ob town to not?

@penguin - please provide a case against me.

@Penguin - why was your vote on me to start the day. It predated your catching my misuse of a word.

Coincidence.

I've been raising hell all game.

Please, go through and find scummy reasons for me to be tunneling Gamma, Boring, Shadow, you, and briefly Implosion.

@Boring - thanks for the insight. Gun to your head - is Grendel scum?

He's not the towniest player in the game, but he's not in my bottom two. So probably not as things stand. (you don't have enough gym badges to stop me from turning a yes/no question into a full sentence)

@Grendel - what's your current feel on me? I know your vote is still on me. Have your opinions changed at all based on the last few pages?

What caused the change of opinion Penguin?

nn30 is today's lynch.

I'm gonna need you to state your case on this.

Well reasoned, cited, etc.

I've already asked for this once also.

I'm conflicted about my boring read and I'm more confident about you(nn) flipping scum so.

You've yet to tell us why you're so confident.

You're moving pretty deep into "I'm willfully ignoring reality" territory now.

I'll ask again.

State your case on me.

[nn30]

It's funny, nn calls Penguin scum but is absolutely okay with being on the same wagon as him.

My vote on Boring predates Penguin saying anything on the topic. My vote was there due to the case Prism and Implosion presented.

Are your conf. bias goggles really so obscuring that you're intentionally misreading the game in order to paint me as scum?

[Zoronos]

Hmmmmm...
Prism / Implosion, what is your take on Penguin?

[Zoronos]

Nevermind, that's a stupid question. Implied is hard town reading him.
Prism, if you want to chime in feel free.

I'm still on the lynch-grendel plane at the moment.

[Zoronos]

My god my phone's autocorrect is aweful.
Implosion not implied.
Plan not plane.

[nn30]

I mess the t9 days. I could type faster with 9 buttons that I knew exactly how to manipulate than I ever could with autocorrect that doesn't know what it's doing.