Mini Normal #1838 - Game Over

nn30
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Post Post #2500  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 2:13 pm

Order for mass claim?

Sure. First at the top.

Boring/Grendel (can't decide who is the most scummy here)
PP
Diefire
Myself (since I'm still a point of contention for Shadow)
Zoronos
Implosion / Prism

PenguinPower
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Post Post #2501  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 2:41 pm

Zoronos already claimed.

nn30
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Post Post #2502  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 2:53 pm

You're right. Mb.

podoboq
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Post Post #2503  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 3:21 pm

Official Vote Count 3.11
LynchingWith 9 votes in play, it takes 5 to lynch.

boring (3): Prism, implosion, PenguinPoqer
Grendel (2): Zoronos, Dierfire
nn30 (1): Shadow_step
PenguinPower (1): boring
Shadow_step (1): Grendel

Not Voting (1): nn30

V/LA: Zoronos


Deadline: (expired on 2016-11-14 13:30:00)
Currently looking for reviewers, a backup mod, and a flavor writer for a Magic: the Gathering flavored Large Theme. PM if interested.

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Post Post #2504  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 4:57 pm

In post 2500, nn30 wrote:Order for mass claim?

Sure. First at the top.

Boring/Grendel (can't decide who is the most scummy here)
PP
Diefire
Myself (since I'm still a point of contention for Shadow)
Zoronos
Implosion / Prism


What the heck??
How can you keep a cop cleared townie and someone else in the same bracket?
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nn30
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Post Post #2505  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:00 pm

In post 2504, Shadow_step wrote:
In post 2500, nn30 wrote:Order for mass claim?

Sure. First at the top.

Boring/Grendel (can't decide who is the most scummy here)
PP
Diefire
Myself (since I'm still a point of contention for Shadow)
Zoronos
Prism
Implosion


What the heck??
How can you keep a cop cleared townie and someone else in the same bracket?


Is there a reason you're nitpicking this much?

There. I fixed it. Feel better now?

Shadow_step
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Post Post #2506  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:09 pm

Blatalant attempt to buddy up to Prism, but you'll get away with this too cause you are so "towny"
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nn30
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Post Post #2507  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:14 pm

Your conf bias goggles really need to come off.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor

Yes I'm calling myself stupid for having them on the same level.

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Post Post #2508  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:15 pm

I don't know if we're mass claiming today, I'll ponder it.
But if we're doing it it is absolutely not on a list shadowstep makes final choice on.

nn30
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Post Post #2509  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:17 pm

In post 2508, Zoronos wrote:I don't know if we're mass claiming today, I'll ponder it.
But if we're doing it it is absolutely not on a list shadowstep makes final choice on.


Implosion should have final choice, if anything.

nn30
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Post Post #2510  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:18 pm

Someone educate me here - what is the utility of mass claiming? Is it a power play for town, or is it a desperation move? Or is it somewhere in the middle?

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Post Post #2511  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:21 pm

You call me scum and then call me conf biadsed, implying I'm town. What is it, I can't be both.
If its conf bias you certainly aren't making it easy for yourself by posting things like that.
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Post Post #2512  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:23 pm

In post 2508, Zoronos wrote:I don't know if we're mass claiming today, I'll ponder it.
But if we're doing it it is absolutely not on a list shadowstep makes final choice on.


We are mass claiming today and everyone will have equal say.
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Shadow_step
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Post Post #2513  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:26 pm

In post 2510, nn30 wrote:Someone educate me here - what is the utility of mass claiming? Is it a power play for town, or is it a desperation move? Or is it somewhere in the middle?


Did you miss this post or something ?

Spoiler:
In post 2495, implosion wrote:
In post 2479, PenguinPower wrote:
In post 2476, implosion wrote:if we don't massclaim zoronos dies tonight, it seems foolish to waste a possibly more-informed use of the jailkeeper tonight, etc. Theoretic worst case scenario is scum have a blocker and block whatever other active power we have I guess? but if scum have a blocker we're going to have another significant PR and we'll want to know about that. And also most importantly we're at the point where these claims will REALLY help PoE.


2nd time you've brought this up. I get the Zoronos bit; but, in a closed setup how is this going to benefit PoE? This is my first time playing one, so if you could explain that bit more.

Basically, there's a benchmark for how much town power will be in a mini normal and if we all claim we can speculate about how much power is left unaccounted for. There may be town power roles who have useful information which can be used to speculate further, or there may be confirmable roles or roles that can let us eliminate people as scum as well. Or people might claim contradictory roles or information. Mostly though it can just be used to speculate on which roles are likely in the setup together; I've caught scum just from massclaim analysis.

If someone contentious like boring or nn happens to be a major power role claimant and we have good reason to believe them as town from that claim, it massively simplifies the gamestate; if someone currently less contentious like me or prism does, then we at least won't really lose much because we have a high-priority kill target already claimed in Zoronos (and I for one believe him).

Additionally, these claims can inform who Zoronos targets tonight, especially if we lynch scum today. I know we went through this song and dance in our last game with shannon but if we lynch scum today, Zoronos should have stated his target beforehand so that if he dies, we get a pseudo-clear. We don't want Zoronos accidentally blocking a town power role like a tracker who could get an extremely useful result in that situation.
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Grendel
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Post Post #2514  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:38 pm

If we're mass claiming it'd be better to do it sooner rather then later.

The longer we wait the more time scum has to ponder plausible roles to fake claim.

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Post Post #2515  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:50 pm

I'm fine with whatever list is finalized by Implosion.

Just don't dilly dally about it.

@Implosion, after this can you explain what you found to be town about Shadow's play yesterday, and today?

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Post Post #2516  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 6:02 pm

Just post your list ^^
Nobody gets to finalise anything, it will be based in average.
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Zoronos
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Post Post #2517  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 6:59 pm

This discussion is distracting from actually finding scum. It should stop, and likely do so now.
My scummiess meter on Shadow_step has increased markedly. The things that Implosion pointed out in are not only super aggravating, but also many of them are scum sided (specifically calling yourself conf town while not actually confirmed anything).
The summary of them all is "You are playing both anti-cooperatively, and are actively breaking down cooperation amongst other players." That's an actively pro-scum strategy.

I think at the very least you need to eat some humble pie. In the mean time, I think the rest of us should have a larger discussion on whether or not the wide town read based on D1 play is misguided / overridden by his behavior since then.

However, my best scum read remains Grendel, so I think people should either vote that way, make a case for Grendel being town, or make a more convincing argument for Beatrix being scum (because the bus vote stuff on LUV I don't find convincing, given that there were a number of opportunities for her to vote opportunistically on town targets and instead maintained her vote on a scum. So if she was busing, she was super dedicated to the bus and is probably bad for busing on D2 when she could have lynched town and then bus'ed on D3).

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Post Post #2518  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 7:21 pm

In post 2505, nn30 wrote:
In post 2504, Shadow_step wrote:
In post 2500, nn30 wrote:Order for mass claim?

Sure. First at the top.

Boring/Grendel (can't decide who is the most scummy here)
PP
Diefire
Myself (since I'm still a point of contention for Shadow)
Zoronos
Prism
Implosion


What the heck??
How can you keep a cop cleared townie and someone else in the same bracket?


Is there a reason you're nitpicking this much?

There. I fixed it. Feel better now?

Ftr i did also find this questionable.

I'll make my next priorities discussing shadow and re-analyzing grendel; zoronos, could you point me to a summary of what you've said or a list of the most important posts on him or something?

nn30
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Post Post #2519  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 7:48 pm

Do we have any way of knowing how many scum are left?

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Post Post #2520  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 7:55 pm

very probably 2 given two nights with one kill each. But no.

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Post Post #2521  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 10:10 pm

Dierfire has been prodded.
Currently looking for reviewers, a backup mod, and a flavor writer for a Magic: the Gathering flavored Large Theme. PM if interested.

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Post Post #2522  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 10:20 pm

Right, lets do it:
Penguin
Deirfire
Nn30
Prism
Boring
Grendel
Implosion
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
@Zoronos, I would love to hear a more developed case against me frankly.

-Optimal bussing position, not moved by LUV’s original claim
-My reaction to your vote, and the scum tells you associated with it.
-Using bad play to hide scummy intent

Is there anything else here you want to add?

@ALL

Call me egotistical, but I’d like a novel written about my escapades if I’m gonna be mislynched. Can people who are scum reading me detail why they are scum reading me currently?

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Post Post #2523  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 10:25 pm

In post 2081, Shadow_step wrote:Intent to hammer LUV


In post 2092, Shadow_step wrote:Brilliant, all the lynch baits got all the good PRs :/

VOTE: Nn

In post 2102, Shadow_step wrote:He will hammer cause he is scum.
Probably going bonkers in his at.


These three posts happened in relatively quick succession. The second post feels strange to me in particular (it's not because he voted me - it's because he's so quick to believe the claim of the person he just declared intent to hammer on).

Zoro counter-claimed between the 2nd and 3rd quote - which would explain that flip. But the flop between the 1st and 2nd is still throwing me off.

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Post Post #2524  (ISO)  » Sat Nov 05, 2016 10:36 pm

NN30... Why am I duking it out with boring for your most scummiest read, meanwhile you seem the most skeptical of Shadow's slot when I started pushing shadow more then anybody else has since D1?

Before my push you thought he was town yea?

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