Pick Your Power: Double Deck (GAME OVER)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i guess you can all say that it was.........

fate

.......... that brought me here

VOTE: Transcend

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I really don't see any merit in massclaiming. Maybe at least claiming active negative utilities?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

If someone

were

hated and hated abilities were active, they'd probably claim as soon as they entered the game :/. Plus I don't think any wagons are getting close to lynch range at this point of the game.

I really don't get your point Creature.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Help me.lynch dreal then

sounds good

VOTE: Drealwhateverthefuck

drealmerz have you played with creature before?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I don't think creature and I have never played a completed game together before

He's basically always like this... and I actually think he's towntelling pretty hard.

As town he speaks whatever is on his mind and tries to brute force the setup or game. That's what his massclaim idea and paranoia about hated feels like - Spyrex basically articulated it, he's just looking at the list of cards and trying to figure out what scum may have picked.

Titus, I'm not really seeing drealmerz town, can you explain it a bit?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Read Drealmerz as if he's me with less experience.

If Creature's trying to brute force the game, why is he opposed to a selective massclaim?

I'm not really sure how to read you specifically though, I just read you like I would read people in general. All I really see is him jumping on a LHF wagon and just awkward early-game posts which I don't townread.

Creature doesn't seem actively opposed to a selective massclaim, it's just that town has showed that we're not going to massclaim and now that there a wagon against him so I don't think he's going to try to.

Also Maria is not the kind of person who breaks under pressure lol.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

you can understand my aversion to his approach though, yes? I generally don't like to vote very early in a game, people giving such confidence in their reads so fast and feeling comfortable enough to make a vote takes more time for me, usually - here I got immediate scumpings and at the least, voted to express how seriously I take the issue of ability/role spec

Not really? If you mean approach to the game in general, the thinking-aloud thing and trying to brute force through the game is something I do too. If you mean the massclaim idea, then yes I agree that that's a bad idea but Creature never really pushed for it, he just thought about it in the open.

I mean getting reads takes time for me too, but I find voting in places that I feel would lead to interesting reads/places I'm not really sure about helps me get out of that position fast enough.

Also, I actually like this post.

VOTE: Kison

[gigabyteTroubadour]

why are we wagoning him?

two people is hardly a wagon

[gigabyteTroubadour]

omg funnstral is in this game i didn't even know

the table just got 10 times better

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Not really? If you mean approach to the game in general, the thinking-aloud thing and trying to brute force through the game is something I do too. If you mean the massclaim idea, then yes I agree that that's a bad idea but Creature never really pushed for it, he just thought about it in the open.

1.) I too like thinking aloud (it gets me in trouble all of the time) and talking about all contingencies (I love setup talk) - but only so far - no roles or abilities, at all - balance, mechanics, excellent

2.) he didn't push for it, that's not what I find scummy (obviously because it's not there) - my aversion and SR comes from even suggesting the idea BECAUSE it could be a kind of a passive way to see if scum can get ANY information - someone who doesn't know better, someone who is excited that their queen is in play, even just 1 tiny thing, it could give the slightest bit of information up to scum, seemingly innocently enough, but it is something. "oh I wasn't ability-fishing I was just asking what ppl thought about mass-claiming, I didn't mean to cause 3 ppl to tell me 9 cards"

it's not like I'm reading it HARD that way, not even close, but it is on my radar as definitely possible - and not meaning to keep on about it either, I'm ready to move on, was just clarifying for you

I really don't think people are gullible enough to derpclaim their picks just because someone suggested a massclaim though...

but yeah i'm getting you now

Wouldn't surprise me if Titus went for ninja as town

actually if scum take a tracker to find PRs it has pro-town utility. dunno if anyone thought of this though

also if there were a way to find out exactly how many cards are missing, is it better to say so after people claimed missing cards or before?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

@giga, That's why I said everyone should claim how many missing cards they have, but not yet claim what they are. A structured massclaim is best but New Amsterdam and I have yet to work out details.

Eventually, we will get more info and fake claims become impossible.

got it

i'm actually liking the missing cards massclaim now that i took some more time out to look into the set-up (i only skimmed the rules since i was asked to replace in at an inconvenient time irl) so we should probably hammer that out soon

[gigabyteTroubadour]

@titus, it's something everyone can figure out and i might be wrong so i don't think there's a need to crumb it

also i thought the implication was that we'd only be claiming the amount of missing cards :/

and also, uzi, do you really think scum are going to claim to have their picks randomized? like yeah he could be lying but then i don't think he'd pick something decent like a jailkeeper, he'd probably pick negative utility that town won't pick.

(i'm missing zero cards btw)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

@Giga: I just don't buy why he didn't try. I guess it's more anti-alignment if anything but it still pings me.

Scum are at a disadvantage when it comes to role-madness (at least I think), so I'd agree that it's just anti-alignment but far more likely town imo.

Like I don't get how Uzi would panic about useless details and completely ignore the bigger picture with regards to vifam

this too but idk if panicking is the right word

[gigabyteTroubadour]

if he were scum, wouldn't his buddies just pick for him :/ ?

at least that's what i think. he just seems like a pointless slot to sort after he claimed to not bid because it's just such a town thing to do

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I think the +3 comes from the fact that there are multiple ways to die in this game. Fruit vendors can basically become psuedo vigs if people with allergies claim

kraska, why is kison a better vote than uzi?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

DECK x 42 - DISCARD PILE x 0

@Titus

and i think the trump card makes 1 more, so 43

if people with allergies claim

can you hold my hand and tell me WTF anyone would claim to have an allergy?

idk so a fruit vendor doesn't accidentally kill them?

Coz the maria vote feels odd. I can't quite put my finger in it but it does

Pedit: @giga

yeah i agree (calling maria easily pressured was ???) but you seem to also think that uzi is scummy

idk i just feel like you should be voting uzi for some reason

[gigabyteTroubadour]

idk man i just learned that pgos aren't supposed to claim

also i don't think ascetics should claim in this set-up because all ascetics are doctors iirc

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I'm not gonna go gung ho on uzi when he seems to be a space cadet as either allignment...atleast not until I'm really positive her being scummy weird

fair enough then

What does "deckx42" mean? Idgi.......

deck has 42 cards in it at the moment

[gigabyteTroubadour]

So.... does this mean all the trump card pool is cards that ppl have in the game rn?

no it means the inverse

and also i can confirm titus's math since i did it when i asked if i should reveal that there are 8 missing cards :/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

23 players in the game (18 town + 5 mafia)

52 cards in a deck, times two is 104

everyone picks 3 cards, 23 * 3 is 69 so 69 cards max

43 cards are left, and we know we started with 104, so that means 61 were taken (104 - 43 = 61)

69 - 61 = 8 cards that were picked by someone in the bet but they didn't get (could be one person per card, but someone may have missed 2 cards and only have 1)

does that help?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

How the fuck do you guys talk so much. I'm gonna read now. hold on. Also I need to go out in about an hour so after that i cant participate until the am.

is this your entrance every game

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Is there a reason people are claiming how many cards they missed out on? I can't immediately see the point (though I also can't see any problem with it).

The main utility of it is to make sure scum can't fakeclaim as easily if we require everyone to say how many cards they have. If scum picked something suspicious, they can't omit it from their claim and are instead forced to pick a card they didn't pick, and that can eventually flip (confirming that they didn't pick it) or be counterclaimed.

PEdit: Also what Titus said

still deciding how i feel about uzi in all honesty but he's not a bad vote

[gigabyteTroubadour]

UNVOTE:
I don't know.

why did you back off from voting kison??

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I think kraska already claimed she got all 3 cards.

I'll double check though

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I got all the cards I wanted

^Titus

[gigabyteTroubadour]

eh I guess that is backing off nvm

can you answer the question though

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Reads look more like "who can i get lynched the easiest?" as opposed to "who do i think is scum?".

Can you explain this a bit more? I don't really see MoI as an easy lynch.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

he's MoI though

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Moi doesn't get lynched v often

yeah that's my point

so why is max going for easy lynches if his scumreads are you and MoI?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

UNVOTE:

What made you change your mind about Vifam?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Bc moi has no content and i ain't scummy

that doesn't really make a lynch easy though

transcend your reads aren't making sense

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Do they ever

yeah??

which is why i have no idea what to make of you thinking in an almost different dimension than i am

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i'll sleep on this i guess

[gigabyteTroubadour]

what are u even sleeping on?

my read on transcend (sleep didn't help)

They make sense to me and that's all that matters.

I'm not here to appease 17 other people with my ever so grandiloquent reads

yeah but how am i going to sort you if i can't understand your shit lmfao

like idk i think your reads not making sense is a scumtell for you (Open 646 you were pushing on Luna for basically moonlogic, and in sonia's normal you were pushing on obvtown slots and your partner) but you're not really pinging me?

I need vifam to shitpost more so i can be sure he's town.

i can assure you he is :^)

he's one of my weaker townreads tbh, but mechanically he's like almost definitely town

No, Trans can change his!

VOTE: Vedith

Flashwagon time

All aboard the Vedith train

VOTE: Vedith

sounds good

I didn't see a reason not to bid but I guess looking back now he may have been confused about the set-up as he thought this game was based on Yu-Gi-Oh! so he might have just said screw it.

the rest of your post makes sense but this doesn't :/

like i'm pretty sure vifam didn't actually think this game is based on yu gi oh and the fact you brought that up just seems really weird but i'll laugh if i'm actually wrong about that

@Drealmerz, who specifically from the LUV defenders pings you the hardest?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

would you like that?

yes actually

[gigabyteTroubadour]

The quotes are things I'd like to keep in memory, by the way.

what about those quotes did you find significant enough to keep in memory?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I am not missing any cards.

kison's not missing any

[gigabyteTroubadour]

There's 5 or 6 wagons

actually this reminds me, there are a lot of 2-vote wagons that are kind of just sitting there and i'd like to change that. i'm just not really sure where to start

i guess anyone else who doesn't like the uzi vote should try to find some consensus. i'm still trying to poke around and find something that works for me because uzi is an uninteresting vote to me right now

i'd probably be voting for maxous if not vedith but transcend's read on him is bugging me and i feel like i should be sorting transcend first

wait rb, aren't you townreading transcend? what seems town about him to you?

"Lurker lynches are bad" aka Scum Hideout

also this

Hate to do this, and its rather uncharacteristic of me, but ill not be participating for another 24hours or so. Got my gf visiting this weekend so havent had time yet to read up.

Worry not, my participation is coming and then Ill convince everyone to lynch transcend

Do you have all 3 of your cards? If you have missing cards don't tell us what it is

[gigabyteTroubadour]

If you have missing cards don't tell us what it is

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I like both major wagons ftr. We should try to consolidate.

Do you mean you like the wagonees for scum or their composition for town?

also i moved my vote from kison to vedith so there's only one major wagon now but that's semantics

@RB, can you go into your Transcend read because he's kind of a priority sort for me and I'm honestly stumped on him??

[gigabyteTroubadour]

figured, but it was worth a shot anyway :/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

dave how can you setup spec people into roles without claims? like i've done what you're saying you're doing in PYP X/Y before but it can't work the same way here because the roles are far more complicated, can it...?

like i know you can read people sometimes and say "oh this person is probably a doctor" because i do that but is it really applicable in this setup?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I'm more interested in the how than the yes/no part.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Pedit: No, there's a thing with the numbers which sorts sets of people into (1 scum in this set). I've never seen more than one. It's only a rough way to pigeonhole because sometimes there are zero.

but this set-up is totally different because there's two of each card, so it's actually plausible that scum deliberately picked identical draft numbers... like i'm pretty low in the draft and i'm surprised to have gotten the cards i did.

every time a PYP set-up runs this discussion is brought up and I've never seen it actually be helpful (when i did it i ended up being needlessly paranoid of a townread of mine because i read into them wrong), and now that there's less of a mechanical disadvantage to intentionally botching the draft it's just more confusing. like what if the scumteam has people in it who are willing to fuck with that (like i could totally see dunnstral doing that)? Without like a single flip it's just guesswork that COULD be useful, but it's just easier to scumhunt...

like i'd like to know who you suspect based on this speculation though because if that person is actually scummy then by all means i'll shut up about this, but??

i find it rly weird that youd hate on my style when youve seen me firsthand violate entire scumteams in 2 separate games now. Im more thinky than the thinkiest thinker

wait really that just makes this interaction weirder

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Oh I missed dreal's missing card claim
Okay so.........
Wanna know how rb can possibly have him as scum after claiming to bid on a card like that?

kraska how are you townreading Maria, Vedith, and Max? Those are the only reads of yours that aren't computing with me

also idg why people suddenly flew shit at kraska for having townreads, i basically have the same ones as her :/

i'd probably join you on transcend but his wagon's kind of sketchy besides like you and maybe vecna from what i remember tbh

[gigabyteTroubadour]

my dilemma is that the uzi wagon is mostly townreads, but I don't think Uzi is that scummy

while transcend is suspicious but his wagon is too :/

creature how do you feel about McMenno

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh hey

VOTE: McMenno

kraska transcend isn't happening bc i said so

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh hey

VOTE: McMenno

kraska transcend isn't happening bc i said so

Go vote somewhere else, Giga.
Not with me!

vedith maybe we can be friends just this once

[gigabyteTroubadour]

[gigabyteTroubadour]

tbh I wouldn't mind nuking the LUV wagon composition.

kison's the only scummy person on that wagon though :/

unless you mean moving the first four people to a better wagon, then I'm all for that

[gigabyteTroubadour]

What's Vedith doing that's town?

No clue, but I'd rather vote with Vedith than McMenno, Maria, and Maxous and who else besides kraska who voted for Transcend ://

[gigabyteTroubadour]

why is kison town :///

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Spoiler:

VOTE: Vedith

@rb, Vedith > Maria wagon all the way because at least I can read Maria later in the game when she actually attempts to do shit.

kraska drealmerz and creature should sheep.

don't really care for the other wagons options either (jackel is ok i guess but i'm not feeling it)

mcmenno is still scum ftr

@Titus, don't you think you're giving McMenno a townread a bit too easily? Yeah, him not claiming to have a repeat card when the massclaim is screwed up is pro-town but it's not like lying in a semi-open set-up that's solvable is a smart move for scum anyway when town puts this much diligence into stopping fakeclaims. plus if he had lied he could have been counterclaimed which needlessly puts scum into a 1v1. dunno i want your perspective on this a bit more

i can't explain my read on him quite yet so i'm OK voting elsewhere but i just... want this to be known for the future

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Wow that picture

i take the time to make quality, game advancing shitposts.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hey rb, creature, vifam, kraska, titus, fishy, dave, and drealmerz

and i guess anyone else that's town

we need to powertown the fuck out of scum, and since giving reads is now a thing everyone's doing this is what i'm at (townreads are ordered, everything else isn't):

Spoiler: Giggles's Reads <3

Strong town

• rb, creature, vifam

Town

• kraska, titus, fishythefish, davesaz, drealmerz

Townlean

• Moi-slot, Vecna

Probably town but I can't really read these people

• Dunnstral, LUV, Spyrex

willing to wagon due to scumreading/nullreading:

• Jackel
  MariaR
  Vedith
  Transcend
  gerryoat
  Kison
  Maxous
  Drone
  McMenno

at the moment i think Vedith is the best vote, so if you townread him and are one of the names in large print i'd like to know why and who your alternative is. i would rather focus on a lynch that hits a scummy player with set-up information that supports their scumminess rather than vice versa so keep that in mind.

i'm not too thrilled about the card rig and it's p r o b a b l y from scum (doc disabler, ninja, shit-ton of fruit allergies (and a fruit vendor with jacks!!), and beloved aren't worth opening up a neighborhood until we know who's in that neighborhood so), so i'd be down with autolynching anyone with a 4 of clubs too btw

if two people have the four of clubs, should the one who wasn't able to get their rig through claim? it's not really a hard guilty but it would help POE whoever rigged the deck (although going by just that could suck because derptown could have rigged the deck wrong, not that lynching someone who can't use their role right is a terrible idea)

also i don't even know where in this game i left off so

fishy basically said everything else i wanted to about the setup, although i disagree that spades isn't that bad during the night (it's worse!)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Why is Vedith scummy - and what is that set-up information that supports that? Sorry if I'm being blind.

no need to be sorry

at this point my definition of a scumread is "not a townread" so really in a smaller game vedith would probably be a nullread here but

i don't really like vedith's play this game because of his obvious lack of scumhunting (or townhunting or just gamesolving, but that's basically tablewide) and more importantly his dynamic with Rb feels off from his side.

obviously a lot of people can be pegged into the category of "not scumhunting", but Vedith is on the more active side and yet he's useless. most of his ISO is just throwing shit at Rb (who's trying to get town to get its act together and is really obviously town) and shitposting. like yeah maria is shitposting too but it feels somewhat more... genuine? i guess is the right way to put it. vedith just reads emptily, and curbing town efforts to work together before it really starts is ultimately pro-scum. plus his vote on mcmenno feels like a bus tbh

he's also a candidate for picking the governor card and scum probably got to one if it was picked so quickly into the draft

with uzi, he just reads to me as incredibly awkward but from what i've seen from him on this site it's definitely a personality thing and the description of him being the D1 mislynch in a large game is really apt (i can't exactly talk about it just yet but i really really agree here). meta-ing him would probably be wise

I'd be very OK with a Vedith lynch. I don't townread him, and his wagon looks on the townie side. I'm currently happier with the Uzi wagon - I see nothing townie about him, and several fairly small but decent points that make him scummy.

Why is Vedith scummy - and what is that set-up information that supports that? Sorry if I'm being blind.

"I'll vote Vedith, tell me why"

hi vedith~ <3

god the giggle emoticon (or the vedith emoticon as i've caught myself calling it in my head once) is really fucking creepy when you look at it up close

vedith is scum for using , add that to the case

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh god did Giga flip scum

i mean

you already knew that

....

buddy

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Vedith is a high draft pick and is acting unreasonably cocky about not getting lynched.

put 2+2 together pls

lmao i'd totally be acting like that as scum too

in role-madness that's nai

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I think I'd like the governors to claim. Hidden governors are a terrible idea - at least if they are in the open we can lynch the hell out them if they use the ability. Stealth vigging of them is FBM. The hidden bulletproof stopping a kill is waaaay less important than a possible missed lynch.

Anyone see a reason not to demand these claims on pain of lynch?

tbh i'd be for this

can govs ot the lynch off only themselves or anyone

they force a no-lynch instead of a lynch on anyone iirc. (the anyone part for sure, i only think it ends the day)

Max, how does Town benefit from having the governors not claim?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

It does end the day (source: the rules)

yes i know i just forgot because i only have one window open and don't like using tabs

sometimes i wonder if the rest of the table has read the rules though.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

fishy read 1371

i missed it bc i dont read a lot of what goes on day one but it's a fair point, we could just be giving scum royalty vig/stealth vig targets. and based on my last pyp experience vigs are basically the most important thing for scum to take

sorry vecna :/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i still don't think titus's # of cards massclaim was a bad idea because it doesn't give scum that information, it's still ultimately pro-town

but we're veering that rabbit hole where it does become pro-scum

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Btw, cop is daycop, so better start doing something.

it's not a daycop, queen of clubs is still in trumps

they can cop tonight

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i posted a readlist in 1806

uzi wagon is still thriving but fishy and titus are like the only people i care about on that wagon and i think it's a mislynch, most of the townier people jumped off of vedith for some reason and are on vanities/smaller wagons but it's still a good vote, people on jackel atm are scummy

^basically my take

[gigabyteTroubadour]

probably the two of us can vote transcend or maria and make it a viable wagon too if you want

although you townread transcend? kraska posted a case that i think made me feel better about the vote

[gigabyteTroubadour]

tbh the real question is why is he town

shit interactions with rb are basically the thing that's making feel like it'll hit scum, empty ISO isn't helping much either

i'm also like 60% sure he was trying to hardbus mcmenno but that's my pet scumread that's probably town all along

[gigabyteTroubadour]

1333 is the kraska case, above was about vedith

[gigabyteTroubadour]

like i know exactly what kraska is talking about because i've played with scum transcend before and she's probably right but i'm also not feeling it?? i'm really conflicted and i definitely think he should be copped

[gigabyteTroubadour]

McMenno is town I'm fairly sure.

I'm open to transcend being scum

i'd vote transcend right now and ask you to sheep but like i want vifam's approval because i want a glorious all-town wagon on someone who's scummy that actually sticks :/

By under control I mean no one has rage quit yet I think

magna did lol

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Titus lynch, this way. Lets go.

if we lynch transcend i'm for copping titus tbh (transcend will basically be my cop recommendation until he's dead or conftown)

but i still think she's town

who else would you be willing to vote for

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I'll try and be more active bro I just haven't read most of the game

I'll read the case on Transcend and get back to you guys

sounds good

Ugh this is so freakishly annoying.

My Titus case/wagon is not getting any traction because a lot of people just arent really bothered thinking about the setup whatsoever. It should be very apparent to people that have given the setup some thought and that understand the mechanics that what Titus is doing is extremely scummy.

i still really do not see the harm in the number-massclaim we did, it limited the amount of wiggle room fakeclaiming scum could get from the fact that there's two of each card which i still think is pro-town. i read 1371 and i... want to agree with it? but it just feels like a disconnect from how titus usually approaches this game as town

like i agree that we shouldn't claim if we're the governor (as was suggested earlier) or something, but the PoE pool from the number massclaim for individual cards is way too huge to make any actual use out of, probably even with the information advantage scum have

btw i'd totally be the scum member with the spreadsheet (and i've been theorizing stuff I could do with one as town) and like what we did doesn't really give enough information to work with, knowing 10-15 extra cards doesn't win the game for scum when there's a pool of 104.

personally i want titus to address your case though :/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

titus can you look at my 1806 and tell me who i'm townreading wrong or who you are also willing to wagon

[gigabyteTroubadour]

How do you feel about Vedith?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i mean i know i wrote in-thread that it was probably scum that did it just a while ago, but vecna made me re-think it and the beta deck rigger is actually probably town?

look at the spades-powers and most of the NU/anti-town aspects of it are present during the day. i think the beta deck rigger placed it there to let the jack with the cop power use it tonight

i kind of get what you mean about vedith though but i will probably have to rethink it when i'm freer

[gigabyteTroubadour]

but yeah this is going to be tougher than i thought

i've completely ignored drone though not going to lie

[gigabyteTroubadour]

but what are the obvious scum motives?

doc disabler and fruit allergies are the only thing that can affect us and there's no doctors available in a Jack-trump night anyway. beloved only comes into play during the day, there's no trackers so ninja doesn't matter

like the more i look into it the more i see the Jack of Heart's cop getting activation with no downside

[gigabyteTroubadour]

and now that i think even more of it

jack of spades is a pretty powerful card in town's hands... so why get rid of it so easily?

shit maybe you're right :/

although wouldn't it be a better plan to pick a weaker spades card, like the 8 (watcher comes into play but is countered by ninja)? the plan is basically to have a doctorless night i'm guessing?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also, other than to rig the deck why would scum take the 4 of clubs? is rigging the deck to stop doctors really worthwhile D1? :/

the tracker doesn't really catch any useful PRs (jailkeepers?? but then they can just join the neighborhood and it's more effective)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i realize i'm waffling hard but this doesn't really make sense from either perspective

unless i'm underestimating the importance for scum to rig the deck

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Why do we want diamonds tomorrow? For the double lynch?

this seems like an obvious question tbh but i just want to make sure i'm seeing this right. hearts just looks better to me

[gigabyteTroubadour]

VOTE: Vedith

^ a reminder before i go to bed

kraska you never told me why you townread vedith

i'm probs just going to move my vote to whichever of {Vedith, Maria, Transcend} has the biggest wagon for your fyi information but i feel like dave rb and vifam are the only townreads that seem to consider the vedith wagon

with a lot of pestering i could probably do jackel but his wagon sucks lol

also why is jackel selfvoting

[gigabyteTroubadour]

@Mod, Jackel is voting Vedith, not himself

no clue if there's a fourth voter on jackel though

[gigabyteTroubadour]

VOTE: Transcend

let's get him

[gigabyteTroubadour]

vedith is still probably scum but like that claim is kind of weird and i want to think it over

[gigabyteTroubadour]

maria babes vote transcend now

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Titus how do you feel about gigascum

More like, Gigadumb!

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Titus how do you feel about gigascum

More like, Gigadumb!

I am not partial to likely fictious enties.

are you calling me smart

VOTE: Drone

i take offense to that

[gigabyteTroubadour]

do you townread drone?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

fine i am just going to sulk in a corner or sth

no but wagoning him doesnt feel right
and transcends been genuinely trying to fling shit there the most so my guess is drone's probably town

I JUST WANT EVERYONE TO BE HAPPY AUDHDHSJSHVJENEHCHF

[gigabyteTroubadour]

kraska is really town why are we contesting this

[gigabyteTroubadour]

contesting what?

i don't understand the scumreads/shade thrown onto kraska

[gigabyteTroubadour]

case is 1333 by the way

[gigabyteTroubadour]

VOTE: Transcend

still think milkshake is town btw, magna picking governor as town makes a ton of sense.

i'll get back to dave on a transcend case when i have more time irl, i misunderstood his question

[gigabyteTroubadour]

^^^

vig this tbh

[gigabyteTroubadour]

help me bus transcend mariaf

[gigabyteTroubadour]

@Mod, I'm going to be V/LA for 2 days

UNVOTE:

Need to think things over a little bit more tbh

@RB, why do you think Kraska is scum? I think her transcend case makes sense based on my previous experience with scum!Transcend and her play is obviously her town play. Like even though I flubbed up last time I played with scum!Kraska, I like to think my one niche on this site is reading kraska. her play here reads as town and if you need me to go in-depth here i can once i have more time irl

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Oh rb was poisoned okay

VOTE: MariaF

uh?? how did you come to that conclusion??

[gigabyteTroubadour]

UNVOTE:

Actually, rb being poisoned doesn't make sense with Transcend being town. Since we know he rigged the deck, scum would have deliberately set rb's poison to go off during Aces but there's no way to plan for that to actually happen without deck rigging. Rb is a player scum want to get rid of immediately, not poison and hope that Aces turn up at some point.

Scum vig/factional kill makes more sense, so I really don't see Maria's "slip" being alignment indicative (since I know Maria would absolutely play dumb as scum, which is why I jumped on her when she assumed poison). Town making the assumption that the delayed kill was poisoned makes sense, I guess, if they don't know how vigs work in this set-up??

I think Dave's vote was fine though but I don't grok his mindset 100%.

pedit: yeah what transcend said basically

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Do people really expect me to read the rules of an online game? lol

yes.....

VOTE: Jackel

the way vote's phrased in (and the reasoning itself tbh) 376 feels pretty awkward as is the general tone of the post

backtracking of finding transcend suspicious in 749 makes little sense too, same w/ the question towards gerry

magna's catch in 1531 was good too

good with this as our lynch today

Who tf would vig rb? -_-

I totally would tbh though I'd vig titus first

VOTE: davesaz

DOG SQUAD HERE TO ROOT STUFF OUT

gfd i was coming around to being ok with you

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i literally just explained that rb couldn't have been poisoned ://

[gigabyteTroubadour]

UNVOTE:

Actually, rb being poisoned doesn't make sense with Transcend being town. Since we know he rigged the deck, scum would have deliberately set rb's poison to go off during Aces but there's no way to plan for that to actually happen without deck rigging. Rb is a player scum want to get rid of immediately, not poison and hope that Aces turn up at some point.

Scum vig/factional kill makes more sense, so I really don't see Maria's "slip" being alignment indicative (since I know Maria would absolutely play dumb as scum, which is why I jumped on her when she assumed poison). Town making the assumption that the delayed kill was poisoned makes sense, I guess, if they don't know how vigs work in this set-up??

I think Dave's vote was fine though but I don't grok his mindset 100%.

pedit: yeah what transcend said basically

read the OP for poison mechanics

i can't see why they would specifically set rb to die during aces without having the deck rigged

transcend being inno'd means that town rigged the deck

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ok like every one of milkshake's posts were bad

but i still think magna's replace out was town so i'm not really following the scumreads on that slot :/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i keep going back and fourth on maria

i don't want to lynch someone who softed vengeful while clubs is in trumps (unless i'm doing so while thinking they're town i guess) tho tbh

[gigabyteTroubadour]

*forth

lol ebwop

[gigabyteTroubadour]

yeah i think it's tinfoil tbh, who would else would he have investigated? you...?

not sure how i feel about McScummy tbh any more

Irrelevant question, what benefit is there to scum to taking neighborhood cards? would they want like one member to take a bunch of them or what

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Ok honestly this shit is confusing and i think I've obvtowned my slot enough to not get lynched ever

Like only person who DOESN'T townread me is k77 who's been confbias on me since what, page 1 or some shit. Lol.

I bid you adieu.

Why is your motive to not get lynched as opposed to solve game?

Transcend is obvtown.

VOTE: kraska77

And kraska knows it

yeah the inno is definitely transcend

[gigabyteTroubadour]

yeah the inno is definitely transcend

"Look at me trying to look useful when I'm not"

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Jackal is still scum guys. Look at the resistance and misrep to his wagon. Jackal's ISO is devoid of scumhunting. His wagon has been misrepped as looking for the jack, reasonless, and rushed by scum for starters. None of it is true. The same players that are resisting (minus Giga) are consistent with my scum pool.

?

i'm voting jackal how am i resisting...?

Low skill player

Lapsa, Macho Townie,

Wake88, Vanilla Townie,

beeboy, Odd-Night Cop,

BK201, Mafia Goon,

dude that's low

[gigabyteTroubadour]

VOTE: Jackel98

Even though

He will

Probably be

A mislynch

why would you vote for what you believe is a mislynch

and why is jackel town...

I also don't get why Jackel and Vedith took governor, I doubt scum took two governors so there's probably only one scum out of the two but the two of those players are like the last I'd expect to pick it as town i guess

[gigabyteTroubadour]

maria can we hug??

[gigabyteTroubadour]

transcend why did you have to be a useless clear

i find that i can only play well when I'm clear tbh, why are most people the opposite

maria can we hug??

I don't hug scum!

im only 17 i can't be scum

[gigabyteTroubadour]

titus i'm not a he

[gigabyteTroubadour]

maria i don't get your scumread of me at all tbh

It's like the scum squad is coming out to play.
Where's Max to help with it?

Vedith remember when we were friends?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

maria i don't get your scumread of me at all tbh

It's like the scum squad is coming out to play.
Where's Max to help with it?

Vedith remember when we were friends?

You're normally a lot more controlled than what I've seen from you I also don't get your random wagon jumping it just seems like you give reads but just settle for w/e lynch the top wagon is.

In a game this large, it's hard to play like I normally do because so much of it relies on direct interaction with slots that are very likely to be town and finding scum via POE. Here it's kind of a clusterfuck and people are putting in various amounts of effort so it feels more like an extended RVS I guess? Like sometimes I jump on wagons pushed by townreads but the wagonee is a nullread when I'm lacking scumreads and that's kind what I've been doing here I guess.

like if you look at my reads i'm basically opening myself to settle anyway because finding town is more important and all that jazz

vedith idk if i'll break ur heart again. i break the hearts of men in my spare time and leave no mercy so i guess ur right that we should keep our distance for the time being... </3

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Hug Squad > Dog Squad

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Hug Squad > Dog Squad

Dogpile: gigabytetroubadouba

welcome to both squads my dude

[gigabyteTroubadour]

jackel should probably claim next time he comes on

chance of town derphammering is decent and i want to at least talk about the claim when it happens

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Claiming vengeful just makes people want to lynch you more.

i mean there's the argument that you don't want to lynch someone you scumread when you think they have a vengeful during clubs since that means you're giving that power to scum

my vote stays despite the claim btw for that reason (if he's scum he wants the unvotes and to be lynched later by policy, and kraska made a good point about why lynching town jackal now is a good idea too), though i want to know who town!Jackal venges

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i feel the same way about you :/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

what's making adjusting my read based on jackal's claim is that i have legitimately no idea what scum would take. in my last pyp game i was able to clear someone based on what they claimed to pick making zero sense with their scumplay (Charloux, who's generally a D1 lynch as scum, picking Rolecop as scum didn't make sense because a scumteam that takes rolecop in that set-up is relying on it to root out a cop+doctor and doesn't want to bus D1).

with jackal's hand, i can't make a similar connection. i see someone who's worried about dying, which seems null for the most part?? his play is scummy so i still think he's a fine lynch.

I guess the point I want to make is... are scum actually going to take the obviously scummy picks like roleblockers that only can block cops and kills? because if so, having jackal as your deep townie makes little sense, which makes me crazy paranoid about how scum are arranged in the draft and what they ultimately picked.

also i'll admit i haven't read the last few pages so i'll probably just do a catch-up tomorrow. i was kind of focusing more on a newbie game that just finished and that was low-investment :/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

well i had a good run guys

i took a two of hearts, i wanted my time in this game to be short bc i wasn't expecting to enjoy it but i ended up having a lot of fun

only important information i can think of that I have to say before i die is that we have 14 diamonds in the deck. i'll type up a readlist tomorrow (though i should double check if i suicide after morning or after the lynch)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i mean i'm the ideal IC imo

not a threatening enough player to die upon being confirmed (making it a waste), somewhat lynchbaity, but not a complete idiot so being conf is useful

i think at least. plus i gamesolve better when i'm confirmed :/

pedit: ok thank god i have time

pedit 2: spyrex stop i thought you crumbed having it too....... lmfao it could be worse

[gigabyteTroubadour]

OH

Nobody died because maria is the mafia gov and got shot at, and that card also has bulletproof.

what if... the mafia used their factional kill on rb ://

were any vig cards even active yet? people seem to forget how factional kills work

although it'd be interesting to know if scum actually hasn't taken vigs yet

[gigabyteTroubadour]

VOTE: MariaF

Don't really have a better vote at the moment but Maria's scumreads don't make any sense at all

Gerry/Me/Drealmerz off the top of my head

it feels off

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh lol

i don't think mcmenno is scum tbh

not anymore at least

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i don't think mcmenno is scum tbh

Why

can't discuss atm i need to work something out first

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I have the 3 of clubs mcmenno, I already claimed my result.

@Titus, I inventoried during the night with my 3 of clubs card, so at night.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

we know how likely it is we get a double lynch without scum rigging the deck

14/40 is kind of mediocre odds

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also i took useless powers because i'm dying early so

and also what dav said

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hey since mcmenno outed me btw

should we lynch in the clubs hood to find whoever has the 10 of clubs? can't see why town picks it and it's a 5 member hood, meaning one (or two, but I doubt it) person has it.

also not sure how much of the hood i should discuss openly

[gigabyteTroubadour]

titus have you played with scum maria before? she's really good at reading genuinely when she's scum :/

Max... how does this suggest Vedith as town...?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Also why would scum choose roleblocker with a neighbour affix when they can choose roleblocker+strongman

To roleblock multiple cops

The roleblocker+strongman can only get cops during one kind of trump, while the roleblocker/neighbor gets a different cop

almost every cop is paired with a corresponding roleblocker, so it's likely scum have multiple roleblockers

@Giga, You've just highlighted my point. Maria wouldn't be scumread because she'd appear genuine as scum

the people scumreading her are familiar with her play though

except for kison of course

@Max, forgot about that, I should take Vecna's idea and make a spreadsheet with all the claims :/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hey since mcmenno outed me btw

should we lynch in the clubs hood to find whoever has the 10 of clubs? can't see why town picks it and it's a 5 member hood, meaning one (or two, but I doubt it) person has it.

also not sure how much of the hood i should discuss openly

Roleblocker isn't a scum only role.

it's not but that specific roleblocker has zero town utility

it only blocks cops and pgos iirc

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh it stops vigs too :/

hm

[gigabyteTroubadour]

didn't consider that

[gigabyteTroubadour]

newbie derp with factional kills and roleblockers

but i was specifically talking about the 10 of clubs, which can only stop Cops, PGOs, and Alpha Vigs (and factional kills) since those are PRs active when 10 is in trumps

dave isn't scum btw

[gigabyteTroubadour]

So my answer to that clubs neighborhood hunt thing is no

yeah i'm starting to realize why... :///

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ok something doesn't add up here

i went back and took a look at my reads and i have way too many townreads, i had to even throw away some to make a scumteam that works in numbers (but not dynamics). gonna try to start from scratch here :/

@Uzi, who do you think is scum with Maria?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Giga, Sheep me until i am wrong?

i'll think about it

i'm still kind of in a prodge-posting state right now because real life, i'm hoping to get a good re-read in like saturday or something. expect a more informed sheep or counter-proposal then

if we were in D1 i'd say yes without a second thought but like i'm down with the sentiment of like having cases behind every vote until we actually hit scum, the wagon behaviors we've had were pretty shitty and kind of discouraging in general.

i mean i'm kind of hypocritical at the moment because my vote on Maria is mostly a kraska sheep but

[gigabyteTroubadour]

btw is anyone familiar with how magna approaches scumplay?

his replace-out still reads town to me but that read is getting stale and milkshake is literally a joke (not sure if this lacks offense, sorry dude). is replacing out from frustration something he'd do as scum, or is he more the type to take advantage of what he sees as an anti-town environment?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hello all

Merry Christmas all

Can someone be a dear and help me where we are heading in this game. Can I skip the 155 pages and pick up the game from here.

Guys I am beloved and hated with that spade up. I haven't finished reading but I did complete an ISO of Vedith I read through and realized Vedith claimed cards. Won't have time today because of holidays. Can someone give me the 411?

Yes, I started to prepare a post with claims, quick wagon summaries, and people I'd like to claim but didn't get to finish it.

ok something doesn't add up here

i went back and took a look at my reads and i have way too many townreads, i had to even throw away some to make a scumteam that works in numbers (but not dynamics). gonna try to start from scratch here :/

@Uzi, who do you think is scum with Maria?

Leaning towards Kison, Milkshake, Titus, and McMemmo/Spy

I still think there is a small chance of Transcend since I pointed out that rb might have cleared Gerry as opposed to him.

first can you point out where rb may have cleared gerry as opposed to transcend?

Also, can you explain why you would think Kison/Titus is scumteam dynamic? I get why Titus would be on the list but Kison as a Maria partner also makes zero sense to me, why does it look like a bus?

Mostly because this reads to me like you just listed other popular scumreads (and Titus, who would have been a lynch candidate today from at least 1 faction from the game) without really trying to think they make sense as Maria partners.

VOTE: Lil Uzi Vert

^ also this is the wagon I'd like for today, mostly for that post being something i'd expect from a Maria partner

---

While I felt Titus was obvious town (or at least an obvious townbeard), I think her being vigged is ultimately helpful because the other King of Diamonds now can hide and doesn't have to worry about being a lover (although the PT may have been useful).

My personal request to the card revivers is to give me the Ace of Hearts and someone you trust that isn't me the 2 of Diamonds (although i really want diamond neighborhood access zzzzz), although I can understand why you may not trust me until Hearts are in trumps and thus not listen to me. A more general request is that pro-town cards should go to any one of {Giga, Drealmerz, Fishy} and maybe -Grey- (kraska was obvious town but you may not want to put some cards in the hands of someone who just replaced in, use your judgement). I absolutely

do not

want the King of Diamonds, the reason I want PT access is to give out inside information I may have in the case that I die due to being confirmed town which is rendered useless by the King of Diamonds.

If you give anyone a cop, note that we have more claims/flips of Jacks, so the Queen cop is theoretically better to give out but I don't think you're allowed to given it's a spade.

I also should clarify that my investigation result from yesterday was misread, there were 13 diamonds in the deck at the start of the game/at the time of my inventory.

Also merry Christmas everyone <3

[gigabyteTroubadour]

The Skinny

Claims

• Vedith (now Mathblade) claimed to have the Jack of Clubs, 8 of Spades, and 2 of Spades at L-1.
  
  
  
• Transcend claimed to rig the deck with the Ace of Clubs, meaning he has the Ace of Clubs and Jack of Spades. He also claimed to be a member of the Clubs Neighborhood (which I can verify), so he has the 8, 9, or 10 of clubs.
  
  
  
• Transcend is presumably the innocent result of rb's sole investigation. Look through rb's ISO and voice any disagreement you have though.
  
  
  
• gigabyteTrouabdour claimed to have the 2 of hearts (Innocent Child) and 3 of clubs. McMenno claimed to be neighbors with them in the Clubs Neighborhood, which they verified. This means their remaining card is an 8, 9, or 10 of clubs.
  
  
  
• Vecna claimed fruit vendor and vended fruit to Gerry, which has been verified by Gerry.
  
  
  
• McMenno claimed to be a member of the Clubs Neighborhood, and so has an 8, 9, or 10 of clubs.
  
  
  
• The deck started out with 13 diamond cards, so 13 diamond cards are in the hands of players and 13 are in the deck (now 12). (This is the result of giga's N2 inventory)

---

Wagons

• Major D1 wagons include LUV (major pushers being Titus, Fishy, and Kison. Strong opposition mostly came from rb), Transcend (pushed by Kraska/-Grey-), and Vedith (pushed by rb). Drone was a lolcompromise wagon that got hammered way too quickly.
  
  
  
• Major D2 wagons include Transcend (which was stopped because of rb's presumable inno on him), LUV, and Jackel (pushed by kraska/-grey-, main reason being that he was a scumread player with a vengeful, and any kill at that stage of the game would provide information. he flipped town and presumably attempted to kill Maria, but she could have been protected by a scum white mage).
  
  
  
• D3 was basically just the Maria wagon.
  
  
  Anyone is welcome to provide more on the specific cases, but I figured ISOs can speak for themselves once you point out the major wagons.

---

General Announcements

• IF YOU RECEIVED FRUIT AT ANY POINT,
  please claim when!! Knowledge of what fruit vendors are in play will help me figure out what diamond cards are in the deck and better plan out night actions once the next 2 inventories necessary are completed.
  
  
  
• IF YOU HAVE THE ABILITY TO INVENTORY,
  please select either
  SPADES
  or
  HEARTS
  . I already have the most information on Clubs, so one of the other two suites will be more helpful to me. Crumb your result if you have no way of communicating with me more privately. Inventorying for specific cards isn't going to be helpful until we figure out all of the suites.
  
  
  
• I want to know how many people are in the diamonds hood, but I don't know the safest way to do so without outing anyone there. Giving me the 2 of diamonds is a waste since that card is specifically designed to doctor me, but otherwise that would have been pretty convenient.

Anybody with the 7 of Hearts should just claim it ASAP.

Tia

Why, to make sure that no one revives the same card at once? We know there's two of them already so I guess that's valid.

They should also claim how many people are in that hood btw.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

In that case, we should revive a 9 of diamonds to put on the top of the deck.

9 of diamonds would give us beta vigs, and also at least 1 other inventory and 2 card-cop results in the clubs neighborhood. I also have a relatively safe way of directing specific people in that hood who to investigate without outing them, too. The only issue I can see is that a second 9 of diamonds should be revived because we're ensured no doctors, which might be an issue.

Additionally the 10 cards also have a cop power.
So we deffo want to put a 10 on top for the next night.
If we have a second card revive we can give a card to Giga

I mean that works too, but there's the same issue of not having doctors.

I want to know how many people are in the diamonds hood, but I don't know the safest way to do so without outing anyone there. Giving me the 2 of diamonds is a waste since that card is specifically designed to doctor me, but otherwise that would have been pretty convenient.

three. there are three people in the diamonds hood. what a hoot

that's uh

actually very informative

thank you

[gigabyteTroubadour]

do you mean 3 counting rb btw

[gigabyteTroubadour]

that actually changes everything goddamn it

[gigabyteTroubadour]

The only issue I can see is that a second 9 of diamonds should be revived because we're ensured no doctors, which might be an issue.

laughing at the unintentional redundancy here btw

and since we don't have doctors when 10s are in trumps i'm even more in favor or 9s but I still don't think it's my first choice

i'd actually like vecna's input here

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Also, -Grey-, who was Kraska set to kill before you replaced in, or were you not told/did she not input anyone?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh fuck i missed fishy's claim lmfao

[gigabyteTroubadour]

neighborhood with conftown...?

it's not my first choice any more but once i figure out the deck's contents then i do need someone trustworthy to tell it to

also dunn i'm already BP during clubs

[gigabyteTroubadour]

that actually changes everything goddamn it

how so

thought menno knew the 2 of diamonds for sure, plus it strongly hints at who is in the hood (in terms of cards not people)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

vig not being town is (hopefully) remedied by reviving the other doctor but i understand the concern

it's not my final choice though, more input is needed

knowing the number of people in a hood lets me figure out how many cards are in the deck for certain. if there are 6, then that means that all of the neighbor cards are in play. 5 means that at least one isn't (and with the inevitable claims it's possible to figure out which one without outing the whole hood), and so on and so forth. knowing what cards are in play without people outright claiming minimizes the risk of stealth vigs/scum knowing what cards town has since I can PoE the cards in the deck with my inventory ability.

We have a doctor today - they should maybe probably be on giga

this, and if there's a second it should be on fishy.

I want to lynch kison

Why is he the most likely to have bussed Maria?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i can do spyrex and menno too btw, menno a little less since he's in the diamonds hood

@uzi, i'll respond in full later but i did miss the post you made about gerry. i had a lot more time to focus on this game but most of it went into solving the deck. i assumed that since i asked for who you believed would be scum with maria that there would be partner associations in your reads. sorry for the assumption

[gigabyteTroubadour]

for the card revivers, we should lay out ideas for now but wait for the daykill before making a full plan

[gigabyteTroubadour]

VOTE: Spyrex

fair enough

[gigabyteTroubadour]

menno's neighborhood posts have been kind of sketchy but i guess it's town to pick cards to be in neighborhoods...?

oh fuck i forgot we have a time limit for day actions nvm

my pick is still revive two nines, one to whoever can rig it onto the deck and the other to someone trustworthy for proection

[gigabyteTroubadour]

wish we were together in a neighbourhood as well giga, if only I had gotten that Ace of hearts (no offence to my current partner though, were gonna solve this shit together).

that's why i want the ace of hearts

[gigabyteTroubadour]

By my guesstimates nearly all aces are gone from the deck now Giga so I feel that'd be a terrible choice.

i know, but there are two aces in the discard pile

rig one on, let me use the neighorizer

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i still prefer putting 9s into trumps if at all possible

[gigabyteTroubadour]

actually yeah idk what i was thinking, uzi's not scum

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i guess jailkeeper is ok but i REALLY want to wrap up the inventory business

the faster i finish this the better, since my time alive won't be wasted

[gigabyteTroubadour]

unless you can hardclear an entire hood, yes

i don't want scum knowing the entire deck if we can keep that info away from them

[gigabyteTroubadour]

yo wait

what if we give me rigging powers

that way, after i confirm myself, i can rig my 2 of hearts onto the deck and disable the mafia kill again...?

or are we unable to revive spades cards?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

@Mod, if two Alpha Deck Riggers are alive, can the one lower in the draft rig the deck successfully if the one higher in the draft intentionally does not submit an action?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i figured but i want an aswwr to 3932

[gigabyteTroubadour]

*answer

ebwop

[gigabyteTroubadour]

It's removed from the graveyard? Or is it secretly revived

@Mod, when a card is revived, is it publically revealed in any way (e.g., removed from the discard pile in the OP, announced in a new post, etc.)?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also vecna the only way we can be in a hood together is via ace of hearts

i'm only in the clubs neighborhood, and everyone there is alive

[gigabyteTroubadour]

next card is a heart but aces needs to be in trumps to neighborize.

if clubs are in trumps then i'll be bulletproof too so the only issue with putting the ace of clubs in trumps as far as i can recall is the cop disabler (presuming maria was in fact protected)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

There are a lot of good uses of the card revives, but please please please: Do not state in public which one youre going to choose. Do not give scum the information.

Good options I can see:

Card revive the 2 different cop cards to two different people
Card revive harmfull-for-scum trump cards both to fishy and trancend
Card revive protective abilities such as the jack of spades to hard townreads.
Card revive a neighbourhood card to me so I can get into a smaller talking environment with Giga ^^

also not publically announcing picks could be an issue in that dunn and the other 7 of hearts might do the same thing by accident :/

in theory though i would prefer not annoucning publically btw

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i mean i think most of us are phone-posting and busy with christmas stuff

and yeah vecna if you know for a fact who the other ace of hearts is then i'm fine with a proxy hood

so i probably wouldn't want the ace of hearts just yet

[gigabyteTroubadour]

9 of hearts has an inventory and i'm pretty sure someone took it

better if two people took it, meaning that if i have them pick the right suite to investigate we won't have to inventory again

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also card cops in the clubs hood i can leash/direct

[gigabyteTroubadour]

menno's neighborhood posts have been kind of sketchy but

i guess it's town to pick cards to be in neighborhoods

...?

Why wouldn't Scum want to infiltrate hoods?

i mean that was my original thought

it just seems like a waste of power though

[gigabyteTroubadour]

what that tells me is that you literally should not have claimed any of those cards

but at least it confirms my read on kraska *shrug*

also max i'll read your case in a bit but i see a drealmerz vote and i'll have to veto that

[gigabyteTroubadour]

my phone's at 1% so i'll get back to you guys tomorrow

spyrex is still my lynch of choice for today, uzi is likely town tbh and i'll go into that read in-depth

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Honestly, my death is nothing short of a Christmas present. Thank you scum!

i agree

I'm not opposed to an AA9-wagon but I would like to know why Math thinks that slot is lynchbait. Magna's votes sucked (but his replace-out felt town), milkshake was useless, and we haven't seen much of AA9 yet so it's not like we're lynching someone who's actively playing

and

looking scummy (which would be like... actual lynchbait).

Also, with the beloved claim a Spyrex lynch is out of the question for today.

UNVOTE:

Just an idea of where my head is at:

Out of the question for lynching for the majority of the game: {Drealmerz, Fishy, Vecna, -Grey-}
Will consider with a really fucking rock solid case but is otherwise a hard townread: {Davesaz, Dunnstral, Kison, Mathblade, TWIE (ehhhhh)}

everyone else is basically fair game for rope

VOTE: McMenno

^ probably my first choice, this absolutely should have been the vig target from last night

[gigabyteTroubadour]

For Dave and Kison, you basically hit the nail on the head — Kison maybe less so because I can see him being scum hyperfocused on his own partner (Kison has basically been pushing Maria and LUV all game so..?) but town is more likely. I was hoping to see how he approaches the aftermath of the lynch and I think the outcome has been town thus far.

TWIE obviously comes more from Vifam, but the townread based on play got stale. It just never really made sense to me that scum!Vifam actually picks his cards at random or takes a card like the 8 of spades (...right? i have to check my spreadsheet later) and then lies about randomizing his cards. Town picking at random makes sense.

Agreed on the D2 Maria push being more interesting but from what I remember in my mod-ISO when making that wagon summary, it never really went that far? Dunn brought up earlier that we should look at people who voted Jackal so he can shoot Maria and I want to agree, but besides Milkshake I don't really remember any of the votes being awful (Kraska was obvtown and lead the push and I supported the Jackel-so-he-can-shoot idea...).

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I find your rocksolid townpile questionable. especially kraska need to be looked at and vifamslot just disappeared into nowhere at the end. also a reminder that effort does not indicate alignment

who said i'm scumreading you for a lack of effort

[gigabyteTroubadour]

why not mcmenno

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Nah it went to where I wanted it to go so they didn't choose anything

Can the other card reviver revive the card at the end of the day?

also idk if the 2 of hearts was the best choice now that i'm thinking about it

scum probably know who has it (especially if mcscummy is in fact scum) so??

it's probably fine though if it's who i think it is

twie's reads make sense and i basically feel the same way/can jibe with the thought process so i'm ok leaving him as a townlean

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I wouldn't mind the Jack of Spades to get rid of my 2 of hearts

[gigabyteTroubadour]

neither of the jack of spades are in play any more

if spades are in trumps during the day, i can rig the deck with the 2 of hearts so i don't suicide when 2s are in trumps

[gigabyteTroubadour]

jack of spades is

[gigabyteTroubadour]

and we were so close

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Dunnstral (2) - McMenno, gerryoat

why is this a wagon lmfao

[gigabyteTroubadour]

That's actually a good idea.
Get the innocent child confirmation and then discard the card.

The other card revive should do that.

+plus it would give another scum kill disabler

You get a townread. Have some popcorn to celebrate.

Still reading.

isn't that a little bit too generous of a townread

like he +1'd basically conftown's suggestion, not that that's scummy but it's not super town indicative either

VOTE: McMenno

This can die today.

Note to kraska: Sorry for redirecting your shot.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

not really sure how i feel about 10s

the lack of a doctor (and BP protection).................. is a bit......... unsettling..........

which is why i would want 9s but the unknown beta vig is a risk of its own (plus we need two revived nines to make it worthwhile)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Dunn and grey are confirmed scum lol

i can go for a policy lynch on this slot

what did you have to smoke to scumread kraska btw

No.

ok when i asked that question i was hoping for either a "good point" or a "no, this is why"

so could i please have the latter?

---

i legitimately do not understand the townreads on mcmenno and why people are so adamant about not lynching him

like literally all he has done this game is claim scum. in the neighborhood, "Watch out for moles in the hood. i know the scumteam has them because i'm one of them ", in-thread we have gems like:

yes it worked good job guys

to my buds

my scumbuddies. also hmpf.

and

I don't think I can support a mariar lynch here

one I feel like this is kinda her v kraska on who jackel shot and I am scumreading kraska more

two she is my scumbuddy and I don't really want to bus right now

^ not to mention he called maria the responsible lynch the day before here

like this is someone deliberately playing like scum, I get that "too scummy to be scum" is a thing but mcmenno has literally been riding on that idea to coast and be useless. none of it feels genuine either tbh

and don't forget his involvement with claims

Giga is in one of my hoods might as well claim that now

this literally did not need to be outted and it was done without my permission. i mean the info's out there now so i'm going to milk the fuck out of it but still

also in the hood he started speculating on what roles each hood member has completely unprompted. i suppose it's a shitty rolefish if it really is a rolefish but WHY THE FUCK WOULD YOU DO IT AS TOWN ANYWAY??

not to mention how fsdfhjsakldhiuign CLAIMING FRUIT VENDOR IN THE DIAMONDS HOOD I WANT TO ACTUALLY SHOOT MYSELF

his iso totally reads like a maria partner btw just like LOOK AT IT

mcmenno's play feels super fake here and i legitimately do not understand why this wagon has NEVER had traction all game............. if mcmenno were actually shittown playing like this i would expect scum to actually WANT this lynch

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I don't think I can support a mariar lynch here

one I feel like this is kinda her v kraska on who jackel shot and I am scumreading kraska more

two she is my scumbuddy and I don't really want to bus right now

as I said yesterday I am in two hoods and only have two cards so unless you think this is some elaborate scum gambit I was not bulletproof yesterday

Giga is in one of my hoods might as well claim that now

more thoughts when I get back to a computer

i'm really terrible with cases but hopefully my incoherent screeching moves some votes over to an actually decent wagon (read: not drealmerz aND NOT FUCKING DUNN)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

(them quotes are accidental <3)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

You look to be lynch shopping. I don't like that.

lmfao bye

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also math, how do you know mcmenno is reaction testing? i don't see what reads he's getting out of this, he's barely commented on my slot (especially pre-IC claim) and i've been the one most vocally reacting to him all game

[gigabyteTroubadour]

mcmenno would you like to elucidate to the town what the fuck you have been doing the entire game?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

let's lynch gerry or mcmenno

gerry is likely town, maria was trying to deflect her lynch onto him because she felt they were equally useless and was pushing the angle that scum were pushing on her over him because he was scum

plus her scumteam pick was me/gerry/drealmerz and last time she threw random people together as a scumteam as scum they were all town (you remember her fire/creature/chrimi scumteam from 649 right)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i guess the scumteam was just luv/dunn/gerry/me/drealmerz all along

maria was death miller

Bussing exists btw

yeah but like

it doesn't feel bussy? and gerry's reactions to it have been ok

Gerry wouldn't have been in danger

Also, his reads this game are awful

on the second line i've never seen gerry have an a game so idk if that's AI

[gigabyteTroubadour]

it doesn't feel bussy?

I hate when people say stupid shit like this.

If bussing "felt bussy",

it wouldn't work

!

fuck ok

so i went through gerry's ISO to try to justify my position with like quotes and stuff

but after re-reading some hit classic posts like

Someone sent me fruit too (During Day 2 not the night) BTW. AFTER I SAID DONT SEND ME FRUIT. That means one of the fruit venders is mafia. I only said dont send me fruit to see if a maf would.

so like. do we know why no one died lol

U moron lmao. And so you're saying mafia didn't kill anyone?

i just gave up

so yeah i guess it could have been a bus now ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

plus iirc on gerry's first game here he coasted to a scum victory by dumbtelling hard (and fighting with his partner, MariaF, to the point where there was moderator intervention)

mcmenno would you like to elucidate to the town what the fuck you have been doing the entire game?

more than a number of other slots

thanks mcscummy

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Hey giggles. A lynch on me isn't happening. I'm hand feeding you mafia

i'm not trying to get you lynched. are you mcscummy?

also stop trying to lynch obvtown lmfaooaosdfasdjfoasdflasdk;fhsadlf

seriously kraska lead the maria lynch and i know her towngame really well

plus -grey- has the fucking king of diamonds

like literally all he has done this game is claim scum. in the neighborhood, "Watch out for moles in the hood. i know the scumteam has them because i'm one of them ", in-thread we have gems like:

CLUBS HOOD IS AN ALL TOWN MASONRY #NEVERFORGETEVINTER

...................................................

k

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh that's what he meant by that answer lmfao

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Mcmenno doesn't get lunched today on my watch

why

why is this slot town

why

-a poem by gigabyte "giggles" Troubadour

also gerry where did u pick up the nickname giggles for me

it seems

suspicious

[gigabyteTroubadour]

the poem was about mcmenno's slot not gerry's