Mini Normal 1861: Musical Mafia (TOWN WIN)

[Aj The Epic]

Yeah culted fits really well in a team with flubber and massive. I'm moving my vote there, though again I'm pretty ok with a flubber vote too.

VOTE: Culted

If you're going with that pool, Massive or Flubber first please. Culted is the least suspect imo.

[Kairal]

Mm yeah I guess realistically Flubber is the one that's got a chance of going ahead.

VOTE: Flubber

[Aj The Epic]

FWIW massive has to die N4 if he's town. Assuming we get that far, there's that option left available.

Lemme check VC to make sure I'm not hammering/sending to l-1

[Aj The Epic]

So As far as I can tell:

Karial: Massive, Culted
Flubber: Kairal
Naomi: Me

It's most likely wrong but I don't think I saw a vote from Dier/IaI/BV anywhere and Flubber unvoted.... Naomi SHOULD have a vote? From shadow slot I think, and that would also probably be on Kairal. I'll go check again

VOTE: Flubber

[Aj The Epic]

Ok Naomi/Shadow both have not voted today so I think the VC's correct.

[Kairal]

Dier hasn't posted in nearly 4 days :/

[Gamma Emerald]

Replacing Dierfire for inactivity.

[Gamma Emerald]

Vote Count 3.01

0 - Dierfire:
0 - BlackVoid:
2 - Kairal: Massive, Culted
2 - Flubbernugget: Kairal, Aj The Epic
0 - I Am Innocent:
0 - Naomi-Tan:
0 - culted:
0 - massive:
0 - Aj The Epic:
0 -No Lynch:
Not voting: Dierfire, BlackVoid, Flubbernugget, I Am Innocent, Naomi-Tan
With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline is (expired on 2017-01-13 15:30:00)
I will be gone between Friday to Monday as part of a birthday trip, so things may be a little off on timing.

[culted]

I already did but ok. I had no problem with your argument- however you made an argument shifting the focus from massive to Newman. This is exactly what a scum team might try when one of their members was the front runner for a lynch. As I say though massive's claim checks out, he's not scum, so you can't be his scum partner so there's no use discussing it.

This is my entire problem.

You're taking a surface approach looking for arguments you don't even have a problem with that fit nicely snug and square into this massive/flubber/culted narrative without even attempting to see my side at first. But when pushed on it you say that my thought process isn't something you have a problem with.

Why do you think I'm scum? Why do you think flubber's scum?

Why are you waffling so hard on massive's claim?

[culted]

Deadline extension would be great.

[culted]

Yeah and the fact that you don't get another investigation in that scenario is one of the many reasons your claim is suspect.

Massive and mini were the buzzwords before his claim.

[Gamma Emerald]

Due to the need for replacement I will automatically give a 48 hour extension.

[culted]

I am confirm as of right now I have no intent of pushing you and if your content remains consistent post page 22 Im pretty certain that won't change. You may been one of my later reads but I been Green reading you for at least 12 pages. (though I don't have my notes the precise time)

Hmm.

What did you see that changed from your initial impressions up to page 12?

Im guessing you mean in reference to Kairal. Their content stepped up. at page 5 (125 posts in) they had only really made a few one line statements and a series of tripple posts at the very tip. Post that point we had a lot of good discussion which helped me make my green read after. Posts like this one;

Sheeping discussion. Personally I've never really understood the concept. The whole reason I make arguments is in order to persuade people. I want them to go 'Oh that's a convincing argument that X is scum, so I'll vote for them too'. To me sheeping seems like successful persuasion. On the other hand last game scum did blatantly use my argument, everyone else called them out for it and lynched them. So it seems it is a scumtell. It's a weird thing that's for sure.

Anyway right now we have 2 votes on AJ (from Massive and Io) and I don't see any reasoning provided for either. Mind explaining? Personally I looked through his ISO and he looks fine to me. By which I mean he has a reasonable number of posts and doesn't seem afraid to create solid interactions with people, and is actively creating content. Now sure my reads are often poop as previously established but if you post persuasive arguments as to why he should be lynched maybe I'll vote him too :p.

As red you'd have no real reason to make people out to be less red for easily ML's So it makes sense to me that their Red.

The last line doesn't make any sense.
I don't understand how kairal is trying to make aj a less likely mislynch here all he's doing is asking people why there's votes on him; if anything that's opening the door for him to get more votes.

[culted]

kai/naomi/iami

Flubber is an obvious deadline lynch on town if I've ever seen one.

[culted]

@mod

I'm almost certain that vc is wrong.

What I'd like to do now is figure out exactly why there's so much resistance to a kai lynch.
And why everyone in the game is lock-scum on flubber.

[culted]

Finally took a good look at iami's iso.

It's repulsive.

[culted]

Her posts today have been giving me scum vibes but that town tell is pretty strong.

Checks out as a kai partner as well this is good.

[culted]

The goddamn entirety of kairal's gamesolving today has been.

"well gee, culted and flubber make sense as scum with massive, so I'll just vote whichever of them my whimsy tells me to vote every other page"

Which doesn't make sense considering kairal took massive's claim at face value and then continued to push that narrative while having zero reason to suspect flubber and i individually.

It's just scum trying to lynch whatever.

People need to look into iami. Specially that day 1.

[culted]

Still reading. I read everything so it's going to take me a while. Can we have one more person vote extension please? Massive? Flubber? Culted? Dierfire?

By the way, no comments on my mass-claim proposal? We're a day off from lylo so unless there's some part of site meta I don't understand, now

is

the optimal time for mass-claim.

I asked you a copuple pages back whta the order was and why you were feeding into the paranoia on massive that shit is gonna fuck us over. I'm vt.

[Kairal]

I'd be more inclined to take that seriously from someone who isn't voting me entirely based on OMGUS.

So why do I think you're scum? I've explained a few times but lets go through it. Firstly and most strongly it's just process of elimination. I have town reads on Dier, IamI and AJ. I'm willing to entertain the idea that massive is lying but for personally unless we get pretty strong evidence otherwise I'm inclined to take role claims at face value. Even if massive was lying he'd be very unlikely to clear a scum buddy so BV is town. That leaves 3 people of which you are one.

From here I decided to try and narrow it down by looking for patterns of interaction. Naomi is flinging a lot of shade at Flubber, whilst you are acting exactly like I would expect Flubber's scum partner to act. Moreover looking back through the game you frequently avoid interacting with Flubber despite the two of you having a pretty strong scum read on Jin. You never really provide a good explanation for that read either.

Then as I noted earlier you happen to make an argument that we should all be voting Newman whilst massive is the main wagon in town. The timing on this is exactly the timing I would expect from scum trying to divert a wagon on one of their buddies onto a townie.

None of this makes me certain you are scum. However your actions are consistent with scum motives and you've contributed very little to town.

[Kairal]

You know just rereading your ISO... the entirety of the first two days you never have a scum read who hasn't been confirmed town at this point. Never. It's all Io, Newman and Jin. We all have bad reads sometimes and none of us are coming out of this game looking good. Still I think it's particularly notable that you only ever scumread people that we now know are town. I don't think the same thing is true of any other people left alive.

[culted]

I'd be more inclined to take that seriously from someone who isn't voting me entirely based on OMGUS.

Saying that your take on the game is manufactured and convenient isn't omgus.

So why do I think you're scum? I've explained a few times but lets go through it. Firstly and most strongly it's just process of elimination. I have town reads on Dier, IamI and AJ. I'm willing to entertain the idea that massive is lying but for personally unless we get pretty strong evidence otherwise I'm inclined to take role claims at face value. Even if massive was lying he'd be very unlikely to clear a scum buddy so BV is town. That leaves 3 people of which you are one.

"PoE" isn't a reason to call someone scum. Ifthat's how you arrived at me as scum then it doesn't make sense to posit my posts as scummy without explaining what my scum motive would be. To be fair you've used some preflips in places (that still don't particularly make sense on top of that but w/e)

"I'm inclined to take role-claims at face value"
You don't role scum often do you? xDD

From here I decided to try and narrow it down by looking for patterns of interaction. Naomi is flinging a lot of shade at Flubber, whilst you are acting exactly like I would expect Flubber's scum partner to act. Moreover looking back through the game you frequently avoid interacting with Flubber despite the two of you having a pretty strong scum read on Jin. You never really provide a good explanation for that read either.

You're scum with naomi so it makes sense for you not to take the other angle here.

And I could also say you 'avoided' interaction with a good number of slots. But depending on what your reads were or if that slot was lurking I'm not just gonna check off another box and call you scum with it. Why doesn't it make sense to have more interaction with people who aren't on a similar wavelength?

And that's complete bullocks; Jin got lynched day 2 for a reason.

Then as I noted earlier you happen to make an argument that we should all be voting Newman whilst massive is the main wagon in town. The timing on this is exactly the timing I would expect from scum trying to divert a wagon on one of their buddies onto a townie.

And once again if you fine the argument fair...
...Begs the question why it stood out to you in the first place.

Are you town looking at just straight trajectory? Then why the undertone when you initially found it interesting of the thoughts being scummy?
Are you scum just trying to make your reads make sense? This I find more likely given your flail and repeated desire to stick to your guns.

None of this makes me certain you are scum. However your actions are consistent with scum motives and you've contributed very little to town.

Last line just hedges this entire post.

Why aren't people voting this?

[culted]

You know just rereading your ISO... the entirety of the first two days you never have a scum read who hasn't been confirmed town at this point. Never. It's all Io, Newman and Jin. We all have bad reads sometimes and none of us are coming out of this game looking good. Still I think it's particularly notable that you only ever scumread people that we now know are town. I don't think the same thing is true of any other people left alive.

It is true for everyone left alive.
Nobody knows who's reads have been better or worse: we haven't seen a scumflip yet.

[culted]

Kairal why do you think iami is town?

[Kairal]

If you can find a player I don't have interactions with I'd be curious to see it.

I picked up your defense of massive because I was specifically looking to see if anyone tried to swing the wagon away from massive when he had the most votes. Guess who did?

Jin got lynched because I noticed a pattern of votes between you and Flubber and decided to see if you were onto something or if you were scum colluding. Results suggest the latter

I'm hedging because I'm town and don't have access to everyone's alignment. I think you are the most likely player to be scum, but no I'm not certain. I don't have a smoking gun or anything.

I am however finding it hard to believe you are arguing in good faith and legitimately don't see where I've pointed out your scum motives. Repeatedly.