Micro 676: Bill Wurtz Mafia (Game Over)

[CommKnight]

VOTE: Transcend

Might as well make a quick claim and get some discussion started. By my count that is L2, so further votes would earn my immediate FOS.

[CommKnight]

Unvote

VOTE: CommKnight

Hmmm, interesting play. However there's a few problems that need an explanation.

• There is no explanation for your immediate switch. I assume you'll say because I joined some band wagon or that putting someone at L2 this early is "scummy". Both terrible reasons. Do not forget, you also voted for him, thus any unvote warrants that you randomly voted as a poor joke vote or to seem active in the first stage of the Day 1. I gave my reason for putting him at L2.
  
• By unvoting you take away someone from claiming and having real discussion happen for the rest of Day 1. Thus you are looking to stall such discussion. This is evident by your lack of reasoning when unvoting and voting me. You still haven't even said anything. But hey, let's try to look active.
  
• Mixing your lack of reasoning for either votes and your want for a delayed discussion, you have failed. For you are now being called out.

While I would've been happy for a claim from the first one, your behaviour dictates that you are stalling the game. Stalling is motivated only by scum. You like to make sure it's the last possible second before we have someone at L2 so town either is forced to no lynch or lynch an innocent townie.

Therefore, you have earned this.
UNVOTE: Transcend
VOTE: Implosion

There is little to no real leads Day Ones. But i am happy enough with my analysis of your behaviour to lock this vote in. It is not leaving without a claim.

[CommKnight]

VOTE: Transcend

Might as well make a quick claim and get some discussion started. By my count that is L2, so further votes would earn my immediate FOS.

what do you mean "make a quick claim", VOTE: Communist knight

Simple. A claim early on is good for town, it gives us plenty of time to discuss. However, one has already made his motives clear with no words spoken from his unvote. Do tell me if I'm wrong to assume not explaining a vote and unvote while also delaying discussion to be scum motivated. Correct?

Fastposted by Kain.

I have explained my reasoning quite clear. Even explained the why to your question. In the words of Samuel L. Jackson. "English Mofo, do you speak it?". I do not believe I explained anything in Mandarin.

[CommKnight]

This is the internet. This is a game. If your feelings are hurt by light banter, then I'm sure there's a safe place somewhere else. Not once have I called you a name, but look what you have already stooped to. I quoted a movie scene which is quite the comedy piece for those that enjoy his films and that scene. Also racism is defined as "prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.". If you can point me to where I have made such claims or discrimination, then do go ahead. Merely stating that I have explained things in the common tongue of those playing this particular game is not inherently racist. Now if I were to say I explained it in English which is a far superior language than plebian Mandarin, then I would be approaching the line of racism.

Now, shall we have civil banter or will more names be called?

Fastposted twice.

Is banter not allowed on this forum? I can be quite the gentlemanly baiter, although I will not call anyone "douchebags" or the likes.

Claims are always good to get, because they can be checked into. However, we got something far more valuable within page 1 of today. Not only has a fellow randomly voted with no reason as to why they initially placed the vote in the first place. They have also withdrawn said vote and voted another with zero reason given. I have assumed as to the reason they'd publicly state, although as to my analysis I believe that is their true purpose. In fact, it could be said we caught a scummy player off guard by possibly putting a mate at L2. A wagon he himself caused and that he'd say he voted said scum first when in fact it was an early vote in hopes that it would not reach L2 before he could do so. Thus, panic has come in and now he will use the same line every scum player uses when it comes to being picked apart like that.

Now, shall you give a reason as to why you ignored his unvote and vote with no words spoken? That is flying under the radar without chance of having someone pick apart your words, however, I have picked apart his actions.

[CommKnight]

This is a quick set-up game. No real specialties going on. It's safe to assume there's at least a cop and doctor active with possible other town PRs if we have 3 mafia. If there's 2 mafia it might be just them and a bunch of VT's.

If he were to fake claim cop or doctor for instance and the real cop finds the other scum, we could nail 2 scum by D3 for instance giving 2 nights for real cop to check two people and then the real cop/doc can counter claim them D2/D3.

Then you have behavioural analysis. FBI, RCMP and other federal police forces around the world have a branch that does this in real life to catch real killers. Now obviously there's much difference between that and this, but the subject is the same. If someone claims a role but is not acting in quite a way that that role would typically act, then they can be analyzed and called out upon it. By having zero claims D1, you have nothing to analyze, nothing to look for. Then there's the reaction to said claim. How do people treat the claim? Who believes it? Why? How do they treat the claimed person the next day?

Now that explains the why as to why I want a claim D1. It helps people begin critically thinking. If they claim a power role, they can be called out on it D2 or D3 if they lie about someone else's action. If they claim a VT then we still have a claim to analyze.

As to Implosion, you have seen my reasoning for switching to him. His actions have warranted a FOS. Which at this stage is sufficient for a vote and answers gotten. He has contributed nothing besides two votes and not even an explanation for either of them. Perhaps he hoped to skirt by without someone noticing that lack of contribution to the discussion even this early on.

[CommKnight]

Fast RVS = good RVS. Implosion, Kain, and Comm are all town.

I really don't like this post. It screams to buddying too much. He could be 100% correct, but how quick he is to just tick 3 people in a 9 player game off as town is a bit... off.

As I said, I'm comfortable with my earlier analysis. Implosion is definitely worth looking into at this point. Although there are people who have yet to contribute and we'll see what happens with them.

[CommKnight]

Parama and Transcend seem to have a problem with putting all their thoughts into one post. I can understand 2 posts together, but 5-7 in a row of 2-3 sentences? I'm sorry, but continue to say you won't read walls of text, I won't read pages of fluff posts that could've all been put into a single post and shortened the amount of pages so far.

Anyway, that's just a pet peeve of multi-posts. Onto some reads since others have become active. Cloud is quick to assume I'm a new player. New to this site, yes, other than treating days differently than other places, minds do not so easily change nor does the internal knowledge of being mafia change how people act across the game. Opportunistic votes are inherently scum tells. Switching a vote without explaining reasoning is something a scum easily slips up. Why bother explaining it right away? They just want town dead. Townies can make this mistake, but it is mostly overlooked by scum. It's a mentality pattern that you'll notice. Look at your own vote on me, you explained it out, whether right or wrong, you analyzed the situation in your own mind and came to a conclusion that you shared publicly. Reread page 1 and consider that Implosion never put much thought into the unvote and vote of myself. Once called out upon it, he is easily able to make something up.

Now I don't "permanently" scum read him, but I have said it's not moving until we get a claim.

To answer Morning Tweet, you're right for pointing out that mafia know the alignments (barring possibility for 3rd party interference). However, we're not looking to put everything on the table for them. We're looking for a piece of the puzzle to work with. Now, I'm not sure about you fellas, but a puzzle cannot be completed blind with no pieces set on the table. But with a piece given to us to work with for a day and night phase, we can feel out around the edges of that piece and build upon what the full picture may look like and our PRs can go into the night with something to work with.

Now, Syrana. This is a person of interest. I think everyone has contributed *something*. Syrana has yet to do so. I think his theme song is "We all live on the yellow SCUM-marine". FOS placed for sure. But as I've said, Implosions initial uncaring to give a reason for his unvote and vote is still on a higher standing for now. As to why anyone would town read him already is beyond me.

The only 2 people I town read are Kain and Cloud. Rest can easily fake their "reads" at this point.

[CommKnight]

Have you ever played an all-vanilla game, where there are no claims? Just curious.

I have once. Mafia slipped up and claimed a power role when it became evident there were none. As to this being the same as that. You'll never know unless you get some claims. You'll think a power role might be collecting information when in fact we have none if we leave roles completely to the unknown.

For balance reasons, I'm willing to place my bet on there being either 2 town PR's and a mafia PR or if it really is all VT, then there is definitely a 3rd party. As 2 mafia in a 7 VT vs 2 would be a bit unfair for them and 3 mafia vs 6 VT would be unfair to us. It's just at that number where a PR or 3rd party must be active to balance things out. Which in games with a Neutral 3rd party (one who can win with any) or who's win conditions do not stop town's win conditions, I do not mind aiding by the way. Town of Salem which people seem to keep pinning me to (even though it's only one medium I play on... hah... medium... curse...), people on there are rather... ignorant. For example, if we have a known executioner and their target is a useless role, I'm willing to sacrifice a useless role to gain a non-killable townie (they would've won so no reason to side with mafia and counts as a confirmed vote against them for LYLO). Even survivors, who can vest and when mixed with a transporter can create a movable shield for town. However, in RT mafia, most players are unable to think that critically and just see "not town" as inherently bad. For those who've played the game and know the Jester role, I've managed to help a Jester win while getting a mafia killed. Mafia were tricking town, but I whispered the Jester to kill a certain somebody if he guiltied him. Well, I managed to get mafia to guilty him and got 2 birds with one stone.

But enough about my views of 3rd party neutrals/using 3rd parties to counter Mafia. There's not even a confirmed 3rd party active in this game as of yet.

Back to Implosion. You view his unvote and vote as a discussion generation. However, if you can move past your projection unto him of your own alignment and motives and see that he did not explain why he added nothing to his unvote and vote. He claims it's to "generate healthy discussion" (after the fact), however, how can a healthy discussion be generated from nothing of substance in the vote? If I had not analyzed that lack of substance as scummy, there would've been no healthy discussion generated at all from it. Objectively speaking, everything seems to conveniently be explained well after the fact. But in that moment, he had not contributed anything. In fact if you isolate his username in the thread, you can see that between his first and second post, he said nothing at all. Then let's say it was his intention for the sake of seeing it from another light. He is still able to stay out of the main spot light unless someone (such as myself) begin picking on him constantly. Because there is nothing from him to arouse more eyes other than those looking closely at the posts themselves.

In your own words Cloud, I see you as a "misguided" townie. You cannot see how he has attempted to keep himself out of the center of attention through simple actions. Further ignoring it because it's page 1. Some of the earliest actions are better give aways than when someone has time to establish the vibe of the town for the match.

Fastposted by Kain 3 times.

Someone needs to take a chill pill and slow down. More people are town reading you than scum reading you currently. Also there we go again with assuming I'm a noob. Sure, I've been away from forum mafia for a year, but I'm in no way "new". In total, I have around 50 forum games under my belt with moderator experience of 6. None on this site mind you, but it's still experience.

Do not let the 'noobiness' of my methods fool you. It's been the bane of many mafia. (As for games where I played mafiaso, the stuff I can come up with is already messing with your heads as town, the stuff I come up with as mafia, well.. I once convinced town I was a Van Helsing type character chasing after a Werewolf and a Vampire. The Werewolf we knew was there because of night immunity, once he was lynched, the town was frantically searching for a vampire while I was an investigative immune mafia). Needless to say, the methods work as town, especially by the later days. If mafia are smart, they'll probably off me tonight or tomorrow night. It gets much more insane and dangerous for them the less players that are left in the game. Not only that, but as you've seen, already multiple people townread me, and regardless as to me being correct or incorrect at the current moment about my read, I become harder to lynch for them when they can't get the numbers to do so.

Now why am I explaining the above? Simple. WIFOM. Am I sweet or am I poisonous? Something they'll have to decide fairly quickly.

Fastposted 3 more times.

[CommKnight]

These are the others who seemed to be at least a little suspicious of you. I agree with their suspicions. I was being pretty liberal when I said everyone - it's definitely not everyone, but it is some people I am at least lightly townreading right now.

The three stated aren't exactly in good standing themselves. With my biggest suspicion on Implosion, Syryana's lack of contribution and Parama just isn't really readable as town yet by nearly anyone. So a little suspicion from them towards me isn't exactly all that much to side with.

[CommKnight]

Jsyk if you're obv towning in these walls of text, that's your fault

Still not reading any of them

Say less for God's sake, it's not hard to condense

Say more. This isn't RT mafia. You have room at actually articulate your thoughts. If you were pulling this in any RT game and I was a vig, you'd be shot tonight.

[quote="In post 181, Morning Tweet"

@Comm

What information do we gain from, say, a doctor revealing his role? What does this do to spur discussion?[/quote]

That would be worse case scenario. Which you'd have to WIFOM a possibility that there may be a lookout protecting doctor. The likelyhood would be low. But who knows?

As for posts lately, Parama's negativity towards my lock vote his null and voided by his vote and asking for hammer of the same person I'm scum reading. Implosion really hasn't improved his standing at all with me.

I know night may be upon us shortly. But at the moment, I think I'm pretty easy with the following reads:

Spoiler: Reads

Gamma - Inactive/Null
Implosion - Scum read
Kain - Town read
Morning Tweet - Beginning to lean towards scum, nothing solid, just a vibe.
Parama - Null
Stormcloud - Town read
Syrana - Null
Transcend - Null

I'm willing to bet at least one scum is in the Tweet, Implosion, Syrana trio. Which if I take Transcend's example of eliminating possible teams with my two town reads at the moment. I will also note that I do not think Syrana/Tweet are a duo.

Spoiler: Pairings

1. Implosion/Parama
   
2. Implosion/Transcend
   
3. Implosion/Tweet
   
4. Implosion/Syrana
   
5. Tweet/Parama
   
6. Tweet/Transcend
   
7. Syrana/Parama
   
8. Syrana/Transcend
   
9. +3 with Gamma with each.

I think Implosion's lynch would reveal quite a bit about how the current wagons and thoughts are going.

[CommKnight]

This is the weirdest tunnel I've ever seen honestly. CK, KT and Parama all seem to think I'm town that's just lying to them about another player...why exactly?
I mean I guess there's the rare world where I'm scum with implosion and town catches 2 scum for the price of one, but why on earth would scum hard defend their buddy on day 1?
If I was just VT and had no idea about implosion's alignment I have no reason to do this either - I'd probably hammer him happily in that situation. So it follows that I do know something and his entire wagon is just ignoring me entirely.

If you know something out it, refusing to out such info could lead to a lynch. However, since this is Day 1 there is only one role you CAN claim that would clear Implosion, which you have not claimed yet, so I'll wait until you do before I pull off.

Oh looky, you and Implosion finally claim!

UNVOTE: Implosion

Also Implosion, that "crumb". This isn't WWII, none of us are Alan Turing. Don't pretend we'd ever figure something like that out from that very very vague "crumb".

Can't wait for CK to make his once daily wall and then disappear again /s

Some people got this thing called a job. Plus school work, plus sleep plus somewhat of a social life and this isn't the only game I play that takes time. I'm not going to be clinging to this one forum for hours on end, not my fault you guys created over 10 pages in under 10 hours.

That being said, it generated a bunch new content to allow me to get a very strong town vibe from Transcend, his frustration feels like genuine townie frustration.

I really am not liking the fact Gamma is on V/LA for so long. If he's mafia that allows mafia to skirt below suspicion and when I'm looking for a team, there could be one half of the team not even here!!!

But that can't be helped so let's go through the list here. Because my method becomes much better when I can work with what's left. With Implosion and Storm off the table, that leaves 6 people. (2 of which being mafia at least which means 33% chance of hitting mafia from my point of view if we were to random lynch). [Note: Not going to lie, until the mason claim, I had suspected it was a possibility but then ignored it when I remembered I've never seen masons in any game with less than 12 players at least. So I would've lynched Implosion's ass if we didn't have a way to clear him D1. He was scummy as all hell.]

2. Gamma Emerald
4. KainTepes
5. Morning Tweet
6. Parama
8. Syryana
9. Transcend

With my town read coming from Transcend, he's off the list. My read on KT is deteriorating but not willing to lynch him nor Parama today. I have suspicions there, but not enough for a D1 lynch.

That leaves Gamma, Tweet and Syr. Gamma is V/LA so can't fairly lynch him and he can always be checked into tomorrow. It really is now coming down to Syr and Tweet. I don't feel Syr's posts have been genuine. But... nor do I follow others' town reads on Tweet. I want someone to explain to me why Tweet is town in their eyes. Barring ALL previous games they've had with her. She seems like she'll either be a useful town player or a very dangerous mafia player. Dangerous because no one is really scum reading her at the moment.

Also if you notice some jumps in logic in this post, it's because I was quoting and commenting as I read through the pages. I was right on my read on Storm but wrong on my Implosion read. Many people were wrong on their Implosion read, but I think if we're willing to keep the day going for a bit longer, we can maybe find out more.

Finally, was I wrong for wanting a claim D1? It outed two people, however, it definitely supplied plenty of reads worth of material. (Aside from Gamma's slot). If there's a doctor, now there's a chance masons can be protected as well. Or if there's a cop, there's 2 less people to check into. If you don't think that is worth it, then you might be thinking about it wrongly. We have more control with any other PRs existing now. As the scum pool is narrowed and there's confirmed town to protect. Heck, based on that WIFOM alone, the masons should be safe tonight unless mafia want to risk a no-death night.

[CommKnight]

Think about this possibility: If neither of you gained votes today, scum would take you out for not being suspicious. In fact, now by WIFOM, you are safer than ever and it creates a better chance for town to be productive by eliminating 2 people off the lynch pool for D1 and D2.

[CommKnight]

My Parama read is definitely sliding towards town over the past few pages. Also consistency. Storm has missed his explanation and his explanation of his explanation but I've seen them and they seem genuine to me at the moment.

So assuming my Parama and Transcend town reads are correct, Gamma being AFK and not comfortable lynching Kain today. It'd be between Tweet and Syrana. Which I kinda want to see more from Tweet. I don't mean just asking questions about OTHER people's reads, but expanding upon her current views at this moment. I think we do need something more from her and no one else seems to be willing to pressure for more.

VOTE: Tweet

I realize I won't have much support on this, but it's between you and Syr. Unless Syr is a bad mafia who got himself looking suspicious, I think you have a very real chance of being scum and if Gamma is also scum, that's the perfect way for you to get by without looking like you're avoiding any active players.

[CommKnight]

I realize I won't have much support on this, but it's between you and Syr.

If you know you won't have support and you know a single vote isn't going to provide much pressure, and your other scumread has an active wagon going on, why vote for Tweet?

I got a feeling if I go ahead and help lynch Syr, he's going to pop town. Also if we don't get Tweet to talk today, it might be too late tomorrow.

[CommKnight]

Or you can add your vote to mine and begin piling up the pressure.

This isn't about reads. This is about instinct. As in I scum read Syr and not 100% sure about Tweet, but know from past experiences that if I let Tweet slip through, then my luck will be that Syr will be town and Tweet be mafia and no one bothered to make Tweet talk enough D1 to get further reads on her upon flips today and tonight.

It's not that complicated to understand. I'll last minute lynch Syr, but until then, I want more out of Tweet and I'll push a wagon on her to L1 if I have to, to get more.

[CommKnight]

Or you can add your vote to mine and begin piling up the pressure.

This isn't about reads. This is about instinct. As in I scum read Syr and not 100% sure about Tweet, but know from past experiences that if I let Tweet slip through, then my luck will be that Syr will be town and Tweet be mafia and no one bothered to make Tweet talk enough D1 to get further reads on her upon flips today and tonight.

It's not that complicated to understand. I'll last minute lynch Syr, but until then, I want more out of Tweet and I'll push a wagon on her to L1 if I have to, to get more.

[CommKnight]

Not sure what happened but sorry for the double post, I only clicked submit once.

[CommKnight]

Just gotta convince Parama, Implosion and Syrana would be forced to out of self interest.

Fastposted by Syryana, speak of the devil.

[CommKnight]

Tweet's vote still being on Gamma is a little weird. It's been there like all game. He hasn't joined any of the major wagons. Not sure what that means though.

Possible scum trying to lay low. Look through Tweet's posts. There's very few posts that you can draw anything from because she isn't being forced to answer anything herself. Only ask questions. This is NAI. So ask yourself, why do you town read her so much? Is there any post she's made that pops out and says "town" to you?

[CommKnight]

UNVOTE: for now. Was surprised to come back to a replacement when all I wanted to do was add a bit of pressure and ask some reads as well as ask some pretty specific questions.

Gamma is suppose to come back tomorrow. So I hope to see something from him by Wednesday night!

[CommKnight]

I was really disliking Tweet for seeming disconnected but CloudKicker seems alright so far. I think it was just RL stuff getting to her, not scum lurking. Slot's basically null for me atm.

Agreed. I concur on the analysis of Kain as well. Early game seemed like townie to me but has since really drifted back to null/possible scummy behaviour for me.

So that leaves Syryana for today for me. The only one I seem confident enough to lynch now. However I'd like to take 3-4 days to get Gamma to speak up because we need something from that slot.

[CommKnight]

Honestly as much as I dislike the fact he V/LA'd pretty much the first real day of the game. That wasn't the kicker, it's been almost 24 hours since he posted on the forum and not a single word from him yet, that's what's bothering me.

But anyway, pending that,

Intention to vote Syr in 24 hours from now whether or not it's the hammer.

If Gamma doesn't post by then, tomorrow I'm straight up lynching that slot. If he's scum letting two flips go by without ability to read that slot would give it unfair advantage if it is scum.

[CommKnight]

What if you die in the night and aren't alive to lynch Gamma?

Then I suppose someone else can push it.

[CommKnight]

Extending my vote cast for 1-2 days, pending on how much content Golden posts.

[CommKnight]

VOTE: Syryana

All slots have spoken enough for reads, now it's time to hammer the scummiest guy we've found.

[CommKnight]

Sorry, read it before work but didn't have time to post before having to go.

I was pretty certain Syr was scum and Transcend, why are you voting for Rob? He's the ONE guy who isn't confirmed who didn't vote to lynch Syr. What do you think of Parama and Kain? Or even Cloud at this point?

[CommKnight]

Golden and Kain both have yet to post. No one seems to be making anything of the flip.

[CommKnight]

And I WILL VOTE: Kain

Time to light a fire under your ass.

[CommKnight]

Honestly ISO Kain's posts. When the hell has he done any scum hunting last?

[CommKnight]

on top of robster's shit show of a day d1, i voted robster and not a single vote followed. there was resistance everywhere. when i voted syryana yesterday, everyone followed that vote like a bunch of ladies to a boot clearance. robster would be the absolute easiest mislynch if he were town imo.

You actually have a point. I mean it's been a quiet day, not even StormCloud has really returned. (By the way, when I asked on Cloud, I meant CloudKicker).

UNVOTE: for now.

I'm still town-reading Transcend so as far as I'm concerned, we got at least 3 townies doing hunting if StormCloud comes back.

I'll do up a bigger post tonight once I'm out of class. But I'm gonna light a fire under some asses. Because this Day 2 is ridiculous.

[CommKnight]

Kain can you explain me your read on com please, you didnt answer

His read? Lol. It was an OMGUS vote for me voting him. He has no case.

[CommKnight]

[5] Syryana (Transcend, KainTepes, CloudKicker, CommKnight, Parama)

[2] KainTepes (Stormcloud, Syryana)
[1] Transcend (Golden Robster)

[1] Not Voting (implosion)

I really hope you're joking Transcend. Because there's only 2 people who weren't on Syr, Storm and Golden. Storm is town, we know that and we know there is at least 2 mafia. Which means it is impossible for Syr's entire wagon to be town.

The wagon on Kain was gaining support too easily. I'm still under the impression Transcend is town. I need to ISO Kicker, Parama and Golden. But I'm getting the growing feeling that Kicker and Golden might be the two we're looking for because I town-lean on Parama as well with Storm being clear and Kain being that guy that's a bumbling fool but the wagon on him grew too fast to be a scum-lynch.

[CommKnight]

Mostly the reason he changed on Transcend and how he acted afterward. I hated his early D1 play but that might just be nothing to really go on.

Pretty much everyone was piling on Kain until it was noticed no real resistance to the wagon was given by anyone.

So in my opinion a Kicker-AJ team is highly likely. There's always the slim chance one is town and another scum is actually in Transcend-Parama-Kain, but for now I'd say at least ONE scum is between Kicker and AJ. Just having trouble with sorting which one is the better choice today.

If we can get the scum from the two, then we can look at past interactions from other players on that slot. Honestly AJ's slot (which was the Golden/Gamma slot) feels like the most likely to flip scum. Golden and AJ barely put in any effort and Gamma didn't post even when he returned, buying his slot more time.

Is there a case against Parama that you can make Storm? If not, then I think Kicker-AJ are the best two to look at today.

Fastposted by Transcend.

Yes, but you said it like there was a chance it was a full town wagon on Syr. From ANYBODY's POV.

[CommKnight]

Well we seem to have a 4-way consensus here then. With Storm, Trans, Para and me all agreeing the others are town.

Sadly I once considered Storm could be mafia, but the mod said it wasn't a bastard set-up. I've had games where one mason is town and one is mafia. It's too much of a bastard set-up though without cops and other roles to counter such a set-up.

So we're left with a Kain, AJ and Kicker pool. Care to explain why Kicker is town to you Storm?

[CommKnight]

Honestly on reread, besides Kain, no one is really touching Kicker.

VOTE: CloudKicker

This is the only person I'm comfortable with lynching since Implo thought AJ might be easy mislynch and Kain makes sense as an easy mislynch and yet everyone else is town-lean. So going for the one out based on process of elimination and no one going after him hardcore really at all.

[CommKnight]

So Kicker, in mind that there's 2 scum alive right now, do you really believe both scum to be in Kain and Trans?

[CommKnight]

Aj it's fine to do a silent reread but you still have to actually provide content

Especially on a day that is pretty quiet. You had plenty of time to reread by now.

I liked Kain's early D1 as well, but yes, he has changed lately. Which seems to make him easier to mislynch and the other slot because of the lack of content from it.

Kicker's slot is Tweet remember. As I said before, Tweet could be dangerous D2 as scum.

[CommKnight]

Ha, if only it were that easy Parama. Unfortunately the scum is more than likely in the Kain, Kicker, AJ slots. Well, at least one of them, the second one may be Parama or Trans, but I don't really SR them atm.

So my question is, out of those three, who do you think is most likely scum? Ignoring site flaking bias.

[CommKnight]

It's fine, but my lynch ain't happening so you're gonna have to go with my reads because everyone else reads me as town.

So the question is again, out of those three, who would you say scum is?

[CommKnight]

ok so i think SYRANA is the scum for sure,,

Alisae replaces KainTepes

ROFLMFAO. I don't think he got the memo.

Now then, ISO Gamma, Golden Robster and AJ, then you'll understand why people want him dead. Some of us think that's an easy mislynch.

Parama's early game was scummy, but he's fallen to the town side, with Kain (you) starting town, but lately has become an easy mislynch scapegoat.

Stormcloud is town. Plain and simple.

Transcend was null in the beginning but as leaned town since the end of D1.

CloudKicker is likely scum, I'm on him but there seems to be little support which further adds to the likelyhood he's scum. Storm is too unsure, his buddy is easily hiding in the ones who don't want to lynch him, AJ and CloudKicker are avoiding voting at the moment.

Now if you want to lynch CloudKicker, how about you help me convince Parama, Transcend and Storm to get off their arse and lynch a scummy today.

[CommKnight]

The slot was replaced twice. Basically the entire first day was Gamma site flaking after V/LA was up Golden came in and was next to useless. Now we have AJ whom has contributed very little as well. So that slot has been completely unreadable in times that it should've been active. Because of this, it's an easy mislynch of townie quitting/not caring and being targeted by scum as easy lynch-bait.

I'm not going to fill in anything else for you, because we need more out of Kain's slot. His last few posts have been rather... nonsense.

[CommKnight]

And ywall haven't thought about giving AJ more time because?

You haven't bothered to fully read what I said because?

[CommKnight]

@Storm, tell me your opinion on this thought. Because we need a consensus if we're going to work this out.

It looks like there's two camps. Transcend and Parama in one and Alisae and AJ in another with CloudKicker kinda on the outlier aside from Parama TR'ing him.

Now, Alisae has a point, Syr did become a counter wagon for a day that was coming to an end. Does that necessarily make Transcend scum by itself? No.

[CommKnight]

@Storm what's wrong with a Kicker lynch? Everyone else seems to be trying to get you to lynch AJ which I'm pretty sure is a mislynch. Both Alisae and I are voting Kicker. If you town read both of us at least you aren't being sent astray by possible mafia target wagon.

I can almost guarantee AJ is a mislynch at this point. If I were scum, I'd be pushing on that slot hard as hell right now too because let's face it, nothing from that slot has been good. It's too easy of a mislynch for mafia not to push it.

[CommKnight]

UNVOTE: CloudKicker
VOTE: AJ

I tried to reason he was just an easy lynch by scum, but I town read Transcend and AJ's actions lately have been inexcusable. Where have been your cases made AJ? Pretty much everyone else has made some sort of case that wasn't purely on gut reads. But you? You've done sheep all. Even CloudKicker has contributed more.

No more excuses, you've made zero cases and sheeped someone on a vote then had the audacity to claim you thought it all along.

[CommKnight]

He had all the time before Alisae came in to push anything... and not sure about you but 1110 absolutely screams scum to me. The second sentence of that "I don't vote until I'm confident nothing's going to go wrong with my vote".

I'm reading that as "I don't vote until I'm confident the pressure is off me and I am free to help push a mislynch without looking scummy as a wolf in sheep's clothing."

I don't care if you sheep other games Alisae. This is here and now where AJ had plenty of time to push a Transcend vote and sheeps the new replacement for a rather neutral townie slot.

[CommKnight]

Storm, don't you think it's odd that the AJ wagon was suddenly created out of thin air?

Describe thin air in this context please. Because I was reluctant to vote him and was against is prior and Storm is confirmed town. This has been going on for a while now. It didn't just magically appear overnight and 2 votes + the very person you're asking about a wagon is a poor question to begin with. Unless you assume 2 votes spaced 2-3 real life days apart as a wagon on one person before Storm voted?

I think scum is Parama and Trans.

I keep toying with this idea in my head. Neither started out good, but I liked their late D1 play and so far their play D2.

Also AJ, what you said, it's how I'm viewing the game too. As well as 3 other townies. They know they're town, they know Storm is town and they know 2 of the 5 unknowns are mafia. All trying to TR at least one to 50/50 it. Which is why I'm sticking to my TR on Transcend. Gotta TR someone in the unknown, gotta put that trust in at least somebody.

Back to my thoughts on Transcend-Parama scum team that Alisae seems to think. I'd agree dependent on certain circumstances, but they aren't really playing together and not like Parama has any love for Transcend.

[CommKnight]

Votecount 1.11

[4] Transcend (Gamma Emerald, implosion, Parama, Stormcloud)
[1] implosion (CommKnight)
[1] Gamma Emerald (Morning Tweet)
[1] Syryana (Transcend)

[2] Not Voting (KainTepes, Syryana)

With 9 alive, it is 5 to lynch.

Let me know if you see any problems.

Deadline is in (expired on 2017-01-24 22:00:00)

I do believe this one was just before the masons outed (since I'm still on Implosion at this one). Parama didn't have any love for Transcend when putting him at L2 followed by Storm, a confirmed townie putting him at L1.

If we were to go from this one, either I, Kain or Morning Tweet would have to be Transcend's scum buddy if he were scum. But since I don't think he's scum, this is not telling, but should at least tell you the Parama/Transcend team is probably not likely.

Fastposterd by Alisae: Read above. I don't think Parama/Transcend team exists tbh.

[CommKnight]

Alright, amuse me here Alisae, let's say for a moment Parama/Transcend team is false. There has to be a 3rd person you're kinda iffy about. That 3rd person that you're thinking "Yeah, they could be town, but there's some bad vibes coming from that slot."

[CommKnight]

The phrase is:

[CommKnight]

Hmm..
I think scum is in {Cloudie, Trans, Parama}
Cloudie was the last townie listed in my PoE that I was iffy about.

Cloudie I'd likely put in scum pile as likely as well.

I'd say {Parama, Cloudie, AJ} atm with scummiest read on the right.

[CommKnight]

btw for those who don't know it's lylo.

Massclaim?

VT and I honestly doubt there's any town PRs in the game. I think the Masons were it. Which makes it 2 vanilla mafiaso we're against.

I should've went with my initial read on AJ's slot as an easy mislynch but he acted sooo bad in the last few pages before his lynch.

[CommKnight]

I'm going with my gut this time, last time it said AJ was easy mislynch and it still says Alisae would be too easy as well. So going to hard TR him for the rest of the day.

Transcend TR has deteriorated based on flips and wagons. But something is warning me at the back of my head that it could've been set up that way to make him look like the scum being counter-wagoned twice.

Parama's slot was on both town flips as well as mine and Transcend's but Parama's early gameplay was scummy, it was only his late D1 and D2 that didn't make me push that slot as scum. So possible there.

Also CloudKicker... I feel like it could be Parama and CloudKicker slots together. But out of respect for StormCloud I think my SR today will land on Parama's slot.

[CommKnight]

Transcend?

I've been up for nearly 15 hours straight. I am going to get to this tomorrow.

UNVOTE: Cloud

To prevent quick hammer. I will, however, say that I think it speaks volumes that he was not quick hammered.

My thoughts exactly. If you were voting town as town, that would've been quickhammered since both Alisae and Transcend were active. However, there is one alternative, scum throwing the other under the bus since there's no cop or doc to earn town cred for tomorrow's LYLO.

Or even to throw people off the scent.

Either way, that was ballsy enough move and produced good results that at least either you or Kicker is mafia. With how close Kicker and Transcend were just posting buddy-buddy. I'm going to VOTE: CloudKicker

And I can do so safely, because we just watched it, he wasn't quick-hammered like he would've been if he were town.

[CommKnight]

They had plenty of opportunity to lynch you if you were town.

[CommKnight]

@TB, why are you asking for a Doctor claim? Any particular reason?

[CommKnight]

Well I can promise there is no doc. You didn't claim it, Trans didn't claim it, Ali claimed VT and so did I. This set-up is 2 mafia goons, 2 masons and rest are VT.

But still, scum fucked up. I'm pretty much town read by everyone and I helped lead a lynch on his buddy.

TB would only be scum if he bussed for Town cred. On a day that wasn't clear that'd be a stupid move, so I think TB is legit town.

But it comes to Alisae and Trans. Trans I'd argue could be made to look bad by a smart scum and Alisae probably thinks they could cause doubt in me (if he is scum).

Either way, I was pretty sure I'd end up in the dead talk thread by the end of the night, surprised I'm not to be honest. But that's their fault. Now they got 3 town looking for him instead of just needing to trick one. They have to cause TWO town to mislynch instead of one. Which gives us the advantage.

Stupid move scum, stupid move.

[CommKnight]

But... nor do I follow others' town reads on Tweet. I want someone to explain to me why Tweet is town in their eyes. Barring ALL previous games they've had with her. She seems like she'll either be a useful town player or a very dangerous mafia player. Dangerous because no one is really scum reading her at the moment..

LOL, that moment when you were right D1 and no one listened to me gut. Guess an ISO of Tweet and CloudKicker is needed to see who they were pushing early on and who they kinda avoided drawing attention to.

[CommKnight]

You learn nothing. But when I stay alive, I can tell you Alisae is town based on ISO of Morning Tweet and CloudKicker towards Kain.

Now then, VOTE: Transcend

Only 2 possibilities.
* Transcend scum and tried real hard yesterday to protect his buddy but ultimately failed.
* TB played good and bussed his buddy knowing no one could blitz and earning town cred.

But based on ISO's I think Transcend is scum and he was the leading lynch for two days that he technically should've died much earlier.

So, Alisae, up to you to hammer.

Fastposted by Alisae, guess I get the hammer for once. GG either way this goes. (By the way, I am legit town, so this might be a town win!)

[CommKnight]

Now that it's dusk, everyone out your real alignment, no need to hide it now!

[CommKnight]

Haha, I should have went with a few of my initial gut reads and stuck to them.

Glad I didn't fuck up either LYLOs

[CommKnight]

@Mod Link to dead chat?

[CommKnight]

tho tbh you didn't really do anything it was moreso Trans suspecting you.
pedit: Comm you'll learn overtime. Not only do you have to correctly sort people, you have to convince others that you're right.

Eh, winning the game is one thing, I enjoy being able to sort people before the game ends. It's like a puzzle. The conclusion is meh, but trying to sort all the pieces out first is the fun part of the challenge.

Also StormCloud, guess we surprised you with 2 right lynches in a row eh?

[CommKnight]

Not gonna lie, it's Parama's slot that I was kinda feeling iffy about, otherwise Trans would've been obvious a bit earlier for me. Like it was one of the two but I couldn't sort them out until TB came in and pulled some ballsy moves.

[CommKnight]

I need to start keeping notes again. I skim through some posts because they're fluff and it's like, nah, this isn't even worthy enough to finish reading. XD

[CommKnight]

TB wasn't my "biggest" SR. I simply said Parama I had a hard time sorting between you and him. I was feeling Kicker was scum for a long time. But no one else would push on him and kept saying they townread him.

[CommKnight]

I also think killing StormCloud was a mistake. Should've offed me and then someone else as well. Just because I think StormCloud could've been easier manipulated at LYLO than the remaining town you left alive.