Newbie 1769: Happy New Year! (Post-Game)

[Raskolnikov]

If I wasn't outted I'd be calling for thinkbig to be lynched right about now so the game could just move on already. Not even that sure on him but a slot like that has to die, if town should've replaced out ages ago.

But as is I guess holding steady until near-deadline and hoping things clear up by then is the only option.

[-Grey-]

I'm not scumreading Casserole, is just that this game is feeling way too easy and I find it highly unlikely that we have the entire scumteam narrowed down to 3-4 players on d1.

That's a lot of townreads.

[Shade]

@mod I'm asking to replace out

I'm really sorry everyone but I just can't keep up with this pace of game. I know its my bad that I can't and its not fair to you who wants to play the game with more active players so I decided to replace out.

I might try this game again when my current project finishes or in next summer.

Thanks for the game though! This was fun.

Good luck everyone!

[schadd_]

schadd_ began slightly defensive but cleared himself after he realized i wasnt just trying to smash him flat -- i genuinely wanted to be convinced

what happened to that?

re actilurking: uh, i would say that i'm actually just doing the regular kind of lurking. i'm def. reading the thread, but for the last 6 pages i kinda wanted to let grey & cass argue, which has been fun.

readlist concerns are probably valid.

town
creature - dead horse (but watch it be a GBT-creature scumteam)

rask - claimed tracker and hasn't been counterclaimed. plus, tracker is a kind of difficult fakeclaim i think. forgetting this, though, i would put him at null-kinda-kinda-town. claim matches this one (again, needs a login; to quote: "Fuck this. I am the tracker. Move your vote now." the dude was the tracker.) he's also taken the same attitude as me about cass & grey arguing, which is biased. has been emoting a lot, which gets harder to do while seeming consistent, which he has as far as i can find. giving me a full newbie clear in 518 is odd considering his attitude in 563 (and i don't think i should be easy to read)

nulltown
shade - really nothing sticks out to me in a bad way. last time i commented about him i was worried about feigned newbiness, but there has been a steady growth in, e.g., use of the lingo and stuff that makes that seem more difficult to do. not impossible, though. he has also not been that big on reads; i certainly wasn't D1 of my first game but he has been calling out individual posts a lot; this is easier to do as scum than broad reads of a person i think. this isn't very strong, though, and there's def. some amount of scumhunting

null
GBT - well, dipped off a bit in terms of posting, which sorta kills my town-from-posting-a-lot read. 695 seems a bit of a convenient piece of emotionsing, considering such. my prevailing opinion about them now is that they shouldn't be readable D1.

mbg - there's a lot of stuff that reads as newbscum that is afraid of D2. town always has the reassuring knowledge that they're town, and any votes that they do are ultimately justified. as well, as a newbie, i was generally excited to try my hand at scumhunting and wasn't really worried about my reasoning being dumb. i'm not a fan of mbg's hesitance with voting and, recently, tendency to discredit his reads. i'm not sure how his confident reads at the start of the day fit in to this narrative. this all aside, he's been really transparent with his reasoning, and more so as the game progressed.

nullscum, not ordered
cass - wowowow, schadd. she went up to nullscum once she voted you, jeez. but yeah, not a fan. i think that she has gone back and forth on everyone at this point, maybe except shade. she is very talented in the art of choosing a person and cooking up a bunch of scum narratives and slips and whatever. it gets hard to townread that after a while, and it gets less useful as the days progress at the very least.

greyreen - more of a read on gayreen than -grey-, still. there ofc isn't more to say about gayreen since 738. grey is definitely angry, which i think you get good at feigning if you play F2F, but who knows. pointing things out before reading all the way is kinda towny, but i would think he knows that. there's a lot of rhetorical/unanswerable questions which gives me a yucky impression (see 534, 609, 801, 838). it's kinda hard for me to divorce scum from mean and abrasive, so this is more difficult.

tb - still waiting on the readlist, winky face

[-Grey-]

grey is definitely angry, which i think you get good at feigning if you play F2F, but who knows. pointing things out before reading all the way is kinda towny, but i would think he knows that. there's a lot of rhetorical/unanswerable questions which gives me a yucky impression (see 534, 609, 801, 838). it's kinda hard for me to divorce scum from mean and abrasive, so this is more difficult.

Those questions are neither rhetorical nor unanswerable. They are pointed. They put the recipient on the spot for a reason.

Scumreading somebody simply because they're not sunshine and rainbows is ignorant. Abrasive play gets more genuine responses than being Mr. Rogers.

[cassielle]

cleared my original concerns, yes. there are new ones,and some old ones, and my concerns arguably should have been addressed better by you originally.

did you see 876? it's a very good read. from the time i entered the game this has been a concern and it keeps going that way. you keep dodging scrutiny. may or may not be related, but lets live on the edge and just flatly claim that it is, unsupported by evidence.

and you sure are hyperdefensive. vote for you = scum instantly? why? why is scumreading you scummy? and where is your scumhunting behavior? scumhunting is natural to town even if it gets pointed the wrong way once in awhile

why is your vote the same exact vote as post #7? why has that not moved? its safe to say the wagon has stalled, in fact, on multiple separate occasions. do you really believe in that vote that much? do you truly have that much conviction in it? where do you get that conviction from a 23 post ISO which is devoid of content?

why is this second readslist substantially identical to the first aside from "gbT went inactive" "shade is uh something lets call it nulltown" "i actually have an opinion on cass and its mostly because she voted me and tries to aggressively scumhunt"? why would gbT taking a day or two off (because thats all its been, really) instantly drop them to null? why does it seem like you cant form an actual opinion on shade and so you just throw that slot in nulltown? indeed, from your description, why not just null? why are all your reads weak and without conviction?

how the hell are 801 and 838 unanswerable or rhetorical? mbg managed to answer 838, which is the exact opposite of that, and -grey- has pursued and asked followup questions to all of your examples. er, except 801. because, well, you havent even tried to answer it to begin with, just thrown your hands up and said "impossible! must be rhetorical." why dont you want to answer?

[-Grey-]

@cassielle - 869 whenever you have a moment, please.

[cassielle]

like i originally stated, your post that was about creature was just totally incomprehensible to me -- no quote, no link to post, and it didnt seem to connect to anything in particular. that was less misrepresentation, less misinterpretation, and more "i dont even know what the hell this is can someone identify this species" outright confusion. i still do not know what that post means, how to parse it, anything. its impenetrable to me.

intention was JUST to get you to point out wtf you were talking about lol because i couldnt identify it.

[-Grey-]

Sometimes it's not pro-town to be transparent on the reason behind a read.

Questioning someone that has an "out of the blue" concrete read that is intentionally being vague about the source of the read looks like scum more than town.

[mattblackguy]

VOTE: ThinkBig

L-1

I gave think the benefit of the doubt at first thinking his irl issues was the cause of his inactivity, but seeing how he's still active in other games that's just bullshit. He's not contributing, and it's clear that he will never contribute. I'm tired of him stalling for time.

[Aeronaut]

- VoteCount 1.14 -
With 9 players still alive, it's 5 to lynch!

[L-5] mattblackguy -
[L-5] -Grey- -
[L-2] schadd - -Grey-, Cassielle, Creature
[L-5] Shade -
[L-5] Raskolnikov -
[L-1] ThinkBig - schadd_, gigabyteTroubadour, Raskolnikov, mattblackguy
[L-5] gigabyteTroubadour -
[L-5] Creature -
[L-5] Cassielle -

Not Voting - Shade, ThinkBig

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2017-01-18 20:00:00)

[Aeronaut]

Replacing Shade.

[cassielle]

it wasnt the read itself (which was later anyway) its that that post didnt seem like a read. it seemed sorta like casting shade or a fluffpost (and still does even from a null or townread perspective -- meaning it stands out in your ISO). your words were "If I saw what I thought I saw IRT Creature, that was really, really stupid." you could have been talking about something creature did/said, about someone having something to do with creature (some weird post??? idk), ANYTHING -- i dont have any idea what that post is about. at all.

that wasnt me misrepresenting you because from where im at theres nothing to represent, its just this critical post referring to anything or nothing and i have no clue what it could refer to beyond roughly a quarter of the posts in thread from a wide variety of players -- which doesnt help anyone narrow it down by now

p-edit: i have long noticed tb has been active in every game but this one, yes, but i dont want to risk talking about active games so ive put it off. i do encourage everyone to go have a look at the players recent posts tho, because yeah, he needs to replace tf out or contribute and instead hes coasting by promising content that will never come because it doesnt exist

suspicious

but i like schadd_ more for this by far.

[ThinkBig]

Once again, I do apologize for my inactivity and will be active tonight.

My biggest problem in games is that I tend to not know how to respond or continue when I"m widely scum read and when I have a huge wagon against me. I tend to lurk and fall back so I don't make more mistakes.

[-Grey-]

i dont have any idea what that post is about. at all.

You're not meant to.

That remark was meant more for Creature than anyone else.

[ThinkBig]

VOTE: schadd_

L-1

I'll explain this vote and my reads later tonight.

[-Grey-]

Dueling L-1's.

Dammit Shade why did you have to ditch us?!

[-Grey-]

I like the wagon makeup of schadd better.

I'm staying put.

[cassielle]

thats fair, but i had no way of knowing /that/ either. i had no way of knowing anything about it

again, thats your point, but i then have to say like, well, i dont feel like thats fair to jump in and call that misrepresentation. you explicitly withheld any information by which i could judge the post, and thats fine and good, but then i have to guess when i am trying to interpret it and the whole imperfect knowledge, etc.

not meant to try and interpret it? cool, but i cannot know that unless you tell me that and im scumhunting, im gonna try to assign interpretations and motivations to EVERYTHING

the whole thing ends up with me basically saying

if you want to say that is misrepresentative, tell me how i could have drawn /any/ conclusions about that post /at all/ -- and i do mean /any/ conclusions, short of "you know how to type" or "you are proficient in the english language" -- and i will accept that i misrepresented you outright without further explanation from your side.

p-edit:
curiouser and curiouser

but i agree, the schadd_ wagon feels like its going places

[schadd_]

grey is definitely angry, which i think you get good at feigning if you play F2F, but who knows. pointing things out before reading all the way is kinda towny, but i would think he knows that. there's a lot of rhetorical/unanswerable questions which gives me a yucky impression (see 534, 609, 801, 838). it's kinda hard for me to divorce scum from mean and abrasive, so this is more difficult.

Those questions are neither rhetorical nor unanswerable. They are pointed. They put the recipient on the spot for a reason.

mm. the one that stuck out to me was, perhaps intuitively, the one that you asked me. 801, "schadd_, why does your ISO read like coasting scum?" and obviously, i mean, i don't really see it, because i'm town. me being able to answer this pulls counter to the sentiment of 842 (though this may have been a rhetorical question, heh). so, it feels like you're just fishing for me to not be able to answer your question.

Scumreading somebody simply because they're not sunshine and rainbows is ignorant. Abrasive play gets more genuine responses than being Mr. Rogers.

yes, and wouldn't it be sunshine and rainbows if that was the basis for my read of you

[schadd_]

doing 880 later

[cassielle]

there are ways of answering questions that dont have direct, up-front answers. mbg gives a primer in 840

[-Grey-]

if you want to say that is misrepresentative, tell me how i could have drawn /any/ conclusions about that post /at all/ -- and i do mean /any/ conclusions, short of "you know how to type" or "you are proficient in the english language" -- and i will accept that i misrepresented you outright without further explanation from your side.

Just as a word of advice, if a rock solid townread appears out of thin air and stays there, it's best not to dwell too much on such comments.

Even now, we're dancing around anti-town territory discussing this much, but it's more of a learning thing than an optimal play thing.

[cassielle]

fair enough. generally i dont question that much, i just didnt understand that post at all. but ill drop it.

interesting that schadd_ handles your post but then sees mine and says "nope, do it later." hes at l-1, that seems to me like a very poor move.

[-Grey-]

grey is definitely angry, which i think you get good at feigning if you play F2F, but who knows. pointing things out before reading all the way is kinda towny, but i would think he knows that. there's a lot of rhetorical/unanswerable questions which gives me a yucky impression (see 534, 609, 801, 838). it's kinda hard for me to divorce scum from mean and abrasive, so this is more difficult.

Those questions are neither rhetorical nor unanswerable. They are pointed. They put the recipient on the spot for a reason.

mm. the one that stuck out to me was, perhaps intuitively, the one that you asked me. 801, "schadd_, why does your ISO read like coasting scum?" and obviously, i mean, i don't really see it, because i'm town. me being able to answer this pulls counter to the sentiment of 842 (though this may have been a rhetorical question, heh). so, it feels like you're just fishing for me to not be able to answer your question.

I'm fishing for you to justify your play, which you aren't even trying to do.

Attempting to redirect my question as a reason to scumread me isn't going to make me go away.