Large Normal 201 - House of Harmony - At The End(GAME OVER)

[Manuel87]

VOTE: Gamma Emerald
Its not a game without me voting Gamma.

@Transcend: No selfvoting and no quitting this time if you are town! (if you are scum you can selfvote if you want)

Havent played any Multiball games yet so i got a small question.
Mafia is confirmed but what can the other faction be?
I know SK and wolves. Is there some other possibility?

[Manuel87]

Sorry Manny the stupidity of people really just gets to me and i just give up so i don't have to deal with their stupidity. Lately I've been less of a lynchbait tho.

Never surrender to stupidity.

Based on flavour I'd guess black and white. I Syed fire and ice mafia and the factions were fire and ice.

Oh so 2 different Mafia teams is also a possibility. Well makes sense as SK would probably have it really hard with that many players.
And the 3 faction thing is not possible in normal? I think along the lines of Mafia, Mafia, SK

[Manuel87]

omfg I didn't see this guy in the playerlist.
Did you vote me in 1830?

Just checked wasnt sure myself but yes i voted you.

Beeboy's fire and ice: 13 players 9/2/2
Wakes massive ass role madness: 42 players (wtf) 29/6/6/1
Kmds jungle republic: 12 players 7/3/2

@Trans: Except for the last one i think the balance was ok.
My guess for this game is 12/3/3 i think it fits the balance of Fire&Ice and Massive role madness.
Would you say thats about right?

Why is Gamma so high and Alisae so low in your reads? I think he has a valid point about town!Gamma not spamming like that.

[Manuel87]

Manuel87

- Manuel refers to me as town here. I'm not sure if he townreads me here or if he just doesn't want me to play stupid this time. Regardless part of me thinks he might have read the game and didn't offer any content. He's a weak scumread for now until he responds to this.

I would say i hope you are town and i dont want you to play stupid so we can win because i think you are really good but i have yet to play a game with you were you dont give up.
Regarding the no content thing i disagree. I actually tried to get the game out of this stupid shitpostingstorm by asking a serious question.

[Manuel87]

I know SK and wolves. Is there some other possibility?

Is this the question you were talking about?

Well there is some part missing but yes thats basically the question.

[Manuel87]

Ughh, I don't like how you try to compliment Trans and think this is gonna get you off his SRs

I actually thought about saying something else because ppl could view it as AtE but seeing who tries to throw shade at me for stating my honest opinion gives me more information so thanks for that.
Oh and i dont know how much selfesteem you have but personally i wouldnt compliment someone if i didnt mean it just to win a mafiagame.
VOTE: Pepchoninga

[Manuel87]

To expand-

My initial post about pepcho (449) I lay out two things.

1. Pepcho's shade throwing looks scumy
2. I didnt disagree with one point (about manuel) he made.

I'd expect town to focus on point 2. It's possibly a shared scumread between us. If pepcho was at all interested in lynching Manuel and not just saving his own skin he push harder there.

Instead he focused on how I had fine reasons to scumread him. This implies to me he was more focused on getting me to townread him than to further the Manuel lead.

I don't care about pushing anybody atm. If I was sure, you would more then likely see me tunnel the guy.

Hoh i wonder what exactly you would tunnel me for.

[Manuel87]

I just love how you are actively trying to discredit me.

You discredit yourself by saying you play from a neutral PoV.
That is antitown even if you are town its still just that.
Basically what you are saying is "i always play antitown so when i am scum i cant get called out for it".
Same thing about the lynchbaitstatement. You say you always get used as lynchbait. So why are you fine with being lynchbait?

This is where i am at right now.
Scum:
gerryoat, Gamma Emerald, Pepchoninga
Town:
drealmerz7, Transcend, Alisae, kuror0, PeregrineV, Ramcius

[Manuel87]

gerryoat is town

Show me one post in his Iso that should convice me he is town.

[Manuel87]

gerryoat is town

Show me one post in his Iso that should convice me he is town.

Show me one post thst should convince us that Ram is town den.

I am not trying to convince you he is town.
But if you want you can look at his whole exchange with you. Thats what my townread is mainly based on.

How about instead, you give your case on me. Town would do that and not just say you SR me.

Spoiler:

FINALLY ANOTHER GAME WITH TRANSCEND. (i hope our distancing is good lol)

Trolling post intended to imply that you and Trans arent in a scumteam together because scum would NEVER do something like that.
Not much but if anything this post has scummotivation.

great, now shut the fuck up and let other people participate and generate reads - the game JUST STARTED
sit back and let yours grow/evolve - observe a bit and maybe learn something even
it is anti-town to shitpost so much and no, not even half of it is "playing the game", it's sucking oxygen out of the room

^ forced

shadethrowing at a good post from drealmerz7.

@MOD

if both scum teams kill the same person does the kill not go through like fire and ice or will they die

wait there is 2 maf teams?

He is surprised that there are 2 mafia teams yet he asks that instead of questioning Transcends knowledge about it.

I like Transcend and Gamma. I'm not so sure about the rest of you.

It's better to say why you like them and not just you do

Didnt have an issue with Transcend townreading him without a reason.

I see no reason for there to be that many votes on Alise and BYF neither have had very bad posts. I think these could be early scum pushes. But idk how multi works. I guess the individual maf teams have to scum hunt for the other so that could alter my feelings in a bit

They had 4/3 votes. Thats not much in a 18 player game. Again the only motivation i see for a post like that is scummotivation. Getting on Alisaes and Yoshis good side while not really defending them and throwing shade at the ppl voting them without considering their reasons for voting them. The fluff about multi is also silly as it doesnt really change anything about what scum wants to do during the day. We will come back to this later btw

Was that vigi shot legit? If not I don't like the fake vigi shot and the fake confirmation that the vigi shot was real.

Btw this is a fake reaction, he says this an hour plus after free the mod posted after the fake shot. It was a forced reaction to cast a dark cloud over it

Calling someone out for a fake reaction after he just faked a reaction to a fake vig shot.
Question for Gerry. What did he cast a dark cloud over? You had any townintent in saying "oh yes he shot me mod confirmed it" ah damn even though he shot me (town) he is still town.
You already imply here that you are town yet you later say that you never said you are town.

plus gerry saying yeah I am town

Lie. I never said this. I asked him what he thought I was. Nice way to try and twist words lol

As i said you implied that you are town and you later said you are town.

People on this site don't make sense sometimes. Why would i do that thing to make attention on myself as scum

You would do it in hopes of looking towny when you actually did 0 scumhunting up to this point.

VOTE: Alisae

looks like someone just jumping on a wagon

random shadethrowing again. Btw in 456 he said Yoshi had no bad posts yet suddenly he does? (This post by Yoshi was before his 456 in case you wonder)

Gerry thoughts on Pep?

Looks like he might be lynch bait.

Not interested in voting Pep but also not interested in defending him. Scum staying off a possible misslynch. (doesnt mean Pep cant be in the other scumteam)

Has everyone already posted ?
So far no scum reads yet.

Right here he says he has no scumreads and asking if everyone talked yet.

Was that vigi shot legit? If not I don't like the fake vigi shot and the fake confirmation that the vigi shot was real.

Suddenly he is very interested in a fake vig shot. If you look at the timing, you will see that he posted this 1 hour after the mod did the vote count, which means it was obviously fake at this time and he was trying to just cast a dark shadow over it.

If I was a vigi and I had 2 bullets and I was in a room with gerry, hitler, and stalin, I would shoot gerry twice.

Here he thinks he has something to push on, since others were talking about it as well, and tries to push on something that shouldnt give that strong of a scumread if he had no prior scumreads.

Very bad reasoning.

How about instead, you give your case on me. Town would do that and not just say you SR me.

Everyone can feel free to ask me about my reads thats why i posted them today because i had some time to answer questions.
If i want to push on someone i will make a case dont worry but you wanted my case so badly i will make an exception for you. Because right now i am still fine with my vote where it is.

[Manuel87]

The entire segment with me is exactly why I scumread him and if you are town and you belive he is town you should be trying to explain exactly why, like the way you explained your gerry read.

A scumread is very different from a townread. My read on him might also be influenced by my scumread on you though. If i had to name a reason i would say gut. His posts just come of genuine to me.
He has a certain aggression that doesnt feel forced.

To some extent yes, many people base meta on other games too. It should never be anything close to a leading factor tho. It is but a guideline for a better view on the player you at hand and helps with the analysis as you have an idea of how a person generally thinks. From then on tho, I'm pursuing in gaining more food on you, so I can form a read around this game and around solid arguments and not by gut and past game experience. I have stated what I have. I find you attitude disturbing and also your answeres not satisfying.

Maybe it's your questions are bad, not my answers? If someone ask me in serious manner, i answer serious, but you try provoke me, so why you expect serious answers? If you have something against me, we can discuss, but Jaack and Lemon Tree look more serious than yours "you not so aggressive" and obvious provoke attempts

That was the post i started townreading him.

[Manuel87]

Manuel87 - As I said before, I didn't like some of his back and forth with pepcho. I think there is a decent amount of reaching in his case on gerry, as if he's trying to justify it after the fact. I also think its fairly strange to townread PeregrineV like he did in 774 (the guy hasn't done enough to single him out as a townread), but I can't really put my finger on why that would help Manuel as scum. Just something to note for later.
@Manuel - Explain to me your Peregrine read from 774.

Two strongest scumreads are Gamma and Pepcho.

Vote: Gamma Emerald

Thats why he is in my townreads. Also liked his additions later even though i am not really scumreading Iron or Mick myself.

I wonder where i ever said i have a hardcore bullteproof case against gerry? I was asked about my read and i explained it. As simple as that.

What didnt you like about my back and forth with Pep? The part where he threw shade on me or the part where i called him out for it?

[Manuel87]

i'm ok with the mick wagon i guess. but i think manuel is more scummy. mick was drunk when he made those awful posts so it makes me wanna give him the benefit of the doubt

So you asked me for my scumread on you.
I gave my reasoning and have yet to see anyone that is defending you to argue about the points i made.
The best i got so far is " I think there is a decent amount of reaching in his case on gerry"
But that statement is just a way to devalue my points without arguing about them.

2.) His second scumread is Gamma, who hasnt talked in 2 days I believe. This is another safe scumread because not only is he not here to defend himself, but he can just say he thought that gamma is lurking right now. Since this is a the lurker, it makes it a good middle scumread.

3.) His third scumread is Pep. Who is looking more and more like lynchbait. If you see the amount of pressure and votes that have been piling up on pep, I think that he thought this was a safe last scumread just to throw in at the end, because since others scumread him, he won't be questioned much on it.

I have played 2 games with town!Gamma and in neither he was inactive. That can be because of RL so i wouldnt read him scum for that alone but on top of that the only posts he made when he was active were mostly unhelpful spam. For somebody with 52 posts thats quite an achievment. And i dont remember Gamma going that hard into unhelpful spam. In our last game together he even suggested replacing out because of the earlygame spam.

Pep tried to throw shade at me and i called him out for it so tell me how exactly i was using the arguments others made for my scumread? You say he is looking more and more like lynchbait. Doesnt that imply that you yourself think he is scummy? How do you come to the conclusion that he is lynchbait?

Btw you are trying way to hard to tell everyone that you are town. What is the reason to mention that every time you get a chance?

[Manuel87]

Btw you are trying way to hard to tell everyone that you are town. What is the reason to mention that every time you get a chance?

Hey, I think you just copied what alisae said. and it's obviously me doing it as a joke, as i answered to him. but nice try.

What he said was similar but not the same try again. And you think it is funny because?

btw guys im town.
r u triggered, manuel

Yes, triggered into thinking you are actually a

<insert swear word>

.
VOTE: gerryoat
Still no argument why my case is supposed to be bad. Just more stupidity to hide the fact you arent scumhunting at all.

[Manuel87]

Language.

[Manuel87]

Hbd Gamma

The way you wish someone a happy birthday on facebook if you don't like them, sometimes in hopes to stir up a fb fight.

[Manuel87]

Manny/Mick probably separate factions. I doubt they put two of their eggs on one obv town lynch.

Gerry is obv town only to you yet you cant explain why. But by now i am used to your awkward townreads on scummy ppl but once he flips red i will still FoS you.

[Manuel87]

Gerry is one of my heaviest reads in the game with substantial logic that you neglect to acknowledge.

I fail to understand your logic but you might want to enlighten me by explaining it.

[Manuel87]

My primary reason for not scumreading gerry at this point is we just finished Wordplay Mafia, where he was town and had similar posting style.
Went back to check- here is his iso-

Code: Select all

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?t=68819&f=2&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&user_select%5B%5D=28282&user_select%5B%5D=0&user_select%5B%5D=0&user_sort=Go

In both games he goes to figure out Transcend's alignment. Turns out he was scum last game, and gerry called it, but otherwise he appears to be scumhunting in both this game and Wordplay.

I have to disagree with you. I have read a little into his Iso of that game and i think his play is quite different from this one.
Main point is the thing about Transcend. In our game he mad 0 attempts of reading Transcend he is fine with being TR by him and pointing out and mentioning it when he gets the chance. I see nothing close to that in the Iso you posted.
Also he took the initiative in the game you posted, here he is just arguing and scumreading ppl that mentioned a scumread on him.

I would like to hear about your Pepo scumread, and your drealmerz townread.

For drealmerz

Spoiler:

i liked a lot of his early stuff. It felt like he genuinly got more and more annoyed by the spam in the first 10 pages. Something i dont see scum bother with because its fine for them if the game doesnt progress. 10 pages of spam means that a player with less time will have it harder to catch up so i agree with him that it is antitown.
Also when he is confronting players he says clearly why he thinks what they said is scummy/towny instead of just throwing shade without committing to it.
here is one example:

...1.)If someone is legitimately town they ought to be able to get out of a hole.
Basically, I agree with the sentiment of this post.
2.) Yeah I just woke up about a half hour ago and I don't remember going to bed so this might be a little less than coherent yeeeeoooow

1.) so if they can't get out of it they're scum and the lynch is okie-dokie? - that sounds like mislynches never happen in your world? what am I missing?
2.) yyeeeeeowwww indeed! you know you sound shady and so you excuse it, even if it is true that you just woke up, the genuineness of this remark is non-existent to me, very forced
scumpingsdings for you

For Pep

Spoiler:

i dont like how he is throwing shade without committing to a scumread. Its what scum does give ppl a reason to scumread someone without joining the push on said person.
He also tried to discourage earlygame scumhunting from drealmerz.

if I were scum and alisae were scum I'd be busing him right now for such a move and my posting would be identical (even this post), so
don't pretend to be able to read me, it just hurts the game

Why does this guy wants so much to get something out of nithing so fast?

Ughh, I don't like how you try to compliment Trans and think this is gonna get you off his SRs

I don't care about pushing anybody atm. If I was sure, you would more then likely see me tunnel the guy.

So he thinks i am scum but doesnt want to push on me because? Doesnt make sense for town to act like that.

Don't really care wether I'm on your good side or not, as long as you are willing to cooperate with the rest to have a good discussion and

ultimately achieving our alignment's goal.

???????????

You know I never talk from a town perspective.

Not the problem here.
How do you know you two are the same alignment?

I don't. That's why I talk from a neutral perspective. Also from his to an extent too. I doubt he thinks he is mafia, even if he is. So the way I present things is good for everybody.

First like i already mentioned what he suggests he is doing is always playing scummy so he cant be called out for it. While that is Nai it defenitly is a shitty way to make sure you have an easier time when you are scum.
The problem is with how this develops. He talks like they are the same alignment so he is already talking from a town pov yet when he is called out for his statment he says he is talking from a neutral pov which doesnt make sense to me. In the last part of the quote he is again implying that he (i think he is Transcend here) is town as he isnt talking about him as mafia. While the initial statement is Nai to me. How he handled the questions from Alisae looks like he was panicking and answerd with a shitty metaexcuse that didnt make sense.

2. Nah. Plus getting roasted by Pine is nothing new.
3. I think you implied that you two are the same alignment.
VOTE: Pep

Yep, your reads are bad. I'm not the same alignment with him. He put me on the bottom of his reads ffs.

This continues here. Why is he suddenly a different alignment just because he is scumreading him? Town has no knowledge about alignments so the SR itself is Nai but the reasoning for it may be something to look into.

Well let me clear my words now, cuz I got a little confused by Alisae's tunneling and now you seem to be on the same train. I'm saying one thing. I don't like Trans. His reads overall feel forced and his reasoning is fake. This is all. Explained and well. He doesn't think we are one the same side, evident from his reads. I'm not excluding the possibility of a TvT. Tho I have been leaning more and more on me actually finding scum.

Calling Transcends reads shit while he himself refuses to give reads and doesnt explain why Transcends reads are supposed to be shit.

Will respond to gerry in a different post this already got quite long.

[Manuel87]

Just more stupidity to hide the fact you arent scumhunting at all.

pretty sure i broke down why i thought you and iron were scum. but OK whatever fits your agenda hmmm?

Everything you quoted is like i mentioned in my last post responses to ppl scumreading you. How is that scumhunting?
I already mentioned the thing about ironstoves vote on you when you asked me about my read on you which you didnt comment at all.
Quick summary. Why shouldnt he develop a scumread on you for something he thinks is scummy just because he said some posts earlier that he has no sr yet?

Hmm your 2nd quote is part of the 1st quote so i will just ignore it.

You asked me about my scumread on you and i gave you my reasoning. Yet instead of arguing about that and trying to convince me i am wrong you dont mention anything about it at all instead you say my scumreads are artificially and carefully crafted as scum because everyone in my SR is an easy target.
By now i explained all my scumreads. Feel free to explain what you dont like about my reasoning instead of just throwing shade as your defense.

I was maf with you before, you should know how i act as maf lol. You're acting pretty similar to that game, so that's why i scumread you a bit more than my analysis.

No you were towntraitor thats quite a difference if you ask me.
So how exactly am i acting similar in this game? If you dont remember i will refresh your memory.
In said game i pushed on my scumbudy to the point he was lynched and i was tr for the rest of the game.
You tried to get the lynch off us both so i had to make sure you arent lynched because ppl might have figured out i am scum because of you.

[Manuel87]

In said game i pushed on my scumbudy to the point he was lynched and i was tr for the rest of the game.

you're pushing on me now
but no, really It's not the play, but your way of posting that i feel is similar.

Wouldnt that mean you are my scumbudy and i am hardbussing you right now? In case ppl dont understand it that was a joke.
Why would my way of posting be different as town? Do you know how i post as town? If you use meta to scumread me you should know how i play as town dont you think?
If nothing else i am pretty sure i have the same posting style no matter what i am.

[Manuel87]

That same intuition tells me Manuel is town. Look at 801. Scum has no need to go through so much trouble to back up their read, especially on day1. And a lot of it comes from your sussing out of Transcend.

not with his bad reason for having a fos on me he isnt.

I have yet to see you argue about my case. You didnt comment on any of the points i made against you. (Like everyone else defending you or scumreading me for my case on you)
I also want to mention that i already voided one of your reasons to scumread me.

Manuel, its that I don't remember seeing them interact with Garry up to the point where Manuel gave his case on Garry. It feels like the scumread just suddenly appeared.

I explained my read on him when he asked me. You might want to read that part again before misreping it.

The only person to give me a decent reason for his TR on gerry was PeregrineV. Even thoughas i explained i think his reasoning is wrong at least he has reasons.
Everyone else defending him doesnt even try to tell me why he is town for them. This huge unexplained resistance on that slot makes me scumread him even more.
- Transcend has a TR on Gerry since early on that he cant/wont explain. Yet as i said its something Trans did in both games i played with him as town.
- Jaack defended him a little bit and explained it with gut feeling
--- Alisae, Pine, BYF all chanisaw defended him quite hard without explaining why they think he is town or trying to show me why they think my arguments are supposed to be bad. If gerry flips red those 3 are the first we have to look into.

[Manuel87]

I explained my read on him when he asked me. You might want to read that part again before misreping it.

Naaaaaaah, you're misrepping me now.
You never interacted with him up to the point where he asked for a case.
If I phrased it differently sorry, that's what I meant.

It is true that i didnt interact with him until i mentioned my sr on him but the point you make is that i made a case without interacting with him.
I gave the case when he asked me why he is in my scumreads.

Either way i dont see what is bad about developing a scumread on someone.
Please explain how it makes me scum when you dont even take your time to argue about my points on him.

[Manuel87]

And why would I defend Garry?

- You scumread ppl for attacking/scumreading him.
- He is on top of you townreads.
Can you explain your townread on him?

[Manuel87]

And why would I defend Garry?

- You scumread ppl for attacking/scumreading him.
- He is on top of you townreads.
Can you explain your townread on him?

Good words coming out of this mouth. Also has some good posts.

Like every post where he comments about getting townread or wanting it

Also they don't really strike me as someone who's scared about getting lynched.

Can you quote me some posts that struck you as towny?

[Manuel87]

Can anyone tell me what each of those lists represent?

Bad reads

[Manuel87]

The following:
Alisae
BigYoshiFan
Gerryoat
Pepchoninga
PeregrineV
Pine
Ramciusslot

active ppl

The following:
Drealmerz7
Elena Fisher
Gamma Emerald
Ironstove
Jaack
Kuror0
Lemon Tree
PenguinPower

low post count

The following:
ConManMick
Manuel87

bad wagons

[Manuel87]

BTW Manuel
Garry's good posting:
456, 622, 742

I already talked about this in my reasoning to scumread gerry.
First he sees no reason why BYF should have so many votes later he scumreads him for something he did before gerrys post where he questioned the votes on BYF.
How do you get a townread from that?

460

Pep already gave his thoughts on Transcends read on him. An attempt to look like he is scumhunting that shows that he probably just skiped over the thread.

494

Defending himself and throwing shade at the same time. What do you like about this post?

732

Also something i had in my reasoning about gerry. I dont like how he calls him lynchbait instead of answering the question.
What exactly do you like about his answer?

783
795
809

What exactly do you like about gerry trying to throw shade on someone that just mentioned a scumread on him?
He asked me about my read on him and i explained it yet he didnt argue about any of the points i made. Instead alle he did was trying to discredit my reads by calling them "artificially and carefully crafted as scum"
I fail to see how that is a towny reaction.

931

I already said that it was similar but not the same. What exactly struck you as towny in this post?

956

He tries to show us his "scumhunting" he shows 3 quotes the 2nd is part of the first so he basically shows us 2 instances of him scumhunting.
Both are reactions to someone scumreading him.

990

What exactly do you like about this post?

996

He throws more shade without showing why he thinks like that by quoting a post that makes him think so.
What do you like about this post?


I look at those posts and see no townmotivation in any of them.

[Manuel87]

you get he's defending himself in 494? I get that he's showing no attempt to defend himself in 494. Mostly because it shows that he doesn't really believe there is pressure on him.

He starts with "It wasnt me" thats already a defence in my books. If he doesnt care about it why is he scumreading everyone that mentions a scumread on him?

in 732 he answered the question and gave his thoughts on it. Now you're just misrepping him. Sure he may have not said why but given Garry's current posting I don't see him to be the kinda guy that has super content heavy posts.

No instead of giving a read on Pep he calls him lynchbait. What does that mean? This looks like he is giving an answer when he is actually not.

in 783 I agree with him that your SR on him came out of nowhere. in 795 +809 he has a good case on you and he's trying to convince people that he thinks you are scum and he wants to get you lynched. To me that looks like scumhunting.

What exactly is good about his case on me? To me that looks like OMGUS. His "scumhunting" is only directed at ppl that mention a scumread on him.

I forget why I included 931 in there. But that answer doesn't seem to be scummy for me. Maybe it's just a good response.

So you are satisfied with him saying "lol i am town roflmao" every time he gets the chance because he thinks its funny? I dont get the joke maybe you can explain to me whats funny about it?

990 I like his focus on someone he is SRing.

Again he is just reacting to someone voting him. What about this is scumhunting?

996 is a good post because he's basicly saying that your pushes are fake and I agree with that.

I welcome everybody to show me where my reasoning on him is wrong yet noone did so up to this point. All i get is "your case is bad/scummy" but noone shows me where my case is bad.
Feel free to be the first one to show me an argument why you disagree with the points i made on him.

[Manuel87]

Transcend plays with me the most on and off this site. I think you should trust his read on me if you TR him

That doesnt mean that his read is correct and if he doesnt explain his read on you i will not follow him blindly.
Also he TR you immediatly i dont think there is a player that can be read with 1 post.

Manuel who are your other scumreads? you can't have me as your only scumread

If i consider you a Schrödingers Cat that would be Pine, Gamma and still Pep although i liked him more recently. Also leaning on Elena.

1. Fine to the first part. To the second maybe it's because he felt like scum was attempting to push him?

Possibly but why would you give him scumhuntingcredit for it when he was just reacting instead of taking the initiative?

2. What made you think I was asking specificly for a read? Tho to be fair, that is a good point.

I actually dont see what the question should have been about if not about his read on him.

3. Maybe he's just paranoid? Hey, I have an idea. Let's ask Garry. And I just like the case cuz I also feel like your SR on him was fabricated.

It wasnt really a case but my thoughts on his posts. He wasnt my mainscumread at that point and i just answerd his question.
Also this post from gerry was made before i gave my reasoning.

4. You're basicly attempting to pin him down for someone that was dismissed earlier as not meant to be AI.

In my head someone that mentions "i am town" every time is trying to implant that thought into the mind of other players.
Like in you make a read on him and think back "hmm he was townread quite a bit he is probably fine dont need to look to much into his slot"
While i agree that this might be a far stretch i dont see how on the other hand it has any townmotivation whatsoever.
So at the end i have something that is either just <insert swear word> ( ) or scummotivated.

6. Huh...Now that you point out that observation that is wierd. It's sorta like what Garry is saying about Ironstove. I guess...

Did gerry give a case on Ironstove?

[Manuel87]

Responding to my own quotes.
1. I believe he was taking the initiative with his case on you and the reaching to see if anyone will follow
2. Fair. TBH I did sorta want a read, but I asked what made you think I assumed for it. I also do find it wierd he never really gave me a read.
3. ok
4. ok I just disagree.
5. Yeah he did.

Wasnt he just reacting to me having a scumread on him?
Can you link me his case? I only find his point about the fake vigi shot.

[Manuel87]

I don't like the interaction between Alisae and fro99er on p. 66. Looks fishy. I also don't like how easily the wagon shifted to my slot. Why was there so much resistance to voting Ironstove but none to my slot?

You're such a joker. Iron got to L-3. You're only at L-5 if I count correctly

"Fuck my buddy might be killed better try to shift that wagon"

@ Transcend: who is the most likely scum on Clumsys wagon right now?

[Manuel87]

If you've tead the thread in depth younwill see I'm a slow beginner. I'm more cautious about what I do as town, but when I get good suspects I will push them to the death when I know they are scum. I'm usually an active player, regardless of allingment, so if I'm not that active there probably is another reason..

As a scum I still have a slow start (I compensate with shitposting as both allingments) but I'm not that cautious. I'm more willing to sheep and even tho I still have active assaults against people they are not that overblown and are more directed to several persons as to one.

This is a brief overview that shouldn't be relevant in our situation.

Excuse me while I try to invent a way to wash off the scumminess of this post from my body...Grosssssssss........

Had to search for that post from one of my past games because thats exactly how i feel right now :O

Since there is to much resistence on gerry anyway might as well vote Pep again.
VOTE: Pepchoninga

[Manuel87]

May I borrow that qupte of your?

Well its not mine but i dont think MathBlade would mind.

Manuel gimmie your reads right now please.

Scum:
Pep, gerry, Pine, Gamma
Town: drealmerz, Clumsy, Transcend, PeregrineV
Can make a Rainbowlist Transcend style later with all players when i have my break at work.

Since there is to much resistence on gerry anyway might as well vote Pep again

What is your read on clumsy?
Why resist the Clumsy wagon?

See above.
A wagon on Ironstove formed. I didnt like the wagon because of the ppl on it (mainly gerry). But his comeback into the thread was aweful. Instead of reading the thread to see why he is pushed he throws around random arguments. Yet after thes his wagon suddenly shifts to Clumsy.

[Manuel87]

A wagon on Ironstove formed. I didnt like the wagon because of the ppl on it (mainly gerry). But his comeback into the thread was aweful. Instead of reading the thread to see why he is pushed he throws around random arguments. Yet after thes his wagon suddenly shifts to Clumsy.

So you didn't like the iron wagon because of the people on it but you're going to stick with the iron wagon that had your scum reads because a counter wagon formed???

This is bad analysis.

No i thought he could be scum because of his comeback tantrum. scum being on his wagon also doesnt necessarily mean he cant be scum (in the other scumteam).
And i am not on the Ironwagon. Pep has a way higher chance to flip scum for me and if he does Iron has a good chance to be his buddy.

[Manuel87]

I caught up, here's what I think so far:

mafia:

pine - http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 8#p8726248
elena fisher - http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p8727384
transcend - http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p8727931
alise - http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p8725864, http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p8730331
clumsy - http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p8730311

town:

jack
conmanmick
kuror0
dream
PeregrineV
bigyoshifan
pepchoninga

null:

ramcius
gerryoat
fro99er
cabd

I feel left out : /

[Manuel87]

THIS GUY. LOL

I KNOW RIGHT

THAT MAKES THREE OF US

[Manuel87]

@ Transcend: who is the most likely scum on Clumsys wagon right now?

@Transcend can you answer this pls?

[Manuel87]

Manny's been okay lately but I've scumread him before then townread him when he was scum and IT WONT HAPPEN AGAIN

Funny the moment i stopped pushing on gerry i get a lot of ppl saying something like that.
I wanted to say wtf but i am actually not surprised about that reasoning.

[Manuel87]

ppl saying someting like that was only related to the Mannys been ok lately part.

[Manuel87]

So why is that a White Knight?

It's like you know iron's alignment...

"I like to use buzzwords but not know what they mean or how they work"
explain how that's a slip please.

I never said it's a slip.

I said why do you think it's a WK? It makes no sense

Pep caught me. I basicly decided to sheep Pine's reasoning as well as provide my own. Pine thought it was a WK so I sheeped that, but I also added to it that Pep didn't really feel like bringing attention to Iron at first but then when he was forced to he was like "ehh, he's scummy but not as scummy as my other scumreads" which honestly might be a perfectly normal reaction.

Honestly I'm starting to get more townvibes from Pep...

You realize that Pine said Pep is scum no matter what Iron flips right?

[Manuel87]

Jaack is with Mack and Clum.

Hmm how do you come to that conclusion?

[Manuel87]

Manuel if you thought I meant paired with Mack and Clum, I didn't mean that. I mean with them in the readlist.

Yes thats what i thought you meant. Thx for explaining the misunderstanding.

[Manuel87]

You should understand that a scum player would try to instigate a town player like this in order to get you reported and force-replaced or mod-killed.

I have run into many scum players who I have fos'd early flaming me with insults and personal attacks in order to get me to tilt.

This is the very reason I was banned for a month, because I named the scum players on D2 and they were vets and friends with the person modding the game, I essentially flamed them back and they insta-reported me and banned me.

I would not even drop down to alise' level, I know and you know and all good town players know he has provided no real content and is only trying to stir the pot.

wtf did i just read.

[Manuel87]

You should understand that a scum player would try to instigate a town player like this in order to get you reported and force-replaced or mod-killed.

I have run into many scum players who I have fos'd early flaming me with insults and personal attacks in order to get me to tilt.

This is the very reason I was banned for a month, because I named the scum players on D2 and they were vets and friends with the person modding the game, I essentially flamed them back and they insta-reported me and banned me.

I would not even drop down to alise' level, I know and you know and all good town players know he has provided no real content and is only trying to stir the pot.

wtf did i just read.

Some players are so bad at mafia, all they can do is try to provoke the actual player by being cancerous and try to win that way rather than actually engage with their brains.

Sorry but i dont like outside influence in a game and everyone playing this game should feel the same.
Having someone modkilled or forcereplaced or even ragequitting is a huge deal in my opinion because it influences the game from outside.
I would never be satisfied with winning that way and acusing another player of doing this is a huge insult for me.
If it happened to you in the past thats aweful but leave it in the past and dont bring it into new games.

[Manuel87]

Rainbow Reads:

drealmerz7, PeregrineV, Transcend

Clumsy

Ramcius

, ConManMick

kuror0

Alisae, Cabd

Lemon Tree

Elena Fisher

Indigo

, BigYoshiFan

Fro99er

PenguinPower

, Jaack, ironstove

Gamma Emerald

Pine, Pepchoninga, gerryoat

drealmerz: Already mentioned this but him getting annoyed by the earlygame spam felt genuine and is towny. Would like to see more from him but i agree with what he said when he posted after some time. Town is not in control of this game.
PeregrinV: As for drealmerz i would like to see more from him but i like his reads. The early scumreads were close to what i had and later his readslist was also close to mine. Mick and gerry need to change in his reads though.
Transcend: Hard to read but i think he is town. Similar playstyle to my first game with him. This might either change drastically or get locked with the first flip of the game.
Clumsy: Ram felt town to me in his exchange with Pep and him replacing out like he did is something i dont see scum doing. Frustrated town replacing i dont like outside influence but it happened and i think the people trying to paint this as NAI are scummy as fuck.
ConManMick: cant really explain that read lets call it gut for now. I dont see anything that pings me scummy in his Iso.
kuror0: Not much but he was the first to call out gerry for his constant "i am town" spam and reacted good to his childish provocation. Would like to see a readslist from him
Alisae: Not sure about this slot. Probably should be a bit higher but i didnt like how much he defended gerry. Gerrys flip would probably tell us a lot about his alignment.
Cabd: Not much from him so far. Didnt exactly wow me with his entrance. I generally think its really easy to look towny when replacing into a day 1 slot that had no reads on it. His entrance was just to weak to be able to do that though. Need to figure out if the lack of enthusiasm is AI or NAI.
Elena Fischer: Good point about Ram replacing out being towny. Dont know why she would tr gerry when he literally said vote who i want or ill scumread you. I wonder why she never mentioned anything about me again after she said she is going to Iso me.
BigYoshiFan: Simply based on his reads he can be town with some bad reads. Or scum that has good reads on the opposing team. I dont know why he suddenly voted Clumsy when he was Null in his readslist. Probably should be lower but there are to many scummy ppl.
Fro99er: came in and deflected the Ironwagon. I wasnt to fond of th wagon but Irons comeback was aweful and i started to consider voting him. Pushed hard on Clumsy from the start. Should probably be lower in my reads might change it next time.
Jaack: Nothing that made me think he is town so far. Could be in a scumteam with Pep and Iron.
Ironstove: Ill give him that he had the best post in the game so far (it was about a vigi with 2 bullets). Like i said i didnt like his wagon but his comeback was just awefull. Instead of reading up why he had so many cotes he threw around random accusations.
Gamma Emerald: Already explained that read nothing changed maybe some others should be lower then him because my only reasoning for him being scum is meta and i usually dont like to read someone only on meta but still I agree with what Alisae said about town!Gamma not shitposting so much early game. Not sure if i would vote him if he doesnt get some content but if he is town he really should start playing this game.
Pine: One of the leading forces on the Clumsy wagon. The worst reads in the game so far and i dont see a townplayer that bad so the only explanation is he is scum.
Pepchoninga: Looked a little better some time ago but his constant push on Clumsy and wishywashy answers for reads on other players are really bad. The post i quoted when i gave my vote was probably the scummiest shit i have seen in this thread so far.
gerryoat: scum


Funny enough all 3 of my scumreads immediatly tried to deflect the townread on the Ramslot for subbing out.

[Manuel87]

Pine: One of the leading forces on the Clumsy wagon. The worst reads in the game so far and i dont see a townplayer that bad so the only explanation is he is scum.

Pine isn't on the Clumsy wagon

Maybe leading forces was wrong. But he is SR him since he joined and was one of the ppl that tried to negate the tr on Ram/Clum for subbing out.

[Manuel87]

Clumsy - Jaack, BigYoshiFan,

Pepchoninga

, Ironstove, Transcend, Aliase, gerryoat, kuror0, (

Pine

)

time to find out who the scum here is

@gerry: explain why Alisae moves up and not down?

[Manuel87]

Their posts feel natural to me, like they are genuinely trying to figure out the game.

@gerry: Look at this post and remember that this game is multiball. What are your thoughts?

Also, I think on that wagon Kuror0 might be scum, what do you think of this post?

ok finally finished catching up. But for now I will just VOTE: clumsy
Many players are catching so we should have a nice end of the day, I have to sleep but tomorrow will post my list and ideas.

Especially after saying that he scumread me, he saw me just vote Clumsy. and the wording of it seems a bit weird. He's more worried about ending the day then finding maf

My read on the slot changed drastically.

Also, wait. Manuel wasn't I your biggest scumread? Why am I not redded in that post of yours? Unless you're implying you think i'm on a different team than them? Or did your read on me change?

You didnt start as my main SR but the restistance on your slot and your reaction to my SR paired with Peps posting being better made me rethink.
After our exchange you got better i think so i strated to rethink my read again. Also Pep got a lot worse when Iron was pressured and Pine caught my attention as well.
You arent in my TR but i dont want to lynch you right now.

gerry: fro9 opinion? he's now penguin if it helps

i second this

[Manuel87]

Clum list your strongest TRs in order from strongest to weakest with the following people in mind:
Manuel, Mick, Elena.

@gerry: Thats what my first line was about. Dont know how that disappered.

[Manuel87]

Can someone explain why the mason's partner is not claiming to confirm ?

The way I see it, If one mason is already out then we should have the other mason out as well so that we have 2 town clears, rather than having 1 mason die tonight then allowing for fake-claiming shenanigans to occur.

2 scumteams 2 shots 2 kills

[Manuel87]

lynch pool: cabd, gamma, kuror0, jaack, mick

@Transcend: give me 1 scum for each of those lynches flipping town instead of scum.
example: town!cabd=scum!Elena, town!gamma=scum!Manuel, town!kuror0=scum!gerry, town!Jaack=scum!Transcend, town!Mick=scum!Pep (random names that came to mind dont think to much into it)

[Manuel87]

Fine with my vote where it is.
i actually want an explanation why Pep isnt wagoned right now because he oozes scummy.
His flip gives a lot of information. Since i am sure he flips scum we probably can pin down 3-4 players that could be his partners. (Iron, fr99er, Jaack)
If he flips town which i doubt we have a lot of information for tomorrow.

Also scumreading Transcend and Alisae.
Transcend for wanting to lynch ppl with almost no interactions except for Jaack
Alisae for the thing about the Masons right after the claim.

[Manuel87]

pretty sure i have one scumteam nailed down with fro99er, Pep and Iron

[Manuel87]

I want everyone to explain their pep townread without using the word lynchbait like right now.

[Manuel87]

Manny I would like to hear how you got to that conclusion.

Dude Elena comes in and votes Pep. And suddenly fro99er, Iron and Pep bombard her.
Like yeah be more obvious.
+ I already suspected them to be scum together.

Fro99er litterally came into the game and derailed the Ironwagon when Iron just posted the most aweful comeback after his V/LA.
Pep was whitknighting him the whole time as well.
Look at my readslist and a recent post of mine about Peps flip i already mentioned this read twice.

[Manuel87]

Hmm...Manny, idunno about Frogger and Iron. Iron's push on me seems very town motivated and Frogger seems to be doing town motivated things.
If Pep were on a scumteam I think he would try to figure out who the masons were in a PT.

They can try to figure it out all they want but as long as there is no claim they cant know for sure.

[Manuel87]

I dont argue with ppl from team Schnee you are confirmed scum to me.
If you are town dont be stupid and vote Pep. First we kill off those 3 to reduce the nightkills then we hunt for team Belladonna.

[Manuel87]

pretty sure i have one scumteam nailed down with fro99er, Pep and Iron

Manny I would like to hear how you got to that conclusion.

Dude Elena comes in and votes Pep. And suddenly fro99er, Iron and Pep bombard her.
Like yeah be more obvious.
+ I already suspected them to be scum together.

Fro99er litterally came into the game and derailed the Ironwagon when Iron just posted the most aweful comeback after his V/LA.
Pep was whitknighting him the whole time as well.
Look at my readslist and a recent post of mine about Peps flip i already mentioned this read twice.

Man we're so terrible at scum if we're that obvious.

*eyeroll*

i agree

[Manuel87]

Fro is saying he thinks clum and man are masons btw

Well we both have a target painted on our backs for reading Clumsy correct i am well prepared to die tonight.
Thats why i am getting out my reads. I actually wanted to post my thoughts on team Belladonna later but i will go to bed soon and scum might lynch Yoshi over night.
Belladonna suspects: Pine, Alisae, Transcend

[Manuel87]

pep is like a little lost boy.

Manny should I tell him what's up in my scum chat you seem to think I have with him

He can just acces is by following the link in his rolepm

[Manuel87]

Pep was at L-4 if I'm not mistaken and then a random clum wagon showed up

Iron was L-3 but not Pep but same difference for me.

[Manuel87]

Top three from the survey are: Yoshi, Pine, and Jaack. Can we please agree to lynch there and end this day before we hit 200 pages?

No we lynch obv scum Pep today and continue with his buddys tomorrow.

[Manuel87]

Everyone who joins the pep wagon I will not vote all of day 2 regardless of my read on them.

And what

if

I flip town?

WHY

IF

YOU FLIP TOWN AND NOT WHEN

^
Can we like lynch this already?

[Manuel87]

If Yoshi is lynched and flips town protect me with everything you got.
Also Yoshi is V/LA until 21st if he doesnt get the chance i take the hammer as a scumclaim.

[Manuel87]

If Yoshi is lynched and flips town protect me with everything you got.
Also Yoshi is V/LA until 21st if he doesnt get the chance

to claim

i take the hammer as a scumclaim.

[Manuel87]

Cabd joins the candidates for team Belladonna. Transcend on the sidelines for calling it out. Plus there can only be 3 because i dont see a world where 10v4v4 is balanced.

[Manuel87]

Anyways long story short: I want Jaack or Cabd lynched. Those are my top two scumspects.

Tomorrow targets of interest are: ConMan, kuror0, Pine, Manuel87, Elena Fisher in no particular order.

Transcend goes back intot the starters for team Belladonna. Lets see who goes to the sidelines. Probably need to Iso one of Cabds towngames to see if he is just bad town.
For now he is out. @Cabd: Dont think about the shower yet you may enter again.

[Manuel87]

I have exactly 0 idea what the context of this post means btw

My iso is 70 posts and the context can easily be seen in my most recent ones. If you wanted to know you could easily find it.

[Manuel87]

If you've tead the thread in depth younwill see I'm a slow beginner. I'm more cautious about what I do as town, but when I get good suspects I will push them to the death when I know they are scum. I'm usually an active player, regardless of allingment, so if I'm not that active there probably is another reason..

As a scum I still have a slow start (I compensate with shitposting as both allingments) but I'm not that cautious. I'm more willing to sheep and even tho I still have active assaults against people they are not that overblown and are more directed to several persons as to one.

This is a brief overview that shouldn't be relevant in our situation.

Excuse me while I try to invent a way to wash off the scumminess of this post from my body...Grosssssssss........

Had to search for that post from one of my past games because thats exactly how i feel right now :O
VOTE: Pepchoninga

[Manuel87]

how does bad unequal scum

[Manuel87]

Because he is playing the i am bad town card to its fullest.
Noone can be so bad. Plus this way he can keep voting a slot that isnt gonna be lynched today and stay off of all possible lynches.
I pointed out his team and none of the slots is being pressured so he is fine with the way things are right now.

[Manuel87]

Transcend just reread the yoshi claim in mind that yoshi is actually town and read froggy

When Yoshi flips scum and I flip town I'll make sure to laugh at this.

Why not laugh at it the moment Yoshi flips scum?

[Manuel87]

Transcend just reread the yoshi claim in mind that yoshi is actually town and read froggy

When Yoshi flips scum and I flip town I'll make sure to laugh at this.

Why not laugh at it the moment Yoshi flips scum?

Because i'm not flipping scum.

Trying to override your slip with a silly comment. #Howtoplayscum

[Manuel87]

Cloudie, you sure a frogger
lynch is happening to day.
Because I don't think it is

Do you know why its not happened ? its cuz hes colluding with other slots, you know like mefias

Same goes for Pine and Transcend how is fro99er different to them?

[Manuel87]

Your claim is nothing without another one, sorry. Everytime I've read masons claims and it is not a lie it has come in a pair.

Without that, your claim just seems like a scum trying to take pressure off.

Taking pressure of by painting a huge X on his back for the other scumteam to kill him. Sounds legit.

Fixed quote.
Gives me a pagetop feel.
-S

[Manuel87]

Fixed quote.
Gives me a pagetop feel.
-S

Thx best mod ever <3

[Manuel87]

If jack flips scum or town, vig should shoot pep if we have one

fixed it for you

[Manuel87]

So we ready to lynch scum now?

[Manuel87]

I like Elenas plan lets go with that

[Manuel87]

TBH I don't like limiting the Vig's NK to 1 option.
Scum has way too much influence on the Vig shot that way.

Jaack shoots who we tell him to shoot to prove his claim!
But what Elena said is true.
Question is do we have Jaack shoot Fr099er or Iron.

[Manuel87]

i actually like the 3 targets idea

[Manuel87]

Iron, Fr099er, Pine should be the targets

[Manuel87]

dont want to put Alisae into the Target list because it was his idea.

[Manuel87]

shooting in 3 is still better.

who are good vig shots we can all agree on

Pine, Pep, kuror/cabd would be my choices.

Pep is being lynched we talked about that.

[Manuel87]

God i litteraly dont want to go to bed because of the fact that i will have to read 15 pages when i wake up

[Manuel87]

It's been so long, my love,
My beloved
I have missed you
But I fought, in tears, through shitposts and 'content',
For you,
Because I love you.

Finally, we are reunited,
Darling,
I trained myself in the arts of the ninja,
The ways of the modkill
And the abilities to be with you,
My dearest.

Don't ever leave me again,
My sweet,
Oh so lovely
Pagetop.

</3

Obviously a hint we should discuss this in depht before ending the day

[Manuel87]

i am pretty sure we are removing drealmerz from the shooting list as Jaack will just shot him as his obv choice.
that makes it
Pine, Fro99er, Cabd
And i also want Iron on that list. I thought about it at night and we need 4 targets. 2 from team Schnee and 2 from team Belladonna

[Manuel87]

no but if scum have protection and we have 2 targets from each team they have to decide who to protect.

[Manuel87]

fine with me

[Manuel87]

@Alisae Why shouldnt he RNG it?

[Manuel87]

If he is town thats fine with me.
If he is scum he has a reason for the kill and we will try to figure it out.
He is either claimed PR or scum so a priority target for NKs.

[Manuel87]

People I didn't claim a power role or mason, why are you beliving me?

i hate this post

thank you now vote scum and end this day ffs.

[Manuel87]

Clumsy why arent you voting Pep?
Can we please kill this scum to move on.
I am fully aware that some ppl are trying to get 1st place and its getting annoying. Yeah i am talking about you gerry.
Also why do you jump to Fro99er he is one of the vig targets for tonight.

Btw: VT is the safest claim for scum because they will not be touched by the opposing scumteam.

[Manuel87]

L-2

[Manuel87]

C'mon t'fuck I'm getting bored

So while we wait for Pep to be finally lynched. Who do you think is scum with him?
Who do you think is in the other team?

[Manuel87]

Jaack sticks to the 4 ppl we gave him.
Shooting anyone else will put a hard FoS on him if he even survives the night.
List is Pine, Drealmerz, Cabdslot, Fro99er

[Manuel87]

Argh to bad i hoped Elena would turn it around. I think she correctly read every remaining scum at one point in the game.
GG Gerry. The bussing prevails again^^

Thanks to Scout for being an awesome mod. Love your games the setup was really cool. Looking forward to your next one