Mini 1855: Questionable Content Mafia - Game Over!

[Socrates]

Confirm.

[Socrates]

Whoo, this will be my fist game of mafia in... looks like 6 years?

I was surprised to see how many names I recognized in the game list, though I think SpyreX might be the only player I have personal experience with. (ignoring alts, of course)

Camn, did we ever play? Or were you one of those people I would see around yet somehow never end up in the same game?

(<3 Spy. Good to see you again)

I am genuinely amazed by how much this is physically affecting me.

My inability to just write what I like and being forced to constantly check and change things to ensure perfect grammar.

It's making my hands shake and my heart rate skyrocket.

Let me tell you about what it's like to be a copyeditor,

[Socrates]

Oh god, this game is going to move fast, isn't it?

[Socrates]

@SpyreX You're missing nothing, really.
Socrates is meh.

I would love to know what this is about, seeing as how I hadn't posted yet.

I would see it as premature scum trying to say something about their partner earlier than they actually need to, but it's about me???

[Socrates]

Is JaeReed typically low-hanging fruit? Because he looks like standard issue low-hanging fruit to me. I guess he did specifically call

himself

out as being such, huh? Blah.

Also, periods are stiff. Noted.

.

@MOD:

What should our expectations be re:vote counts?

MOD: Umm, similar to the one I just posted. Nothing too fancy. I hate BBCode enough, so I won't be doing fancy ones like Ircher does.

[Socrates]

Oh boy, if pre-game joking reads as town to you, then we are not going to get along at ALL.

Socrates
I don't totally disagree- they might just be bait... But I certainly am not overwhelmed by Jae's townieness.
Plus I'm trying to #MakeMs.netGreatAgain....starting by powerlynching all VIs.

Hmmm, your platform speaks to my heart. But are these mere empty promises that will be forgotten after the election?

[Socrates]

VOTE: jawreed

This is Charlie Brown and the football all over again

It's like I never left!

Also, to answer your question, this is the avatar that was on this account when I logged on, but it was a late change, as I recall? The previous one was a black and white dramatic interpretation of my namesake.

[Socrates]

Hey guys camn needs more votes
The way she approached jae shows she's not interested in pressing them for content
Instead of poking jae about the weird comments on Socrates, all she does is call jae scum

It would be difficult for her to do so, seeing as how two people (one being myself) had already pointed it out.

Oh boy, if pre-game joking reads as town to you, then we are not going to get along at ALL.

Given your list of words you don't like being used in your sig... I kinda already figured!

What are your thoughts on the gamestate so far?

I like that you asked me a direct question!

I don't like that I like it so much. You said you did a quick meta dive on me, correct? Am I that easy to read?

[Socrates]

Why don't you like that you like it?

I did, but I was just skimming for whether your general posts would come off as stiff early game to me. Conclusion was that you confirming that way was NAI and I should probably focus on your content. For example, reading a highly emotional player confirming so stiffly would indicate to me that the person is most likely concerned in some way over their alignment/role. My guess is you're probably more on the logical side than emotional when playing. I could be wrong, but.

I don't find you easy to read. If I found you easy to read then I wouldn't have asked for your thoughts on the gamestate as an attempt to engage you.

See, you referenced my list of Words I Don't Like in a negative way, but not only have you not used any of those words, you also seem to have access to my secret list of Words That I Love To Hear.

Gamestate
Engage
Thoughts

And so on. I love it when someone engages me directly, and you are saying exactly the things that would appeal to my personal ego, and you started doing it rather abruptly.

You did all this, yet you failed to comment on how

I

failed to actually answer your question.

Is... Is SpyreX telling you what to say?

[Socrates]

And suddenly, you use the first word on my list right after I mention it.

vote: JaeReed

daytalking scum.

[Socrates]

Second word

[Socrates]

Hold the phone mr.crates
While I'm down with some ropes are you saying i fed her that?

I obviously can't be sure about you specifically, but his words reek of coaching. Coaching about me specifically? Who most fits that criteria?

You probably meant for them to have a lighter touch.

[Socrates]

I don't think there's an expression for the bewilderment on my face.

It's been eons since I've coached anyone aside from don't lurk and don't post like pants on head cause the most important thing is being genuine

You should add meta to your list i hate that one the most

It wouldn't have to be much. Just a sentence like "Socrates is easy to please, just talk the right way." and then Jae oversells it way too hard.

[Socrates]

But then why would i be voting her? This is bizarro

And time for bed

Wha? Charlie Brown always tries to kick his football.

I wasn't really all that serious about this whole daytalk conspiracy thing, but then you go and say something silly like this. Now

I

am the befuddled one.

@Socrates Your entire premise here is flawed in that it's built off SpyreX being scum, and if you feel he's scum that strongly then you should be voting for him, not me.

Imagine I get revealed as Innocent Child right now. What would that tell you about SpyreX? Nothing.
Now imagine SpyreX gets revealed as Innocent Child. Suddenly I can't be his partner. In that situation would you stay on me or move your vote? If you'd stay on me then there has to be more to your vote than believing that I was being coached on what to say in scum chat.

No, no, you have it backwards. My premise relied on you being coached scum. IF that is the case, THEN who is the coach? It doesn't have to be SpyreX, he's just the most obvious answer.

Your words to me rang as inauthentic (one might even call them stiff), so I considered the possibility that they weren't actually yours and proceeded accordingly.

Camn voting me specifically

without

engaging me would ring as a town-tell if I hadn't just spent the last dozen posts explicating my feelings on the subject. In that context, bah humbug.

MOI is really hung up on Lady's post restriction. He sounds like he has had a bad experience with post restrictions in the past, so maybe that's justified, but a scum would take great pains to ensure that door stays open for the future.

The youngin's seem to have mostly not cottoned to the fact that wagons are no big deal, which fits with them being youngin's.

Honestly, I'm having a hard time keeping track of people. I forgot Dunn was even in this game! I keep confusing Lady and Kraska in my head for some reason, and we have two people who haven't even shown up, I think? Maybe I'm too old for this.

IAI's catch-up post doesn't sit well with me, but god dammit, ALL catch-up post read as scummy to me.

[Socrates]

Still around, is he?

[Socrates]

Fate is never terrible it is a warm bubble of rage

Don't remind me, I wish I could have a warm bubble of rage.

Instead I'm forced to play with perfect grammar and spelling.

I wish I were dead.

If I told you that the subjunctive mood is fucking bullshit and using the plural past tense to refer to oneself is a nonsensical idea, would that make you feel better or worse?

[Socrates]

OK.
First-

Socrates

He is very clever at saying nothing. That is my problem with him.
The first ping of my scumdar was this:

@MOD: What should our expectations be re:vote counts?

This was in his 4th post... the prior three of which were literally nothing about the game.
I wonder what he was thinking there... like.. were his thoughts of the previous 96 posts so unimpressive that he started wondering about... votecounts? To me this reads as "tryna look useful". Even DS thinks its weird.
Then, One might ask- when WILL he have actual thoughts about the game? Lets look.
Ah. Post 161.. about the coachin.
Seriously? 161 posts until you could find anything to talk about other than theory?
Its clever. The less you say, the less people can jump on.

What a weirdly primitive characterization of my behavior. Yes, the first 96 posts were largely unremarkable outside of, you know, the thing I pointed out about Jae and the flavor claim, which I am not going to comment on.

The question to the mod was because

I

wanted a votecount, but I phrased it as a polite question because I'm a nice guy.

Nothing to say about my actual back and forth with Jae? You just skip past all that and pretend that 161 is my first utterance on the topic?

[Socrates]

My face!

I am wounded.

You still haven't given any sort evaluation about said thought, though I have managed to get you to acknowledge it.

Frankly my current interest was in waiting to see whether MOI was going to actually follow through on his interrogation of LUV, or if those 'strikes' meant nothing, but you have distracted me, madame.

[Socrates]

Its nothing, Soc! Its cotton candy.
But.. if we get a scumflip on one of them its worth coming back around to, obv.

As opposed to your meat and potatoes argument that I asked for a votecount just to look pretty.

[Socrates]

Upon review, it occurs to me that I didn't fully explain all of the little side details that made me suspect Jae was trying to buddy me in the first place.

I'll do that in a bit. Food now.

You did.
What crazy madwagon were you missing 4 pages in?

I wasn't sure how many votes Jae had accrued. I was surprised to see that he had only two votes and that you had three, which I think vindicates my taking the time to ask.

[Socrates]

So, Jae deciding to state a neutral read on me before I had even begun to post is weird as hell, as I (and other people) have already pointed out. Confused about why he would do that, I (and others) press him about singling me out, of all people.

His answer? That my confirmation post felt "stiff" and that he had done a "meta dive" on me (and SpyreX!? post 105) to research my playstyle.

Stiff?

STIFF?

Compare my confirmation post to Lady's six posts earlier, remembering that this would be BEFORE Lady could say anything about her (ostensible) post restriction:

This is a confirmation post.

Confirm.

I'm the oddly stiff one? Rubbish.

And of course it was all a dead end with nothing to show for it than a 'meh'.

Why do the legwork on such an obvious dead-end, and NOT do the leg-work on his gut-town read of MOI (as MOI has, again, already pointed out himself)?
It doesn't make any sense.

I expressed my dissatisfaction with his logic not only on me, but also on MOI and he turns around and says something about my sig and starts trying to "engage" me directly. I consciously and deliberately turned it around on him to see if he was actually interested in feeling me out or if he was just trying to stroke my ego, and he proceeds to give me a bunch of veiled compliments while failing to follow through on his push.

And thus, he earned a vote from me.

It's not the most complicated of cases, but it's good enough for a starting place, and now I've suddenly got Camn jumping down my throat over nothing.

I've speculated that Jae was coached to do this by another member of the mafia. It might not have even been coaching about me specifically, just a suggestion to buddy up with one of the more experienced players and use their egos against them, or something. The three oldest accounts in this game are (I think?) me, Spy, and Camn, and Spy being the coach would explain why Jae would choose to 'meta' me and Spy but nobody else. Now that I look at it, though, Camn being the coach would also fit astoundingly well.

But that's not the important part, it was just an idle thought about how this would fit into the larger game. It means nothing until we've lynched this Jae fellow and proven him scum.

BUT

I'm starting to get to the point where I just want to murder some lurkers.

Dunn has contributed fuckall.
Pisskop has failed to appear.
Nacho needs to stop reading the webcomic and start playing.
SpyreX, is your current vote serious?
Is it a part of Lady's post restriction that she has to complain about having said restriction in every post she makes?

[Socrates]

Half and half. I'm not passionate but i dont have something revving my desires yet

How much longer should we give Nacho before we kill him?

[Socrates]

Half and half. I'm not passionate but i dont have something revving my desires yet

How much longer should we give Nacho before we kill him?

You don't get to ask this question.

While I am still alive, I decide when it is time to consider lynching Nacho. No one else.

Oh?

Okay, then I'll ask for your opinion. Is it time to consider lynching Nacho?

[Socrates]

Okay-dokie.

I just get frustrated when I realize I'm only thinking about the things directly in front of me. Which I tend to do. A lot.

[Socrates]

Camn, I'm worried about something I said earlier. When I said your characterization of me was 'weirdly primitive', I meant that I thought you were characterizing ME as primitive, which I was describing as weird. But now I'm looking at it and I come across as insulting you, which I can assure you was not my intention at all!

My sincerest apologies.

--

LLD had posted about her restriction by the time I reached the thread, I believe. I don't see why that's so hard for you to understand, really.

That's an easy lie to make, but I guess it's easy because it's plausible. Eh, If you say so.

Veiled compliments? Don't get you.

The words you like I didn't even know were words you liked. I've been reading a lot of mafia theory lately because I've had problems with my reads. A lot of it I guess is posted by older players or something and I picked up the usage from there and fell into using it with you because that's what I tend to do.

The parts where you call me a 'logical' player and 'of course I am a difficult read' and whatever. They're called 'veiled' compliments because they appeal without being direct.

I don't even know what you mean by "consciously and deliberately turned it around on him" like... eh w/e. I'm actually reaching the end of my patience so I guess I need to cool it a bit.

You know, the whole part where I didn't answer your question but instead asked you a question about myself? Which you *totally* noted yet elected not to say anything about?

I wouldn't buddy up to any of those accounts if I wanted to buddy. I don't know any of you. If I were planning to buddy someone this game it'd be someone I've played with previously.

You seem to equate older accounts with being scumhunting gods. You're not. None of us are. Egos lose games.

That's what I... That was my entire...

*sigh*

Also, you think camn could have coached me? Y'know, the person who was tunneling me and i was tunneling them earlier? You can't seriously believe that.

What Camn said.

[Socrates]

MOI is really hung up on Lady's post restriction.

Can you elaborate on why you think this because this is pretty moonbeams and I don’t get the sense from the rest of your posts that you are a moonbeams sorta guy.

Your suspicion about LUV's attitude about the post restriction in posts 204 and 206. It did make up a significant chunk of your words at that point.

I'm starting to get to the point where I just want to murder some lurkers.

The game has been open a whopping 26 or so hours when you made this. You are ready to start murdering “lurkers” before people can even be due a prod?

Has it really only been that long? It feels like longer.

Time, what are you really?

[Socrates]

Your suspicion about LUV's attitude about the post restriction in posts 204 and 206. It did make up a significant chunk of your words at that point.

Yeah but that has little to do with me being "hung up" on LLD's claimed restriction and 100% to do with LUV's posts looking suspect.

So I'm not sure how that translates in me being overly worried about LLD's claim.

Yeah, attacking the guy who responds favorably to the post restriction to keep the door open for a future mislynch as scum. It's not a strong scum-tell, just something I noticed.

[Socrates]

Scum sees townie with post restriction. Wants to keep them around because restricted townie makes their life easier and makes for a juicy target late game. Scum sees other player accept post restriction, gives them a slap about it because they don't want the town to just accept the restriction but aren't going to attack it directly.

'Hung up' was perhaps a poor choice of words, if that's what you are getting *hung up* on. (tee hee)

[Socrates]

Drunk posting?

Nah man, I'm cool to drive

[Socrates]

What do you mean, "hand over my keys"? I can't afford a taxi.

[Socrates]

Your couch is so gross dude

[Socrates]

Prod received. Sorry. Will look at thread in a few hours.

[Socrates]

Ugh, it occurs to me that, on some level, I simply WANT to believe in a Jae/Camn scumteam. It's just such a pretty idea. So perfect. Everything from the way they voted for each other to Camn jumping on me the moment I laid a semi-serious vote on Jae to my previous comments about the coaching.

The way Camn is clinging to 'Socrates is clever scum' despite her accusing me of committing the newbest of newb-scum-tells (helpful scum) in no way helps. And I am too reserved? What happened to not giving scum instructions on how to win? YOUR words in this very thread.

The way Jae has completely flip-flopped from 'Socrates is too paranoid to be faking' to 'Socrates's paranoia is too contrived to be real' also doesn't help. (Also, for what it's worth, contriving a reason to jump on your wagon would have been foolhardy for me to do as scum, since the 'let's power-lynch the VI!' wagon always fails. Always. THAT is the football SpyreX was talking about if you haven't clued in to that yet, Jae.)

Pisskopp fails to impress.
Was Aristophanes making a point of not reading the thread?

LUV seems timid in general to me, but maybe I'm just not paying enough attention to him. Always a difficult call about what that says about alignment for a fairly new player.

My eyes are glazing over at Camn/Dunn's back and forth.

I said I wasn't going to comment on Kraska's claim, but I guess there's no harm in pointing out that falseClaim-Miller is the classical purview of the Serial Killer. It gets both investigative roles and the mafia off their backs in one swoop.

[Socrates]

Woah now lets not sully something like a speed wagon by pretending its cause they're a vi

My apologies.

Pisskopp fails to impress.

do I?

Yessir.

[Socrates]

although "misrep" and "opportunistic", while overused, are still fairly important in finding bad boys and girls

It's about leaning on the the words themselves to build a case. Everything is a 'misrep' to the other party, and all votes can be called 'opportunistic'.

[Socrates]

How.

Ive been pretty standard Kop, Id argue.

I'll admit that I'm not familiar with StandardKop, but nothing you said once you finally caught up registered as interesting to me.

do my reads not impress too? or were those just not interesting enough to comment upon?

What reads? That Camn is tricksy? Did I miss a post? I don't find fault with the IAI scum-read per-say, but it's a pretty low-effort flake-vote.

[Socrates]

although "misrep" and "opportunistic", while overused, are still fairly important in finding bad boys and girls

It's about leaning on the the words themselves to build a case. Everything is a 'misrep' to the other party, and all votes can be called 'opportunistic'.

not everything should be a misrep to the other party; no reason why two arguing people can't understand each other
all votes can be called opportunistic, but there's a big difference between an scummily opportunistic vote and a vote that pushes someone close to a lynch

If they are arguing in the first place, it's usually because they don't understand each other. Respectful disagreement is a nice idea, but people rarely acknowledge it in practice, in my personal experience.

Either way, if you can make the argument sensibly without leaning on the buzzword, you are okay in my book.

I don't want to drag this out any further, though. I'm already uncomfortable with the amount of references people are making to my sig. I was going to change it before the game even started, though I never got around to doing so. I should probably go ahead and do that.

[Socrates]

whys camn town

she seems so excited and happy! ^.^
why is she scum?

Would Camn be excited to play as scum against people she likes?

[Socrates]

How.

Ive been pretty standard Kop, Id argue.

I'll admit that I'm not familiar with StandardKop, but nothing you said once you finally caught up registered as interesting to me.

do my reads not impress too? or were those just not interesting enough to comment upon?

What reads? That Camn is tricksy? Did I miss a post? I don't find fault with the IAI scum-read per-say, but it's a pretty low-effort flake-vote.

Theres a secret condition to my role. Is that interesting?

No? And it would only be if your play was deviating from your normal style, which you claim it isn't and I can't contradict you.

[Socrates]

Boy, Aristophanes accumulated 5 votes real fast, with at least one more stated 'unofficial' vote (Jae) and he's about due for a prod.

Don't like this. Not one bit.

Though if he's in the middle of committing the dreaded Double Flake, a scum-bus wouldn't just be possible, but probable.

It takes 6 to lynch right? Asking because I get this uneasy vibe with this group putting someone at L-1. If I had to describe it, it would be more bloodthirsty than reckless.

I have a completed scum game if anyone would like a look but yeah this is how I play. I understand it's not perfect and I'm working on that but it's a lot better than how I first started out on this site, which was try to imitate other people I saw and just try a whole bunch of things all at once. I got mislynched in all 4 of the games that I did that in.

The mod didn't spell this out, but it should be 7 to lynch with a clear majority in a 12 player game.

And that's a good attitude, if it's genuine! Say what you feel, and don't worry about catching heat for not being as bold as the others. A lot of their actions come from sheer familiarity with lots of different experiences, and if you aren't familiar, you SHOULD be asking questions.

[Socrates]

Does this sig make me look fat?

[Socrates]

I am Marigold Farmer.

[Socrates]

vote: Nacho

[Socrates]

IF Nacho is scum:

Camn, LUV, and Jae are all town.
I'll need to take another look at MOI.
Heavy odds on Ari being scum.

[Socrates]

We are not allowing Aristophanes to die without posting.

Replace him, if need be.

[Socrates]

Welp, there goes my primary scumread in a puff of smoke and corpses.

whys camn town

she seems so excited and happy! ^.^
why is she scum?

Would Camn be excited to play as scum against people she likes?

I REALLY wish Nacho had answered this. It was a serious question! And an important one! I thought maybe he had dodged it because he was full of shit, but alas.

LUV's claim makes me go because reasons. I might elaborate. I might not. If you want to call me rusty, this is probably where I earn the descriptor.

I need to ponder. And probably re-read.

[Socrates]

I'm also 1 shot commuter
Game could potentially end up with hqlf the town being untargettable if what hes saying is true
Which is why it's not

What.

[Socrates]

the fuck is this game.

[Socrates]

Kraska, is there anything about your role that you haven't shared? You don't need to share what it is if so, I just need to know if there's more to it.

[Socrates]

No, fuck it. I'm 90% sure you're town. You don't need to answer that.

Has everyone checked in?

[Socrates]

vote: Magna

Jae clearly breadcrumbed investigating Pisskop. He's town.

Magna's reasoning for hammer Uzi is fucking godawful. The mod refusing the confirm the presence of a third party is evidence of a third party?! That's VI logic, and he's no VI.

The only thing that gives me pause is that Uzi apparently WAS lying about being Ascetic, but I have no idea how Magna could know this other than being Ascetic himself. In which case, why the fuck didn't HE claim Ascetic day 1 if he thought that was the pro-town thing to do?

Prev-Edit: Magna, How does your BP interact with poison? I forget how that tends to work.

And your case on Camn better be fucking rock solid, because your snipes at her was as bad as she herself was saying.

[Socrates]

So you are suggesting the poison was completely useless?

[Socrates]

The hammer on a lie that was contradicting your stated role is the only thing you have going FOR you, Magna, since he WAS lying. It's everything else surrounding the hammer that makes me go HMMMMM.

[Socrates]

I'm just going to assume nothing insane happened like Dunn decided to upgrade Pisskop night 1 and that upgrade made him into a godfather just as Jaereed chose to investigate him. That would be too much for my heart to bear!

The hammer on a lie that was contradicting your stated role is the only thing you have going FOR you, Magna, since he WAS lying. It's everything else surrounding the hammer that makes me go HMMMMM.

Well either vote me or don't. Your going HMMMM really is of little interest to me.

Also Pro-Tip - I was not the first person to bring up the concept of LUV being 3rd party. What do you think about that?

Really? I missed this. Who? And when?

And your melodramatics about my suspicion is not helping.

[Socrates]

Really? I missed this. Who? And when?

And your melodramatics about my suspicion is not helping.

You really are rusty aren't you. You think me blandly telling you "Vote me or not" is melodramatics? I mean - that's pretty bad. If I get lynched due to LUV lying I get lynched. Life goes on. I'll make my Camn case and my Town flip with posthumously make it clear it is coming from a Town perspective.

If you think that post and your sarcastic response to my "HMM" comment doesn't come off as callous and melodramatic (and now you're throwing yet another insult my way!) then you seriously need to rethink how your words come across to others.

And the thing I'm getting at here is that this hole you've dug isn't as deep as you seem to think it is. Especially when you claimed to have a thick skin. But maybe you wouldn't realize this if you ARE scum? Do you panic this easily as scum?

[Socrates]

Well you missed it because you couldn't see it - I was LLD's best friend. Although that was only for yesterday and last Night. Now she has a new best friend. In fact that the only reason I even asked DS to confirm the possibility of third parties (which happened in the PT) whic led to his post was because LLD said basically "Yeah, he's third party".

And if camn somehow isn't scum LLD would be my first choice. She ostensibly Neighborized me to "sort" me as her biggest question mark but really did nothing to prod conversation between us.

I'll be sure to keep this in mind, but my problem wasn't the idea of Uzi being third party. It's that you used the fact that the mod wouldn't confirm the presence of a third party as supporting evidence for the hammer!

In my day, no self respecting mod would EVER answer that question, REGARDLESS of the answer. Not to mention that DS has repeatedly tried to emphasize that he doesn't like people doing this.

[Socrates]

Your whole thing about thing about how you've "made peace with your mislynch but I hope my case on Camn will live on!" and then throwing insults at me is the very definition of panicking.

[Socrates]

But you ARE implying that I'm stupid for voting you in a very backhanded way.

[Socrates]

Fuck it, now this is just crazy. I'm going to claim.

I'm a one-shot commuter with a drawback, just like Kraska. This is why I was going all hubba-wubba at her claim, but I re-examined her play, liked what I saw, saw how she had the exact same reaction to Uzi's claim as I did, and then looked at just how our roles aligned and thought 'this HAS to be a red herring'.

This is actually part of the reason why I'm currently sitting on Magna. A true bulletproof ON TOP of all the conditional protection in this game? And the flipped scum power is useless against ALL of it!? What IS this game?

And now we have ANOTHER set of conflicting claims?

Great, now I have to look at Kraska again, because there's no way they're BOTH red herrings.

Sell me on your claim, Camn. Considering Magna's description of their interactions, I might be willing to believe that LLD is the odd one out, but how does neighborizer fit with you supposedly being an upgrade-able robot? Any breadcrumbs to speak of?

I must admit I've been giving Spy a bit of a pass because he has mentioned being borderline V/LA for most of the game, but your argument about this supposed scum-slip gives me the same vibes as your push on me back in day 1.

[Socrates]

Both Pisskop and Spyrex intimated that they know exactly how being upgraded would effect them, and yet you sound like you don't?

[Socrates]

There's even more to your role?

I'd be lying if I said that wasn't a tough pill to swallow, but I feel like I'm saying that about every claim so far.

I'm going to sleep on this.

[Socrates]

MOD:

I hate to add to all the V/LA issues this game has had, but my internet connection has been super wonky these last few days and it only seems to be getting worse. I'm letting you know now just in case I go dark.

MOD: Just mark it on the Control Panel and that's all that you'll need to do.

@Socrates

– why didn’t you claim your drawback Day 1?

Because I wanted the scum to try to kill me, otherwise my role is useless. and besides, I at least USED to be more than capable of rolling with this particular drawback without it ever becoming an issue. Maybe that isn't orthodox town play, and maybe I'm not the player I used to be, but it's the truth.

Rest assured, if I felt like it needed to be shared, I would share it.

But you ARE implying that I'm stupid for voting you in a very backhanded way.

No, not really. I’m flat out stating that your reasoning for claiming my hammer was bad (discussing the question about 3rd party possibilities and the Mod not confirming or denying) are pretty nonsensical given the actualities of the game-state. That’s NAI as having bad reasoning isn’t solely a Town or Scum trait.

Did you actually read the Mod snippet I posted? I asked him to confirm that the language as written was meant to signify only two alignments (as it does as stated) or if he meant it to mean “at least two alignments” which would allow for 3rd parties. Given he refused to comment left the option open for 3rd party roles.

Yeah, I read that post. I also read his other posts about how he doesn't like town trying to fish for information out of him. Your right that it's the most non-issue in world, that WHY it's so baffling that you would bring it up at all. It comes across as someone trying to gin up as many reasons to hammer as they can.

Considering Magna's description of their interactions, I might be willing to believe that LLD is the odd one out, but how does neighborizer fit with you supposedly being an upgrade-able robot?

Why, if you think I’m scum, do you believe anything I said about the PT without my flip?

Do we really have to play this silly game? Just because I suspect you doesn't mean I am going to flatly ignore everything you say. I would be shocked if you were lying out-right about the neighborizing seeing as how LLD could just contradict you, and she has apparently decided putting forth her own interpretation of your conversation isn't worth her time. I have to wonder if maybe she's trying to distract from the issue by pushing for a robot lynch?

This goes back to the problem I've been having with you today. You talk like I have a super hard-core scum read on you that won't be swayed, when that wasn't really the case. My experience had always been that scum tend to overinflate a townie's suspicion on themselves because the townie IS in fact on the right track, forgetting just how fluid most scum reads tend to be. You don't have to be going ALL CAPS LAWK ALL THE TIME to come across as panicky.

Speaking of this, LLD, DO you have anything to say about Magna's take on your neighbor talk?

[Socrates]

What's your opinion of Magna, Camn? I think you voted him yesterday, yet you haven't really said a word about him today.

What are you doing, Dunn? Just have nothing to say?

Piss, do you really think Dunn is scum, or what?

[Socrates]

#3 as in your pick for third member of the mafia, or third on your current suspect list (under Spy and LLD)? Things have slown down enough that I'm trying to get a sense of where everyone currently stands.

Is LLD the type to talk almost exclusively about her prime lynch target as town, or would that just be mostly a function of her PR?

[Socrates]

You've already asked Spy to give some scum reads, so it seems redundant to badger him further about it. I hope this "theory" stuff isn't just a stall tactic.

[Socrates]

A 12-person mini, no less!

Am I out of my gourd to be getting weird feelings about Dunn? He seemed so townie day 1, but it's occurred to me that his insistence about hiding his upgrading makes things mighty convenient for a ScummDunn do something other than what he says. Like, maybe it's just that he's a straight roleblocker, with the risk that if he roleblocks a robot it gives them a boost?

I don't know the flavor well enough to know if that could fit. It would explain why he would want the name claim from a scum perspective.

And now he's been so reserved today when he had seemed pretty gung-ho about lynching Uzi. It feels weird.

But that's so elaborate! I'm just being crazy right? Someone talk me out of this.

[Socrates]

Dunn's town, I think.

I had thought so too, but I had also been kinda working under the assumption that the Robot's were vanilla until upgraded, but then you claimed otherwise and now I'm trying to rethink how his role fits into the larger game.

I don't think it's massclaim time yet, but if the other robots ARE French Vanilla, then I can't see myself not voting for you.

[Socrates]

A 12-person mini, no less!

Am I out of my gourd to be getting weird feelings about Dunn? He seemed so townie day 1, but it's occurred to me that his insistence about hiding his upgrading makes things mighty convenient for a ScummDunn do something other than what he says. Like, maybe it's just that he's a straight roleblocker, with the risk that if he roleblocks a robot it gives them a boost?

I don't know the flavor well enough to know if that could fit. It would explain why he would want the name claim from a scum perspective.

And now he's been so reserved today when he had seemed pretty gung-ho about lynching Uzi. It feels weird.

But that's so elaborate! I'm just being crazy right? Someone talk me out of this.

Well for starters, a quick fact check shows I wasn't "gung-ho about lynching uzi"

Maybe I'm forgetting, but I thought you vocally rejected his claim based on it being comically absurd. Phone posting, so I'll have to review myself later.

[Socrates]

I've made it to a library today, so let's get some posting in. I shoulda put V/LA like the mod suggested.

Oops I'm here

First of all I've got krasko as town

I don't think pisskop is a godfather either

What do you mean, "Oops, I'm here"? Are you just reading the thread, posting nothing? I certainly can't throw stones about meeting activity requirements, but did you just admit to tactically lurking?

But it looks like Camn admitted to being upgraded, so my theory about you is out the window?

Unless Camn flips scum? Nah, even then it's implausible.

All logic points to you being obvTown, so stop making my spidy-senses tingle, gosh darnit!

[Socrates]

Then in 299 we get “IAI is still scummy but I prefer a pisskop vote” which is textbook Suspect Partner, vote Town.

Except Pisskop might be scum. So if he flips scum.. is this classic: caught one scum, voted other scum? We will see.

I REALLY don't like how you accuse Magna of moving the goal-posts before he even had a chance to do it here, Camn.

The points about NK-ing Nacho also don't work for me one way or the other. Both are plausible narratives, and that's all there really is to it. Not because of "WIFOM", but because it ignores the fact that Mafia is a team game, and individual players don't have 100% freedom to NK based upon their personal whims, not to mention the fact that scum have access to info that we don't. That's why NK speculation is such a crapshoot.

Sure, Nacho was town-reading Camn, but was she confident that it would stick? What if she saw something in his behavior that made her suspect that he was power? She seems to know him pretty well, after all. What if her partner needed Nacho killed?

--

On the other hand, Magna, how do you feel about the fact that Camn's waffle on IAI came just a few posts after

I

said that all catch-up posts read as scummy?

Personally, I thought she had just read my post and agreed.

[Socrates]

Kraska, why are you so confident in a townCamn?

[Socrates]

Re:fake claiming

I'm having a hard time judging when the Aristo-bus was decided upon among the scum. (Remember that scum probably have day-talk, according to Spy) He was clearly in on it, what with the self hammer, and everyone talks (and talked at the time) like Ari is the easiest scum-read on the site. This is why I said Nacho had been my biggest scum-read before seeing his flip on day 2.

The whole thing felt like a plan. This is why I said we shouldn't let Ari die without posting anything. That wasn't me trying to defend him, Magna, that was me saying "don't kill this guy without at least getting a claim out of him", which was where the thread seemed to be going. It was probably a futile statement, but I felt like I had to at least try to say it.

Camn being there to get him to participate in the nameclaim got points from me at the time, but in this context, if scum have fakeclaims, and he was planning to die, not using his would the

shrewd

thing to do and Camn being there to get it out of him would just be convenient.

Hmm.

[Socrates]

You sure drew a lot of random stuff out of me saying I was here

Observing that your phrasing made it sound like you are tactically lurking is "a lot of random stuff"?

Everything else was unrelated.

[Socrates]

I'm not tactically lurking and never said I was

But that's what I said. "Oops, I am here." in response to a prod can EASILY be interpreted that way, but it was PROBABLY just unfortunate phrasing and I am PROBABLY just being paranoid.

Did you even read what I said?

[Socrates]

I read what you said. You interpreted what I said however you wanted to, but I hadn't actually said or implied that

Yeah, I had an initial, instinctive interpretation of your words, probably informed by the fact that I was already feeling weird about you, and then reasoned my way to it probably just being my imagination.

Your reaction to this is confusing the hell out of me. I just talked to Magna about scum over-reacting to minor statements about them by townies, and now here you are.

But again, all other logic points to you being town.

I asked you to

stop

making my spidey-senses tingle!

Pre-edit:

Nuh-uh Camn, this is a bridge too far. If you have something that should save you, then out with it already!

VOTE: CAMN

Pre-Pre-edit:

Dammit, pisskop! Fun fact, did you know that I got burned by a godfather really badly in my very first non-newbie game? I want to believe that you're town, but you're giving my nothing to work with, here!

[Socrates]

For the record this is L-1. Since Socrates didn't bother to mention it.

Oh, whoops! I wasn't counting.

[Socrates]

To be honest, IF all of the claims for NK protection are true, then yeah I actually COULD see an extra NK being the scum-upgrade.

[Socrates]

And maybe you DID try to use it.

Do bulletproofs get notified when their BP is used up?

[Socrates]

Piss fake-claiming 1-shot BP in response to a vig that needs to prove their role would be ballsy as hell.

I don't think I could bring myself to call that bluff. Bravo, if you're scum.

[Socrates]

What is this.

Lady, if I'm understanding you correctly, you're voting him not because of something he said in the neighborhood, but because of a sudden change of heart about how he WOULD behave in the neighborhood?

Please clarify.

[Socrates]

Lady, what is the punishment for failing your PR?

This is important.

[Socrates]

I was all ready to pounce on you having failed your PR yesterday, but god damn is that such a perfectly convenient answer.

God damn.

I am incredulous, here.

Please respond to my other question, and also my earlier question about your night with Magna.

[Socrates]

Nacho's dead, Piss.

[Socrates]

Do you hate me abbreviating your name that way? It just occurred to me that you might.

And I can't see Lady and Spy being scum together. How do you feel about Lady?

[Socrates]

Why would scum be less likely to crumb who was in their neighborhood? I am unfamiliar with this logic.

And do you think it is important that we lynch a robot today? Shouldn't Camn proving her vig settle things, in your shoes?

[Socrates]

Robots: You, Spy, Camn.

Dunn has claimed the ability to upgrade a robot.

People have speculated that exactly one of the robots are scum.

I had assumed the binary between camn and Spy you have been presenting was along this logic.

You are telling me it's not?

And most people think (or at least thought in my day) of a proven vig as being basically confirmed town, because scum would *never* have two NK's. I've already expressed worry that that might not be the case in this game in particular, though.

[Socrates]

Why the hell would a scum neighbor not be upfront about their role? Playing coy about it would just be playing scum poorly.

[Socrates]

Define recently.

[Socrates]

She hopped from the major wagon onto the guy who just derailed the major wagon for ??? reasons at the time that it looked like the wagon would probably fall apart due to the claim.

My thinking was that her words about Spy not listening to her was about the fact that she hadn't seen Spy unvote and was going for the hammer. Or something.

This is why I wanted her to explain more, which she hasn't done.

The Kraska vote is a decent point, though, unless she was totally going to circle back around and be the hammer but wanted to look like she was scumhunting elsewhere in the meantime.

[Socrates]

I need a votecount.

I've completely lost the thread on where everyone is.

MOD: Coming right up.

[Socrates]

Spyrex was the first to unvote the claimed vig whom, by all indications, would almost certainly shoot him specifically if they survived the day. If he is scum and Camn is town, he sure as hell

should

have waited for the 'lulhammer' on Camn from Lady--which she DID try to do, and if anyone would know it was coming, it would be Spy, since they are neighbors.

He has replaced the vote, but only after the hammer window has passed.

That's townie as fuck.

[Socrates]

I am so fed up with MOI's tone right now. Like. So fed up.

Is that how I come across to other people? God I hope not.

--

Camn, you're killing ME now. A townie hammering themselves because they aren't having fun is everything I don't want in the world. The whole reason I walked away from this game back in the day was realizing that the most effective scum tactics are to make the game unfun for the townies. Walls of text. Lurking. Name calling. Arbitrary and inconsistent demands about contribution of "content". All that jazz.

Blahblahblah Appeal to emotions blahdeblahdeblah.

*sigh*

Fuck it, I was going to say that I'm going vote with my heart, but the only reason I even voted you in the first place was because of the way you were handling your claim. I still think MOI is scummy, and his bullheaded insistence on not actually listening to other people and just looking for the flimsiest things to clamp onto in every post that doesn't support his narrative has done nothing to make me think he is town.

VOTE: MOI

I don't care if this causes a loss, this is not how I want this game to be played and I'll happily walk back away with Mafia being a stupid game about ruining other people's fun. If you are faking it Camn, I'm just going to say it's bad form and I'll never play with you again.

[Socrates]

Move your vote back, Camn.

#MakeMafiaScumGreatAgain?

[Socrates]

Spy, Kraska made a good point that most of the town was already heavily skeptical of Uzi's claim. All it would take was a tiny extra bit of conflicting info in the scum PT for him to confidently go out and claim "LIAR".

That might not even have been the plan! The plan might have been soft-counter claim a townie, get him lynched, and then when he flips town go "whoops what a weird setup I guess!"

I thought you hated arguments about Meta? What do you think about MOI's characterization of Camn's meta, which according to Camn, is literal madness?

[Socrates]

MOI, serious question, has scum self-voting in order draw pity ever actually happened -- and WORKED -- on this site in the last few years?

My experience had always been the same. Player gets fed up with tedious arguing that goes nowhere, genuinely gives up, self-votes because they don't want to play anymore.

Everyone else shouts "AtE! AtE! AtE!" and then they proceed to get lynched almost every time. I have to admit that it's been a long time and, if I have seen the self-vote gambit work, I have forgotten it. Even the times I saw it flip scum, they were still genuine about giving up.

I think Camn was genuinely upset. Maybe she's not some 'wilting flower', but this game, more than most, has the power to seriously get under people's skin, especially when you feel like your main antagonist is being not just endlessly contrarian but also snarky and condescending about it at the same time.

The thing is, from my shoes, if Camn was just being being shrewd about how to best survive, all she had to do was talk to me. I think anyone can see I was not all that interested in a Camn lynch, and the only reason I hadn't yet bothered to move my vote off of her wagon was because she was in no danger when I was last online and I am slow about moving my vote around. I think a calm, manipulative Camn would see this and start engaging me directly rather than start flailing on some futile AtE gambit that just makes everyone else go "ha ha! gotem!" and has only drawn a collapsing wagon back onto her.

I think she was genuine about being upset and wanting to quit, so I ask you the following because you seem to have the most experience with her (though to hear her tell it, you're the last person to ask this question): Would Camn be more likely to get frustrated and quit as town or as scum? I've been reconsidering and maybe THIS is the time the scum overestimates my read on them.

(I'm also serious when I say that faking that kind of behavior is straight up bad sportsmanship in the first place and if she demonstrates a consistent pattern of doing this I will be policy voting her in the future.)

PS: The feeling's mutual.

[Socrates]

I had discarded my "premeditated bus" theory about aristo once Nacho flipped town, but I suppose Kraska also threw down a vote on him super-duper early, if I'm remembering.

[Socrates]

@Magna: Without having read your link yet (I will), I'd like to clarify I am specifically talking about self-voting, not just general AtE. That always got special distinction because it was 'playing against your win-con' and made people mad, rather than drew pity (just like it did in this game). I would love to supply a specific example, but I don't have the time (nor energy, to be honest) to start combing through 6+ year old game threads to find one. I did quite a bit of reading of games I wasn't in, and I do have to admit that I don't entirely trust my own memory. That's why I am turning to another player.

Spy's input here would also be appreciated.

Let me look at the game you linked.

[Socrates]

Would Camn be more likely to get frustrated and quit as town or as scum?

It's only the lesser aspect of me that gets that way....and I think it's either alignment. Magna said himself that he didn't understand my behavior in Buffy from a strategic perspective....And my slot went on to easily win that game. I just honestly couldn't take the shit play.

But the

real

me drinks the blood of my enemies.
No quitting.

I appreciate the honesty and, if you are town, I don't want to encourage townies to start lying about their meta to provoke town-reads, but you have to understand that this doesn't exactly inspire confidence.

Spyrex and Kraska flashwagons out of nowhere! I've been townreading them both!

Camn I don't like you trying to undersell Spyrex's stance on you. He tried to post knifecrab! If that isn't a firm stance I don't know what is.

I'm also real bummed to see Kraska apathy vote on Spyrex when we still have a full day left. First post today that has made me seriously consider MOI's narrative.

Piss said that Kraska's scumplay is to fluffpost without really trying. I'd love to hear his thoughts on her right now.

[Socrates]

I'm also real bummed to see Kraska apathy vote on Spyrex when we still have a full day left. First post today that has made me seriously consider MOI's narrative.

Forget this. I just double checked the timer and we have 12 hours less time left than I thought we did. I'm leaving the library now and I can't guarantee time to check in closer to the deadline, so I'm going to try to break this stalemate now.

VOTE: CAMN

I've been back and forth on her all day, but her claim IS hard to believe, her push on Spyrex feels forced, and while I feel for her outburst, she HAS demonstrated a willingness to behave that way as scum before so I can't in good faith discount her based on that alone.

All those promised Camn wagoners, get back over here.

[Socrates]

I'm not talking about it.from a wifom perspective.

So you lld and i cant all be scum together right.

Lld has neighborized you.
Lld has neighborized me.

So at least once, if shes scum, shes wasted the ability. After a man down.

Its not a 50-50 game its a gamble with minimal payoff as scum

She pretty boldly said her ability was compulsive very early on. With that in mind, scum neighborizor is a high-stress role that requires having to spin your scum web on two fronts. If she wasn't confident in her ability to perform, I wouldn't be surprised for her to chose to neighborize her scumbuddy to buy her a night's reprieve.

That said, if Magna was that scumbuddy, I wouldn't expect him to out their D2 neighbor status and cast shade her way unless their was serious drama going on between them in the scum PT.

You, on the other hand, wouldn't be too crazy a possibility. I had read her sudden outburst on you as "I'ma mad that I can't manipulate you!", but I suppose that could have just been a distancing tactic that no other player would ever follow with the aforementioned plan to circle around and hammer whichever townie got to L-1.

And let me reiterate that her claimed punishment for failing her PR does not sit with me at all. A

chance

her ability might fail? A

chance

?

Apologies to the replacement, but I would be happy to lynch that slot if we can muster the votes.

Camn, I've been thinking about your suggestion about bouncing your shot off a claimed BP. Magna would be a terrible idea, because if we misslynch today, a BP scumMagna can just lie about the notification and autowin, but testing Pisskop might not be a bad idea. A BP Godfather with the potential to be further upgraded (assuming he's actually a robot)? That seems crazy. Either he's lying scum or we confirm you both.

[Socrates]

I didn't assume that Piss's claim was bull, I believed it was a serious claim. He's been pretty happy to flippantly refer to his role and he himself said that roles are overrated. I'll go re-read the exchange, but it wasn't obvious to me that he would be faking it as a townie.

As to your scenarios, it would depend on Piss's flip. You seem to forget that BP's are notified when they get shot, so...

1) Scum had to double team him, confirming the vig shot occuring
2) we wait for Pisskop to say whether or not he got shot.

If he's town lieing about being BP, then BLAH! STOP LYING ABOUT YOUR ROLES, PEOPLE!

[Socrates]

You seem to forget that BP's are notified when they get shot, so...

Diamond said if their BPs are used up they are notified.

If you are talking to me specifically I am unlimited so it would never be used up.

So there isn't any reason to assume that I would be notified.

@MOD

- would an unlimited BP be informed of being shot?

Ah, I had forgotten that you claimed unlimited. But that just reinforces the fact that shooting YOU would be a bad idea, which is what I said. Piss claimed 1-shot, unless I'm also mis-remembering that.

And if it was just Pisskop joking around, then forget it.

[Socrates]

Too late, I guess.

[Socrates]

No love for Zoidberg...

[Socrates]

Though you are basically Sweden in WWII. You should've done something g to prevent my murder.

You try to wound me for being unsure of myself, but now I'm just curious how Swedish schools teach WWII to their children.

I never really got taught about what their perspective on the war was in the first place other than vauguely smug dismissal about them not taking a side. It
might have been more sinister than that, but I wouldn't know.

Americans only get to be all high and mighty about WWII because Germany turned out to be SUPER DUPER FUCKING EVIL in a way that was independent of their war machine and had nothing to do with America's own involvement in the war. Americans themselves wanted to stay out of it until Japan shouted "COME AT ME BRO!" from across the pacific.

Hindsight is 20/20, and while Sweden would probably be aware of German anti-semitism, everywhere in the world is fucking biggoted in some form or capacity. I shouldn't need to remind you about the Japanese-American interment camps.

To put it in Mafia terms, Germany ended up flipping scum, but I wonder what it all looked like to a place like Sweden before the dust settled.

[Socrates]

Mod:Family just arrived in town. Officially V/LA until new years.

[Socrates]

Do we wait for a replacement for Kraska before we vote for the NL?

Are you caught up, Shadow_Step?

[Socrates]

Still V/LA for two more days. (Families!)

The consensus seems to be no lynch as soon as the replacements catch up, so I'm going to go ahead and put this out:

VOTE: No Lynch

We need four people to vote to get on with it, so I'm not trying to cut them off, just putting it down now in case I'm not around so there's less waiting as soon as everyone's ready.

Shadow, could you give us your perspective on the neighbor threads between your slot/MOI and your slot/Spyrex?

[Socrates]

Kuroi what exactly is the point of saying that you are not scum?

It' a cute intro. Leave it at that.

Camn did this more or less the whole game. Shadow should have seen at least some of that by now.

[Socrates]

Kuroi what exactly is the point of saying that you are not scum?

It' a cute intro. Leave it at that.

Camn did this more or less the whole game. Shadow should have seen at least some of that by now.

Judging me based on others is definitely not a good idea.

It's such a softball question, though. Townies do it, scum do it. All the person being questioned needs to respond with is "I'm funning around" or somesuch, and that's the end of that.

More reading:
- Townie points from MOI although he's quite difficult to read. His first point in 206 is odd. I haven't seen him so outraged based off poor grammar. And this is coming from me, the grammar lord himself.
- Socrates' 241 gave me a scum vibe since it was less town-motivated and more dismissive than something I'd imagine from town.
- Dunnstrall is throwing his votes on page 13 like they're candy? wtf?
- Camn's 418 is actually pretty good.
- 521 is reminding me of Spyrex's lurking, which I don't like.
- Page 22 makes me believe Dunn might be town, because he's acting believably scummy.
- 598, and unprovoked! I kind of really think you're scum!
- 603 I'm struggling if this is protecting of scum, but I'll take it.

I'll stop here, at the end of page 25.

Unprovoked? We did a mass name-claim.
You must be doing some serious selective reading if you missed that.

[Socrates]

I saw this page and the first post. We lynched scum day one. Pisskop is IC. Anything else I should know?

Pisskop is also BP, so we're no-lynching to hopefully get the scum to kill one of the non-confirmeds.

We did a mass nameclaim day one because Dunnstral was looking for robots. Pisskop, Spyrex, and Camn had all claimed to be robots.

What do your neighbor threads look like?

[Socrates]

I'm thinking we get on with the no-lynch, and if Kuroi truly is town the night phase will give him time to read the thread in full and get a clearer picture of the gamestate. What's more, if they're scum they won't have that excuse to fall back on anymore. Titus doesn't seem interested in digging into the backlog either, so there's nothing to wait for there, unless she has something she still wants to add.

@Magna: The obvious conclusion is that they don't have a positive way to spin their actions in the neighborhoods, and it's hard not to see scum there. The problem is that LLD seemed to have some personal stuff going on leading up to her ban, Shadow just flaked more or less, and Titus is really committing to not reading (which, if I'm being fair, I can sympathize with when replacing into endgame with a lot of pages), so I'm continuing to push the topic to make sure it's not just a fluke of the gods that I'm not getting a straight answer.

@Titus: What's the penalty for failing your post restriction?

[Socrates]

And Titus, I specifically wanted your impression of the neighborhoods without context, because while that might not help you read other people, it will help me read you.

[Socrates]

I feel like I'm missing something.

[Socrates]

Are you sure they didn't try to shoot you?

When I saw the lack of a kill, I figured the scum tried to call your bluff.

[Socrates]

GOD DAMMIT PISSKOP!

[Socrates]

THE FUCK WAS YOUR PLAN, EVEN!?

[Socrates]

Are you sure they didn't try to shoot you?

When I saw the lack of a kill, I figured the scum tried to call your bluff.

If you are Town Socrates what makes you think this sort of question at that juncture is in any way Pro-Town?

THE FUCK IS THIS QUESTION?

If Pisskop falseclears a member of the scum team on shit logic, then we're done! That's game over! Trying to make sure he had actually thought things through before declaring Kuroi as town is the MOST Pro-town thing to do.

And guess what, his logic, whatever it was, was shit! Now we've lost our IC, and Kuroi clearly isn't actually confirmed as town.

This was the worst move he could possibly have made!

I am so mad right now.

Scum would have been happy to just let him keep on with it, though, especially if Kuroi is, in fact, a member of the scum team.

[Socrates]

PISSKOP, DON'T YOU REALIZE THAT IF YOU HAD LIED ABOUT BEING BP INSTEAD OF ABOUT BEING A DOC YOU COULD HAVE POTENTIALLY BOUGHT US AN EXTRA LYNCH WHEN THE SCUM TRY TO KILL THE CLAIMED IC/DOC!?

[Socrates]

I dont trust the first real heat coming from you in lylo. You've been fairly chill and that smells fake but gdi pisskop

However i reaaaly dont get mois questions yesterday and i think this is gonna come down to what happened the last two nights

@mod:
Does a bp know when theyve lost their bp?

I already asked him this question, and he said yes.

[Socrates]

Given pisskop's flip, it is highly unlikely for Kuroi to be scum. Pisskop had a doctor role. If he lied, then that's just rather fucking stupid. So we can presume that pisskop believed Kuroi to be clear. Unless scum knew that Pisskop was a doctor, rather than a bulletproof, they would be unlikely to randomly wifom no kill. Possible, yes. Likely, not really.

I don't have any interest in flipping Kuroi.

Pisskop claimed multi-shot BP after being revealed as an IC. He was actually a one-shot BP. He's dead now. How can he be dead unless he was shot twice?

Unless there's a serial killer that has been waiting the whole game to make his move, nobody tried to shoot Kuroi the previous night, and he is in no way cleared.

And yes, if he was conciously lying about this, then it is rather fucking stupid. That's why I'm mad!

[Socrates]

I dont trust the first real heat coming from you in lylo. You've been fairly chill and that smells fake but gdi pisskop.

If I can't get fed up with ridiculous bullshit at LYLO, then when CAN I get fed up with it?

And also this is NOT the first time I have lost my cool this game. Did you forget how mad I got at MOI on day 3?

[Socrates]

Can't tell if Socrates is legitimately pissed or grandstanding.

Oh, I assure you, it is the former. I'm going to now walk away from my computer to go cool off.

Is there another missing nightkill?

No.

[Socrates]

Actually, before I leave, the thought just occurred to me that there might, in fact, actually be a serial killer in our midst, and between all of the protective roles in this game we might have just fluked our way into 1 kill a night the whole game!

[Socrates]

I dont trust the first real heat coming from you in lylo. You've been fairly chill and that smells fake but gdi pisskop

However i reaaaly dont get mois questions yesterday and i think this is gonna come down to what happened the last two nights

@mod:
Does a bp know when theyve lost their bp?

I cannot answer this question.

Uhhhhh.....

And maybe you DID try to use it.

Do bulletproofs get notified when their BP is used up?

I'm assuming this is directed at me.

Yes.

I was about to write this big apology post about how I let myself vent my frustration about real life issues in the game thread and how I was sorry I acted so childish, but am I about to have a whole

new

reason to be pissed off?

[Socrates]

Like, if the mod forgot that he already answered this question in the affirmative and then, further, changed his policy mid-game and didn't tell pisskop, that would completely explain pisskop's behavior yesterday and be the biggest mod-fuckup I've ever seen.

Please tell me this isn't what happened.

[Socrates]

VOTE: Magna

[Socrates]

For the record, I was in fact pissed off when I started posting last night. It was for reasons outside of the game, but the anger was real. I woke up today worried I had just lost the game because I let it influence my posting.

[Socrates]

I honestly have no idea if I played well or not. Every moment felt like we were surviving through the very skin of our teeth.

Camn was so super-duper-mega town that it boggles my mind that we were able to get her lynched. And she had a provable ability! And was about to shoot scum! And we had no way to stop her!

And Uzi was provable as well! And he got lynched too!

And Pisskop really should have claimed his doc ability instead of his bullet proof, and then pushed for a lynch, like I said. Even if the gambit he tried to pull wasn't obviously a lie, he was the only one we were ever going to shoot.

Dunn played his role well, but should have taken a more pro-active stance about his positions on day 3. LLD would still have been a mislynch, but we quite literally NEEDED to lynch Camn or we were fucked. If she shot Spy, there was no way I was going to make it through two more mislynches on my own. I'm not that good at this game!

And Jae, yes, your cop breadcrumb was incredibly obvious, and is more or less the only reason you got killed. The way you expanded your argument to not lynch any of the robots threw me for a bit about whether you were more than just a cop, but the fact that you were an information role was undeniable.

[Socrates]

Talk to Socrates. He is the only hope for sensibility here.
LLD is gone.
Magna has too much of his ego tied up in it, plus maybe scum.
Spyrex ...If he was town he could be swayed...But he isn't.
And pisskop would hammer anyone.

So Socrates is my Schindler. Only he can save me from genocide.

Sorry Camn, I was your Brute.

I even did want to save you, but you were going to shoot my good buddy! My hands were tied!

[Socrates]

socrates was scum???????




i was like.......3248398% fooled socrates

I honestly started to feel bad about how you were going to react when you found out.

[Socrates]

Here's a fun game for anyone that reviews this thread: try to spot the point in the game that I lost access to my anxiety medication, and then try to guess when I got it back.

I bet it's real obvious if you know to look for it!

[Socrates]

I'm fine with the scum topic being revealed. The only thing I'm really embarrassed to be seen is when I drunkenly speculated that Kraska was a traitor. I was less than sober when I said that.

And Jae, yes, your cop breadcrumb was incredibly obvious, and is more or less the only reason you got killed. The way you expanded your argument to not lynch any of the robots threw me for a bit about whether you were more than just a cop, but the fact that you were an information role was undeniable.

Honestly, I half knew pisskop was town because I was playing with him and dunn as scum in another game at the same time.

But I knew I wasn't likely to stop a lynch on pisskop without having the inno result, and I don't lie as town. It gave him enough time to get conftowned by Dunn and I was hoping he'd do a little more because I have seen him pull off some good plays. It just wasn't meant to be

You did the right thing, to be honest, and literally everyone in the town should have picked up on it converged on you. Camn did, props to her, but both Uzi and pisskop himself should have wanted to use their protection on you, but then Uzi got lynched and Pisskop didn't submit any action. You copped good in the context of this setup, it was really the rest of the town that let you down.

[Socrates]

glad I didn't replace in

still don't have the heart to get SpyreX

but I owe Socrates revenge from 6 years ago PYP

Ah, memories.

Long time no see, friend! I wasn't sure if this game was going to be a one-and-done deal for me, but I obviously have to let you get your revenge. Just point me at a game and I'm /in.

[Socrates]

Well played soc and spy. Sorry my play was so bad. aristo, I left you in a really crappy spot. It's like I've forgotten how to play as scum or something...

All good man! I hope you get your groove back!
I didn't do the slot any good anyway, so that's on me too!

Again congrats to the scum team. Those not named Aristo did a great job of basically staying out of the way as Town slugged itself to death. Which, basically, is the goal of a Mafia team.

I honestly don't know what is wrong with me when I roll scum. I really have to work on this, because my meta has been glaringly obvious. With very few exceptions my scumgame is weak AF!

I'm sorry, if I had known that you struggle with playing scum I would have made more effort to give you support in the PT. Spy and I weren't talking to each other much because there was little need, but I can see how that might feel a bit intimidating to a fresh replacement.