OPEN 663: STACK THE DECK (GAME OVER)


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Post Post #21 (isolation #0) » Thu Dec 22, 2016 4:05 am

Post by davesaz »

Mafia have secrets.
VOTE: Secret Agent Jin
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Post Post #38 (isolation #1) » Thu Dec 22, 2016 10:26 am

Post by davesaz »

PyP X/Y is my favorite setup but I like anything with some randomness to the roles.
My least favorite role is bodyguard.
Don't think I have a preference for alignment.
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Post Post #139 (isolation #2) » Fri Dec 23, 2016 9:26 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 137, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 130, ThinkBig wrote:
In post 102, Dunnstral wrote:It's about intent. Get off of me. I'm not getting lynched. Vote Gamma.
In post 103, Dunnstral wrote:Next thing you know I'll be l-5 followed by l-4
I find these two posts to be an over reaction and I'm not liking post 103.
To play devil's advocate for myself, not sure why I'd make such a big deal of it as scum
In order to wifom once people call you on it.
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Post Post #140 (isolation #3) » Fri Dec 23, 2016 9:27 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 136, Superhans wrote:
In post 135, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 117, Superhans wrote:@Dunnstral,
Why are you voting Gamma?
Would you want to convince other players to do the same?
He's not engaging in anything while being here, very odd for him.


MARIA is also trying to be as scummy as possible it would seem
I can get behind a pressure wagon.
VOTE: Gamma Emerald
Pressure is more useful if the target doesn't know you're voting merely for pressure.
Also note to myself to see if the quoted post becomes relevant later.
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Post Post #143 (isolation #4) » Fri Dec 23, 2016 9:30 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 111, ssbm_Kyouko wrote:Oh I guess there was something to comment on. Disagree with you realeo about thinkbig only have 2 options and I don't like his questions because they could be potentially intended to rolefish in some way. Problem is this particular fish might be town, and I've seen him ask the same questions before in a game I was spectating. Either that or he copied his questions from that game. Not sure
Did either the comments you were replying to or the reply itself advance your reads on those players?
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Post Post #144 (isolation #5) » Fri Dec 23, 2016 9:31 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 142, ThinkBig wrote:
In post 141, Dunnstral wrote:davesaz scummy
Why?
I don't think I've ever posted anything that Dunn didn't think is scummy.
Inability to comprehend my playstyle perhaps? :roll:
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Post Post #222 (isolation #6) » Sat Dec 24, 2016 6:25 am

Post by davesaz »

V/LA till Monday.
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Post Post #263 (isolation #7) » Mon Dec 26, 2016 4:46 pm

Post by davesaz »

@mod: Dunnstral and I voting for a cloned player?


Fixed!
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Post Post #295 (isolation #8) » Tue Dec 27, 2016 9:35 am

Post by davesaz »

Yes, thanks!

The Gamma wagon is in response to a clear joke based on username. It doesn't really make sense to me yet but I would need to slow down from catchup speed to see if I've missed something about Gamma's reaction to being wagoned.
I don't remember the basis of the Realeo wagon and would need to reread.
The SAJ vote was RVS. I typically don't move it until I have an actual scumread. That usually takes quite a lot of content in the thread. IIRC this game already had an unusually high filler ratio but I'm not positive about it.
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Post Post #297 (isolation #9) » Tue Dec 27, 2016 10:58 am

Post by davesaz »

Does that mean you think it wasn't a joke? Or that you think the wagon was for a different reason?
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Post Post #300 (isolation #10) » Tue Dec 27, 2016 11:56 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 262, grapes wrote:
Realeo ( 4 ) -
(ssbm_Kyouko, Gamma Emerald, algebra, Secret Agent Jin)
Superhans ( 2 ) -
(Kop, MariaR)
MariaR ( 2 ) -
(ReubenWasFine, ThinkBig)
Secret Agent Jin ( 2 ) -
(davesaz, Dunnstral)
Gamma Emerald ( 1 ) -
(Superhans)

Not Voting ( 1 ) -
(Realeo)
In post 291, grapes wrote:
Gamma Emerald ( 5 ) -
(Superhans, ThinkBig, Realeo, Desperado, Kop)
Realeo ( 3 ) -
(ssbm_Kyouko, algebra, Secret Agent Jin)
Desperado ( 2 ) -
(ReubenWasFine, Gamma Emerald)
Secret Agent Jin ( 2 ) -
(davesaz, Dunnstral)

Not Voting ( 0 )
Gamma's wagon popped up really fast. I agree that there is not much content there, but don't know that it rates such a quick L-2. Though I do endorse the idea of wagons as town, to try to get movement. I want to examine which votes seem opportunistic there. Unfortunately most of them are going to come across that way. Realeo and Desperado still stand out for placement and CW reasons.

I see Realeo as having more posts but much the same kind of posting as Gamma. MariaR/Desperado slot is similar as well.
I'm only partway through reviewing the game, still getting impressions on everyone...
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Post Post #302 (isolation #11) » Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:11 pm

Post by davesaz »

counter wagon
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Post Post #303 (isolation #12) » Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:11 pm

Post by davesaz »

Which is not enough to go on by itself of course, but important to recognize.
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Post Post #308 (isolation #13) » Tue Dec 27, 2016 2:21 pm

Post by davesaz »

Which post and why do you think it's scummy?
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Post Post #312 (isolation #14) » Tue Dec 27, 2016 3:27 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 309, Dunnstral wrote: These ones. I thought they were scummy at the time. I didin't vote you and you can stop acting like you didn't do anything
I'm not sure what you mean by "acting like I didn't do anything". Am I trying to disclaim posts or something?

The question is why you thought they were scummy. Do you not want to answer that question?
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Post Post #314 (isolation #15) » Tue Dec 27, 2016 3:33 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 311, Realeo wrote:Gamma is capable of making content when the RVS is over, fyi.
Yeah, I had already noted the lack of content.
In post 300, davesaz wrote:I agree that there is not much content there
However the timing of when the wagon happened could be important. Whether the people who voted were voting because of the joke, the joke seems to be the trigger on timing. The first vote after that point could have brought Gamma to the attention of the others. That happens to coincide with Desperado being voted. It makes me wonder if there is someone who doesn't want Desperado votes.
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Post Post #315 (isolation #16) » Tue Dec 27, 2016 3:36 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 313, Dunnstral wrote:They're scummy because I felt like they were. If I wanted to make a case it wouldn't be off of those two posts.
That's not going to help sort your motive, but whatever you like...
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Post Post #374 (isolation #17) » Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:27 am

Post by davesaz »

Posted around 12:15.
In post 328, grapes wrote:
Antihuman replaces ReubenWasFine!
Posted around 2:19. (2 hours later)
In post 329, Antihuman wrote:Lol everybody who's sheeping the Gamma wagon "cause he posts fluff" should take a good fucking look at ThinkingBig
I think this looks like a player who arrived just after a VC and did catchup by iso of the players on the biggest wagon. The 2 hour gap shows that there was plenty of time to do that.
The catchup post has a lot more detail than I'd expect from scum trying to pick someone at random to push to derail a wagon on a buddy.
Not sure why y'all are reading it that way. I'm open to being convinced. Is there something wrong with the points in 329?
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Post Post #375 (isolation #18) » Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:29 am

Post by davesaz »

Best guess, Kop hasn't read and unvoted in response to the prod.
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Post Post #377 (isolation #19) » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:14 am

Post by davesaz »

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Post Post #378 (isolation #20) » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:16 am

Post by davesaz »

I said y'all because couldn't remember who and didn't want to interrupt writing my post. Plus it helps to see if anyone else thought that by the replies...
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Post Post #426 (isolation #21) » Fri Dec 30, 2016 7:16 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 409, Realeo wrote:
@To the people who are voting AntiHuman


If you scumread AH, how come you didn't scumread ThinkBig?
Please explain why you'd expect people scumreading one to scumread the other.
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Post Post #427 (isolation #22) » Fri Dec 30, 2016 7:17 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 414, Realeo wrote:
In post 412, Dunnstral wrote:Also why are you trying to push it that one of AH/TB has to be scum?
I'm having hard time processing why people are triggered by AH, but not by TB.
Do you think they did similar things or something?
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Post Post #450 (isolation #23) » Fri Dec 30, 2016 4:41 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 445, Realeo wrote:Am I the only one who didn't townread ThinkBig? Why I feel alienated?
Why do you feel such a need for others to share your read?
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Post Post #453 (isolation #24) » Fri Dec 30, 2016 5:38 pm

Post by davesaz »

I'm not sure what your reads on the two slots are.
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Post Post #455 (isolation #25) » Fri Dec 30, 2016 5:59 pm

Post by davesaz »

I'm trying to get him to answer that for himself...

I thought that I had made a very good analysis of the timing of AH's first substantial post. I don't see why anyone would think the intent of that post was to derail the Gamma wagon.
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Post Post #540 (isolation #26) » Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:44 pm

Post by davesaz »

Just realized I've been reading but not posting.
In retrospect I think MariaR did indeed crumb traitor. Too late at night to dig further but I can vote at least.
VOTE: Desperado
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Post Post #644 (isolation #27) » Wed Jan 04, 2017 6:15 am

Post by davesaz »

I do not agree with the common assessment of AH's entrance. I think he ISO'd the people on the biggest wagon and posted a legitimate case on one of them as a form of catchup.
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Post Post #645 (isolation #28) » Wed Jan 04, 2017 6:16 am

Post by davesaz »

I still think Desperado would be the best lynch.
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Post Post #654 (isolation #29) » Wed Jan 04, 2017 10:34 am

Post by davesaz »

Unofficial VC
Antihuman ( 5 ) - (Gamma Emerald, Desperado, ThinkBig, Alisae, Superhans)
ThinkBig ( 2 ) - (Antihuman, Realeo)
Desperado ( 2 ) - (Dunnstral, davesaz)
Realeo ( 1 ) - (algebra)
Gamma Emerald (1) - ssbm_Kyouko

Not Voting (1) - Kop
8 hours remaining

I still have doubts about Antihuman being scum but it's in town's best interests to avoid a no-lynch. And I could be wrong...
VOTE: Antihuman

That should be L-1. Superhans' vote was not because ssbm_Kyouko had moved off.
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Post Post #665 (isolation #30) » Wed Jan 04, 2017 11:58 am

Post by davesaz »

And now we're back to L-2 with Desperado's vote change.
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Post Post #679 (isolation #31) » Wed Jan 04, 2017 2:38 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 671, Desperado wrote:Why have Dave and Alisae been pushing me as traitor all day but are both fine voting AH and could never get a real wagon going on me?
Because the others are blind?
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Post Post #795 (isolation #32) » Sat Jan 07, 2017 10:41 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 774, Superhans wrote:@Davesaz
Name 2 players you would kill right now.
TBH after the AH flip my reads need a complete redo. The things I saw that made the Desperado slot look like traitor need to be analyzed a different way, AH's replace in needs to be reread, and there is all that wagon analysis to be done. It hasn't helped that my screen time today has been severely limited.
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Post Post #861 (isolation #33) » Sun Jan 08, 2017 10:13 am

Post by davesaz »

Being late in the "batting order" due to timezones and lifestyle is kinda annoying because it makes me look like a sheep at times, but...

I agree on the analysis of AH/TB interactions. TB is probably scum. I actually thought AH's "case" was pretty good -- but traitor can pick a partner to get the attention of and it fits perfectly for that scenario.
VOTE: ThinkBig
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Post Post #924 (isolation #34) » Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:59 pm

Post by davesaz »

Do
not
claim because of this PSA. If you have a role and choose to claim it for other reasons I'd recommend not unless they're good reasons.

A goon cop inno is only a real inno if there are only 2 town PRs. If there is a 3rd town role then mafia could (but is not guaranteed to) have a role which would return not a goon.
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Post Post #942 (isolation #35) » Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:06 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 928, Desperado wrote:But dave's rolefishing was noted.
I should start compiling a list of how often spurious rolefishing accusations are made by scum vs. town.
Especially ones after the poster has explicitly warned people to not accidentally reveal themselves.
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Post Post #943 (isolation #36) » Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:06 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 941, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 932, grapes wrote:10 days, 4 hours, 57 minutes remain until deadline.
??

There was like 13 days left when you claimed?
:up: :!:
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Post Post #966 (isolation #37) » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:06 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 950, Desperado wrote:Who gives a shit when the deadline is? Both wagons were L-2.
TBH I was not accurately keeping count, but I think this is wrong.
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Post Post #1061 (isolation #38) » Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:15 am

Post by davesaz »

I've been super busy. I've made it a point to finish out games that I start, and I do expect my activity peak to slow down eventually.

I'll run through my reads to see where I am.
Superhans - Town
Desperado - Actions have been pretty scummy. It's possible my traitor read on this slot was because it was scum seeking the traitor.
davesaz - Town
ThinkBig - Actions of AH push scum here. I think I haven't paid close enough attention to the content because of the clear scum implications... Could be misdirection and AH wasn't trying to crumb at all
Kop - Really can't get a handle on him. Thinking he seems more disinterested town but I have trouble remembering the meta here.
Dunnstral - Town
algebra - ConfTown
Realeo - Getting mixed signals
Gamma Emerald - Claimed a town role, don't remember especially scummy interactions, but interactions would indicate scum if not overruled
Alisae - Had been thinking town, not as sure recently

Putting that in order
Town - Superhans, davesaz, Dunnstral, algebra
TownLean - Alisae, Gamma Emerald
Null/Scumlean - Kop, Realeo
Scum - ThinkBig, Desperado
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Post Post #1065 (isolation #39) » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:45 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1063, Desperado wrote:Have you read anything I've said w/r/t AH and ThinkBig?
I'm using things that happened before you joined the game.
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Post Post #1125 (isolation #40) » Fri Jan 13, 2017 5:51 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1061, davesaz wrote:
I've been super busy. I've made it a point to finish out games that I start, and I do expect my activity peak to slow down eventually.
For the record, I'm not even trying hard yet. But I do believe everything I've posted.
If you scumread me for that you're an idiot. That might be a scumtell for other people but not for me.
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Post Post #1129 (isolation #41) » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:00 am

Post by davesaz »

You're making an assumption that my post targeted any specific player.
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Post Post #1130 (isolation #42) » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:01 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 155, MariaR wrote:Oh no I'm found scum in 155 posts
...so scary
Crumb
In post 246, MariaR wrote:Crumbing roles are something I expect scum to do more then town but it really is NAI unless it's leading up to someone being under pressure.
Crumbs are by scum
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Post Post #1133 (isolation #43) » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:09 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 249, MariaR wrote:I don't really think it's something to dwell over
But I'm seriously not crumbing I'm scum, move along.
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Post Post #1136 (isolation #44) » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:19 am

Post by davesaz »

Why didn't preview show more posts?

My current TB scumread is completely unrelated to originally thinking Maria/Desperado slot was traitor. My TB scumread is based on thinking that AH as traitor did indeed try to reveal that he <knew> TB was scum.

Now suppose I'm wrong about AH's intention, and he was trying to push TB as a mislynch. If scum had really wanted to mislynch TB based on AH's entrance case they might have pulled it off that day. I certainly agreed with that case. The only reason I didn't jump on it with both feet is a number of people I was hard townreading didn't like the case. I never believed AH was scum and was really surprised he flipped traitor.

I can easily accept that y'all think I'm wrong. I'm often wrong as town, sometimes spectacularly wrong. But I have to play it like I see it.

BTW this message brought to you by virtue of me ignoring a meeting in progress to type it. The team is looking at code which is unlikely to have any bugs. But I'm going to need to actually appear like I'm working so further replies may be seriously delayed.
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Post Post #1266 (isolation #45) » Sat Jan 14, 2017 6:15 am

Post by davesaz »

Pedit: in response to Kop's post and the conversation leading to it.

So many fallacies
There are more games with traitor than the ones you've played
Not all setups with a traitor have the possibility of a recruit
There could be players who have never seen the role and don't know how it "should" be played (according to your preconceived notions)
There could be players who think differently about the role and play it differently than "standard"
There could be a situation where a player wants to play differently than they would otherwise

Several of you are missing something entirely. Scum would want to know who the traitor is, but my opinion they have no reasonable motivation to post anything about it. (not necessarily though, my last point above applies here)
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Post Post #1267 (isolation #46) » Sat Jan 14, 2017 6:19 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1264, Desperado wrote:I just don't understand why Dave scum would push and vote me as the traitor, or how a wagon didn't form on me if his buddy wasn't already pushing that theory with him.
Reinforcing my other post -- why would scum anybody push anyone as traitor? Ideally they'd want town to overlook the traitor possibility, as the true function of a traitor is to slip by even if all the scum are caught.
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Post Post #1268 (isolation #47) » Sat Jan 14, 2017 6:21 am

Post by davesaz »

There are much better ways for scum to push a mislynch. They should use anything but traitor as an excuse. I honestly can't see how this is even a thing! Yes, townie me saw something which happened to be wrong, and I pushed it, townies do that all the time. :roll:
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Post Post #1270 (isolation #48) » Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:39 am

Post by davesaz »

It looks like Kop is painted into a corner.
His scumread Gamma claimed a town PR but his vote is still parked there.
The wagon on TB has wound down so it's pointless for him to jump there now.
He sees people nibbling at me but not voting. Desperado doesn't seem viable, most people are townreading {Superhans, Realeo, Dunnstral} and Regfan is conf.

Plenty of scum motivation for waiting it out instead of digging a deeper hole by trying to press something that is implausible.

VOTE: Kop
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Post Post #1336 (isolation #49) » Sun Jan 15, 2017 7:37 am

Post by davesaz »

Kop, why would you RB ssbm_Kuyoko when you SR Gamma?
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Post Post #1343 (isolation #50) » Sun Jan 15, 2017 7:46 am

Post by davesaz »

Thoughts on Kop's target? Seems pretty sketchy to me.
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Post Post #1411 (isolation #51) » Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:52 pm

Post by davesaz »

VT/

Dunn might be scum who realized I've got his partner dead in my sights.
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Post Post #1420 (isolation #52) » Sun Jan 15, 2017 4:43 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1416, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1411, davesaz wrote:VT/

Dunn might be scum who realized I've got his partner dead in my sights.
This argument is really bad/lazy; he's talking about Kop here, but I was voting that as well a while ago, up until the claim, and he's implying that he actually did anything for the kop wagon, which he didn't, he just hopped on at the end again

I don't think it's a real thought process that he thinks I'm scum with Kop for voting him, if davesaz is scum here he's either setting up interactions with his buddy Kop, or he wants to lynch a pr
Nothing you say?
In post 1336, davesaz wrote:Kop, why would you RB ssbm_Kuyoko when you SR Gamma?
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Post Post #1421 (isolation #53) » Sun Jan 15, 2017 4:43 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 144, davesaz wrote:
In post 142, ThinkBig wrote:
In post 141, Dunnstral wrote:davesaz scummy
Why?
I don't think I've ever posted anything that Dunn didn't think is scummy.
Inability to comprehend my playstyle perhaps? :roll:
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Post Post #1422 (isolation #54) » Sun Jan 15, 2017 4:45 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 861, davesaz wrote:
Being late in the "batting order" due to timezones
and lifestyle is kinda annoying because it makes me look like a sheep at times, but...
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Post Post #1424 (isolation #55) » Sun Jan 15, 2017 6:56 pm

Post by davesaz »

Despite my otherwise head on playstyle, I do occasionally make tongue in cheek comments and employ sarcasm.

I fail to understand why people scumread it. My town play is so obvious it borders on being illegal.
All you have to do is accept that (aside from rare jokes and the occasional reaction test) I honestly believe everything I type.
I'm never afraid to be wrong, I'm never afraid to not know the right answer (more often, not have an answer at all).
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Post Post #1437 (isolation #56) » Mon Jan 16, 2017 3:43 am

Post by davesaz »

Alisae has Kop as "town, genuinely ..." in the same quoted post. (different wording than mine)
I thought, eh, I remember not thinking that about Kop back then so I re-ISOd him.
In post 241, Kop wrote:
In post 224, Dunnstral wrote:mafia traitor is bulletproof btw so they wouldn't even die
I didn't realise it's BP until I looked at the setup specs. It's one shot though, but obviously that doesn't mean anything, just means scum won't shoot that slot again.
Turns out he looked at the setup back then, in enough detail to notice traitor is 1-shot BP.
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Post Post #1495 (isolation #57) » Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:26 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1493, Regfan wrote: 1. Mafia selected 0 Additional PR's, Kop is scum. In this instance Gamma & Realeo are confirmed town.
I don't follow this - how would scum Kop confirm Realeo as town?
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Post Post #1644 (isolation #58) » Thu Jan 19, 2017 6:47 am

Post by davesaz »

^ Correct but this is also possible WIFOM positioning Gamma for a lynch if not killed.
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Post Post #1824 (isolation #59) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:15 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1746, Superhans wrote:@Davesaz,
Why aren't you commenting mate? Your last post was almost 3 days ago.
You're clearly online, you've commented today already.
I can understand that laziness may cause town to not post, but its really really not helping us.
I slept the last 13 hours or so. Was in/out of napping at computer another couple hours before that.
In the middle of reading about 5-6 pages of catchup. Not amused by the full page quote pyramid.
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Post Post #1825 (isolation #60) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:25 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1804, Desperado wrote:
Spoiler: Color Coded VCs, D1 and D2
In post 50, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 001


Superhans ( 4 ) -
(
Kop
,
ssbm_Kyouko
, Superhans,
Gamma Emerald
)
MariaR ( 2 ) -
(
ReubenWasFine
, Dunnstral)
Realeo ( 1 ) -
(ThinkBig)
Gamma Emerald
( 1 ) -
(
algebra
)
Secret Agent Jin ( 1 ) -
(davesaz)
davesaz ( 1 ) -
(MariaR)
Kop
( 1 ) -
(Secret Agent Jin)

Not Voting ( 1 ) -
(Realeo)

Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.

Hohoho!
In post 175, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 002


Gamma Emerald
( 3 ) -
(
algebra
, Dunnstral, Superhans)
Superhans ( 2 ) -
(
Kop
, MariaR)
MariaR ( 2 ) -
(
ReubenWasFine
, ThinkBig)
Realeo ( 2 ) -
(
ssbm_Kyouko
,
Gamma Emerald
)
Secret Agent Jin ( 1 ) -
(davesaz)
Kop
( 1 ) -
(Secret Agent Jin)
Dunnstral ( 1 ) -
(Realeo)

Not Voting ( 0 )


Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.

Gamma is v/la until 12/25
ThinkBig is v/la until 12/27
In post 262, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 003


Realeo ( 4 ) -
(
ssbm_Kyouko
,
Gamma Emerald
,
algebra
, Secret Agent Jin)
Superhans ( 2 ) -
(
Kop
, MariaR)
MariaR ( 2 ) -
(
ReubenWasFine
, ThinkBig)
Secret Agent Jin ( 2 ) -
(davesaz, Dunnstral)
Gamma Emerald
( 1 ) -
(Superhans)

Not Voting ( 1 ) -
(Realeo)

Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.

Seeking a replacement for Maria.
Prods will go out tomorrow!
In post 291, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 004


Gamma Emerald
( 5 ) -
(Superhans, ThinkBig, Realeo, Desperado,
Kop
)
Realeo ( 3 ) -
(
ssbm_Kyouko
,
algebra
, Secret Agent Jin)
Desperado ( 2 ) -
(
ReubenWasFine
,
Gamma Emerald
)
Secret Agent Jin ( 2 ) -
(davesaz, Dunnstral)

Not Voting ( 0 )


Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.

Prodding
algebra
and
ReubenWasFine
.
In post 326, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 005


Gamma Emerald
( 5 ) -
(Superhans, ThinkBig, Realeo, Desperado,
Kop
)
Realeo ( 3 ) -
(
ssbm_Kyouko
,
algebra
, Secret Agent Jin)
Desperado ( 2 ) -
(
ReubenWasFine
,
Gamma Emerald
)
Secret Agent Jin ( 1 ) -
(davesaz)

Not Voting ( 1 ) -
(Dunnstral)

Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.

Seeking a replacement for
ReubenWasFine
.
In post 371, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 006


Antihuman
( 4 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
, ThinkBig, Desperado,
ssbm_Kyouko
)
Gamma Emerald
( 2 ) -
(Realeo,
Kop
)
Realeo ( 2 ) -
(
algebra
, Secret Agent Jin)
Secret Agent Jin ( 1 ) -
(davesaz)
ThinkBig ( 1 ) -
(
Antihuman
)

Not Voting ( 2 ) -
(Superhans, Dunnstral)

Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.

Prodding
Kop
.
In post 437, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 007


Antihuman
( 4 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
, ThinkBig, Desperado,
ssbm_Kyouko
)
Realeo ( 2 ) -
(
algebra
, Secret Agent Jin)
Gamma Emerald
( 1 ) -
(Realeo)
Secret Agent Jin ( 1 ) -
(davesaz)
ThinkBig ( 1 ) -
(
Antihuman
)
Desperado ( 1 ) -
(Dunnstral)

Not Voting ( 2 ) -
(Superhans,
Kop
)

Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.

Secret Agent Jin has requested replacement.
In post 512, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 008


Antihuman
( 3 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
, Desperado,
ssbm_Kyouko
)
Desperado ( 2 ) -
(Dunnstral, Alisae)
Realeo ( 1 ) -
(
algebra
)
Gamma Emerald
( 1 ) -
(Realeo)
Secret Agent Jin ( 1 ) -
(davesaz)
ThinkBig ( 1 ) -
(
Antihuman
)
Dunnstral ( 1 ) -
(ThinkBig)

Not Voting ( 2 ) -
(Superhans,
Kop
)

Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.
In post 609, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 009


Antihuman
( 5 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
, Desperado,
ssbm_Kyouko
, ThinkBig, Alisae)
ThinkBig ( 3 ) -
(
Antihuman
, Superhans, Realeo)
Desperado ( 2 ) -
(Dunnstral, davesaz)
Realeo ( 1 ) -
(
algebra
)

Not Voting ( 1 ) -
(
Kop
)

Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.

Prodding
Kop
and
Gamma Emerald
.
Let me know if the VC is incorrect for some reason.

No deadline extension.
In post 669, grapes wrote:
DAY 1 VC 010


Antihuman
( 5 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
, ThinkBig, Alisae, davesaz, Superhans)
ThinkBig ( 3 ) -
(
Antihuman
, Realeo, Desperado)
Desperado ( 1 ) -
(Dunnstral)
Realeo ( 1 ) -
(
algebra
)
Kop
( 1 ) -
(
ssbm_Kyouko
)

Not Voting ( 1 ) -
(
Kop
)

Seven to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-05 01:30:02) remain until deadline.
In post 715, grapes wrote:
Day 1 Finish.


FINAL DAY 1 VC


Antihuman
( 7 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
, ThinkBig, Alisae, davesaz, Superhans,
Kop
, Desperado)

ThinkBig ( 2 ) -
(
Antihuman
, Realeo)
Desperado ( 1 ) -
(Dunnstral)
Realeo ( 1 ) -
(
algebra
)
Kop
( 1 ) -
(
ssbm_Kyouko
)

Not Voting ( 0 )


Seven to lynch.






Antihuman
(Mafia Traitor)
was lynched Day 1.


Night 1 begins now and ends in (expired on 2017-01-07 02:12:02).
In post 816, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 001


Gamma Emerald
( 3 ) -
(
Kop
, Realeo, Superhans)
ThinkBig ( 3 ) -
(Desperado,
Gamma Emerald
, Alisae)
Realeo ( 1 ) -
(
algebra
)

Not Voting ( 3 ) -
(davesaz, ThinkBig, Dunnstral)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.
In post 864, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 002


Gamma Emerald
( 4 ) -
(
Kop
, Realeo, Superhans, Dunnstral)
ThinkBig ( 4 ) -
(Desperado,
Gamma Emerald
, Alisae, davesaz)
Realeo ( 1 ) -
(
algebra
)

Not Voting ( 1 ) -
(ThinkBig)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.
In post 932, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 003


ThinkBig ( 5 ) -
(Desperado,
Gamma Emerald
, Alisae, davesaz, Realeo)
Gamma Emerald
( 2 ) -
(
Kop
, Superhans)
Alisae ( 1 ) -
(Dunnstral)

Not Voting ( 2 ) -
(
algebra
, ThinkBig)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.
In post 956, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 004


ThinkBig ( 5 ) -
(Desperado,
Gamma Emerald
, Alisae, davesaz, Realeo)
Gamma Emerald
( 1 ) -
(
Kop
)
Alisae ( 1 ) -
(Dunnstral)

Not Voting ( 3 ) -
(
algebra
, ThinkBig, Superhans)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.

Prodding
algebra
and
Kop
.
In post 1088, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 005


ThinkBig ( 4 ) -
(Desperado, Alisae, davesaz, Realeo)
Gamma Emerald
( 1 ) -
(
Kop
)
Alisae ( 1 ) -
(Dunnstral)
Desperado ( 1 ) -
(ThinkBig)

Not Voting ( 3 ) -
(
algebra
, Superhans,
Gamma Emerald
)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.

Seeking replacement for
algebra
.
In post 1269, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 006


Kop
( 3 ) -
(Dunnstral, Desperado,
Regfan
)
ThinkBig ( 2 ) -
(Alisae, davesaz)
Gamma Emerald
( 1 ) -
(
Kop
)

Not Voting ( 4 ) -
(Superhans,
Gamma Emerald
, Realeo, ThinkBig)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.

Please refrain from using provable randomness -- even just for emoticons.
Thinkbig v/la until Monday.
Gamma Emerald
v/la until Tuesday.

Seeking a replacement for Alisae.
In post 1310, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 007


Kop
( 5 ) -
(Dunnstral, Desperado,
Regfan
, davesaz, Superhans)
ThinkBig ( 2 ) -
(Alisae, Realeo)

Not Voting ( 3 ) -
(
Kop
,
Gamma Emerald
, ThinkBig)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.
In post 1391, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 008


Kop
( 2 ) -
(
Regfan
, davesaz)
ThinkBig ( 2 ) -
(Alisae, Realeo)
davesaz ( 2 ) -
(
Kop
, Dunnstral)
Desperado ( 1 ) -
(ThinkBig)
Superhans ( 1 ) -
(Desperado)

Not Voting ( 2 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
, Superhans)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.

ThinkBig is v/la until Monday.
Gamma Emerald
is v/la until Tuesday.

Still looking for a replacement for Alisae!
In post 1484, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 009


Kop
( 3 ) -
(
Regfan
, davesaz, Dunnstral)
ThinkBig ( 2 ) -
(Alisae, Realeo)
davesaz ( 1 ) -
(
Kop
)
Desperado ( 1 ) -
(ThinkBig)
Superhans ( 1 ) -
(Desperado)

Not Voting ( 2 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
, Superhans)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.
In post 1500, grapes wrote:
DAY 2 VC 010


Kop
( 5 ) -
(
Regfan
, davesaz, Dunnstral, Superhans, ThinkBig)
ThinkBig ( 1 ) -
(Realeo)
davesaz ( 1 ) -
(
Kop
)
Superhans ( 1 ) -
(Desperado)
Regfan
( 1 ) -
(nydushermain)

Not Voting ( 1 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
)

Six to lynch.
(expired on 2017-01-21 05:24:02) remain until deadline.
In post 1653, grapes wrote:
FINAL DAY 2 VC


Kop
( 6 ) -
(
Regfan
, davesaz, Dunnstral, Superhans, ThinkBig, nydushermain)

ThinkBig ( 1 ) -
(Realeo)
davesaz ( 1 ) -
(
Kop
)
Superhans ( 1 ) -
(Desperado)

Not Voting ( 1 ) -
(
Gamma Emerald
)

Six to lynch.






Kop
(Roleblocker)
was lynched Day 2.


Night 2 begins now and ends in (expired on 2017-01-21 21:33:02).
Thanks, but no analysis?
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Post Post #1827 (isolation #61) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:07 am

Post by davesaz »

Superhans is consistently a late entrant on big wagons, other than wagons on ThinkBig. The only exception to this rule that I see is being early on Gamma d1, but that was after being 3rd on that wagon and two left it.
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Post Post #1830 (isolation #62) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:52 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1829, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1827, davesaz wrote:Superhans is consistently a late entrant on big wagons, other than wagons on ThinkBig. The only exception to this rule that I see is being early on Gamma d1, but that was after being 3rd on that wagon and two left it.
So do you think Superhans is scum, then? What's your opinion on Desperado and Thinkbig?
The voting pattern suggests SH scum, yes. This is only part of it, I want to look at attitudes surrounding the votes.
Work in progress. I'm looking at all the question marks the same way, seeing if the vote patterns are natural feeling or if they feel contrived.
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Post Post #1832 (isolation #63) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:55 am

Post by davesaz »

In case it's not obvious, the flips force me to do an almost complete reset as it's likely most of what I thought was wrong. A reset isn't going to be very fast.
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Post Post #1833 (isolation #64) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 11:10 am

Post by davesaz »

Continuing on with looking at votes...
SAJ is on Realeo d1 and it gets to 4. Alisae switched to Desperado - why?
Alisae then goes to AH, starting off in wagon position 5.
D3 something happens that causes Alisae to replace out. Suspicion that it's thinly veiled but tactical
Note: look at what was happening...

nydushermain replaces Alisae and votes Regfan. I thought at the time, surely it would be obvious Regfan is IC, but on further examination the mod did not update the playerlist to indicate confirmed town so this looks more like a greeting. lots of back and forth and then a hammer.

Followup questions -- why did Alisae change the vote to Desperado? What were the circumstances leading up to Alisae replace out?
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Post Post #1843 (isolation #65) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 12:04 pm

Post by davesaz »

I think the easy / obvious is town's undoing. I plan to take my time and thoroughly analyze everyone other than the IC.
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Post Post #1844 (isolation #66) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 12:18 pm

Post by davesaz »

If ThinkBig is scum, why are his reads changing in such an organic way that flows with the game events?
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Post Post #1846 (isolation #67) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 12:20 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1839, Superhans wrote:I think Davesaz is being opportunistic, I'm an easier player to push than either Desperado or ThinkBig.
In post 1840, Superhans wrote:Okay taking that last post back, I had thought Dave had voted for me.
Your elevated defensiveness here is noted. As to whether it is AI or not, I'm undecided. I tend to have knee jerk OMGUS-like reactions as town and it's possible others do too.
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Post Post #1847 (isolation #68) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 12:22 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1845, nydushermain wrote:
In post 1844, davesaz wrote:If ThinkBig is scum, why are his reads changing in such an organic way that flows with the game events?
Loaded question
Honest question. I'm making an observation but I'm open to an explanation that overrules it.
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Post Post #1852 (isolation #69) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 12:54 pm

Post by davesaz »

Despite my uncertainty regarding TB, based on the relatively organic game progression, I did notice this and still remember it. My interpretation of the exchange
supposing TB and Desperado(Maria) are scum.
Caveat:
I'm not sure they're scum nor am I trying to cast shade
. I just want feedback on whether this interpretation even makes sense...
In post 265, ThinkBig wrote:Welcome Desperado! I will be catching up and posting tomorrow. Hope everyone had a nice holiday.
Hey buddy who I can't talk to in PT because we don't have daytalk!
In post 266, Gamma Emerald wrote:VOTE: Desperado
:shifty:
I'm afraid...
(Makes joke based on username)
In post 267, ThinkBig wrote:VOTE: Gamma

Afraid of what? Please explain your vote.
OMG how can he be onto us like this? <revs chainsaw>
In post 275, Desperado wrote:@ Realeo: Ya, agreed. I found myself nodding along with Maria's thoughts a lot, actually.

@ ThinkBig: You think it's scummy to be afraid?

-----

One thing I didn't agree with Maria on was Superhans. Think he's town and I like the wagon that he and Dunnstral had going on Gamma, who has been active but has spent more time discussing previous games than hunting scum; further evidenced by what appears to be an RVS vote on a replacement on page 11.

Unvote
Vote: Gamma Emerald


Just ISOed Realeo to asses the competing wagon and saw that he's now voting Gamma as well, I liked what I saw particularly early on from Realeo so that makes me feel even better about this vote.
<the part of the quote directed to TB> So buddy you think we can actually get somewhere with this? <votes it to see if it takes off>
In post 276, Desperado wrote:Gamma can you be more explicit? What are you afraid of?
Umm, do you really have dirt on me?
In post 277, Gamma Emerald wrote:The role in your username
In post 278, Desperado wrote:Who else is scum?
<gee, I'd better play it at least slightly cool> Well other than me <haha> who is scum?

As I said, this is just a hypothetical view of what it could be, if they're both scum. I don't necessarily believe this is the actual subtext. By bringing it up what I want is discussion on whether it's plausible or not.
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Post Post #1853 (isolation #70) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 12:56 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1850, Dunnstral wrote:I also don't see what you guys are seeing about dave
I'd be a lot more comfortable reading you if I could be confident you understand the concept of honest posting and could recognize it when you see it.
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Post Post #1857 (isolation #71) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 1:19 pm

Post by davesaz »

Actually with both PR flips realeo is no longer technically conf. I have him on the re-read and analyze list.
I've lost a couple games as town by failing to accurately recognize "scum leading town", so I caution against doing solely town reads.
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Post Post #1862 (isolation #72) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 1:23 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1856, ThinkBig wrote:
In post 1852, davesaz wrote:Hey buddy who I can't talk to in PT because we don't have daytalk!
This is casting shades. I do this in most of my games. It's NAI for me.

See here, here, and here. As a rule, I try to welcome replacements (though I don't always).

Also, with three town PRs, the scum team most likely chose day chat over the other PRs.

OK, back to work. I'll finish responding later.
That's the least AI part of the sequence of events. I'm more interested in the interpretation of other townies as to why you voted Gamma in that situation.
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Post Post #1865 (isolation #73) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 1:25 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1860, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1858, nydushermain wrote:
In post 1857, davesaz wrote:Actually with both PR flips realeo is no longer technically conf. I have him on the re-read and analyze list.
I've lost a couple games as town by failing to accurately recognize "scum leading town", so I caution against doing solely town reads.
Gamma had a green check on him.
If realeo were a mafia pr it wouldn't matter
Correct but better stated as, a goon cop green would not be accurate if realeo were a mafia pr.
I happen to agree with whomever posted that daytalk is the more likely choice, but it's best to keep realeo off the conf list regardless.

pedit: turns out I'm joining the chorus, but still posting it :cool:
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Post Post #1872 (isolation #74) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:59 pm

Post by davesaz »

What did you expect to get feedback from?
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Post Post #1883 (isolation #75) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 5:43 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1877, Realeo wrote:Do I need to make another pyramid quote to get people feedback?
On my old site, posting more that twice in a row would get you banned. At a minimum what it will get you from me is ignored. I hope not to have to make this point again.
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Post Post #1884 (isolation #76) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:04 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1880, Realeo wrote:
@davesaz
For your , I think I can create any narrative that I want to that conversation.
I would have thought you would like the narrative I put to it, since it matched your agenda. Did I misinterpret your reads?

Clarification on my previous post -- too many *consecutive posts without a change in subject* bother me. I don't mind multiple posts on different subjects, and I find myself doing that when I want to answer multiple points without multi-quoting and making a massive wall.
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Post Post #1885 (isolation #77) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:07 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1861, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1853, davesaz wrote:
In post 1850, Dunnstral wrote:I also don't see what you guys are seeing about dave
I'd be a lot more comfortable reading you if I could be confident you understand the concept of honest posting and could recognize it when you see it.
huh?
What do you actually think about me, and why?
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Post Post #1888 (isolation #78) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:50 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 1424, davesaz wrote:Despite my otherwise head on playstyle, I do occasionally make tongue in cheek comments and employ sarcasm.

I fail to understand why people scumread it. My town play is so obvious it borders on being illegal.
All you have to do is accept that (aside from rare jokes and the occasional reaction test) I honestly believe everything I type.
I'm never afraid to be wrong, I'm never afraid to not know the right answer (more often, not have an answer at all).
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Post Post #1889 (isolation #79) » Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:54 pm

Post by davesaz »

You (and that's personally you) lose games (specifically ones where you scumread me) because you expect people to act evasively so much that you can't recognize when they are not being evasive.
There is no conceivable scum motivation in anything I've posted this game. Of course not given I'm town, but any attempt to force read this as scummy has to come from either stupidity or scumminess.
I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt instead of power lynching you. I suggest you use that opportunity to up your game.
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Post Post #1926 (isolation #80) » Mon Jan 23, 2017 4:24 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1896, Superhans wrote:
In post 1889, davesaz wrote: [...]
I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt instead of power lynching you. I suggest you use that opportunity to up your game.
Lol I can see scum motivation in this post. Threatening Dunnstral for making a case on you. Id like to see you to go ahead and tell me
how
you'd power lynch Dunnstral.
No case can be made, because there is no possible scum motivation in anything I've posted.
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Post Post #1927 (isolation #81) » Mon Jan 23, 2017 4:28 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1842, Superhans wrote:A N Y O N E not scumreading either TB or Desperado?
In post 1893, Superhans wrote:@Realo,
Do you think TB's chronic lack of content and originality is necessarily scum? What else do you base your scum read on?
In post 1914, Superhans wrote:
In post 1901, Realeo wrote:Out of topic. Superhans. Why you asked for an elevator pitch? I am still flustered.
Well if u want to lynch TB, pitch it to me.
I'm confused. You think TB is scum but you want others to explain why?
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Post Post #1929 (isolation #82) » Mon Jan 23, 2017 4:37 am

Post by davesaz »

What I want is for Superhans to answer.
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Post Post #1951 (isolation #83) » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:02 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1934, Superhans wrote:
In post 1926, davesaz wrote:
In post 1896, Superhans wrote:
In post 1889, davesaz wrote: [...]
I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt instead of power lynching you. I suggest you use that opportunity to up your game.
Lol I can see scum motivation in this post. Threatening Dunnstral for making a case on you. Id like to see you to go ahead and tell me
how
you'd power lynch Dunnstral.
No case can be made, because there is no possible scum motivation in anything I've posted.
Then why did you you say you'd give Dunnstral the benefit of the doubt instead of power lynching when there was no way to lynch Dunnstral anyway?
Sometimes the only way to make someone see the truth is to slap them with a virtual fish.
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Post Post #1955 (isolation #84) » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:11 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 1952, Superhans wrote:Davesaz who'dya think is scum?
I tend toward ThinkBig, but I'm worried about it being too easy.
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Post Post #1957 (isolation #85) » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:15 am

Post by davesaz »

I mean easy in the sense of obvious, not in the sense of no resistance.
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Post Post #2092 (isolation #86) » Wed Jan 25, 2017 2:54 pm

Post by davesaz »

I'm still at work, it's 7pm and I read my first work email at 8am. 11 hour days are not conducive to big mafia production. My family still needs dinner so it may not even be tonight...
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Post Post #2094 (isolation #87) » Wed Jan 25, 2017 7:31 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 2079, Realeo wrote:
In post 2078, Superhans wrote:
In post 2074, Realeo wrote:Am I the only one who is not hard townreading nydush?
Ny seems kinda obvs town to me. Y r u not town reading?
help? second opinion?
I had prior slot holders as possible scum...
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Post Post #2151 (isolation #88) » Thu Jan 26, 2017 12:05 pm

Post by davesaz »

Superhans asking for top town like that is very scum behavior. I also see a lot of probing for mislynch candidates.
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Post Post #2190 (isolation #89) » Fri Jan 27, 2017 6:29 am

Post by davesaz »

Pressed for time, I have a bug to squash.
I think I'm satisfied that ThinkBig is no longer "too obvious a choice". I'm very happy with the amount of analysis, I agree with most of it, and I think that's our lynch. Because of that bug I don't have time right now to add anything new.
LA for 24-36 hours
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Post Post #2245 (isolation #90) » Sat Jan 28, 2017 5:33 am

Post by davesaz »

At this point I don't give a fuck what you do. Lynch me if you'd like to, or lynch someone else. This game needs a flip, now.
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Post Post #2246 (isolation #91) » Sat Jan 28, 2017 5:34 am

Post by davesaz »

VOTE: ThinkBig
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Post Post #2253 (isolation #92) » Sat Jan 28, 2017 11:40 am

Post by davesaz »

What hes seeing is that im thoroughly disgusted that im even a topic of discussion. This is town me. There is so much difference between this and any game ive been scum that you must be blind to not see it. Either drop the subject of me scum, or lynch me and probably lose.
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Post Post #2254 (isolation #93) » Sat Jan 28, 2017 11:54 am

Post by davesaz »

Second guessing is going to lose this for town even if we were right from the beginning about who scum are. We had 4 firm town, two likely scum, and two question marks. Now we have as many as 6 question marks because we've screwed around so long that the likely scum are talking themselves back into the town.
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Post Post #2269 (isolation #94) » Sat Jan 28, 2017 3:06 pm

Post by davesaz »

I don't normally think in terms of teams. I find it leads me to rule out good scum with few or more obvious teammates prematurely while incorrectly pairing town with scum or each other.

Dunnstral's adamant refusal to back down on calling me scummy without being able to specifically point to specifics causing the read is a big red flag, but unfortunately I know he does this as town.
Superhans overreliance on asking other people their reads is also a red flag.
I would not want either of them in LYLO.
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Post Post #2288 (isolation #95) » Sat Jan 28, 2017 4:47 pm

Post by davesaz »

Desperado, do a (relatively) old man a favor and remind me who you think is scum.
I know I can look it up myself and don't mind doing that if you insist, but it's been a long day for rl.
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Post Post #2340 (isolation #96) » Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:57 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 2189, ThinkBig wrote:No. No one should self vote.

Be home in about two hours. Should respond more then
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Post Post #2393 (isolation #97) » Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:01 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 2384, Realeo wrote:Nobody, except regfan and Dunnstral, addressed my fucking concern about ThinkBig is active in other game
I noticed the comments on the subject but didn't feel it required a response.
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Post Post #2397 (isolation #98) » Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:09 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 2392, Realeo wrote:How the hell nydus reach the conclusion of dave town? That's magik.
Did you actually read his posts on the subject?
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Post Post #2398 (isolation #99) » Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:10 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 2395, Superhans wrote:I'm certain that either TB or Desperado is scum, but Dunnstral is the only likely partner for Desperado, so flipping Dunn's will flip Desp and hence flip TB.
In post 2396, Superhans wrote:Oh and if Dunnstral flips town we 100% need to flip Dave tomorrow.
We call this lining up lynches, and it's a 100% scum tactic.
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Post Post #2401 (isolation #100) » Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:28 am

Post by davesaz »

Because I think TB is scum.
Mafiascum, the site.
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Post Post #2405 (isolation #101) » Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:18 am

Post by davesaz »

Well, in that case... ;)

Still, it's really bad.
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Post Post #2595 (isolation #102) » Wed Feb 01, 2017 4:28 am

Post by davesaz »

VOTE: ThinkBig
The false tracker claim would have been enough. Scum would not have given 4 town roles without recruiting.
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Post Post #2617 (isolation #103) » Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:46 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 2605, Desperado wrote:
In post 2556, Regfan wrote:For those that prefer reading quotes rather than links I've spoiled two of the major interactions between Dun/Dave that make me think it's not S/S.

Spoiler: Interaction #1
In post 307, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 293, Superhans wrote:^Ah i messed up, Dunnstral doesn't vote Dave, but calls him scummy with no explanation,
Change question to:
@Dunnstral why did you scum read Dave?
Because he made a scummy post.
In post 308, davesaz wrote:Which post and why do you think it's scummy?
In post 309, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 139, davesaz wrote:
In post 137, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 130, ThinkBig wrote:
In post 102, Dunnstral wrote:It's about intent. Get off of me. I'm not getting lynched. Vote Gamma.
In post 103, Dunnstral wrote:Next thing you know I'll be l-5 followed by l-4
I find these two posts to be an over reaction and I'm not liking post 103.
To play devil's advocate for myself, not sure why I'd make such a big deal of it as scum
In order to wifom once people call you on it.
In post 140, davesaz wrote:
In post 136, Superhans wrote:
In post 135, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 117, Superhans wrote:@Dunnstral,
Why are you voting Gamma?
Would you want to convince other players to do the same?
He's not engaging in anything while being here, very odd for him.


MARIA is also trying to be as scummy as possible it would seem
I can get behind a pressure wagon.
VOTE: Gamma Emerald
Pressure is more useful if the target doesn't know you're voting merely for pressure.
Also note to myself to see if the quoted post becomes relevant later.
These ones. I thought they were scummy at the time. I didin't vote you and you can stop acting like you didn't do anything
In post 312, davesaz wrote:
In post 309, Dunnstral wrote: These ones. I thought they were scummy at the time. I didin't vote you and you can stop acting like you didn't do anything
I'm not sure what you mean by "acting like I didn't do anything". Am I trying to disclaim posts or something?

The question is why you thought they were scummy. Do you not want to answer that question?
In post 313, Dunnstral wrote:They're scummy because I felt like they were. If I wanted to make a case it wouldn't be off of those two posts.
In post 315, davesaz wrote:
In post 313, Dunnstral wrote:They're scummy because I felt like they were. If I wanted to make a case it wouldn't be off of those two posts.
That's not going to help sort your motive, but whatever you like...


Spoiler: Interaction #2
In post 1853, davesaz wrote:
In post 1850, Dunnstral wrote:I also don't see what you guys are seeing about dave
I'd be a lot more comfortable reading you if I could be confident you understand the concept of honest posting and could recognize it when you see it.
In post 1861, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1853, davesaz wrote:
In post 1850, Dunnstral wrote:I also don't see what you guys are seeing about dave
I'd be a lot more comfortable reading you if I could be confident you understand the concept of honest posting and could recognize it when you see it.
huh?
In post 1885, davesaz wrote:
In post 1861, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1853, davesaz wrote:
In post 1850, Dunnstral wrote:I also don't see what you guys are seeing about dave
I'd be a lot more comfortable reading you if I could be confident you understand the concept of honest posting and could recognize it when you see it.
huh?
What do you actually think about me, and why?
In post 1887, Dunnstral wrote:I think you're mafia. Posts like this:
In post 1411, davesaz wrote:VT/

Dunn might be scum who realized I've got his partner dead in my sights.
While talking about kop when it didn't make sense (and we know he was town now)

along with the defensiveness that followed that

Do I need to go over your iso for you to understand why you're scummy?
In post 1888, davesaz wrote:
In post 1424, davesaz wrote:Despite my otherwise head on playstyle, I do occasionally make tongue in cheek comments and employ sarcasm.

I fail to understand why people scumread it. My town play is so obvious it borders on being illegal.
All you have to do is accept that (aside from rare jokes and the occasional reaction test) I honestly believe everything I type.
I'm never afraid to be wrong, I'm never afraid to not know the right answer (more often, not have an answer at all).
In post 1889, davesaz wrote:You (and that's personally you) lose games (specifically ones where you scumread me) because you expect people to act evasively so much that you can't recognize when they are not being evasive.
There is no conceivable scum motivation in anything I've posted this game. Of course not given I'm town, but any attempt to force read this as scummy has to come from either stupidity or scumminess.
I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt instead of power lynching you. I suggest you use that opportunity to up your game.
you have got to be fucking kidding me
In post 2606, Desperado wrote:every single one of those posts
screams
scum theater
That's town me slapping (possible town) Dunn with a fish, to see if he's just
stupid
misguided town or scum trying to mislynch me. I have a huge soft spot for automatically thinking everyone who scumreads me for no reason is scum, and it leads to more than a normal number of mislynches, either me or the town blowing smoke. Dunn's attacks on me gave me a strong gut scum reaction, but I know that not only do I misread that often, Dunn as town does exactly what he was doing here, which meant I couldn't trust it. When I'm town with an untrustworthy scum read, I prefer to let other town sort that player. TBH, Dunn totally misplayed it -- if he had flipped his read on me, I would have interpreted that as waking up and probably defended him. Though that would have led to TB going down yesterday anyway...
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Post Post #2624 (isolation #104) » Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:53 am

Post by davesaz »

Technically, dead people shouldn't post until the mod posts a flip.
It doesn't bother me, just don't want you to get into trouble.
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Post Post #2651 (isolation #105) » Wed Feb 01, 2017 7:17 am

Post by davesaz »

Thanks for modding!
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Post Post #2653 (isolation #106) » Wed Feb 01, 2017 7:19 am

Post by davesaz »

In post 2619, Antihuman wrote:TB, I didn't bus you, it's astonishing you still don't get it.
I pushed you from the getgo in such an obvious way even a blind man would notice
I knew your alignment
. Seriously, it didn't make you wonder that I nitpicked on
every single thing
you said? I think Dunn has recognized me as a traitor and you could've done too but instead you panicked and created a counter-push that got me lynched. I planned on unvoting you when you finally recognized me as a partner and I was very close to do that anyway when I saw it was all in vain but you re-voted me and it was all too far gone. I'm still baffled people picked me over you when your only defense was "throwing shades" the whole game, rotfl. If you got lynched instead, I would've prolly rode on towncred for a good while.
All of this could've been of course avoided if only you recruited me. Oh well. Sorry for how it turned out, I didn't wanna play it safe and boring.
This was BTW the exact thought I had for a SR of ThinkBig.
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