Mini 1875: Pine's Death Trap Post Game - Town win!

[nancy]

Hi everyone! Some great players in this game (unfortunately replacing one of them!), looking forward to suffering Pine's masochisms with you all. I notice that I have a rather girthy and tumescent wagon on me, have I claimed yet? If not, I'm a VT.

I've just woken up and I'll need to make my way home to my computer before I can post in serious. Thank you for your patience!

[nancy]

Home. Will try and catch up asap. Can anyone provide me with broad strokes of Day 2?

UNVOTE:

[nancy]

So I lurked this thread Day 1 but I hadn't kept up since start of Day 2. TR on Keyser and JJD. The scum on my wagon is RC and possibly Sheep.

Vifam is probably Town. I can't find any scum motivation behind just about any of their posts. I don't think 513 and 823 come from scum!Vifam basically ever.

At first look I don't see how 990 can be written by Town. Poverty of scumreads, blind acceptance of RC's PR claim, unsolicited NK analysis with mention of Aslan (aka Alisae) that looks like scum attempting dumbtell. 867 is lynch shopping. Backing off my wagon before the trigger was pulled looks like scum not wanting to get their hands dirty. 1045 sounds contrived. All of this paints Rauth as scum until you take into consideration that he's a newb, at which point all of his dumbtelling and apparent scumminess becomes newb!town. I TR this slot.

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

Spoiler:

I can still want an answer for it. Maybe he did actually townread my early posts or maybe he just wanted to buddy me and do what's not!hisscummetaforgameswithme.

Am I meant to TR you because you're implying that other people might be scum trying to avoid being scumhunted by you? If so, no.

Why are you assuming that I'm trying to push the game back in the direction of RVS? What do I seem different than, since I don't recall playing with you?
I have a serious vote on someone that

I think is decently more likely than average

to be scum.

Waffle bold. Second line is scum!RC waiting for a better deathtunnel lead than a scumbait post (208). First line is sensing someone who might get in the way of his control of the game and baiting them (gerryoat) into a fight RC knows they'll lose. See 221, 222 and 233 (both quoted below), and so on for the obvious follow up.

You know newbscum Gerry reminds me of newbscum me. Go in super hard and call everyone exaggerated scumreads for virtually no reasons. Show me what you can do, scum!Gerry.

Isn't this what you're still doing? You're just more adept at it, now, and you have a reputation to back you up.

Overly defensive? you discredited my push and it looked like you were making a batshit insane comment about my play. How were you expecting Town!RC to respond to that, exactly?

There was no push. Refer to my response to your 222 immediately above.

Also Scum!RC doesn't so much appease people who scumread him as he turns on them and destroys their hopes and dreams and powerlynches them.

You said it.

And just remember that I play every single game that I'm in differently, regardless of alignment, so unless you have an intricate understanding of my meta I would not compare me from game to game.

Meta is unreliable, I don't pay much mind to it, you're playing like a scumfuck this game so I'm willing to bet you're a scumfuck this game.

Yes, I referred to Scum!RC in the third person because Scum!RC

isn't actually me because I'm not scum.

Or maybe I'm just a major egoist who can't help himself!

The latter.

That's how I feel about everything that you've said about my slot but you don't hear me complaining.

You just OMGUSed him and called for a powerlynch, so yes, I do hear you complaining.

Uh ok lmao. Just because you claim cop doesn't mean I'm mafia.

Also I don't feel like I need to point this out but this is NEVER town's reaction to me outing in the way that I did, ever.

Unless they're somehow a PR with a role that makes your claim unbelieveable?

Does this look like the legitimate response from town who thinks that I just claimed a major investigative role?

You didn't claim a major investigative role, you claimed a conveniently weak as fuck one, but yes, it does.

I don't want to deal with any more of this bullshit in this game so I am telling you to vote him and get out of my way. There are plenty of mislynches and I won't care if you're town.

So basically you don't care about genuine scumhunting and mislynches advance your wincon? OK, noted.

Like if anyone in this game actually thinks that someone who is claiming to scumread me reacts in this way then they are batshit crazy.

Don't be batshit crazy and vote this cheeky clown.

Nice AtE.

No, because the only reason that my case wouldn't get followed is because people would suspect I am scum. Scum will not be able to afford to keep me alive and that's going to be removed from consideration.
Keyser is this really the reason that you want to be lynched?

Scum will not be able to afford to keep you alive unless you conveniently mislynch all of Town for them and claim a barely effective role PM. Furthmore, nice AtE.

Nah you're going to get lynched because every single person in this game will realize that your reaction to my claim didn't come from town.
Your only focus after that claim was in defending yourself and trying to discredit me and act town. No concern about an outed cop claim, no calling me scum faking a claim.
You reek of scum motivation and you are going to die today.

The reaction came from town, so you are full of bullshit here. You're also talking backwards. Calling you a scum faking a claim is impossible for the same reason that, as you said later, counterclaiming wasn't going to happen, namely that you catered your claim to make it impossible. For Town's benefit, supposedly. Yeah, right.

Keyser would you stop coaching scum it's really unbecoming of you.

More AtE. Yum.

Oh no you weren't nightkilling me for anything that had happened up to that point. I'm getting nightkilled for what's to come.

Funny how that didn't happen. So like, am I also supposed to TR you because you're implying that scum want to kill you? If so, no.

And like: look into games like NY184 that I've played. Take away the amazing AtE and the PR hunting and the perfect choice of pushes and you're left with an aggressive guy throwing shit everywhere until it sticks. That's this guy. Like I knew that he was scum so soon because he's so much like how I was when I was new to playing scum.

But you don't have to go off any of that. His respond post claim literally claims scum over and over and over.

@Transcend i thought this Radiant Cowbells person was supposed to be good?

who lied to me. or are they just trolling rn?

Again: posturing. Do you really think that Town!gerryoat

APPEALS TO OTHER PEOPLE

to attempt to discredit me?
No. Town!Gerryoat the way he's playing would be FUCKING PISSED at me and you all know it. What he is now is scared and that's why he's appealing to other people.

You're accusing gerry of having a bad scumgame while subtly reminding everyone of how good your scumgame is. You're accusing gerry of being scum for appealing to other people while appealing to other people. Yes, we understand now how much more sophisticated your scumgame is, and thank you for scumclaiming for us while you were at it.

No. All Gerryoat is smart enough to figure out is to try to discredit me and stay alive for the day. That's so far from town motivated that it's laughable.

Flip this around to be about yourself and it actually fits, this time.

I read 1870 to death before this game for meta on other people. I know exactly what your scumgame is like.

M-hm.

Look if you genuinely want me to talk about how I knew you were scum then ask me in postgame because all I see right now is scum posturing.

So like, you can't really come up with any good reasons and are just posturing until your opponent gets fatigued or people sheep you because of reputation? Mkay.

I mean I already made several cases on why your play doesn't come from town. But I am pretty sure that I could have gotten you lynched with how scummy you are by just telling people to vote you.

Except your cases sucked. This is scum!RC knowing he's already won the fight, by the way, and pretending to not have to even try.

When I claimed cop or variant with cop in the name his immediate reaction was to start hard discrediting my slot. No indication that he was worried that town PR was outed, no worry that I might be scum. PURELY, SINGLE MINDEDLY interested in discrediting my slot to keep himself alive. Does anyone here think that town would act like that in response to that? Answer: no.

Was what actually happened that you provoked him into getting into a fight you knew you could win by reputation and bruteforce and then discredited him continually and pushed bs arguments down everyone's throats until they finally gave in to your monomania and joined your wagon? Answer: yes.

Oh and I have never seen a town player in a single game that I have played try this hard to discredit someone, regardless of any reads going around.

Why do you keep talking about yourself? It's unbecoming of you, RC.

I did it as a reaction test because being RC I do not expect to live the night anyway unless I get docced so I don't see a big problem with me being outed.
You can like it or not like it but I caught scum.

Don't like it, you didn't catch scum, your results suck, you smell like a scumlord, I hope you die.

I assume you're used to people backing down from you, but I don't back down. Which is why I think your ego took a hit. And you're trying to strong arm a lynch for someone scumreading you.

I'm not trying to do anything. You have basically already been lynched, it just hasn't quite happened yet.

Pontius Pilate: I wash my hands of this mess.

And you CLEARLY do that as scum so the best that you can do is say that you... also sit there discrediting your attackers as town? I mean I've never seen a town player discredit half as much as you and there's a reason on MS that discrediting is generally seen as extremely scummy but hey if you actually do that shit I'd love to see it.

You've spent the last like 40 posts before this point discrediting the first player to stand up to you over and over so remind my again why you aren't scum?

Conclusion #1:

RadiantCowbells and gerryoat aren't in the same scum faction.

No, I'm actually hard, hard, hard bussing his ass so if you wouldn't mind please help me with this sweet bus.

Sudden switch to mentioning bussing in this and 340 is a tonal scumtell to me, as if you're trying to up with a new angle to same shtick so that it doesn't seem like you're repeating yourself despite saying the same thing over and over.

If you want to argue that I might be scum, then saying that I'm blowing things out of proportion or defensive might make sense or have a purpose. But you aren't arguing that so ??? just discrediting.

Nice strawman. He actually was arguing that, and all you've been doing the whole time is discrediting.

I agree that we are unlikely to have multiple cops and I would be suspect of anyone else who claims one. But obviously if someone actually is another cop variant they should not 'counterclaim' since I will be dying tonight anyway. I would lean town except for the fact that you are still not voting gerry and it feels like you might be scum with him waiting to see how the rest of the game reacts before you commit a vote to him.

Good shading. Wait - you died last night?

See because I am NOT a fan of your interactions with Gerry. Feels very apt to be SvS. If you're not going to vote him then don't blame me if my last will is for you to be lynched tomorrow.

More AtE.

Oh and you know what else is cool? Scum!Gerryoat posts a fucking shit ton. Averages about 105 posts per game as scum.

As town? Far less invested. Between the games I've looked at it's 23, 50ish, and 74 posts per day phase. Contrast his LOWEST scum game had 80 posts per day and he went one super long stretch without posting in it.

Is this seriously what you're passing off as scumhunting?

Oh I'm sorry I forgot that

power role fucking radiantcowbells expecting to be docced

was selfish/anti-town play. Please forgive me your highness.

Oh, now I get it. You didn't really ever believe that you were going to die last night. Great alibi. Guess there's no way to bust it without mislynching all of Town to find the doc, huh? I guess you're a little disappointed that I turned out to just be a plain old vanilla then.

Keyser, I get the impression you disbelieve my claim. If you do, then just shut up about it and figure it out tonight with my flip. Kay?

Wait, so you DO believe you're going to die! Okay, okay, I've got it now. We're on the same page.

Oi dumbasses. Do you really think that if Gerryoat were town then absolutely no one would be interested in jumping on a hard pushed wagon and blaming me for it?

No one else is going to get lynched today so pull your heads out of your asses and vote him.

The AtE is strong in this one.

It's your scumbuddies trying to get him quicklynched to keep you alive. I mean I think it's shit play since you're all goign to be fucking obvious scum tomorrow but whatever floats your collective boat.

Nah there's a lot of dumb town there as well.

AtE & hedge. Obvious playbook is obvious.

Except I don't always deathtunnel the first person that I scumread on day 1. Great job buying into Gerryoat's shitty discrediting and teaching him that it's a viable playstyle.

The discrediting by accusing him of discrediting is getting kinda old tbh.

Ooh I have a countertheory. What if Gerry is just a scumfuck who called my vote on Rautherdir 'taking the game back to rvs' to discredit a vote on his scumbuddy like he discredits everything else that does't help him?

Your countertheory sucks scumballs.

Him calling my vote on Rautherdir and attempt to drag the game back to RVS seemed kinda chainsawy and didn't make much sense outside of that context and we all know how good my chainsaw reads are

Oh.

[quote="In post 510But like in general it's not what's there it's what's absent. There's not a single post that I can point to and see any scumhunting going on in his brain behind the wheels.
Just feels like a series of disconnected posts that don't, as far as I can tell, have a single town train of thought underlying them.[/quote]
Funny, exactly how I feel about your posts.

VOTE: Vifam

Scumread that slot yesterday and that was an absolutely unacceptable quickhammer.

So why do you need to remind us that you scumread the slot yesterday? Typical scum reaction with a vote on an easy target, which you conveniently never push.

Notice me not retracting my claim?

I did not just claim what I did for lulz and I have nothing else to say about it right now.

I am bulletproof and I claimed what I did to bait nightkills. I claimed the way I did to minimize the odds of being counterclaimed and it worked. I am actually pretty good at that.
If you don't believe it coming from today note the point where I said that there was no doc in the setup. I said that for a reason.

Ohhhh I get it now. So you tunneled town and claimed a cop role while asking doctors to protect you in order to bait a NK that would be wasted because you're an unconfirmable PR role. Now I get it. It all makes sense and I definitely don't think you could've made any of that up as scum.

Because I think that getting you to calm the fuck down and leave me alone is more valuable than the slim chance that scum try to nightkill me twice.

If I bait 1 kill all I do is waste scums night and don't actually get us a mislynch.

The cop is dead there's no huge value to my role anymore.

Oh so THAT'S why you claimed BP. So now it's super obvious why you're not dead and even baiting a NK doesn't really get us anywhere actually so everything you did Day 1 just fucked Town over and nothing else. We're totally on the same page now, I promise.

I mean there's still value in wasting a nightkill. But if JJD is going to flip his shit at me I might as well come clean and try to get town on the same page.

Hope you're damned fucking sure on that TR, town!RC, cuz you gave up the opportunity to deathtunnel a PR with a fake guilty just here. Oh wait, second sentence was addressed to the actual scum!RC playing this game.

Hey you smurfs what are all of your Matt reads?

Good lynch shopping.

Hey matt what's your read on yourself?

Good recovery.

Well I disagree.

VOTE: MattBlackGuy

Even better recovery.

No matter how hard I try you're never satisfied.
This is not a home I think I'm better off alone.
You always disappear even when you're here.
This is not my home I think I'm better off alone.

You're on fire.

Why would I nightkill JarJar? There's an obvious nightkill in this day phase for RC!Scum and it's not JarJar.

Gee, I wonder who. Certainly not Vifam.

FTR the day 1 deathtunnel was because I was trying to act like investigative RC who got outed and expected to die and needed to lynch his target at all costs.

Oh please.

I don't even need to include Sheep who I'm having second thoughts about to have a confident pool of 6 town. Scum killed the cop but I think this is going to be a town sweep from this point on.

Scum (you) most certainly did kill the cop. Good attempt at shirking any responsibility, though.

I'm not sure if you've caught on yet JJD but I am absolutely sick and tired of wasting my time defending myself instead of lynching scum. If I can get you to fuck off it's worth it.

Lol. If by lynching scum you mean mislynching Transcend because.... I'm sorry, why, again? You don't like his playstyle? Or mislynching someone who refuses to extrapolate on their reads in great depth is easy? Sure, that makes sense.

VOTE: Rautherdir

If you were Town and genuinely scumhunting you would've recognized that this was newb!town like 5000 years ago.

I like this.

There's a really slick tell on Rautherdir that if he flips scum I am near 100% on who one of his partners is.

Gee, how promising. Is this like how when you had a cop variety role and were baiting NKs and it was going to be super great? Too bad neither of these claims are things you'd have to make good on, and everyone will conveniently forget that this was one of the baits you used to have him mislynched.

Yeah. one of many things I don't like from his slot.

But I want to sell my vote out to a lot of different wagons today because I'm not ready to settle down

So you're not even trying to pretend that you're not shopping for lynches anymore? Kay.

I promise you you sitting there and pushing one me makes me play a ridiculous amount worse.

And when you die, you'll not be playing at all! Nice AtE, btw, as always.

I mean it is AtE. It's also true.

No, there's no chance that I'm getting lynched today so please just leave me alone and let me focus on my stuff.

What stuff?

Transcend if you play like that I'm just going to lynch you.

Oh, right. That stuff. So your response to pressure is to push the lynch of one of the easiest targets on the playerlist. I get it. Good stuff.

This is PL until he replaces out or produces content.

Too bad the content wasn't what you were hoping for. Guess you'll have to policy me for finding you scummy if you can't find anything else that sticks, now.

JJD may actually be scum ftr.

Woah now. You're moving the super solid TR who you outed yourself as BP for and in so doing showed D1 to be a total scumfucking of Town to a scumlean? You must be totally surprised that he didn't stop pushing you after you claimed that BP role! Guess if he doesn't let up the only recourse is to move into the lynch pool. Good Town play, RC.

If you are town here do not join another game with me in it Transcend. This is not cool.

Someone hammer.

Likelihood of this coming from Town with like 8 days left in Day 2? No.

I am voting a slot that is refusing to contribute anything to the game and encouraged a quickhammer on town cop.

This is just desperate. First of all, Transcend has added more to this game than Akarin, matt, and Rauthedir, two of which you "suspect" as being scum, so your reasoning is bs. Second, you fucking started that shithole of a wagon and pushed gerryoat down a hill with a cliff at the bottom. Remember 326? Nah, I forgot all about it, too, and everything else that happened D1, so I'll blindly believe your self-serving version of what happened.


Hey look guys, RC has been full of shit from the start of his ISO to the end! Gee, I guess he must be Town!

[nancy]

I'll elaborate on Sheep and my TRs later.

[nancy]

have I claimed yet? If not, I'm a VT.

This feels very fake to me.

I have more self-respect than that. This makes me want to TR you, though.

nancy replaces Transcend, effective immediately.

Welcome nancy! I've recently been told that you're really good at this game

Haha, thanks, but whoever told you that must have been high.


Sheep may be Town after all, but nothing more than a lean for me right now. Day 1 mostly looks good from the slot, Day 2 is a mixed bag. Sheep, I don't really understand why you were scumreading Transcend so hard. Could you please elaborate on this? I want reasons other than activity / game involvement. Also, how familiar are you with his playstyle / personality?

TR on JJD mainly because his posts have mirrored my thought processes for most of the game. D2 start and the push on RC is Town through and through. Keyser has basically been obvtown from the start, constantly ushering the game state forward and being pretty much a townbloc magnet.

I don't like Grendel very much, but I don't have time to really explore that right now so it'll have to wait for this evening. It's nearly 2pm and I need to sleep the afternoon away. Ciao.

[nancy]

Do you understand my case now?

I also find you replacing in, looking at the game enough to assess a Vote Count but not looking at it enough to see all the unvotes and the mirror claim to just ring very fake and unlikely.
Which I am now adding to the overall case on your slot.

Much better, thanks. I actually wasn't piling you in with the activity crowd, I just didn't care to hear that side of your arguments, so feel free to feel unmiffed. As for your second point, when you're your fone at your girlfriend's trying to help her get out the door and find a PM from Pine saying you're in deep doodie, you go to the thread and find the latest VC via the activity overview because you're sure as shit not trawling through pages looking for it, then post to confirm and that includes a claim because your slot is at L-1. Didn't read anything, noticed the unvotes after posting. This is such a dumb and cheap thing to fake.

Rautherdir

- scum. Just playing the noob card way too hard. So many LAMIST posts.

The slot could newb!scum, but newb!town makes more sense to me because I think scum!Rautherdir would attempt to manufacture more scumreads than he has. The rest could swing either way.

Whether or not she's town or not doesn't make her right.

I'm not going to be helpful to the town if I'm forced to play defense all the time. If I can't get some space you might as well just lynch me today because I'm not going to get much done at this rate.

Enough with the victim card. No one is forcing you to play defense. Town actually tends to perform really well under pressure because they have less and less to lose as they get nearer to being lynched unless they have a juicy role PM. If you want to prove to me that you are Town I want you to find and catch the scumteam. I don't want just one scum, I want the whole fucking team, and we will powerlynch them together if you do. Otherwise, I will continue to consider you an enormous scumlord and I will consider it my honored duty to powerlynch the fuck out of you and leave you dead and burning in the wreckage of your own ego. How's that for motivation?


Gonna browse through Grendel's stuff nao.

[nancy]

Are you speaking from experience?

I've always found newbie scum more likely to

not

saturate the thread with lots of scum reads. Or well, demonstrate a hesitancy to generate reads on other players in general.

Indirect experience and the word of experience players, yeah. The idea is that they feel nervous about not having scumreads because it might seem like they aren't scumhunting and therefore aren't Town. Hesitancy to generate reads is for sure a part of it, albeit potentially more just a newbie thing than a newb!scum thing?

[nancy]

I'm probably voting Gerry since I already had a mild suspicion on his slot.

Don't believe you ever answered JJD asking you why/how you had a mild suspicion on gerry.

Would a Scum!Ruath be so ballzy as to utilize the strategy a scum Grendel employed in his last game with Ruath?

What does this mean?


773 likely comes from town!Grendel. His nagging paranoia mirrors my and Keyser's sentiments and that gives me townfeels for the slot. Most of Grendel's posts give off solid town tones but without being anything scum couldn't fake and 773 pushes me towards the former.

I don't see 780 coming from scum.

Townlean on Grendel.

[nancy]

Don't worry, we don't need you.

[nancy]

843 is town!Akarin.

856 is town!Akarin or very smart scum. I don't get a drip of tonal deception here and what may look like defense is just aggression towards a bad read.

862 is too poorly written to not have any scumtells in it if Akarin were scum.

Scum doesn't mention Aslan in 998.

1007 is probably town!Akarin because I think scum!Akarin would've been more sensitive to the associatives between the slots, unless Akarin is playing dumb / devil's advocate.

Can't say I'm a fan of the JJD vote, his read on matt being separate to a hypothetical scum flip on the slot doesn't seem as hard to grasp to me as Akarin has made it out to be, so I townlean this.

[nancy]

I'd take another angle... playing the Devil's Advocate, the problem is: RC's actions could fit the scum-narrative that Nancy has painted like a glove,

but RC could still be town who did all those anti-town/scummy things!

That's exactly the point you make in 1171. RC's play is designed to WIFOM Town out of wanting to push a lynch on him. The questions to ask are: Which do you think is more likely, scum!RC or town!RC? If RC is Town, what do we gain and lose by keeping him around? If RC is scum, what do we gain and lose by keeping him around? If you can't fight your way through the WIFOM then all you have to rely on are the results of his actions. Town was completely fucked by him Day 1, not just because he pushed the cop to death but because he shut out discussion. Day 2 was nearly ended 8 days early.

[nancy]

I mean, if you can make an argument for town!RC that doesn't consist of.. well, he could just be playing fucking horribly as town this game, I'd love to hear it.

[nancy]

Separate from that, but also notably bad was Ruath believing the RC is town, but was willing to lynch RC if the case put against him was "good enough".

I don't see 780 coming from scum.

Why not?

Thanks for the explanation. I missed Rauth saying that, ouch.

Not from scum because you're basically soothing paranoia, which I don't think scum would be likely to do as freely as that. Scum generally want to fuck townblocs, not promote them. And if you're scum with Keyser here your skill level is too high to make an associative post like that likely.

[nancy]

*cheers from the sidelines*

So RC how do you like matt's chances of having a red role PM?

Grendel you don't like RC's arguments for JJD being scum?

[nancy]

I'm cheering on whomever needs it most.

Your list what I'm referring to when I mention matt. I'm presuming your hardread of JJD resulted in a red and I think JJD is done producing content in response to this at least for now, so MBG/JJD associatives look like the next order of business.

Ok so if I wasn't in some sort of funk here's what I'd do, in order.

1) JJD has made a lot of content and is probably one of the easiest to read of the remainders. Hard read his slot and see if I can write him as town or scum.
2) Look at MBG/JJD associatives. There was that interesting situation around MBG's entry to the day which I also scumread. See if I can write that off as not SVS.
3) Sheep is doing something I believe to be a major scumtell for them but I can't tell if it's because of the alt thing. Reread their slot.
4) Force content out of Lil Uzi Vert. Hardread it.
5) Reread both Rautherdir and MBG and see if either of them specifically call to me as a better lynch.
6) Lynch whoever my top scumread after all of the above has been done.

[nancy]

UGH. Are you fucking kidding me.

He was NEVER going to be lynched. I was pushing that fucking wagon for reactions. Whatever.

Grendel is scum to me right now. I don't see him genuinely trying to sort alignments in that whole exchange with RC. JJD is scum and one of LUV/matt are scum. Game is pretty much solved imo.

VOTE: JJD

[nancy]

Yeah I'm glad we saw that in time.

[nancy]

Grendel is not scum

Why not?

[nancy]

There's only one scum in [Keyser,Jar,Sheep], and I don't think it's Keyser, but I'm not confident enough to give a full Town read so I'm keeping him here just in case.

Why only 1 scum in {Keyser, JJD, Sheep}?

Vifam, why is it that you can't be lynched exactly?

[nancy]

{Rauth, RC, Keyser}
{Akarin}
{Sheep, Vifam}
{LUV, matt}
{JJD, Grendel}

So when I say 1 scum in LUV/matt, that's what that means. It isn't about partners / associatives.

[nancy]

If LUV and JarJar flip scum, it will look bad for you. D1 you scum read JarJar hard. Start of D2 he was then a town read. And now he's back in your list of players that you'd happily lynch.

This is all association theory though. One flip at a time.

It's probably worth noting that if matt is scum, he's voting LUV over JJD. What makes you want to flip LUV first? Just a stronger read on that slot?

So far in this game we've lynched one scum

We haven't lynched any scum.

(how many days left did we have til deadline?!)

2.

UGH. Are you fucking kidding me.

He was NEVER going to be lynched. I was pushing that fucking wagon for reactions. Whatever.

How the F was THAT case a reaction test?

Sorry not sorry

[nancy]

As I remember it, yeah, it was like 2 days and 14 hours or something.

[nancy]

Nvm, 17 hours 51 minutes according to the penultimate VC. Forget why I remembered 2 days.

[nancy]

Oh the VC is a countdown. Well that explains it. Derp.

[nancy]

UGH. Are you fucking kidding me.

He was NEVER going to be lynched. I was pushing that fucking wagon for reactions. Whatever.

Grendel is scum to me right now. I don't see him genuinely trying to sort alignments in that whole exchange with RC. JJD is scum and one of LUV/matt are scum. Game is pretty much solved imo.

VOTE: JJD

Why do ppl keep saying that I lack sincerity with my questions?

Its an easy way to make me look scummy, meanwhile not something I can actually argue because arguing tone gets abstract really fast.

I also don't understand why you are overlooking that all my potential scum buddies are in my lynch pool. Are you just assuming that I'd be prepared to lynch my whole team? Or are you not taking everything into consideration here?

Pre-edit

I'm happy with Jar Jar or LUV

still think Viafam is town.

On my fone but it seemed to me like you were trying to talk your way out of scumreading jjd and then another who I can't remember. The questions were all posed in a cooperative way but ñike nudged rc towards nulling the read. It felt strange precisely because he's in your scumpool so the resistance to putting the vote there didn't fit. I didn't get this feeling from your earlier posing, though.

[nancy]

@keyser yeah putting gerry to l-1 was like the primary reason i scumread the slot

[nancy]

@keyser yeah putting gerry to l-1 was like the primary reason i

scumread the slot

Was your earlier town read of JJD and scum-read of RC really a reaction-test?

Can you confirm please.

Yes. From a scumhunting perspective, scum are more cooperative when they think you like them and town are more cooperative when they think you dislike them. The way I saw it when I replaced in, the game was on a somewhat precarious balance where Town was divided in opinion over the RC slot and the Vifam slot. I was 90% sure RC was Town and pushed the fuck out of it to eliminate the remaining 10% and stop Town from derailing itself on Transcend. RC was almost policy if that Transcend lynch went through. I basically fucked up the creeping opposition to townbloc and clarified the positions of a few slots that were previously murky, so I'm not about to apologize for the WIFOM.

@LUV I'm not pushing for a Grendel lynch right now. I'm not hiding my read on him because he's widely TRed and I don't want that to be a blindspot should I die, but there's no action there at this time.

@RC I don't think we should lynch LUV today. I'm not sold on this being scum. Let me pocket him and we can reconsider once we have a flip or two. This slot isn't a threat right now.

@Grendel why do you have Vifam as a TR?

@Town there's no reason to hammer a lynch with this much time left in the Day. Even if we agree on a lynch we can just leave it at L-2 until we get closer to deadline and capitalize on that time by scumhunting. Sheep, Vifam, and matt are probably the most contested slots right now, so we should focus our attentions there.

[nancy]

Fyi my townbloc is {Akarin, nancy, Keyser, Rauth, RC}.

[nancy]

You guys like Grendel and LUV likes me so all we need to do at this point is sort our reads.

[nancy]

RC I fully intended to push you until I had all the information on scumspects I needed. It got cut short just when things were starting to get juicy, but at least we got something out of it.

Fro99er Vifam claimed to be unlynchable. Do you have anything to say about this?

UNVOTE:

Don't like scum having hammer right now.

[nancy]

Also Fro99er why did you claim?

[nancy]

And yeah welcome

[nancy]

Sheep isn't voting matt because he's tunneled on me atm.

[nancy]

It is. But I'm not about to stop scum digging holes for themselves

[nancy]

Scum theater imo.

[nancy]

{Fro99er, Grendel, JJD}

Maybe Sheep, but I'm doubtful. Maybe LUV, but I'm doubtful.

[nancy]

You're at Uzi, JJD, matt right Keyser?

[nancy]

Yes my reads on you and Akarin were and are real. All my current reads are real. It wasn't just a simple reaction test, I had doubts about JJD and RC and others and that's what the push was designed to dispel. I find it's easiest to get reads on things when I'm in control or when they're directed towards me because it limits the unknown variables.

You're obvtown to me and Akarin is still a townlean.

[nancy]

My read on Grendel was real, I was on the fence about him and a couple of his posts pushed me towards townreading him until that exchange with RC. I felt as though almost all of his posts could've been faked by scum.

[nancy]

Akarin was actually a TR until the slot kept pushing JJD for reasons that didn't really add up to me. Same reason I'm not too hot about Sheep with his tunnel on my slot. People scumreading someone or finding scum motivation no matter what they say is a scumtell for me and that's what those two cases seem to me to be.

[nancy]

{Rauth, RC, Keyser}
{Akarin}
{Sheep, Vifam}
{LUV, matt}
{JJD, Grendel}

Now:

{Rauth, RC, Keyser}
{Akarin}
{matt, LUV}
{Sheep}
{JJD, Grendel, Fro99er}

[nancy]

Mainly rotating my scumleans up based on associatives so this is all pretty fluid still.

[nancy]

JJD flip is going to be extremely telling about how on-point our reads are right now. If it flips green we'll have to seriously reassess.

[nancy]

Some input would be good? I'm around for another half hour or so before I have to take off for an hour, then I'm around again for another couple.

[nancy]

I get a really dark feeling that LuV is scum and that Frogger and Nancy are the buddies trying to hard push a lynch on JJD and cry for a reassess when he flips town.

Oh no, you have discovered my master plan. Guess I'd better cringe in fear and hardbus LUV in a desperate attempt to assuage the paranoia.

[nancy]

Yeah idk maybe I was wrong about scum theater, RC reminding me how dumb paranoia is. I can actually buy JJD MBG Sheep, just look at the counterwagons right now.

I'm gonna flip this and I TR the whole fucking wagon if it flips red. Except maybe Grendel. He can be a null.

VOTE: JJD

[nancy]

Me too tbh

Gonna shower be back later.

[nancy]

==> Vote Count 2.6 <==

With 11 votes in play, it's 6 to lynch!

A firing squad is normally composed of several military personnel or law enforcement officers. Usually, all members of the group are instructed to fire simultaneously, thus preventing both disruption of the process by a single member and identification of the member who fired the lethal shot. To avoid the disfigurement of multiple shots to the head, the shooters are typically instructed to aim at the heart, sometimes aided by a paper target. The prisoner is typically blindfolded or hooded, as well as restrained, although in some cases prisoners have asked to be allowed to face the firing squad without their eyes covered. Executions can be carried out with the condemned either standing or sitting. There is a tradition in some jurisdictions that such executions are carried out at first light, or at sunrise, which is usually up to half an hour later. This gave rise to the phrase "shot at dawn."

Execution by firing squad is distinct from other forms of execution by firearms, such as an execution by a single firearm to the back of the head or neck. However, the single shot by the squad's officer with a pistol (coup de grâce) is sometimes incorporated in a firing squad execution, particularly if the initial volley turns out not to be immediately fatal.

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[L-1]

JarJarDrinks - Akarin, nancy, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Fro99er

[L-3]

Lil Uzi Vert - mattblackguy, Keyser Söze, RadiantCowbells

[L-4]

nancy - Cooperative Sheep, JarJarDrinks

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Fro99er -

[L-6]

mattblackguy -

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Rautherdir

Day 2 ends in (expired on 2017-02-17 18:00:00)

[nancy]

Then talk, Keyser. I've been trying to engage you..

At this point we have a really fucking good townbloc but no scum flip so we don't really have any solid basis on which to analyze our reads. Once we get the flip and NK we'll know if we're headed on the right track. I'm with Fro99er here, LUV looks more town than scum and the post he quoted is one that really stuck out to me early when I was lurking D1. Even if he IS scum, I have him pocketed right now and there's just no reason to lynch him today.

[nancy]

You're so meticulous Keyser, I love it. Alright I'll just sit back and wait like a patient little girl. When you're ready, take the shot.

[nancy]

Here are VCs for referencing purposes.

Spoiler: Day 1 VCs

==> Vote Count 1.2 <==

[L-7]

Alisae -

[L-4]

Grendel - Keyser Söze, mattblackguy, Cooperative Sheep

[L-7]

Akarin -

[L-5]

Rautherdir - Vifam, Transcend

[L-5]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae

[L-7]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-7]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-7]

Transcend -

[L-7]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-7]

Keyser Söze -

[L-7]

Vifam -

[L-6]

mattblackguy - Lil Uzi Vert

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells - JarJarDrinks,

Waiting for their DOOM

- Grendel, Akarin, gerryoat, Rautherdir

==> Vote Count 1.3 <==

[L-7]

Alisae -

[L-5]

Grendel - Cooperative Sheep, JarJarDrinks

[L-7]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir - Transcend

[L-4]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae, Grendel

[L-5]

JarJarDrinks - Vifam, mattblackguy

[L-7]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-6]

Transcend - Rautherdir

[L-7]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-7]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam - gerryoat

[L-6]

mattblackguy - Lil Uzi Vert

[L-7]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Akarin, Keyser Söze

==> Vote Count 1.4 <==

[L-7]

Alisae -

[L-5]

Grendel - Cooperative Sheep, JarJarDrinks

[L-7]

Akarin -

[L-7]

Rautherdir -

[L-2]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Transcend

[L-5]

JarJarDrinks - Vifam, mattblackguy

[L-7]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-7]

Transcend -

[L-7]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-7]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam - gerryoat

[L-7]

mattblackguy -

[L-7]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Akarin, Keyser Söze, Rautherdir

[L-1]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Transcend, JarJarDrinks

==> Vote Count 1.5 (FINAL) <==

[L-7]

Alisae -

[L-6]

Grendel - Cooperative Sheep,

[L-7]

Akarin -

[L-7]

Rautherdir -

[LYNCH ACHIEVED]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Transcend, JarJarDrinks, Vifam

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks - mattblackguy

[L-7]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-7]

Transcend -

[L-7]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-7]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam - gerryoat

[L-7]

mattblackguy -

[L-7]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Akarin, Keyser Söze, Rautherdir

Spoiler: Day 2 VCs

==> Vote Count 2.1 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-6]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-5]

Transcend - Cooperative Sheep

[L-5]

Cooperative Sheep - Transcend

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam - Grendel

[L-3]

mattblackguy - RadiantCowbells, Keyser Söze, Lil Uzi Vert

[L-4]

RadiantCowbells - JarJarDrinks, mattblackguy

Waiting for their DOOM

- Akarin, Rautherdir, Vifam

==> Vote Count 2.2 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-5]

Akarin - Vifam

[L-4]

Rautherdir - RadiantCowbells, Transcend

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-6]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-3]

Transcend - Cooperative Sheep, Rautherdir, JarJarDrinks

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-5]

Vifam - Akarin

[L-4]

mattblackguy - Keyser Söze, Lil Uzi Vert

[L-5]

RadiantCowbells - mattblackguy

Waiting for their DOOM

- Grendel

==> Vote Count 2.3 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-5]

Rautherdir - Transcend

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-6]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-1]

Transcend - Cooperative Sheep, Rautherdir, JarJarDrinks, Vifam, RadiantCowbells

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-4]

Vifam - Akarin, mattblackguy

[L-4]

mattblackguy - Keyser Söze, Lil Uzi Vert

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Grendel

==> Vote Count 2.4 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-6]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-1]

Transcend - Cooperative Sheep, Rautherdir, JarJarDrinks, Vifam, RadiantCowbells

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-3]

Vifam - Akarin, mattblackguy, Transcend

[L-4]

mattblackguy - Keyser Söze, Lil Uzi Vert

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Grendel

==> Vote Count 2.5 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[L-4]

JarJarDrinks - Akarin, RadiantCowbells

[L-5]

Lil Uzi Vert - mattblackguy

[L-5]

nancy - Cooperative Sheep

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam -

[L-5]

mattblackguy - Keyser Söze

[L-5]

RadiantCowbells - nancy

Waiting for their DOOM

- Rautherdir, Vifam, JarJarDrinks, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert

==> Vote Count 2.6 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[L-1]

JarJarDrinks - Akarin, nancy, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Fro99er

[L-3]

Lil Uzi Vert - mattblackguy, Keyser Söze, RadiantCowbells

[L-4]

nancy - Cooperative Sheep, JarJarDrinks

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Fro99er -

[L-6]

mattblackguy -

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Rautherdir

[nancy]

TR on JJD mainly because his posts have mirrored my thought processes for most of the game. D2 start and the push on RC is Town through and through.

Was this a reaction test nancy?


What results did you get? (if already posted, please link)

Calling it a reaction test is simplistic. No, those were not my actual reads, and yes, the wagon overall was designed to test reactions. JJD's thought processes had largely mirrored mine, but that was irrelevant to my real read. JJD's ISO is scummy and his jump on the gerry wagon is scummy. That's why I'm scumreading him. His push on RC was bad and his reaction to my push on RC was very bad.

Fr099er, remind me why you believe JJD and matt can't be scum together? Your 180 here is garbage.

Rauth, you're dead tomorrow in 10/10 games where there is a BP / no protective so we have no more reports.

Akarin is Town, stop trying breaking up the townbloc. We're killing JJD today.

[nancy]

{Fro99er, Keyser, RC}
{Akarin, LUV}
{}
{Sheep}
{Grendel, MBG}

VOTE: MBG

Get wrecked son. Death by townbloc. GGz.

[nancy]

Oh wait Rauth isn't dead. Lol. TR Rauth

pedit wtf RC lmao ok I sheep you baby cause I love you lots

VOTE: Fro99er

[nancy]

So it was scum theater and I shouldn't have second-guessed myself?

[nancy]

Cool.

[nancy]

I still think Grendel is a scumfuck and your read there is wrong though.

[nancy]

He'll probably be angry and call us terrible though, I'm a little scared!!!!

[nancy]

Scumteam is unlikely to be {JJD, mbg, Sheep} imo. mbg doesn't put both scummates as SRs.

[nancy]

Adapting to information, sorry. RC agrees with me on scum theater I'm going back to that read.

[nancy]

1483 and 1725 make that team less than likely.

[nancy]

matt why is Grendel a hard TR for you?

[nancy]

It was his exchange with RC where he gave me the impression that he didn't care about sorting alignments. His posts could be pretty easily faked imo, he hasn't done much to actually advance the game at all and he's just been blending a lot. He hasn't taken stances. Idk maybe I'm just being pigheaded.

[nancy]

I mean scum!Fro99er here means that it might actually be LUV after all given how his stances on JJD and LUV were the only two hard stances he gave, I'd still be more inclined to think it's Sheep as the third though.

[nancy]

{Fro99er, Keyser, RC}
{Akarin, LUV}
{}
{Sheep}
{Grendel, MBG}

Why did you leave out Rauth's name?
You thought he would/should be dead?

Yeah, my reads are in a notepad file, I just copy pasted without realizing. Rauth is a TR obviously.

It looks like Sheep is scum to most people in most scenarios. This might be a better alternative to mbg/Fro99er? We really need to flip the roleblocker today, that's kind of at the forefront of my mind.

[nancy]

I mean my SR on Fro99er is basically reliant on me reading the 1v1 with JJD as scum theater. I read it this way because JJD's tone was fake. RC's reasons for SRing Fro99er seem to be different to mine. Vifam was Town for me and Fro99er was mostly Town, but I can totally see the hardbus as well, hypothetically speaking. So essentially this doesn't exactly inspire a lot of confidence in flipping the slot.

[nancy]

And while I accept that there is potential scum motivation in much of their posts, it's hard to read the above for instance as simply a last-ditch self-save by scum!Fro99er.

[nancy]

That's what I'm saying it looks like. Especially since basically everything in 1816 mirrors what's being going on in my head since the JJD flip.

[nancy]

RC, why?

[nancy]

There were 2 potential counterwagons to JJD and I was one of them.

[nancy]

Oh I'm not arguing against you here. I'm basically waiting for RC to post something meaningful about why you're scum but it hasn't happened yet.

pedit nope.

[nancy]

Basically for there is a preponderance of associatives pointing to scum!mbg in contrast to a tonal read of Fro99er/JJD interactions yesterday.

Then there's Sheep's tunnel on my slot and continually moving goal posts in order to find it scummy.

Then there's Grendel who I tonally read as seeming disingenuous in interactions with RC yesterday.

[nancy]

I don't have a problem with it honestly. I see it as taking everything into account. I've been doing the same in my own head.

[nancy]

mbg[/v]

hhhhaab

[nancy]

VOTE: mbg

[nancy]

Let me know if you want to combine brains at any point Keyser.

[nancy]

Lol RC.

[nancy]

Eep. I'm outa here. You're on your own Keyser!

[nancy]

VOTE: Fro99er

OK I promise I'm with you this time RC and not as sheep-me as me-me. Thank you for the explains.

[nancy]

What if it's a Jar Jar, Matt, Frogger scumteam?

Unlikely for scum!Fro99er and scum!mbg to be cross-bussing at this point. Granted, last ditch effort is kind of where the scumteam has to be at right now, so it's not out of the realm of possibility. Most likely scumteams look like Fro99er/LUV and mbg/Sheep. I'm still a little doubtful of any really obvious pairings but whatever.

[nancy]

There are just 3 votes on Fro99er right now and I don't think anyone else has voted anyone.

[nancy]

We really need to flip the roleblocker today, that's kind of at the forefront of my mind.

Have you ruled out a town-jailkeeper?

Never occurred to me actually.

Sorry Fro99er. Didn't mean to make you feel like you didn't exist.

[nancy]

Hey Grendel. Sorry if my SR on you is making me look really stupid to you. I like you even if you end up being scum.

pedit wowzer. Voting you at this point would be vanity. I'm not sheeping either Fro99er or RC at this point. I can see both scum!Fro99er and town!Fro99er. Before RC explained his scumread on Fro99er I had only my read of his interactions with JJD as scum theater versus the scumread on mbg and the apparent associatives there with JJD. Once RC explained his scumread on Fro99er I was able to see much more of the potential scumfuckery of Fro99er and I don't think we're putting ourselves in a bad position by mislynching town!Fro99er given that without him there would only be 2-3 realistic scumspects left. And yeah, I'm completely aware that I may be in a tunnel wrt you.

[nancy]

Yes they are always this fluid. I typically talk to all my scumreads as if they are Town, even when I'm pushing them, which is why it's apparently so hard to read me. I can live with the paranoia.

[nancy]

Hi RC

[nancy]

Yay! How are you?

[nancy]

Why do you capitalize my name all the time q.q

[nancy]

I'm with you on mbg. I kinda wish there could just be a bigger scumteam cause it'd make things easier lol. I dunno about what JJD was doing. Right now I'm kind of torn between lynching Fro99er and it doesn't matter if he's Town because if he is then we have a super tiny scumpool and we can just muscle the win. I mean there are like 3 scumspects that basically everyone agrees on so I don't think this townbloc is going anywhere which is good.

Don't think it's fruitful to start being paranoid about Rauth right now. Same goes for Akarin. Like if Fro99er and mbg were both to flip green then that'd be the time for paranoia. I'm actually kind of considering whether we shouldn't lynch Sheep today. That way we don't have the dichotomy of Fro99er/mbg and it also clears me since most of the scumteams seem to be a me or Sheep situation.

[nancy]

Yea I kinda have sads too tbh ):

Not related to this game tho

[nancy]

Honestly it kinda baffles me how anyone is paranoid about this slot considering what I did D1 but it's whatever.

[nancy]

Hi Sheep

[nancy]

Frog. Wrong animal lol

[nancy]

Yea sry that was kinda rude

ribbit


pedit whatever yesterday was. d2

[nancy]

It was my first day anyway

I dunno it felt liked I helped Town fuck up the scumteam but I probs did nothing so. I mean if mbg isn't scum then I definitely did like nothing. It's w/e I'm sure u'd have killed JJD on ur own anyway

[nancy]

Eh the lynch was kinda sealed before frog replaced in imo

[nancy]

was a solid team effort anyway, honestly cbf about 1 person having what credit for whatever

[nancy]

oh sorry

was all u babe

[nancy]

so what u up to frog?

[nancy]

rc which parts felt like good defensive play to you? if u don't mind humoring me, i'm still a newbshit tryna learn and stuff

[nancy]

ah ok

i was being like extremely offensive i thought?

pedit eh don't let me interrupt

[nancy]

oh i see what you mean

well i mean when i replaced in i felt like i had the scumteam pinned

the push on you was designed to out them and it kinda did.. it was just offense in reverse or something i dunno

[nancy]

so like why is there no one voting anything? this game has gone completely dead

[nancy]

Jfc man I saved your ass from a probable d3 PL and brought town together around the JJD lynch and you're fucking scumreading me for it smh

[nancy]

how is the frog vote weird? I saw scum theater with him and JJD as it was happening and said so, I dropped the read because it seemed to much like shitty paranoia after you made some post but then today you come out and say it was actually a good read so yeah I go back to that. I don't see the issue. My reads are fluid, it's how I play, I adapt to new info really fucking quickly. Especially after you gave explanation for your read and when back through his ISO and felt like I saw everything you were saying.

pedit why does it bug you?

[nancy]

I hard townread them if scum theater doesn't exist. I hard scumread them if it doesn't.

And yea I see your point about the LAMIST thing.

[nancy]

EBWOP scumread them if it does.

[nancy]

Night. Thanks for talking. I feel a bit happier.

[nancy]

Oh I got pagetop, yay (:

[nancy]

Keyser Keyser Keyser who do you want to lynch today?

[nancy]

Gf is non-normal afaik.

[nancy]

Your SRs of LUV/mbg were based on JJD associations?

Sheep basically tunneled on my slot all of Day 2 and continually found new reasons to scumread me. He did basically nothing for Town Day 2 I see no reason why you should be so unlikely to vote for him.

[nancy]

Thanks Pine. <3

[nancy]

Honestly Keyser, look at Sheep's ISO. Complete non-presence from the slot Day 2. He's TRing JJD and pushing me as scum and is happy to wagon null!LUV. Where does this reluctance to vote come from?

[nancy]

I'm saying the motivation is there. I see very few reasons for town!Sheep to completely disappear from thread. I wouldn't even call his tunnel passionate. He was only half-heartedly trying to push me and I didn't see any real defense of JJD either. Can't really see the town motivation there at all.

His scum read of me involved continually manufacturing new justifications, some of which were reachy/NAI, yes.

[nancy]

Also @LUV I don't see the scum motivation in 1778. Explain to me why scum!mbg is so willing to mislynch town!Frogger when their death practically guarantees that they will lynched the following day? This is not even a self-save and it gets scum!mbg nowhere.

[nancy]

I was townleaning Vifam. Could you provide the VCA on that?

[nancy]

Here are VCs for referencing purposes.

Spoiler: Day 1 VCs

==> Vote Count 1.2 <==

[L-7]

Alisae -

[L-4]

Grendel - Keyser Söze, mattblackguy, Cooperative Sheep

[L-7]

Akarin -

[L-5]

Rautherdir - Vifam, Transcend

[L-5]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae

[L-7]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-7]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-7]

Transcend -

[L-7]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-7]

Keyser Söze -

[L-7]

Vifam -

[L-6]

mattblackguy - Lil Uzi Vert

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells - JarJarDrinks,

Waiting for their DOOM

- Grendel, Akarin, gerryoat, Rautherdir

==> Vote Count 1.3 <==

[L-7]

Alisae -

[L-5]

Grendel - Cooperative Sheep, JarJarDrinks

[L-7]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir - Transcend

[L-4]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae, Grendel

[L-5]

JarJarDrinks - Vifam, mattblackguy

[L-7]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-6]

Transcend - Rautherdir

[L-7]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-7]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam - gerryoat

[L-6]

mattblackguy - Lil Uzi Vert

[L-7]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Akarin, Keyser Söze

==> Vote Count 1.4 <==

[L-7]

Alisae -

[L-5]

Grendel - Cooperative Sheep, JarJarDrinks

[L-7]

Akarin -

[L-7]

Rautherdir -

[L-2]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Transcend

[L-5]

JarJarDrinks - Vifam, mattblackguy

[L-7]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-7]

Transcend -

[L-7]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-7]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam - gerryoat

[L-7]

mattblackguy -

[L-7]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Akarin, Keyser Söze, Rautherdir

[L-1]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Transcend, JarJarDrinks

==> Vote Count 1.5 (FINAL) <==

[L-7]

Alisae -

[L-6]

Grendel - Cooperative Sheep,

[L-7]

Akarin -

[L-7]

Rautherdir -

[LYNCH ACHIEVED]

gerryoat - RadiantCowbells, Alisae, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Transcend, JarJarDrinks, Vifam

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks - mattblackguy

[L-7]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-7]

Transcend -

[L-7]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-7]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam - gerryoat

[L-7]

mattblackguy -

[L-7]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Akarin, Keyser Söze, Rautherdir

Spoiler: Day 2 VCs

==> Vote Count 2.1 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-6]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-5]

Transcend - Cooperative Sheep

[L-5]

Cooperative Sheep - Transcend

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam - Grendel

[L-3]

mattblackguy - RadiantCowbells, Keyser Söze, Lil Uzi Vert

[L-4]

RadiantCowbells - JarJarDrinks, mattblackguy

Waiting for their DOOM

- Akarin, Rautherdir, Vifam

==> Vote Count 2.2 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-5]

Akarin - Vifam

[L-4]

Rautherdir - RadiantCowbells, Transcend

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-6]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-3]

Transcend - Cooperative Sheep, Rautherdir, JarJarDrinks

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-5]

Vifam - Akarin

[L-4]

mattblackguy - Keyser Söze, Lil Uzi Vert

[L-5]

RadiantCowbells - mattblackguy

Waiting for their DOOM

- Grendel

==> Vote Count 2.3 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-5]

Rautherdir - Transcend

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-6]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-1]

Transcend - Cooperative Sheep, Rautherdir, JarJarDrinks, Vifam, RadiantCowbells

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-4]

Vifam - Akarin, mattblackguy

[L-4]

mattblackguy - Keyser Söze, Lil Uzi Vert

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Grendel

==> Vote Count 2.4 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks -

[L-6]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-1]

Transcend - Cooperative Sheep, Rautherdir, JarJarDrinks, Vifam, RadiantCowbells

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-3]

Vifam - Akarin, mattblackguy, Transcend

[L-4]

mattblackguy - Keyser Söze, Lil Uzi Vert

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Grendel

==> Vote Count 2.5 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[L-4]

JarJarDrinks - Akarin, RadiantCowbells

[L-5]

Lil Uzi Vert - mattblackguy

[L-5]

nancy - Cooperative Sheep

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam -

[L-5]

mattblackguy - Keyser Söze

[L-5]

RadiantCowbells - nancy

Waiting for their DOOM

- Rautherdir, Vifam, JarJarDrinks, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert

==> Vote Count 2.6 <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[L-1]

JarJarDrinks - Akarin, nancy, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Fro99er

[L-3]

Lil Uzi Vert - mattblackguy, Keyser Söze, RadiantCowbells

[L-4]

nancy - Cooperative Sheep, JarJarDrinks

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Fro99er -

[L-6]

mattblackguy -

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Rautherdir

==> Vote Count 2.7 (FINAL) <==

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[LYNCH ACHIEVED]

JarJarDrinks - Akarin, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, nancy, Rautherdir, Fro99er

[L-3]

Lil Uzi Vert - mattblackguy, Keyser Söze, RadiantCowbells

[L-4]

nancy - Cooperative Sheep, JarJarDrinks

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep -

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Fro99er -

[L-6]

mattblackguy -

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells -

[nancy]

So LUV you think it's {mbg, Sheep}?

[nancy]

I honestly have issues with {JJD, mbg, Sheep} simply because it's so fucking obvious. Why are both JJD and Sheep voting me when the JJD hammer goes through? We have to assume terrible scumteam play here to allow so many obvious associatives.

pedit look forward to hearing back.

[nancy]

[L-7]

Alisae -

[L-6]

Grendel -

Cooperative Sheep

,

[L-7]

Akarin -

[L-7]

Rautherdir -

[LYNCH ACHIEVED]

gerryoat

- RadiantCowbells, Alisae, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, Transcend,

JarJarDrinks

, Vifam

[L-6]

JarJarDrinks

-

mattblackguy

[L-7]

Lil Uzi Vert -

[L-7]

Transcend -

[L-7]

Cooperative Sheep

-

[L-7]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Vifam - gerryoat

[L-7]

mattblackguy

-

[L-7]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

- Akarin, Keyser Söze, Rautherdir

[L-6]

Grendel -

[L-6]

Akarin -

[L-6]

Rautherdir -

[LYNCH ACHIEVED]

JarJarDrinks

- Akarin, Grendel, Lil Uzi Vert, nancy, Rautherdir, Fro99er

[L-3]

Lil Uzi Vert -

mattblackguy

, Keyser Söze, RadiantCowbells

[L-4]

nancy -

Cooperative Sheep

,

JarJarDrinks

[L-6]

Cooperative Sheep

-

[L-6]

Keyser Söze -

[L-6]

Fro99er -

[L-6]

mattblackguy

-

[L-6]

RadiantCowbells -

Waiting for their DOOM

-

This is utterly terrible scum play to allow such associatives on both day-ending wagons if {JJD, mbg, Sheep}.

[nancy]

My pleasure. I have them saved as draft always.

I think 3 scum on the mislynch is unlikely, yeah.

What was your case on LUV? Posting numbers acceptable.

I have to get to bed really soon.

[nancy]

Yeah I thought about multiball a while ago Keyser but the NKs don't allow for it.

Akarin's case on JJD was actually misreppy. What Akarin actually should've been pushing for there was an overly pedantic argument/analysis by JJD typical of scum who are reaching for material that isn't there.

[nancy]

I will say this again, Frogger backing off of Jar, because he is not sure that Jar is scum after he said that he was never more confident in a scumread, but then pushing me on mainly associations with Fro99er, and Nancy is scum! If he wasn't even sure Jar was scum anymore, but then pushed me on a case that was mainly built on my associations with the person he is not even sure if scum anymore is stupid as shit, and I don't know why anyone can't see it.

Could you rephrase this please or elaborate? I don't really follow it. (Edited your EBWOP in.)

[nancy]

Ugh didn't see this new page. Claiming here was really bad mbg.

[nancy]

Because I don't think you were actually going to get lynched.

[nancy]

I wasn't going to vote you. Anyway please answer Fro99er's questions.

[nancy]

Yeah this isn't looking pretty....

[nancy]

I sheeped RC once, then unsheeped.

Why did it take you so long to give us your N1 jail?

[nancy]

mbg, this looks really really bad for you right now. You should probably cooperate.

Fro99er is right, a JK here makes Town really fucking strong.

[nancy]

Sigh.

If this is really {JJD, mbg, Sheep} then yeah, this could just be scumteam given up.

[nancy]

@Rauth imagine there are 2 scumspects left and neither JK nor Cop are outed. JK hits 1 scumspect and Cop hits other. GG scumteam. It's pretty overpowered.

[nancy]

Yeah we basically just have to wait for Sheep and Akarin to return to thread.

[nancy]

Jerk! So selfish!

[nancy]

Omg that mod #yoink

[nancy]

Lol.

[nancy]

You don't want me in LyLo RC? I'm hurt.

[nancy]

RC it's fine if you just want to mislynch me for PoE but really, you've suspected everyone except Akarin today, the paranoia is eating you alive.

[nancy]

Anyway I don't have any site meta to back this up but I don't bus. I don't like bussing I think it's a shitty gimmick people use when they don't have the skill to play scum properly and the current bus-heavy meta is something I could really do without.

[nancy]

Well I'm sorry it's my opinion

Bussing is only required IMO if you don't have the ability to outmaneouvre and misdirect Town with pure skill play and coordination. You shouldn't ever need to kill your own teammate in order to win. Aiming for a perfect win in every single game is something that imo people don't do enough. They're content to ride it to LyLo and hopefully win there by PoE. This is why there are so many lurkers on MS. They're both related as I see it. But I'm a newbshit so I really don't have any idea what I'm talking about.

[nancy]

You seriously need to resolve this paranoia otherwise you're going to be completely paralyzed when it comes to LyLo.

[nancy]

Fro99er how did you get a scumread on JJD so quickly after replacing in? Your first read is "JJD is probably scum" in your 3rd ISO post. 1433

Why did you choose to give a running commentary as you were doing your catchup read? 1431, 1432, 1434

Why did you claim in 1444 when there was no pressure on your slot?

Why did you focus so heavily on your read of LUV? You didn't really go into significant detail on other slots.

[nancy]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=61784

Not skilled play / coordination? Bussing is hard to do well, y'know.

I take your point, but none of this would exist if bussing wasn't so prevalent. Turning bussing into coordinated team play is necessary adaptation to the meta, it's the meta I don't like.

I've never bussed in any of my scum games either. It always seemed to work against what is supposed to be a team game. That's not to say that if I thought a bus could win me the game that I wouldn't take it though. But if everybody just "didn't bus", then town would mop up almost every game. Because a scum wagon would clear everybody on it.

Which wouldn't be fair, or fun

If scum is getting run up then the scumteam has fucked up somewhere and that's what should be addressed. Bussing is just "welp, we played bad, guess we better kill each other to hide the fact". Obviously you have to mix up your meta every now and then to keep Town healthily paranoid but there's a bus in every single game I'm in it seems like and it's just ridiculous.

[nancy]

I thought I was at L-1.

I'm sorry to go over this shit again I'm just trying to figure out if this just paranoia or if there's actual scum motivation to what I think I'm seeing. Work with me?

Claiming kinda does hurt Town because you're giving scumteam information for NKs.

Have you played without anyone else besides RC?

[nancy]

Haha thanks Pine.

[nancy]

NOW I FEEL ALL OBSERVED GOOD JOB SENPAI

[nancy]

Honestly the more I look at this the less I can see any scum motivation for Fro99er here *unless* Fro99er's endgame is to not get lynched, and he has basically offered himself up right now. Maybe it's a gambit, maybe it isn't. If scum!Fro99er genuinely expects to get lynched then the stuff with LUV doesn't make sense. If LUV is his scumpartner then he's drawing the most fucking obvious and terrible associative any scumpartner could possibly make. If LUV is Town then he's helping Town by giving another townie obvtown status. The only motivation here that I can find for scum!Fro99er is to NOT get lynched and yet he's repeatedly offered himself up.

My read of the interactions between JJD and Fro99er as scum theater was because JJD's responses to Fro99er were softballed and JJD was never really there, in contrast to JJD's pretty vehement interactions with RC. I took this as indicative of Fro99er being JJD's scumpartner.

pedit hm.

[nancy]

Can someone please help digest the potential scum theater with me?

[nancy]

It starts here: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 8#p8852708

[nancy]

The issue with that scumteam Fro99er is that it's so obvious and requires scumteam to bad and also in full steam ahead bus mode.

I still think {JJD, Fro99er, Grendel} is a reasonably likely scumteam but I need to work over this a lot more. I have to go so I'm unvoting for now.

UNVOTE:

[nancy]

This massclaim is a farce. It's Gredndel/Sheep. Anyone who doesn't see this is blind. I'm on fone will be home in a few hours to post properly.

[nancy]

Home finally. Have time for a quick post then shower and I'll be back.

VOTE: Nancy

I believe this is the right lynch today.

I think you could be right

This rarely comes from Town, not to mention I'm the only slot scumreading Grendel and there is significant scum motivation here to get rid of me.

I've never bussed in any of my scum games either. It always seemed to work against what is supposed to be a team game. That's not to say that if I thought a bus could win me the game that I wouldn't take it though. But if everybody just "didn't bus", then town would mop up almost every game. Because a scum wagon would clear everybody on it.

Which wouldn't be fair, or fun

Unsolicited opinions in the middle of my exchange with RC. This is scum!Grendel trying to distance himself from the idea of being a busser in this bus-heavy scumteam.

I hate to admit it, but I'm very susceptible to self meta. Most of my Nancy read is gut paranoia and losing faith in my other scum reads. I don't think that's enough to justify voting her.

I think sheep is it?

VOTE: CooperativeSheep

I need to reread some of this roster tbh

pre-edit

Hi RC

This is not town!Grendel. Grendel has been reluctant to vote anyone all game and how he's jumping on Sheep. He's also moving me back out of his lynchpool, probably to reduce associatives with Sheep, who still wants me dead for ~reasons~.

Both Grendel and Sheep also have each other in their lynch pools. This is way too fucking convenient.

The last two scum are in {Grendel, LUV, Sheep}.

VOTE: Grendel

pedit can't wait Pine

[nancy]

@Nancy, If Grendel was scum with Sheep he would lose the game by bussing him right now. No way he can get past Jailkeeper, and cop.

VOTE: Sheep

Yeah this is the best lynch for today.

Don't think that's the case. Grendel is widely TRed and there'd be no reason for Cop to be checking him, especially if he was just first spot on a scum lynch. Besides if he's RB and mbg is JK then he can easily roleblock mbg and kill Rauth, problem solved.

1)The other wagon that I would have voted early in the day (Matt) was already close to being lynched. Compare that to here where Sheep had zero votes.

2)You are not the only one scum reading me. And if there was significant scum motivation in offing you now when the tides were turning why did I choose to back off?

Sorry how is randomly bussing Sheep relevant to not joining a lynch on mbg? I never argued that you were scumpartners with mbg.

Who else is scumreading you besides Sheep? LUV is sheeping me and won't even vote you. As I said, to reduce associatives. The tides were turning?

@Nancy

With the reads you have there's literally no reason cherry pick which lynch you want if we're both flipping scum. So you should get on Sheep.

I'm not cherrypicking. You're scum with either Sheep or LUV.

[nancy]

Oh hey I just found out that I actually suck at this game. So RC you're a doublevote for as long as I'm alive. I'm not giving any more reads on anything. Not voting myself because it's against my wincon.

UNVOTE:

[nancy]

Yeah, forget everything I said. I have no confidence. I am probably wrong about everything. I don't care. My gut can go fuck itself. RC is the only person I'm willing to give my vote to. End of story.

[nancy]

mod replace me please sorry

[nancy]

Alright. Sorry. I just kind of imploded. Today is not a good day. Cowgirling it up. I might be in a very bad tunnel on Grendel and also Fro99er with the scum theater stuff. So. Goodbye paranoia. I deem thee worthy, my sheepiest of friends.

VOTE: Sheep

[nancy]

Thanks, Keyser, it's appreciated. *hugs*

[nancy]

Something like this, which tells me I need to reset. And also partially explains the paranoia.

{Fro99er, Keyser, RC}
{Akarin, Grendel, LUV}
{}
{Rauth, Sheep}
{}

Rauth is obviously a soft-confirmable PR and hence technically a TR but that's my read on him based on his actual content.

[nancy]

Lol.

[nancy]

Aw ily too. Also lol.

[nancy]

Just realized something but I'm basically asleep so

UNVOTE:

[nancy]

Okay so what I realized when I was in bed last night was that I don't understand the NK and also why No Lynch is a bad idea here.

Correct me if I'm wrong with my NK analysis / PoE here but shouldn't either mbg or RC be scum here? I don't think scum has a RB. If they had a RB then they don't try to kill Rauth last night, they just RB him and kill someone else. And they don't kill RC because while RC is known for his fakeclaims there's still a chance that he isn't fakeclaiming here and you don't take that chance. Keyser is the choice 100% for the NK last night imo. The only way they target RC imo is if they are happy enough with their position to risk coming into today without a kill.

[nancy]

Like what are the possibilities here with Rauth getting a No Result and there being no NK? If mbg is Town JK then scum had to have either targeted Rauth or RC or an unclaimed BP. If they targeted Rauth that means they have no RB. If they targeted RC they're happy with their position or potentially Keyser is scum. We have no way of telling which one it was until one of those 3 dies, I think?

If mbg is scum JK then they jailed Rauth and targeted RC or an unclaimed BP. We have no way of telling which until one of the 2 dies.

If mbg is scum goon then they targeted RC or an unclaimed BP but that doesn't explain the No Result. They would have to have a roleblocker or Rauth's claim was fake.

If they had a JK/roleblocker, again, why would they kill RC? That's just a risk you don't take unless you can really afford the consequences should you be wrong.

[nancy]

Super helpful RC, thanks.

They wouldn't have tried to roleblock a protective role if they believed RC's claim. There wouldn't be a protective and also a BP I don't think? And if they didn't believe the claim and had a roleblocker they would've just killed RC and roleblocked you. Which would align with the NK results. But I find it kind of unlikely.

[nancy]

A little help here, Keyser?

[nancy]

{Rauth, RC} seems very highly unlikely because I just don't see them having a gameplan from this point forward. Like there's no way they NKed last night and came out with a No Result today and are just sitting on their hands hoping to mislynch all of Town without their gambit being exposed. I don't see RC playing this way. So if it's mbg or RC by PoE then mbg is almost certainly scum. So can someone please help me here and tell me if my PoE is correct?

Something unexpected has to have happened last night for the scumteam, or they are just extremely happy with their position and went for the kill on RC because even if the claim is real they'd want to kill the slot soon anyway and a mislynch wasn't going to happen?

[nancy]

I don't see the gambit working tbh. No responsible Town is going to lynch themselves into oblivion while Rauth continues to come up without reports, and I don't believe RC would gamble the whole game like that on D2. He'd have to basically be hoping that Town paranoia is somehow potent enough for all the mislynches to seem okay and yet never touch him or Rauth.

[nancy]

Granted he may not have expected JJD to get lynched so soon, but it's still far fetched and gymnastic-y. I don't see this play coming from RC.

[nancy]

What about RC?

[nancy]

Another possibility is that mbg IS JK, scum has a strongarm and no RB. They targeted Rauth last night without strongarm because they didn't expect a JK in this setup with Cop, Backup Cop, and BP.

[nancy]

Dude I'm trying to gamesolve. Help me. If we gamesolve correctly it's irrelevant whether I'm scum or Town because we'll find the scumteam whether that's me or whomever.

[nancy]

The doublevoter thing was just me having a meltdown. What do you want/need me to explain? If this is about your reads then that's fine, but I'm pretty directionless right now.

[nancy]

I'm not certain at all of mbg/Sheep anymore, I actually think it's unlikely because it requires bad scum play and I don't like assuming that.

[nancy]

Either Sheep or LUV for PoE probably. Sheep's probable partners imo are LUV, mbg and Keyser, in that order of likelihood, but mostly based on circumstantial and iffy stuff like Keyser not wanting to vote Sheep, Sheep having LUV in his scumpool along with 2 others yet never going after him, mbg for them both being on counterwagons when JJD was getting lynched. Maybe mbg, depending on what we do with gamesolving and how likely it ends up being that his claim is real.

pedit thanks but I'm at an all-time low on confidence right now. I mean I'm in the process of resetting and I'm happy to go through the game from page 1 and scumhunt from the start all over again to give you what you need.

[nancy]

Alright.

VOTE: LUV

[nancy]

Hey Keyser, quick question, how well do you know RC's town game? How does he react to buddying, in your experience?

[nancy]

You mean you think he could've been imitating it this game?

[nancy]

Why not rely on your meta analysis? You don't know RC's meta that well?

[nancy]

No, I haven't. Not yet, anyway. Think the innocent investigation is legit?

[nancy]

I'm kinda doubting both these wagons right now. They might both be Town. What do you think?

[nancy]

Keyser?

I need direction here.

[nancy]

Hrm. OK.

What about these two wagons right now? I'm kind of tired of waiting for people to return to thread and give their opinions, what do you think about them both as they stand currently?

[nancy]

I mean I'm not asking for your vote just what you think.

[nancy]

LUV and Sheep both look kinda townie to me, y'know?

[nancy]

Sorry I'm being kinda needy here I realize.

[nancy]

I swear I just have one question after this and then I'm done

[nancy]

I'm pretty undecided myself, what's your overall feeling about them?

[nancy]

I mean aside from the associations that is.

[nancy]

Like you'd have LUV as Town if not for associations?

[nancy]

If you had to pick one? Between LUV and Sheep? Which wagon do you think you'd end up on?

[nancy]

q.q

[nancy]

If you could answer 2326 that would be great because I'm rereading things and I'm starting to get some ideas and stuff but I need GUIDANCE!! And you are a hero Keyser!! You can give me what I need!!

[nancy]

But I'm going to bed SOON.

[nancy]

And then I just have ONE LAST question and then I'll NEVER BOTHER YOU AGAIN PROMISE!!!!

[nancy]

Keyser Keyser Keyser

[nancy]

Did you know I'm a Ravenclaw?

[nancy]

Yay!

Okay so last question Keyser who are you going to kill tonight?

[nancy]

Alright. This reset has been good and I'm part way through D2 right now. I don't really want to post anything substantial until I've done the full reread and put stuff together but so far I'm sorting Grendel as Town and Sheep as scum. Rauth softed PR D1 so both he and RC are conftown to me. I'm also believing mbg's claim, so that gives me 4 slots sorted into Town so far. Akarin is a townlean, Keyser is a scumlean, everyone else is null. Wouldn't be surprised if both Sheep and LUV are scum tbh considering LUV has totally abandoned this thread.

[nancy]

Did you know I'm a Ravenclaw?

Me too! My friends say I'm a Slytherin, but that is Fucking Horseshit.

Agreed. No way you're Slytherin. No way. I mean I can see where they're coming from and there are little hints of it but just no. I have a bit of Hufflepuff in me, and a tiny bit of Slytherin, too, but I bleed Ravenclaw.

[nancy]

Awesome! Hi ThinkBig!

And yeah you summed it up perfectly Pine, it's all about ambition, that's why they're the baddies!