Thespival Mafia (Denouement)

[Holy]

/confirm

[Holy]

O my~ a fast paced game...

Not jester.

I didn't like the way Greasy Spot delayed to answer questions toward him.
Gladly will join the wagon on him.

Meanwhile,

vote: hasdgfas

. Tongue tied in this game?

About tyhess, I can see why if tyhess is a scum, the more he recruit the more dangerous he will be.

About Iammars, I felt that was just an idiocy slipped.

[Holy]

Holy,

think

Lol!

Meanwhile,

vote: hasdgfas

. Tongue tied in this game?

Actually, looking back at hasdgfas, it appears that he has a post restriction.

Hint: AMEN!

Fine..fine..

Unvote

.

[Holy]

I believe there will come the time when we need tyhess to recruit and he need to do that with our approval.

[Holy]

(Hey I can finally get on) after reading this whole thing Mith seems very scummy but I am reluctent to vote..

Why does Mith

seem very scummy

?
Why are you

reluctant

to vote?

BM

Because you sensed his evil tone...? O_o
Because you feared his evil counter..? o_O
Lol! j/k

[Holy]

Well I can see from the jester side to win as soon as possible too (with not revealing oneself as the jester) by just trying to behave normally-neutral-enough (lol!) on Day 1 to survive the lynch and to avoid the 1st NK, and 'home free' on Day 2 by behaving scummy enough to get the attention for a lynch.

[Holy]

I didn't like the way Greasy Spot delayed to answer questions toward him.
Gladly will join the wagon on him.

I'm busy at work lately, I can put more attention at weekends I guess.

[Holy]

@hasdgfas: Err, if you agreed with Meme's on Dani, why didn't you vote him too?

[Holy]

I'm still new with this PR thing. And I think I get what Meme's direction at with the A word thought.
Although hasdgfas's Random Power maybe a bad thing for town, but I still prefer he's able to discuss (express himself) normally than hides behind his PR.
I'll wait for others to sound their opinion regarding this A word for more revelation.

[Holy]

Oh yeah, I almost forgot,

I AM THE JESTER!!

Ok, I didn't feel like to believe that so early, I'll wait for a moment for a possible counter-claim. I didn't know if you were serious or just being frustrated.

[Holy]

I AM THE JESTER!!

You lied earlier, what makes you think you'll be believed now?

Vote: Greasy Spot

, b/c:
1. He lied
2. He requested it, and
3. I think that there's more then enough material that been covered here on the 1st day.

That places Greasy Spot at L-2 btw. Keeping him around for endgame just isn't very appealing to me atm, and if he really is the jester then that's one less party to compete for 1st place with.

His reason voting GS was overabundance IMHO, seems fake.

Vote: Monkey

.

[Holy]

@Monkey: it sounds like you want to appeared understand enough of his scummy situation (at least for me). Also I sensed an eagerness on that, hasdgfas just broke his restriction, and there's still time before the deadline (which wasn't so far away ).

[Holy]

I actaully don't think monkey's idea is to far fetched...all sacastro would have to do is keep his vote there and if something big turns up where the person he's voting for gets waggoned and lynched, he can bide his time and say that he wasn't done reading yet and effectively hammered one guy and contributed without giving info on another.

Did you really believed if the person he's voting for gets lynched, on the next day he could still give the excuse that he wasn't done reading at all? Insane indeed.

I mean we're not in day 1 anymore randomly voting people.

Ehh, I really thought that we voted the scum on day 1 .

[Holy]

I wish I knew how to tell the difference between newbie scum and newbie town.

Their boldness with their mistakes or their feeble scumhunting, meh.

FOS: wolfcrier

for it.

[Holy]

In conclusion, let's lynch RW. Also, Monkey is probably just newbie-town, but he's still really annoying me right now.

Hm, I still prefer a Monkey lynch.

Not sure with RW, noob-scum or noob-town.

Still suspecting wolfcrier, and still in reckoning progress of a wolfcrier-jester probability too.
(i.e. I need a wolfcrier re-read).

[Holy]

Though I'm not interested in switching my vote from Quickben (who's truly lurking -- posting elsewhere while saying he'll get to us "asap" 5 days ago), Holy's starting to look rather questionable to me. Her last few posts kind of confused me so I did a pull of all her posts -- they're kind of a study in blend.

<3

When did it starts, MeMe?

^_^

[Holy]

I had kinda been overlooking her...

Why, scum?

[Holy]

... I already announced my findings on Holy: "they're kind of a study in blend."

I'm ready when you're ready >.>
But please, attack me on weekends would be better, no promise though...

[Holy]

Holy

I feel that you would be a strong candidate for HD 4

I'll take it... ;_;

and Holy, because you don't post much and don't say much when you do. It's that simple.

Wow, you must have overlooked like one third of the town in that case -.-;


I'm supporting an RW lynch now, I just need the Vote Count first.
And I still haven't re-read wolfcrier, maybe tomorrow.

[Holy]

^Wow, a responsive mod!
Lol, kidding ^.^

Unvote, Vote: RossWilliam.

Sorry Holy

RossWilliams already took the job.

How about HD#6 for you?

HD6: Ridiculously hot female distraction used to boost ratings among male teens.

Duties

are to look good and

constantly

need help.

I hate duties..., seems hard. No, but thank you ^_^

[Holy]

funny how Holy had no interest in a RW lynch until I called her out for not contribuiting much.

Hm, you're definitely not reading well >.>

[Holy]

^
1. I definitely think you were only following MeMe with not the same reason as hers.
2. Your play screams you're a noob, I already state my RW concerns somewhere, whether you are the scum-noob or town-noob that made me uncertain until your last few comments and that's not exactly because of your call on me.

[Holy]

Lol! I have re-read wolfcrier, seems like jester than scum. Maybe...

@al_ko: scumhunting act doesn't add up with overlooking any player at all. Anyway RW's reason, I believe is made-up.

[Holy]

@farside22: Well my lady, although not "huge", I believe I've sound my concerns clearly and regularly. And welcome to the town. Btw, I believe your PBPA is unfinished, please carry on... ~.^

Hiyas!

Oh, hello there!




Hm, I must admit, I'm quite interested with Pooky's case ~.~;

[Holy]

Hm, if tomorrow our doc claimer is staying alive, then I will think further about her case. For now, I'll support an RW lynch or Monkey lynch, still.

Personally, I'm still curious about farside22's "choosy" PBPA, TBH.

[Holy]

Unvote. Vote: Monkey.

Concerning farside, I prefer giving her one more chance to convince us of her innocence after we lynch Monkey.

Does anyone have a problem with me recruiting Sarcastro tonight? I would like everyone's opinion on that.

I'm opposing this. He's voting and contributing, we're able to see his pattern to analyze whether he's scum or not.

I'd prefer you recruit someone who isn't voting. Like Iammars.

I can see with your point about Iammars for the candidate, that's why I'm really curious for farside's choosy PBPA, she said that I and also MeMe aren't contributing, i.e. lurking but said nothing about Iammars, which I think is the one who actually kind of lurking.
But I oppose any recruit this soon, it isn't helping us much IMHO.

[Holy]

Hm, I really thought wolfcrier's posts were so jester-like though.

[Holy]

Monkey, he hardly contributes or does anything

That, is scummy to me >.>

[Holy]

Holy, (and anybody else who happens to log on in the next few minutes), what are your current thoughts on Bx2 and Monkey?

BeepBeep: I was biased by wolfcrier's posts though, so when I read her now, I still consider she's might be jester.

Monkey: I don't think he's following the game well. His vote and his comments lately showed that indication more.

[Holy]

Monkey, he hardly contributes or does anything

That, is scummy to me >.>

Then why dont you f*ing vote?

Lol! Don't I!? Dun that.

[Holy]

^I did what Talitha pointed about how to find it, I got doc and cop card from there.

Vote: farside22.

After this, I'm leaning to vote the missing players from her list, although I'm pretty sure she also listed her 'too scummy' friend too.

[Holy]

I'm not sure why Thesp would have 2 doctors. I never went to Thesp game before or looked anything up, but that's just my word and I had no clue another doctor would be out there.
Since there is little I can say in my defense on this matter I would look at Holy and Pooky after my lynch. Holy sent my scum radar off with her lack of comments and quick vote.
For those saying the mafia didn't kill me last night, why would they when Monkey came up doctor. I make a perfect target for today. You can say WIFOM all you want, but that is what I'm reading from some people and why they are voting against me.

I don't think this game is so flavorful and need to have 2 doctors able to save at night at the same time, I'm not ignoring the possibility of a backup doctor in large game, but it's more likely there's a doc and a nurse than 2 docs since the beginning.
Are you trying shifting suspicion to me, there? ~.^

[Holy]

^Pooky said 2 people that need to confess.

I don't think this game is so flavorful and need to have 2 doctors able to save at night at the same time, I'm not ignoring the possibility of a backup doctor in large game, but it's more likely there's a doc and a nurse than 2 docs since the beginning.
Are you trying shifting suspicion to me, there? ~.^

Both claimed Doctors claimed Star Trek's McCoy. There is no indication that either is a backup, or that one is a nurse.

Both claims are for full Doctors, same character, same card.

Do you believe the game has two full powered Doctor McCoy's?

Nope, that's why I think she's lying and voted her.
I don't believe the theory that the scum decided not to kill doc to let her lynched the next day. That only lead for two possible unsuccessful kill two nights in a row for the scum, which is silly.

[Holy]

^hm, I was thinking for the probability of tonight too, if she's really the doc and we leave her peacefully today, the scum will deal with a possibility of unsuccessful kill two nights in a row, with last night.
Yes, I was wrong for mixing it up with tonight possibility too.
Overall, the theory she's the doc that left alive by the scum is a silly theory. She lied, I guess.

[Holy]

Also fun conversation for tomorrow. When I come up doc Holy what excuse will you have from saying it was silly?

Are you bluffing on me? ;_;

[Holy]

I guess farside is kind of nervous, she's keep saying it 3, lol.
Well, I'm quite curious here, Pooky.

Regarding PJ's conversation with Beep!Beep!, I should say Beep's scumscore isn't quite balanced to me because it only looks from the voting patterns, on the other side, Beep kind of fair to admit it and still considering other aspects too (my assumption from watching his play), I also noticed that Beep isn't voting his top blindly just because his scum scores says so.

[Holy]

Farside names a lot of players (about half the living players on that day, which is why I wanted half the living players today). A couple of recurring players (for no apparent reason) are MeMe and Holy. These two players should be watched, along with Ross William - if farside turns out to be scum.

Look at beep, beep tomorrow folks. After my lynch and the fact that I will come up as Doctor should be enough. Oh and don't forget about Holy either.
GL.

@BeepBeep & Farside: I'm not fond of how both of you try to shifting suspicions to me for something that not happened yet, if both of you questioned me, just assault me directly please. Although I'm quite sure Farside is scum and BeepBeep might be a jester that finally decides to help us hunting scum.

[Holy]

By the way this is what irked me about Holy the most is what she stated yesterday.

Hm, if tomorrow our doc claimer is staying alive, then I will think further about her case. For now, I'll support an RW lynch or Monkey lynch, still.

This is what started out with if she is still alive to beep beep using that for his main arguement.

unvote: Vote Holy

Either one, but both look scummie to me.

Hm, I didn't believe with crappy theory that scum will let a doc alive last night, that's why if you're still alive today that means you're saved by the doc, or the scum was roleblocked, or simply that because you're teh scum.
But it turns out Monkey was a doc, and I don't think we have two full doc from the start though, so my conclusion you're likely a lying scum. There's 3 deaths, so I doubt, if there's a roleblocker, that the roleblock was succeed, and I doubt for the protection possibility, the doc was dead obviously.

About yesterday lynch, your wishy-washy PBPA did raise my suspicion and then you followed the day with claiming doc, I don't have any idea whether you're telling the truth or not yesterday, so I think the wise play for yesterday was back to my main suspects, which is RW and Monkey.

[Holy]

Holy, why do you feel that Beep Beep could be the jester?

BeepBeep predecessor was wolfcrier, if you read wolfcrier's posts, you'll found that he was saying things with a faint contradictory almost on his every post, like saying that he found someone was scummy but refuse to vote him at the same time. That kind of action seems like asking to be lynch for me.

Holy, why do you feel that Beep Beep could be the jester?

I have an inkling that the Jester might be you, as you seem to hold many opinions contrary to logic, common sense, or going straight against the grain of the majority thinking in the game.

Which of my opinions that contrary to logic or common sense?

[Holy]

Although I'm quite sure Farside is scum

Is there a strategic reason for you to hold you vote right now?

There's no strategic reason, I just think we possibly got a scum here.

BeepBeep might be a jester that finally decides to help us hunting scum.

Were my predecessors Jester-ish? Is there not a more efficient way to have oneself lynched, than to hunt scum? But thank you for recognizing that I am hunting scum.

Yup, your predecessor was so jester-ish. And the more you scumhunt, the more enemy you got, so maybe you'll got your lynch, although I don't think I will participate.

[Holy]

Holy, why do you feel that Beep Beep could be the jester?

I have an inkling that the Jester might be you, as you seem to hold many opinions contrary to logic, common sense, or going straight against the grain of the majority thinking in the game.

Which of my opinions that contrary to logic or common sense?

Ooops, sorry, apparently you directed it to CKD.


And sorry for the simul-post.

[Holy]

Beep, were is that scum list you said you would post?

I want to do a good job. Later today.

care to address the rest of my post?

Holy, why do you feel that Beep Beep could be the jester?

BeepBeep predecessor was wolfcrier, if you read wolfcrier's posts, you'll found that he was saying things with a faint contradictory almost on his every post, like saying that he found someone was scummy but refuse to vote him at the same time. That kind of action seems like asking to be lynch for me.

but you feel like Beep is making perfect sense? if not, what dont you agree with in reference to anything he has been saying lately (note: both of you are push for farside's lynch)...also, Holy did you know about the game cards before the game started?

I know nothing about the cards before the game started.
She listed her scum with scum scores... Umm, no, I don't think she's making perfect sense, but I must admit, her efforts analyzing this town residents are quite good, at the same time she poked almost everyone with it though.
Why should I agree with Beep? I don't think I understand your question. Let me say this once again, with 3 deaths last night, dead doc, and farside's wishy-washy PBPA, and the fact she survived the night, simply, I think she might be scum.

Side note for Holy

. You were the one who brought up the day before me being alive would make you think more about me. Did that not click that either (a) you look scummie for said comment or (b) giving something to the scum to use for the next day lynch? Just curious.

Yeah, right, are you asking me or just want to stating me as either (a) or (b), there?
Because it never cross my mind if scum would let a doc live for another day, so if you were telling the truth about your claim, I don't think there will be tomorrow for you. But if you survived the next day, there's possibility scum was roleblocked, plus if this morning we deal with no death or only one death, I might consider you were telling the truth and won't vote you, but the fact is, we deal with 3 deaths this morning and we discovered a doc, i.e. Monkey.

[Holy]

@CKD: if I need to, I can (I knew how), with right clicking the picture\view. When Talitha sent the link, it just reminded me of it.

@farside: yeah, well, tomorrow is tomorrow. And today I just want to make it clear about the reason why we need to lynch you, scum.

[Holy]

I smell opportunism in the "plan bad = MeMe scum" votes, possibly even an attempt to save farside (for tomorrow? because she's a partner?).

Hm, I noticed that opportunism too, "plan bad = MeMe scum" votes. From your plan, I think, directing vig or RB is bad plan, but I can see your point regarding chaos between likely jester or just scum pretending jester, all in all, I don't think scum will follow the plan without victimize the innocents, or like MoS' said.

I'm quite sad you're leaving, MeMe. The reason I joined here, some of it is because I want to play with you ;_;

[Holy]

I

do not consider the jester "winning" equivalent to the town "losing" when the game continues. If the town gets second, I will

not

be placing it as a "loss" in my statistics.

I would rather lynch the Jester than a townsperson

, when it comes right down to it, and that's how I am going to play.

While I, prefer lynching whom-who-looks-all-over-like-scum over the-obviously-provoking-jester or likely-townsperson-without-worries, and that's how I am going to play.

Holy has been implicitly defending wolfcrier/Beep! Beep! all game on the basis of "gee, it looks like he is the jester".

Lol! It's because I honestly think he is. If you want to vote him, please feel free to do it, but I won't join the bandwagon though.

I want the three of these players to

all comment on each other

. Pooky needs to comment on Beep! Beep! and Holy; Beep! Beep! needs to comment on Pooky and Holy; and Holy needs to comment on Beep! Beep! and Pooky.

Hmm, I don't think Pooky's attempts to trap scum looks like a scum-plan, he seemed throwing it without nothing to lose feel and hopefully feel that we might bust a sweating-scum-that-worries slipped. And with his ways when launching it, it didn't smell came from scum.
While your recent analysis, smell like it.
As for Beep!, my comments about her already all over the place, I suppose.

[Holy]

Lets see if people read things I say.
I'm tired of being ignored and I want to help with the confusion. So I will say Beep Beep you are trying hard to lynch a claimed doctor on WIFOM logic. Mafia could be using that same tactic and it is completely easy to do with Monkey dead and coming up doctor.
Now that said I am a Quack Doctor. I wasn't a 100% sure day one since I replaced a person and I wasn't going to say anything about it figuring I would get lynched saying who CB actually targeted and I wanted to stay alive long enough to understand who was scum, who was jester and who was town. I'm not getting anywhere with anyone so it doesn't matter. Night one CB targeted Mith, Mith died. Night two I targeted Sacrostro because (a) I thought him Jester and if he wasn't Jester he was scummie as hell and wanted to see if the Quack Doctor theory I had was right. Well he died and was shown as a townie. I only say this because well people keep ignoring me execpt to say I'm scummie or to listen to crap-pot Beep beep for some assign reason I have yet to understand. Plus it helps lesson the confusion on the 3rd kill or 2 mafia idea that people have.
I still stand by Holy and Mathcam as scum other then that I haven't got a clue. If you still want to lynch me I'm not going to stop or argue go right to town, but I will keep saying I expected, I still expected it and nothing is going to get through to any town person left in this game, but I already figure I'm going to be lynched. I'm just helping solve one less confusion.

QUACK OR NOT, you did claim a doc, and you survived.
The fact that you changed your story of who you protected actually, only convinced me more of you as scum. If you concerned of your sanity which you doubted on Day 2, and if you really protected Sarcastro last night, EARLY on this day when you found you're likely to be lynched, you would reveal this immediately to the town, you got 2 results which dead because of you to be sure of it (if it's true), but no, you pushed this Quack theory on the middle of the game and after PJ mentioned about his Quack theory.
So, nooo, I don't buy your new claim.

vote Beep Beep

, I dont think you are the Jester now, you are just DGB, if the Mod assigned you the Jester role, he is a sick SOB.

Gasp! So it's DGB >.> <.<

My FFM mod, euh...

withholding information

Sure is. That's how I find scum, and how I want to be able to continue finding scum. Nobody but me needs to believe in my method. I don't need to make converts. If you don't trust it, that's fine.

Vote me, lynch me over it. I don't care.

Hmm, *thinking hard...* *thinking reaaally hard*
Nahh, your predecessor was jester-ish also.

[Holy]

Hm, PJ seems good at propaganda skill, lol. He might be scum, I'm not that sure. But I'm pretty sure with todays catch, farside's claim as quack in the middle of this day feels too sudden, plus her Changing Story of who were targeted/protected by her, not seems pro-town.

I would like to roll, but deadline is in ~6 days, what would we gain with voting PJ now but a sneaking scum?

[Holy]

Apparently, I'm doing good in hunting docs, lol.
;_;

Holy

1.)

What do you think of Beep! Beep! now that she cannot possibly be the jester?

After I re-read her, I think she might be scum who hides behind her scum scores smoothly. I don't trust her PBPA too, said about get a "

solid

town vibe" about someone, made me suspicion her more.


Hm, CKD reaction is so OMGUSsy, I clearly get what hasdgfas meant, I think CKD's attempt to discredit hasgdfas' reveal of whether is it Pooky or him is an overemphasize attempt to survive, which likely came from scum.

I definitely will vote CKD. Amen.


Regarding PJ's frustration and his attempt to understand more about other players, I don't think that as scummy. Sometimes I did that too if I must (depends on the town), and from experience, usually I end up being lynched after that kind of effort ;_; Well, might be because I'm suck when doing that, I guess.

[Holy]

Hm, roleblocker. But not targeting Pooky, it didn't fits with the track result claim.

NB: CKD, your 'breadcrumb' sucks.

[Holy]

@CKD: Who did you blocked then? And why?


Sorry for the trip-posts.

[Holy]

Good interrogation there, BM.

Allright, honestly I'm beginning to doubt hasdgfas, I'm still confuse here...
Lets see, CKD breadcrumbed and at the same time said his curiosity for where will Pooky brought the Talitha case.
Hasdgfas wasn't voting farside, but the moment farside change story of who her targets were, he voted farside, and claimed vigging Sarc and said maybe it was a double kill.
While from the Quack description, a Quack may kill the patient if the patient is not attacked, but if hasdgfas got vig power at that time, it means Sarcastro was attacked.
I'm still new with this kind of variant, maybe a dose of opinion from others?

And then today, hasdgfas' claiming tracked CKD to Pooky.
CKD counter, claiming that he was RB-ed someone last night, but not Pooky.
CKD's claimed targets from N1 to N3: Talitha, Talitha, RW. All dead.
Grrh, one of you must be scum, I'm just still confused which.

[Holy]

My goodness. Can we let her read?

There's plenty of interesting stuff to talk about instead...

Cam

Plenty..., really?

[Holy]

Luls.

[Holy]

or whether or not I'm scummy for my recent behavior.

Recent behaviour? I see little reason to suspect you on your behaviour.

The strongest argument against you consists of 1 word. MeMe.

Oh, I thought so too, lol! XD
If your behaviour alone measured without considering MeMe's, I definitely think you might be scum.

[Holy]

^Somewhat yup, I just realized what I underlined, lol. No, I don't think MeMe was that scummy. I'm still unsure about MeMe/mathcam, tbh.

[Holy]

Sorry, I haven't got a time to post now. I'll catch up tomorrow.

[Holy]

lynch CKD

<grinning> I'm leaning on that actually.

^Somewhat yup, I just realized what I underlined, lol. No, I don't think MeMe was that scummy. I'm still unsure about MeMe/mathcam, tbh.

ok, what has Mathcam done to make you feel that way?

BM

"it's rather advantageous for scum to know how every person feels about every other person", Mathcam said.
I can see his point, because personally I'm not fond with PBPA too, people can change their minds, opinion is dynamic along with the game progress, besides that, scum tend to twist our words from it.
But, the way PJ put his assignments, didn't feel like there's something scummy beneath it.
So, I'm just not sure whether or not Mathcam's refusal motive was truly like what he said.

ugh, I am tired of arguing with this town...you deserve to lose..

unvote Has, vote CKD

thats is negative one kids...lets see which scum jumps in and hammers me

I'm still considering whether hasdgfas' claim VS the quack the day before is legit or not, but with you voting yourself, my impression towards you just not getting any better >.>

[Holy]

I've re-read hasdgfas and CKD, I've decide, I think I'll vote CKD. Meanwhile, I'll give more time for Mizzy.

Reasons to disbelieve hasdgfas's claim

...

2.)

After breaking his 'restriction', there were no tangible negative effects that he or others can see.
...

We can't see it, but he said "ungiven: unknown", maybe that is the negative effect: not given. I can believe that, unlike CKD VS Pooky thing, I don't really believe this whole RB thing, mostly because the timing though.

Opportunist.

vote: mathcam

Obviously, hasdgfas' and CKD's claim are contradictory. One of them must be lying, which means one of them must be scum, I suppose. So what's wrong with his vote btw? He has explained his decision.

I may be wrong, but I thought I should point out the possibility.

Pointing it out is okay, but voting him while we have this hasdgfas VS CKD case? That's quite distracting, IMO.

[Holy]

-->

b.)

A few players have called CKD's breadcrumb very "weak", without taking into account the

reason

his breadcrumb may have been so late (even I did not notice this until after CKD mentioned it), and the fact that his breadcrumb was substantive enough (by fitting "RB" in one post three times) that it was implausible to think he had left

separate

breadcrumbs for the possibility of him claiming

a different

role.

Scum favorite fake-claims are RB and Cop, why? RB - Because if there's such a role like Tracker in the game, they may be able to 'explain' about the Track Result to keep alive. Cop - Usually near endgame, fake-claim Cop too early is bold but careless, this could be happened well because of their 'knowledge'. Wait, maybe I should add Jester too on that list? :p
So, if CKD is scum and had left the RB-claim trail, I don't think he feel the need to left

separate

breadcrumbs of a different role, RB is quite a safe claim.
I'm not dismissing the plausibility that CKD maybe indeed the RB, but the fact him created the trail after Pooky's claim, is bothering me. If he is Town, like from the meta (link he provided about his MASON claim), don't you think he should realized the need to breadcrumb on earlier day like his mason-claim case, to help when revealing his -might be helpful RB result- sometime when needed, to us? And not after being called by Pooky regarding Talitha's death.
While typing this, I realized if RB is quite a common role, and feel quite bothered by the fact that no one 'till now had counter claim CKD's role. It might be indeed he's not faking it. But, an RB is not always on the town side, I guess. And obviously, hasd's and CKD's claim are contradictory, one of them must be lying, so I don't believe the possibility if both are Town.
However, like you said, his role-blocked choices were odd. If he can explain his reason of his each night choices well, which so far he didn't do, maybe I should reconsider his lynch for a second time.

[Holy]

hasd - not breaking.

MGIA - no vote-stealing, there's no need for it, yet.

If on this weekend, not much that can change my mind, I'll vote before Monday comes.

[Holy]

Deadline: Sunday, March 30 at 2pm Central US Time.

Oops!
I thought we still have a week more before deadline :p

I'll be here on Saturday or around deadline then, I still want to know more from MoS or Iammars if the time permits.

[Holy]

FOS Holy, BTW. Not as sure she's town as I once was.

FOS Beep! Beep!, obviously she's not jester :p
Well, reason?

Alright,

vote: curiouskarmadog

.

[Holy]

I am not liking the timing and lack of reasoning of Holy's vote.

I've said my opinion regarding CKD and hasdgfas, have re-thinking it, told my decission. But I didn't vote before now, because I wanted to know more about others stance regarding CKD vs Hasd case, so they cannot twist it tomorrow, although apparently from Mizzy, Iammars and MoS, their stance regarding this case still not much known. Btw, CKD's reply not really satisfying me :p

[Holy]

Having one's vote taken away makes the game very boring for the robbed player.

Have fun...

Translation: "Having my vote take away is a convenient excuse for me to shut up and try to stay in the corner after it has been effectively shown how wrong I have been about practically everything."

Luls..! I can't help not to laugh :p

To rekindle Beep! Beep!;

But I didn't vote before now, because I wanted to know more about others stance regarding CKD vs Hasd case, so they cannot twist it tomorrow...

Please elaborate. What do you mean, know more about the others' stance? It sounds like you wanted to follow the majority on purpose. If you took a firm stance early, why do you fear twisting? What kind of twisting did you expect?

Knowing others' stance (their analysis) regarding "hot" issues or any issues, basically means knowledge about their process of thinking, in the end it's quite helpful when we need to compare which player likely pro-town or actually deceitful when re-reading them.
While not knowing their stance means a harder read on those players, it may be worse if end up with them fooling us later, as if they were "agree all along" or "actually opposing the case from the first time" kind of twisting.

Lynch PJ for crying out loud.

Hm, I haven't re-read PJ, but after watching him yesterday, he seems pro-town. So, what made you think he's the scum besides your guts?


Btw, watching BeepBeep yesterday, I'm starting to doubt my suspicion to her, or maybe I'm just fooled with her drama against CKD :p


Regarding MGIA's recruiting decision;

I don't just throw around votes, and have no intention of "quick-lynching" anybody.

I'll rely on those words for now >.>

Has, any reason why you don't want to tell us immediately?

This question set off my scumdar something fierce. Has obviously has a reason, whether it be because the information will be more useful later or that he's scum and hasn't though of the answer yet, or else he would have told us. Mizzy's question reeked of scum wondering whether or not she had been tracked/investigated/whatevered last night. In any case, my instincts tell me to give Has the benefit of the doubt until it becomes necessary to do otherwise. If he doesn't come up with something satisfactory, we can always insist that he breaks his posting restriction.

Cam

I can't be sure about this case. It could be simply a mere curiosity for hasd's motive.

The problem, my dearest goofball, is that I may need to lynch MGIA first. If he is scum and steals another vote overnight, then the town could easily be put into a {3 votes} v {3 votes} situation, or worse.

Then nightkill me. Please.

I'll put it on my "list of things to do", then.

Wait..., is that a confession? :p

[At home]

I was thinking while walking home: we cannot afford to lynch by a "plurality" lynch today, or on any other day from here on out. If do not formally lynch somebody, then all the scum have to do is switch their votes last minute to give somebody "the most votes" so that they will be lynched by plurality. We need to decide on a lynch and actually

lynch

them.

Deciding and discuss it before actually voting is okay for me, I'm doing that on my other mini-theme game atm.


Uhm, I guess I need to re-read PJ and BeepBeep >.>
I'm starting to doubt mathcam because his recent case towards Mizzy <.<
Gah! Need to re-read AmeliaSlay too...

[Holy]

Knowing others' stance (their analysis) regarding "hot" issues or any issues, basically means knowledge about their process of thinking, in the end it's quite helpful when we need to compare which player likely pro-town or actually deceitful when re-reading them.

I've made my views known aplenty. Go back and read.

That was a respond to your elaborate request >.>

Please elaborate. What do you mean, know more about the others' stance?

^

Your known views will be read again, don't worry <.<
It'll took times, of course...

[Holy]

Greasy Spot(town) WAGON

mith(town), wolfcrier/BB(town), Sarcastro(town), Monkey(town), Captain Bandwagon/farside(town)
PookyTheMagicalBear(Jester), RossWilliam(town)
curiouskarmadog(SCUM)
Mastermind of Sin(SCUM)
*** petroleumjelly
*** Iammars

There is already 2 scum on this wagon. Unlikely that there would be a third or fourth.
Therefore, PJ and Mars get fifty townie points each.

50 points each for 2 players.

farside22 (town) WAGON

hasdgfas(town)
RossWilliam(town)
Mastermind of Sin(SCUM)
***curiouskarmadog(SCUM)
*** Holy
*** MeMe/Mathcam
*** Battle Mage

Two scum here. Thirty-three townie points each.

33 points each for 3 players?

Hm, I guess your formula based from 100/players. Have you proven your theory on your other games? I don't think your formula is effective to detect scum though, because I don't remember you ever mention MoS as your suspect based from your calculations before this. It proved fails, don't you think?

I'll continue my read tomorrow, I'm sleepy now.

[Holy]

10.)

Include the CKD-wagon.

11.)

Include the CKD off-wagon.

Well. That's a tougher one because it's recent and fewer of the players have had their alignments revealed.

curiouskarmadog - 5 (hasdgfas (1) (assumed town), Battle Mage (2)(town), Mathcam (5), petroleumjelly (7), Holy (9)).

AGAIN

, I believe that at least one scum jumped on that bandwagon. Maybe even two, since the scum is doing so well, they can afford to bus big time to earn some late game town cred. And guess what, it's my top three acting up again,

mathcam, PJ and Holy

.
<snip>
It's between mathcam PJ and Holy. Which one (or two?) bus'ed CKD?

You've played your theater quite well I think, because today when reading the arguments between you and PJ, back and forth I'm thinking if you're perhaps simply just a townie which too confident with your own method.
But, if you're really have a confident with your formula in catching scum, you won't play with your calculation result, but you did play with it. For an example, earlier today your result was:

No known scum hiding off wagon? Fifty scumpoints each.

TOP THREE:

petroleumjelly 178
Amelia 103
MeMeMe/mathcam 40

but you changed it like in the uppermost quote (underlined)^
So, what the use for you to insist using the method if it's not for covering your excuses as scum? I've tried to see it from another perspective, but it just failed every time I tried to rely with the method, it lack of behaviour analysis which at anytime may bring different results too.

There is no compelling reason NOT to lynch me, and there are none marching over the horizon. I am vanilla, so I'm screwed. I have no night action to prove myself or to be proven by others. I don't even have a vote. I am a completely useless player, everything I say is wrong anyway, the way I find scum is utter and complete rubbish and there is not value to it. I am the PERFECT lynch for today. No better alternative will show up.

These kind of things always successfully give me a headache, I really need to re-read you, which I only have the time to do it on weekends.
And you kept saying PJ is scum, but besides your score, you didn't help us to discover the things we may missed about him as likely the scum?
Although so far in my eyes, when reading his arguments, he seems pro-town for me.

BTW Holy, how is YOUR method for finding scum? Is is better than mine? Do you think that anyone that doesn't find scum in a manner that is approved by PJ is scum? It's my method, I like it, and I believe it to be effective.

Lynch me for it, scumbag. I dare you.

My method is based from knowing the players behaviour from watching them enough, my experiences and being aware of crap-cases which likely came from scum. I'm still learning, so I don't think it's better than yours :p
Well, we have our own methods, why should we seek PJ's approval???
If you believe for it effectiveness, you're supposed to be consistent with your method results, wouldn't you?
Why don't you 'scum-hunt' rather than provoking your lynch if you're really a townie then...
In addition, I've noticed Iammars' contribution (although still not many) today which nothing alarming, but I don't really satisfied with Mizzy's little contribution today though, I definitely will re-read AmeliaSlay/Mizzy this weekends besides re-reading you.

[Holy]

Sorry all, I'm having an internet connection problem at home from my ISP.

I'm posting this from public computer at my office, per user, we aren't allowed to access the internet, I'll visit an internet cafe after work to post and read the game.

[Holy]

Re-reading Beep still in progress..., I still think she's scum because of her 'device', but what made me hesitant, for I might be wrong, was Beep's uncertainty for CKD yesterday seems genuinely came from town. So, due to my difficult access to the internet lately, last night I did my analysis about that, relying from my memory. And I remembered if CKD and Beep were strongly accusing jester each other > it could be they are scum together and did a bussing strategy, and Beep's uncertain-appearance yesterday could be just a distancing last minute effort from her buddy. It's the conclusion I got, but to have a better view about Beep, I guess it's better if I finish the re-read too.

[Holy]

I'll have more free time next week, after April 23rd. Works deadlined at 22nd. Sorry.

@hasdgfas: re-reading was halted, fyi.

But

tonight

I can allocate some time for the game, I'll try to finish my re-read objectively.

[Holy]

Re-reading Beep objectively, I'm not so sure anymore of her being scum. She did scumhunt, she admitted her 'device' is only looking at vote patterns. She did her analysis/hunt in this game, although every time she did her Scum Scores (meaningless numbers in my eyes :p ), it kind of tainted her foregoing efforts bit by bit. She didn't push a weak case merely from her Scores, although her Scum Score did point RW as scum for example, she still questioning RW, tried understanding him more.
Re-reading Beep made me want to re-read PJ too.

Btw, congrats Mizzy

[Holy]

Well, with 2 scum dead, I believe most of the populace here are townies, at least 6 vs 2 (4 anti-town to balance this game, I guess).
Plus MGIA's role and his alignment are separate things, MGIA is quite hard to read too, while his predecessor seems so noob. I just think I should be more careful with my judgment, worst scenarios might happen from here. I prefer a clearer read, considering each person motives or playstyle before I conclude. My current suspicion might be biased with the recent hot issues or my earlier surmise...
So far, Beep is my only finished reread. Still reading PJ... I'll try to allocate more time to finished the reread faster before deadline.

[Holy]

I've spent all day re-reading the remaining players. And have been thinking over about their acts wholly.

Starting with PJ, overall, I like PJ when he was questioning players to get a more good read on them, I consider his reason as a pro-town move, I doubted him once when he speculating about a quack-doc role which soon followed with farside changing her story, when she 'correcting' her night choices, it only convinced me more of her as scum, which made me suspecting PJ was her buddy trying to help farside-scum to survive the lynch for another day (been thinking about it.., silly suspicion, I know..). Furthermore, PJ's frustration when he felt he doesn't have a good read on someone is another indication of him is town for me.

Mathcam, I found if his cynical tone made me felt uneasy toward him, but when reading him wholly and getting used to it, I know if he's putting good efforts in the game, he has been sound about his analysis, suspicion, his poking at bad-arguments and at lurkers, overall, his play is consistent in my eyes. His predecessor, MeMe, she was laying low, but I'm agree if she would be more careful when throwing a 'plan' if she's scum.

Iammars, considering his lurking as unintentional, nothing alarming was the 'first impression' I got. But wait.., it just doesn't make sense, he was too neutral about almost anything or other players (scum-knowledge might took part on this), we're not on a first day anymore, although he was quite responsive on 'current' issues, but I can't found a real good analysis from him about the issue(s) or the players related with the issue, sometimes he just let the reader to take conclusion dependently from what he wrote or pointed, keeping himself 'safe' for not explicitly stated his way of thinking. Yeah, I think he's scum for that... Thus,

vote: Iammars

.

Mizzy/Amelia/QB, I may contradict my logic about them because currently Mizzy is voting for Iammars, but I just found myself is distrustful against them when reading their posts, especially from QB's on day 1. Maybe just an over-suspicion for still not having a good read about them.

MGIA, he didn't afraid to sound his opinion including when he has none, and he is following the game well. Considering the possibility the Cult Leader staying alive till the end with a collective of stolen votes, if he's scum it is way too powerful, after thinking about it, I'm doubting the mod would put it on one alignment with the scum for a balanced game.

Hasdgfas, well, two words indeed, but poking players well with it. I considered him town. Hallelujah. Amen.

[Holy]

Well, before I voted Iammars, I've been thinking it over, I've weighing between all the remaining players, measuring for their each play, and I feel comfortable with my choice.
Iammars did seems quiet and unhelpful which not quite a clue of being scum from most perspective, but he's just different, he seems playing safe with his opinion, unlike MGIA, MGIA is a bit quite too, but he's been sound with his suspicion or thoughts.
I don't care if people think I'm scum, my suspicion at B!B! just not as strong as it used to be.

[Holy]

EBWOP 2017: *bit quiet

[Holy]

I think it's ~30 minutes more before deadline hit.

[Holy]

About BB?
Well, I think she's town after all the efforts she did, although her Scum Scores not make sense for me.

[Holy]

EBWOP

We killed four MAFIA. I think we can take to the bank that we're after a serial killer.

Oh I hate this, I'm suck at finding SK. Usually a SK wears the town-mask quite convincingly >.>


And hi again Flame ^_^
Oh wait I'm the cop... not!

Actually, while I agree with a mass claim once Flame has caught up, though I think we'll see nothing but a slew of vanilla claims.

Welcome to the game, Flame, btw.

We do have one role left for sure. I thought it would be you or Holy. If it's not you, then it's Holy. Holy is town.

The SK (I do think that's what we are looking for) is either you, mathcam or Flameaxe.

Or you... :/
I don't know.., a Cult-SK? Isn't that means an easy win for the SK if the SK can manage staying alive 'till near end-game well.

[Holy]

I am vanilla, and I'm surprised that you still think I'm scum. There's actually a pretty hard-to-defend-against case that I'm mafia, what with my staunch support of has and my reluctance to lynch Iammars -- but the SK? I don't see how you can believe that. On another note, notice the lack of self-beratement about being horrifically wrong on at least one account, Beep -- it happens.

I'm a little tied up in RL, but I should be active again pretty soon.

Cam

Wait.., believe what?
Maybe I should re-read all the cases against the mafia by myself, without you re-creating the scene over my head >.>

[Holy]

Oh, a mass claim, I forgot. Vanilla here. And you claimed when you replacing if I'm not mistaken, as vanilla right?

[Holy]

Re-reading yesterday situation, a support for has or a reluctance lynch against Iammars not exactly proves you're Vanilla or SK, Cam. Null-tell. And I saw Beep was also against Iammars lynching, but I like her meta reason (post #1980), seems sincere.

I'm still suspecting Mizzy more though :/

[Holy]

Has everyone double-checked their role PMs?

Sure did. Innocent townsperson, against the forces of evil, yadda yadda, every vote matters. So Holy can suspect me aaaaall she likes...I don't have anything to defend against at the moment.

It just.., I liked you when you first came, replacing. But now, you seem like just going along with the flow. Have you finished reading this game, what's your opinion or conclusion about this town or the remaining dwellers, Mizzy? I don't mind if it's not so detail, I can understand your cute little reason if it's the case.

I am vanilla, and I'm surprised that you still think I'm scum. There's actually a pretty hard-to-defend-against case that I'm mafia, what with my staunch support of has and my reluctance to lynch Iammars -- but the SK? I don't see how you can believe that. On another note, notice the lack of self-beratement about being horrifically wrong on at least one account, Beep -- it happens.
Cam

Wait.., believe what?

Believe that I'm the SK.

Re-reading yesterday situation, a support for has or a reluctance lynch against Iammars not exactly proves you're Vanilla or SK, Cam.

This post is confusing to me. I was saying that both of these things are more likely to be mafia tells than SK tells (or townie tells, for that matter). Since apparently BeepBeep and I both agree there's likely only an SK left, I found it odd that she would still think I was scum. In any case, it's probably not my optimal strategy to spend time

too

much time arguing that I'm probably mafia, so I'll stop with this train of thought.

Ah, yes.. Reading your explanation and reading back your previous post about it, I can see what you meant clearer now, the logic and the situation, sorry for my confusion which confusing you (lol).

Other thoughts: It looks like we probably have two days left to find scum, assuming we have just the one kill each night. Both my principal targets from yesterday are still alive, though my suspicion of Beep has diminished somewhat because she's unlikely to be co-scum with CKD any more, which was my biggest argument. This leaves Flameaxe...OH. Important realization. If Flameaxe is scum, he wins after a wrong lynch, since even if we lynch a town Beep, he can recruit a second vote overnight.

Yeah you're right, if a godfather is dead, I think we can be sure that there's no more mafia and only a SK left for one kill each night, which means two days left is a possibility. Hmm..., that reminds me, our godfather, mith was a mason, there must be another mason, no? Not allowed to reveal I guess.. (at least according the Wiki).

[Holy]

Can anyone else comment on my Flameaxe comments? To sum up, it seems likely to me that Flame's alivedness is somewhat strong evidence that either Beep or Flame is scum.

The math's Flameaxe comments:

Important realization. If Flameaxe is scum, he wins after a wrong lynch, since even if we lynch a town Beep, he can recruit a second vote overnight.

For that matter, if Flameaxe isn't scum, why isn't he dead by now? Surely scum would not want to not be in the situation where he/she could be lynched by Flameaxe and other person -- too risky.

I'm starting to be convinced Flameaxe is the play-o'-the-day,but I'm not sure yet. It's crucial that no one vote yet, since if he's scum, he could finish off a lynch just by himself.

If Flame is scum, I don't think he would miss the chance to recruit last night. A third recruit would benefit a Cult-scum, resulting his vote today (if today's exist) would means a hammer at the same time. I can't see why a scum would miss that kind of chance, unless he's considering there's still a mafia alive today and prefer a clean-look by not recruiting... Well.., a recruit or a no recruit from Flame last night, the more I think about it was kind of WIFOMy. What I know, missing last night recruit was careless as scum, don't you think?

I can see what you mean for Beep's still "kicking" with Flame's existence alongside, letting the Cult-who-steal-her-vote alive is a good camouflage for a Beep-scum in 'voting'. And I believe, the mafia wasn't suicided last night, which means last night the SK must be targeting hasd, but from what I know, Beep thinks hasd as pro-town and not mafia, if I'm not mistaken. Why would Beep-scum prefer let off a mafia which may threaten her more.., that is something interesting to consider though.

I feel Beep is town, and so far, I think Flame is town, which leaves either you or Math. Beep likes Math for a lynch, and I think I may lean that way, too, because I've always had a 50/50 read on Math and I could see him buddied with has and Iammers if he's scum, but I could also see him as an SK or some other anti-town bugger. I haven't voted yet because one wrong vote could lose us the game.

And... I feel Mizzy is SK, because I feel difficult reading her or her predecessors in this game although she's more active than me, my bad... =)
Luls.., sorry can't help it. Hm, I'm still considering other possibilities too, being cautious with my vote. And, there's still discussion in here, which is a good sign, hurray!

[Holy]

I think I explained my take on this earlier -- if Flame was scum and recruited last night, that meant that three of the 7 people alive through the night would have been Cult of the Couch. If the other scum group killed any of the three, a 50/50 shot, Flame would no longer have voting majority, and worse, it would be quite clear that he was scum (acting to gain majority control of the vote, after we had quite clearly admonished MGIA for using his ability the night before). So would Flame take a 50/50 shot at immediately winning or losing the game? I think not, since all he has to do is survive today to win, which is like a 4/5 shot, possibly higher considering that some of us (namely, me) look scummier than he does.

For that matter, it's possible that if Flameaxe

did

target someone who got

simultaneously

killed, that the person's status would not be changed to cult. So if he targeted Has or PJ, we might not even know about it.

Luls, haven't think about that possibility

How exactly did you guys come up with me being scum? Pure lack of evidence?

Ah~ we reached a consensus, luls.

How exactly did you guys come up with me being scum? Pure lack of evidence?

Everyone knows that's an obvious scumtell.

Cam

I have to agree with that.

I think we have to kill both Mizzy and mathcam by endgame. If we do this, we will win.

A little more elaboration from your conviction would be nice =)

[Holy]

I want to kill mathcam first.

Who do you want to kill, Mizzy? Where are your suspicions?

I believe, it is me or mathcam (her answer from the page before this).
She didn't explains why 'bout me though, if it is guts... guts is misleading sometimes, right Mizzy

[Holy]

Holy, since you are mith's Mason, I don't see why Mizzy should suspect you.

When did I say I'm a mason, luls... I'm not.

I suspected Holy before we did any role-claiming.

Btw, I can't clear your misconception if you don't explain your analysis 'bout me :/
That is, if you still care for a civilized discussion >.>

I will be the first to say, I don't understand the whole "It's Flame or BB! Flame must die first!" thing. Given there is one anti-town player left, if it was BB, why would I still be alive?

For her vote-camouflage, if that's the case, I believe..

[Holy]

Alright, after scrutinizing about the Cult, plus re-reading the Cult discussions, I don't think Cult could be trusted anymore. Thinking about the Beep case, I don't have any idea if someone recruited means their status changed to Cult or not. If changed, I don't think last night deaths might came from Beep. If not changed and she's town, we're wasting a lynch. If not changed and she's scum, she hides well with letting the Cult alive with her vote at his hands. Furthermore, if the Cult win condition is not with the town, letting the Cult would be dangerous to us, it could means no more tomorrow (here we're in lylo), assuming The Cult survived today and actually having their own agenda, and may successfully recruiting again, we're screwed from the minute we let him roaming free for that. Stopping a possible evil Cult scenario or lynching who we think as the SK first besides the Cult (assuming Cult is with the Town), that is the question...Either case, confused and all, but still, I'll go with this

vote: Flameaxe

. Just sue me or feel free to enlighten me in case I'm wrong for that...

[Holy]

@Cam: Yeah, reading the Cult discussion from the confirmed townies (dead) around those Day 1 helps me reached that awareness, not that I ignored you or all :p

[Holy]

Sorry, busy days...

I'd be willing to vote Holy based on my suspicions of her...it really bothers me that she stuck a vote out there without saying anything first and her posting has come across as "coasting" for the most part.

Well, my thought process laid out in the open to read, what exactly do you mean with "coasting"? As far as I know, that's how I play anywhere, crazy play.., luls...
If you're doubting 'bout the Cult-Scum possibility, what's your opinion about a Cult-Cult possibility, Mizzy? I've thinking about it, and after we successfully eradicated the mafia, I don't want us to lose here (I've experienced this kind of situation once, a not well thought one, lol), 'cause after my search 'bout what exactly is a Cult, I just don't know if letting Flame is wise, if Flame isn't Scum, I only can think it is you though.., but lylo situation is more demanding, I guess... If only I have two votes right, I really want you lynched at the same time if possible >.>

[Holy]

@Cam: I wasn't too convinced if Beep the recruitee was evil, because what I read about the Cult was the Cult (whichever his alignment is) is successful when recruiting a pro-Town player. It's true that I was stating that possibility about Beep, I like thinking for every possibilities, and I wasn't sure whether the mod might be changing that condition or not, btw this is really my first time playing with a Cult, I'm not that knowledgeable with the variations to be sure
O gosh, I'm too, really need to re-read.. argh... *headaches ;_;
(Need to learn the genuineness about your insistence towards Beep, especially after She recruited)

@Mizzy: Mafia, SK.. aren't they all Scum my dear... :p
Btw Mizzy, try to convince me of your innocence then? Or better, based from your experience what make you think it's mathcam? I'd like to understand your thinking more. Anything...

[Holy]

Haven't finish my re-reading here...
Tomorrow I'll go playing all day with my junior high friends (mini reunion).
Hopefully, I'll still have the energy to continue my read on Sunday =)

[Holy]

Well, I was in the middle of my big reread when I realized I had a pretty big stash of notes from my original read when I replaced in to the game. Interesting to see how my opinions have changed since then. This is a merge of the relevant stuff on Holy (Mizzy's next) from my original notes with stuff that has happened since then. (Posts are numbered as in the "view all posts by" numbering).

Holy

:
Post 1 - Holy votes for Has for what clearly looks like a posting restriction, and she even makes a comment as such. When someone the points out that Has likely has a posting restriction, she reluctantly unvotes. Definitely weird, possibly scummy. She does seem genuinely confused in posts 8 and 9, but also plays the "wait and see" game in post 8, which also looks a little scummy.

Post 10 - Holy votes for Monkey for an "overabundant" vote on GS, presumably in reference to putting him at L-2. Seems mildly contrived, but again, could be genuine.

Post 17 - Rather defensive against a pretty mild "attack" from MeMe.

Post 25 - Opposes tyhess recruiting anyone. Possibly a town tell, but I guess scum doesn't want a more powerful cult either.

Post 35 - Seems anxious about Pooky reveal. Worried she got caught?

Post 48 - Says that CKD's breadcrumb sucks. That's really weird, since it seemed quite compelling to me. Did Holy believe the breadcrumb and just want to get CKD lynched?

Post 53/54 - Got excited by a chance to join in an attack on me and then realized she didn't understand what the originator of the attack was saying. But later attacks Beep in post 57 for a distracting vote on me. Hm.

Posts 50-70ish - Waffles back and forth on Beep, but seems to be completely reversed from my stance. Thinks Beep is scum when I think she's town, and vice-versa. Weird. Attacks her scum scores, but then later says she thinks Beep is town because of all the work she did making them.

Posts 70-now - Occasionally anti-mathcam, but frequently anti-Mizzy:

Mizzy/Amelia/QB, I may contradict my logic about them because currently Mizzy is voting for Iammars, but I just found myself is distrustful against them when reading their posts, especially from QB's on day 1. Maybe just an over-suspicion for still not having a good read about them.

I'm still suspecting Mizzy more though :/

And... I feel Mizzy is SK, because I feel difficult reading her or her predecessors in this game although she's more active than me, my bad... =)

Not sure what to make of this.

Your findings on me just an indication that I

am

playing this game, vice versa. I like the effort btw.

[1] God, clearly?! Obviously not for me.. I was playing in another game with hasdgfas at that time, he was showing his capability to play but here I saw him playing differently with hardly any words, and I called him for that. A word to free the restricted player was indeed my first in here, there were many experienced players in here, hearing them wasn't such a bad idea, remembering I don't have a clue what was going on, especially that was on day 1.

[10] O yeah, his #2 justification was sucks, btw it was around the time when hasdgfas just broke his restriction to speak normally, therefore his #3 justification was rushy. With that, I blame him, and not regretting my decision at all.

[17] I'm just

curious

with her (my first mod in MS) "findings" on me, I really think that would be fun hearing "the accusations" from her, after all maybe this game is the only chance I can play with her because I realized she wasn't playing much but modding now. Aside from that, I'm kind of used to being called scummy by the majority in every games I play(ed) here, chance in hearing from her excited me, I won't call that "defensive" :p

[25] I just didn't trust his judgment yet. Anyhow, scum always have the option to just kill him, don't you think?

[35] Hallucinating there? :p

[48] From my point of view, if I got a pro-town power role and realizing the breadcrumb necessity, I would do it as soon as possible, especially watching CKD's meta as MASON, it was quite a different play from here. Btw, obviously at that time hasdgfas and CKD were contradictory too.
Err.., wait... so you think CKD's breadcrumb was quite

compelling

, as far as I can remember, you were also insisting his lynch , explain how was that kind of thoughts aligned..!?

[53/54, 57] Hm, I always like an opportunity knowing a-hard-to-read player with my own style, I was once lynched (townie of course) for that at Yaw's :p
Well, Beep

was

acting weird.

[50-70ish] The jester died, thus made me re-evaluating the reason behind her scum-scores, more like a scummy device to me... Later, after the big PBPA read, she and her scum-scores just didn't feel like that scummy anymore, I was also thinking about the possibility of her as scum with the scum-scores gambit, but reading her play it just didn't seem like it.

[72, 80] Yeah, I'm still trying re-reading Mizzy/Amelia/QB for a second time here...

[82] That comment was more like a sarcasm though... Just showing an example if I can accuse her without reason too. I still didn't understand her thought process stating that Beep and Flame is town and thus leaves me and you just like that, I'm not dissatisfied with her "conclusion" to be exact, but with my little read on her because those lack of reason statements... (Well, maybe if she's stating if PJ is town, I might agree without question, but we're talking about Beep and The Cult back then..., so her thought process would be quite revealing, I suppose).

[Holy]

A quick answer for that (remembering my slow re-read progress), by watching your play and Mizzy's play, I think it's Mizzy. I doubt if scum would thoughtfully taking notes for stuff that has happened, at all.

[Holy]

Yup, Math, I still feel you're it, but I also worry that I'm wrong because Holy's incorrect English is very hard for me to interpret and I don't have a lot of time to re-read to figure things out.

Holy, did you mean by your last post? I can't understand it, sorry

Truly sorry for my laziness in double-checking my posts.


My last post, post #2129 was for answering mathcam from post #2128:

Holy: Okay, while I process your defense some more, got any offense? Who do you think's the SK?

Cam

there.

A quick answer for that (remembering my slow re-read progress), by watching your play and Mizzy's play, I think it's Mizzy.

I doubt if scum would thoughtfully taking notes for stuff that has happened, at all.

In italic, refers to math's play. This doubt really bugging me here.

[Holy]

^that's my belief about scum in general (they understand more about the situation, what's the use of taking notes for them...), at the same time I realized if there's might be "careful exception" such as in lylo situation. Well...taking notes isn't a solid prove. Only a cruel 'WIFOM', hurting my head...my theory...

[Holy]

Hm, I should confess. I just started my read, finally had the chance to... And I was in the middle of AmeliaSlay read when I saw your anti-Mizzy post posted, Cam.

Like I said before, QB and Amelia were quite unreadable, just like your finding there^
Indeed QB mostly talked about strategy, but upon my re-read on AmeliaSlay, I found if her justification voting MeMe was kind of odd too, she voted MeMe because she was disagree with the plan, but was she really think if MeMe was the scummy-scum for throwing that plan?

"It seems it's easier for the mafia to exploit this plan than it would be to gain a consensus"

, quoted from her post (#6). Haven't got a chance to asked that earlier to Amelia, almost forgot it too.

Holy: Based on your note-taking theory, what do you think about Mizzy's post #13?

Cam

Hm, you got me there.., only 10 pages and then she got bored I guess, I'm not really taking it as a serious effort for finding scum because of that. And TBH, every time I read that post, I was skimming her points, and directly read her-thoughts part. Her points were only a retold summary for me, while her thoughts there are kind of oddly interesting, Mith was dead when she was replacing, but she kept mentioning and complaining about the-already-dead-Mith there, and not much opinion on others.

[Holy]

^Lol, I let the window unrefreshed for hours obviously. I just noticed your post time.

[Holy]

@Mizzy:

I agree with Jelly on the couch recruitment action last night...it does seem awfully convenient and I don't see how it can be seen as anything but anti-town.

Even his responses as to why he did it don't really ring as sincere to me.

Like I said previously...Beep's play seriously makes me mad. If she's town, she's seriously playing her role terribly. However, if she hates it so much, why doesn't she abandon or get herself replaced? The fact that she is still trolling makes me think she's scum as opposed to frustrated town. Then there's the dual benefit of her lynch; removing a vote from MGIA and putting him back to his old self again...

I mentioned before that I found his random, unannounced recruitment to be pretty shitty.

I agree that MGIA's last post does explain his night action...but

it doesn't sit well with me

and unfortunately, it's neither a scum nor town tell. What bothers me the most is that he doesn't care about the outcome and basically made the game much less fun for someone else that DOES care about the outcome (I think.)

You were so anti-MGIA.

I feel Beep is town, and so far,

I think Flame is town

, which leaves either you or Math. Beep likes Math for a lynch, and I think I may lean that way, too, because I've always had a 50/50 read on Math and I could see him buddied with has and Iammers if he's scum, but I could also see him as an SK or some other anti-town bugger. I haven't voted yet because one wrong vote could lose us the game.

And then, swoosh! Your suspicion for our Cult suddenly gone.
So, what made you changed your mind about him, Mizzy?
Why were you stayed away from the Cult discussion back then?


@mathcam:

Beep: I think there's some pretty good info there, even if I find the numerical assignments somewhat arbitrary. How come only 6 people got rankings, and one of them is dead?

I'm actually finding PJ rather scummy in this exchange. Basically I'm surprised that PJ is bothering trying to nit-pick at what is clearly a very arbitrary scoring mechanism and based on Beep's rather specific theories on how to find scum. I agree with Beep's last post -- given that no one really taking Beep's analysis to heart, and that it doesn't even seem like she's attempting to use it as a tool, why spend so much time dissecting it? But more to the point, I

really

can't understand the point of view that Beep's been doctoring her scores in a nefarious scum scheme, mostly for the exact same reason that she's not actually convincing anyone.

At first, you were pretty neutral against Beep, and leaning for her simply as possibly PJ's victim.

Here's a theory whose plausibility I haven't entirely thought through yet: MGIA and Beep are scum together, they thought that Beep was a likely lynch target for the day, and so MGIA stole her vote as a pretty definitive distancing play, particularly distancing given how blatant Beep has been about being upset with her lack of vote. It would certainly be a compelling defense for MGIA if he used Beep's own vote to get her lynched and she turned up as scum.

Cam

I fucking knew it...DGB and Beep Beep are the same person...god everything makes so much sense now. No wonder I dont understand anything you are saying....which is funny, because i said the exact samething in another game about DGB today....

I ran across this line again in reading through CKD's posts again. This too seems a little over-the-top. Given that we already know CKD was prone to faking dramatic positions (the self-vote, the imploring pleas, the fake bah post, etc.), it would certainly fit the pattern for CKD to have already known that Beep was DGB and have taken this opportunity to feign a dramatic surprise at this revelation.

I think I'm sold.

Vote: Beep! Beep!

.

Cam

Suddenly, you started Beep-cultMGIA scum theory. Then your vote ended up landing on Beep based from CKD's previous reaction towards Beep/DGB.

Can anyone else comment on my Flameaxe comments? To sum up, it seems likely to me that Flame's alivedness is somewhat strong evidence that either Beep or Flame is scum.

Cam

I know you can't believe that, but I don't care at this point. You guys are going to do what you want, when you want, and I feel like the only thing I can do is warn you and let you screw yourselves.

Why so defeatist? I personally believe that the last scum is either Beep or Flameaxe. Based on scumminess alone, I'd probably go with Beep, but for tactical reasons Flameaxe has to be the first to go. Ultimately, we'll probably need to hear a lot more from Flameaxe, since most likely he will be two out of the three votes on the lynching bandwagon, assuming I am unable to convince Mizzy and Holy to seeing my point of view.

After mafia (the situation back then was CKD, MoS, Iammars, hasdgfas were dead and revealed as mafia) seem eradicated from the town, you went back to your anti-Beep, said if it's probably Beep based on scumminess alone.
Before the DGB-CKD's reaction case you were pretty neutral about her, and then you seem found a lot of scummy things about her. What exactly the 'scummniness' you thought you've found about her? Your stance towards her wasn't quite clear actually. I also failed sensing the strong evidence of her being scum with Flame's alivedness, actually.

[Holy]

With my limited amount of playtime, I worry that were I to place the first vote, I would not have time to react fast enough to any developments. I don't want the town to lose just because I can't be quick on my feet at the moment.

Oh Mizzy, what's the difference between the first who voting with the hammerer? Let's assume there's already two vote thrown each other between player A and B, still should decide who will be hammered between them; being the first or the last voter doesn't mean the most suspicious person would be changed so suddenly (considering the decision optimistically made with our best ability), don't you think so?
Hm, or in this case a triangle vote... assume: the last voter is B the innocent. C vote A, A vote B, and I(B) vote C (my scummy scum); if scum is A, A would unvote and hammer C; if scum is C, before B placing the vote, C might unvote and hammer B first. Well (considering you won't place the first vote) what would you do by pretending you're the B (the last voter), Mizzy? Uhhn.., on second thought...it's pointless asking you this actually.
Oh wait... (you can just forget that two silly case), I forgot about the longest held vote thing, the scum can just wait 'till deadline pretending as a confused townie if the first voted isn't the scum.
That whole ifs may applied to mathcam too.


Hm Cam, yeah I guess I'll stay on Mizzywagon, if I'm wrong about you, I guess it means my experience still not enough...or I'm just suck at this game...

[Holy]

I am willing to change my mind. I just need a good reason to.

Oh, such a cruel fate indeed... ;_;

[Holy]

Oh wait...

(you can just forget that two silly case)

, I forgot about the longest held vote thing, the scum can just wait 'till deadline pretending as a confused townie if the first voted isn't the scum.

EBWOP:
Well I Am confused there :p , ^ the scum can just hammer I guess. So forget this line:

(you can just forget that two silly case)

too.

[Holy]

Holy: I'm confused as to why you wouldn't have voted for Mizzy, then. Trying to leave options open?

Mizzy: Since I'm starting to think you're scum, maybe it's silly to continue to try to convince you, but note that if I were scum, I think it's clear how easy it would have been for me to have joined with Holy to get you lynched by now.

Cam

Lol! Is the situation really would be that simple there, can't I be wrong this time?
There's still plenty of time mathcam, why are you so rushy? Like you said my careless rushy vote would end with Mizzy hammered if I'm wrong about you.
Let me do my little meta search for awhile in this peaceful weekend =)

[Holy]

^Alas, I'm not liking the last minute idea either, I'm doing my best here... Just a little more...haven't finished. Tomorrow maybe..., along with the vote. That's what you all wished, isn't it? ;_; Uhh I'll be damned if I'm wrong, o gosh.

[Holy]

^I'm speechless Cam. I'm in the middle of my interesting reading of Mizzy's Mostly Mountainous, it was over at May 27, 2008. The situation almost similar with this one, it was on lylo, along with all her difficult RL situation, she was townie on there and in there she played more vocal than this one. I already said if I would make the final decision today, I said that because I don't know if I could follow the game well after Sunday, especially on Monday, there's no stalling intention at all. So based from what I've read, here's my

vote: Mizzy

.

[Holy]

Lol!

[Holy]

I said mathcam was scum.

Oh, I was really fooled by MeMe, damn you ;_;
I also never play with mathcam, I knew his tone was disturbing, damn it... (sobs).
First night, Mith murdered. Obviously not me, I prefer saving him for last, yeah... I'm that evil :p
Suddenly MeMe announced her little meta about me, hm I re-read my own posts, try finding the cause. I said something 'evil' about Mith here, and a few experimental play on other games based from my former a.k.a first IC - Mith whom sadly lead my lynch as Vanilla on my first game, Mith was the Doc, MeMe was the Mod. I can't be sure about those suspicion, but why MeMe picked me? There were many famous players here, why picked me? The thought of her suspecting me for Mith's death emerged, hmmm, funn~
If MeMe suspecting me for it, it means she can't be responsible for the night activity, right? THAT thought is exactly the origin of my downfall ;_;
And then came the Quack case, so Mith might be quacked. My suspicion to MeMe was on and off after that.

I didn't have a partner. I actually breadcrumbed this in one of my posts (I had a townie called the Lone Gunman Mason in one of my GL games once), but I didn't expect anyone to notice it.

Only if I knew... ooh if I knew...
The odd rant from Mizzy about Mith even though Mith already dead made me suspect her as the second mason, my bad...

Also, Holy killed me the perfect night, as I was probably going to go after her(after breaking PR) the next day.

I was very aware of that possible situation, sir

I hope you didn't hate your role too much.

Pfft, no. You gave the role the wrong person (or just the right person, however you look at it). After having been the 'lone mason' in Sanity Mafia, and having what I think to be a good grasp of your modding policies, my general thoughts on my role were "I am just a vanilla townie, but I just

might

not be". The thing I hated most about my role was the possibility that I had to

claim

the role, because I knew it was going to sound a bit ridiculous.

Lol! <3 PJ. You're the best
I was saving you for last too :p . Too bad, maf got you first.
I must say, I learned a lot by playing with you, PJ.

Holy: Heh. Sorry that all my hard work in that last day to make sure

you

got lynched, and not Mizzy, was of no benefit to me, but yet deprived you of your win. Actually, I'm not that sorry. Again, though, well-played -- if I had been a townie, I quite possibly would have been convinced to go after Mizzy instead of you.

Cam

Yeah, if you were a clueless Vanilla, I'm pretty sure the last day would be smooth for me, damn it... :p

If Holy wasn't lynched on the last day, would she have won since she was immune to mafia kills?

Both would have won, since both achieved their win conditions simultaneously. (Nothing could prevent the SK from being the only one alive at that point, and the mafia would be at 50% at that point.)

Wait, does that make sense? Nothing could

cause

Holy to be the only alive at that point (assuming we lynched Mizzy and not me), never mind

prevent

it.

Cam

Yup, the Werewolf should be the sole winner if that's the case, because nobody have any Silver Bullet in this town including the mafia, right? :p

[Holy]

Werewolf in Town, behind the night scenes:
(Night choices mostly affected with my skill in finding Vanilla with quite a good accuracy :p )

1st Night: Dani Banani > chewed.
I want my first blood shed to be the purest one. I also avoid a 'popular' victim, don't want a double kill with the mafia. Hmm, Dani was so Vanilla in my eyes, I love his town play though :p (and Sarcastro's, hehe..)
Dani seems exhausted with his job, I decided to free him from here (sorry Mod, lol).

2nd Night: al_kohaulec > torn limb from limb.
I decided it would be nice to hunt a mafia for the second one. al_ko didn't seem like a vanilla to me (and he wasn't :p ), honestly thought he was a maf, turned out he was a cop, hm, too bad...

3rd Night: RossWilliam > ripped.
Must find mafia, god damnit >.> <.<
Oops wrong again, at least the Seer down. Yay!
After the Doc-Cop-Quack-Seer incidents, I put a mental note: not Vanilla enough doesn't mean must be a mafia, silly! Should examine each play more thoroughly there.

4th Night: Mastermind of Sin > mutilated.
I gave him a chance to show his better play, but enough is enough. After reading each person play that night, it seems I got a mafia this time. And I did, phew!

5th Night: hasdgfas > slaughtered.
If hasdgfas indeed a pro-town his tracking ability might trouble me. If he's a mafia, I have nothing to lose. Adios~

6th Night: Flameaxe the CotCR > disemboweled.
Well, should not risk my life. Buh bye~

[Holy]

Yup, the Werewolf should be the sole winner if that's the case, because nobody have any Silver Bullet in this town including the mafia, right? :p

But apparently this werewolf cares not only about being alive, but being the

only

one alive...and since I am such a potent godfather that my flesh is impenetrable even by werewolf teeth, you lose. Nanny nanny poo poo.

;_;
Childish boy... /jk :p

Oh, and thanks for the compliments, everyone, though I think that it might be excessive praise for an uninvestigatable unkillable mafia godfather with 4 teammates.

Oh, and thanks for the compliments, everyone, though I think that it might be excessive praise for an uninvestigatable unkillable mafia godfather with 4 teammates.

Erm...you

weren't

NK immune or invetigative immune - the only "benefit" your role had was that if you died, Iammars died. (Hence Holy being able to win if Mizzy had been lynched.)

Cam

Hah!
Well, congrats btw