Mini Normal 1874: Camping Trip Mafia (Game Over)

[mattblackguy]

Hey Lil Uzi

VOTE: Lil Uzi Vert

This is only my second game on this site, and I never played with anyone here before so I hope we all have a good time.

[mattblackguy]

Thanks but that didn't have the answer

look closer my friend

[mattblackguy]

VOTE: Sick

Continuing to troll when someone is trying to advance the game isn't helping much.

[mattblackguy]

Kyouko, are you actually in a masonry with Sick? I can't tell if he was serious or not.

[mattblackguy]

All I need to know is that no townie should ever do something so stupid which means you are most likely scum.

Really? Do you really think no townie would troll day one and fake claim? I've seen both scum, and town fake claim on page 1. You say massive is scum because he voted for something that is NAI, but you are doing the same thing with Sick claiming mason day 1. Trolling page 1 ≠ Scum, just like not doing RVS ≠ scum.

VOTE: TwoFace

[mattblackguy]

Why didn't you ask everyone who voted for me why they were scumreading me?

Everyone that voted for you was in RVS, or they stated why they were voting for you. Your vote was an empty vote outside of RVS. We're not mind readers, so how about you explain your vote instead of deflecting.

[mattblackguy]

Don't care what he did in another game.

But why don't you care? Sens was telling you relevant info that was trying to give you a better perspective on the way Sickofit plays. If you're town then you would take that into consideration, and reevaluate. We're not robots not everyone plays exactly the same. What might be scummy for one person may be NAI for another. I don't know how you can ignore a very important part of the game.

[mattblackguy]

He's not telling you to base your reads off of meta. I just read up on past games to get an understanding of someones playstyle. Not how they play as town or how they play as scum, but how they play in general.

[mattblackguy]

TwoFaces last few posts seemed genuine to me though. I think he's town.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Massive

I still want you to explain your actions instead of deflecting.

[mattblackguy]

I still want you to explain your actions instead of deflecting.

In case that wasn't obvious this was targeted at Massive.

[mattblackguy]

Nadpool, why aren't you saying anything? I don't know how I can get a read on you if you are just going to be voting, and not actually engaging with anyone.

[mattblackguy]

If you think he's town then why's your vote still on him?

[mattblackguy]

So who's your top scumread now?

[mattblackguy]

You already made your RVS vote on page 1. There was no reason for you to make another one at that stage on the game. What were you trying to accomplish with a random vote with no context behind it?

[mattblackguy]

Why did it take you an entire page before you voted TwoFace?

I already explained my vote on TwoFace. Go back and read if you are interested. Now are you going to keep deflecting or are you going to actually answer what you were doing?

[mattblackguy]

Sorry I thought 116 was addressed to me since we were having a conversation. That's my mistake. Shannon is null for me right now, but I didn't like how you were deflecting when someone asked you a question.

[mattblackguy]

So who's your top scumread now?

@Sickofit ^

[mattblackguy]

@matt, 43: first thing I don't really like. parking your vote at a easy target while stating a reason which is non alignment indicative. scummy.

Alright so what was your reason for voting Sickofit a few posts earlier. If he was an easy target then why'd you vote on him?

[mattblackguy]

Yeah, what AtE? Nice try though putting the 2 people you think are the easiest mislynch bait as the scummiest.

VOTE: Lucca

[mattblackguy]

Easiest mislynch bait because we are the most inexperienced players in the game.

[mattblackguy]

@matt, 97: what about his posts seemed genuine?

92 This felt real to me. The refusing to engage in a discussion was why I initially scumread Sick also

@matt, 64: didn't you vote Sicko on page 2? what changed, Matt?

read the post. You'll see what changed.

@matt, 90: another concerning post by Matt. laying low and popping up to say obvious game theory stuff. he's the scummiest so far. I'd say TwoFace is the second, but the speed that his wagon had is weird if he were to be scum. and there is a possibility he's just extremely confbiased town.

I don't know where you get the laying low thing. The post was trying to understand what TwoFace was thinking and understand why he's ignoring the fact that people obviously have different playstyles. It wasn't just obvious game theory that wasn't relevant to the game.

[mattblackguy]

UNVOTE: Massive[/unvote

VOTE: Sickofit
This is reverse psych. The fake claim was just a ploy, so when pressurized he could say scum would never fakeclaim a town role.

Twoface is a townie(for now.)

The mason fakeclaim happened page 1, why comment on it now but not before? Also I've seen townies fake claim page 1 before. You can argue it's anti-town, but I really don't think that's AI.

What are your opinions on other players/ thoughts about other things that have happened?

[mattblackguy]

[mattblackguy]

Guys, why is this game so slow... Sens can you just tell me who the scum are?

[mattblackguy]

Lucca get in here and fight me.

[mattblackguy]

This game is

weird

[mattblackguy]

Why not? In my experience, posts like 154 are scumtells. Specifically "Guys, why is this game so slow?"

Saw rb do it in JaeReed's mini normal 1857 and he flipped scum.
Saw Eric Rasputin do it in Open 660 and his replacement later flipped scum.

Haven't seen anyone make a post like that and flip town

This scumtell is great

[mattblackguy]

You're cherry picking.

And are you an alt?

How am I cherry picking? You are taking a statement I said that was NAI, and saying it's a scumtell, and saying "Haven't seen anyone make a post like that and flip town" so I proved you guys wrong. Not cherry picking at all.

And no I'm not an alt.

[mattblackguy]

And by your logic IF (and im not) cherrypicking then both of you are cherrypicking too. Kyouko showed only 2 examples, and you showed none. So what point were you trying to make exactly?

[mattblackguy]

Then again Sick having super bad reads, bad logic, and sheeping others arguments would be scummy for anyone else, but sadly it resembles what I've seen from skimming several of his town games.


TwoFace why do you want a Sick lynch so early? If Sick flips town then we basically accomplished nothing today. Why are you so focused on Sick's slot and basically ignoring everyone else?

[mattblackguy]

How does lynching scum on page 8 make it easier to find partners then lynching scum on page 30?

[mattblackguy]

And how is mislynching on page 8 better than mislynching on page 40?

[mattblackguy]

30*

[mattblackguy]

Bussing is less likely to happen on quick scum lynches. Reactions are stronger and more real. Dragging out lynches makes it easier to deflect attention without drawing suspicion

Ok this makes sense.

How does lynching scum on page 8 make it easier to find partners then lynching scum on page 30?

I don't think sick is a mislynch so can't answer that question

The thing is Sick acts like this when he's town too. So it doesn't matter if you don't think he's town. There's still a real possibility that he is town. And the fact that you are not even considering that a possibility is concerning to me. Honestly if you actually are town then I think you are playing just as bad as Sick.

[mattblackguy]

Except I've already said I can't possibly see the things he's doing come from town so I have actually considered it

Can you say what these things are again? I think you said them before but I just want to make sure everything is 100% clear

[mattblackguy]

The thing is Sick acts like this when he's town too. So it doesn't matter if you don't think he's town. There's still a real possibility that he is town. And the fact that you are not even considering that a possibility is concerning to me. Honestly if you actually are town then I think you are playing just as bad as Sick.

I feel like I said this before... Just feels like I'm going in circles waiting for more people to contribute. Anyways I'll readdress this later.

I want to talk to Lucca now.

I KNOW YOU ARE ONLINE LUCCA COME HERE!

[mattblackguy]

YeahA few things but for starters why was Sich and Loopdan your 3rd and 4th strongest townreads?

[mattblackguy]

Because I wasn't reading either as town at all. But I guess it makes sense if Loopdan wasn't a town lean.

Sicko this game has felt scummy to me mostly all game. Only reason I really have doubts is because of how hard TwoFace is tunneling on him.

And who do you think we should focus on next? Rereading the few posts you have I don't think the Lucca wagon is the right track to finding scum. I probably did over react when you had me and Fykus as top scumreads, but I'm not sure I agree with a Fykus wagon right now either.

[mattblackguy]

I'm thinking maybe one of {Shannon,Kyoku,???} ??? being someone else but I can't think of who.

[mattblackguy]

@sicko, 167: I don't like this at all. this post feels scummy to me. actually it feels to me like you are trying to get on my good side so I don't push you again.

Actually that post didn't really feel scummy to me. Maybe NAI. I mean it's kinda natural if you're town to think the person defending you when a wagon is forming/formed is also town.

[mattblackguy]

So who's your top scumread now?

@Sickofit ^

Off i can't think of anyone off the top of my head... and I need to go to bed as well. I'll hopefully pop in tomorrow sometime and reread.

VOTE: Fykusl

I'm fine with my vote being on Fykus right now. Matt and TwoFace were other potential scumreads, but Matt's page 5 is solid and TwoFace can easily be extremely confbiased town.

aside from that, I feel like we need more content. where is kyouko? where is shannon? where is lil?

doing a small readlist now:

- TOWN
Sensfan
Massive
Loopdan
Sickofit
Lil
Shannon
Kyouko
TwoFace
Matt
Fykus
- SCUM

when Innocent and Soul come to play, they will be placed at the readlist. feel free to ask any questions.

Right now my top biggest reads are

Town - Lucca, TwoFace, Sensfan, and Shannon.

Scum - Matt, Fykus.

This didn't look good at all to me.

[mattblackguy]

UNVOTE:

Need to reevaluate

[mattblackguy]

Fykus, what's your current read on TwoFace?

[mattblackguy]

Sorry for the newbie question but what does LAMISN mean?

LAMIST means Look at me I'm so town! So I think LAMISN means Look at me I'm so neutral!

[mattblackguy]

Still somewhat scum read to me, but not as much as it was before.

What changed that it's not as strong as before?

[mattblackguy]

Let's just lynch Lucca. All he's done is make catch-up posts and given out reads with very little reasoning for them. He's barely interacting with people and is not trying to sort anyone or really game solve.

The catch-up posts thing is just a playstyle. Just take a quick look at other games he's in and he does the same exact thing, so that's NAI. Not sure what you are talking about with the other stuff, because everything you are accusing him of doing he's doing the exact opposite.

[mattblackguy]

@lil, 311: the tryhard part I will give you, I can see how you would get to this conclusion. I know that was the first to vote Fykus, but other people joined with worse reasons than me. if you were truly concerned with my votes on Fykus, why wouldn't you be concerned with their votes?

Just looked back at your ISO, and your reason to vote Fykus was pretty weak though. Only person I recall having a decent reason for voting Fykus was Innocent.

But I gotta agree with the second part. @LUV, why didn't you question Shannon on her vote on Fykus? Imo her reason for voting Fykus was just as bad as Luccas.

[mattblackguy]

@Matt: Could you link me just two games so I can briefly skim?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p8752949
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p7952456

[mattblackguy]

No my problem is you said a player was screaming scum (Player A). Then you vote a player who has offered nothing (Player B) without ever changing a read on the player screaming scum.

Player B is a lurker, waste of space, call it whatever. Could be scum could be town from my experience. I personally agree that Nadpool might be scum albeit for additional reasons than "offering nothing."

So if Player A is screaming scum, and you never reliquinish that screaming scum read, one you specifically state later was only strengthened by a lack of a reasonable response:

"I thought id call him out on what I considered him to be doing to see if he'd offer a reasonable response. A page later he hadnt offered one, so I put my vote on him."

and then all of a sudden vote a lurker who is doing nothing, yeah that catches my eye.

LUV, what do you think about this?

[mattblackguy]

Eh well thought you were still here and not really that important anyway. I agree with what Innocent is saying here, and I think Fykus deserves a wagon on him now.

VOTE: Fykus

[mattblackguy]

Apologies for not knowing how to link post numbers properly (youll have to go back through manually if you want to take a look).

Code: Select all

[post]251[/post]

[mattblackguy]

Ok so after having a read through again, I noticed in #251 Shannon sticks up for Twoface re: the tunneling thing but then in #301 she starts lightly putting some pressure on him again. Its not much to go on, but it could potentially be the signs of a scum team here. Apologies for not knowing how to link post numbers properly (youll have to go back through manually if you want to take a look).

Three things about this:

1. Shannon doesn't even stick up for TwoFace in 251. She just confirmed what he said was true.
2. Your whole read on Shannon is based on the fact that you say TwoFace is scum. TwoFace hasn't even flipped yet. Voting Shannon based on this doesn't make sense.
3. Even if TwoFace was scum this still doesn't make Shannon scum. The association is really weak, and doesn't mean much.

[mattblackguy]

@matt, 337: yeah, my reason for voting Fykus was to apply pressure to his slot. he had only entered the thread twice to state popular opinions. I voted him, then used that vote to get more of him. Then I unvoted him.

First game is a little different since you aren't wallposting quite as frequently as this game, but the second is exactly the same. You had over 10 catch up wallposts over the course of day 1. LUV's whole case on you is that he dislikes your playstyle which is NAI.

[mattblackguy]

I'm just being open and honest with my thought process, does that make me scummy? Sorry, I just assumed that honesty is the best policy here but I guess not.

If you think TwoFace is scum, and only think Shannon is scum because of interactions with TwoFace then why aren't you voting TwoFace instead of Shannon? You're not being clear with your thought process.

[mattblackguy]

^^

[mattblackguy]

Looks like Fykus just gave up. He's still posting on the site, but not here.

[mattblackguy]

Nah it's L-2

[mattblackguy]

wait why is sick on the shannon wagon. He said me and fykus were his top scumreads

[mattblackguy]

Am I not entitled to have more than scum read at one time? Is it not normal to juggle votes between your scum reads based upon how many votes are on each?

Sure, but can you tell me why you think Shannon is scum that doesn't involve TwoFace?

[mattblackguy]

Tbh I'm just waiting for Shannon to CC Fykus so we can lynch scum.

[mattblackguy]

I believe he's at L-3

[mattblackguy]

TwoFace just lynch confirmed scum.

[mattblackguy]

I'm on scum right now. Waiting for the lynch.

[mattblackguy]

If we don't lynch Fykus we gonna have to find one of his partners today then.

[mattblackguy]

I look bad because I don't believe his claim?

[mattblackguy]

I think it's bullshit too, but Sick probably second best lynch after Fykus. Guess I'll lynch that scum tomorrow.

VOTE: Sick

[mattblackguy]

btw I'm not getting lynched today... I promise you that.

Who should we lynch today?

[mattblackguy]

@mod Sens needs a prod

I won't be on tomorrow, and I'm waiting on what Soymilks replacement has to say.

[mattblackguy]

I claim matt

[mattblackguy]

Lucca, no!

[mattblackguy]

Alright seriously cmon guys lets go. We have less than 3 days left and need to decide on a lynch very soon. I still rather lynch Fykus over anyone else, but I need 6 other people to jump on that wagon with me. If not Fykus then Sick would be a decent lynch option. I'm still going to wait a little bit before jumping to the Keyen wagon, but I can also see myself voting there.

People that I can't see myself lynching today : Innocent, Shannon, Lucca, TwoFace, massive, Nadpool

Still happy with my Shannon vote.

Why? If you see something in Shannon that no one else is seeing then you should say it now otherwise Shannon is not getting lynched today.

[mattblackguy]

Wtf shannon why did you unvote?

[mattblackguy]

He's at L-3 and already saying "congrats lynching a pr". Yeah that sounds fake to me. If you're a PR no need for you to claim that early. You should have finished doing your catchup, because only thing I saw from your catchup so far was your opinion on Fykus, and Sick, and like Void said both were weak points.

I can't speak for anyone else but the reason I was suspecting you was because your catchup and your drive to scumhunt didn't seem genuine. It felt like you came into the game, and latched on the first reason to scumread someone, and voted them and stopped there. What you were scumreading Sick for happened on page 2 of the game. There's 20 more pages, and you didn't really comment on those besides Fykus.

[mattblackguy]

By my count Keyen, Fykus, and Matt have all claimed or had someone else imply a claim for them. I'm not voting anyone who claims on D1.

I haven't claimed and Lucca was wrong about me softing. I just didn't believe Fykus' claim in the slightest.

[mattblackguy]

Keyen

[mattblackguy]

VOTE: Keyen

[mattblackguy]

He just said "PR" which reads like he was trying to scare us away from lynching him without actually committing to a claim

Yup this exactly

[mattblackguy]

so no more detail on that claim OK?

Sounds like a good way to get people to reveal their PRs ready for NKs tbh

[mattblackguy]

VOTE: Mattblack based on a read of Two Face's ISO. Will also accept votes on Sick.

Shannon, what are you even doing? I had you as a solid Town read at the end of the day and now you making me second guess my gut :/

Ok so TwoFace never even said he was scumreading me. His scumreads were in order:
1.Sick
2.Massive
And to a lesser extent
3/4.Fykus/Lucca

So you saying the reason for voting me is because of TwoFace's ISO makes 0 sense. Can you put me in your mind when you made that post because I don't understand it at all.

[mattblackguy]

So you think I'm scum because I still wanted to lynch Fykus after he claimed? I said I didn't believe his claim, which is why I still wanted to lynch him. You scumreading me for wanting to lynch someone I think is lying scum is like me scumreading you for thinking fake claims are scummy. Shannon please stop being

weird

.

Alright enough getting sidetracked. Fykus and Sick top lynch targets for today.

VOTE: Sick

[mattblackguy]

@Jupiter 1

[mattblackguy]

Are you going to do a catchup on the rest of the stuff that happened day 1? Also what's your experience with mafia like?

[mattblackguy]

As for who I jailed last night, it was shannon since I was scum reading her pretty hard yesterday. Seeing as a kill got through last regardless of my actions I'm less inclined to see shannon as scum today (for now at least). Hopefully this post has explained my thought process well enough.

So fmpov, I think we should lynch the scummiest person, and so far I think shanon has been giving the weirdest vibes mainly because she's like, not really sounding genuine in her tone and that makes me feel like she's hiding something which is usually a characteristic of a mafia, so I'd like to lynch her, however I feel like that twoface vs sick fight was pretty town versus town which I see a lot and I am prtty sure that us doubling down to lynch sick after twoface flipping town doesn't really mean sick is scum, so I think people pushing it are pretty suspicious

Ok yeah this is 100% scum

Visited SSbm, who was targeted by Fykus.

If Sick was telling the truth he would know 100% for a fact that Fykus is lying, and that Fykus is scum, but he doesn't come out voting on him day 2. Instead Sick starts day 2 calling Jupiter 100% scum, and decides not to place a vote anywhere. That makes absolutely no sense at all.

[mattblackguy]

But I don't believe Fykus' Jailkeeper claim either which is why I'm torn. Are they both scum, and is sick doing a god awful job at bussing his buddy? He's not even really bussing him. The night actions don't match up so one of them has to be lying for sure, and Sick should know this, but he's not doing anything about it. I don't buy that he didn't see Fykus' night action claim because he saw JupiterCrush's post which was on the same page right after BlackVoid, and Fykus were talking about his jailkeeping target. I don't understand.

[mattblackguy]

@Shannon, Did you believe Fykus' Jailkeeper claim when he claimed day 1, and do you still believe it now?

[mattblackguy]

@Jack LUV offered reasons why he thought Lucca was scum in 331. What do you think of his reasons?

[mattblackguy]

Mattblackguy is curious how Nadpool's speech will evolve on day 3. Will Nadpool be speaking in eloquent essays?

[mattblackguy]

Jupiter is a solid town read for me based on his posts on this page (I hope it's still this page, otherwise, yay I got a page top!)

What exactly on that page made him a solid town read for you? I didn't get that impression.

[mattblackguy]

I definitely don't like sensfans contributions to this game. All he's done is defend Sick, and complain how this game sucks. Not sure if he's scum though.

[mattblackguy]

I feel like if he was scum with Sick he'd play a little better? Anyone familiar with Sens here?

[mattblackguy]

it's really weird that he stopped posting right after the claim

It's really obvious that Sens has been prod dodging every 48~ hours so it's not weird that he stopped posting. He's barely even playing this game.

Sens 7th post - 8th post (4 days apart)
Sens 9th post - 10th post (2 days apart)
Sens 10th post - 11th post (3 days apart)
Sens 15th post - 16th post (1.5+ days hours apart)

Sens posts roughly once/twice every 2 days, and doesn't even post any game advancing content. The way you are playing this game is disgusting regardless of alignment. Replace out if you're not going to play.

[mattblackguy]

Sens 15th post - 16th post (1.5+ days apart)

EBWOP

[mattblackguy]

I just think Fykus is desperate and is trying anything to play up the super noob/dumb persona. That just looks like an attempt at forcing in a townslip. What he said didn't even make any sense. He said if there are 2 scum then if he blocks one it confirms 100% whether they are scum or not. Common sense tells you if there are 3 scum and u block 1 there's a 33% chance you block the one that is attempting to kill them if there are 2 scum and u block 1 there's a 50% chance to block the one attempting to kill

He's using that noob card way too much this game.

[mattblackguy]

Still think Fykus and Sick are both scum and are just attempting the worst double bus in mafiascum history

[mattblackguy]

Nice find Black Void! Yup that pretty much confirms that Fykus is playing up his newbie persona way too much, and lied about his knowledge of the game thus is scum.

[mattblackguy]

I'll give Sick and Fykus one more day to really explain everything they can, and after that I think I'm ready for a lynch.

[mattblackguy]

Void, how do you manage to blend in when you're scum? Your townplay is such obvious Town it seems like it'd be hard to replicate.

[mattblackguy]

Prefer Town by far. Just like being honest and gamesolving. it's also more relaxed cause I don't have to worry about being caught. I have 0 completed scumgames.

[mattblackguy]

I don't know, really. Like, I saw it but just didn't have it in me to engage in this game. As I said, I've been having trouble really finding this game to be something other than a chore. Not entirely sure why. Hopefully my dive into it tonight will re-energize me.

Replace out if you're not going to play.

[mattblackguy]

Not much else to say. I'm still waiting on Fykus, and Sick to actually post about what's going on. They've been stalling this game for long enough. Lynch one then lynch the other tomorrow if they don't post something decent by the time the timer runs out.

(expired on 2017-02-17 00:32:22)

[mattblackguy]

And also as for my offsite scum games they were hosted on a private torrent tracker so unless you're on said sites I won't be able to link them to you. Generally though I stayed pretty quiet most of the game and ran my posts through my team mates using day chat before actually posting.

Is that what you are doing right now?

[mattblackguy]

i think sick gave up, and i'd like to keep him alive and lynch outside of sick because at this point we'd get more information.

1 of sick/fykus has to be scum (maybe both). Why would you want to lynch outside of them?

[mattblackguy]

Then what information do we get from keeping him alive?

[mattblackguy]

I don't understand how you can be so sure that Fykus is town.

[mattblackguy]

aye new avatar

[mattblackguy]

Like, I understand why one of them is, but why both of them? What do you think the original plan was (assuming there was an original plan here)?

Sick is the same guy who claimed 1-shot bulletproof in a newbie when he was VT and got lynched by the real 1-shot bulletproof in mylo. Do you really think he thinks out his actions?

[mattblackguy]

I went through the newbie game he just completed to see how he treated the JK claim and here's what he said:

Unfortunately im just a vanilla townie. Had i been cop i would have tracked grey. So if you jailed nydus that means hes either scum or a target of scum or maybe mafia had a roleblocker that used their action and maybe pep never sent in a kill?

So, he knows that if there's no kill, then it's possible that the person jailed could be a target of scum and wouldn't 100% determine if that player is scum or not like he says here:

Sorry, I was under the impression that there were only 2 scum players in these games? I figured by jailing a suspected scum I could see whether or not it stopped a kill from happening which would 100% determine if that person was scum or not. I'll adjust this strategy for night 2 and jail my top town read instead (won't reveal who it is, hopefully scum will waste a shot on them).

So, yeah I think you are right. He's pretending to be newbier than he is. I didn't worry about it too much at first because he did play up the newbie-card in his newbie towngame but his play there was very, very involved and passionate and the difference to here is quite stark.

@Fykus, explain this. Why were you acting ilke you didn't know how jailkeeper worked earlier when you clearly understood how it worked in your previous newbie game?

[mattblackguy]

Oh wait that actually is a hammer. Forgot Jupiter put him at L-1... Still lynch Fykus' ass tomorrow regardless of Sick's flip. I'm counting on you Innocent, and BlackVoid.

[mattblackguy]

If Sick flips town then look at Fykus' day 1 L-1 wagon. It probably has at least one of his scumpartners on it. Most likely Nadpool or Kyouko(Jack)

[mattblackguy]

Actually nvm just realised if Sick flips town then Kyouko(Jack) is town by extension since Fykus would have visited him.

[mattblackguy]

Jack you still believe Fykus?

[mattblackguy]

predetermined to be sacrificed

So you think the scum team's plan was to sacrifice Sick? What do they get out of sacrificing him? I don't think any scum would gain any towncred from Sick's lynch. Only person I can see who "could" get some towncred off of Sicks' lynch is Fykus.

[mattblackguy]

predetermined to be sacrificed

So you think the scum team's plan was to sacrifice Sick? What do they get out of sacrificing him? I don't think any scum would gain any towncred from Sick's lynch. Only person I can see who "could" get some towncred off of Sicks' lynch is Fykus.

That is the reason I gave in my intial post about the subject. The hope would be that fykus would get towncred for being cc'd by scum (or sick would get towncred for cc'ing scum). I'm not sure this is what happened but it's one of my leading theories. If it's false and fykus is really the JK, than sensfan is almost certainly scum. If fykus is scum, I don'tthink sensfan is too, but there's a little possibility I guess.

Alright so we're basically on the same page then.

[mattblackguy]

@Fykus 717 756

Also I agree with Jack. I think Jupiter needs to claim.

[mattblackguy]

There's one other thing I want people's opinion on. I had a tinfoil theory that Lucca/Jupiter was scum and they were using the word "weird" as a code for "bus me now." Because Lucca started out townreading sickofit and precisely after the first time he uses the bolded word "weird," Lucca changes his stance and starts pushing him. But Lucca/Jupiter doesn't really fit in with Fykus especially after that end-of-day "don't jail me" request.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=69804 - I think the weird thing was a nod to this game where Lucca kept bolding weird.

Not saying that Lucca/Jupiter can't be scum, because I honestly think they are very likely to be scum. Especially with how Jupiter initially tried to push the lynch off of Sick at the end of day 2.

[mattblackguy]

Nadpool sees no reason why Fykus should still be alive.

VOTE: Fykus

Nadpool doesn't think a Jupiter claim is necessary until tomorrow.

Dude wtf you are speaking the same way you did say 2!

VOTE: Fykus

Hard to tell which of Sens/Jupiter is the last scum but I'm pretty sure it's between these two.

[mattblackguy]

Ok so this is interesting...

[mattblackguy]

Black void is town

[mattblackguy]

Alright I'm going to claim because I'm not sure what to do with this new info. BV, and Inno help me out.

I'm doctor.

And yes I know I'm dead tonight now

[mattblackguy]

I was on Innocent night 1 and night 2

[mattblackguy]

Jupiter feels like he's being honest here though.

But Joat with a protective ability, and a doctor?

[mattblackguy]

Yeah Jupiter that's what I'm saying.

[mattblackguy]

Town Tracker
Town Backup
Town Doctor
Town JOAT(1-shot role cop,1-shot bulletproof,1 shot doctor)
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
Mafia Roleblocker
Goon
Goon


This seems like a balanced role list to me, but I'm still very inexperienced what do you guys think?

[mattblackguy]

Jupiter if you are telling the truth then yes you are right. From your POV Me and Fykus both can't be telling the truth.

[mattblackguy]

Yeah maybe me claiming now was bad... Should have waited till tomorrow. I was confused about JOAT with protective.

[mattblackguy]

Alright so lynch Fykus today. Sens tomorrow?

[mattblackguy]

BV - town
Jupiter - town
Innocent - town
Shannon - town
Jack - lean town
Nadpool - ???
Sens - Scum?

So I say we lynch Sens tomorrow, and if he flips town then lynch Nadpool.

[mattblackguy]

Shannon is town by association with Fykus, and Sick. Both sick and Fykus were pushing very hard on her day 1, and don't thin Fykus is the type of player that would his teammate like that day 1

[mattblackguy]

Forgot about massive. Honestly I'm not too sure about him, but Jack and Innocent strongly feel he's Town. They're probably right and I'm just missing something about him

[mattblackguy]

Sorry about typos I'm on my phone

[mattblackguy]

How many mislynches do we have after today? 3?

[mattblackguy]

Im pretty sure swinging through Sens, Nadpool probably wins the game. If both are Town then I would say massive.

Unless someone else comes out as PR I'm like 95% sure that these are all Town and shouldn't be lynched ever:
Innocent,Shannon,BV,Jupiter

[mattblackguy]

Can we do VCA before I die? Both Fykus and Sick were at L-1 on day 1 and that may be helpful.

[mattblackguy]

@Matt, I haven't ruled out the scum distancing from Shannon. I'm going to have a look at her ISO and discuss in a bit.

I just don't see Fykus bussing Shannon that hard on day 1 if they were scumbuddies. Just look at how reluctant he was to bus Sick.

[mattblackguy]

Fykus tied shannon to at least two people (TwoFace and KNPD) and called them her scumpartners. That's something I see newbie scum do with their partners (tie them to a townie so that if the partner flips, they can try to push that townie and if the townie flips, they don't have to push the partner anymore).

That's a good point, and you may be right that I'm clearing Shannon too easily. I'll have to look through Shannon, and Nadpool more.

You were partners with scum!shannon right? What do you think of her play compared to that game?

[mattblackguy]

@Jupiter, If sick flips scum Nadpool will highly suspect Sens. If sick flips town, Nadpool definitively wants a Fykus lynch.

Nadpool sees no reason why Fykus should still be alive.

VOTE: Fykus

Nadpool doesn't think a Jupiter claim is necessary until tomorrow.

Why did you push for Fykus lynch at start of day 3 instead of Sens lynch?

[mattblackguy]

BV - town
Jupiter - town
Innocent - town
Jack - lean town
Massive - lean town?
Nadpool - ???
Shannon - ???
Sens - Scum?

[mattblackguy]

Actually the only reason Massive is in lean town is because Jack, and Innocent have strong town reads on him.

@Jack @Innocent Can you talk to me more about the massive townread. First thing I noticed about him is that he ignored the Fykus, and Sick wagon for the entirety of day 1, and planted him vote on Shannon for all of day 1.

[mattblackguy]

788 Oh is Jupiter scum?

Did you finish reading the rest of the day?

[mattblackguy]

I'm here now. Having a doc CC Jupiter doesn't make me feel ANY better about Jupiter.

I'd sure like to be able to read parts over and have a think but that won't happen until Tuesday.

How do you feel about Fykus?

[mattblackguy]

Two other things that stick out: #1: what on earth made shannon believe that the TwoFace kill pointed towards Matt? It was incredibly obvious that TwoFace's suspects were sickofit, with massive a close second.

Shannon thought I was scum because I still wanted to lynch Fykus after his jailkeeper claim.

[mattblackguy]

I don't agree with Jupiter lynch over Fykus at all. Fykus has been playing like obvious scum all game.

[mattblackguy]

The thing that puts me off from a fykus-sick pair is sick's lack of pushing on fykus despite cc'ing him. I don't get why sick as RB would cc his partner and then not try and push that lynch through for the towncred.

Why would sick cc Town!Fykus and then not push on the slot? It can go both ways.

[mattblackguy]

@Massive, Sick never tried to get Fykus lynched. He never even voted him day 2. Also why would Jupiter preform the kill when Fykus said on day 2 that he will jail one of {Jupiter,Innocent,BV}. Unless you believe that Jupiter, and one of Innocent/BV is the scumteam.

Fykus has been abusing the noob card all game to try and get away with shit that makes absolutely no sense. Another recent example:

Fykus voted Sick because he didn't beileve there are 4 PRs in a 13 player game and didn't even mention the fact that Sick's PR claim CCed his actions.
Fykus jails Jupiter because he believes that Jupiter is a PR even though from Fykus' perspective that would make him the 4th PR, and from Fykus' POV that would make Jupiter scum, and not a 4th PR.

[mattblackguy]

Where is Sensfan? Lurking at this point SCREAMS 'I am dodgy and don't want to draw attention to myself'.

Sensfan has been lurking this whole game. He hasn't even voted since RVS. This is why I asked him to replace out, so we can properly read his slot.

[mattblackguy]

with matt's claim, my town read on fykus faded so I'm willing to lynch him because matt could be the 4th pr.

Can you explain your previous townread on Fykus for me?

[mattblackguy]

@Jupiter Also can you quote some of Fykus' posts that made you give him a townread before?

[mattblackguy]

@BV, Innocent is town. You're getting too paranoid

[mattblackguy]

@Jupiter, Why didn't you vote either Fykus, or Sick at the beginning of day 2? You said you role copped sick so you knew he was a roleblocker. Did you seriously think town had 5 PRs, and 2 of them were roleblockers?

[mattblackguy]

@everyone who thinks Fykus is town,

Why do you think Sick didn't try to push Fykus' lynch yesterday? If Fykus really is Town Jailkeeper then Sick would have good reason to push for his lynch because it was between him and Fykus. It's not like Fykus was a universal townread. It actually was the opposite, and many people were already scumreading him. Sick wouldn't even have to try hard to push the lynch through of Fykus. Why would Sick want to get himself lynched over Fykus? He was the roleblocker, and if Fykus was a jailkeeper then he had all the reason to push a mislynch of the jailkeeper before he gets lynched tomorrow.

I'm a watcher. Now get the fuck off my wagon

Visited SSbm, who was targeted by Fykus.

This doesn't read like someone that was purposely countering Fykus, and trying to get him lynched. So I don't think his intent was to mislynch town!fykus, or to bus his partner. I think Sick accidentally countered Fykus when he was trying to make his results match up. (Either Sick thought Fykus said he visited SSbm, Fykus was supposed to say he visited SSbm or some other blunder happened here)

So why didn't Sick push for Fykus' lynch after he fucked up by countering him? Well simply he couldn't. Fykus wasn't getting townread, and even if he tried to slightly push Fykus it could cause people to jump off his wagon to Fykus' wagon which he absolutely didn't want. He had no choice at the point but to take the lynch because pushing his partner would have made the situation way worse for the scumteam.

After Fykus flips goon Sick would have been proved to be lying since there's no way Fykus!goon could have visited SSbm. This means if Sick pushed Fykus, and Fykus got lynched then he would get lynched the next day for lying. The only option Sick had after countering Fykus was to lie down and take the lynch, and just hope that Fykus could get away with some towncred.

[mattblackguy]

@BV, If you lynch Inno this game I'm going to be pissed to you in the post game. You guys are both town and need to work together not against each other.

[mattblackguy]

See lol

[mattblackguy]

Can't believe a few people actually believed Fykus was town

[mattblackguy]

@Jupiter, Why didn't you vote either Fykus, or Sick at the beginning of day 2? You said you role copped sick so you knew he was a roleblocker. Did you seriously think town had 5 PRs, and 2 of them were roleblockers?

@BV, I haven't ruled out Jupiter/Fykus both scum. Can you please press Jupiter on this?

[mattblackguy]

I could see where Jack was coming from. What he was saying made sense, and I was also a little suspicious of Jupiter. I didn't agree with him when he said he wanted to lynch Jupiter over Fykus, but I don't think he's scum.

[mattblackguy]

I'm having a hard time reading massive. Nothing really pings me as really townie, but doesn't ping me as scummy either. The fact that he ignored Fykus, and Sick wagons while pushing Shannon wagon with little reasoning given could point to him being scum with them.

Although... I don't know if all 3 scum would push the Shannon wagon together. Seems like that could be unlikely no?

[mattblackguy]

I think Sick fucked up and was trying to make his results match up with Fykus' results.

[mattblackguy]

GG everyone. I had fun with you all. Props to TwoFace, and Inno for nailing scum quickly on day 1. Also enjoyed playing with you BlackVoid and hope we can play again sometime. This is my first time I got to gamesolve with another townie and it was really fun Most of the time I'm getting scumread and trying to convice townies to work with me and get lynched anyway. It was a nice change :p

Yeah Lucca I didn't believe Fykus was a jailkeeper because I was a doctor, and because of have scummy he was acting in general. I didn't claim because I knew it was possible for their to be a jailkeeper, and doctor in the same setup, and didn't think it was worth it day 1. Why did you replace though? You were one of the players I was looking forward to playing with this game.

[mattblackguy]

Had scum not screwed themselves town probably would have lost:P

If the scumteam was something like you, BV, and Innocent then yeah probably

[mattblackguy]

Also thanks for modding Leon. Your flavor was great all game and really enjoyed it. Really surprised that this is your first modded game on this site because you were on top of everything.