Civilization Mafia [GAME OVER]

[Leonshade]

Who are your "weakest" town reads, Leon?

Gorkington and davesaz, followed by Senpai and LUV. Gorkington isn't based on much, but especially that one post I pointed out showed some towny thinking. Davesaz is just based on his use of the PR to essentially clear Maxous. Senpai's stronger due to his hard defense of Creature, but I suppose there's a chance he didn't expect it to have such a strong effect (or was looking for the towncred). LUV I don't have much reason to scumread, but him being scum wouldn't surprise me like many of my other TRs.

[KidAmn]

I don't really have a great reason to believe that you're scum

, but Nero doesn't seem to be happening and I still think my PoE is largely correct, with two/three erroneous townreads.

If this isn't setting off alarms for anyone I don't know what the fuck I need to do at this point

[Leonshade]

Shrug, just being honest. I'm the probable lynch for today, and you're not only among the few I'm comfortable lynching at the moment, but the most probable counterwagon.

[Nero Cain]

Senpai's stronger due to his hard defense of Creature

Scum know who town are so "defending" isn't really a town tell. What do you think of my reasoning that Senpai is prob scum for mostly tunneling Vecna the whole game and not really having any scum reads outside of that? Also Dave is prob town due to that wonder uness you think he's scum with Creature and/or Max.

[Leonshade]

Senpai's stronger due to his hard defense of Creature

Scum know who town are so "defending" isn't really a town tell. What do you think of my reasoning that Senpai is prob scum for mostly tunneling Vecna the whole game and not really having any scum reads outside of that? Also Dave is prob town due to that wonder uness you think he's scum with Creature and/or Max.

My reasoning at the time:

excuse me if I don't trust the reads of someone that has been on both mislynches.

Also I find it hard to believe that a town Math is so dejected that she's goinf to play from the sidelines.

I'll agree to this.

I've seen dejected Math before, I can believe their play here.

Senpai is town as fuck for 7593, single-handedly course-correcting the game state.

Do you still feel the same knowing that its based on outdated meta that no longer applies?

I think the only reason for Senpai to do what they did is if Creature is buddies with them. A generally easy to TR Creature getting wagoned only benefits scum, and Notice went in hard on defending Creature. I don't think the potential towncred would be a worthy trade-off for stopping the wagon on Creature. I also TR Creature and LUV and agree that the two of them being the top wagons was horrible. Notice went out of their way to change the direction of the game away from a direction I loathed, going against a universal TR's reads in the process. I don't see any reason for scum to do any of the above except to defend their buddy, and I don't see Creature as scum here.

Whether or not the meta is accurate is irrelevant for my TR on Senpai.

Scum often TR a mislynch for towncred, but they usually still want the actual lynch to go through. What Senpai did actually stopped the wagon.

There could be a bit of hindsight bias here, since there's no guarantee that Senpai's defense would've done anything. They COULD have just defended Creature for the towncred and done so in a way that would match Jae's town game for the towncred.

Tunneling Vecna and having no other SRs could just be due to a lack of engagement with the game. I've been struggling finding strong SRs to stick to, since nobody stands out as obvscum and there's so much content that analyzing it would take forever.

I don't really think Dave is scum, but since it's only based on that one thing it COULD be wrong.

You could add RC to my list of "weak" TRs, since I was scumreading the slot before. I really do TR his entrance though, and while RC is usually the first to claim that you can't accurately read him, I'm not going to change my read just because "it's RC".

[Leonshade]

Nero, I still don't like your reactions today, but I'm willing to think that I could be wrong on you. Usually when I craft a "grand narrative" of why someone is scum, it's because I'm grasping at straws. It usually turns out wrong. I'm trying to stick to the basics now that my interest is re-invigorated.

[Nero Cain]

What if its a Senpai-Creature and that's why Senpai didn't want the wagon to happen?

Lke Creature's early game was to ask questions and act like he's oblivious.

[Nero Cain]

I'm trying to stick to the basics now that my interest is re-invigorated.

What re-invigorated your interest?

[Nero Cain]

my gut really says there's scum in the the people that everyone seems to be town reading.

[Nero Cain]

Like I know I'm town and I don't feel strongly that Kid or Cloud are scum. I could but a LUV town. Dave, Creature, Max are all mixed in together. Caser is going after the IC wonder so ok. That leaves us with a pool of...


Alisae
MathBlade
Leonshade
Gorkington
RadiantCowbells
Vecna
NoticeMeSenpai
nancy

and there are deff scum in there.

This isn't the same RC from timeshift. Ali is being all lurky and thats not thier town meta. I think Senpai having a shit ton of town reads and tunneling the same slots like the whole game is prob scum. If we aren't doing RC today (like we should) I'd do Gork or Leon.

[Leonshade]

What if its a Senpai-Creature and that's why Senpai didn't want the wagon to happen?

Lke Creature's early game was to ask questions and act like he's oblivious.

I suspected Creature the one time he was scum against me, and I generally find him easy to read. His townread is one of the last I'd doubt.

I'm trying to stick to the basics now that my interest is re-invigorated.

What re-invigorated your interest?

RC replacing in to provide a fresh perspective, as well as just taking the time to think about the game instead of simply following it.

[Leonshade]

Like I know I'm town and I don't feel strongly that Kid or Cloud are scum. I could but a LUV town. Dave, Creature, Max are all mixed in together. Caser is going after the IC wonder so ok. That leaves us with a pool of...


Alisae
MathBlade
Leonshade
Gorkington
RadiantCowbells
Vecna
NoticeMeSenpai
nancy

and there are deff scum in there.

This isn't the same RC from timeshift. Ali is being all lurky and thats not thier town meta. I think Senpai having a shit ton of town reads and tunneling the same slots like the whole game is prob scum. If we aren't doing RC today (like we should) I'd do Gork or Leon.

Why are you townreading Kid and Cloud? I remember you explaining Cloud with meta, but why Kid?

Strange that you exclude the two players I suspect of being your buddies. I don't know if you'd be that blatant about it, but that's just WIFOM thinking.

[Nero Cain]

like the thing here is that Leon had a (light?) town read on me and its not like my play changed at all so his argument that I'm not scumhunting and just arguing makes like no sense to me and it seems plenty plausible that he's just you know scum that saw a growing bandwagon and hopped on.

[Nero Cain]

RC replacing in to provide a fresh perspective

he really hasn't. He's scumreading me but the reason he's given he can't or won't back up. All off the Dave, Yuri and SSBM have been major lynch contenders so other than his "scumread" on me he's harping on things that have been a thing for awhile now. So I'm not really seeing whats "fresh".

[Nero Cain]

keep in mind that I pushed a Dave wagon and RC thinks that makes us buddies. I don't see how that's from a townie mindset.

[Nero Cain]

I remember you explaining Cloud with meta, but why Kid?

I never liked Frogger's Yuri case and I had felt like if Yuri was scum (and thus be pushed by town) where does all the heat on Yuri go? Like myself, I can be pretty fickle with reads and jazz but for the most part town will continue to have the same/similar scum reads.

[Nero Cain]

Yuri (9): Lil Uzi Vert, Akane and Nebby, Vecna, Spiffeh, beeboy, Fro99er, The DEO, Nero Cain, Leonshade

and if we go with a Yuri was push by scum that points to scum being in Ali, Vecna, Nancy, Math, Nero, Leon.

I know I'm town so

Ali, Vecna, Nancy, Math, Leon has scum in it.

I might be willing to call Len town here since my vote on Yuri was about ending the day and I wouldn't be that surprised if Leon felt the same.

So yeah there's scum in Ali, Vecna, Nancy and Math.

[Vecna]

Like, you know im town - you even state so here in this block of town - but why do you feel the need to keep attacking me?

I never knew I had any town bock though if you mean that I think you are maybe less likely to be scum of the ppl with scumreads on me then yeah.

I just think its really odd that you keep me as a substantially strong scum read in your reads lists and threat me like I'm scum/null. At this point in time I'm fairly lynchable due to I guess, maybe not falling in line and wanting to wagon the same mislynches over over and over again. (Yuri, ABR, Bee) There hasn't been a halfway decent case on me the whole game.

Why, if you keep presenting evidence for why you think I'm town, do I never move up in your reads? Its like you are taking out of both sides of your mouth.

Oh, it was meant to say block of posts. typing error. Also, see my last list of reads?

[Nero Cain]

naw, I'm still pretty close.

[davesaz]

I really don't know what to think of RC's steadfast refusal to even notice my requests for a case, much less act on them.
I have even less clue of what to think of nobody else paying any attention to them.

[Creature]

"If Creature isn't scum, then Maxous is scum and this is multiball"

Then nancy questions why she's being ignored.

[MathBlade]

V/LA today sorry something came up

[Nahdia]

Lynch Vote 4.25

Leonshade (6):

NoticeMeSenpai, KidAmn, CloudKicker, Lil Uzi Vert, Caesar Wills It, Vecna

KidAmn (4):

Maxous, Creature, Alisae, Leonshade

RadiantCowbells (2):

Nero Cain, davesaz

Vecna (2):

Gorkinton, MathBlade

Nero Cain (1):

RadiantCowbells

Not Voting (1):

nancy

With 16 players alive, it takes 9 to lynch by majority.
Lynch deadline is in (expired on 2017-03-26 13:41:51), at which point at which point we will default to no lynch.

[RadiantCowbells]

why wouldn't you just bump it

[RadiantCowbells]

you have brought shame on moderators everywhere