Mini Normal 1917: :X Mafia (Game over!)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

felt this was pertinent to this game

[gigabyteTroubadour]

anyway

[gigabyteTroubadour]

VOTE: Nero Cain

also kraska was obvtown and a complete waste of a PR but i cant really complain because it means i'll have to save my breath and not have to make a bunch of meta wallposts that'll be ignored again like last time

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I'm always wishwashy.

this is horseshit btw

nero's scum and i don't think scum are bussing

only slot i'm townreading so far besides kraska and mcm is vedith but i haven't read the game yet

just felt the way the wagons happened it was TvT - i've never seen a scum wagon stall like that EoD against a town wagon

also CCC going for an information lynch is probably not a good idea - do you have a compelling reason to think that Vedith/Not_Mafia is scum over, say, Nero?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

grendel can you tell me why you're not voting nero

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Who you voting when I flip town?

not a good question to ask when i have no reads since when i watch games i only pay attention to slots im familiar with

only have read kraska and you and kind of grendel so

i replaced into this game specifically to lynch you and also because kraska asked me to

[gigabyteTroubadour]

well yeah

we're conniving backstabbing commies thats sort of our thing

[gigabyteTroubadour]

nero can you link me a town game of yours where you were this wishy washy and uninterested in scumhunting?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

tbh I'm having trouble forming reads this game because I've gotten into a bad habit of accidentally scumreading most power roles as town but I think I understand how it happens and I'm being overly careful to not let myself fall into that this game and it's making me weird and cagey because avoiding it requires me to be more careful and I haven't really felt able to do so since I fell behind once in this game and that's been locking me into only being able to talk about the subset of players I feel like I've put enough effort into separating properly in that way

and now i'm just playing like shit in a different way than usual so that's useful

That souns like the opposite of my problem, where I scum read town power forcing them to cliam.

If you weren't being careful where would you reads be?

also grendel i really hope you're not town here :////////////

[gigabyteTroubadour]

your iso says otherwise

like you ask questions but there's no oomph to them

i dont really know if i want to read civ though

[gigabyteTroubadour]

yeah i skimmed the first page of your iso in civ and there's at least some fire there

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Not_Mafia
DeathRowKitty

Cheetory6

Hiraki

CCC

Grendel

MuttonChopMagic

SlingshotWaffles
Backhand
Nero Cain

NotTheRealPaul

kraska77

uh hmmm

kraska talk to me about cheet and paul here - cheet's vote on me is kind of iffy imo and if paul is striked for the reason i think he's striked it's not good enough for me

like cheet is kind of town from what i've seen but i dont think he's strikeworthy

waffles i think should be striked here too unfortunately

[gigabyteTroubadour]

grendel whatever happened to your backhand read

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ok

i'll be honest

i really cannot care to read any other slot

we're powerlynching nero today and grendel tomorrow and both slots should just be treated like confscum

the third will probably be found via pr shenanigans

[gigabyteTroubadour]

{kraska, mcm}
{waffles}
{paul, vedith}
{cheetory, ccc}
{hiraki, backhand} - dont care to read/null
{grendel, nero}

hiraki kind of doesnt read like a grendel partner but could be a nero partner which is kind of weird

and backhand isnt a grendel partner

ok so my townreads are shit lmfao

let's just lynch scum first though

[gigabyteTroubadour]

actually switch paul and ccc

[gigabyteTroubadour]

{kraska, mcm}
{waffles}
{paul, vedith}
{cheetory, ccc}
{hiraki, backhand} - dont care to read/null
{grendel, nero}

Okay but.......
Are you serious about waffles' and vedith's placement? Like I agree they're more likely town than not but how can you be more assured about contentless slots being toqn than cheetory being town for example

i dont even know

im barely reading for content most of the higher reads are based on other things

drk was town.

get ur vote off of me then.......

prodge

hi GT! Remember me?

yeah obv
lets get nero

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Another Nero meta read vote! Wow!

this is why i refuse to townread you

please read my posts again and tell me i'm voting nero for meta

hi giga byte trroubidar
dud u roll shcm t his game my pupitar?

are you having a stroke

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hiraki if "his questions dont really seem to do anything but nitpick, he's passive, and kind of a wet noodle" isn't a sufficient case or something you can agree with wrt to nero how would you feel about a grendel lynch

[gigabyteTroubadour]

let's find out

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Grendel's reads' progression is non existent. It really reads like he's starting from conclusions and making his way back

that and i dont think town scumreading a slot (backhand) as strongly as he did just has that read drop off the face of the earth

and his read on me/push is shit too lmfao

((also i thought u were asking whats hiraki's deal lmao))

[gigabyteTroubadour]

the town narrative where he's annoyed that meta he doesnt have experience with is a thing is a thing i guess but im pretty sure non-meta reasons to scumread nero have been brought to the table and even if they havent before my replace in i've pushed nonmeta stuff so?

the bullheaded refusal to see it doesnt rly compute with me though which is why i'm skeptical

he kind of had ok grendel interactions though

[gigabyteTroubadour]

thats why im trying to engage him on grendel

grendel and i are friends but id never honestly say i have a remote understanding of how he plays mafia as either alignment like i can say about you or house or dunn or creature

so like the points against him are meta agnostic (even though nero is too) and there isnt really a way he can insinuate they are

i guess outing this might defeat the point but i think i can tell the difference about how scum would react here vs town....

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Surely this is only one time!

i was talking about kraska not nero there

but ok i'll address your stuff

[gigabyteTroubadour]

nero can you link me a town game of yours where you were this wishy washy and uninterested in scumhunting?

i mean

the point of this question was to see if he's been this way as town before because as i read it it's just scum but i guess it's not unreasonable to think that this comes from someone who's familiar with nero's meta? idk

it's not a meta read though so let's take a look at the posts that can marginally be considered scumhunting questions from nero's iso

Ugh, I'm pretty cool lynching RQS guy.

tell us more.

slingshitwaffles/notsure being lock town
via the replace out wording and around

So you think he's town b/c he requested to be replaced?

K I'm slightly townreading him

for?

first question and third questions are meh i guess. he kind of does follow up on the first but it's an easy question to ask as scum and he doesnt really do anything with the information he gets from the question. same applies for the third

second is a scummy question - the answer is already in the question and he's undermining the actual read and trying to misrep it into something less than it actually is. it's loaded and a nitpick that's just bullshit.

@ Sling

, do you know what the amished tell is?

vote:Sling

also like cheets PP case and I'm willing to go back the that if we can't lynch this scumbag.

waffles didnt invoke amished's tell (he called his pred an idiot not scummy) - like you can argue that nero thinks that it's actually AI here and that asking sling if he knew about the tell is scumhunting but that's absolutely something scum can do and being able to point to a tell makes convincing people easier since you can detach yourself from the emotional nuances of reading someone that's hard to fake as scum

It's a fairly poor tell. It's when someone complains about their predecessor being scummy.

I've had plenty of success with it though it only works on new players that aren't aware of said tell.

The first time I subbed in a game I called my predecessor scummy
I was town, and like, I never believe in supporting tells that personal experience finds not funny

ok, I find it not funny too. If you don't want to support something that you don't think has merit then that's on you bro. I will agree that like with any "tell" it's not 100% accurate and him telling us he thought his predecessor was dumb is still distancing himself from the previous owner. It was my impression, its scumhunting yo. If he's scum then he'll do other scummy things.

unvote

but in what world is this a town reaction to getting criticism?

does he think it's scummy or not? why does he give a shit what MCM thinks about the tell?

like........................... there just isnt a town explanation for this. his mudslinging didnt work and he has to backtrack and find a new push. if this were a town thought process he'd keep pushing waffles here

Gamma why aren't you voting anyone?

Why is that?

where is the follow up to this

ok he scumreads gamma but is this scummy? where is this addressed ever again?

notsure pings me with 77 Looks like white knighting of Grendal. And 80 is just weird. 84 seems like a fence sit.

why is he not voting sling here then

when mcm called him out he said that since sling is scum he'll do scum things and his pred did something he says is scummy so.....??

Alright. I guess given what I've seen of him it may not be a thing he would do. I feel you've thought it through so I'll let it go.
I think I should reread to get some better reads since some people had been pinging me as Town on first glance.

Gamma backing down kinda irks me.

theres a difference between "hey i think ccc knows the answer to this, this seems off" and then being given a good explanation to why it probably doesnt matter versus being told you're pushing a shitty tell on your top scumread and then backing off and not voting that slot for a while despite the fact your iso shows that he's your top scumread

one shows a disjoint in thought process that most likely stems from faking it (and is just flat out hypocritical) and the other came from basically conftown

Not too long ago, well maybe about a year ago. Pisskop was getting heavily scum read and

TACTICALLY

replaced out [as scum]. So I would not be surprised if he'd do the same in an attempt to maybe not get deadline lynched, idk. Cheet is also saying this is his scum meta sooooo...

vote:Gamma

I have all night phase to ponder if you are his buddy or not but scums is scum.

the way he also pushed this onto cheetory was pretty gross - i missed this my first skimthrough actually and this makes me want to townread cheetory a bit more.

he's already shown though he has his own thoughts on gamma so why does he need to tie cheetory's read into his? with gamma being basically conftown this reads like him trying to reduce his accountability for a mislynch

What do you think about nero, grendel?

Do you have something to say?

Not yet--you always this defensive?

yes

what is the point of this line of questioning and why does town even think to post this ever

@kranska Maybe I'm not understanding something but are you actually scumreading CCC or just want him lynched 'cause he's "lynchbait"?

I just posted my reads a page ago and said multiple times that I can't follow his thought process and don't like his posts,

speaks for itself i think

I agree this doesn't seem like Town Nero, but do you have anything else?

Why?

like just 'cause Kraska is claiming that I have no strong scum reads doesn't mean that its true. Why do you value her words over mine?

doesnt make an iota of sense in context, sling is......... literally asking that because he doesnt value kraskas words

absolutely zero point to this question but mudslinging

I mean I was scumreading both the Gamma slots and the sling shots. Kraska immediately comes in and pushes Sling. Like there's only two thoughts I can have here-they are cross bussing or I'm, wrong on one and Kraska wants to us that as evidence that I'm being wishy-washy-let alone the fact that being "wishy-washy" isn't and never will be a "scumtell" for me. Its like buzzword scumhunting.

coming from the guy who tried to push waffles for the amished tell when he didnt even invoke it lol

where is nero trying to do anything though to piece together if theyre bussing or not? like maybe the above question could be a simulation of doing that but the question is so useless and misreppy i dont think this is the case

So, when you come in and you respond to things pertaining to you, it can kind of come across like you're only popping up when you need to defend yourself.

I mean sure but I mean its not like I haven't been scumhunting. In fact, Kraska is playing hard and loose with my "meta" here. Like she's saying that when I'm town I'm confident is my reads yet she's also using my previous cofidence to claim I'm not scum hunting. like bullshit. We should rope this scum.

kraska accused him of not having real reads (an absolutely valid accusation btw) - thats........ not meta

MuttonChopMagic- conf Town(?)
kraska77- conf Town(?)

this is pretty silly. Like ok, I think there is the possibility that MCM and Kraska are scum pulling a gambit but that should get cleared up sooner rather than later unless he's like 1x. It could easily be a difference in playstyle but the last time I received a FN message I did

NOT

out the conf town until they got ran up b/c why? Like you advertise that X is conf town and alert the scum and any potential protective roles where to be. I just don't think her actions are as pro-town as she wants you to believe but Slings kinda fencesit here is gross.

more useless nitpicking - theyre not conftown and theres nothing wrong with sling not being 100% sure about it

calling it a fencesit is really dumb and theres no scum motive to it anyway considering it's easier to just say that theyre town - unless you think theres a reason that scum are going to keep MCM and kraska alive to push that narrative this is just shade that never amounts to anything

Nero and waffles, where are you at on Not_Mafia? Do you consider "backup" to be a viable claim to keep alive?

NM is null scum. Firstly, NM is always going to play like this or atleast that's the gist I got. I'm not really super familiar with him. When I replaced in and he was the leading wagon like it felt kinda safe and lazy. I could have easily wagoned him without drawing much attention and him tunneling me despite that kinda gives me an "I don't care who is lynched" vibe. I think that theoretically scum could claim backup and it would be a relatively safe claim and its something that could maybe work itself out down the line. Even if he is scum there's still two others.

in what world is this a scumread

"nm is null scum but he's always going to play like this" then maybe you're not reading him right?? yeesh

---

so basically

• his questions have little follow-up or bite to them - this is scummy because it means it's all just for show
  
• he backs out of his reads easily which means he's more interested in what town wants to do than actually lynching scum
  
• most of his questions are leading or misreppy and dont really have any utility in scumhunting. he's just throwing pointless shade which gives me the impression he's faking scumreads and not genuinely trying to put the pieces together

does this help hiraki

[gigabyteTroubadour]

if that's the case then i'd like nero to explain the point of most of those questions

also i have more to say 1 sec

[gigabyteTroubadour]

About Grendel, I think I would need to read more. I really hated his early game content but I didn't SR him then. His lack of motivation/time now isn't helping with my ability to obtain a read on him. As said previously, I'm pretty set on CCC and Waffles at this point and as much as I'd love to find number 3 right now, I'm pretty committed there.

ok with this - can you articulate like why your dislike of his content didnt lead to scumreading him?

like it's fine to be like "ok i have a completely different opinion than this person but that doesn't make them scum" but i'm not really seeing the town narrative for grendel's thought process and feeling this way insinuates that you at least are waffling?

also wrt to passiveness/not doing anything but being nitpicky, i think there are town ways of doing it but there's usually some discernible thought process/something that reads like gamesolving when that's the case.

sorry to use meta but like house is a player i can read well who likes to nitpick a lot as either alignment and there's a very clear town way he does it and a clear scum way he does it. when he's town, he gets aggressive and starts throwing his weight around to get people to notice whatever contradiction he sees. as scum he does it just for the sake of being "right" if that makes sense. like the difference is as town he's convinced he's right and wants others to notice, as scum he's just arguing with his "scumread"

with nero i get a similar impression, like there's a "gotcha!" kind of feel for how he deals with his scumreads but then there's little follow through to get interest in their lynches

[gigabyteTroubadour]

it doesnt

why did your read change? explain the read to us

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ok, can you be more specific on that?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

[gigabyteTroubadour]

no let's not

can you just explain your read

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i'm not really getting a vibe one way or the other from them off gut alone, can you point out something more specific in his recent posts you dislike?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I agree with kraska and that's with the knowledge that we have vastly different opinions of this game.

you mean like here?

eh... i mean he and kraska are kind of right that that set of posts didnt really help you pick out what you were seeing

with the stuff on me, I guess that makes sense? like you have a point where that "technically correct" kind of mindset usually comes from scum since it's easier to argue a perspective that you know is true and dont need to lie/misrep/show how informed you are to prove it which i kind of mentioned earlier

i guess the progression makes sense

[gigabyteTroubadour]

for me to agree though i do want more talk with hiraki

he's not a lynch for today and possibly not even tomorrow

[gigabyteTroubadour]

thats what i meant by "with me"

that i got

[gigabyteTroubadour]

all good g

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i mean yeah it's a mafia game of course reads are subjective

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hi ccc

[gigabyteTroubadour]

that's l-2 yeah?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i replaced DRK

vedith n_m

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i tunneled you in our last game and hard townread scum >_>

also ive replaced into games and done absolutely nothing before so lmfao

[gigabyteTroubadour]

via POE? i thought there was more to your read but ok

talk to me about your townreads then

[gigabyteTroubadour]

if scum had a completely null partner wouldnt they be fine bussing it since it's an infoless lynch that could be used to give them towncredit

or better yet do nothing about it and push other people as bussers

[gigabyteTroubadour]

wait why is paul a likely doc target

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i mean i was like that when i was new and early game i still read like that

own reads > others tho always

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hmm

ok

then yeah

it's probably nero+grendel+comical third option

i kind of have off vibes about vedith here (he seems more reasonable/logical than normal but i'll admit i cant read him worth shit), but it's not the psuedomasons, slingshot, or paul. cheet and ccc dont fit due to interactions too, that team probably does still go for the pr shot even if nero and grendel are likely lynches since theres a lot of lynchbait in this town

{masons}
{slingshot, paul}
{ccc, cheetory}
{vedith, hiraki, backhand}
{grendel, nero}

[gigabyteTroubadour]

what do you think of nero

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Grendel

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i read through that and i'm happy i pushed nero over you

now - you said earlier you were waffling wrt nero? what aspects of his play are town, or were you just concered about him flipping scum and making you look worse (i'd rather see nero flip scum and then you ml'd than nero avoided outright.... or your flip lowering my towncred to get nero lynched)?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

grendel if you're town i'll see through it

ive barely interacted with your slot and you had a post that was like asking drk who her scumreads-that-are-prs and you had a difficult to follow thought process

those are amendable things i think - they look scummy but i havent read the game proper and maybe look less bad when i can understand the nuance and context

point is nothing is set in stone

[gigabyteTroubadour]

largely depends on who mutton is..........

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ugh

i knew i shouldnt have left you for rb............

[gigabyteTroubadour]

well we don't know if accountant is scum and my read on that slot is largely based on nero

i would rather figure that out first - see how nero reacts to my case vs him, etc

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Never been lynched D1 Grendel. Got lynched D2 in my only completed game

he meant slingshot lol

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ok

grendel can be town

once nero posts a retort and hiraki gets back to me i think we should end the day before we get souped up in apathy again since i dont really see a direction we go in other than a nero lynch

[gigabyteTroubadour]

how is kraska being an idiot

[gigabyteTroubadour]

his questions have little follow-up or bite to them - this is scummy because it means it's all just for show
he backs out of his reads easily which means he's more interested in what town wants to do than actually lynching scum
most of his questions are leading or misreppy and dont really have any utility in scumhunting. he's just throwing pointless shade which gives me the impression he's faking scumreads and not genuinely trying to put the pieces together

not trying for bonus points

[gigabyteTroubadour]

mentally drained - will respond to stuff hopefully tomorrow morning

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Replacing out is null, replacing out under pressure is kinda scummy. I thought it was odd that MCM was town reading the replacement for replacing out.

All this "nitpicky" and "loaded" is just maniplutive word salad.

no - it's not. i literally explained what that meant in the sentence before it

your question is - "so you're townreading him for replacing out"... when the statement you're asking about is already in the question. by a "nitpick" i'm saying that it's a trifling detail that notsure replaced out. the real meat of the read as mcm says is in the

how

your question completely ignores that and asks something already answered. that's ignoring the meat of a read and undermining it, not trying to get an explanation.

means nothing.

lazily pushing on a tell is scummy because it gives you an excuse to not look into motivation

that

absolutely means something

Just look at 856,927. I'm still scumreading his slot. There wasn't support for his lynch. I could be right, I could be wrong. If I'm wrong then me just continuing to hollar that he's scum from the rooftops does nothing but distraction from lynching scum. Even if he was scum there were still two others so yeah. If you want to callit LAMIST fine but it was the pro-town thing to do also I unvote my scumreads like all the time so?

how does this make sense...........

the person who was getting wagonned at this time was n_m - your scumreads were gamma, waffles, pp, and backhand iirc. how would you asserting your opinion that waffles is scum here distract from scum getting lynched when you don't even think scum is getting wagonned? like you would have a point if gamma was the main wagon at the time and you voted gamma instead of unvoting, but you vote gamma like a day later.

the more salient point there too is why didnt you return

when

you pointed out things you found scummy in, say, 856, that weren't amished's tell.

How 'bout when I fucking vote him?

when you vote him you only mention his replace out

re-iso'd you again and this resurfaces though....... for you to call it nai

I didn't "need" too. I'm just saying it reinforced my own read.

this is like maybe the only retort you've said that makes sense but i really dont think your own gamma scumread was addressed that strongly in thread

Backhand had been snarking at the sidelines without engaging me for awhile. That's not townie. I ask ppl why they are scumreading me all the time. Why is that such a strange question to ask someone that was scum reading me/doing the leg work to try and get heat on me slot?

uhhh there's a lot more to that interaction than you just asking why someone's scumreading you, just the way you went about it feels off. plus backhand could have been trying to sort grendel with that line of questioning, i dont think your snipe really helps you figure that out

How is it misreppy when that's you know...what actully happened? Its me thinking outloud.

please tell me how, then, that thought was meant to piece together if theyre bussing or not

ummm...I've argued at least twice about not lynching NM. Like NM being a useless not entity and lurking through the game is a real possibilit I think and its in no way scuumy for me to keep that in the back of my mind. Why are you so bullish on NM slot being town?

first of all how am i bullish on nm's slot being town? i called vedith odd already and my townread of that slot has always been weak

but i dont understand the thought process where you say you scumread n_m but give reasoning that makes it seem like a non-committal and nonexistent read.

anyway, nero, what's your read on me? you obviously dislike my push but is it bad in a scummy way to you? why or why not

oh look, I'm everyone's top scumread now, besides maybe Hiraki and Cheet. Like that should be a huge neon sign that I'm a mislynch.

i dont think a scumteam with you tries to save you ever lmfao

anyway cheetory and hiraki are next, wanted to address my scumread first

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i) Lack of follow-ups to questions isn't a good scumtell and there are other reasons that could apply besides just asking questions for the sake of looking like you're asking questions. I would need examples where you feel like he doesn't have bite where you feel like townNero would otherwise.

ii) I feel like dropping reads is easier for town to do than scum? Do you have experience with the opposite? Because I feel like as scum, I generally just hold onto my reads because I'm scared that switching easily is something that I won't be able to do convincingly vs just doubling down on what reads I do have.

iii) Nero throws a lot of shade as town. I also think it makes sense for someone uninvested who isn't as overly concerned with how he appears to push angles that aren't thought through.

i) as a tell it's bad yeah but most static "tells" are kind of crap. the important thing is to look at the hows. anyway... for examples of what i mean in a condensed way

• 601 (mostly the second one - the answer to the question is in what he's quoting anyway and he's clearly missing the meat of the read)
  
• 1129 second example of a question he asks where the answer is in front of him and deconstructs the purpose of whoever he's asking's original thoughts
  
• 1197 i guess has "bite" but it's not the kind of bite you would see from someone gamesolving or who noticed something scummy. it's leading slingshot into saying something he clearly doesnt believe in

like all three of these questions have a leading premise (601 watering down mcm's read, 1129 adding his own reasoning to kraska's scumread when she already explained it as something else) and already have an answer in front of them. a question with "bite" would be something that throws scum off their trajectory if that makes sense, i guess. a question with an obvious answer or obviously misleads the person being questioned doesn't really do that, it's just an annoyance. and both of those qualities dont strike me as what i'd see from someone trying to solve the game since theyre not constructive.

ii) i think this is more of a personality tell - like i can tell you'd be the kind of scum more likely to tunnel because you'd be more self-conscious of how people perceive you in general (i'm kind of the same way). i'm sure nero has some degree of self-consciousness since we're all human but i dont get as strong of a vibe from him in that regard. like the way he backed off just looked awkward in of itself, where we would probably avoid doing that because of its repercussions while nero sees it as the right move to do as either alignment. it'd be scummy no matter who did it but nero decided to post it is my point though.

iii) it's not the shade that's scummy, it's how it's thrown. i still dont really understand how, say, the questions i pointed out above give any sort of insight to the game besides making slots (most of which are flipped town anyway) "look" worse. like i've seen nero be snarky and throw shade at his scumreads, but he was doing something with it. it just feels half-hearted here since he's not really pointing at scummy behavior but things that are "wrong".

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Question for you then - do you think the nature of this wagon being formed has scum on it or a bunch of VIs? Regardless of your personal opinions, there are some terrible votes here.

i feel like with how town has been playing there's kind of a subconscious need for some sort of leader figure to get everyone together

like... d1 ended in a deadline scramble. there was no sense of unity or leadership in town.

when i generally replace into a game as town i try to figure out what town needs me to do since i'm generally a flexible person who's good at understanding what people want. sometimes they want someone who's calm and willing to sheep town. sometimes they need a kick in the nuts and a good screaming to do something. sometimes they need someone nurturing who's going to point out what town is doing right and encourage everyone not to give up.

the second option was probably the best here since i had a read i was confident in and felt my slot was relatively townie anyway (and thus in a position to towntell).

the wagon as it is has 3 slots i basically know for a fact are town (me, kraska, and mcm). slingshot i had a theory on that's probably wrong but i dont think he's scum anyway, ccc strikes me as newbtown. so like... with that construction i'm not anticipating fantastic votes. the point is though that town is starting to find a center of focus in the nero wagon - maybe ccc is scum on the wagon, maybe waffles is, but there's now some unity. i think scum either are hanging back hoping that paranoia sets in from a "bus" (unlikely to actually work) or trying to figure out how to adjust to town cohesion. the latter can still be the case if nero is town or if ccc/waffles are scum, since voting nero is certainly a way to react to that.

does this make sense...? like i think it's just people finding a sheepable voice now

---

yeah, i'm totally picking up the same vibes from grendel but i think from his last few posts we're going to see a more transparent grendel which should make his trajectory a lot clearer and easier to read.

sorry, this interaction kind of wound up being outdated - i see what you mean though

---

I have no clue what you're trying to say here as much as that you think that it's easier for scum to not lie rather than to lie. I don't get how you could effectively use this as a way to find scum when it's also an effective way to find town.

I hate that my top SR is just gonna get a pass for "bad play" by multiple players and votes Nero. That's just fine.

this is another thing i can really just say "it's in the way it's done"

like... town wants to find scum - scum will want to simulate that, and one way to do that is to argue with people over details that ultimately arent relevant. i think that's what slingshot was seeing there and i can understand the thought process but i dont exactly agree with it being scummy in this instance.

like atm i want to secure a nero lynch before i sort most of the other slots because i think the gamestate will click once he flips scum and it'll be easier to sort people that way

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ccc plays like a newb and does in all of his games - he's getting passed for one because he is.....

the wagon speed can mean anything imo, it could be stalling because scum dont want to bus or counterwagon, it could be because if they're on it.

The way he was insinsting that he was still "technically" correct and because of that I was scum seemed kinda eh. He did kind of the same thing with you but it was a bit different.

^ hiraki that's literally what he said here, so yes that's honestly what he's thinking

[gigabyteTroubadour]

still townreading the wagon comp here

[gigabyteTroubadour]

yeah probably, that's who i want tomorrow regardless of flip

[gigabyteTroubadour]

then do something town

who is scum? why?

what do you think of nero?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

yeah we gucci - completely understand

just so far though i dont have a great impression of your engagement but if you do more and i townread then cool

lmao i barely can play when im at work i dont get how yall do it

im mostly here during bathroom breaks or days off lol

[gigabyteTroubadour]

that kill and nero's self hammer strongly implies that the wagon was all town sans nero imo

unless that was a vig kill lol

the first thing i want to look at today is the day 1 wagons now that we have a scumflip

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also fwiw i thought slingshot softed tracker really hard which is why i townread him >_>

[gigabyteTroubadour]

unless that was a vig kill lol

dont claim this if it's a vig kill btw

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i was going to say "bad read" and then vote you as a joke but does that mean you're claiming mutton visited you?

would like verification

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i see little reason for you to scumclaim tbh so i'm taking that as a conftown claim until mutton says otherwise

Vote Count 1.17

kraska77

(5): CCC,

SlingshotWaffles

,

Nero Cain

,

MuttonChopMagic, PenguinPower

Nero Cain

(4):

kraska77

, Not_Mafia,

Cheetory6

, Backhand
CCC (2): Hiraki, NotTheRealPaul
Backhand (1): Grendel

Not Voting (1): DeathRowKitty


With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
Deadline is on Friday, June 16th at 5:00 PM PST, in (expired on 2017-06-16 20:00:00).

Vote Count 1.18

kraska77

(6): CCC,

SlingshotWaffles, MuttonChopMagic, PenguinPower

, Hiraki, NotTheRealPaul

PenguinPower

(4):

Cheetory6

, Backhand,

Nero Cain

, DeathRowKitty

Nero Cain

(2):

kraska77

, Not_Mafia
Backhand (1): Grendel

Not Voting (0): Nobody


With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
Deadline is on Friday, June 16th at 5:00 PM PST, in (expired on 2017-06-16 20:00:00).

Vote Count 1.19 (FINAL)

PenguinPower

(7):

Cheetory6

, Backhand,

Nero Cain

, DeathRowKitty, CCC, Not_Mafia,

kraska77

kraska77

(5):

SlingshotWaffles, MuttonChopMagic, PenguinPower

, Hiraki, NotTheRealPaul
Backhand (1): Grendel

Not Voting (0): Not a single person


With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.

grendel this is a really bad look for you especially if you were around during the deadline scramble days :/

i think i want to lynch between the penguin voters and grednel today as a result

there could be one scum in {hiraki, ntrp} (theyre not both scum ever i think) but unflipped slots moving from kraska and penguin makes me think that if there's two scum on the mislynch it's between them - no one during that gamestate cared who got lynched so there's almost zero point for scum to stay parked on kraska if momentum was moving to penguin

really this just makes me want vedith more today - backhand/nero interactions are probably the only plausible distancing interactions from memory and I like CCC still. backhand makes less sense as scum though from where in the wagon he is

VOTE: vedith

i remember n_m having a weird progression on nero too and vedith's interactions upon replacing in feel really strangely coordinated/coherent for vedith.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

of course i dont want to lynch someone entirely based off of vca so if you think hiraki or ntrp is scum that's fine and i'd be fine wagonning there with a strong case - just think this is good support for a vedith lynch today

I mean, Mutton has said he was 1-shot loyal.
Doesn't mean anything at this point unless he underclaimed.

did he claim that after kraska outted her result fully or before?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

actually let me just read it

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh........

yeah that can definitely be a gambit

<:/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

kraska is still 100% town though if she's not conftown

[gigabyteTroubadour]

can believe that if grendel and hiraki towntell

[gigabyteTroubadour]

yeah i need to chew on it too more

i think hiraki's change of read on nero made some degree of sense wrt timing but like

it's also a necessary call if he's scum with nero (especially if CCC is town which would be the case with a scum hiraki) since that means that a fucking stronk townbloc is running up nero and if he defended it too hard it could look contrived at that point

zzzzzzz

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i kind of feel like hiraki or grendel would have been better investigations then unless you were deliberately aiming for town you didn't think would get nightkilled :/

mostly because grendel <3 but still lol

actually had a second look at the playerlist and ok i'm still nullreading way too many people

ccc and paul are now my only unconfirmed townreads

[gigabyteTroubadour]

idk i kind of felt that nero's gamma vote cleared cheet :/

anyway i almost forgot

@mod kraska's still on v/la, she should be back in a week at the most (she said 5-7 days yesterday)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I remembered to send my action this time! Yaya!!!

Didnt get much though. I didnt realize how little info my role actually gets :/

Gonna reread the mini vedith case since I just skimmed it first time

lol???

anyway uh it's not really a case

basically i dont see why scum would stall on kraska or a vanity wagon since the net gain of voting kraska is the same as voting penguin and they benefit from getting a deadline lynch. n_m is the scummiest slot that moved votes

im fine giving vedith space i guess to be useful though \_O_/

UNVOTE:

[gigabyteTroubadour]

vedith! vedith! vedith!

who's the scum mvp?

vedith! vedith! vedith!






i would have thought of smth more creative but it's midnight lol

[gigabyteTroubadour]

you hear that fucker backhand?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

im teasing but ok

[gigabyteTroubadour]

vedith dont ever toy with my heart like that ever again

VOTE: vedith

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also just fyi 2-shot loyal friendly neighbor seems really weird in this setup when there's other pr claims

we've had games that were just 3 masons from the start and no other prs

[gigabyteTroubadour]

why backhand?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

like that's a reasonable teamread from your pov but how did you work it out

[gigabyteTroubadour]

how did you find the scumteam?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Interactions / VC / Logical reasoning

I think we're going to want a

teensy

bit more detail here.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

vedith can still be town but wrong but we have enough mislynches to work through it

[gigabyteTroubadour]

godfather isnt normal and is highly unlikely (like .0001% chance) to be in play

i want to avoid setup spec at the moment but i see it as really unlikely that theres a backup pr :/

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I think that my tr on Giga might be misplaced, some things I noticed that bothered me yesterday/today. Some scum bussing scum rhetoric that I noticed.

I should be back later tonight to talk about it.

considering you saw my scumsweep in TaD i'd like to hear where this is coming from

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hiraki i strongly disagree that CCC's posting wrt vedith is scum indicative but i'd rather have him explain his thoughts

[gigabyteTroubadour]

explain the thought process that lead you to your rainbow reads

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Interactions / VC / Logical reasoning

what were the interactions

what did the votecounts tell you

what is your logical reasoning

[gigabyteTroubadour]

RAINBOW READS!!

kraska77

MuttonChopMagic

Cheetory6

CCC

gigabyteTroubadour

NotTheRealPaul

Grendel

Backhand

Hiraki

Okay guys...Here it is!
And before scum say that Implosion told me who scum are, no... I worked it out by myself.

Also, I'm a PR. A backup \o/

So, you can all start chanting my name now. I solved the game.

VOTE: Hiraki

bold me the interactions here

italicize the votecounts here

underline the logical reasoning here

pls + ty

[gigabyteTroubadour]

you can do it at a pc

[gigabyteTroubadour]

it's like 5:00 am there and he probably has work

give him time

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Yup!

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I would try to compel myself to push waffles though

but nero would be bussed at some point

[gigabyteTroubadour]

because i can fish out his claim if right

he'd basically be the atrus in that he seemed pr-y but wasnt this game except he can get lynched

[gigabyteTroubadour]

basically i vanity tunneled him and gave weak cases on him until town consensus happened because i thought he was a pr

[gigabyteTroubadour]

no one suspected atrus and my case was called bs several times

[gigabyteTroubadour]

house was the only person who took it seriously >_>

[gigabyteTroubadour]

getting to this in a bit

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ok i keep getting sidetracked to hell and back but i'm getting to this at some point. preliminary thoughts so i'm not just prodging:

grendel's push on me isnt scum motivated necessarily, it is something he will eventually have to do as scum but it's a legitimate thought he would have as town. i think nero's responses to me (and his selfhammer) though should be telling enough that he's wrong. i have yet to look at how he's reevaluated if at all

i think vedith's bullheadedness is scummy here and i would expect him to maybe be more suspicious of me as town but his case might be town (has vedith put in that much effort into a game as scum?). will have to comb through it closely

hiraki...... i will feel horrible about if he's town (same with grendel but i'm more confident he's town here) but poe is making me like him less

i really don't see ccc's play as scum motivated, just bad and irrationally rational if that makes sense. he only deserves a second look if hiraki is town, i think kraska's point with Accountant complaining about VI's is salient here and makes them unlikely partners

backhand fits the bill of someone distancing from nero but that also means he's likely to be town too - i also dont think i've read any of his posts until i joined the game so??

this is a fuckton of waffling but this is specifically how i'm waffling atm. will see if new posts affect any of these thoughts.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Apologies for not addressing you directly in these Giga, I was typing it up while you weren't around.

oh look, I'm everyone's top scumread now, besides maybe Hiraki and Cheet. Like that should be a huge neon sign that I'm a mislynch.

i dont think a scumteam with you tries to save you ever lmfao

anyway cheetory and hiraki are next, wanted to address my scumread first

still townreading the wagon comp here

that kill and nero's self hammer strongly implies that the wagon was all town sans nero imo

unless that was a vig kill lol

the first thing i want to look at today is the day 1 wagons now that we have a scumflip

Saying things like, “Scum team is never saving you”, while coming into today with the thought that Nero’s wagon had no scum on it does not add up. The first thought is a clear implication that scum _would_ in fact bus Nero, yet Giga keeps finding reasons that Nero wouldn't be bussed in this game. It registers as an excuse to lynch people off the wagon.

Which, is classic trade mark of bussing scum maximizing on newly nested opportunities. In a SWOT analisis, scum are always classify post filp associative as prime pickings. That is also where their reads begin, premature to a flip, tying their buddy to town long before a flip happens.

grendel can you tell me why you're not voting nero

Example A would be me.

Also I think the rhetoric around the all clean wagon on Nero could be easily changed depending whether or not I/Hiraki/Back/Vedith were on it. Overall looking planned vs developed when town usually doesn't play that strategically. Planned being a strategic mindset, while development falls between tactics and strategy.

this point i think would be more salient if i committed to pushing you despite your future play

i don't really have a narrative after nero's flip. i dropped you being his partner really quickly because i actually interacted with you in the thread.

i still think CCC is town. paul is an obvtownpr. everyone else on the wagon is conftown from my point of view. you're right in that if you, hiraki, backhand, or vedith were on the wagon i would be a lot more hesitant calling it all town.

but think about it - a scumteam with nero on it really has no reason to bus when this is a natural thought process that plays out. this is what i meant at daystart about how the slingshot kill makes CCC very likely town. it's meant to bring about paranoia because of how off it is. paranoia is the

last

thing i want while i'm trying to reap towncred as scum. and if you're scum you already know that "giga bussed" is a narrative that needs to be spun.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ftr I’ve never seen “blatant” role fishing come from scum. I’ve only seen it from town that didn’t think things through before posting. It’s a legit awful reason to scum read somebody, and comes super close to, “If they’re not scum their terribad town”.

Do me a flavor, Can you think of any games where scum blatantly role fished?

first i just want to make it clear that i think this is the town way grendel discusses this scumread

anyway

i mean i guess not? i dont think i've dealt with a rolefish before in my mafia career besides slingshot (though i thought he was a tracker) but the way you did it felt like you were missing the point of kitty's reads and felt detached.

I didn't understand how you could think my push was in its entirety bad when Death row Kitty was giving me nothing to work with interaction wise. I didn't look back at the slot until D2 becuase their slot was super null express.

I was still scum reading Back hand. I cloudn’t think of how to articulate why due to one of the biggests reasons I thought he could be scum being a ethically grey thing that could be inappropriate to pick at. I wanted to make a case that was sans that, but never got around to it.

hmmm

ok i get this.

though i did think your drk push was bad because i thought the way she reacted to your "rolefish" was super obviously town (even before replacing in).

[gigabyteTroubadour]

havent read vedith's case yet but how do the confs feel about vedith/backhand over vedith/hiraki

i dont think i'm not lynching vedith today just for the sake of clarity and because his role doesnt make sense in the setup so far but the question is which of {ccc, hiraki, backhand, grendel} is his partner.

i'm pretty firm atm that grendel and ccc are town. i dont think hiraki's interactions with vedith right after his case though feel like scumVscum

[gigabyteTroubadour]

like grendel's defeatist attitude is sitting well with me here and is exactly how i would expect him specifically as town to feel here

ccc doesnt make sense with the gamestate as scum.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hiraki i think you missed that cheetory is confirmed town

from your pov i should be in his place. (and you forgot vedith)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

why are you sure that vedith's town?

like why would this setup have a backup when there's already a realistic possibility town has a 3 person masonry

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Giga don't you think this is town vedith?

he's unreadable for me too

idk

is he willing to put this much effort into a scumgame? town i can believe i guess

but what is he a backup of and why

grendel i still think is town too?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hey i just realized

this is mini normal 1917

☭

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh

UNVOTE:

hang on.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

vedith, are you positive that claiming what you back up is absolutely damaging to town?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Code: Select all

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=68345&user_select[]=28162

cheet i'm double checking but the way he evaluates games feels like a carbon copy to this game from what i recall.

he's a very peculiar player which i think makes his thought process difficult to understand but it... fits in its own world.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I don't get this setup. As in, my role confirms a townie twice while ALSO confirming myself unlike cop
as we see now, I got outed day 2 and we /still/ have virtually confirmed town (short of a 4 person scum mini there's no scenario where were scum bop)
that itself is tremendous town power. if scum shot waffles and not a vig then I don't think there's any world that was optimal cause
now there's 3 ics and a free mislynch is dead... that's not even worth a pause
doc is on me tonight because you don't know my main but I have a near flawless late game voting record
I want vedith to claim because it's important and there are 3 more important targets regardless (3 ics tomorrow is game)
so yea, actually, everyone but doc should claim (claim vt @ doc) including the neighbour cause in the end one of us ics is gonna be the kill all the same


nobody claim until kraska and cheet respond to this
but otherwise vedith -> hiraki -> grendel -> backhand -> ccc -> ntrp claim (tsk tsk)

why am i out of this?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

cool

also i have a hunch towards your main's identity but i can wait until post game if you would prefer that.

really thought you'd be more paranoid of me though.

btw, if it wasn't clear
doc being killed wouldn't matter but them being roleblocked is what I fear

yeah i got that.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Vedith Vedith Vedith! \o/

also lol ccc

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Prevents any sort of action from happening to its target

it stops kills, investigations, other protects, roleblocks, you name it

[gigabyteTroubadour]

nope target can do whatever

[gigabyteTroubadour]

massclaim should finish before any value calls wrt claims are made

[gigabyteTroubadour]

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i cc backup vt

[gigabyteTroubadour]

paul's up now

[gigabyteTroubadour]

they shouldnt

ftr i'm pretty sure the scumteam can figure out who the rolestopper is from any vantage point of unconfirmed town (assuming it's not vedith or hiraki) but i need to double check

[gigabyteTroubadour]

@hiraki are u saying ur in a neighborhood too? I was neighbors with pp/klik the D1 lynch

Cheetory/MCM/Kraska are in a neighborhood too, IIRC.

no, Mcm just used his friendly neighbor on them

not the same thing as neighborizer

havent had the chance to work out claims in my head

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ughgeg

VOTE: grendel

ftr i dont have a good feeling about this but i dont really see a better choice with vedith's claim

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ughkjhgfvhgchf

idk

hiraki is fakeclaiming if scum mind you

scum arent going to get a backup of a role they can't inherit in my opinion - unless someone can show me a game where that happened?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

you can only inherit a role as a backup if it's the same alignment as you

i was a UB in my first non-newbie game (Open 649) and I didn't know that the normal guidelines didn't apply to opens and thought i could lynch an obvtown neighborizer to turn into a friendly neighbor

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Vedith (1): Vedith

vedith vedith vedith! \o/

town!md and scum!bumd is possible and not something that should be discounted
it is a legitimate thing that happens. gives scum an edge on guessing what town power exists while adding some confusion that's amounted

I'll reply to relevant stuff in a bit cause right now I'm taking a shit

"warning scum: there is a motion detector in the town. be

very

careful"

maybe a tracker or watcher but i dont see why it'd be useful but ok

[gigabyteTroubadour]

\_O_/

we have like 4 conftown (paul lol) and me that's already a 2/5 chance to hit scum at random

[gigabyteTroubadour]

zzz

VOTE: hiraki

and no it's not just 2280 but i really am not feeling grendel scum any more

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Giga not seeing the differences on Backhand’s posting style from 1915 to this game is also setting off a red flag.

i never read 1915 and solved that game mechanically

sorry

[gigabyteTroubadour]

grendel literally what tactical benefit did that unvote have

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Wait giga why am I conftown?

i believe your claim and your actions and dont think they come from scum

[gigabyteTroubadour]

no it's just this time i understand your mindset

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i need time to actually get my thoughts together i've been shit this day phase

[gigabyteTroubadour]

but it's normal 1917

i have standards to uphold this game

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i'm like 30% sure grendel's town here








and i've learned to never be more than 30% sure of anything

i might towncase him or something but it doesnt feel right

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Why is 1917 so important?

october revolution

wrt the rolestopper that's actually a good point but then why would scum no-kill n1 as if they were building up towncred for their role but then not actually use it in a town way in future days while they know their claim will be under scrutiny?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

oh and lemme point out the tracker soft

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Wait what happened with MCM and kraska? is MCM fruit vendor? Kraska recieved amne cops results??

What did you do last night?

VOTE: NTRP

Answer it please.

i thought this was coming from a suspicious visit result

[gigabyteTroubadour]

going to sink my teeth in here for real tomorrow i think

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Why is 1917 so important?

october revolution

wrt the rolestopper that's actually a good point but then why would scum no-kill n1 as if they were building up towncred for their role but then not actually use it in a town way in future days while they know their claim will be under scrutiny?

Do you think there is a team out of {Backhand, Not_mafia, Hiraki} that would have been negligent enough to forget to send a night kill?

Would Nero have been on top of that stuff if his teammates weren't?

(I know its a little silly, but u never kno)

No, I really don't see any combo of three forgetting to submit a nk?? lmao

thats kind of tough to do - occam says dont consider it

[gigabyteTroubadour]

by defeatest I mean that you're expecting to get lynched?

is that wrong or

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also grendel

the rolestopper was probably on paul

mutton claimed a 1 shot pr which means he has less utility over paul who more than likely from an uninformed rolestopper's pov has multiple shots

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i'm here but at my D&D session

[gigabyteTroubadour]

give me like an hour

[gigabyteTroubadour]

give me like an hour

ok im just flat out exhausted

gonna lay my head a bit but i'm not disappearing on anyone

ive been detached from this game and several of my other ongoings have ended so i dont really have an excuse now

[gigabyteTroubadour]

eugh

sorry ive been a pos today

gonna catch up in a bit i need to eat and drink water but i just got home

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i'm still kind of in head-floaty-not-quite-there skimming mode and im kind of not reading in any coherent order but

Additionally, I have a hard time understanding why scum wouldn't just buss rather than take the time to explain to me what I was missing at the end of D2. The chances of giga flipping town are near zero.

is this a typo

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i guess with grendel towning it up i'm more open to CCC!scum but let me look into grendel's hiraki/backhand case first since my initial reads with vedith's claim being a townclaim leads me to there

kraska idk if you ever got back to me but why do you seem sure that backhand is town? i cant remember any of his posts tbh but when i read nero's iso when first replacing in i saw their interactions as reasonably likely distancing

[gigabyteTroubadour]

honestly i dont know why i suddenly feel so tilted every time i open up this game

nero was obvscum but i dont really like any of the partner possibilities or i have some reason to have cold feet around their lynches

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Grendel basically articulated what I didn't really like about Backhand/Nero interactions but from backhand's pov instead in 2312

In both, though, the other is just kind of "there" as a scumread in the background. Nothing really hardpushed, not that much heart.

I didn't realize how crappy his D1 votes were though since I didn't give it too much stock since my focus has always been on grendel/hiraki wrt nero's partners.

I don't want to vote Backhand atm though unless we can be sure we can swing onto a lynch there by deadline

pedit: yeah wait hang on

[gigabyteTroubadour]

how do we feel about Backhand/CCC?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

ftr i discovered what grendel's rqs tell is and know it at least has found scum once lmao

i'm looking at how CCC treated backhand at the moment though (that bit happened to run into my isoing lol)

[gigabyteTroubadour]

how do we feel about Backhand/CCC?

general impression here so far is that they're interacting a hell of a lot more with each other than Accountant or Nero interacted with backhand

also nero had some push on CCC that i kind of didn't get the impression was distancing? 1312 feels a bit too antagonizing to ask a buddy. 1588 though gives me the opposite impression but zzzzz

accountant's stuff on CCC was kind of weird though but yeah not much interaction here either

so point is it's probably not backhand/ccc imo. way too much engagement with each other and then weird indifference to nero.

specifics to come if there's anything worth poking at but i dont see anything yet

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i know this isnt going to be taken seriously but i'd be a lot more active and useful here as scum

and more spammy probably

it's ok grendel once you see me in action more my scum and town meta will be super obvious to you

[gigabyteTroubadour]

are we in auto win with the extra ml?




hang on

[gigabyteTroubadour]

{MCM, Kraska, Cheetory, Paul} - Conftown
{Grendel, CCC} - Strong town
{Vedith} - Town
{Backhand} - Backhand


we're not unless MCM has yet another clear and one of the 4 non-clears (whoever of Grendel, CCC, Vedith, me, backhand is not investigated} is the rolestopper




i'd like to soviet hammer this dayphase though if that's OK - it's Mini Normal 1917 after all o7

pedit: yeah just explained lol

[gigabyteTroubadour]

lol literally as i was about to submit a blackout occured

which sucks because i had a long draft for another post that i was about to save that's now gone

Do you have anything on why you feel Backhand's most likely scum right now besides PoE?

shitty votes that grendel pointed out and i looked into last dayplay but other than that no

was going to do a closer read after my vla (

@Mod, ends friday. phone broke and i'm not home for very long until i have off from work

) though

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Oh, my mistake.

Ccc didn't act last night and no one died so he's cleared.

(I'm a little drunk and I've lost the bit, help)

he's not clear if there's no kill LMFAO

and i didnt receive anything, i would have outted as much from my first post.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

hey grendel did you see mcm's post

[gigabyteTroubadour]

fuck i thought i deleted that >_>

[gigabyteTroubadour]

So, should I be speaking about whether or not I got a Loyalty message from MCM last night?

yes. hard yes or no please.
same from giga and grendel mateys

this is a hard no.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

honestly i feel super tilted at backhand being town lmfao ive townread the rest of the suspects

CCC interactions feel off with both scum so i'm not sure it's the right call

my v/la is like almost over so i'll be active again tonight ^_^

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I think at this point the game can mechanically solve itself, and I'm unsure what I can bring to the table currently.

same

and im just super tilted irl too lmfao

[gigabyteTroubadour]

wait i wanted to hammer....

kraska can i?

i realized i said that ccc was probtown but mcm raised a good point that his role is basically a cop so?? i guess nurse makes some sense if we think of it as cop/doc but weaker

grendel is more likely to be town than ccc and i think the lynchpool if vediths role is townread is just us three so??

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also ccc if scum had a traitor they would be endgamed rn

[gigabyteTroubadour]

i'm hurt i didnt get to soviet hammer this game

it's fucking 1917 come on guys

[gigabyteTroubadour]

giga i have never misread to date

kraska im telling you he's not rb

rb has misread me twice i think lol

also his posting times he's in north america

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I thought Kraska was the RoleStopper XD

it was obviously cheetory lol

i figured it out like d2

everyone else did an obv vt thing

[gigabyteTroubadour]

kraska wouldnt self vote if she were the rolestopper she'd just claim