Micro 720: Pokémon episode 7 GAME OVER

[Vedith]

Never fear, Vedith is here!

I'm at games night tonight so I'll catch up tomorrow morning.

[Vedith]

I'm here

VOTE: theslimer
Tell me why I shouldn't

Beeboy is probably town. BBT, tell me otherwise.
But I think BBT is just town tunneled.

I don't really like beeboy's easy townread on Wisdom
VOTE: beeboy

Beeboy normally gives town reads on faces he knows. And normally gets pulled up for it from what I remember.

slimer is town i think
Infinity not so much

Why?

Infinity - Can we be best friends this game?

And I'm never going to pretend to read NM.

[Vedith]

I literally told you to do so actually.

And what's the difference between a tunneling town and a tunneling scum?

I know, that's why I done it.

tunnelling town are less likely to give in. tunnelling scum want to keep opportunities open. BBT isn't doing that.

[Vedith]

Java, do you actually have any others reads on the game?
Tell me why I should consider Wisdom.

[Vedith]

Hmm. I never thought of that before. But I'm still pretty tied to bbt. The closest thing to leaning scum I have so far

Okay, why?
Other than BBT is looking for reasons and possibly scum tunnelling.

Do you have any town reads?

[Vedith]

Okay, so doesn't Beeboy seem town to you then if BBT is scum? Or do you think he's bussing?

[Vedith]

Leaning. There's not enough evidence so I'm treating it as though it's isolated due to behavior. He could be bussing but until I get a stronger read, I'm just watching his interactions and such. If he turns out to be scum though I am fully in favor of a beetrap lynch

?

[Vedith]

Yes! But why do you townread beeboy?

Yay \o/ Infinity is official off limits to lynch!
Well, the wagon doesn't seem convincing, BBT's reasoning doesn't seem convincing, this looks like Beeboy's town game. As I said, it's not odd for Beeboy to town read certain faces easier than others.
Also reminds me of their opening in viewtopic.php?f=84&t=68127

[Vedith]

You could at least say what you didn't understand. And if it was all of it then what?

Words are hard!
I didn't understand the end. If BBT flips scum, you would be up for lynching Beeboy?

[Vedith]

this game does feel slow, seems everyone is being cautious and I haven't had any bonafide scumreads, just a few townreads

Okay, so why voting Beeboy?
103 suggests this is where you are leaning most as scum, why should I vote with you?

[Vedith]

it's mostly that he hasn't done anything. He wagoned java and then unvoted and gave a townread on Wisdom - which he walked back some when I pushed him on it - and that's it. I haven't seen him actively trying to sort anyone yet. I get why some people are scumreading slimer but at least slimer is actually talking to people and asking questions

I'm not scum reading Slimer, my vote is a place holder while I get a general idea of the game. I do want them to explain what he meant though, considering they were supposed to be active tonight?
Do you think Java has done more than Beeboy?

[Vedith]

I think there's scum on beeboy

Out of the people who have voted beeboy so far, who do you think is most likely to be scum?

Obviously the one I'm voting

Why's he scum?

[Vedith]

Ah, basically saying if BBT is scum then I'll see his actions on beeboy as tunneling. Otherwise unless I'm convinced that he is scum, beeboy is practically null to me. I think.

I'm still unclear. How can BBT be tunneling Beeboy, and if flipped scum, then Beeboy is only null?

[Vedith]

Do you think Java has done more than Beeboy?

I liked his 71 and his general response to the early wagon. I don't think he's done much either, but I'm not interested in pressuring/voting him instead of beeboy if that's where you're going with this question.

Why did you like 71? It looks like a standard question to me.
I'm not suggesting you vote anywhere else right now, I'm getting an understanding of your opinion, since Beeboy is your vote due to him not doing anything, I wanted to know why you weren't focused else where (even more so for the same reasons).

Why are you not interested in applying pressure on Java though?

[Vedith]

Show me.

[Vedith]

I mean show me yours and beeboys game.

[Vedith]

I can't find it. Are you an alt?

[Vedith]

Beeboy - Why GL over Wisdom?

[Vedith]

I've never played a game with Beeboy being active, or at least to a state where you notice the difference.
And the last encounter I remember I already linked.

Beeboy was town there but felt the same as here.

[Vedith]

What am I cross checking for?

[Vedith]

I'm not feeling beeboy as town here. Vedith, convince me!

Mines only guy and meta (meta to what I have), and the reasoning on Beeboy just seems pretty damn weak.

[Vedith]

No I'm saying it's gut. I'm also saying the reasoning is bad and that's why I'm not convinced.

[Vedith]

I'm still debating to join your wagon, GLs or NM.
I'm not feeling anywhere else.

Do you not like me voting Slimer?

[Vedith]

Whys he town for you?
Why should I vote Beeboy?

[Vedith]

Whys he town for you?
Why should I vote Beeboy?

[Vedith]

So you want me to lynch Beeboy on a feeling? And then you you're tired of hearing that the cases on Beeboy is weak?...
Cool

[Vedith]

What's your opinion on NM?

[Vedith]

Vedith, in my, java's, and guilty's experiences, beeboy tends to be a lot more active and energetic than this as town, and you've yet to properly address that. All you've done is given a town game of his in which he played very differently, and arguably was much more present than in this one.

Could this be a WK?

If it's WK then you believe him to be town? So why the intent?
Also, his play from our game doesn't differ much from here. So far the only reason for his lynch is because he's not posting a great deal.
Sorry but I'm not sold by that. Anything else?

[Vedith]

if its a wk shouldnt you be voting vedith?

This

[Vedith]

Where are you getting "this is a WK" from "could this be a wk?"

And youre continually avoiding the core issue that beeboy is lacking presence when he's posting in this game.

Looks to be shading while not wanting to put a vote down to me. Either I'm WK or not. But it shows you have doubt on the person you just put to L1.

I'm not avoiding it, I think it's weak reasoning.

[Vedith]

Because he's not far different in that game. The only change is how he reacts to familiar faces, like he did here.

[Vedith]

Im working out motives and reasons.
If Beeboy is town then his entire wagon isn't town. Otherwise it would have been hammered or more of a convincing reason would have been given.

Why does Beeboy have a higher chance of flipping Scum?

Do is your intent here to lynch or to get a claim? Because that's 2 different things by far.

[Vedith]

VOTE: Infinity

Yup I can do this.

[Vedith]

Well that was an easy jump off Infinity.

[Vedith]

see this is the kind of thing that looks more to me like spreading paranoia than what Infinity did

do you think Wisdom is scum with Infinity? Or do you think he's town and you're just complaining that he moved his vote back to beeboy

I think he gave in too easy. NAI.

[Vedith]

if it's NAI then why did you comment on it?

Are you against me commenting on actions I don't agree with?

[Vedith]

also my question wasn't really about what him jumping off the wagon

says

about his alignment, moreso like what's your read on Wisdom and how are you reading the situation

I'm asking you do you think Wisdom is town and you're just complaining at him, or are you calling it out because you think it could be scummy, and you're dodging

The situation is NAI. I answered that.
Wisdom moving his vote off is NAI - This means there's no scum or town motive that takes priority here imo.

Now, since you want to know my read on Wisdom. Town Wisdom would normally have called me scum, but as of recent it's shown that I don't read Wisdom too well (Wisdom can link the last game if he wants I forget which one it was) but I had him as scum from meta and was wrong.
So I'm open minded, but not decided.

[Vedith]

but as of recent it's shown that I don't read Wisdom too well

Its pretty worrying youre not calling me scum yet

Okay.

[Vedith]

Vedith I know you're still trying to figure stuff out but could I get what reads you have so far?

Java, what do you think about vedith? And did your wisdom read change?

Beeboy town. Still gut
BBT I originally thought town but I don't 're call anything he's done since I joined in
Java town - although I think his reason on Beeboy is weak his response looks very good. Not really enough to go on.
NM is more of a flip to see
You I think are Scum. Looking to prepare a mis lynch for tomorrow.
GL seem to have got defensive over you (or at least aggressive in moving away from you) but that could be because he wants Beeboy lynched and just being a pleb.
Wisdom possible Scum. I don't know, first time he hasn't Scum read me, unless he does...
Slimer gut says Scum. Not a fan of posting plus showing lack of reason for votes or just lacking general opinion.

[Vedith]

first time he hasn't Scum read me, unless he does...

what? Isnt that the other way around? And like i said, i do scumread you

Oh okay. Doesn't really change much then. You Scum read me every game.

[Vedith]

Oh Yeah?
Well tell me why I shouldn't lynch you.

[Vedith]

Infinity tries less as Scum from what I've seen and that's the only for I have with Infinity town.
He looked more focused on trying to shade me than to get Beeboy lynched and I'm not going to town read him with that.

[Vedith]

Do you want me to town case myself?

All I can say is that you're scumreading me for weak reasoning on page 15.

You Scum read Beeboy because you say his posts lack energy... or whatever the shit was.

[Vedith]

It's not impossible.

[Vedith]

Isn't Beeboy L1?

[Vedith]

Can we all just agree on NM?

[Vedith]

But you think it can be Beeboy and NM?

[Vedith]

Beeeeetle juuuuice

[Vedith]

Doesn't exactly mean he's doing it in a Scum motive.

[Vedith]

Because I don't really know where to go with the game.
I hate slow paced games and this feels like one of them.

[Vedith]

Okay, so if Beeboy is town (let's say he flips green) where's Scum?
How do you think the wagon was pushed, Scum motive or town?

[Vedith]

I'm just looking at your trail of thought.
I think Beeboy is more likely town. So what of it? You're now saying that anyone ever against a leading wagon is WK if that person flips town...

[Vedith]

Okay if that's your reasoning then we have nothing else to discuss.

[Vedith]

Nothing. You do you I'll do me.
I disagree with your reasoning... maybe I should say you know GL is town because you think he's town...
Like it makes no fucking sense.

[Vedith]

Gut.
Why is he Scum?

[Vedith]

There's a limit to how long you don't say why he's Scum.

[Vedith]

Still no reason for Beeboy as Scum?
Just relying on saying that others are right...

[Vedith]

Why would you expect me to have everything figured out when you don't yourself

Because Slimer is scum if you're not.

Although given how Wisdom is acting I'm more inclined to suspect Slimer/Wisdom rather than You/x

UNVOTE: Infinity

Wisdom, I'll ask again, why is/was Infinity scummy?

[Vedith]

where are you basing that on?

The fact I have them both as scum reads.
But I doubt Slimer would bus the way they did if scum together.

[Vedith]

because he said you might be wking beeboy yet voted him
plus other general scumminess
but sadly it might not be indicative

I mean Beeboy, not Infinity!
Why is/was Beeboy scum?

[Vedith]

So basically my current option is, vote Beeboy or risk being lynched...
And same for Beeboy apart from they haven't jumped over onto me for the easy ride.
If Beeboy was scum they would of just gone meh and put me to L1.

That should show doubt for your reads for a start.

[Vedith]

Vedith do you have any thoughts on my 336, I don't believe I ever saw you address that

I don't think much about it.
I see Beeboy adapting/changing his reads, you call it him panicking and he doesn't.
I think you're being lazy regardless of alignment.

And why should I not consider Beeboy town if I think his wagon is bad, he didn't take an opportunity to jump on mine, and apart from you no one else can answer why they think he's Scum.

At this point I'm going to be biased to town Beeboy like you're going to be biased to Scum Beeboy.
But if you think I'm also Scum then why are you trying to convince me that Beeboy is Scum rather than the other players?

Tell me your reads on all other players so far.

[Vedith]

Do you think beeboy was being honest in saying that?

Do I think he was honest in believing it? Sure.
I'm not exactly sure what your argument is here then, since I clearly misunderstood it.

if scum!beeboy
town: {BBT, Wisdom, Infinity, Java, Vedith}
possible scum: {slimer, Not_Mafia}

if town!beeboy
town: {BBT, Wisdom, Infinity}
possible scum: {Java, Vedith, Not_Mafia, slimer}

So if NM and Slimer are possible scum regardless of flip, why don't we go on Slimer?

[Vedith]

I think he is town but he is defending me really hard based on gut so I am not 100% sure.

There's a difference to defending a case on you, and wanting a case on you.
When I asked Wisdom, he replied with "Because".
The only person scum reading you with a case is GL.

I don't understand how wanting to know the reasons is WK.
By logic of lack of scum explanations for you, yes I have you as more likely town.
The fact you aren't pushing on me being lynched instead, yes I have you as more likely town.
The fact that other players are just getting away with doing fuck all while you are being voted, yes I have you as more likely town.

It's not rocket science, and I'm right here more often than not.

VOTE: Slimer
Can we just lynch this spot?

[Vedith]

VOTE: Slimer

Give out your reads please.
Right now, I see no reason why people shouldn't be voting here.

[Vedith]

I think vedith is likely scum because he's usually more obvious town to me, and because he doesn't seem to have genuine reasons for scumreading people.

When have I ever been obvious town for you where you haven't been scum?
If I recall you call me scum more than town.

[Vedith]

So you think I'm scum?

[Vedith]

Yes I'm scum with Wisdom.
Now, do you scum read me?

[Vedith]

Okay great!
Now claim since you're at L1. Visit anyone?

[Vedith]

VOTE: Wisdom

I think you're trying to distance. So okay.

[Vedith]

So you went quiet.

VOTE: Slimer

[Vedith]

I'm off to see Spidraman!

[Vedith]

Stupid questions stupid answers.

[Vedith]

Says the guy who couldn't wait 13 minutes for a reply on a forum

I was going out and you stopped replying

[Vedith]

Spridaman was good btw.

[Vedith]

Cool

[Vedith]

V/LA over the weekend! Have fun all! \o/

[Vedith]

We can either wait for the replacement, or just lynch Slimer.

[Vedith]

Game is stalling while we wait for replacement.

I'll help out

Intent to hammer Vedith.

It's not a good idea to lynch me though...
Can someone just vote Slimer. They were scum day 1, they're scum day 2.

[Vedith]

Because day 1 they weren't scum hunting, they weren't trying to progress. They had no actual reads and the only 2 people I remember them saying to lynch were GL or Infinity. GL was never going to be lynched then ends up dead.
They had no intention of participating in the game, yet were posting (empty posts).

Just voting to vote.
Tried to call say that they thought me, Wisdom and Beeboy were bad wagons (or they thought we were town) while we were the only 3 main wagons of the day. So it's just scum trying to lay low.

[Vedith]

If you are convinced he is scum, is he being bussed? Is he with wisdom? I do not believe he would be with infinity, who looks to be town.

I already said that they aren't with Infinity.
And Wisdom I don't know. He scum reads me every single game we are in.
NM could be scum, and your slot could be scum. I don't think BBT is scum though. But not a lot to go on.

Bussing at this stage when I'm at L1 is less likely (considering I was always going to be a push today). So their buddy is most likely you or Wisdom

[Vedith]

Vedith, why am I not scum?

Because from everyone else, you were looking for more from each player rather than just focus on 1 or 2 people. You chllanged nearly every player on something.
You have an easy enough reason to vote me on being consistent of me being scum/scummy to you and instead placed a vote on Slimer. If I was lynched over Slimer today, the focus would never be on you but instead Slimer, so you would have gained an additional day with less future focus than Wisdom/NM. That's why you're not scum with Slimer.
I don't feel your tone is from scum.

[Vedith]

Yeah, that's true. But I'm pretty sure you would have done it already as scum.
I'm that confident that Slimer is scum that I won't consider you scum with them.

[Vedith]

VOTE: Wisdom

Wisdom visited Steel.
I am Tracker.

[Vedith]

I also claim Officer Jenny.

[Vedith]

Also BBT night 1, no visit.

[Vedith]

GG town!

[Vedith]

Thanks for modding and thanks for the game everyone! \o/

[Vedith]

I should have just hammered vedith, such a misread onto him is rather troublesome.

If scum had left me alive it would have likely been their win for it.

We were trying to hit PRs.
I got that BBT went no where night 1, and Blackvoid wnet no where night 2.

[Vedith]

Shoulda, woulda coulda I guess

[Vedith]

We had a 2 shot Strongman in a 9p game. And a tracker with 3 roles that can be seen visiting.
This wasn't town sided imo.