Mini Normal 1931 | Endgame

[skitter30]

hi i am ausuka
ausuka was a failed experiment in which i
a) tried to post less and edited my posts heavily to achieve this
b) tried to use logic and disregard my tonereads because i wanted to play more logically/in a way that could be explained

this didn't work so well which i guess is kinda obvious in hindsight

this game probably deserves better so from now on i am acting normally

posts incoming

Huh. Would not have guessed. K, going to have to reread everything with this in mind.

[Ciara24]

@Eddie: I'm becoming a bit concerned with your posting over the last page or so. Can you please address the points I raised in 547?

@Ciara: It kinda feels like you're active lurking, tbh. Why is Eddie so high on your list? If you're good with lynching Ausuka, why are you not voting there?

@Thor: I'm starting to become a bit concerned about TB as well. I know softing PRs is a thing he does as town, but I've also read enough of his scumgames to know that he has a strong tendency to lurk as scum. And besides for his RVS banter with me, and the PR soft, he hasn't said anything all game, and certainly nothing of substance.

I still have to do the Ausuka/SD/wave thing, but I'm going back to work today. I'll try to do it after work before Shabbat, but if it doesn't happen then, it's going to have to wait until tomorrow night.

P-edit: I think he means feeling better about me means he feels better about the Ausuka lynch. But I could have read that wrong. Thor, can you elaborate?

VOTE: Ausaka

I don't feel like Eddie is scum, even though his interaction with Thor was a bit weird. I'm not great at reading players who post a lot though, especially when some of it seems like it could be jokes, so Eddie and rb fall into that bracket for me.

It's a little bit strange that you're putting Eddie/rb so high when you feel like you have difficulty reading them . . .

because in previous games I have had a tendency to scum read people who's playstyles I don't understand, and I'm actively trying to avoid that now by forcing myself to read their posts as coming from a town perspective, at least initially in the game. It's a bit of a flaw in how I scumhunt, admittedly, but I'm working on it.

[skitter30]

K, the Thor/Eddie thing is beginning to get annoying. Thor is still town, despite the lovely language and imagery he's been using. Eddie has become ???? cuz I can't figure out what he's doing. I dunno if he's just stubbornly sticking with a read despite being shown multiple times that he's misread Thor's posts because he doesn't want to back down, or if he's sticking to his guns because he thinks if he's persistent enough he'll be able to push through a mislynch, or if he's doing it for some other inscrutable reason that I just cannot fathom.

I really can't tell what's going on with him. The fact that he's ignoring my questions isn't exactly inspiring confidence in him atm, and is also making it hard for me to figure out what his intentions are.

[skitter30]

because in previous games I have had a tendency to scum read people who's playstyles I don't understand, and I'm actively trying to avoid that now by forcing myself to read their posts as coming from a town perspective, at least initially in the game. It's a bit of a flaw in how I scumhunt, admittedly, but I'm working on it.

Uh, what?

You don't understand their playstyle, so you're forcing yourself to see it from a town perspective? So you're artificially creating townreads on people because you know you have difficulty reading them? This solves the problem how exactly?

And when are you going to start actually analyzing their posts ('at least initially in the game') in order to try to sort them instead of just lumping them in your townpile?

[NotTheRealPaul]

@Ciara do u still not have a read on me and skitters? Looking back at your 560 you said you dont have reads on me, skitters, tb, and dunkers. I understand tb and dunkers as theyve made even you look super active, but skitters and I have been posting and you should have a read on us by now IMO.

[NotTheRealPaul]

btw i agree with whoever said eddie was playing with/messing with thor. That makes a whole lot of sense to me rn given what ive seen of eddie's personality.

[wavemode]

Ok well

scum winrates go up when you lynch scum day1. its for a myriad reasons we wont get into but this fact is empirically valid

so funfact: i wish to remove one of the most obstructionist players from the game in thor. his emotion could be fake or real, and ppl are getting turned off his interactions - this is a serious problem because the longer the game goes, the more difficult it will be to play with a town thor or against a thor scum.

i also think hes just scum so thats like a bonus, but i dont think day1 is best spent agonizing 5ever over trying to find a scum on the statistically most unlikely day to find one.

i think ausuka/MM4 is town as well now, so with them town and thor's weird interactions over that slot, i think thor is evenmorescum

perfect fifth/thinkbig is the other lynch ill entertain today, if not thor

This... this post is bad. Very bad.

[NotTheRealPaul]

@wavemode can u expand on that? I mean he is advicating for a ML D1 but its kinda a game theiry thing so I figured there wasnt rlly a right answer and he was more experienced than me so I left it alone. Unless ur talking about a different part of the post

[wavemode]

rb why is your personal dispute with Thor now the whole town's problem? You sound like you're calling for a policy lynch on someone who

you

picked a fight with. It wasn't the other way around. He wasn't being obstructionist at all. I mean, Thor could be scum, and you could go ahead and present evidence of that to convince us of that... but I'm failing to understand how killing town!Thor here would be beneficial to the town like you are trying to argue.

Also, he doesn't scumread Ausuka. Not sure why you're suddenly so sure she is town, but if she is, that's not a point against him. You made a very vague argument here that sounds like grasping at straws.

You've also shrunk your lynching pool to two people - literally one person who hasn't participated in the game at all and another who you've just been arguing with meaninglessly for days. Not sure how every other lynch has been suddenly ruled out in your mind but that strikes me as very strange, and your targets seem like low-hanging fruit, and in the context of your whole post that sounds like you are no longer interested in game-solving.

[rb]

i think it's beneficial to the game to kill thor whether he's town or scum

TB is very scum, no matter how you slice it

[rb]

yes i very much expected people to not understand, but i'm going to keep pushing this idea until it becomes a thing because it's empirically valid whether you like it or not. people can be flat earthers all they want, and i'll keep telling them they're wrong

for whatever reason, scum winrates go UP when you lynch scum day1. yes i have plenty of ideas why but it's much less important than the fact that towns win more often when you lynch people who're obstructionist/difficult and day1 doesn't go for an absurdly long time. town winrates go down when day1 drags on and on

why the fuck would i NOT have narrowed down my lynchpool after 26 pages?

26 pages of game isn't enough to come to a conclusion that you find 2 people to be the most scum?

~

here's the thing: thor is an excellent lynch whether he's town or scum, because there's now 3 slots who cbf even interacting with him. so we're at an impasse where we either start policy lynching 3 ppl or we policy lynch thor (who simultaneously has a high chance of flipping scum)

[rb]

and ya, i made points about why i think thor is scum - i also think ausuka(mm4) is town now, and not interested in that wagon. the slot felt very fucking awkward and misleading, but there's a perfectly fine explanation - it was an alt from someone deliberately trying to change their playstyle.

on the other hand we have literally no reason for TB to have been as inactive as he has, and when he's scum he often has periods of random inactivity that don't align with any weekends/jewish holidays

TB is scum, thor is probably scum and ausuka is town. for many, many reasons, thor is an excellent lynch today

[rb]

and ur completely misunderstanding if you think it's my personal dispute that makes me want to lynch thor rn.

[rb]

if anything, this day has actually dragged on - given how active most of the game is, it's actually interesting that we DON'T have strong wagons - so i think scum are likely splitting votes and not pushing together, and most likely won't be found on the same wagons (up to this point, now that i've said it, any further VCA's related to that aren't as relevant - but i think 26 pages of voting is enough pattern to look for scum)

[rb]

and the playstyle thor has rn is pretty much scum to the letter

he gets into a big debate not about points where he's trying to solve the game - but in an argument defending himself for 3 fucking pages of **MUH EMOTIONS** when he's at what, L-6???

THOR IS AT L-6 AND HAVING 3 PAGE LONG WALL OF TEXT ARGUMENTS WITH PEOPLE

and prior to this most of his points are just addressing minor inconsistencies with arguments e.g. "this minor point on Ausuka is wrong, but your general direction is indeed correct" - he's subtly pushing the Ausuka wagon while simultaneously distancing himself from the 'bad reasoning' - i guarantee if we lynched Ausuka and he flipped town, Thor would be wall-of-text shitting all over your minor inconsistency and trying to get you lynched tomorrow, wave. his agenda is already set from day1, his major concern is not solving the game - but in doing everything he can to make that attempts to sort HIS OWN alignment are thwarted. look where thor is concentrating his efforts, think about why he's doing this.

and then realise that even if he's town, this is a completely abysmal obstructionist playstyle that we can live without.

[Thor665]

from my skim over the last few days, I think eddie is playing you, so yeah, there was mirepresentation involved. that's my answer to question 1.
in answer to question 2: if I am correct in my thinking that it was some sort of a reaction test, I feel like it would have come from town!eddie. now I feel like it's a complete clusterfck of the highest order.

So you did read it and did draw conclusions - why did you then post what you posted about ignoring it?

nah I'm just not replying to you like I said pages ago because it's a waste of time and doesn't help game solve.

this

That would hold water with me if he wasn't still calling me scum.
He's basically admitted that he's lying about me but hasn't changed his read - and rb thinks *I'm* the toxic one (which ignores that he's being more toxic than me and apparently came in with a grudge on me from...something)
It's weird and annoying.

here's the thing: thor is an excellent lynch whether he's town or scum, because there's now 3 slots who cbf even interacting with him. so we're at an impasse where we either start policy lynching 3 ppl or we policy lynch thor (who simultaneously has a high chance of flipping scum)

You do note that one of those slots is you - who had a grudge to start with.
One is Eddie who, by HIS OWN ADMISSION. chose to pick a fight with me, lie about me, and annoy me for...reasons (and this makes *me* the problem in your mind)
And the third...who is the third?

[wavemode]

and the playstyle thor has rn is pretty much scum to the letter

he gets into a big debate not about points where he's trying to solve the game - but in an argument defending himself for 3 fucking pages of **MUH EMOTIONS** when he's at what, L-6???

THOR IS AT L-6 AND HAVING 3 PAGE LONG WALL OF TEXT ARGUMENTS WITH PEOPLE

and prior to this most of his points are just addressing minor inconsistencies with arguments e.g. "this minor point on Ausuka is wrong, but your general direction is indeed correct" - he's subtly pushing the Ausuka wagon while simultaneously distancing himself from the 'bad reasoning' - i guarantee if we lynched Ausuka and he flipped town, Thor would be wall-of-text shitting all over your minor inconsistency and trying to get you lynched tomorrow, wave. his agenda is already set from day1, his major concern is not solving the game - but in doing everything he can to make that attempts to sort HIS OWN alignment are thwarted. look where thor is concentrating his efforts, think about why he's doing this.

and then realise that even if he's town, this is a completely abysmal obstructionist playstyle that we can live without.

Again, you're using debate that you and eddie initiated as evidence of Thor being scum. That pings me bad because he could have just ignored all the things you and eddie were saying about him, and then you could just as easily call him out for dodging your accusations. You are literally forcing a catch-22 here and it's ridiculously bad play, I hope you realize that.

Pointing out some inconsistencies in an argument is also too NAI for me, sorry. You've explained why it makes sense for scum to do it but not why it is so inconceivable that town would do it. That's called a bad read.

This Thor push suddenly stinks to me. And TB is null.

I'm sticking with SD for now, in any case. I stand by that at least one of SD/Ausuka is scum, and now SD is the more likely. And I stand by my previous arguments for scum!SD. Furthermore, MM4 and SD suddenly and simultaneously flipping around on almost all of their past arguments and hard pushing on each other is making my scum senses tingle. They could be scum together and this is two-way bussing.

[NotTheRealPaul]

I agree with wavemode on the thor issue: Im more likely to want to lynch rb than thor at this point.

That said Id prefer not to lynch either because I still read both as town.

pedit: still agree with wavemode here. Really liking wavemode for town.

@wave: is us ausuka sr based on the same things sd's is? also can u refresh me on ur sd sr because if I remember it was because sd wasnt showing much desire to gamesolve but I feel she has been better recently.

[wavemode]

As I've said before, SD and Ausuka's early game was spent throwing shade at people who were low-hanging fruit rather than actually trying to question people and understand their motives. And they were actively helping each other do it. In my mind there's no reason for two random town slots to be that buddied with each other.

Possibly

one town and one scum.

Their general tone was also gut-bad for me. They tried to make things people did seem worse than they really were. In many cases they might consider something to be "weird"... but their logical jump from that to it being actually scum-indicative was always lacking.

You're right that they've both since turned around but their recent simultaneous retractions of their arguments and push on each other is not making me feel any better about them. We could be seeing the power of daychat at work. And also, just in general I don't flip around my scumreads just because the person stopped doing what I called them out as scum for doing,

after

I call them out. I mean, of course they will do that, if they are trying to be townread.

[Sunlit Diamond]

As I've said before, SD and Ausuka's early game was spent throwing shade at people who were low-hanging fruit rather than actually trying to question people and understand their motives. And they were actively helping each other do it. In my mind there's no reason for two random town slots to be that buddied with each other.

Possibly

one town and one scum.

Their general tone was also gut-bad for me. They tried to make things people did seem worse than they really were. In many cases they might consider something to be "weird"... but their logical jump from that to it being actually scum-indicative was always lacking.

You're right that they've both since turned around but their recent simultaneous retractions of their arguments and push on each other is not making me feel any better about them. We could be seeing the power of daychat at work. And also, just in general I don't flip around my scumreads just because the person stopped doing what I called them out as scum for doing,

after

I call them out. I mean, of course they will do that, if they are trying to be townread.

Excuse me.

I did absolutely nothing to "actively help" Ausuka. I agreed with her on one point, which on later inspection I realized was baseless. Ausuka, did, however, actively try to put me in the "you're my friend" area, and it doesn't feel good...specifically because I *know* I wasn't playing the game particularly well to begin with.

When I actually did an ISO and read through her stuff, there was more than enough there for me to feel comfortable voting her even without whatever that was. I will ride that vote right through a lynch, because she is scum and needs to go.

[Sunlit Diamond]

Additional quick commentary - rb and Thor are still reading TvT. There's a level of anger and tunneling going on there that COULD come from scum, but I'm not seeing it in this case. Eddie, on the other hand, feels worse with every post.

[Eddie Cane]

i feel good and u know it

[Sunlit Diamond]

Also! I based my initial read of you on a scan of your ISO that felt funky to me. You have since posted a lot, I reread the entire thread and your ISO, and my opinion changed. Why is that worth a scumread?

p-edit: that was mildly creepy eddie

[Eddie Cane]

u don't get to accuse me of feeling bad and not let me counter.

[wavemode]

Also! I based my initial read of you on a scan of your ISO that felt funky to me. You have since posted a lot, I reread the entire thread and your ISO, and my opinion changed. Why is that worth a scumread?

p-edit: that was mildly creepy eddie

How do you feel about MM4's posting being strange because he was trying a new playstyle? Does that not cause you to question your scumread on him?