Real Folk Blues Rematch [GAME OVER]

Cerberus v666 · Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:47 am

Priscilla was a bodyguard. Safe to assume she wasn't actually the target.

Cerberus v666 · Mon Jul 17, 2017 11:41 am

Thanks random. <3

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:32 am

Pretty much. Now that I've received my lie detect posts, I'm ready for the day to end. With smith lynched, preferably.

Can everyone who is voting PV other than Vedith explain their preference to me, without mentioning the commuter pattern(since that's something that I can specifically resolve using my lie detect tonight(a night where the SK shouldn't be able to kill, if the pattern is significant, so lynching groupscum is superior in the short term, in the event that I'm wrong about PV), so it shouldn't be considered as a reason to vote for PV versus groupscum candidates)?

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:47 am

In post 13093, Gorkington wrote:like even if everyone just picked one person. just one. and looked at them and made a case for whether they think that individual player is town that would make it MILES EASIER FOR ME TO SORT THINGS FOR BOTH THE PLAYER DOING THE CASE AND THE PLAYER BEING CASED.

Sorry Gork. This actually made me feel bad, but now I'm not in a position to act on how I'm feeling bad and contribute in a more constructive fashion.

I can give you some cliffs notes of my thoughts though, purely off the top of my head, lemme grab the lIving playerlist.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 6:17 am

Cerberus v666 -Me, nothing to say.
mhsmith0 - groupscum, as I've been saying, you put out your own case reiterating the stuff I'd noted, namely bad associative with scum slots, that is, an attempt to clear or otherwise save them with poor reasoning, as well as an inconsistent application of standards between whemestar and aristo.
Shiro -IC, *shrug*
Insomniacs - leaning town but very little reason for it. There's a nonzero chance they are groupscum(this is the sort of situation where I'd really need to actually put in the time to iso them), but their behavior feels like frustrated and misguided town.
Vedith - very little to say here. Recent posting felt genuine, but that's are very weak reason for any opinion
Drixx - If I weren't aware of RL stressors, and of the fact that I can't imagine Drixx being quite so passive in any anti-town role, I'd be concerned. As is, I'm content with the not groupscum conclusion, and I find it unliely he's a sk
Master Vampire - absolutely no opinions whatsoever.

Vaxkiller - probtowm, as I said before
PeregrineV - also probtown, due to previous statement combined with willingness to be lie detected etc.
Randomidget - no clue really. Some questionable weird things, the claim was shit, and the inconsistency in reasoning for suspicion on Vax and drixx(that is, completely forgetting there were perfectly good reasons to not consider either as likely groupscum, after seeming to indicate that they were aware of those reasons not long before) make me leery, but they're possibly simple mistakes? I've never seen scum!RM, so I don't know how likely he is to do those things as scum, but I can see town!RM making those mistakes.
Gorkington - if SK or groupscum, congrats on your win. Losing before lynching this, even if the moderators don't want to answer my questions about Titus' role.
Scott and Ramona - very little about them sticks in my kind as well, much like MV, but they've had more content than MV.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 6:35 am

Good luck with that Smith. Better men(and women) than you have tried. ^^ The game in my signature is the only time I haven't lived to endgame(excluding being shot), and it took an IC tunneling me for 1.5 day phases AND a fundamental misunderstanding of the vote system in the game(the hammer vote was meant to only be a l-1) for it to happen.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 7:02 am

Smith, how could you ever arrive at the conclusion that I'm obvscum? And when you say obvscum, is it sk or groupscum? Considering you've only seen me in lazy town mode, what standard do you have to apply that gives you any ability to determine if I'm playing in a scummy fashion?

The issue with the wheme v ari thing was that all you said about where was that he was "being wolfy". Wtf does that even mean, without details? I really did look at your iso multiple times to figure out where you said more about what behaviors made him wolfy, and never found any such statements. That meant the push you made against wheme was purely based on setup spec(which I discounted as crap), and his lackluster contribution, which was a trait he shared with Ari, and a trait that(barring experience with wheme to the contrary) should have been null for both at best, not town for one and scum for the other.

Pedit: you're tied with PV in the vc right now. With a slight trend against you, because people are campaigning for you over PV. If one person votes for PV, you could easily hammer him to save yourselfs. You're far from a guaranteed lynch.

Also, I just like being a cocky bastard about not getting lynched, it makes me smile.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 7:05 am

It's quite clear to anyone with respect for and experience with my town game that I'm phoning this one in. I mean, have you even glanced at any of the town games I'm well known for, and the ridiculous amount of work I put into them?

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 7:12 am

Mm, maybe I'll link some for you later, so you can have some reading in the dead thread.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:48 am

@PV Dave's protect protected against all kills.

@Drixx: what part of smith's posting convinced you, where his previous behaviors did not?

@MV: sorry man, I did put a ?, I wasn't sure if you had claimed or not, but it seems like the only unclaimed slot we have right now is Drixx, who has claimed to have taken no actions, which means there is no town tracker/watcher, OR the bebop crew has one and gork has been torturing me all this time by denying me that information.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:03 pm

Not LOTS, but yes there are a few different gating mechanisms, either day, or playercount, or scum count, or certain slots dead, but seems likely such a power is linked to a specific slot, and it is quite swing if it's linked to a single geoupscum slot, instead of the sk slot.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:13 pm

This isn't all in order, because I was halfway down the page when I control-f'd(speaking of which, that has fucking 245 results on the third page of your ISO, so yeah, that was a lot more of a pain in the ass then you kept trying to say it was).

In post 8221, mhsmith0 wrote:
In post 8211, WhemeStar wrote:lol Titus how funny would it be that your mason crew is the scum crew and it's gg for town LOL.
Were at least three day phases away from any reason to worry on it. Red dragons getting their asses kicked gives a LOT of room to not worry on that.
Ps not liking the attempt to spread paranoia on something way before it's appropriate.

Rb/wheme/?/?/? Is my headspace rn.

One thing you dislike.

In post 10452, mhsmith0 wrote:
In post 10354, WhemeStar wrote:What about smith
if PV flips scum here this just gets vigged right? Because I'm pretty sure he was throwing out a TR on me not all that long ago, and I have no clue why that's changed.

Another thing you dislike.

In post 10453, mhsmith0 wrote:
In post 8513, WhemeStar wrote:Also I'm fine with a lynch on me because I thought Smiths idea was good and if I wasn't Wen I would've agreed with it
Like, this in particular is kinda weird as the last thing he'd said about me but now he's fine with lynch me.

Wheme, you in particular I'd like to explain why I'm now scum to you. Also explanations from my voters would be appreciated. Please and thank you.

A third thing you dislike.

In post 5863, mhsmith0 wrote:
In post 5860, WhemeStar wrote:So I'm right gunsmith checking me is optimal
I wouldn't say optimal; using it on scumreads is still probably better, but it's at least a defensible thing to do.

I guess that whole bit was a bit villagery of Wheme, tho he was probably already almost always an actual miller given Yume claim.

A thing you liked(from before you decided his flavor meant he was scum).

In post 6088, mhsmith0 wrote:Also wheme probably a legit miller, so he'd be off the list.

IDK, I have more town reads than I have scum reads, which again suggests to me that scum are mainly just not doing stuff.

More indications that you thought he was town from before you decided his flavor meant he was scum.

In post 11679, mhsmith0 wrote:
Spoiler: Wheme's ISO on page 2
In post 10380, WhemeStar wrote:That's what I asked

In post 10563, WhemeStar wrote:
In post 10522, Vedith wrote:
In post 10521, Titus wrote:If PV's claim is remotely acceptable, I'll be joining you here.
Then I'll just lynch you and Gork...
What

In post 10591, WhemeStar wrote:VOTE: PV

In post 10616, WhemeStar wrote:
In post 10615, Vedith wrote:
In post 10607, Gorkington wrote:insom's probably right that ari is more likely to be scum and yes im inviting vedith to come in and say "lol told you so", but i dont really care hes still a garbage person and im glad this is probably my second last game ever so i dont have to play with toxic waste like him anymore.
You call me toxic while I kept it game related... You just constantly insulted me with everything not game related.
You need to learn what toxic really means, and you should be grateful that I'm not sinking to your level of toxic, because I truly can.

You need to learn to accept when you're wrong and I proved this by pointing out your flaw in your top Scum read.

As I said though, you do you.

I'm going to lurk mode, because you know, that's how you avoid being lynched now days rather than questioning people
Been doing it all game

In post 10671, WhemeStar wrote:Aristophanes is town

In post 10681, WhemeStar wrote:That Ari replacement was towny af

In post 10907, WhemeStar wrote:I could do Smith but not Ari

In post 10909, WhemeStar wrote:Don't think he's been on site for a while

In post 10933, WhemeStar wrote:Titus I'm confused about your Bus swap

In post 10937, WhemeStar wrote:Ok but why them

In post 10989, WhemeStar wrote:Would Ari replace out like that if he was scum

In post 11025, WhemeStar wrote:VOTE: Insomniacs

Part of me really wants this gone but part of me thinks its town and RB also thought they were town too

In post 11072, WhemeStar wrote:Why would I claim my scum flavor though

In post 11119, WhemeStar wrote:
In post 11116, mhsmith0 wrote:
In post 11113, Titus wrote:Also, buddying me would largely be ineffective. I am pretty much putting myself at the bottom of the night action pick order to lynch Math.
I'll believe that Math could be a blue traitor after we get a blue flip (Math's reluctance on Wheme, while Wheme/Gin seem happy enough to pile on Math, is reasonably in range with what at least could be a blue traitor dynamic). Wheme is probably going to be a blue flip, and is still I think the optimal lynch today.
Your so confident I'm scum it's funny lol

In post 11120, WhemeStar wrote:At the same time I feel like you know I will flip town but idk

In post 11124, WhemeStar wrote:? I'm just not sure if your push on me is town coming from the POV that all scum flavor is the same as this game as it was last game. Or if your scum trying to get towncred by pushing me

In post 11127, WhemeStar wrote:You can argue that it was a good wagon and a good reason for voting me (which I think it is a good reason)

Also if I was scum I would of defended Jjh a lot more

In post 11129, WhemeStar wrote:Is randommidget confirmed town cause I think he's scum

In post 11132, WhemeStar wrote:Nah I'm making it to end game

In post 11186, WhemeStar wrote:Like I still don't understand why I would vote Jjh like I did if I was scum

In post 11194, WhemeStar wrote:
In post 11192, mhsmith0 wrote:
In post 11186, WhemeStar wrote:Like I still don't understand why I would vote Jjh like I did if I was scum
Find me three legitimately interesting or solvey things you've done this game. You have >200 posts and they basically all look like boring slop.
They are boring slop. I've never really gotten into this game

Now tell me why your bringing up something else than what I am talking about

In post 11231, WhemeStar wrote:I am not fine with that

In post 11234, WhemeStar wrote:Okay

In post 11235, WhemeStar wrote:Also I think the major reason I've been doing nothing is multiball messes with my head

In post 11246, WhemeStar wrote:
In post 11239, Master Vampire wrote:
In post 11235, WhemeStar wrote:Also I think the major reason I've been doing nothing is multiball messes with my head
good thing its not multiball then
But people are saying it is

In post 11411, WhemeStar wrote:Hey math I'm not certain scum

In post 11412, WhemeStar wrote:Literally the case on me is that my flavor is the same as scums was last game

In post 11415, WhemeStar wrote:Uhm I forgot why I town read Tywin

I voted him cause I thought there was a guilty on him?

In post 11419, WhemeStar wrote:
In post 11416, Cerberus v666 wrote:Whene, you didn't do what I said.

Go read the quotes I pulled from your iso. When your read on someone changes, please explain why.

Hint: you pushed Tywin as scum long before there was a guilty. Some nice town points you just pissed away with that answer.
I did? I forgot lol

In post 11420, WhemeStar wrote:
In post 11417, Insomniacs wrote:
In post 11412, WhemeStar wrote:Literally the case on me is that my flavor is the same as scums was last game
Case on you is you are miller and you've been doing jack crap all game.

Literally the flavor is irrelevant to the case.

--Math
The flavor is how the case started

In post 11421, WhemeStar wrote:So cerb, you want me to go through that Wall of quotes of yours. And explain to you why my reads changed from person to person?

In post 11463, WhemeStar wrote:Why do you guys want to lynch Smith

In post 11621, WhemeStar wrote:I want to

This is "healthy and scumhunting"??? HOW??? The closest thing to anything substantive is when he stated a TR on Ari due to "town replace-out", and the rest of that set is unending crap. And, for someone who wants to "work together", you seem completely uninuterested in that one bit of content he DID have (since you seem to want Ari dead, but not to talk to him about Ari). Why is THAT?

A fourth thing you disliked about Wheme.

So, I went through the ISO from the time you started attacking wheme(not too long after the posts above where you decided he was town, then you went and found the flavor from the previous game and decided he was scum and stuck to it for quite some time), and I never, in all of that, saw any substantive reasoning used for WHY those actions are scummy. You never defined what, in those four posts, made you certain he was scum, as opposed to any sort of bad town. You just kept saying he was wolfy, and spent a shitload of time contending that his ISO was empty, that he was the mechanically optimal lynch, and speculating about his partners. None of what you said represented a substantive case. You went so far as to say you had constructed a "substantive behavioral case" on him, but you did no such thing.

So yeah. I did what you wanted. Still no fucking sign that your push on him was anything other than setup spec combined with his empty iso, particularly since you were confident he was town prior to his exact flavor claim/your search for the previous games setup.

Now, there is also a shitload of head butting between yourself and ginngie, which kinda counterbalances the aristo stuff, but to be fair I don't really know either of your scum styles well enough to know if, in the position your team was in, you would so blatantly go at one another. It's a decent maneuver for getting the other partner through the end game, especially when neither of your actively the most suspected people in the game, so it's something that everyone is going to pick up on when they bother looking at ISO's, but maybe he was legitimately trying to get you lynched?

Of course, on the other hand, if you and Ginngie were teammates, the way he was attacking you made his pressure on you CONTINGENT on a bluescum wheme flip, which...as teammates...you would know wasn't going to happen. So I guess that's pretty much moot.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:20 pm

Vedith's ISO is pretty empty. Why isn't he scum Smith? Hell, why wasn't he scum earlier, to be more exact?

So yeah, i read through all of Vedith's ISO, the only substantive things within it was his attack on PV, and his defense of Ari, which he claims wasn't an actual defense of Ari, but was instead an attack on the fact that the case on ari was really shitty.

So yeah, Vedith I guess could be scum, but has less evidence against than them Smith, but they've also done far less. % of ISO wise, they've probably spent equal amounts of time defending scum. :-/

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:22 pm

Drixx, can i get some realtime conversation going on with you in the game? You know my RL schedule, I'll be up for the next few hours, and I'll be checking this game out. i'd like to just assume you're town and pretend we're a hydra and divvy up this isoing and bullshit like we'd do in a hydra, then we can get back together and talk about it.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:26 pm

I'm like, super driven right now. I wish I wasn't going on vacation tomorrow, or else I'd guarantee you if I can get Drixx communicating with me we'd solve the fuck out of this game by the end of this day phase. Though the first day I'm on vacation my host is going to be at work, so I'm going to just be chilling at their house for a few hours and maybe that could work. Drixx? Maybe we assign analysis duties today, and get back together on thursday when I'm just chilling at my homies and we do the realtime discussion thing and share our notes etc?

Gork/Shiro are also invited to join in, but I'm specifically calling out Drixx because I know we work together quite well, and that he'll put in the work and generate content in a fashion that is easy for me to parse.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:31 pm

Drixx:

mhsmith0 - Most notably, double check me on the bias here, I've been focusing on him for awhile, so it's possible(though unlikely) that I've lost focus of the big picture
Vedith(it's pretty short and empty, but yeah, lemme know if anything jumps out at you)
Master Vampire

Cerb:
Insomniacs
Scott and Ramona

Second tier priorities, we should both read here if we get done with the other stuff

PeregrineV
Randomidget

Sound good?

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:35 pm

In post 13199, Insomniacs wrote:
In post 13198, Cerberus v666 wrote:Drixx:

mhsmith0 - Most notably, double check me on the bias here, I've been focusing on him for awhile, so it's possible(though unlikely) that I've lost focus of the big picture
Vedith(it's pretty short and empty, but yeah, lemme know if anything jumps out at you)
Master Vampire

Cerb:
Insomniacs
Scott and Ramona

Second tier priorities, we should both read here if we get done with the other stuff

PeregrineV
Randomidget

Sound good?
What am I looking at?

-Narna

In post 13197, Cerberus v666 wrote:I'm like, super driven right now. I wish I wasn't going on vacation tomorrow, or else I'd guarantee you if I can get Drixx communicating with me we'd solve the fuck out of this game by the end of this day phase. Though the first day I'm on vacation my host is going to be at work, so I'm going to just be chilling at their house for a few hours and maybe that could work
. Drixx? Maybe we assign analysis duties today, and get back together on thursday when I'm just chilling at my homies and we do the realtime discussion thing and share our notes etc?

Gork/Shiro are also invited to join in, but I'm specifically calling out Drixx because I know we work together quite well, and that he'll put in the work and generate content in a fashion that is easy for me to parse.

Me trying to drag drixx into playing the game with me, and also attempting to increase my own level of involvement by changing the dynamic.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:41 pm

Yes, I saw those other posts, but I didn't include them because none of the posts I ignored amounted to anything other than you restating that wheme's ISO was empty, or you having an issue with some defense someone made of wheme...but none of it was you actually EXPRESSING A CASE ON THE SLOT, OR EXPLAINING WHY THE BEHAVIORS WERE INDICATIVE OF SCUM.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:49 pm

I mean, compare what you were saying about wheme to what's being said about you:

Wheme did these things that I don't like, but I won't tell you why I think those are actions likely to come from scum.

VS.

mhsmith did this, and this, and this, and each of these actions had a directly beneficial effect upon a flipped scum slot.

The first is just bullshit and noise and confirmation bias driven by your setup speculation(and yes, that's EXACTLY what it fucking was, just look at how you found the previous games listing of scum slots, saw wheme's role claim on that list, and tunneled him from that point forward), while the second is something far closer to an actual case for scum beneficial behavior.

pedit: No...what you said did not, at any point, express how those behaviors were scum indicative. Did you even read the posts you quoted? Or are you suggesting that someone else in your ISO you expressed those points?

@Insomniacs: Drixx isn't the SK. Highly improbable. I don't know the experience either of you have with Drixx, but he is absolutely driven as scum. This bullshit nothing guaranteed to be lynched in a 3p lylo playstyle is not something he would do as a SK. Seriously. He's a conniving motherfucker. How does Drixx!SK convert this game state into an actual win? The ONLY shot he could have had would be with a dayvig to skip over actual lylo straight to a win, but given that we have already seen a functional dayvig that almost certainly came from the SK, and it wouldn't have saved him in LYLO, I can't buy that line as probable.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:53 pm

Smith: So I reread what you just quoted, AGAIN, and all I came up with out of it was that you believed he expressed a wishy-washy read, one which could be easily retracted.

Which is basically the same fucking thing as saying that his iso is empty and lacking in substance...

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:02 pm

Also, @smith:

search.php?author_id=26111&sr=topics

These are my hydra games with Drixx. If you want to actually see me trying. There's also the rather substantial Bloodborne game where I hydra'd with Elbirn, but that's not in there, but just another example of town me actually giving a fuck.

I'd recommend you take a look at SU, Space Dandy II, and the hydra PT's we have(mainly the hydra PT), if you want to have some idea of what me trying actually looks like. You can of course also look at our scum games together, but those aren't really relevant since the discussion is about what behaviors people expect from a fully engaged me.

I can find a couple other hydra games with people too if you'd like. There are also other games in there where we were town, but those two we were around until endgame, and they were large themes as well, rather than being smaller games.

pedit: 11095, 11122, response to 4548, 4550 (claiming an SR/push on a flipped scum when he actually hadn't done shit on that front), 5950, 11025, and my 11543 (a BEHAVIORAL interpretation of his ACTIONS in the context of his CLAIM to be a differently functioning Miller, which is different than just setup spec)

How hard is it to add that fucking post tag man, I have literally zero desire to search through the f ucking game for those post numbers when you didn't bother adding that tag. *sigh*

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:28 pm

So, lets break this down.

11095: That's fucking empty as fuck? "Does this read like a town vote to you?" Okay, yeah, no. If you want me to view that as substantive, you follow that shit up with: No, it's not a town vote, because x y fucking z.
11122: ??? How is that a scum tell? How is it more likely to be something coming from scum playing poorly, rather than town who simply doesn't know your alignment, and is therefore looking at your posts through the perspective that it could be x if you're scum, or y if you're town?
Response to 4548: ...Again, you're simply saying that his reads aren't substantive. Again. (For the record, i don't understand why you keep bringing up this quote wall like it was somehow some amazing indictment of him, when the OBJECTIVE of the post was for you to discredit my defense of his contributions to the game, NOT to actually express why you thought he was scum)
4550: True, that was weird. You almost get credit for this, except for the part where you miss that Nero was shot before Wheme even entered the game...which means wheme COULDN'T have attempted to push the slot. Yes, this makes the read etc weird for DIFFERENT reasons, but what you're saying here? It's all bullshit.
5950: Again, not actually AI in any way? "Townread with no drive behind it" Yeah no. That is definitely not reason to scumread someone, at all. More noise.
11025: Same with this. He votes Insomniacs, and is sheeping dead flipped town. Okay? Again, how is this scum? You call it another hedgy vote, so...okay. Again, you are, without actually saying it, simply saying that he wasn't actually committing to his reads. Alright, fair enough. Now you just needed to put your big boy pants on, and look at the slots he's hedging on, and figure out if it makes more sense for scum!wheme to be hedging on these slots, to figure out how it benefited him. In your universe, where you had all these associatives built up, you started assuming he was hedging on these people because they were his teammates, but there wa nearly no actual scum indicative behavior you pointed out. There were preflip associatives, AT BEST.

I mean, i guess I should have probably shoved this garbage case attempt down your throat back when you were pushing it, but I just wasn't feeling the game enough at the time. Sorry for making you wait.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:32 pm

In post 13212, mhsmith0 wrote:And so you're left with a case that boils down to "smith was WRONG and therefore scum", which is inherently lazy reasoning, which ought to be obvious on the surface. No real attempt to evaluate the totality of my ISO, or connections with all the scum, etc. just lazy reasoning that has become popular for whatever reason, probably because it's an easy vote to make.

Ps The random quote from like day two you pulled was an especially cheap shot btw, which I rightfully called put, but it seems like you'd missed that point in yiur response?

It's not that you were wrong. That doesn't matter. Again, it's the inconsistency man. When you apply the same standard to different slots, who do not share an alignment, and you end up with differing results, it's questionable. Had you flipped the things around, and defended wheme, and attacked ari, for the lack of content, then I'd be townreading the fuck out of you. However, you did the opposite, and thus I'm scumreading you.

And sure, I haven't evaluated your connections with ALL of the scum because the scum I HAVE looked at reflect poorly on you. If Drixx gets back to me and we do this proper ISOing thing then he'll get around to it, and I'll trust his judgment on the matter. Also, which random quote are you referring to? I pulled out a couple, but they're still relevant. You said it, own up to the shit you said and the positions you held.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:37 pm

So, eh, SlySly you were suspicious of D1, but were also quite willing to hop off his wagon.
A50 you expressed a bit of suspicion of.
Aristophanes and Tywin you defended.
Ginngie you were suspicious of IF wheme flipped bluescum.

Overall, looking at all the scum slots flipped so far, it still doesn't reflect well on you.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:40 pm

OH, and a quote note: It's just as ridiculous to think that putting the post numbers of posts within a ridiculous mess of nested quotes is somehow going to make it easier to actually navigate said mess.

pedit: Yeah, that's what I thought you were referencing. I fail to see what issue you have with it. Maybe if you stopped being shit and actually used your words to express the thoughts you have on the quotes you keep throwing out there?

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:51 pm

In post 13222, mhsmith0 wrote:
In post 13218, Cerberus v666 wrote:Ginngie you were suspicious of IF wheme flipped bluescum.
FYI I also expressed suspicion of ginngie's weird hop onto wheme which was essentially an unexpressed "I don't want to lynch ari" thing relatively late in the day.

I'm pretty sure I'd also cited stuff that was supcious of her not that wasn't fully dependent on a wheme flip, but yeah I expressed it mainly in the context of blue!wheme because that's what it looked like was happening. I can probably pull stuff if you really care I guess.

The point here is that both you and ginngie had scumreads on one another that were contingent upon something which you, if teammates, would know wasn't going to happen. I'd need to look back at those posts to see your later suspicion, I was mainly looking for the whemerelated stuff, and didn't spend TOO MUCH time on the scum slot stuff.

pedit: I suppose I just don't see how those quotes actually make me look bad, even with lazy analysis. *shrug* So, your point was kinda meaningless to me.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 19, 2017 2:55 am

@Drixx: When you the split I suggested is still viable, though well have to move our meeting of minds to a point in the next day phase. Small though nonzero chance I die( particularly if PV, random, or yourself are the SK), but it's still worth it to do these iso dives.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 19, 2017 4:41 am

UNVOTE: (this isn't because I'm convinced by smith's irritation, but because there's conversation happening and a nonzero chance that wasn't actually the lynch,but I think it was. )

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 19, 2017 4:56 am

In post 13312, PeregrineV wrote:
In post 13311, Cerberus v666 wrote:UNVOTE: (this isn't because I'm convinced by smith's irritation, but because there's conversation happening and a nonzero chance that wasn't actually the lynch,but I think it was. )
I checked and it's 7 votes. The fact smith is still bothering to talk means he's probably town.

Yeah, too bad. I guess the sheep random and make his pushes for him experiment is over if smith flips town.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 19, 2017 5:18 am

In post 13315, mhsmith0 wrote:
In post 13314, Cerberus v666 wrote:Yeah, too bad. I guess the sheep random and make his pushes for him experiment is over if smith flips town.
Saying what I actually think of this probably gets me banned. So I won't. Instead you guys can just IMAGINE my rant here instead.

You're welcome to pm me your rant at some point, I might find entertaining.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:11 am

In post 13317, Gorkington wrote:instead of discussing things can i crawl into a hole and stay there until the game is over?

Yo gork, it's cool man. Objectively speaking, plenty of cause to zero in on smith as scum.

Pedit: ya know smith, everything you're saying now, you should have said earlier, instead of wasting your time not having an actual scumspect today, and focusing wholly on attacking one tiny part of the reasons why people were pushing you. You never gave anyone any reason to think you were town, never pointed out behaviors yourself that made you unlikely to be scum...you just circled the wagons with regards regards to one part of the attack on you

So, yeah, pretty piss poor defense of yourself, so you can't really escape some degree of blame for letting yourself get lynched. *shrug*

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:26 am

Odd cycle vig idea was more reasonable before the kill on cirno, now that we have that a singular set of group scum seems unlikely since they would have used it earlier if possible.

Pedit; yes, sure, you said that at the end of the day, after wasting a shitload of effort into other pursuits that involved directly opposing me and just ended up making you look worse. For what it's worth, after reading that I was going to read through some other interactions in more depth today, but I wasn't expecting you to end up hammered in that short time frame.

Point being, had you bothered saying those things earlier instead of trying to defend your indefensible inconsistency, things would have went a lot better for you.

Just some advice from someone who is very good at not getting lynched.

Peditx2: I've never claimed to not be an asshole at mafia.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:51 am

Eh, yes, but not for the reason you stated, not directly. It wasn't the wheme thing so much as the way you handled your defense of it.

Also, yeah, about 80% of my refusal to move elsewhere was just to test the random thing, I said I was gonna do it and I did!

Plus there wasn't compelling evidence being presented that you were town or someone else was scum, therefore all options were equivalent with regards to PoE effect, so might as well do what I said I was going to do. ^^

And yes, last night was the first time I actually put any effort into investigating things, which is why I actually looked at other stuff. :p again though, wasn't compelling, the vedith ISO was me wanting to find a reason to think he was more likely scum than you, and it simply didn't exist. :/

Do you think Vax( or members of groupscum) have the planning and foresight to waste a kill on a free mislynch to buy Vax the town cred needed to get him to endgame?

Pedit: I'm not talking about shooting gamma, I mean that day kill, if part of groupscum, would have been better used on the gunsmith, much earlier. And I'm at work(which is where I've been most of the time when I've been posting), which limits my ability to efficient look back on the game, so my responses are all very topical and off the top of my head.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:09 am

No idea why red scum would shoot at Socrates, definitely not a reasonable nk(like ari isn't able reasonable sk kill)

Note the ninja, if we have no tracker, doesnt add to scum power.

Also note the multiplying effect if a "masonry" of mostly PRs, including two investigatives.

Also, how does Shiro get saved last night and cirno get day killed? SK had a day kill that didn't cost them their nk?

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:15 am

It's the middle of the workday in North America. That's part of the problem I expect.

We should know which of the options we have going on after tonight, unless another kill gets stopped somehow.

The double sk thing isn't impossible by any means. The concern I have is with their lie detect claims they made. We should have made them more ironclad I guess, to account for that possibility..:/

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:07 pm

So that's really tucking irritating, the first time that I get a useful result, I catch random lying, and he gets fucking shot.

Your work vax?

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:10 pm

Also, there's apparently a poisoner as well? We still have two fucking scum around.

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:17 pm

I'm kinda over this right now, unless the poisoner is groupscum, because we're looking at friggin 11 scum if not.

...

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:19 pm

And not really insomniacs, because why the fuck didn't groupscum kill the doctor, or the gunsmith, WAY earlier, using the poison kills? We also haven't seen any antitown flip with multiple kill flavors. Not guaranteed it doesn't exist, but it seems imprudent to assume less scum rather than more.

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:20 pm

Is that really what you want to waste your time on Insomniacs? You believe bitching about that will somehow be productive?

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:23 pm

Anyways, I'm on an actual like real shit vacation until Tuesday night. Do me a favor and don't lynch anything until then.

Drixx, we need your explicit claim. You're the only one left. You claimed no actions yesterday, but that doesn't mean you don't have a passive.

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:27 pm

His action and role claim, where he said he took no action D5 and N5 and was an odd night commuter. It came back false, and I would have had the pleasure of lynching my homie except someone ruined it. :p

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:28 pm

In post 13405, Insomniacs wrote:Eh, our slot is not taken seriously. I'm just posting for the sake of it. What statement did you check from RM?

Who are you suspicious of right now? You mentioned me yesterday, and that's all I know.

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:43 pm

In post 13408, Insomniacs wrote:You still sticking by even night commuter?

Who are you talking to?

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:53 pm

@Vedith: No, there's some reasonable symmetry with an even night poisoner and odd night sk. Note that the sk had to choose between killing or commuting.

PV has a decent chance of being the poisoner, and simply chose to commute most nights, except when the vig was clearly suspicious of and willing to shoot at him.

Cerberus v666 · Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:59 pm

So, insomniacs, Vedith, MV, or S&R. PV poisoner. One of those first four is the last groupscum. (Drixx isn't on the lost because of the gunsmith clear, and Vax isn't because he has(I assume) made two scum shots hit the wrong person)

IF PV is the poisoner, we remove him, and he killed last night, I expect we'll be going into the night with 7 a alive, no gork, and 3 improbable to be groupscum slots, with 4 suspects. One of us gets shot tonight(probably vax), and we go into tomorrow with 6 alive, 2 gunsmith clears and 4 VT claims. So, in our best case scenario, we have two lynches to use, assuming the PV anti-town thing is accurate.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 6:57 am

To what exactly? There's nothing to react to.

You're also confusing poison for the bioterror kills. We've had one apparent poison kill, cirno, on D7(thus targeted during N6).

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 7:08 am

You should also probably consider that constant commuting(assuming this speculation is correct) makes little to no sense for poisoner ANYONE except one of the lurky, low content slots, without a gunsmith clear on them.

If PV isn't the poisoner, MV or Vedith probably are, with S&R as possible but less likely.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 7:19 am

You don't understand what I'm saying Insomniacs.

People with a gunsmith clear on them are less likely to be targeted for further investigation (such area the watcher/tracker we've had cause to believe exists since Slyslys flip). People who are are low content and lurky are more likely to be shot by the vig. Therefore, the people most likely to choose to commute constantly instead of killing constantly as a 3p poisoner are those who are low content, lurky, and without a gunsmith clear. Basically, those I listed. Everybody else I expect to use their kill every time it's possible.

And dunno, I told you who the pool is. Once I'm back from vacation I'm going to do proper ISO work on those four slots and find who the scum is.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 7:25 am

Honestly though, PV absolutely makes the most sense, because ever since N2 when be commuted to avoid being shot he's been somewhat boxed in, because he had to claim his commute, and was STILL suspected in spite of it, so he had to keep commuting lest someone attempt to verify his commute claim.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 8:01 am

S&R, I don't understand your lack of concern. 9 alive, 2 anti-town roles alive, with 4 lynches to use total. That's not exactly the best of situations. If PV is the poisoner and we immediately catch him, and he targeted gork last night so we don't have another death, thus costing us a lynch, things are okay. If PV is town, then we're in a REALLY bad spot.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 8:21 am

In post 13474, Nosferatu wrote:if poison happens the previous night, isn't it highly likely poison will kill at the end of the day?

Yes. Luckily, the highest priority scum kill, gork, was busdrove, but if the poisoner chose to kill elsewhere, I would expect Vaxkiller to die when the lynch hits.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 9:39 am

Oh, also, completely unrelated: @Randomidget: Does this game mean that if we don't have the chance to be in a hood together/we're not in a hood together early, it means we don't share an alignment? :p

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 11:36 am

Mmm gork how confident are you on vedith scum? As yesterday, it still makes the most sense of go after probgroupscum rather than 3p, especially if we don't think they'll be able to kill tonight...but confirming the removal of the poisoner and reducing the paranoia about drixx, myself, and insomniacs, would be quite helpful.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 2:08 pm

In post 13526, Vedith wrote:Then stop acting like you have it all solved.
I've seen so many games where town are too confident and lose.
And no I don't care about me. I am going to be the lynch, but you are pushing Scott over Nos already. That's what I don't like.

Everyone was listening to Titus, not you.
2 lynches were listened to with you. Ginngie and msh. If you think that's a good record, then you do you.

Again. This is not about lynching me. I'm not even sure how I'm still alive. Msh had so much more than me in this game, and that Was poor lynching.
My issue is you not listing about Nos. Why is this slot ever town after I flip?

I might just sound harsh, and you probably have more thinking on your reads than you are projecting... but from where I'm sitting, you are piling too many mis lynches, and if PV doesn't flip poisoned I doubt town win 100%

@Drixx: are you, once again, considering me as possible gunsmith immune groupscum?

Regarding your rather inane question, yes, there is almost certainly a groupscum left alive because someone died to "shot" flavor last night.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 5:55 pm

Not sure why that post was quoted.

Also, Drixx, there were three people who I made evident my desire to lie detect.

You chose to make a statement so far beyond what I specifically asked for that it could have been considered AI since there was probably only one group scum on one of the nights, therefore claiming you did not take an action on that night(a night when a scum kill attempt clearly happened), was AI.(I specifically asked FB whether or not claiming no actions ever would be AI, and the above are the circumstances under which he said he would consider it AI.) So, you weren't a option.

PV's statements did nothing to deal with the situation where he and random were partners, because everything he said could have been true, and a lynch on one of them would have still been required to figure it out.

Random had the same problems as PV, except his statement allowed me to both check his role claim and his action claim with one statement, so, I went with that one.

What part about that seems "coincidental"? How would scum!me be able to predict that kill or the truth or not of randoms(or your, since you would have gladly lied to catch me if I were scum making up my results) statement?

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 5:57 pm

In post 13555, Drixx wrote:No Cerb. You're the 3rd party self aligned poisoner who is giving out as much truth as you can and trying to lead the town.

Cool. How does a universe exist where I only kill once this game?

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 23, 2017 6:17 pm

And why do I kill cirno of all people, for my entry to the game. Basically no chance he shoots at me anytime soon....free kills for me when we're getting to the part of the game where speeding things up is acceptable, especially when I'm not even in the PoE pool for groupscum.

Man. I could go on and on, really. *shrug*

Cerberus v666 · Mon Jul 24, 2017 3:53 am

In post 13567, Vaxkiller wrote:I'm sorry cerb, your ability is like so shady.

*shrug* this is your fault. If you hadn't got random killed last night we'd be wagoning him right now and everybody would stop doubting my lie detect! :p

Cerberus v666 · Mon Jul 24, 2017 3:59 am

Also, to whoever suggested random knew who the poisoned was because of the phrase "named poisoner", that verbiage is just as likely to simply be a way of referring to the fact that a poisoner is known to him, so I'm not too sure of that possibility.

Cerberus v666 · Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:07 am

In post 13570, Gorkington wrote:considering they both knew that killing each other would give each other a bonus, i imagine giving the player name of the opposing role would be kind of dumb.

Didn't even consider that fact, but yeah, that too.

Cerberus v666 · Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:28 am

@Gork: if we arrive at a 3p lylo with both vax and yourself alive, do you ever vote for vax?

Cerberus v666 · Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:27 am

Not me gork.

My thought right now is that if PV is the sk, we have 2 gunsmith clears in drixx and myself, a mason in you, and vax who is unlikely to be scum. If we can use a rolestop/bus drive to keep you and vax safe for one more night, forcing scum to kill a suboptimal option, we can guarantee a 3p lylo with at least two "not groupscum" alive. That led me to the consideration that what if vax IS the last groupscum, and setting himself up to make sure he can win a 3p lylo with you and ANYONE else alive. I was just trying to figure out if we can guarantee a win if we hit the sk today and force suboptimal kills, and dunno if that's doable because of the chance vax is playing that long game. I think we PROBABLY just win outright, but I'm curious about what happens if that unlikely scenario happens(because it's only likely if vax is groupscum, and he probably isn't).

Cerberus v666 · Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:01 pm

I'll be back late tomorrow night, but not able to put anytime into analysis until the next evening. If you guys want to you can hammer etc I guess, I just wanted to see if I could get drixx to work with me to find the last groupscum, assuming pv flips poisoner.

Cerberus v666 · Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:14 am

Honestly, I don't really want to go down this rabbit hole, doubts like this are easy ways for us to lose. I just wanted to make sure Gork was aware and not taking things for granted.

Best shelved until closer to endgame.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:39 am

Yeah. Everyone's coming up on their prods in the next 12 hours or so, so people might have things to say, but it'll take me a couple nights total to get all the work I want to do done, and I'll be starting I'm 5-6 hours.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:44 am

And obviously I can do that work over the night phase, but that means the people I'd want to discuss it with(namely, gork) could very well be dead by the time I can post it.

Or I could be dead, but that seems improbable.

Pedit: I wanted to go through the isos of the possible groupscum and analyze relationships with flipped groupscum. Then MAYBE go through flipped groupscum and check their posts for their positions and read progessions on the still living suspects.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:44 am

Basically do the work I wanted to split up with Drixx all myself. :p

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:58 am

Insomniacs, S&R, MV, and Vedith. Those are the slots I wanted to go through.

Vedith+S&R OR Insomniacs, for you, and I'll do MV+the one you don't pick.

Mainly wanted Drixx working with me since we've spent do much time hydraing together and it makes it easy for us to pick out things the other overlooks, but I have no problem working with you. ^^ 3 hours until I'm off, another hour until I get home, and then I'll start working on whoever.

Secondary work after that's done will be going through all the actual flipped scum, but let's save that and prioritize them based on the results of this.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:10 am

Just isodiving, main points for me at least are inconsistent progressions, whether on town or scum, doing stuff like pushing a goon when a scum PR was threatened, softballing pushes on scuma, failure to follow up on stuff, etc. Those are the specific things I'm looking for...and the goal is to go in unbiased and come out with a read that has evidence based on day play.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 10:47 am

In post 13616, Insomniacs wrote:So you back from vacation Cerb?

--Math

Super busy with work expect limited posts.

Ya, first day back, at work now, but I'll be actively involved in the game in a couple hours.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:01 pm

Taking a nap(only had 4 hours or sleep after my flight landed last night(, but I will handle MV at least tonight, and likely deal with whoever of S&R or Insomniacs that Gork doesn't take, to get this over with and let us end the day with some discussion having taken place.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:41 pm

In post 13614, Cerberus v666 wrote:Insomniacs, S&R, MV, and Vedith. Those are the slots I wanted to go through.

Vedith+S&R OR Insomniacs, for you, and I'll do MV+the one you don't pick.

Mainly wanted Drixx working with me since we've spent do much time hydraing together and it makes it easy for us to pick out things the other overlooks, but I have no problem working with you. ^^ 3 hours until I'm off, another hour until I get home, and then I'll start working on whoever.

Secondary work after that's done will be going through all the actual flipped scum, but let's save that and prioritize them based on the results of this.

Gork.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:28 pm

335 nero scum thoughts, without support, then...
1650 obliquely defends tywin, and questions the sly wagon
2208 questions why people are hopping off slysly?
2219 down to ambivalent about nero(again without cause)
Nero gets shot.

OKay, so that whole progression above is weird as fuck and I sincerely don't know how the fuck to interpret it. It looks like a bunch of defense of scum slots, but then changes to concerns about the scum wagon falling apart. Like, that feels like a super town reaction there, since his pet push(gamma) was picking up steam and the wagon he was against was losing it, so it makes sense to question wtf is happening there. If that was all there was, those posts would be strong town points in his favor, but then there's also the weak ass "this scum slot made a post that I kinda think is scummy but idk why but now suddenly I no longer have an opinion on them and was ignoring them".

The Tywin+Sly defense in the same post also feels weird to me. Not scum weird, but "why would scum make a post just to defend two of their teammates at the same time and not do anything else" weird. Feels like a really bad move if you end up dead early, with those instant associatives.

After the shot, he's third on the slysly wagon. He obviously couldn't have gone back to gamma, but again, weird as fuck choice to immediately go after his ninja right after his godfather got shot.

2963: Supports lynches on *TWO* scum slots...ones who he had semi-defended earlier...

Fuck this is a mess.
5648: Not too fond of giving Ram town points and not unvoting. Three days out from deadline kinda mitigates the concern a bit, but mmm.
6603: unnecessary defense of a potential mislynch in JJ. mmm.

Didn't vote to lynch Tywin, and didn't actually speak on Tywin at all during the time he was being wagoned. That's really weird.

6979: Starts off with yet another vote on scum.(before the guilty is announced)

Okay, done for the night I think. First of three pages done(reading MV+FB+FA to have all the VC's come up so I can somewhat track the game state relative to his posts). I didn't actually manage to fall asleep, just spent a bunch of time in bed trying to sleep and failing so I'm still not thihking especially clearly.

There was a decent bit of content between 2219 and 5648, but I don't think it amounted to all that much. I'll reread that piece of his iso when I wake up/tomorrow night, and continue on.

Overall, at this stage, I'd have to say I'm overall leaning pretty strongly towards MV being town though, from the first three days of play.

Key points: expressed suspicion on both Tywin and Slysly, but actually supported the slysly wagon. If you're going to bus, bus the goon. It's possible he felt that slysly was simply a lost cause, and tywin was well positioned, but the whole thing really strikes me as very weird for scum. Hell, if you're going to bus, fucking set it up so at least one of the two slots is a counterwagon to the other, so that way people who do vca and shit will give a buncha credit to the unlynched slot. Basically, don't see why he'd start the push on slysly over Tywin. He culd have always gone to slysly at some point, but no attempt was made to strengthen that push. The early vote on A50 kinda speaks well for him too, but it would mean a lot more if he had actually done some more casing. He does, when people ask him, actually spit out perfectly reasonable reasons, so it's still pretty good overall though.

The main negatives of his early play are the D1 associatives with Nero and Tywin. I don't think they're strong enough to outweigh my other points though.

Regarding Vedith: I had actually completely forgotten that Vedith was Chara originally. I didn't have any strong feelings about the slot, but mmm there's a lot more Vedith slot content to look at than I had thought. I might have to look at that again(I gave you vedith because I have already looked at the just vedith slot myself).

Cerberus v666 · Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:11 pm

In post 13631, Nosferatu wrote:i actually had zero reason to have any thoughts on nero

i cant even bullshit them

It's just quite weird for you to specifically point out a post of his as scummy, but then...ya know...go completely neutral. It makes that read feel really manufactured, like you forgot you made a point of noting that when it came up later on. It was like 2k posts later. I'm sure you probably did actually completely forget, simply because so much time had passed etc...which is the reason why I'm not actually considering that point as a particularly strong one against you.

Cerberus v666 · Thu Jul 27, 2017 3:21 am

In post 13634, Drixx wrote:I know that it's just going to get brushed off again, but I'm becoming more paranoid of Cerb by the page. He tried to rope me into tag teaming with him, and if I were to fall into our usual rhythm of working together then I would be far less likely to scrutinize him. We know there's a poisoner. They are presumably a self-aligned individual. What would that person be best served by doing right now?

Holy shot Drixx.
I would just friggin kill you man. For the same reason we were going to kill Mastin in SU2 had the game not jumped to lylo a phase early...scum!me can't trust that you wouldn't rather lynch me than risk losing to me, so even if I had a slight edge versus the other scumspect, it wouldn't be enough.

@vax: He tries. :p it's not impossible this apathy is a deliberate play on my knowledge of him, but I think it's more likely real. He didn't get caught up to the game until after all the interesting things had happened, and now he's trapped in it because of his refusal to replace out of a game simple because he doesn't really care how it goes.

Cerberus v666 · Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:30 am

Eh, SF was different. That wasn't about you perceiving me positively, it was about your desire to view third parties positively. That was the bias I used, not anything about me personally. In this game the third parties are clearly antitown, given than a protown one has already left the game, so it's not a gambit I could utilize.

I'm also inclined to believe my assertion is closer to the truth than you might be conscious of. You did make a point earlier this game of calling my win in SF as something I've rubbed in your face. With that perspective, it's hard to think a desire to prevent that, specifically, from happening again doesn't exist.

What are your thoughts on what Gork and I had to say recently about Nosferatu(MV) and Vedith(NC)?

Cerberus v666 · Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:34 am

(Also, please reply to my earlier point asking you why poisoner!cerb doesn't kill anyone until cirno, and why I PICK cirno when he's not looking at me, and also let me know why he wouldn't be trying hard to swing the focus onto groupscum suspects for today's lynch rather than PV.)

Cerberus v666 · Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:12 am

In post 13643, Drixx wrote:
In post 13642, Cerberus v666 wrote:(Also, please reply to my earlier point asking you why poisoner!cerb doesn't kill anyone until cirno, and why I PICK cirno when he's not looking at me, and also let me know why he wouldn't be trying hard to swing the focus onto groupscum suspects for today's lynch rather than PV.)
It doesn't need replying to. We were scum in SU2 together and what % of our kill attempts actually worked? How many day phases into the game did it take until a night kill of our choosing actually died in the morning? It's a closed setup and you could easily have poisoned people who got lynched or people who got saved (or some combination of both).

Or you could have withheld it just to make the argument you are now.

Except you have to consider that we already have AT LEAST one missing kill unaccounted for, possibly two, because Dave couldn't kill all that much. You also have to consider that, assuming my role is the mirror of randoms, that there are two other anti town kill sources, and would be targeting appropriately. There are two missing poison kills, putting us up to 3 or 4 missing kills, and some of them happened on nights where we already know where the protected resources were allocated. And none of that, including the (more probable) option of me withholding the kill, accounts for WHY CIRNO IS DEAD WHEN HE GETS ME TO LYLO A DAY SOONER.

Idk, maybe I'm overestimating the respect you should be giving my target selection in this environment, but I don't believe I'd have failed this often as scum poisoner, or bothered with the lie detect claim unless completely kill proof(in which case killing cirno makes even less sense).

Are you going to respond to the part where I asked you to contribute in a more significant fashion that just sparring with me?

Cerberus v666 · Fri Jul 28, 2017 12:33 pm

@Gork: thanks for the confirmation of what I was sure you were saying earlier, glad I don't have ro deal with that paranoia.

@Drixx: there are four slots I want your thoughts on man, I don't give a fuck which one you put time into anymore because I've already started putting time into them myself.

Insomniacs or S&R are the priorities to save one of gork/myself time, which we can use to double check the others work.

Cerberus v666 · Fri Jul 28, 2017 12:47 pm

Vedith, you saw the way I looked at things. Look at my nos post, and/or the content I based it on, and tell me, in a reasoned fashion, why your view is correct.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:10 pm

I don't see why you'd hammer just a few hours before 4 people who have been noncommunicative get prodded.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:12 pm

I'm still waiting for Drixx to read and respond to what Gork and I had to say about Nos and Vedith, not to mention the fact that the *only* protown reason to hammer at this moment would be to keep apathy from increasing...unfortunately, that's not a concern, because it's basically already at maximum level.

No benefit, only downside.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 30, 2017 2:22 pm

Insomniacs, it really doesn't matter if scum know where gork and Drixx(and myself and vax) all are. If PV is the poisoner, they have a series of really shitty shots to make while hoping they don't shoot themselves. If he's not, we're in a really bad spot regardless.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 30, 2017 2:26 pm

And gork, just to clarify, you were assuming PV flips as the poisoner, meaning the gunsmith clears, in order to be antitown, would need to be another member of the scum team that's immune to the gunsmith, NOT expressing certain knowledge that Drixx is town?

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 30, 2017 2:36 pm

In post 13717, Gorkington wrote:no i have extra information that makes it almost impossible for drixx to be the poisoner.

Got it.

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 30, 2017 2:38 pm

Indeed.

If people hammer before we finish the entirety of what we were supposed to do, does that mean we both get to call one another lazy etc?

Cerberus v666 · Sun Jul 30, 2017 4:10 pm

@Gork: he has a tendency to overly focus on correcting what he believes to be incorrect statements about himself. Usually there's also gameplay surrounding those posts, so they don't stick out as much.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:48 pm

For the record, I have high expectations from NCs scum game but I don't think I've actually seen it? Maybe I have I'd need to check to be sure.

But yeah based on NC stuff the slot is probtown. S&R+Insomniacs is currently my pool.

Out atm, I'll talk more when I get home.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:03 pm

I don't believe there's anything I could check that would actually give a functional guilty result at this point.

The scum pool is: Vedith, MV, S&R, and Insomniacs.

We have three lynches.

That means the game isn't over.

I also wouldn't rely on gork surviving to share any results his NA could generate to simplify things for us.

Same with me.

Honestly, we just need to decide on one person out of those four who we all agree is town, and lynch through the rest. If we're wrong, we lose, move on.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:32 pm

In post 13830, Gorkington wrote:would checking whether someone acted last night count as a guilty?
we dont technically know how many scum there are left so.

Dude I couldn't tell you. Practically speaking, if I checked someone's action claim for last night and it turns out they are lying, we'll treat it as a guilty right? So, it would be functionally AI, but TECHNICALLY it's not, because we don't KNOW how many scum are left.

Given the answers I've been getting for my questions though, I'm pretty sure it'd be decided to be AI. I'll PM FB though to ask.

The Socrates crumbing thing could be. Could also be insomniacs!scum reaching, but reaching for THAT lynch in particular is a little weird when there's opposition(of significance, in the formorning of Gork and myself) to Vedith and Nos lynches. Could be a plan to get S&R mislynched today, and NK Vedith and Nos' respective champions(gork and myself) to make it easier to get them lynched each day.

Basicallu, really need to finish my homework.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:46 pm

All I know is I asked if Drixx's statement that he has taken no actions this game would be considered AI, and I was informed it would be considered so IF there was no possibility that someone else could have performed the NK on any of those nights.

So, if we're in a situation where there's almost certainly only one scum left...any claim of inactivity would be considered AI, based on that logic.

As I said, I'll ask when I get home.

To answer your question though, I'm probably supposed to punish people making crazy gambits, or prs who fake claim vanilla. Idk. Shit role.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:06 pm

Oh. Welp. Go us?

Again, when I'm home I'll have more to say.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:15 pm

In post 13902, Firebringer wrote:
In post 13894, MathBlade wrote:Titus was a loyal neighborizer. Not a masonizer.

A mason by definition requires the members to know the neighborizer is Town. Might as well have IC'd 1/4 of the town and started off with them talking.
I stated the masonizer doesn't work like a normal masonizer and works more like a neighborizer at least twice now.

So I don't get why you are repeating this like third time.

The role works how the mod decides not based on normal guidelines or precedent.
I agree it's funky and weird but that means you have to adjust to that.

Honestly, it was simply a poor decision in role naming, and poor verbiage used in the roles abilities. Change the name to one of the suggestions, and include the alignment confirmation in the roles actual text, and nobody would be complaining about the role, except perhaps regarding balance.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:18 pm

Really wonder how this would have played out if we had had to use yesterday to remove random, and today to remove PV.

Pretty clutch bus drive tbh.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:21 pm

In post 973, Vaxkiller wrote:Also I bus drove cerb and S&R last night. Also one of the mods said I cant self target.

Yeah I cant believe I was alive that long either, which is why I was telling everyone: I WONT BE IN LYLO

Sorry to doggo who's death I should ahve been able to prevent if I wasnt drunk and not thinking.

Perfect. You picked up what I was putting down. I was hoping my reminder of the rolestop would make them paranoid of shooting at Vax or gork, so they'd shoot at me. :p

Unfortunately, gonna guess they figured that gork was probably a JOAT, since that's what I figured since too many protective otherwise.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:23 pm

@Smith: Sorry yo. 95% of why I didn't back off the push was to test the random thing. The other 5% was me just not finding sufficient cause to town read you.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:24 pm

Had to be a man of my word, you see? And his other reads that he'd pushed hard had been right!

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:26 pm

In post 13929, Firebringer wrote:Town pretty much won this through bad night actions by scum and great actions by Town.
Town didn't even perform that amazing during day, at least after day three

But that's my opinion on this whole game.

Agreed.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:27 pm

FB:Can you explain wtf is up with my role and the refusal to just....like....tell me if post x or y would be considered AI?

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:28 pm

In post 13933, Firebringer wrote:
In post 13931, Vaxkiller wrote:Did scum think I could self target?
Scum completely forgot u were claimed bus driver until day 9

Omg.

*sigh*

Poor scumzors.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:34 pm

In post 13936, Alisae wrote:Cerrrrrrrrrrby

Hai.

Wish you guys had lived longer. Haven't played with froggy in forever!

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:35 pm

You know what else is sad? I sat here reading in my car, with my headlights on, so long that now my car battery is dead. ;( and I need to wait for my little sister to be my knight in shining armor. :p

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:37 pm

I believe, prior to Gork and I actually READING Vedith and Nos, that they could have won the game. Once the two of us weren't really considering those slots as priorities for removal, their odds went way down.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:38 pm

It's fine, I'm out in front of a brewery having a board game night, so I can just go back in and socialize more! So there!

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:39 pm

Hey Gork/cheet/wall: plz claim ty. I figured you're a JOAT, rolestopper/role block/tracker.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:41 pm

So there was no tracker or watcher at all in this damn game????????

*sigh*

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:42 pm

Wait. Did you commute on one of the missing kill nights? Is that the explanation? Or did scum overlap kills?

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:44 pm

Hmm.

So musta been scum overlap I guess?

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:45 pm

In post 13960, Nosferatu wrote:I was actually a compulsive n1 weak seraph knight

I don't believe you. :/

Fb, will we get a proper game end please? With like, living people's roles and stuff! We can't criticize anything until we know stuff!

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:10 pm

I pretty much outlined why Nos was town based on their first three days of play. Didn't make much sense for scum. Vedith I was just trusting in gork.

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:37 pm

For the record, I love all of you, you're all wonderful people. Please don't be hard on yourselves...instead, if you want something to change, change it.

I really sucked this game, for example..

was too disconnected to even begin to properly play. :/

Cerberus v666 · Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:01 pm

In post 13986, Cheetory6 wrote:Working with you close to end-game was probably one of the few bright spots in this game for me. (Even if I kind of sucked at throwing effort at the game after a certain point)
So.
You have that.

Aww. Thank you. That means a lot, really.

It was nice to actually...DO SOMETHING, and not just have the words be thrown out into the void.

Cerberus v666 · Thu Aug 03, 2017 2:42 am

In post 14031, Randomnamechange wrote:I DID NOTHING WRONG
APART FROM THE STUFF I DID
GG YALL
ALSO HOW TF DID PV OUTSURVIVE ME
TY FIRE FOR MODDING

Dumb luck yo. Although I guess he was gonna outsurvive you regardless.

Did you figure out that he was the poisoner when he claimed commuter?

Cerberus v666 · Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:24 am

In post 14067, Ginngie wrote:Also, like, all of you should have been replaced like 5 times over but I couldn't be assed to find replacements

Lol, right?? Lazy players are the worst..:p

Cerberus v666 · Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:01 am

Sly is right that there was very little reason for town to go after him. I pointed that out on the day, but didn't care enough to fight against a lynch on someone who didn't have any redeeming qualities(in the game, that is. I'm sure you're a wonderful person.)

However....I'm also quite opposed to bussing, and were I your teammate I wouldn't have fought against it at all. Had your entire team started the wagon on you after NCs lynch, you would have all been a lot better off.

Cerberus v666 · Fri Aug 04, 2017 3:03 pm

In post 14089, Cerberus v666 wrote:Sly is right that there was very little reason for town to go after him. I pointed that out on the day, but didn't care enough to fight against a lynch on someone who didn't have any redeeming qualities(in the game, that is. I'm sure you're a wonderful person.)

However....I'm also quite opposed to bussing, and were I your teammate I wouldn't have fought against it at all. Had your entire team started the wagon on you after NCs lynch, you would have all been a lot better off.

An addendum to this: Your entire attitude about being lynched has been poor, to say the least. You can't blame your lynch on your team. It was day fucking 1 man. If you're incompetent enough to be the scummiest slot out of 31, then you deserve to be lynched 100% of the time.

Cerberus v666 · Fri Aug 04, 2017 3:15 pm

Alright, I'm ready to talk balance now.

The double SK variant idea was pretty cool, but definitely underpowered. They should have been able to talk to one another(without that information being revealed upon the flip), and shouldn't have been mirrors of one another. I'm not certain HOW they should have been designed, but the fact that they mirrored one another basically guaranteed their deaths at some point given the likelihood that they'd need to explain how some action failed on them at some point. Add in my roles existence, and they couldn't even safely fake claim as just VT to prevent the mirrored thing.

The Bebop crew was incredibly swingy. Yes, two of them were unable to be protected, but I don't believe that's enough to account for that much investigative power.

The doctor idea is awesome. 3rd parties should be done this way more often.

Cerberus v666 · Sat Aug 05, 2017 6:55 am

In post 14098, SlySly wrote:
In post 14089, Cerberus v666 wrote:Sly is right that there was very little reason for town to go after him.

In post 14090, Cerberus v666 wrote:Your entire attitude about being lynched has been poor, to say the least. You can't blame your lynch on your team. It was day fucking 1 man. If you're incompetent enough to be the scummiest slot out of 31, then you deserve to be lynched 100% of the time.
Contradict much? I wasn't that scummy. I was only lynched because of my team, you said so yourself. I'll be sure to add you to those I won't support if I get teamed up with along with those that voted me on D1 when focus could have been shifted anywhere.

There wasn't cause for town to go after you, which means you, if COMPETENT, should have been able to defend yourself.

Instead, you fucked up, because you're bad at defending yourself(or at least, you simply weren't around to show you were capable of defending yourself), and got yourself lynched.

Cerberus v666 · Sat Aug 05, 2017 7:09 am

To be fair though, the posts you quoted were me misspeaking, not contradicting myself. I meant the simple fact that you ended up the D1 lynch meant you fucked up, all on your own. I can understand the confusion though.

Cerberus v666 · Sat Aug 05, 2017 7:23 am

In post 14101, Randomnamechange wrote:tbh the poor play from scum was to not bus harder. they shouldve tried to push the wagon or stayed off it completely

Yep. That's what I said. Had they pushed the fuck out of it immediately after the NC flip, town cred forever. I mean, less than otherwise since he had a wagon on him before it happened, but still, doubling down on the bus after losing your gf+rolecop? Ballsy.

Cerberus v666 · Sat Aug 19, 2017 12:10 pm

In post 14110, Gamma Emerald wrote:I wanna see mod topic and master role list