Open 697: Tit for Tat GAME OVER SCUM WINS!

[Flubbernugget]

VOTE: virtuoso

We don't miss much if its a mislynch anyway

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Oh

Um

VOTE: kop

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VOTE: guyy

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Guyy's awkward posturing through rvs should be self evident

Who disagrees

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Kunkstar, you had asked why I think guyy was awkward.

I think acting confused is really awkward in RVS, and I expect town to be more supportive of people having reasoning on page 1 no matter how thin it may be. He seems to be scumhunting now though, but his votes arent following his reads. I really think I'm onto something here.

[Flubbernugget]

mod I don't see where guyy's vote is in the vc

Fixed - Wheme

[Flubbernugget]

This isn't really something that your making out, I've several times as town putting reads out there but not voting for them, most likely forgetting to vote.

I've seen several people also heavy scum reading someone but pressuring them in different manners without using the votes until things are most certain in your reads.

You and I obviously have different gamestyles and different understandings. I can agree with your views however, but I won't concretely say someone could possibly be scum because they aren't voting within 'your' reads put out in the thread.

This is weird

Guy isn't doing a any of the things you say town does when withholding a vote

You say you agree with me but then disagree with me within the same sentence

And then say I expect guy to follow my reads which is something I never said

[Flubbernugget]

Also fast wagons early game aren't surprising

[Flubbernugget]

Not much worse than the probable d1 mislynch

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I bet it's the only way you're able to win scum games

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I'm worried that she doesn't seem to care about anything but 116

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I think Kop is town atm.

I am entertaining CommKnight as scum.

[Flubbernugget]

so screenplay now that you know the "slip" was a reaction test, are you still planning on leaving your vote on me? you have even less reason now

flubber, how do you feel about commknights response? kinda makes you look bad a little bit imo

Fucking own your accusations dammit

[Flubbernugget]

Kop, do you think guyy voting me as a threat after not soliciting any reactions from his voteless reads is something town does? Why do you think he is pansy footing around scum reading me? What kind of town doesn't stand their ground?

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Oh I like screenplay for scum too

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You've very sneakily not explained how you used your slip to further your read comm

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Or wait...are you saying you actually believed he slipped?

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Your whole "lack of info is a strategy" thing works better with a vote

[Flubbernugget]

VOTE: CommKnight

Guyy is still scum but CommKnight being unclear about his slip read will not go unpunished

[Flubbernugget]

I'll address what I asked kop in 137 to you

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Vote

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Get lynched

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I like mulch's catch up but the town read is really bad

[Flubbernugget]

Town read on screen play, sorry.

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Referring to Sesq

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Prod received. It's a holiday weekend. Catching up now.

[Flubbernugget]

So I have the time to make a pretty detailed catch up post, which is rare from me. I'm noticing that a lot of the high volume posters are writing stuf that is inherently contradictory and it's making it difficult to dig into motivations, but here is what I have in lieu of my frustrations.

Mulch's 208 about sesq makes zero sense. Referencing Sesq making detailed posts has less than zero basis in reality. However, the majority of his other posts are good enough that this doesn't bother me too much. This could be scum unable to articulate a read on their buddy, but I won't push on that without flips.

@Kunkstar:

you seem to be able to articulate meaning from 208. Can you explain how it makes sense to follow the reasoning of someone's "worst post in the game"? Have you ever seen Sesq with "extremely detailed play"?

For the sake of brevity I'm not interested in citing more examples of Mulch's poorly articulated/contradictory posting, but it's tough to discren whether they're stumbling trying to cover their tracks, or spew monologues tangent to the scope of the thread they're in. After a few flips, scrutinizing Mulch's ISO should be a top priority for town.

Guyy's posting is definetely more town than before. However, their post 206 is strange. It's a call out to Mulch with no reasoning as to why guyy has an interest in his presence. There's no follow ups to it either. I also disagree with the first part of his 228.

@Guyy:

can you explain in more detail why you think mulch and sesq can't be scum together?

I would like sesq to articulate her change of heart on screen in 276

I am usually against tells like this, but Comm's inactivity may actually suggest his slip push...thing wasn't coming from a scum mentality. He may have just said something immensely stupid, and have too much of an ego to recover from the reactions to it. It's tough to build wagon momentum on an inactive player this early in the day phase. We'll see what comes from the replacement I guess.

Assuming TywinL is a TywinLannister alt, I am townreading them. When I played with them before, they lied through their teeth as town. The improvement in play is significant enough here to garner a town read (for now).

@guyy

I think you're looking for stuff like this. I would be fond of you explaining how you're trying to determine Tywin's alignment sooner rather than later. The best I can see from you is playing ace attorney with his words, garnering no analysis of motivation.

I still like screen for scum. Posts like 249 and 250 sound like lies. The scum read on wave needs at least some reasoning otherwise it's just sitting on a safe lurker slot. His interactions with Mulch come off as him being afraid of being caught if he says too much. Also throws weak shade on a player that really shouldn't be too hard to make a scum case against.

I would really like a lynch within {guyy, mulch, sesq} to clear up some of the mysteries I've expressed, but I don't have a true scum read on any of them. VOTE: screenplay for now. Considering most of the thread is in my town reads, there might be two additional scum in the lurkers.

[Flubbernugget]

I see it coming from a scum partner

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If one of Sesq/mulch flip scum I would scum read the other. Not I don't have independent scum reads on them though, so D1 isn't the time to call them scum over that.

[Flubbernugget]

Actually mulch had a really awkard defence of screen. One of them flipping scum could flag the other two as a scum team.

Again, all pre flip associations, so it's more of a rabbit hole than strong tells.

[Flubbernugget]

For as much as you post you should at least give me the respect back of fully reading my wall

[Flubbernugget]

Sesq has been doing a lot of stuff that isn't really AI at all and is more playstyle indicative. His short, non explanatory posts can easily come from both allignments. But when I was following the game and saw his post in 107 it was sort of a lightbulb moment where he had the exact same reaction from me and in a weird way I could follow his reasoning. It was your worst post of the game by far beacuse it felt super opportunistic and obvious, and not very well thought out (just like all the others that pushed on him). This (as a side point) is a sharp contrast to your usually very detailed and well analyzed reads.

This was what I was referencing. It seems as though I misread what you said, sorry. You were saying kunk has detailed posts. Not Sesq.

I don't get how you can follow the reasoning of the worst post in the game. That would make it a good post by definition imo. It's the little things like that I find contradictary, but not necessarily scummy.

Also, I really don't think I've said anything insulting about you. I may have accidentally implied you're stupid? Not my intent, I find your posting disorganized at worst.

[Flubbernugget]

107

"But when I was following the game and saw his post in 107 it was sort of a lightbulb moment where he had the exact same reaction from me and in a weird way I could follow his reasoning. It was your worst post of the game by far beacuse it felt super opportunistic and obvious, and not very well thought out (just like all the others that pushed on him)."

I don't have time to pick out the little things like this through your entire iso, nor do I think the rest of the town would want to trough through it.

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I have explicitly said that I don't scum read you based off of your interactions with others given that they haven't flipped.

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I would really like a lynch within {guyy, mulch, sesq} to clear up some of the mysteries I've expressed, but I don't have a true scum read on any of them.

[Flubbernugget]

Lang, are you planning to read the thread to catch up?

I owe screen answers but not while I'm phone posting

[Flubbernugget]

You're not entertaining.

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Um, that whole reading the slot you replaced wasnt a joke?

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This will be higher priority tomorrow

[Flubbernugget]

I still like screen for scum. Posts like 249 and 250 sound like lies. The scum read on wave needs at least some reasoning otherwise it's just sitting on a safe lurker slot. His interactions with Mulch come off as him being afraid of being caught if he says too much. Also throws weak shade on a player that really shouldn't be too hard to make a scum case against.

I would really like a lynch within {guyy, mulch, sesq} to clear up some of the mysteries I've expressed, but I don't have a true scum read on any of them. VOTE: screenplay for now. Considering most of the thread is in my town reads, there might be two additional scum in the lurkers.

I'm not following how after this big long post it ends with a vote on me. I don't see that progression.

You say two of my posts look like lies. Why?
I said I don't have any thoughts on someone?
I believe it was even pointer out that I haven't mentioned them in my ISO anywhere. So why would you think it's a lie that I have no thoughts on someone that I have never mentioned or thought about?

I also said I thought wave was scum before he went v/la. So I don't see how that's me trying to get away with voting a lurker.

Where, anywhere does it look like I've been afraid to say anything? I think I've already been called out for the things I say. Wasn't afraid then so I don't see how you can assume I'm afraid now.

Who is the easy person I'm throwing shade on?

The vote progression is basically "I'm less confident in my scum reads now than I was before but you can still get lynched."

I guess I can't call 249 and 250 hard lies, but I really don't like that when asked about a relatively active player, you have nothing to say. Mulch tried extremely hard to get you to say anything about screen, and instead of working with him you shade him. It looks like you're afraid to give reads.

I'll give you that mulch is probably town, so making a scum case on them is probably a stupid idea. I'll give you that you had an early read on Wave (even though it's stale now).

Despite this, your lynch removes a player from the game unwilling to analyze other players at worst.

[Flubbernugget]

Screen is viable what are you doing

[Flubbernugget]

Lang

Your vote is scummy as hell and is pushing towards no lynch

Vote screen

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Two really scummy players just hammered scum

Need to think on this one

Ugh

[Flubbernugget]

Screen and Lang get no credit on him.

Why

[Flubbernugget]

Screen and Lang get no credit on him.

Why

The lynch was inevitable

Who would have taken the blame for a no lynch?

[Flubbernugget]

I can hopefully catch up on this tomorrow

[Flubbernugget]

Two really scummy players just hammered scum

Need to think on this one

Ugh

With Tywin flipping scum, and you pushing the counter wagon, does this alter your read on Screen?

It does make them look more town, yes

[Flubbernugget]

I say let's not debate it, what do they do, man? Let's put it to a vote, man..

This is a strange thing to offer without you placing a vote yourself

[Flubbernugget]

VOTE: Kop

Reasons?

You led the lynch on the counterwagon

I wanted screen blood pretty bad too

[Flubbernugget]

And kop is like...really, really town

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The golden rule of mass claim is that if it's viable early game the setup will never make it to signups

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Does your "3 IC proposal" fall out of PR's being named townies to am extent?

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You know what, never mind. That plan is a house of cards and I should know better than to try and entertain it.

VOTE: lang I'm not dealing with this

[Flubbernugget]

There's nothing in the rules counting that hurt tag as a vote either

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Mulch, can you point me to one post where you think Kop isn't gamesolving?

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UNVOTE:

Still not entertaining your nonsense

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Mulch if 198 is the best example you have of kop not scum hunting you really need to re think your read

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He did hammer a scum role cop d1

There's room for the vig to clean up stupidity

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VOTE: guyy

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There's more to life than f5 yakno

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Ehhhh fuck it VOTE: lang

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Yeah your flavor posting or whatever tone you're trying to achieve really isn't entertaining, and it makes your posting hard to understand. Not trying to be rude, just honest.

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Stove, is kop scum for more than just voting you poorly?

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He did hammer a scum role cop d1

There's room for the vig to clean up stupidity

were you not aware of that before lang pointed it out??

In trying to figure out why he was suggesting mass claim I had a mental lapse

Now I really don't care any more

[Flubbernugget]

I'll get to this tomorrow

[Flubbernugget]

VOTE: Lang Buddha

Reason: Jealousy

this is L-1 and a terrible vote

can you please at the very least elaborate

This will be on the books for a lang scum flip

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i find it at least noteworthy that the most suspect (group C) are the ones fighting hardest against a massclaim. even if the points made there are viable or even good, i don't think they're coming from town

This is demonstrably false

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Lang. I've stopped reading your posts and will continue to ignore them until you stop this massclaim thing.

[Flubbernugget]

but the groupings were not based on how players perceive themselves. because that's useless. it's based on everyones perceptions. no one outside of flubber being stupid has given any inclination that they feel mulch or myself are scum. you have been at L-1 two different times with different wagons

Kop had a lot of scum cases on you. Your list is dishonest and warped and it's really shitty to tell everyone else what their perceptions are

[Flubbernugget]

I wonder if Lang going to be for the full massclaim is just to make other subtle rolefishing more palpable

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My "excuse" will be fuck massclaim is the right way to massclaim

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What's really great about all this massclaim discussion is that it's giving us so much extra time to scumhunt that we just ran up a pr on what boiled down to a D2 poe

[Flubbernugget]

VT

I'm going to go back to bitching now

[Flubbernugget]

guyy can claim next