Large Normal 206: World Record Mafia! (GAME OVER)

[massive]

And why did it take so long for a counterwagon to spring up against Nero? And why did the discussion about TwoInAMillion vigging Nero have no impact on your opinion of said counterwagon?

[wavemode]

What's all this talk of counterwagoning with Nero, anyway? This isn't counterwagoning

The only reason he's not lynched is that Two said he would vig him

[Nero Cain]

shhh, Titus is just scum. This is like her default reasoning to push anyone that has another wagon spring up against them.

[Eddie Cane]

i dont really care about titus right now, last time we played i subbed out and insulted her so i'm trying to avoid that

can you explain how the mulch replace out could ever be scum? because mulch was extremely townie to me and that replace out was a massive nail in the town coffin

[Nero Cain]

I think replacing out is mostly null. And meta wise his screaming to get wagons going is pretty similar to his play in NY203. What did you find townie from him?

[Eddie Cane]

i agreed with his thoguhts reading through, its not really a meta read because i haven't played with scum mulch and in the game i spectated with him as scum i already had spoilers

but replacing out is null, sure. this specific one screamed town to me though. he had a mulch temper tantrum because nobody would sheep him, just as he does every single game as town. in the end, his shouting didn't work so he rage replaced. i don't see scum mulch ever doing that. this is stronger by the fact mulch prefers playing scum, is stronger as scum, and prides himself on his scum game. i don't think a scum mulch replaces here because that is not his wincon

[Nero Cain]

I mean, true, Titus is pretty wonky but if she thinks I'm scum and my lone buddy or two is pushing this Flairs wagon then she needs to explain who they are and why. This "they" stuff just seems way shallow.

And her line about there being a counter-wagon to me b/c I'm "useful" to scum seems like her goal is to shift blame to once I flip town. And again she's not naming names so...

[KidAmn]

Yeah, not feeling this Nero counter.

Either a) Nero's scum or b) he provides a benefit to them. Otherwise, they wouldn't bother wagoning flairs at all.

I want KidAmn or Nero.

Come back when you've read the game and aren't scum.

So never and never.

[Nero Cain]

despite your constant omgus of me I know that doesn't make you scum

I mean FMPOV, you are/were scum that was strong arming my lynch and I think that's possibly scum motivated. I also didn't really like

though using the gerry tells mastina taught me I think ur probably scum on meta regardless

let's see if the Nero tells giga showed me are right

its like you keep trying to absolve yourself of mislynches.

of course now that it's been discussed/planned that I'm getting shot you are calling me town so, idk seems kinda odd still.

[Nero Cain]

The problem with Wave is that, if he's scum, he's doing absolutely nothing to help his side win short of joining your wagon. His vanity wagons get him absolutely nowhere.

Well, myself (mostly myself) and a few others have called him scum. So whatever he's doing is not getting himself wagoned and I'd argue that just surviving and not getting lynched are the most important traits for scum.

IF

Flaris was town then I think there's utility in scum not being on the wagon.

[massive]

Sure, I can see how "just survive to mid-game" is a viable scum strategy this game, especially in the first day when they still had their encryptor.

[MarioManiac4]

Yeah, the longer this day goes on and on, the more sure I am that Dunkerdoodles is the right lynch. 3797 gives my reasoning, but I feel like I need to expand on that more.

1432 is a horrible post all around. In particular; how can 60 be interpreted as a "bussy vote"? It was a RVS vote, probably tied to my mason CC antics. Calling it AI is a stretch, but when you get to the point where you're using it in a case, I don't think Dunker is arguing in good faith there.
"Mario is confscum" in 86, uhhh, really isn't bussy. 316 is the first real post noted, but he's comparing the early read to an actual post here. I could see this coming from disorganized town, but he's not just presenting it as a case; this is the initial thought Dunker gives, the initial analysis of my posting. The only real comment he had on me before this point was calling one of my posts a "scummy post" which isn't really a complaint he only made to me. Calling 954 bussing just makes me more sure that Dunkerdoodles isn't arguing in good faith here, and that he has an outside agenda for 1432.

This position did poke its head again later, only to dissapear when people didn't choose to agree with his read and it has not received any development since, even though MM4!scum has become more popular recently. (It also makes no sense as a position. Considering my attack against TWIM, my lack of leading the GR wagon and GR's push on me being insignificant, if not a joke, it makes literally no sense that we would be "bussing each other for towncred."

His whole position against Boonskiies is horrible too. Like, we have a gunsmith who is soft-cleared who is claiming an innocent on a player with a traitor and a doctor dead. He justifies this by saying "well maybe there's two traitors" which is pretty damn hard to imagine being in a normal game at all. I really don't like his insistence on calling Boon scum, even voting him instead of KA past a gunsmith innocent, with his only justification being that he "doesn't like how much Boon is saying he's conf-town." (He gives some D2 reasoning in 3379 but I feel like judging Boon on his claimed role is a horrendously bad idea as is proved by this game alone. If you want to scumread someone for lying about their role, ok, but...)

Dunkers is welcome to explain this, but I don't think there is any satisfactory explanation.

I've been getting more busy recently and it's getting a lot harder to fully keep up with the game so comments by me might slow down and/or be slightly less perceptive with the current gamestate. I fully agree with Eddie that Mulch's replacement was unlikely to come from scum (as I have said recently) so I really don't want to lynch Titus anytime soon. I do feel like it's safe to say scum have played a part in the flairs wagon, although I disagree that it's necessarily because he's scum or scum have specific utility for him.

Wavemode, KidAmn, Boonskiies and TWIM are my Real TM LockTown. These reads aren't changing anytime soon or in the case of the latter two at all. I had some doubts about WM previously but recently I feel like he's really towned it up here.

Flairs wagon is meh. I've already mentioned my scumgame with her; she basically didn't post ever. It could be a coincidence that she couldn't get into that game in particular for other reasons, but meh. Going from what she did there to what she's done here would be a huge improvement. The wagon is basically a "Whatever, fuck this, let's vote out a lurker" which I can kinda sympathize with because I did that D1 and we hit scum then. I guess that Flairs' turnaround on Nero is iffy, but I want her to be able to explain it before we lynch her, if we do. I'm feeling a lot better about lynching Dunkerdoodles at the moment.

Yumeko Jabami is doing precisely nothing and they haven't done anything for a while, which is getting old. But I feel like some of Unabombah's interactions with them are unlikely to be SvS.

My reads are like this;

MarioManiac4, TwoInAMillion, Boonskiies, KidAmn, Wavemode

Titus, gerryoat

Yumeko Jabami, Eddie Cane, Nero Cain, Flairs, davesaz

massive, Mary Saotome

Dunkerdoodles

[Nero Cain]

Why isn't Titus in your locktown reads then?

[MarioManiac4]

Because she isn't locktown? I don't want to lynch Titus right now, but that's a lot more subject to change and evaluation than my locktown reads.

[wavemode]

I'm going to trust Boon's townread of Dunker for now

[Eddie Cane]

or my townread I've had since d1

[Nero Cain]

I'm going to trust Boon's townread of Dunker for now

Wasn't he scumreading him? But by now Boon has been scumreading and townreading everybody at one point or another.

[MarioManiac4]

I'm going to trust Boon's townread of Dunker for now

do you disagree with any of the points i've raised?

[Mary Saotome]

Coming back and seeing a flairs wagon this brings tears to my eyes. Now vigging massive or Mario after this will be just perfect.

[massive]

Mary have you ever mentioned why you keep namedropping me in your shoot pool?

[Flairs]

As long as kills are can get through Aestic, sure I guess

VOTE: Eddie Cane

why do you go from lynching Nero to lynching one of the people pushing Nero the hardest?

Because that was my first lynch, pretty much nothing to do on how he was on Nero

@MM4&others- some people (TIAM basically) did some arguing and was convincing enough in the sense that we should lynch because it's becoming more urgent, and it could be avoided some more if we put it off more and now is a relatively ideal time to do it. But there's assurance now that Nero will be killed tonight, so that's been gotten out of the way, so I can go back to what I wanted to do at the start of the day, hence the vote on Eddie

Also idk about the Dunkerdoodles vote, he'd been pretty consistent and confident on his scumread of Game Replacement

[Nero Cain]

So your lynch was just a straight up policy lynch?

[Nero Cain]

Like, idk, a d3 pl with 2 scum down seems just pretty crazy to me. Of course, I'm biased and know I'm town but the whole "lets just lynch the negative utility role." as opposed to someone that you think is scum. Like is this just the worst town ever or something?

[Mary Saotome]

Mary have you ever mentioned why you keep namedropping me in your shoot pool?

You're in the group of lurking behind big names and doing nothing in this game. You have basically 0 stances on the game besides sheep votes from what I've seen

[Titus]

@Mario, why is KidAmn in your locktown reads? His reply to me is very scummy. It seems more about silencing me than it is engaging with anyone. Nero and KidAmn seem to be just flooding until we give up.