Open 697: Tit for Tat GAME OVER SCUM WINS!

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: comm
Your not doing it right

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: comm
Your not doing it right

You're*

VOTE: Srceenplay

Great. We've have a nazi

[Srceenplay]

Vc wrong

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: wavemode

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: wavemode

Reason for this?

Grammer

[Srceenplay]

Omgys

[Srceenplay]

I'll sheep. I don't get what the slip is but what ever.

VOTE: guyy

[Srceenplay]

Doesn't know what the slip is but votes anyway...hmm
VOTE: Srceenplay

Would you have been ok with the sheep if I didn't mention the slip?

[Srceenplay]

In post 72, Srceenplay wrote:
I'll sheep. I don't get what the slip is but what ever.

VOTE: guyy


It isn't important for you to understand the reasoning behind a wagon before offering it your vote?

Not when I'm sheeping someone.

I'm not seeing anything of significance yet. It just feels like people are talking in circles.

[Srceenplay]

Leaving my vote on Srceenplay. Getting similar vibes from him as our last game together when he was scum.

What game was that?
I don't remember it.

[Srceenplay]

Not liking this.

Sounds to me like a personal problem.

[Srceenplay]

That said, if guyy is scum, I like Srceenplay for partner after 72

So basically I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. Sounds to me like I'm the safe vote.

[Srceenplay]

No. It more like asking him why not vote me instead of just shading if he thinks I'm scum no matter what.

[Srceenplay]

I may have read through that to fast.
I see now it was tw o different points.

[Srceenplay]

Also fast wagons early game aren't surprising

How often have you seen them right?

[Srceenplay]

You never said he was scum

?

Yes, I did

I said if guy is scum, he could be the partner

What I didn't say is that he's definitely scum no matter what

My first read I thought he was implying that I was scum no matter what but after ready again he just implies scum are on his wagon no matter what.

[Srceenplay]

are you still planning on leaving your vote on me?

For now, ya.
I'm not 100% for sure who to put it on. Want to read the entire game again first.
Plus I don't like it when there a people who are not voting. I would hate to be one of them.

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: kunkstar

[Srceenplay]

Kunk and Wave are a team
Comm and Kop are possibilities as well.

[Srceenplay]

Comm and Kop are possibilities as well.

Not as a team per day but as scum possibilities

[Srceenplay]

*per say

[Srceenplay]

How many of you have played with kunkstar?
Could you describe his play style for me?

[Srceenplay]

Get lynched

Someone else first.

[Srceenplay]

I'm curious on your thought process to give me a town lean. You like my reads?

[Srceenplay]

Ok. Trust my reads then.
ISO kunk just seems to me like a guy with to much information trying to make it fit.

[Srceenplay]

do you think i'm off base about flubber?

I don't know. I will look tomorrow.

I'm a gut read player.
I reread and gave my gut reads. I'm horrible at giving reasons for them. Something I'm try to work on.

Flubber did not ping me on my read through but I'll double check in the morning.

[Srceenplay]

Town here <3

Ill read up tmrw

1 hour later.

Towny

Kunk:

Spoiler:

53 is relatively towny, not a bad point regarding Twyin's post, and more importantly it shows intent to truly analyze as it's a rather subtle thing to pick up on. Can definitely follow them with it too. I also really like 77, specifically the part where he calls out Flubber for criticizing Guyy. Had the same reaction. Unfortunately finding Kunk to be a little bit of a dick trying to critcize all the naked posts but I suppose I can't call that AI. However, 102 I can't even follow his view on this one, Screen's comment was wholly NAI and an atrocious reason to place a vote on. Yet he redeems himself 123 by going above and beyond on this, showing he put effort into reading his ISO to see about this "reaction test." Sure, can come from scum but I think it's slightly villagery in the sense that he has intent to be thorough and not be surface level.

Sesq:

Spoiler:

Honestly I can very easily see Sesq in 107 thinking this because of that glaring red flag by Kunk, lol. I know this is silly but I want to really really townread him for this purity

______________________________________________________________

Nulltown/Town Lean

Screenplay:

Spoiler:

72 from Screenplay is sort of on the surface scummy but honestly not something scum would do. I've been burned with this in the past but I just don't see scum sheeping someone so blatantly with little reasoning. The brutal honesty in 138 and139 is refreshing but I don't follow 138 at all, lol. He just made a relatively towny post. Unfortuantely this level of confidence seems to match his meta. 162 is just pure townyness .

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________-

Null

Wavemode:

Spoiler:

50 matches my thoughts and55 literally exactly what I was thinking. However, 60 feels out of place as a reaction. It was an implied defense of his vote when nobody was really pressuring him anyway.

Flubber:

Spoiler:

92 at first glance seemed really bad and reachy but I suppose I can follow this cause Guy didn't vote at the end of his readslist.

Kop:

Spoiler:

100 is like objetively wrong in the wagonomics and it's a struggle for me to see how he can have such confidence in him being town that he is already basically doing a full on pre flip on opportunistic wolves. Sure, it's possible he can think that he's town for the wagon, but this level of confidence dosen't match the gamestate. I do like how he disagrees with a point though without calling it scummy. You would be surprised how town-based that is in general. I feel like I'm missing some of his posts though that may be significant, so might have to go back on them.

__________________________________________________________________________________________________________-

Nullscum/Scum Lean

Guyy:

Spoiler:

The reads in 89 seem relatively forced, especially because Twyin and Raya are in his townreads which makes no sense. They've been far and away the scummiest so far imo and it's strange that he has this PoV. Gotta see his reasoning. And no vote too! 97 is legitimately scummy or a severe misconception bc I could follow his case on him not voting at the end of his paragraph and it didn't seem unreasonable to vote. The weird emphasis on him unvoting dosen't make much sense. 128 is another post where I just have a clash of perspectives, how can you buy that shit, I don't get it lol

Commknight:

Spoiler:

121 is like scum 101, almost wanna snap vote him at this point for this. Will hold on to crucifying him until I get an explanation, though.

Raya:

Spoiler:

54 is bothersome. He says he agrees with the post before but dosen't back it up with a vote and instead leaves his vote on the rvs vote from very early. 86 is just something so obvious to point out, again I can see from a village PoV but is something wolves can easily push as well.

Twyin:

Spoiler:

29 is the first serious post of the game and is a massive reach. I also wanna scumread 61 too just for scumreading someone for anti town behavior but I know this is probably a playstyle difference . 73 is a super obvious point he's poking at with Screen. I guess? I can see town thinking that too, but it's slightly opportunistic.

______________________________________________________________________________________________________--

Scum

Blue:

Spoiler:

Post 67 is honestly not a bad vote in general (volume reads of little scumhunting) but not something I can really see at this early stage in the game. Pretty bad reason to vote here, not neccecarily scummy.

@smoothblue

, what was towny about 89? This is one post I definitely need clarification on. And 159 is so bad and nothing really scummy at all from Sesq. He hasn't been anymore self centered than anyone here

VOTE: Blue

Lol.

At least you are learning to read me.

A feel like your Kunk and Twyin reads are similar but they are on opposite ends of the list.

[Srceenplay]

In post 129, Srceenplay wrote:
Plus I don't like it when there a people who are not voting. I would hate to be one of them.

Why srceenplay is concerned with appearances (specifically the location of the vote) is not really a town position, but meta could prove me misled here. I will say that so far srceenplay has been consistent with his vote, as from the vote in #138 onward in his iso has specifically focused on that vote, even if he is following up quite weakly, its still something I guess.

I was trying to be a smart ass. Wasn't trying to look good.

In post 168, Srceenplay wrote:
I'm a gut read player.
I reread and gave my gut reads. I'm horrible at giving reasons for them. Something I'm try to work on.

This bothers me because it's consistent with his play so far, and coupled with the above point about his vote makes sense. I just wish we could get more out of him rather than "gut" because without that "more" its hard to pin someone down on a read and hold them to consistency.

I did add to my read.

Ok. Trust my reads then.
ISO kunk just seems to me like a guy with to much information trying to make it fit.

Your first big post (don't remember number) felt like a lot for so early (page2?).
It gave me the impression that you already had information that you wanted to use to start a narrative.
Granted it could just be your playstyle.
That's why I asked people if they have played with you and can describe your playstyle.

[Srceenplay]

It gave me the impression that you already had information that you wanted to use to start a narrative.

This is a scumread style that I can easily follow and easily understand with Kunk early day 1. But I want to know if you just sort of glazed over it, and was like, yeah this is way too much and is an overflux of information for this juncture of the game, or if you really looked at it and see if you coulden't really get where they were coming from. I was able to do just that which is why I'm not scumreading them for it.

No. I did not try to over analyze it. I just read it. Thought it seem a little soon.
Again that's why I was asking others for some meta on him.

[Srceenplay]

are you trying to say mulch knows to much?

I have an idea on the last part of questioning you do with mulch. But I want to wait for his response first.

[Srceenplay]

And iirc wasn't wave on my wagon for the same reason?

[Srceenplay]

The ironic thing about all of this is that Screen could actually be a wolf, lol. This is why you can't full out scumread everybody that has pushed. And even if he is a villager, there are at least 2/3 villagers pushing it as well. Such is life

Make up your mind.

[Srceenplay]

are you trying to say mulch knows to much?

I have an idea on the last part of questioning you do with mulch. But I want to wait for his response first.

I read 184 and 204 different.
184 looked like a read were 204 looked liked an understanding of his read.

[Srceenplay]

Bah

[Srceenplay]

Not enough to give any thoughts to

[Srceenplay]

Under my radar

[Srceenplay]

Skimmed ISO town lean. Nothing scumish to me.

[Srceenplay]

Skimmed ISO town lean. Nothing scumish to me.

Sorry. That's blue ISO

[Srceenplay]

I'm having second thoughts on kunk.
Still think wave is scum.
Going to give twyn some thought later since his name keeps popping up.

[Srceenplay]

A little iffy on you. It feels like you are trying to control the flow of the game. Not sure if I like it.

[Srceenplay]

Not Fire sure on the context.
I k saw they wanted to put a pressure vote on them.
Then it progressed to the post.
I'll have to reread context later.

That part they talk about comm is were I start to Town read comm.

[Srceenplay]

It feels like you are trying to control the flow of the game.

Indeed I am. Am I doing a good job?

You being self aware doesn't sit to well either.

[Srceenplay]

It seems like you are to comfortable.
I remember you not being in control or know what's going on. Taking shots pushing buttons.
Not doing that here.

[Srceenplay]

I don't read other games.
I'm just watching you from the corner of my eye.

[Srceenplay]

@raya36
That's a contradiction, is it not?

You said where you come from votes are more serious and permanent.
You are not used to moving votes around.
Yet it is natural to remove the vote just because someone is getting voted up?

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: Screenplay

You can't post here. Mulch2 already took the spot.

[Srceenplay]

Guy don't tunnel me. It won't end well.

I'll get to this later.
Still need to read twyn.

Not much for me to respond to except for shade being thrown at me. No questions in there.

Your reasoning doesn't sound very good for me being a part of a team. Just be cause you don't see names in my ISO.
I definitely like coms reasoning better than that.

[Srceenplay]

I've been drinking. No substance here.
Trying to get this shitty mod to play civ with me.

[Srceenplay]

I'll be home in about an hour.
If you have questions you want to ask me have them ready.
Otherwise unvote me with your sideways shade throwing.

[Srceenplay]

I still like screen for scum. Posts like 249 and 250 sound like lies. The scum read on wave needs at least some reasoning otherwise it's just sitting on a safe lurker slot. His interactions with Mulch come off as him being afraid of being caught if he says too much. Also throws weak shade on a player that really shouldn't be too hard to make a scum case against.

I would really like a lynch within {guyy, mulch, sesq} to clear up some of the mysteries I've expressed, but I don't have a true scum read on any of them. VOTE: screenplay for now. Considering most of the thread is in my town reads, there might be two additional scum in the lurkers.

I'm not following how after this big long post it ends with a vote on me. I don't see that progression.

You say two of my posts look like lies. Why?
I said I don't have any thoughts on someone?
I believe it was even pointer out that I haven't mentioned them in my ISO anywhere. So why would you think it's a lie that I have no thoughts on someone that I have never mentioned or thought about?

I also said I thought wave was scum before he went v/la. So I don't see how that's me trying to get away with voting a lurker.

Where, anywhere does it look like I've been afraid to say anything? I think I've already been called out for the things I say. Wasn't afraid then so I don't see how you can assume I'm afraid now.

Who is the easy person I'm throwing shade on?

[Srceenplay]

I could have sworn I unvoted him.
UNVOTE:

[Srceenplay]

@mod two double voters.

[Srceenplay]

Dodge-ish

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: comm

[Srceenplay]

Let's lynch Tywin

Alright, as much as I really don't want to keep Lang around for another day Tywin seems to be the stronger wagon, it's too close to deadline to keep this split:

Vote: TywinL.

I agree with this.

VOTE: Twyin

L-1

[Srceenplay]

Can someone translate what he's saying ^

[Srceenplay]

I put Twyin at L-1.
Next post is vote count.
Next post is wave posting saying he needs a catch-up.

I don't know how to explain it but that doesn't sit right to me. He was the first person on the wagon. Early game post.
And
Him coming in right after the vote count and says he needs to catch up but doesn't say anything about him being at L-1.

[Srceenplay]

Which part, man?

All of it. Your posts are hard to read because of your flavor.
I end up just skimming or skipping all together.

[Srceenplay]

I saw in the replacement q you were throwing shade at him.

[Srceenplay]

I didn't know you wanted any particular slot. It was that I saw you shade him and then you end up in the same games as him.
I thought it was funny, you complained about mulch replacing so I was saying mulch2 is replacing into that slot.

[Srceenplay]

I don't see the benifit of a mass claim yet.
We would just lose our strongest power role.

[Srceenplay]

7-2

We could get 3 town clears with a mass claim.
That would leave 6 VT claims we lynch from.
If we miss we potentially lose jailor if he doesn't bloke kill.
Role cop could give us a potential clear or guilty from the VT pool.

It's a tough decision. It would help us by pointing us in the right direction but it gives scum all the information they need.

[Srceenplay]

7-2

We could get 3 town clears with a mass claim.
That would leave 6 VT claims we lynch from.
If we miss we potentially lose jailor if he doesn't bloke kill.
Role cop could give us a potential clear or guilty from the VT pool.

It's a tough decision. It would help us by pointing us in the right direction but it gives scum all the information they need.

Rolecop could also clear the goon.

So we don't gain much but lose a lot.

[Srceenplay]

Welcome to the game Ironstove. Can you understand why someone would scum read your slot or have you not read up?

[Srceenplay]

Welcome Notmafia. Same question to you.

Welcome to the game Ironstove. Can you understand why someone would scum read your slot or have you not read up?

[Srceenplay]

What if we just claim vt or or?

[Srceenplay]

What if we just claim vt or or?

*VT or PR?

[Srceenplay]

Holy shit. That was the first post I understood from you.
I say let's do it. It could jump start the game.

[Srceenplay]

Kop, Flubbernugget, Srceenplay, Sesq


These are the 4 lynches for today. I don't want to do Screen or Sesq yet.

impulse to hammer

Really?

[Srceenplay]

I never vote myself.

[Srceenplay]

What's flubber count? I'm willing to vote there.

[Srceenplay]

I don't know if I believe scum would be ok with lynching their PR. So I doubt they were on the lynch. With the exception of wave. Wave was early vote on Twyin but not really giving a reason. Left his vote there while he threw shade at other people. He went V/LA and as he comes back Twyin gets lynched.

But

Seeing scum wouldn't want to have their pr lynched I would think they would do what they can to keep up another possible lynch. So that is where I think today's attention should be.

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: Flubber

[Srceenplay]

Well that escalated quickly.

Lang needs explaing before being hammered by anyone. Especially with those on Twyin competing wagon voting there.

[Srceenplay]

In post 495, Srceenplay wrote:
Welcome to the game Ironstove. Can you understand why someone would scum read your slot or have you not read up?


Also, I'd like to hear your reasoning on why people would/are scum reading my slot. After reading, it doesn't feel like this slot was being pressured much or suspected at all. Correct me if I'm wrong.

I asked that question to bring you in the game right away and to get some immediate content out of you.
It wasn't that I was scum reading you or understand why your slot would be scum read.

[Srceenplay]

oh fuck i thought ironstove was wavemode replacement

kunk wtf are you doing voting with sesq flubber and kop

Remember sesq made no sense to me
And Flubbernugget doesn't seem scummy so far, is the justification there his wagon placement?

So you think scum hammered their pr is more likely than scum trying to push an alternate lynch?

[Srceenplay]

The swing. I don't like it. Its scumy. I'm just not sure were yet.

[Srceenplay]

@MOD. V/LA until Monday

.
Going on small vacation with family. Not sure what internet connection will be. I'll try to check in.

Im ok with Mass claim.

[Srceenplay]

+1

[Srceenplay]

Letting him say pr without everyone else popcorning defeats the purpose?
No one would know if there is a cc

[Srceenplay]

That's what the Rolecop is for.

But with just him role cop doesn't help.
Scum can hide behind a pr claim unless all come forward.
It's kind of redundant otherwise.

[Srceenplay]

I'm really not a big fan of mass claiming, but if this is what people want I'll do it.

I'm also a PR, and I'd like to see if the last PR will step forward.

It's at the point of no return now.
Ironstove, just popcorn it.

[Srceenplay]

I am not a pr

[Srceenplay]

I was called out as a pr and was to be popcorned to. What else do I say?
I don't think we necessarily need full claims right now. Just pr or not pr

[Srceenplay]

Because I'm Town. Tunnel me would not end well. That's pretty straightforward

[Srceenplay]

also srceenplay you also said "i'll get to this later"

i definitely expected an eventual follow up very different than than you're just vanilla

I don't do detailed posts.
I just got back from a 4 day va ca. Have other stuff that needs done.

What were you expecting?

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: Screenplay

I don't buy this

What is it that you don't buy?

I told you when you entered I thought you might be scum. Now you voting me without reason is confirming that thought.

[Srceenplay]

Someone thinking someone softened a pr doesn't mean they did.
That's a stretch to try to vote someone for.
Most sorts people think they see are not sorts at all.

[Srceenplay]

And mulch you are just using circular reason to say nothing right now.

[Srceenplay]

Why is that again?
Because I'm not a pr makes me scum?
You think I'm scum because I didn't get to something?
I'm sorry friend but that happens a lot with me.

[Srceenplay]

And mulch you are just using circular reason to say nothing right now.

Where did I use circular reasoning

772

Saying "I'm not scum so your scum because I scum read you then you scum read me without ever bringing it up before except for the past makes you scum"

[Srceenplay]

Time for bitching about it is over.

Your turn flubber

[Srceenplay]

So to save the goon we lynched the role cop?

Please try again.

[Srceenplay]

But why would the goon vote role cop?

[Srceenplay]

I think everyone claimed.
We have one hidden PR.

[Srceenplay]

You really put yourself in the maybe pile?

I think mulch and kunk should be together somewhere in between maybe and definitely as an either/or

[Srceenplay]

fucking bullshit “circular logic” and the bs false power role claim

You are the one with the false power claim idea.
If you honestly believed that why continue to push/shade throw all game?

[Srceenplay]

You guys are a bunch of OMGUS.

[Srceenplay]

You forgot to say L-1 NM

[Srceenplay]

I'm town. VT.
I haven't been as well as I should have this game but I would bet a dollar my scum pool has the remaining scum in it.

[Srceenplay]

Eh

[Srceenplay]

Stop with your redundant votes

[Srceenplay]

I didn't lie.
It was a run on bullshit circular argument

[Srceenplay]

And mulch you are just using circular reason to say nothing right now.

Where did I use circular reasoning

772

Saying "I'm not scum so your scum because I scum read you then you scum read me without ever bringing it up before except for the past makes you scum"

[Srceenplay]

I'm not scum so your just affirming yourself to be more likely to be scum by accusing me of being scum right after I accused you and when you didn't bring up anything about it before and trying to reach into past experiences to rationalize it which is what scum does a lot.

[Srceenplay]

4) I am town.

Not it starts all over again.

Your #3 does not make any sense.

[Srceenplay]

That's a valid argument from his perspective

Knight in shining armor

[Srceenplay]

By your reasoning it continues to loop

[Srceenplay]

I literally just posted how

[Srceenplay]

3) You are more likely to be scum because you are reaching into past experiences to rationalize your scumread when you didn't push the scumread of me before.

I said before I was going to keep and eye on you and wasn't sure about you.

Your past experiences I don't know what you are talking about.

You are just throwing words around that don't make sense to try and say I'm scum.

[Srceenplay]

I'm fine with lynching flubber or not_mafia.

[Srceenplay]

I'm not voting outside of flubber and NM

[Srceenplay]

I'm not voting outside of flubber and NM

not even mulch?

Ok. Probably could be easily talked into that.

[Srceenplay]

Why didn't you push me until I pushed you?

@Screenplay

Probably could be easily talked into that.

Where did it change? Were you just hoping to scumread me to discredit me?

I don't know where you are getting any of this.
I have never Town read you or said that I do.

[Srceenplay]

So

[Srceenplay]

have you missed all of mulchs posts the last 3 pages? go read those for the case

To be fair mulch doesn't have a case. He is just trying to be loud.

[Srceenplay]

i also separately was noting in the process that no one questioned ironstove about that

Maybe none thought there was something to question

[Srceenplay]

right now it seems like it's just us being STUPID and INSANE

[Srceenplay]

There is no case on me.
The L-1 test you made to hammer is a little unfair. Flubber is not voting. If he shows up, where do you think that vote is going? Basically consider me L-1 now.
I can't believe you people see me getting on a role cop wagon as scum. I haven't played much with you guys but that and voting myself is something that I do not do.

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: srceenplay

don't know if the last one actually counts

nvm

So, for real, man. What's the case on Screen, hmm?

Bad power role soft, bad push on me, bad defense to me. Look in iso for details

You are full of shit. You thinking you saw a soft and wrong is not my fault. Bad push? You just said I haven't pushed you. Trust me, if I am lynched you are fucked next day for this shit because you are making up excuses to vote me that suck.

[Srceenplay]

There is no case on me.
The L-1 test you made to hammer is a little unfair. Flubber is not voting. If he shows up, where do you think that vote is going? Basically consider me L-1 now.
I can't believe you people see me getting on a role cop wagon as scum. I haven't played much with you guys but that and voting myself is something that I do not do.

You were the second to last vote when the momentum was strongly in favor of his lynch.

It doesn't matter. I was the other possible lynch. I would sacrifice myself before I lynched a power role teammate.

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: Screenplay

I don't buy this

What is it that you don't buy?

I told you when you entered I thought you might be scum. Now you voting me without reason is confirming that thought.

This is the bad push. I said you never pushed me early game, stop twisting my words.

How is that a push. I just reiterated what I said early game.

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: srceenplay

don't know if the last one actually counts

nvm

So, for real, man. What's the case on Screen, hmm?

Bad power role soft, bad push on me, bad defense to me. Look in iso for details

You are full of shit. You thinking you saw a soft and wrong is not my fault. Bad push? You just said I haven't pushed you. Trust me, if I am lynched you are fucked next day for this shit because you are making up excuses to vote me that suck.

We can lynch Mulch today, man, if you have to contribute to any case pls do so, eh?

I don't have a case on mulch and don't want to vote him right now.
If I get flipped definitely look into him or just vig him.

[Srceenplay]

I'm done playing with him. He does not make games fun and I don't like his play style.

[Srceenplay]

If I said I softened a role somewhere I could understand.
You saying you misunderstood something as a soft and it is damning evidence that I'm scum makes no sense.

[Srceenplay]

You also argued me on a team with someone else(don't remember who), both with the reasoning that I hadn't mentioned them in my ISO.
One has flipped scum and one has flipped Town. So I don't see that as an accurate way to scum read me neither.

[Srceenplay]

which is still good enough reason not to lynch you now

Get to it later looks as if I would get to the game or reads later. Is that what you are still asking?

[Srceenplay]

You also argued me on a team with someone else(don't remember who), both with the reasoning that I hadn't mentioned them in my ISO.
One has flipped scum and one has flipped Town. So I don't see that as an accurate way to scum read me neither.

it was sesq, who hasn't flipped

Ok. I was wrong. It looks like that slot is iron stove. Not scum reading that slot.

[Srceenplay]

i still would've rather lynched someone off the tywin wagon

By helping my lynch go through you are going against your better judgment.
At least reread my ISO and ask me any questions so I can make sure I try to clear up any misconceptions.

[Srceenplay]

vote count is wrong

Fixed - Wheme

[Srceenplay]

won't end until I find a replacement and I will add time

[Srceenplay]

It blows my mind that you guys can honestly believe I'm a better lynch than flubber. He was off the Twyin lynch. Town read Twyin. Both things I didn't do. The only thing I'm guilty of is a made up crime that you guys are blindly following. Because of it I can see it losing the game for us.

[Srceenplay]

Tywin tried to save himself by voting for Screen knowing a few had scum read Screen, that may have gotten people to lynch Screen over him. Rolecop is a powerful role for scum, so it could possibly be that screen may be the goon a dispensable role for scum, and tywin may have seen that he had no choice other than to push for the other wagon that was counter to him, and save his bacon.

You own reasoning makes horrible sense. Town got lucky. Caught two scum day 1. Goon did all he could to make sure he survived and the role cop dies. The next day the goon makes a point to vote off the Twyin wagon because he know it that's common fucking sense.

[Srceenplay]

Ty Ironstove.

[Srceenplay]

I feel that is inevitable. It's wrong though.
Please don't quick lynch until I have time to give reads and thoughts.
Obviously both scum did buss role cop.

[Srceenplay]

I really wish vig would have shot me.
I suppose there is a chance I was jailed.

[Srceenplay]

Can everyone give there reason for scum reading me?
Might be helpful for later.

[Srceenplay]

Also. I thought I had over the night.
Why would both scum buss unless they had a plan and didn't need the role cop?

[Srceenplay]

Also this beginning of day stuff by srceenplay makes me wary there but Lang's a bigger priority.

Tell what you don't like. We can't afford to be vague any more. I know I'm the worst for it.

My point was I was the other lynch possibility. After WM quick blind vote I wanted to be sure to get something in before everyone decides just to follow suit, even if you already have predetermined that you want to vote me. After yesterday it was obvious people do.
So I'm just saying let's slow down and talk and think.

[Srceenplay]

Ok. I have reread some and I keep talking myself out of sticking to anything.

Kunk
Lang
Why Mafia
Mulch

That much is obvious. Just going to have to bounce thoughts off each other later.

[Srceenplay]

Why are you town, Screen?

That's a silly question.
I would rather not get started with bs with you again.
Maybe someone else can come and bounce thoughts around.

[Srceenplay]

I think I've played with NM before and he had lurked as Town.
Other than that I don't have a read on him. I thought wave was scum from tone and gut. I reread most of day 1 and still felt the same.

Kunk in back and forth on. Early game I thought you were playing with to much information. Lately I have got that feeling.

Mulch on reread I thought I found some contradicting statements but thinking about it I might be wrong.
I thought he was Town reading me when he came in. Then the next day had me on a lynch list. Then after I claimed said he doesn't Town read me any because he thought I was PR. (That was my perspective on read through but not sure now after double checking it.)

Lang hammered. I was going off the assumption that scum wouldn't buss the role cop. Didn't make sense. Now it's a known fact that both had to have bussed. My thought on that would be if scum can get Town cred from lynching role cop scum can make up for not having a role cop by having a mass claim.

[Srceenplay]

VOTE: Lang

Give some thoughts first.

Why Mafia can you do the same?

[Srceenplay]

I think I've played with NM before and iirc he had lurked as Town.
Other than that I don't have a read on him. I thought wave was scum from tone and gut. I reread most of day 1 and still felt the same.

Kunk I am back and forth on. Early game I thought you were playing with to much information. Lately I have not got that feeling.

Mulch on reread I thought I found some contradicting statements but thinking about it I might be wrong.
I thought he was Town reading me when he came in. Then the next day had me on a lynch list. Then after I claimed said he doesn't Town read me any because he thought I was PR. (That was my perspective on read through but not sure now after double checking it.)

Lang hammered. I was going off the assumption that scum wouldn't buss the role cop. Didn't make sense. Now it's a known fact that both scum had to have bussed. My thought on that would be if scum can get Town cred from lynching role cop scum can make up for not having a role cop by having a mass claim.

Fixed some errors.

I'll also add that waves vote was early. He then shaded people without voting and disappeared for most of the day.
I personally think it is reasonable to think he was distancing at first and then with the time away, he didn't have time to naturally get off the wagon.

[Srceenplay]

Can you figure out my winrate?

[Srceenplay]

No one has anything?
Comment of my post at least.

[Srceenplay]

Your lack of helping is clear.

[Srceenplay]

Helping scum?

And how would you know who is scum?

[Srceenplay]

That wouldn't be knowing. That would be assuming. That is also wrong.

[Srceenplay]

You guys all suck.
I said let's talk things out and everyone just blind votes. No discussion.

[Srceenplay]

Anyone have a reason not to vote NotMafia?

[Srceenplay]

NotMafia didn't even show himself scum reading Lang and hammers without discussion killing they day early.
No town would do that in that situation.

[Srceenplay]

It should also be made clear that no one should officially vote.
Say who you intend to vote but don't actually do it.

I intend to vote nm

[Srceenplay]

guyy(5 L-2!) : Raya, Smoothblue, Commknight, Flubbernugget, Srceenplay

If guyy is town, I'd be surprised if this wagon were all town

Kunkstar, you had asked why I think guyy was awkward.

I think acting confused is really awkward in RVS, and I expect town to be more supportive of people having reasoning on page 1 no matter how thin it may be. He seems to be scumhunting now though, but his votes arent following his reads. I really think I'm onto something here.

How much of a scumtell is that, really? I think several people were confused at 23, myself included, just the way it is worded.

The first part seems to me like setting up future mislynchs with a guy mislynch.

Next part defending kunk

Actually, VOTE: TywinL

Non-RVS

Then he votes Twyin and leaves it there the rest of the day.
His reasoning for voting to me seems similar to what he was defending against.

Alright I'm back in this boys

I've got some theories, let me review the game and I'll post tonight

Then post this right before day end. Doesn't unvote. Doesn't ever explain theories. I would think if you came back with fresh new ideas you wanted to explain you would have at least unvoted.

[Srceenplay]

Did you read my post?

[Srceenplay]

I think you are the partner.
I'll get to your ISO in a bit.

[Srceenplay]

*kunk

[Srceenplay]

Alright, besides the fact that apparently one word posts are a thing, lets see what we can do.

@wavemode: Want to elaborate on that vote a bit...at all even? Just voting with no context doesn't provide anything to convince anyone else, so I don't know how the hell you expect to get someone lynched if you honestly believe in your vote.

I think Raya handled the random stuff in good faith, not being fazed at all (despite the debacle of "is it pressure or is it not" that went on). Disregarding me completely seems pretty town to me, the disregard comes off as a townie who doesn't care about personal survival and rather finding the content that should be discussed instead.

Tywin is another thing, if he noticed that the idea was to run up pressure then why call out kop on it rather than help out? Seems disingenuous to me. I don't think there's any wrong intent in kop there since he obviously mistook my post initially, so very misplaced vote there by Tywin.

Vote: Tywin

for the insincerity.

Everyone else so far pretty much has said nothing of substance, so no reads there.

Your 3rd post of the day. Shade a confirmed scum and shade my scum read. Also buddy up a town player.

VOTE: wavemode

This is a crap post and you should feel bad for making it. Literally zero context. We already went over this. To top it off, it tells me nothing about your alignment because it's just as likely it's lazy town. Try again.

29 just seemed very forced and reachy to me

Ok, so same feeling I had on this, reasonable enough.

Guyy's awkward posturing through rvs should be self evident

How was guyy's posturing awkward? Considering his ISO is just an RVS vote and the subsequent unvote+agreeing with me, lets just narrow it down to his last post. Do you have an issue with guyy's Post #58, and if so what's the issue?

I'll sheep. I don't get what the slip is but what ever.

I can't tell what the slip is either, so that should use some explanation, but the blind sheep is bad. Same as sesq though, seems to be null identifier because its also just bad town play as well.
@CommKnight: Please point out the slip from guyy and what it means?

Changing my vote from RVS to serious until he shows some initiative to scumhunting rather than posting mindlessly.

This is too easy of a place to put a vote, just feels like a place for scum to park their vote without really making waves. I don't like this move.

I need at least 3 daykills at this point god.

Can by lynched:

guyy
assemblerotws
sesq
srceenplay
TywinL
wavemode
Flubbernugget
SmoothBlue

Null (pending responses):

CommKnight

Probably town:

Raya36
kop

His very next post he attacks sesq for voting wave. Kunk literally just shaded that slot but now it's a bad vote.

Also turns around and is understanding of wave.

I make a blind vote on someone (the thing seqs just did) and it's just meh.

Probably scum:
srceenplay
CommKnight

Null/Scum-leaning (willing to lynch any of these as they are actively detrimental to town):
sesq
Assemblerotws
guyy

Null (not acting poorly):
Smoothblue
TywinL
wavemode

Probably town:
Raya36 (pretty good contributions)
kop (need a bit more here, but kinda gut)
Flubbernugget (I like #136 and #137)

Just a few days later both wave and Twyin go from possible lynches to null have done anything bad.
Remember he had a post a few back where he was shading them.

[Srceenplay]

That's a start.

[Srceenplay]

You know what? I think I want a Commknight lynch over a srceenplay one. I'm analysing Mulch's reads (later on in this post) and his points on srceenplay made me relook at srceenplay.

I maintain my position that the blind sheep is a null identifier. #101 is still too emotional of a reaction and he doesn't provide any counter points, so just looks like deflection.
In post 129, Srceenplay wrote:
Plus I don't like it when there a people who are not voting. I would hate to be one of them.

Why srceenplay is concerned with appearances (specifically the location of the vote) is not really a town position, but meta could prove me misled here. I will say that so far srceenplay has been consistent with his vote, as from the vote in #138 onward in his iso has specifically focused on that vote, even if he is following up quite weakly, its still something I guess.

In post 168, Srceenplay wrote:
I'm a gut read player.
I reread and gave my gut reads. I'm horrible at giving reasons for them. Something I'm try to work on.

This bothers me because it's consistent with his play so far, and coupled with the above point about his vote makes sense. I just wish we could get more out of him rather than "gut" because without that "more" its hard to pin someone down on a read and hold them to consistency.

I feel like this is him conceding move on from me but to throwing just enough shade that he can come back later. He says I'm consistent but ends it with not being able to tell if I'm consistent.

In post 208, Mulch wrote:
I'm having a hard time this game trying to figure out exactly what to do with Screen's comment. I feel like there is a chance he's just a wolf, but tbh I do think it's best to consider it NAI and the fact that so many people pushed on it is so alarming. For everyone voting him: Do you follow their reasoning? Yes, I can follow it, and I think town and scum can easily jump on it as well. But...it's also just something that's so blatantly on the surface scummy that it's pathetically easy for scum to push it, which is why I'm wary of scum pushing on it for an easy push in lieu of actually scumhunting and finding true allignment indicative things.

Ok, wait. So there's a little bit of ambiguity here on what you mean by screen's comment, but assuming the "sheep" one is the most contentious and the one that started the wagon, that's the one I'm going with. If we take a look at the highest level of the screen wagon (VC in #126, we have 5 people on that wagon: Mulch, Tywin, Raya, Kop, and myself. Of these people both Mulch and myself have declared the comment NAI and don't use it as a basis for the vote.
Kop clearly uses it as his basis here:
In post 118, Kop wrote:
You voted for someone on the basis of not knowing what the slip was in the first place. I can't think of how you could even justify you jumping onto the wagon that was forming other than getting on a easy safe wagon. All you've done is replace one safe wagon with yourself.

Kop also has not rescinded this fact nor discussed anything further actually.
Raya clearly uses it as his basis in #86. No change of opinion here either, no further discussion.
Tywin clearly uses it as a basis in #73 and doubles down on it in #180.
Commknight, Flubbernugget, sesq, Smoothblue, wavemode don't discuss it.
Guyy also maintains its NAI.

Tywin seems to hashing out his opinion on the ordeal currently, so I'll let Mulch continue that string.
@Raya and @Kop:
Besides the blind sheep on the guyy wagon is there any other reason why you are voting srceenplay?

It's hard for me to explain what I'm feel here but it seems though he is scum reading Town players on my wagon. All while not scum reading me but scum reading me.

I'd be willing to go with a Tywin lynch, but a lot less comfortable with it than a Commknight one. I personally find your position on Tywin a bit flimsy, because it's predicated on a whole bunch of interactions (or lack thereof) that can't be proven in D1. Tywin does double down on the whole srceenplay sheep thing, which in a weird way gives his conviction in a srceenplay lynch a bit more weight because

it's as if he actually believes in the lynch,

but other than that I'm not particularly impressed by his place this game.

Here it looks like he know Twyin is scum because he implies he knows Twyin is making up the read.

[Srceenplay]

That's all I have time for ATM

[Srceenplay]

but they don't follow what his stances were.

Kunk and Wave are a team
Comm and Kop are possibilities as well.

Comm and Kop are possibilities as well.

Not as a team per day but as scum possibilities

The framing of that iso reread is pretty disingenuous, deliberately missing context on some of those quotes to make it appear as if I was being contradictory.

If you think that is true show it. You just stating it doesn't make it true.
If you think something is revelant that's left out add it in.

I left out some parts of the posts that I felt were unrelated. A lot of your posts were long and I didn't want a wall post with information that isn't revelant.

[Srceenplay]

I always thought it was you two early on.
I started to second guess you but now think that was wrong.

[Srceenplay]

N1 Lang
N2 kunk
N3 not mafia

If we are able to lynch scum today and you are unable to block the kill you will most likely be dead come tomorrow.
It would be good for you to get out all of your thoughts and reads today.
Also I don't think you should announce your jail target.

[Srceenplay]

Skimmed Mulch ISO. Will do him tomorrow. I might be second guessing again.

[Srceenplay]

first off I think Mulch did alright at the start of his replace in. It felt a little off to me. I think his tone was different to what i was used to.

VOTE: tywin

VOTE: tywin

Why?

For someone trying to put their thoughts into actual words, this vote is pretty shit.

Have you read the fucking game?

So he votes twyin and this is his reasoning. The closest time he mentioned him before that was 3 or 4 days prior.

Kop, Flubbernugget, Srceenplay, Sesq


These are the 4 lynches for today. I don't want to do Screen or Sesq yet.

l-1

impulse to hammer

here he gives his lynch pool. says I'm a mistakes in a different post because the lynch pool is those off of the twyin lynch. Cant fault him to much for that because i had the same reasoning. We know that scum bussed that day.
so after giving the pool he says impulse to hammer Lang. Again granted he says lang and i get no credit for the lynch because we did nothing but he is in the same boat.

the other things that bother me rereading
he scum reads lang but agrees to do mass claim idea
His push on me for thinking i soft a PR. It blows my mind that anyone can think anything from that.
His tone has defentily changed from when he first entered. Its not the same, which would lead me to believe one of them is not natural.

Mulch, can you point me to one post where you think Kop isn't gamesolving?

198 and who cares?

Mulch if 198 is the best example you have of kop not scum hunting you really need to re think your read

I think he's doing a ton of scum hunting. But results are results and he pushed the main wagon away from the mafia's best role. And he pushed Sesq right now which is an easy push.


But, maybe.


Question: Why the hell did you just unvote on Lang's recent awful post?

trying to vote Kop for not voting Twyin?

[Srceenplay]

thats enough for now

[Srceenplay]

It's not out of the realm of possibility that mulch and kunk are scum together.

I like the idea from kunk though that at the very least nm couldn't have killed so shouldn't be the vote for today.

[Srceenplay]

No one else want to contribute and add anything?

[Srceenplay]

I'm voting srceenplay today. Right now all that I'm waiting on is for Kop to announce his target. I put forth my suggestion and reasoning for it, I don't have much else to add, I don't think there's anything that could really sway my position for today.

Why not add your reads. Even if you think I'm scum you should be looking for the other on. Not looking for the other scum shows me you are looking for this last mislynch to win the game.

[Srceenplay]

Prod the mod to prod the players

[Srceenplay]

Not giving reads.
That to me implies that you think you have already won.

[Srceenplay]

You saying 2 names doesn't convey your reasoning or thought process.
What do you plan to say to convince other hers to vote with you?

[Srceenplay]

Mulch: These are my reads
Srceenplay: Why aren't you giving reads?

Give something.
Again if you think I'm scum you have also got to be looking for the other scum as well unless you plan on the game ending here.

[Srceenplay]

Holy fucking shit.

One of you 3 fuckers is town. It's time to step up and show it to me.

[Srceenplay]

Kop kungstar?
Anything from you?

[Srceenplay]

he's going back and trying to paint things as scummy but they don't follow what his stances wer

Can you give examples. Show us all. Let's have a discussion.

[Srceenplay]

but I don't think scum would reach out that much in aid to put something over the line from a scum POV,

You think scum don't push people? lol

So far I have seen you laugh off two town.

[Srceenplay]

If we lynch scum today that leaves one left.
The way I see it announcing his jail could only create winfom that scum could use to their advantage.
If we mislynch it's game over. So of course I want everyone to slow down and discuss. This possibly the last chance.
To not care to get your position out or say my mind is already made up is not cool.

You three all say you scum read me. One of you is town. I'm asking that Town person to think/discuss who the last one is and why.
Explain your thought process so I can pick up on if you are genuine or Town tells.

[Srceenplay]

Honestly you are right. I do not give up as Town or scum.
The fact of the matter is I'm Town and I'm not giving up. You three all seem as you have or don't really give a fuck. So again whom ever is town really needs to step up.

[Srceenplay]

Honestly you are right.

I do not give up as Town or scum.
The fact of the matter is I'm Town and I'm not giving up. You three all seem as you have or don't really give a fuck. So again whom ever is town really needs to step up.

FTFY

I was trying to make two points.

[Srceenplay]

If I am right why didn't you refute that bullshit?

Me agreeing with you shouldn't matter.
At this point you should be defending yourself and not blowing us off.

[Srceenplay]

Me and kop and this game.

[Srceenplay]

I'm telling you two of you three are.
And
None of you are helping sort.

[Srceenplay]

You saying 2 names doesn't convey your reasoning or thought process.
What do you plan to say to convince other hers to vote with you?

Mulch: These are my reads
Srceenplay: Why aren't you giving reads?

Give something.
Again if you think I'm scum you have also got to be looking for the other scum as well unless you plan on the game ending here.

You and Not_Mafia

[Srceenplay]

You are not trying to convey your thought process at all.

[Srceenplay]

That's all you have?
I'm scum because you think I soft claimed a role.
And
NotMafia because of a shitty hammer.

[Srceenplay]

You need to fix your name. Spelled it wrong.
It's CNN, fake news.

What am I manipulating.
What has been extra scumy?
What is forced?

[Srceenplay]

That's all you got from that post?

[Srceenplay]

It's a joke. You spelled name wrong. It's supposed to be spelled CNN.

[Srceenplay]

I have no clue what you’re on about

Get a clue about something and share it.

[Srceenplay]

This distancing

This is mulch not trying

[Srceenplay]

That's a lie. It's become obvious you came into this day predetermined to get me lynched

[Srceenplay]

Me flailing is a lie

[Srceenplay]

It's become obvious you came into this day predetermined to get me lynched

This is not neccecarily true, although it has hints of truthfullness. I expected that I would want to get you lynched today because you were one of my highest scumreads. But your play this day has not helped at all, from the completely eliminating Not_Mafia from being voted, not disputing the idiotic way Kop townread you, and your manipulation and discrediting of me.

My reasoning for nm is the same as kunks. Your not shading him. I feel it's my job to Town tell hard at this game stage. I'm glad kop picked up on it. I'm not manipulating you.

[Srceenplay]

So would you vote NM no questions asked?

[Srceenplay]

The way I see it announcing his jail could only create winfom that scum could use to their advantage.

Can you explain what you meant by this?

Later. Drinking playing sc2mafia

[Srceenplay]

You accused me of being scum for not trying, when I try harder as scum. How is that you not flailing

Your trying to pass a truth tell? I dont know. I don't know your meta enough to respond. What do you expect me to say.

[Srceenplay]

I agree with kop.
The thing is though I feel like it's game throwing if he is town. I would expect Town to try and step up and try to convey that some how.

[Srceenplay]

Kunk

It feels like he is waiting in the shadows