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One other thing I noticed is scum doesn't have any safe fake PR claims. If scum knows they're in row 1, they can fake BP and if they know they're in column B they can fake claim doctor.
In post 20, PenguinPower wrote:Right now, the setup is open for public comment. My hope is that the new setup will be implemented within the next week or two.
Depending on the comments that could change or not.
Fair enough. I'd still like to mod a game to get a feel for the new setup.
In post 41, Virtuoso wrote:I do worry this setup will become too confusing for newbies
It's a potential consideration, which is why clear presentation and probably a standardized setup discussion are probably going to be part of every mod's opening posts in this setup.
Yeah. Though from a newbie perspective, a long wall post on a discussion of the setup from the mod will probably overwhelm me when everything else seems overwhelming at first.
When I was new, it took me about a game or two to understand matrix 6.
This is considered site standard elsewhere on the site. While not universal, it is by FAR the most common, and it has a strong mafia history backing it. (Mafia roles trumping town roles; roleblocker > RB variant in this case JK.) Soyeah, I do support this.
Yeah. I think it should be the set in stone way of resolving actions via NAR and normal guidelines IMO
not be assigned the night kill, there will be no other impact.
Should a
Mafia Roleblocker
target a
Town Roleblocker
who targets a
Town Jailkeeper
who targets the
Mafia Roleblocker
, the
Mafia Roleblocker
will not be blocked, but the two
Town
roles will be blocked. Similarly, should a
Mafia Roleblocker
target a
Town Jailkeeper
who targets a
Town Roleblocker
who targets the
Mafia Roleblocker
, the
Mafia Roleblocker
will not be blocked, but the two
Town
roles will be blocked.
In all other cases, Roleblocker actions will take precedence over
Jailkeeper
actions should that apply.
Basically this punishes town for having roles that block town, which I think is reasonable from a fairness perspective, since the alternative gives town a LOT of latitude to make bad decisions and get away with them.
This is rather confusing to me and IMO will result in a lot of mod errors
Adding the rolecop to column C completely destroys the follow the tracker strategy. The rolecop also balances out the Jailkeeper, which is quite strong especially when one scum dies.
A town roleblocker gates the tracker by possibly blocking the tracker.
A town universal backup in the first example would be able to inheret the mafia roleblockr ability if he is lynched
I'm just not sure about column in the second table
In post 146, Virtuoso wrote:@Penguin - what are your thoughts on the setup I proposed?
No.
I don't mean to be so blunt, but I'm not looking for a complete setup change without reasoning behind it.
Fair enough.
A
B
C
1
Town Jailkeeper
Vanilla Townie
Mafia Goon (if row 1)
Mafia Rolecop (if column c)
2
Mafia Roleblocker
Town Cop
Town Doctor
3
Town Backup (if A)
Town Roleblocker (if 3)
Mafia Goon
Town Tracker
I think this setup is reasonable and will fix the setup without altering it too much. I firmly believe in keeping things simple and I don't think the 3d3 role is simple. There's too many complexities that will make players confused and even make mods confused. Combine that with day talk and, as RC said, scum win rates will sky rocket.
The setup I am proposing is not that far different from Matrix 6. It fixes the bulletproof claiming strategy and it completely destroys the follow the tracker strategy.
I don't understand the whole triangle setup at all.
The primary reason we are having this discussion is to fix the BP claim strategy and the follow the tracker strategy. This setup does just that while keeping it simple enough for everyone to understand. I don't think we should deviate too far from the old setup
One thing we did on my homesite is that the newbie games were divided in to two parts: The standard matrix 6 setup and once that was over they would do a theme game with flavor and other roles. Not sure how feasible that would be here
