Large Normal 207: Theatre Mafia

[Mulch]

But the last game you play has no bearing on this one, no matter the situation. Just because a player does something in a previous game doesn't mean if they do the same thing here, they are the same alignment.

Yeah, you are misinterpreting that. I told people that Acid is always town when they are useless like this, he provided a counterexample. He's not trying to say that because Acid was similar they are scum here, just that they aren't always town.

[Mulch]

Well, the argument Mulch gave to their idea of acid being town was "meta", without any further explanation.

How exactly do you want me to dscribe meta? It's a vibe thing

[Mulch]

But the last game you play has no bearing on this one, no matter the situation. Just because a player does something in a previous game doesn't mean if they do the same thing here, they are the same alignment.

Yeah, you are misinterpreting that. I told people that Acid is always town when they are useless like this, he provided a counterexample. He's not trying to say that because Acid was similar they are scum here, just that they aren't always town.

I see. So you were using HBA.

not really, I've played multiple games with Acid and modded one of theirs too when they are scum. I'm drawing on many examples, not using one example

[Mulch]

I mean, I’d been saying I thought Jordan was a mislynch even before I went inactive. And I am one of the best people at reading massive, I feel, and i don’t think he’s scum this game. And if he is, I’ll be able to figure that out, but right now, this is pretty standard town massive

This has nothing to do with your scummy point. You thinking they are town separately from wagon construction is fine, but don't use that as an excuse for when you say:


"I think that there are people on Jordan's wagon that are scum (which honestly SHOULD have no influence on your decision anyway)",

but even if Jordan is scum they could be scum anyway

. So you basically just took 3 people and said they could be scum REGARDLESS of Jordan...so why did you bring up Jordan anyway? If it didn't matter?



Also Boon, your not the best day 1 player. So maybe sheep me for once??? And then I'll sheep you lategame if you are alive, unless ur scum ofc.

[Mulch]

Massive? I thought you said Jordan?

[Mulch]

Well, the argument Mulch gave to their idea of acid being town was "meta", without any further explanation.

How exactly do you want me to dscribe meta? It's a vibe thing

Well, you are one of my scumreads, and vague "gutreads", "vibes" and the like coming from a player can be extremely easily faked by scum.
You see the problem?

Yes, but can they also be done by town?

[Mulch]

Ok everyone let's stop this idiotic theory talk and vote Jordan

[Mulch]

Ok everyone let's stop this idiotic theory talk and vote Jordan

Okay, if that doesn't look scummy, I don't know what does.
VOTE: Mulch

Why is that scummy?

[Mulch]

And this one smells like scum.
-Buddying
-asssuming that they will live until lategame with boon
-trying to change a vote via bribery

Buddying is NAI
I am never nightkilled
Asking for votes is towny or NAI

[Mulch]

Ok everyone let's stop this idiotic theory talk and vote Jordan

Okay, if that doesn't look scummy, I don't know what does.
VOTE: Mulch

Why is that scummy?

Are you kidding? This is a combo of Argument of Repetition and Appeal to Emotion! A pretty scummy move if I ever saw one, even more so than the HBA.
Besides, you haven't even given a legit reason for WHY Jordan should be lynched. (At least, not one I've seen.)

I didn't do HBA. When did I do that? I thought I refuted that I did that, actually.

What is arguement of repetition and why is it scummy, and why is appeal to emoition scummy?

He should be lynched because he has not done anything towny, and has made 2 scummy posts, and has refused to follow up on questions I've asked him.

[Mulch]

And this one smells like scum.
-Buddying
-asssuming that they will live until lategame with boon
-trying to change a vote via bribery

Buddying is NAI
I am never nightkilled
Asking for votes is towny or NAI

Are you never nightkilled because you're lynched as scum? Because that seems pretty scummy.

I'm neever lynched as scum, always as town tho.

[Mulch]

Moz I love you mason buddy <3

[Mulch]

lol probaly in your effing pocket

[Mulch]

James, town are often illogical. Scum are normally "logical". And pleasant. And blend in. Mulch is a tricky scum player. But i have expereince with Mulch, and he looks (and FEELS) TOWN TO ME.

Are you accusing me of being scum? Because that looks like EXACTLY what you are doing.

No. Also, respond to my point or you are actually might probably could possibly be scum!!!!

[Mulch]

Mulch has been my number 1 scumread for a long time, and I have tried to push them multiple times. It failed again and again despite their behaviour because some people were using the meta excuse, like with acid(who is also a scumread of mine). Their defense of Acid was also bad.
VOTE: Mulch

It's actually very town because it's quite aggressive, it's trying to get someone lynched. It's not blending in. And scum LOVE theory talk.

Yeah... but that talk was about why their defense of Acid was bad.
And they are aggressive, yes, but.... that could have different reasons: They are under heavy attack, constantly, since I have repeatedly pushed for him, and I was never really alone, and multiple people were suspecting them at some point. At that point, no scum can afford to be not aggressive.

Vig this town^

[Mulch]

Is 879 true or false, NK15?

[Mulch]

For #2, AoR is saying the same thing over and over until everyone begins to think it is true. It's a pretty pungent scumtell.

Dafuck? Why can't town do it to get votes?

[Mulch]

For #2, AoR is saying the same thing over and over until everyone begins to think it is true. It's a pretty pungent scumtell.

Dafuck? Why can't town do it to get votes?

Because it means that you don't really have any reason to vote for him. You're just saying the same thing over and over to get folks to jump on your wagon. That's anti-town AT LEAST, if not scummy.

Who said I don't have a reason? Nobody asked me except now

[Mulch]

Oh, I see your point now. AtE is scummy because it appeals to emotional impulse, rather than logic.

Why is that bad?

[Mulch]

Oh, I see your point now. AtE is scummy because it appeals to emotional impulse, rather than logic.

Why is that bad?

Because in doing so, you're basically appealing to our fear of the Mafia so you can get town lynched. THAT's the danger of AtE; the idea that someone can hesitate into voting the wrong guy and we get a bad kill.

Why can't town use AtE to get a scumread lynched?


Also when did I use AtE lol. Especially when did I use a "fear of the mafia" lmfao

[Mulch]

For #2, AoR is saying the same thing over and over until everyone begins to think it is true. It's a pretty pungent scumtell.

Dafuck? Why can't town do it to get votes?

Because it means that you don't really have any reason to vote for him. You're just saying the same thing over and over to get folks to jump on your wagon. That's anti-town AT LEAST, if not scummy.

Who said I don't have a reason? Nobody asked me except now

Well, I'd like to see it.

Why did you scumread me for it before even asking me for a reason? curious

[Mulch]

Why is bribery bad

[Mulch]

I'm trying to get my scumreads lynched. You 2 are inexperienced and don't unerstand that town can use all tactics available to get their SCUMREADS lynched. Aggresive play is not only scum lol

[Mulch]

But WHY would a townie ever do that?

To get their scumreads lynched?


Also, lol and lmao are meta tells, not scumtells.

And yes, I want people to be afraid of my scumreads. What's wrong with that?

[Mulch]

Why would I push someone without a reason as scum?

[Mulch]

Why would I push someone without a reason as scum?

I don't know. But I still don't see any proof.

If you don't see any scum motiviation how is it scummy lol


Also, how the fuck am I supposed to give proof?

[Mulch]

Because that's EXACTLY what a mafia would do. They breed fear among many to cause dissent and mislynch.

Why woulden't a town do it?

[Mulch]

Anyway here are the things I didn't like about them.

1) They haven't been TOWNY.


2) 619- I feel like their reads on me and acid could be fabricated. I'm not sure, though.

I think Una and Dunker are scum, their posts seem to be less "hey look, there's scum" and more "Hey [insert player here], I think you're right"

This line is legitimately a lie. Dunker has been going around saying everyone is scum. Also, it's not rock solid evidence, but Dunker is often pushed as scum when he is town, he is lynchbait.

Anyway I decided to ask for their reasoning on why I was town and they just ignored it--620.


Then, their scumread in 648 made no sense to me, although I don't often see scum 180ing their reads like that. It;s just such an easy thing to push me on, when it is something really NAI. I mean, I can see town thinking this, but I can also see scum doing this. So there is a possibility for scum motiviation here.

I ask ANOTHER follow up in 650 and still no response.

I disliked 699 his read on NK15 seemed shallow.


And finally 818 made it seem like they knew Massive was town and was trying to setup a lynch on me aftewards.

[Mulch]

Because that's EXACTLY what a mafia would do. They breed fear among many to cause dissent and mislynch.

Why woulden't a town do it?

Breed fear among town? Because that's so anti-town that's not even funny. Making factions is never a good townie idea. They shouldn't need to.

Uh... why not? Why shoulden't I use fear to get my scumreads lynched?

[Mulch]

Lack of proof = no reason for scumread.
No reason for scumread = pressure test or scum mislynch

Nobody has proof in mafia. Some people have REASONS. Sometimes a reason can be as simple as, I don't townread them.

[Mulch]

And Anti-town, in my opinion, is only one step away from scummy.

This is wrong. Also, creating fear to get a scumread lynched isn't anti-town

[Mulch]

More importantly, what towny things have they done. NONE.

[Mulch]

NK15 and James you will learn in time how to read better. I'm not even that good, and moz isn't a god, but we both have a lot more experience with this stuff than you do. Logic isn't always the best way to determine reads.

[Mulch]

A vote on Xandroj

[Mulch]

Same but I really think moz is town

[Mulch]

don't have much time to read atm
what should I vote to avoid no lynch?

Jordan

[Mulch]

would you believe he’s my mason buddy?

No

[Mulch]

Are you hardclaiming Mason buddies?

[Mulch]

Are you hardclaiming Mason buddies?

That’s the only kind of claiming I do!

No, seriously. Are you masons?

[Mulch]

Are you town masons with Jordan??

[Mulch]

That only applies to post # not page #

[Mulch]

Go Jordan

[Mulch]

Why what

[Mulch]

James can be vigged too , ty

[Mulch]

James can be vigged too , ty

And why exactly do you want me killed, Mulch? Is my logic too powerful for you?

I feel like you are going to be a detriment to town

[Mulch]

Why would scum be so obvious that a terrible player like you could pick them up lol

[Mulch]

James can be vigged too , ty

And why exactly do you want me killed, Mulch? Is my logic too powerful for you?

I feel like you are going to be a detriment to town

So a policy kill? You do understand how scummy that sounds, right? You want me dead because I keep pointing out the problems in your posts, not because I'm going to be a town detriment.

I mean, you keep saying random things and saying they are “problems”. Like, me saying “the sky is blue” and that’s scummy for you. Technically true, but not scummy.

This site is called mafiascum.

The sun is hot

The ground is brown

[Mulch]

Why would scum be so obvious that a terrible player like you could pick them up lol

Why am I so bad? Just because I'm new?

The way you are approaching the game is bad. You are already succumbing to confirmation bias , and the things you scumread people for are all bad . Specially the logical fallacies

[Mulch]

Can you answer the questions fully instead of vague one sentence answers- The red responses and subsequent questions were much more multi-faceted and complex than those responses would warrant.

Dude, this sums up half of my problems with your answers. AND YOU SAID IT YOURSELF. A one sentence, vague answer doesn't work.

Just ask me to explain then lol

[Mulch]

James can be vigged too , ty

And why exactly do you want me killed, Mulch? Is my logic too powerful for you?

I feel like you are going to be a detriment to town

So a policy kill? You do understand how scummy that sounds, right? You want me dead because I keep pointing out the problems in your posts, not because I'm going to be a town detriment.

I mean, you keep saying random things and saying they are “problems”. Like, me saying “the sky is blue” and that’s scummy for you. Technically true, but not scummy.

None of these are random. I am taking specific posts and pointing out the obvious flaws in them.

? Everything you have pointed out isn’t scummy. You haven’t even explained why any are scummy .

[Mulch]

The burden of proof is on you. Why are these things scummy?

[Mulch]

How am I “so sure” wtf

[Mulch]

I’m fighting Mulch hard on Jordan lynch. It’s a mislynch.

Why

[Mulch]

Firstly, this is not Burden of Proof. I'm not asking you to prove that you are not scummy, I'm pointing out reasons you could be scummy! Big difference there.
And the scummy stems from:
A: Lots of one-sentence, vague answers (None of which that I just pointed out you will explain.)
B: Obvious panic and self-defense
C: Wanting to kill other players just because they don't agree with you and/or scumread you. Yeah, that especially isn't scummy at all.

Why are one sentence words scummy? Why is self defense scummy?

How do you know I’m panicking? I was not.

I only want to kill bad wrong players, like you and NK15. People I disagree with that are good like rask and boon can live

[Mulch]

i don't like xan wagon at all
VOTE: mulch
looks like this is more likely then moz

Why are you hell bent on ruining this game?

[Mulch]

Name a game you’ve townread me

[Mulch]

boon's last game 1948

I was scum...

[Mulch]

why are you worried about being scumread when normally you dont care

Name a town game I haven't cared lol

[Mulch]

idk but i swear your self meta was not caring about being scumread
or i'm getting mixed up with you and boon.
anyways i already compromised, why are you pushing me if you townread me?
do you still townread me?

I think your lock town and I'm not pushing you at all. That's why I am dissapointed rather than paranoid

[Mulch]

VOTE: Xnad

Better to lynch than no lynch. :/

knew you weren't masons with him

[Mulch]

If this flips scum I wonder if rask could be a scum partner

[Mulch]

Not letting people cfd off of this

[Mulch]

There's just too many towny people ffs

[Mulch]

Not letting people cfd off of this

this is enough of a reason to cfd

What are you doing

[Mulch]

Not letting people cfd off of this

this is enough of a reason to cfd

What are you doing

trying to lynch scum

Your ruining the game, stop and try and remember that I can be town sometimes

[Mulch]

wow sorry for ruining the game by scumreading you

I forgive you

[Mulch]

Ok that's legitimately scummy for Boon. He knows better

[Mulch]

i don't like xan wagon at all
VOTE: mulch
looks like this is more likely then moz

Why are you hell bent on ruining this game?

Wow. Why is voting for you going to ruin the game? What's so bad about being suspicious of all of the stuff you have done, most of which (in my opinion) look REAL scummy?

It's cause I'm pretty confident he's town, which means that we could be finding scum together, and instead he's scumreading me. Also, vote Xandroj or you are scumclaiming. It's too late to have vanity wagons

[Mulch]

I think he's at L-1

[Mulch]

If James dosen't hammer he's confirmed scum

[Mulch]

Fykus, Mulch, Massive, Mozamis, Not Known 15, Texcat, Wave, Boon, Rask


NINE PEOPLE. james hammer or CLAIM SCUM.

[Mulch]

But if Xand is town, My No. 1 scumread is YOU. I just want to make that clear.

This makes me think you know he is town. is this true?

[Mulch]

Okay, why the HECK does not hammering make me confirmed scum?

Because you consciously robbed town of a lynch. When even a mislynch is better than a no lynch.

[Mulch]

because your only argument for him being scum, as far as I've seen, is "He's scum."

You read my arguement and commented on it. This is a lie

[Mulch]

While I'll agree that a mislynch is better than a no-lynch, a mislynch lead by player A whom player B thinks is scummy is not grounds to claim scum on player B just because he doesn't agree. That's like saying all of those who are not on the wagon are scum.

It would have been scummy if you hadn't hammered.

[Mulch]

Mozamis is town

[Mulch]

Mozamis is town

Why?

I’m 99% sure through a meta soul read that can only come from one that has playedwith AND against them as scum in the past months.

Also, I’m salty af that James was scum. I thought he was classic newb town, I wonder if he was an alt

[Mulch]

Ok not 99% sure , but say 70% sure

[Mulch]

Boon I’m so confused at this plan

[Mulch]

So this is basically a glorified mass claim with the slight possibility of confusing the mafia into fucking up. Your not slick boon

[Mulch]

One of them could be a mafia power role blocked by dunker...

[Mulch]

Boon how the fuck is this confirming anything?? Should I just be trusting you because this makes zero sense and you clearly have inside role related knowledge helping you Your decision on why this is worth it.

Right?
Right?

[Mulch]

Result

[Mulch]

I'm completely shook that James was scum. So much for being more trusting that those attack me can be wrong town and not immediately OMGUSing...

WHY. WHY THE ONE TIME IT WAS SCUM DO I PLAY nice and try to convince him I'm wrong. FFs

[Mulch]

Wave scum?

[Mulch]

Moz is scum right now, though, but I’m trying to potentially put another scum and get us some conf townies before I kick the bucket.

Moz isn't scum

[Mulch]

Rask seems scummy, tbh

[Mulch]

Who townreads Rask and why>?

[Mulch]

but I cannot pull them out of my hat.

There are other places to pull them out of


VOTE: Wavemode

spicy

[Mulch]

VOTE: Acidphoenix
For the reasons supplied yesterday before lynch as well as the Dunker death and its implications.

Stop.

[Mulch]

but it looks to me like Boon and Carcalily are trying desperately to cover for Mulch here.

So he might be bussign. More likely he was trying to stir shit though. So Carc town?

Actually makes me lean carc scum.

[Mulch]

So like...

I’m an Ascetic watcher, and I got two names targeting Dunker last night. I targeted Dunker because he was targeting Moz and Mulch back and forth randomly, and if you check the rest of Dunker’s games, he was playing pretty similar to all his other PR games. The moz and mulch thing is relevant because if Moz/Mulch were ScumScum, TownTown, or TownScum, it makes a lot of since to kill Dunker to either frame either of them or play the “Why would I kill him? Dunker’s not a threat to me if I was scum?”

This being said, Dunker was also a perfect low info kill, which is great for scum who likes how current things are going, and after that Jordan lynch, it was a likely target.

So yeah. I’m catching one scum today no matter what, so...I’m ready to catch multiple scum today, so I’ll keep you all in suspense for a bit. But I’m stoked.

I don't get how 2 scum could target him

[Mulch]

Also, what does this have to do with "results"

Boon I don't know your dillema, why we had to do this weird ass massclaim, just say the 2 names, they will claim their roles, whoever is less fishy we will let live, the other is lynched, with all luck you will be nightkilled while you watch our power role that gets to live on

[Mulch]

Then let's discuss flipping moz?

All in favor say VOTE: mozamis

All opposed, please claim scum now and save us some time

Opposed

[Mulch]

make sure i dont get to l-2

STOP. I THINK YOUR THE VIG AND I'M FURIOUS

[Mulch]

STOP. I THINK YOUR THE VIG AND I'M FURIOUS

hpw is that a pro town thing to post, Mulch?

Sorry couldn't resist

[Mulch]

lol.....

Hi vig xD


I was pretty sure it was you after you shot James, everyone else shoots me pretty sure. Lol

[Mulch]

Also u were obvious town

[Mulch]

lol.....

Hi vig xD


I was pretty sure it was you after you shot James, everyone else shoots me pretty sure. Lol

Why wouldn’t I have shot James?

You claimed watcher????

[Mulch]

lol.....

Hi vig xD


I was pretty sure it was you after you shot James, everyone else shoots me pretty sure. Lol

Why wouldn’t I have shot James?

You claimed watcher????

Not prior to you proclaiming Moz town.

True. I THOUght Was him, not knew

[Mulch]

VOTE: acidphoenix
Scum ISO here, hopefully killer as well

Seems stupid doing anything and pretending its going to happen when we're 100% lynching in the results though, literally no point of wagoning anyone if its not one of the 2

maybe if lucky this is the scum sent

VOTE: Rask

This flips red

[Mulch]

Btw acid's scum because when I iso'd to see why he voted moz he scumread him most of the game but the most I got for why is that he implied moz had bad reads

Acid is town

[Mulch]

Like, do I unvote? Man I don't even know. I'm not saying I need to be lead around like a horse but whatever happened to town just telling the truth to each other.

le sigh

Moz makes no sense as the vig. Why would he push to lynch lurkers if he had the ability to bump them off in the middle of the night?

this is scum logic

[Mulch]

I wouldn't be opposed to a bunch of mod kills, and then let the rest of us get on with it.

[Mulch]

VOTE: Pisskop

[Mulch]

Mulchy, mulchy, he’s so fun, he’s so fun, he was number 1!
Rask, rask, aloof and true, he’s so true, he’s number 2.
Assemblerot, so young and free, so free...he’s number 3.
Mozamis, you want some more, that’s okay, you’ll be number 4.
Wavemode, shmavemode, you’re still alive, you can be number 5.

The fuck is this shit lol

[Mulch]

I wouldn't be opposed to a bunch of mod kills, and then let the rest of us get on with it.

good call

[Mulch]

VOTE: Modkill

[Mulch]

Those modkill votes really fuck up the votecounter and I'm on mobile in class so it's hard to do a good votecount.
I'll discuss modkilling with Gamma, if I don't get a reply by tomorrow, modkilling it probably is.

Is that fine?

Yes

[Mulch]

I voted for pisskop so that’s hammer . Gg

[Mulch]

I voted for pisskop so that’s hammer . Gg

Figure me out, Mulch. I’m sending you telepathic messages. I’m passing down one for all to you. It’s on you.

Sincerely hope I’m not supposed to understand this

[Mulch]

Boon definitely
Passing some weird ass role signal for when he’s dead


Rofl

[Mulch]

Is that lynch? I had a PBPA and a case made, but I'll not post it if lynched.

Post the case

[Mulch]

I mean, he’s scum.

Oh
VOTE: loudmouthlee

[Mulch]

VOTE: rask


Also boon check me n1 which means I’m confirmed town. Cause he didn’t die

[Mulch]

Also I called this day 1 nobody listened

[Mulch]

“Explicitly non normal”

Lol

Damn this is hilarious

[Mulch]

think everyone should unvote

?

[Mulch]

EXPLICITLY NON NORMAL

[Mulch]

Boon targeted me n1 when he dies when he targets scum


So I'm mechanically cleared

[Mulch]

VOTE: mulch

Do u know rasks role is literally impossible

[Mulch]

I called this BTW

[Mulch]

no

VOTE: Fykus

[Mulch]

Nero stop being scummy

Wave is town

[Mulch]

Nero gamethrowing again I guess

[Mulch]

@Fykus

Claim vigilante or not vigilante

That's it

[Mulch]

I'm not the vigilante bub

[Mulch]

VOTE: texcat

[Mulch]

Nero historically who has had Better reads

[Mulch]

ok

[Mulch]

Wave can I direct your shot

[Mulch]

Nero gamthrowing again, what else is new

[Mulch]

vote:acid

Holy shit you are a game thrower

[Mulch]

VOTE: massive

[Mulch]

VOTE: texcat

[Mulch]

Mulch
Una/nero




Acid








Massive


VOTE: massive

[Mulch]

Mulch
Nero
Una
Acid
Massive

[Mulch]

Nero claim or I'm gonna policy lynch you

[Mulch]

Wait did you just say I’m not vanilla?

[Mulch]

VOTE: nero

I’m vt


The scumslip

[Mulch]

There can’t be a traitor because traitors don’t count for parity. If there was a traitor left they would be endgamed


Nero was caught in a lie. String him up

[Mulch]

vote:Mulch

I apparently have a guilty so yeah.

This is not the reaction of someone who is fake claiming


Everyone lynch
Nero


He literally fucked up

I don’t know why but he did

[Mulch]

Una

He scum slipped


I don’t know why
I
But he did

And if he’s somehow town then I’m reporting him for gamethrowing

But he’s scum

[Mulch]

What did I do that's a "scumslip"?

You claimed a guilty on me lmfao when I’m confirmed town

[Mulch]

vote:Mulch

I apparently have a guilty so yeah.

[Mulch]

vote:Mulch

I apparently have a guilty so yeah.

Sell it by voting on a confirmed town???

[Mulch]

Nero——-> massive


Wins the game

[Mulch]

.,:

VOTE: massive

[Mulch]

Acid is town una is town

It's massive or nero

[Mulch]

it wasn't an impossibility that scum roleblocks Boon n1 and thus there wasn't an inno on Mulch.