Open 695: Making Friends and Enemies [Mafia Win!]

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Sup?

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Slow game. Looks like everyone has confirmed? Why the lack of posts?

Assemblrotws, any reason for the vote? Anything at all?

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Hi Chisa, are you an alt?

Are you?

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Just going to repost this for the new people in the game: viewtopic.php?p=9681842#p9681842

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Slow game. Looks like everyone has confirmed? Why the lack of posts?

Assemblrotws, any reason for the vote? Anything at all?

Eh. It's a Friday, and the weekend. Not to mention this game is pretty straight forward, so there is little need to discuss game mechanics. Ultimately this game is going to come down to good ol' raw scumhunting!

By the way, why are you asking Assembl for reasons for his vote when the person he is voting has yet to even comment?

Because I assume he has Some kind of reason judging based on what I know of them. I know he's a lurker. I know he is logical. That means he theoretically should make every vote count.

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Slow game. Looks like everyone has confirmed? Why the lack of posts?

Assemblrotws, any reason for the vote? Anything at all?

Eh. It's a Friday, and the weekend. Not to mention this game is pretty straight forward, so there is little need to discuss game mechanics. Ultimately this game is going to come down to good ol' raw scumhunting!

By the way, why are you asking Assembl for reasons for his vote when the person he is voting has yet to even comment?

Because I assume he has Some kind of reason judging based on what I know of them. I know he's a lurker. I know he is logical. That means he theoretically should make every post count.

Post

EBWOP Not that vote doesn't apply, but it wasn't what I meant originally.

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Riiight, so do you have a waifu pillow? Or are you only semi-weeb?
https://www.google.co.nz/amp/s/www.urba ... b&amp=true

Kinda wish I hadn't read that.

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Epic Fial is having some problems with the site, so he cannot post yet. We are working with him to try to resolve the issue. In the mean time, he will not be prodded for not posting.

VOTE: Chisa Weebs are just a no from me.

Well, this at the very least means they were not posting in the Scum chat.

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Also, you guys, I'm sorry if I'm coming across badly because I'm new, but there are now 5 votes on me and two more would end the day while it's still in the random shitposting phase. I don't think that's a good idea.

I'm inclined to agree actually.

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Why would you post that, quick? You should know RVS wagons are for gathering information, not for quicklynching.

I am going to VOTE: Awoo for piling onto an easy wagon formed during the shitposting phase. Scum love easy lynches.

Nice, looks like the game is on, baby

VOTE: Quick

I've seen quicklynches happen and Scum got away with it because "oh I didn't know that was the hammer". I have this policy in all my games and its not because I am Scum. On top of that, I have never seen a quick wagon really amount to anything significant in a game. Some people will Town read the slot that is Quickwagoned, some will Scum read it. It just sucks for reading people actually, and there is the chance it ends in a quick lynch so I just try and avoid them altogether.

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I hopped off of a random wagon onto a serious vote. Got a problem with that, collegeboy?

Not to mention jamiett has a towny vote on me. Even though he's completely wrong about the site meta, it's a town thought process.

So you're voting quick for being too precious? Agree Jamie feels town this time.

VOTE: lucca serious omgus vote.

This is a horrible vote. Like you didn't even talk about Lucca in this post and yet you "seriously OMGUS" them.

VOTE: CheekyTeeky

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VOTE: CommKnight

hey people, what's up?

I knew your name looked familiar. You were in that unpleasant Watchman game.

was that the one that Grey got force replaced and everybody was fighting everyone? I think I remember that. it made me quit mafia, for like, six months. so, how are ya? any reads so far?

VOTE: Cheeky

serious vote.

Uh Quick have you read this? Maybe have a little think about why instead of being so opportunistic. I want a response from Lucca so I'm not moving my vote so FoS Quick.

OK. What did you want Lucca to answer?

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OK. What did you want Lucca to answer?

That kinda defeats the purpose of the excercise.

What information could you possibly get for a naked OMGUS?

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OK. What did you want Lucca to answer?

That kinda defeats the purpose of the excercise.

What information could you possibly get for a naked OMGUS?

You're just rephrasing your original question. I get my best reads from OMGUS reactions. Your continued interference is weird. Why aren't you scum hunting instead of calling me scum for scum hunting? Do you even have any reads?

I think you could be Scum. Besides that, no I don't really have any reads. Should I have reads at this stage?

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VOTE: commknight

also quick the tldr of rvs wagons since I just reread #49

announce your l-1s and policy lynch anyone who hammers

Like I said, I have seen someone claim "oops" and got away with it. Its easy to say the correct theory, but the correct theory doesn't necessary get implemented.

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I'm thinking about our Masons. Important we keep them alive if we can. They effectively have a 1-shot copscan.

What do you mean?

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X person, scummy as hell. Masons attempt to recruit, and see if it is successful. Yes, town. No, scum.

K.

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Truth be told, I'm more of a donkey than a vet.

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Why would you post that, quick? You should know RVS wagons are for gathering information, not for quicklynching.

I am going to VOTE: Awoo for piling onto an easy wagon formed during the shitposting phase. Scum love easy lynches.

Nice, looks like the game is on, baby

VOTE: Quick

I've seen quicklynches happen and Scum got away with it because "oh I didn't know that was the hammer". I have this policy in all my games and its not because I am Scum. On top of that, I have never seen a quick wagon really amount to anything significant in a game. Some people will Town read the slot that is Quickwagoned, some will Scum read it. It just sucks for reading people actually, and there is the chance it ends in a quick lynch so I just try and avoid them altogether.

This could be legit town concern or it could be afraid his buddy gets lynched.

Its a legit concern, period and I would prolly say the same the same thing as both Town and Scum.

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He's scumhunting, town usually does that.

Well glad to see I'm going to be playing with a brick wall Awoo.

So, what did you learn from your OMGUS again?

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please halt stupid needless attacks that are hardly designed to figure out alignment

now bye im out

I will try.

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Why do you all quote each other all the time??

Quick, you were literally replying to the post above yours just there. We can see what Chisa wrote. If it was a quote from 3 pages ago, sure. But I don't get why you constantly cut and paste each other's quotes?

What am I missing?

I have WAY WAY more posts that have quotes in them. I think it's important for context. Granted I prolly didn't need to quote there, but someone could have posted in between my post and theirs, which then people would have to try and figure out who I was responding to. I guess I just got into the habit early to quote people rather than just replying. People have a hard enough time understanding me as it is, I don't need another reason for people to wonder what the hell I am doing.

P-Edit: Phones are the devil.

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@Quick:

"someone could have posted in between my post and theirs, which then people would have to try and figure out who I was responding to"

You could just start your reply with "@Chisa", like I just did with you. That would make it just as clear you were responding to Chisa, and would take up less space on the page.

Taking up less space on the page isn't really a concern of mine.

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Current Townreads:

Jamiet99uk
CheekyTeeky
Quick
Cheesy Yukizone

Current Scumreads:

Awoo
Lucca261
Assemblerot

Current Nullreads:

Aubrey
CommKnight
Non-posters

How sure of these reads are you at this time?

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I like Jamie for Town for newb open thought process. If he has a decent amount of experience, this read is less strong, but if he doesn't have much experience, it tells me that he is paying attention and trying to solve.

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If you could please clean up quotes after yourself, I would really appreciate it. If you are wondering why I think its "ok" for me to quote posts against Jamie's wishes while asking Maki to clean up their quotes, I will say that when ISOing people, context is important. And if you have all the context in the ISO already, it saves time.

Also, you guys, I'm sorry if I'm coming across badly because I'm new, but there are now 5 votes on me and two more would end the day while it's still in the random shitposting phase. I don't think that's a good idea.

I'm inclined to agree actually.

Correct me if I'm wrong here but the way this is put makes it sound like you think sometimes rvs wagons going through are alright? Or am I reading into this too much?

Nope! The opposite of that.

You killed it Awoo :/

Jamie's reaction did feel pretty town, albeit delayed. Not sure what to make of Quick getting all high and mighty. I'll lean town on that for now.

Why did you let quick influence you Awoo?

VOTE: Awoo

This feels gross the comment is question didn't really feel that bad at all

I am inclined to agree.

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alright, full reread complete. to address a few of the more prominent discussions at hand, i townread jamie, don't like lucca's posting and think this is probably cheeky's towngame. also, i find myself agreeing with awoo's 164. maki's questions / comments seem rather empty and her vote seems relatively weak. out of the entire thread the thing you vote someone for is a comment about getting the game moving on page two?
VOTE: maki

@mod, any word on epic fial?

I didn't see anything Scummy in what Maki posted. Looked to just be feeling things out.

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MY NAME IS ERIC BUT POEPLE CALL ME EPIC BECAUSE OF MY LAST NAME.

OK, that is funny.

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A lot of people went into some depth about things like reads and such. This is good.

I am kinda torn on Assembler atm. He isn't posting, which makes me think he might possibly be Scum lurking. That said, he's fell under some suspicion for that so given that he is yet to post that kinda makes the first point moot.

Due to the good content a lot of people are producing (which makes me think either Town is doing well or Scum is playing well), I think Aubrey is kinda suspect for not giving as good of content. I kinda feel the same way about Jamie, but its not as severe. Still think I like Jamie for Town, but this read can change.

I still am Scum reading Cheeky and I don't have a reason not to move my vote right now.

Lucca kinda a little reminds me of a game a played with them under a hydra with Transcend. I don't remember if they were Scum or not in that game, but it looks pretty similar nonetheless. I will have to hunt for the game and will come back with hopefully some more info on this.

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OK, yeah, Lucca was Town in that game. Overall I think he is playing fairly Pro-Town, but for some reason I was thinking he was Scum in the game I was thinking of. Turns out that he was Town that game so I am feeling better about him.

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You're right, I missed it. My vote was on you at the beginning and I have yet to change it because I have yet to decide on a better place to park it.

You can unvote?

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You're right, I missed it. My vote was on you at the beginning and I have yet to change it because I have yet to decide on a better place to park it.

You can unvote?

would you say that unvoting is necessarily better than leaving it where it is?

I think its better to have an Unvote than to have your vote on someone who you don't think is Scum.

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I really want to see more from Epic Fial because I forgot they were in the game until I saw the joke for the second time.

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@Epic Fial, Do you have thoughts on anyone else in the game besides Jamie?

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Maki Harukawa Vadim
Lalendra
Awoo
Epic Fial

Gut is telling me that 2/4 of the above are scum. The other remains in the ones not on this list.

VOTE: Awoo

Your comments thus far have been bugging something in the back of my head. I can't quite place it but I know it's usually right.

This is so weak...

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Maki Harukawa Vadim
Lalendra
Awoo
Epic Fial

Gut is telling me that 2/4 of the above are scum. The other remains in the ones not on this list.

VOTE: Awoo

Your comments thus far have been bugging something in the back of my head. I can't quite place it but I know it's usually right.

Why do you think Lalendra could be scum really not getting that read

Gut is telling me that 2/4 of the above are scum. The other remains in the ones not on this list.
Gut is telling me that 2/4 of the above are scum.
Gut

I know, crazy right? Ask Assemble, it's pretty dangerous (my gut feelings that is). Even if I can't logically argue it out, it's the vibe I get from people.

Also Quick is weak. Can't even read gut and feels the need to comment on it like he's adding some value. Either say why Awoo is town or gtfo.

No I think you have it confused.

What does your gut Pre-Flip really add to the game?

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Quick, you suspect aubrey on account of having low content, could you explain that? I can point to numerous other cases of lower content in the game. Why him/Any other reasons you suspect him specifically?

It was mostly these posts that were right in the middle of where a lot of heavy stuff was being discussed. Looking back on it now, it doesn't look as bad.

Was this topic important what so ever or more so banter for you Chisa?

Understanding how the world perceives oneself is typical, and all that really read as.

I'm scared that I agree with most of this (my) post.

need to see more from Aubrey

......Okay.

I don't know who I want to vote in the 2 because I doubt it's scum vs scum (Cheeky and Awoo)

I initially had some town vibes from this, but then paranoia set in. Whatever happened to this, "I feel good about my vote on Awoo" thing. I can't help but wonder if this is just a tactic to see how the positions of these two players develop down the line.

MY NAME IS ERIC BUT POEPLE CALL ME EPIC BECAUSE OF MY LAST NAME.

Firts. Poeple. Fial. All caps.

I'm onto you.

Maybe scum are lurking weebs in this game. Another possibility is that they are posting a lot but are not weebs. So I'm going to be considering both weebs and non-weebs, and people who are lurking and people doing the opposite of that, whatever it is called. On the other hand, they might be in the middle somewhere. Nearly certain we can hit scum in one of those groups.

Sass overload.

I don't like Epic Fial having tunnel vision. His points are not terrible, but you should really be interacting with more than like 2 people.

I will try and fully catch up and give my thoughts. This is a pretty heavy game and I am not used to that kind of play. I will try and provide some thoughts on things when I get caught up.

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cheeky really did that, and she say it herself on 87, when pressured by quick. openly saying she wants a response from me = openly saying her vote is a reaction test. my point is: if cheeky wanted to have a response from me, putting a vote on my slot and then saying she wants a response is counter productive, it redirects the discussion away from why I voted her. she could've, you know, just asked.

i think i'd like to hear cheeky's point of view with regard to this. anyone else can chime in, as well, if you've got something to add!

I totally agree with Lucca on this. Like its not that difficult to just ask a question to someone. Instead they think they are going to get more out of a naked OMGUS vote. I just cannot understand that.

there was nothing spetacular, it was my first non-rvs vote, on page 5. I don't need a full case on somebody. my reasons for voting her were expressed on post 206. at the time, it was the scummiest thing on the game. so I voted her. I never said I know for a fact that cheeky is scum. in fact, I quote: "because I think you are scum". where did I say I know she is scum or that I don't need evidence? I was engaging with her at that moment. I was furthering my read at that moment.

so, let's talk: what's my motivation as scum to accuse cheeky without any reasons here?

you may not have said that you know she's scum, but from your actions it certainly appears that way. i'm thinking more and more that it's a meta thing, but it seemed to me to be unusual behavior towards someone you scumread. when i see someone pushing someone else as scummy and it appears fake or strange, i'm more inclined to think that they're pushing a mislynch. from what i'm gathering from this conversation you further your reads in ways that i can't easily pick up on, so i'm going to keep that in mind going forward as well as when reviewing previous posts.

in response to your last line, that's what i've been turning over in my head. you'll note that i've never explicitly said i scumread you, even if i find it hard to find town motivation in some of your actions. mainly i disagree with the wagon you've started.

It kinda like you are looking for reasons to Scum read Lucca. You point about Lucca inferring that he knows for a fact that that Cheeky is Scum is kinda bogus. Like the only way that happens is if those two are teamed. I guess that is something to consider, but ATM I am Town reading lucca and we haven't had a flip so I am not going to focus on that and I think its incorrect to do that.

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Epic comes off as a joke account. If he doesn't start taking the game semi seriously, he'll probably need to be exterminated at some point. Scum will keep problematic slots around, and problematic slots are not good for the town to have around for the later game. Take that for what you will. I'm not above lynching slots that I think will be unreadable.

I really want to see more from Epic Fial because I forgot they were in the game until I saw the joke for the second time.

Could be that scum lives in a gingerbread house, the forest is dark, and everywhere looks like everywhere else. Really, there is only one way to prepare for that and survive. Understand that, and you are halfway home. Maybe you think I am a joke. But I am not.

Yeah, this is like really bizarre to me. I have no idea what you are trying to say. I think you were being serious here which makes this really fucking confusing.

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I'm thinking about our Masons. Important we keep them alive if we can. They effectively have a 1-shot copscan.

What steps shall we take to keep the masons alive?

Let's try not to lynch them.

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I think 1 is most likely scum but given interactions I don't think BOTH are scum.

This is interesting because I sometimes am OK saying what is NOT SvS. I am wondering if you look at the same kind of things as I do.

Basically, can you talk more about why you think Awoo and Cheeky can't be teamed?

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Quick, you're doing a lot of defending/townreading, do you have any other scumreads besides cheeky?

IDK where you are getting this from. In my last few posts I have pointed out things I didn't like from North, Epic, and Jamie as well. So no, I don't think all I am doing is defending/Townreading people.

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this last post feels like someone who is trying to participate, rather than trying to scumhunt.

*Trying to get into the game and make some actual reads

Can you please mention who you are quoting?

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his name is lucca

Can you do this without me having to ask? Its really hard to follow. I am in like 5-6 games right now so I can't just remember what everyone says when someone quotes something without a name.

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@MOD, Lucca is voting for CommKnight.

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@MOD, Lucca is voting for CommKnight.

Also, you have Cheeky voting twice. There might be other errors.

triple midterm in one day messing me up. Thanks for point it out ;3 ~ T

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Maki Harukawa Vadim
Lalendra
Awoo
Epic Fial

Gut is telling me that 2/4 of the above are scum. The other remains in the ones not on this list.

VOTE: Awoo

Your comments thus far have been bugging something in the back of my head. I can't quite place it but I know it's usually right.

Why do you think Lalendra could be scum really not getting that read

Gut is telling me that 2/4 of the above are scum. The other remains in the ones not on this list.
Gut is telling me that 2/4 of the above are scum.
Gut

I know, crazy right? Ask Assemble, it's pretty dangerous (my gut feelings that is). Even if I can't logically argue it out, it's the vibe I get from people.

Also Quick is weak. Can't even read gut and feels the need to comment on it like he's adding some value. Either say why Awoo is town or gtfo.

I understood you said gut but you must have some reasoning for any of these reads yes?

Even if I can't logically argue it out, it's the vibe I get from people.
it's the vibe I get from people.
vibe

I feel like this is an effective form of communication with this group. Even the limited amount of what I have said is being overlooked, so pointing it out by breaking down my own posts might help.

@Quick, what does my gut add? How about being on the right track 9 times out of 10. What have you added so far in figuring anyone out besides scumreading town players who are scumming it up because you can't read them worth a lick and are taking the easy route out. I can actually talk about my last game since it finished not too long ago and guess what. Town kept going for the easy mislynches when I kept saying to them it wasn't those people. But am I ever listened to when I'm town? No. But when I'm mafia it's like everyone listens to me and I don't need to do diddly squat all then. But games like this where I'm town, I'm just stuck with a bunch of "why" people.

When my reads start flipping how I told you they would flip and we talk about it post-game, then you can ask yourself "Why didn't I listen to Comm, he's odd but he's a brilliant mofo when it comes to solving who scum are and scum probably should've killed him N1 unless they want to be outed by the time D3 rolls around, because by then he has the whole puzzle together. His D1's are a bit sketchy and he might not have zeroed in properly, but gee golly, his late-game play is like something out of the holy mafia scripture. I sure wish I could be just like him when I grow up."

You know what will help me get more solid reads? Flips. Flips. Flips. And the dumbass remarks people tend to make after them to distance themselves from it. I'm fine with being wrong once or twice, but based on how others react to my pushes when those pushes are flipped, it sure as hell paints a clear picture on what they are.

Now then, I'm going for my nightly nap. My brain is constantly running 19/7 with 5 hours of sleep max each night. My morning class is cancelled so I'm sleeping the **** in for an extra 3-4 hours. Just work on your townreading game of me and you're guaranteed to win 9 times out of 10 with believing in my gut.

This is such bullshit.

VOTE: Comm

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I was really hoping that Jamie was just trying to get some things out of their system, but it seems that IS the way they play.

Really sorry for being lazy, but I am in 5-6 games.

VOTE: Jamie

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I'm thinking about our Masons. Important we keep them alive if we can. They effectively have a 1-shot copscan.

What steps shall we take to keep the masons alive?

Let's try not to lynch them.

This is where I first started thinking a lot of you posts are just really low impact. Like given the conversation around you bringing up "don't lynch Masons" and then (I think) Aubrey saying "OK how do we do that" and then you respond like this here... its just kinda Scumm because it looks like you are trying to be helpful without really adding anything.

@Quick: Why are you voting me? Why am I scum?

Mostly for posts like this that make it look like you are doing more than you really are:

@Aubrey - Okay sorry, I really had just missed your question there... kinda buried in a big block of text and not directly addressing me.

I think you are right that since my vote is still on Awoo it would be prudentbto re-read her. Give me a little time to do that.

Dammit this game is packed with quitters.

That's like the 5th replacement in a 13 player game. Is that normal here?

@CommKnight:

Do you trust your gut enough to stake your own neck on it?

Assemble tells us to follow CommKnight's gut / Assemble's vote is not on the same target as CommKnight....

Hmm.

Because if that's normal here, I probably just need to leave this website.

@CommKnight: While I'm still playing: So, do you agree to the following?

- If I sheep your vote this turn, and (y)our target is lynched, and flips TOWN, then you agree that YOU will be the lynch tomorrow, and to that ens, will vote for yourself tomorrow in those circumstances?

@Awoo

I'm not quitting. I just don't see the point in this website if the games are so shit that half the players quit during the course of an average game like CommKnight has suggested. This game has already had what I'd regard as a worryingly high level of replacements...

It just seems like you are spreading your posts out too much at the least and alternatively I can see you doing this on purpose to make it look like you are having a bigger impact on the game than you really are. Like, your content just doesn't really go that deep, no offence. It just looks Scummy because this game is pretty dense with detailed stuff to talk about and it looks like you are still asking surface level questions.

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@Quick: Why are you voting me? Why am I scum?

VOTE: Quick for literally admitting that his vote on me is lazy. What a pile of shit.

Would you give me a chance to answer, Jesus Christ.

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@Quick: Why are you voting me? Why am I scum?

VOTE: Quick for literally admitting that his vote on me is lazy. What a pile of shit.

Would you give me a chance to answer, Jesus Christ.

You voted me without explanation, and said "sorry for being lazy"... You don't expect me to call you on that?

smh

You asked for a reason, then you didn't wait to see if I would provide one before voting me.

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I didn't think you were going to. I thought you were going to go off and attend to your other games, and be lazy about this one, as your post implied.

You asked for a reason. I usually try and provide that if I am asked. If you were me, what would you have done?

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Like it's sad because I'm wondering about his reading comprehension/memory skills right now. I've said that my D1's are usually worse. I've said flips help me piece together the puzzle better. I've said that expecting me to gamethrow is a bad idea (and right now is one of the primary reasons I am voting him, I refuse to back down because someone wants to pull that kind of shit). Even more, I've said I can be wrong.

But I'm pretty much always onto something in each of my games. It's easier to see where I fucked up at the end when the flips are better revealed, but in every one of my games the scum end up in the radar. When they leave the radar is more often than not when someone (like you) does something worse that gains all of my attention.

Just throwing this out there, but what if you are Scum?

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@Chisa - I'll get to you in a little bit.

I'm Boonskiies, Comm.

Why did you out your alt?

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@Chisa - I'll get to you in a little bit.

I'm Boonskiies, Comm.

Why did you out your alt?

It's already been outed on site before. I actively play different throughout my accounts, with different playstyles.

Its about the avatars isn't it?

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VOTE: Cheeky
I have a lot of townreads and I think this is where I wanna vote right now I prob should've not tried to catch up at 4am when my brain feels like jello and words blend together but whatever if you got questions go ahead and ask em

What changed? I saw in your ISO you really only had like 1 post from Cheeky quoted and it was from the beginning of the game. Basically, I am Town reading you and Scum reading Cheeky and I'm trying to figure out why you switched to cheeky.

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Excellent.

The reaction to my challenge to CommKnight was very interesting. Everyone who said it was a bad idea is entirely correct. Of course I don't want CommKnight to commit to suiciding if he's town and gets his D1 read wrong. That would be a waste.

My intention in proposing this apparently mad idea was twofold. First of all, to dissuade CommKnight from being too cocky about his gut, and anyone else from just slavishly following him. Secondly, I wanted too see people's reactions. I'm going to spend some time assessing those later today.

For the record I do stand by my assertion that a VT should not be afraid to die. A VT dying is not as good as scum dying, for sure - but it's way better than a PR dying. Plus, flips are informative. A lot of people have interacted with me today and if I died, those interactions could provide many clues.

That said, all things considered I'd prefer to stay alive, and I'm definitely town, so if you've got a good scumread, go for them - and tell us why. It's time to start bringing this phase home, my fellow townsfolk.

So... was that thing where you told people not to lynch the masons the same type of thing?

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VOTE: Cheeky
I have a lot of townreads and I think this is where I wanna vote right now I prob should've not tried to catch up at 4am when my brain feels like jello and words blend together but whatever if you got questions go ahead and ask em

What changed? I saw in your ISO you really only had like 1 post from Cheeky quoted and it was from the beginning of the game. Basically, I am Town reading you and Scum reading Cheeky and I'm trying to figure out why you switched to cheeky.

It was more what others did then Cheeky herself now consider everyone starts at 50 rating and goes up and down based on towny/scummy I had her as an early scumread and I have townreads on a lot of other people that are not her and the few other scumreads I do have I would feel less confident on.

Hmm... OK.

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Ok up to page 13

Reads to that point are:

Awoo, Jamie, Comm
NSG, Aubrey, Chisa
Fial, Assemble,
Quick, Maki, Lalendra, Lucca

VOTE: Quick

Why are you Scum reading me? Why did you pick me out of the other Scum reads you have? Why not vote with Jamie, your Town read and vote Lalendra?

Jamie is becoming a policy lynch.
A policy lynch that I support.
VOTE: jamiet99uk
Because otherwise it's too obvious who's getting mason'd, and that's bad. At least when we remove this from the game there is a good layer of ambiguity who the copshot lands on.

Is it bad if I think this slot isn't reaaaaaaly going to flip scum? I don't think this lynch is terrible for town as we also get some info on who's on wagons and stuff, who pushed him throughout the day, etc. But I don't reaaaly think it's going to flip scum.

A lot of my scumreads are on this wagon and I feel bad in that regard but read above.

I THINK THIS IS L-1

I think this is like one of Jamies first games here. He's not PL material. This is bad and I am not going to start looking at you a lot more seriously.

[Quick]

Yeah, I don't mind that at all.

VOTE: Awoo

Choooo chooooo!!!

[Quick]

You know when I saw Awoo's post I was like *perks eyebrow* myself but I think it's so honest that scum doesn't need to say a line like that I don't think scum Awoo looks at that post and clicks submit

So too Scummy to be Scum is what you are thinking?

Resistance #1.

[Quick]

Well, Awoo has been voted before, but IIRC, the wagon never really took off. I find that a bit suspect, but its not like hard evidence or anything. I am also starting to TR Jamie, which is why move my vote onto Awoo.

[Quick]

So if I voted Jamie you'd vote me is the logic I am getting from all this.

Uh... No? where did I even imply that? I don't do pre-flip except to say who ISN'T teamed as group Scum. That would be pre-flip to me. I tend to read people in isolation of other people, even mostly after a Scum flip.

I just made the comment about resistance because that is something I have seen be accurate. To me, its similar to when its close to EOD and there are people that are not voting.

[Quick]

I am also starting to TR Jamie, which is why move my vote onto Awoo.

Sorry I forgot you were voting Jamie I took this as you saying "if you vote my tr you're scummy"

Nope, I pretty much never operate that way, as Town or Scum. People have different reads and that is perfectly normal.

[Quick]

VOTE: Quick Nope, votes on my wagon look good. Except for quick. 344 was just a wagon building vote. Your vote on me is just a wagon building vote. 352 is weak reasoning for joining the wagon. Like the other guy said, it's a weak hypothetical that relies on... what? I like him for scum here.

You vote him since his content is not deep enough but he's pretty town though? voting, pressuring for good reasons. I was just despairing in my post over jamie being doomed not to live to endgame because of silly/annoying things he does and that town won't look past that. But we can though, you know? So I'm happy I made that post.

First, I am not going to explain my Town read on Jamie, I'm just not. Second, I did actually state that I thought your post when you voted Jamie was all kinds of wrong. I aslo stated a reason the other people didn't. But others saw that post was bad as well, so if anything, I was just agreeing with my previous post by voting for you.

[Quick]

Cheeky is there a reason you didn't vote me in 476?

...and then you call me VS you TvT in 483. Not to mention your accusation in 146 makes absolutely no sense. You're all over the place, my dude.

I said that post was scummy as hell not you're scum. That's a suicide post if you are. Main reason I townread you is because of your response to my meta argument. Scum don't say "don't townread me" lol. Yes I am all over the place I'm in too many games :/ but I don't want to replace and be that guy. I think 3 should be my limit.

Yo,

Ok up to page 13

Reads to that point are:

Awoo, Jamie, Comm
NSG, Aubrey, Chisa
Fial, Assemble,
Quick, Maki, Lalendra, Lucca

VOTE: Quick

Why are you Scum reading me? Why did you pick me out of the other Scum reads you have? Why not vote with Jamie, your Town read and vote Lalendra?

[Quick]

You're the one who is ringing alarm bells through my catch up. I noticed you jumped on my wagon agreeing with everyone instead of creating your own argument. I already said it looked like you're cruising through the game and I'm not super convinced you're town by your line of questionning here either. Why would I vote with a town read? One of my town reads is voting my other town read lol. I will go into more detail on my reads at some point. Sorry I keep putting it off, I've been super useless this game.

What are you even talking about? Why do people keep saying I am voting for people without my own reasoning when I most certainly am.

[Quick]

You're the one who is ringing alarm bells through my catch up. I noticed you jumped on my wagon agreeing with everyone instead of creating your own argument. I already said it looked like you're cruising through the game and I'm not super convinced you're town by your line of questionning here either. Why would I vote with a town read? One of my town reads is voting my other town read lol. I will go into more detail on my reads at some point. Sorry I keep putting it off, I've been super useless this game.

What are you even talking about? Why do people keep saying I am voting for people without my own reasoning when I most certainly am.

perhaps you're not doing a good enough job of making that clear. i thought your vote in 498 was just sheeping me. if you had your own reasons for it i didn't really pick up on them.

Than you missed the post directly above yours.

My reason was that Awoo was advocating a PL on someone who in my mind is clearly Town.

[Quick]

You're the one who is ringing alarm bells through my catch up. I noticed you jumped on my wagon agreeing with everyone instead of creating your own argument. I already said it looked like you're cruising through the game and I'm not super convinced you're town by your line of questionning here either. Why would I vote with a town read? One of my town reads is voting my other town read lol. I will go into more detail on my reads at some point. Sorry I keep putting it off, I've been super useless this game.

What are you even talking about? Why do people keep saying I am voting for people without my own reasoning when I most certainly am.

perhaps you're not doing a good enough job of making that clear. i thought your vote in 498 was just sheeping me. if you had your own reasons for it i didn't really pick up on them.

Than you missed the post directly above yours.

My reason was that Awoo was advocating a PL on someone who in my mind is clearly Town.

right, but in that post you're just saying how bad you think the vote is. it isn't until i make my post and jamie sheeps me too that you hop on the wagon. through a certain lens someone might even call it opportunistic, or a scummy hop-on. what stopped you from voting in your first post and what caused you to vote in your second post? to me it seemed like you were scared to draw attention to yourself and you only voted in the comfort of a crowd.

TBH, it was that I agreed with what Jaimie said that was more the thing that made me want to vote Awoo. I've seen plenty of Scum try and get a PL on someone so they don't have to actually Scum hunt as well.

[Quick]

Eh I think you're just itching for me to be scum in a game with you Awoo. I really don't think you're scum so I'm not even going to OMGUS you. I think I'm going to troll you again anyway because all my posts are going through some far reaching scum filter.

Quick why aren't you voting me if you're so convinced?

Because right now I a looking at Awoo.. I think it was Maki that said that you and Awoo can't both be Scum, but that you are both fairly Scummy. I agree with that now.

[Quick]

Eh I think you're just itching for me to be scum in a game with you Awoo. I really don't think you're scum so I'm not even going to OMGUS you. I think I'm going to troll you again anyway because all my posts are going through some far reaching scum filter.

Quick why aren't you voting me if you're so convinced?

Because right now I a looking at Awoo.. I think it was Maki that said that you and Awoo can't both be Scum, but that you are both fairly Scummy. I agree with that now.

But why do you think I'm scum?

Because I think your reasoning is not fleshed out enough. I think you talk like you are Scum and not Town. I can do an ISO case, but I don't think I need to yet.

[Quick]

I've got no grudge against you if that's what you want to believe, cheeky. But maybe I do have some issues with your play.

I just called your read on me weak and I explained why. You respond with "ehh, i'll just troll you, you're town btw". Believe me, I'm trying to find some reason to townread you so you aren't just a wasted day 1 lynch like you say you usually are, but if you're just going to give up what's the point?

Your read on me reads like it comes from an informed perspective. Your post about me reads flippantly. Can't you do anything remotely town-motivated?

And now quick is onto questioning you, getting ready for a hop on himself, so maybe I am off the mark on voting you. But shit man, it's not town's job to act high and mighty "don't question my reading methods" "i'll just troll you, you're so stupid cant you see im town?" then blame town for mislynching them when it inevitably happens, and you need to get that through your towngame's head. Yes you are antitown. I don't know what you look like as scum.

VOTE: Quick

You basically gave a reason to vote Cheeky, but in that same post you vote me. I am not getting this one...

[Quick]

Instead of looking for scummy posts I am looking for scum.

K. So I am Scum for being opportunistic, is that what I am hearing?

[Quick]

Yeah. Whatever's popular, you're on it. This is my observation.

K, but I switched my vote from Jamie who was at L-1 to you who I have no idea how many votes you had but it wasn't even close to L-1. Why would I switch off Jamie like that if that is what I was doing?

[Quick]

Sigh. I really don't want to townread Jamie after all that, but UNVOTE:

I already had some doubt, and his last few posts felt very Towny to me. And now I'm back at square one.

Was it you before who didn't want to unvote and kept their vote on someone because you didn't know where else to stick it? Why unvote now? What changed?

[Quick]

Because a new opportunity arose and the jamie wagon was collapsing? Why did you even ask this?

What do you mean the Jamie wagon was collapsing? YOU put them at L-1...

[Quick]

You literally hopped on a new forming wagon. Where is the jamie wagon now? Where is it GOING to be in a few pages?

"What do you mean it was collapsing?" I'll spell it out for you, since you're intentionally playing dumb:

Before you voted: Jamiet99uk (6!!): Aubrey, Lalendra, Epic Fial, Quick, CommKnight, Awoo

Your vote comes onto me: Jamiet (4): Aubrey, Lalendra, CommKnight, Awoo

Present day: Jamiet99uk (2): Aubrey, CommKnight

And then shortly after that after that lalendra unvotes. If 6 -> 2 isn't a collapse I don't know what is. Everybody still on the wagon is there because they haven't posted yet. Why did you post this? Why are you spreading misinformation?

I don't usually pay too much attention to votes but I did here and you are just wrong here. Jamie was one vote that voted you and they weren't voting themselves, and the other was Noth, who wasn't voting Jamie either. The only person who unvoted or switched votes was epic and I. It was L-1 and then Epic unvoted (which I didn't see because it was a small post and they have no avatar).

This is the unofficial VC and all the votes and unvotes after that:

VOTE COUNT 1.6.1 (UNOFFICIAL)

Jamiet99uk (5): Aubrey, Lalendra, Epic Fial, Quick, CommKnight
CommKnight (2): Chisa Yukizome, lucca261
Lalendra (2): Awoo, Jamiet99uk
Maki Harukawa (1): northsidegal
Epic Fial (1): CheekyTeeky
Lucca(1): Flavour Leaf
CheekyTeeky(1): Maki Harukawa


I hope that's correct...

UNVOTE:

Ok up to page 13

Reads to that point are:

Awoo, Jamie, Comm
NSG, Aubrey, Chisa
Fial, Assemble,
Quick, Maki, Lalendra, Lucca

VOTE: Quick

Jamie is becoming a policy lynch.
A policy lynch that I support.
VOTE: jamiet99uk
Because otherwise it's too obvious who's getting mason'd, and that's bad. At least when we remove this from the game there is a good layer of ambiguity who the copshot lands on.

Is it bad if I think this slot isn't reaaaaaaly going to flip scum? I don't think this lynch is terrible for town as we also get some info on who's on wagons and stuff, who pushed him throughout the day, etc. But I don't reaaaly think it's going to flip scum.

A lot of my scumreads are on this wagon and I feel bad in that regard but read above.

I THINK THIS IS L-1

UNVOTE:

Content within twelve hours, I am hoping. Busy trying to order a new Hilary Clinton waifu pillow on eBay, after the old one underwent terminal deflation last night. Waifu pillows are inflatable and more or less anatomically correct, right?

Jamie is becoming a policy lynch.
A policy lynch that I support.
VOTE: jamiet99uk
Because otherwise it's too obvious who's getting mason'd, and that's bad. At least when we remove this from the game there is a good layer of ambiguity who the copshot lands on.

Is it bad if I think this slot isn't reaaaaaaly going to flip scum? I don't think this lynch is terrible for town as we also get some info on who's on wagons and stuff, who pushed him throughout the day, etc. But I don't reaaaly think it's going to flip scum.

A lot of my scumreads are on this wagon and I feel bad in that regard but read above.

I THINK THIS IS L-1

i'm not going to ask the obvious question of "why push a lynch you think will flip town", because you've answered that. the thing is, i don't think your answer is a good enough reason. like, what do we actually gain from lynching jamie? you say that you can analyze the wagons and see who pushed him and such, but you can do all of that today. if, like you said, you already believe jamie is town, then analyze the wagons and the interactions today with that in mind. you don't need him to be dead before you can start looking at, for example, players that may have opportunistically pushed his wagon. finally, if some of your actual scumreads are on the wagon, is there some reason that you're not attempting to get those players lynched? we have about 6 days left, more than enough time for a good case to change some people's minds.
VOTE: awoo

oh yeah, what's the deal with the bold? seems like a fairly weak reason to lynch somebody. it also assumes that jamie is town and that the masonize turns him into a mason instead of confirming him as scum, which i would say could be a slip except you're already assuming that he's town. i don't give too much weight to slight slips like that anyways.

Awoo must be certain I am town, and yet is trying to lynch me. The whole theory that I'm trying to get masonized makes no sense if you think I'm scum - because there's no way scum would want the masons to confirm their role. Thus Awoo knows I am town and is nevertheless attempting to lynch me.

There is only one sensible conclusion. Awoo is scum.

VOTE: Awoo

Yeah, I don't mind that at all.

VOTE: Awoo

Choooo chooooo!!!

UNVOTE: oof

VOTE: Quick Nope, votes on my wagon look good. Except for quick. 344 was just a wagon building vote. Your vote on me is just a wagon building vote. 352 is weak reasoning for joining the wagon. Like the other guy said, it's a weak hypothetical that relies on... what? I like him for scum here.

You vote him since his content is not deep enough but he's pretty town though? voting, pressuring for good reasons. I was just despairing in my post over jamie being doomed not to live to endgame because of silly/annoying things he does and that town won't look past that. But we can though, you know? So I'm happy I made that post.

Sigh. I really don't want to townread Jamie after all that, but UNVOTE:

I already had some doubt, and his last few posts felt very Towny to me. And now I'm back at square one.

That reminds me...


VOTE: CommKnight

Rationale to follow when I think of it.

Okay, but really cheeky,

I said that post was scummy as hell not you're scum. That's a suicide post if you are. Main reason I townread you is because of your response to my meta argument. Scum don't say "don't townread me" lol. Yes I am all over the place I'm in too many games :/ but I don't want to replace and be that guy. I think 3 should be my limit.

Do scum really not say "don't townread me"? That's reaaaaly not that hard to fake, considering the result I got out of it.

When you say my post is scummy as hell, ok you're not wrong, but what do you really mean by it if you're townreading me? What does this add to the game? This just reads like you have are looking at the game through an informed point of view to me. See this post in here for an example of what I mean. (taken from my scumgame, you were there )

For the record my vote on jamie wasn't supposed to be a reaction test, just a classic LapseInJudgement (TM)

VOTE: Cheeky

I've got no grudge against you if that's what you want to believe, cheeky. But maybe I do have some issues with your play.

I just called your read on me weak and I explained why. You respond with "ehh, i'll just troll you, you're town btw". Believe me, I'm trying to find some reason to townread you so you aren't just a wasted day 1 lynch like you say you usually are, but if you're just going to give up what's the point?

Your read on me reads like it comes from an informed perspective. Your post about me reads flippantly. Can't you do anything remotely town-motivated?

And now quick is onto questioning you, getting ready for a hop on himself, so maybe I am off the mark on voting you. But shit man, it's not town's job to act high and mighty "don't question my reading methods" "i'll just troll you, you're so stupid cant you see im town?" then blame town for mislynching them when it inevitably happens, and you need to get that through your towngame's head. Yes you are antitown. I don't know what you look like as scum.

VOTE: Quick

If anything, It looks like you are panicing with how you are switching your vote every half hour.

[Quick]

Hey guys, I'll hopefully be catching up sometime today. Been enjoying Halloween weekend activities.

Same, I was completely out of it last night.

VOTE: Quick

You're dropping down deep on my list.

Reasons?

[Quick]

Getting a coasting vibe from lalendra.

VOTE: Lalendra, much better vote then maki atm.

"townreading lalendra" --- why?

oh shit I did it again, that quote is from lalendra

Lalendra is playing exactly like a scum IC in a newbie game LOL

And then shortly after that after that lalendra unvotes. If 6 -> 2 isn't a collapse I don't know what is. Everybody still on the wagon is there because they haven't posted yet. Why did you post this? Why are you spreading misinformation?

Sigh. I really don't want to townread Jamie after all that, but UNVOTE:

I already had some doubt, and his last few posts felt very Towny to me. And now I'm back at square one.

Was it you before who didn't want to unvote and kept their vote on someone because you didn't know where else to stick it? Why unvote now? What changed?

SvS

Lalendra & quick both premium lynches 2day

This is pretty much all you have said about Lalendra. These are NOT strong reasons to lynch someone. It looks like you are going after low hanging fruit. Also, you say me and Lalendra are SvS, but you also mention that Lalendra is part of the reason for the wagon collapse on Jamie. So I am not getting how you think its likely Lalendra and I are teamed considering Lalendra unvoting for Jamie implies Lalendra and I are not teamed unless you think Lalendra and I are coordinating in deflating the wagon on Jamie, which is pretty unlikely, let's be honest.

So overall, you are doing pre-flip with lalendra and I that is completely unjustified. You have a bit of an inconsistent narrative that says that lalendra and I are teamed, but the evidence contradicts this.

[Quick]

Now, face my ultimate technique! 542

Half your post has been invalidated. *strikes pose*

You're like, 0 - 3 for actually reading and correctly interpreting the events of the game. You might say my lalendra vote was weak but I don't think so. Good try on the low hanging fruit though. iirc no one was voting lalendra and I was bringing someone who was, yes in fact coasting, to light. You're just projecting your own votes onto one of mine. Do you think you are low hanging fruit right now, quick?

And this makes you Town.... why?

[Quick]

Well Quick, aside from the fact that as Awoo has pointed out, you glaze over shit to look townie and only pick out what you want to pick out in context wise. Then yes, I'd say that's grounds for voting you. You've not done a damn thing so far to convince me to TR you either. So you also have that now working against you.

This is your only point worth addressing really.

What makes you say I am glazing over shit to look townie and only pick out what I want to pick out context wise?

Like this sounds like something you could say about anyone? Not getting it.

[Quick]

But that's the opposite of what he's doing.

^

"Actually thinking about things."... Me-thinks you aren't thinking about the "content" Quick has posted so far. Basically you're townreading him for some reason that actually does not exist. If you're really town Jamie, you're falsely townreading Quick for his long posts. But the truth is a lot of his "content" is fluff. It's misinterpreting things.

Come on, I'll fight Fial, Jamie, and Quick today. You guys get the handicap numbers because it's obvious the processing power isn't there to even, as a scum-team, figure out why you guys are going down-hill here. It's like watching a snake eat its' own tail and question why it's dying.

Quote one post I have made one post that doesn't pertain to the game. This is just blatantly false.

[Quick]

Well Quick, aside from the fact that as Awoo has pointed out, you glaze over shit to look townie and only pick out what you want to pick out in context wise. Then yes, I'd say that's grounds for voting you. You've not done a damn thing so far to convince me to TR you either. So you also have that now working against you.

This is your only point worth addressing really.

What makes you say I am glazing over shit to look townie and only pick out what I want to pick out context wise?

Like this sounds like something you could say about anyone? Not getting it.

Also, Comm never answered this.

[Quick]

3 days to decide a lynch.

Sure, I'll 1v1 Comm, why not?

VOTE: Comm

[Quick]

Note: Everyone who has experience with me are townreading me.

Think on that for a moment and then look at your reads.

Either I'm magically scum with everyone I've played with before or they're posting their actual read of me. Hmmm. What one could it be.

Also note that Flavor TR's me but I don't TR him. We've had multiple games together (same as the predecessor Assemble).

But you know, let's act like the TI and pretend that it's a conspiracy.

That's the stupidest fucking reason to TR you that I have ever heard.

[Quick]

@Aubrey.

1.) Fuck Drag. I was pretty good with my reads that game and we might've had scum D1 without his negative ass tunneling me. But I did manage to get him lynched in that 1v1. So Quick might want to consider rethinking 1v1'ing me with multiple TR's. He just dislikes my *CONFIDENCE* (Ego but with more sureness).

2.) I was bloody right that game too.
Xayzeck MMM, havingfitz, Aubrey, XnadrojX (4)
I had both goons right in this damn buddy list. I even said I could not account for Traitor votes/being voted. I also said that game that one of MMM/Shinobi was scum and the other was town 100% I called Xay out early as all fuck and town didn't believe me. Also vote count 1.5, me, your and Xay nearly lynched your traitor. LOLOL he must've been like GUYS DON'T VOTE ME I'M WITH YOU! That game was a pain... and so was that colour coding...

Also Quick, I ISO'd you ass. Here's the list of people you gone after so far.
- Jamiet
- north
- Awoo
- Comm

Legit, you gone after myself and 2 tr/tl slots. While briefly looking at jamie and then going back to tr'ing him for some unknown reason.

You basically haven't even addressed others outside of a single post really besides us 4. So yes, your posts come off as fake content. I mean hell... we're talking about 80+ posts vs my 20 something. So quadriple my posts but not quadriple the amount of people you looked into. Not even close.

I've also gone after cheeky.

The thing is, you have not really Scum hunted... Like.. at all.

All you've done all game is bark about who is Town and Scum and tell everyone they should Town read you because you are good at this game. You even by your own admission say your Scum game is better than your Town game, so why the fuck does it even matter that all the people who have played with you are Town reading you? I mean this is some straight up RC shit.

[Quick]

Another D1 lynch, lovely.

[Quick]

Oh, I'm not hammered, nice.

[Quick]

and just like that lucca loses towncred

Why?

[Quick]

and just like that lucca loses towncred

Why?

I think his stance is really bad

Why?

[Quick]

It Halloweeeeeeeeeeeen! Which meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeans, this game will be dead to me for most the night! Unless I get back to the home early. Be safe, and have fun to those who celebrate. Horror movie night with the friends I gooooooooo! (as soon as I leave work, cry*)

I'm watching Friday The 13th, ready to eat this candy if no one comes to my door....

Also tomorrow is candy shopping day FYI.

Loving the "I'll hammer Comm if I have to." post. Like get scum read dude. There's a reason you're no where near my town reads. You guys voting me can't even keep a fucking firm stance on me. Now that the wagon is dissolving you're bailing out like a damn coward who just wanted the damn mislynch.

Quick is going to be the lynch today, because after the actions of those that were voting me... LOL if someone manages to mislynch me.

My stance on you is that there is no reason to Town read you at all. With you going on and on about how you are Town, that is enough for me to think you should be lynched.

[Quick]

Cool story bro. Tell me another one. Make it a horror one since it's Halloween.

You haven't refuted my points on you. You also haven't answered my question to you which I asked and then quoted again.

[Quick]

And then?

You're right. I haven't. Because you're stuck on disliking my confidence than having a real case against me. Look at those that are already jumping off me. Like dude, tunneling me and 1v1'ing me was a bad mistake. Unless you can get a wagon on someone scummier, me vs you. You're dead 100%.

So what's it gonna be? Make an actual good case to convince us to lynch someone else, or get hung?

My case is the same, which you STILL do not address. No one should have any incentive to Town read you. You're just playing a manipulative as shit game. No one should be Town reading you because you haven't done anything Townie!!!

[Quick]

Neither have you. I've pointed out that you've barely gone outside of 4 people and Jamie was only briefly.

My Day 1's are shit. What's your excuse?

I've still Scum hunted more people than you have, bro.

This is just how I work. I don't look at everyone right away. I look for key players to read.

[Quick]

Reads:

Town
Jamie
lucca
Maki/Vadim

Lean Town
Lalendra
Epic Fial
North/Thomas of the Tiels

Null
Chisa
Aubrey
Flavor Leaf/Assemblerotws

Lean Scum
Awoo
Flubber/Cheeky
Comm

[Quick]

To both lalendra and Northside:

Do you see what I see with comm saying quick is scum off of gut but then following up with reasoning afterwards? It looks like throwing shade for the sake of keeping the lynch off of him in that context.

To quick

Can you fill me in on those reads? At the very least the ones near the top and bottom.

Reads:

Town
Jamie - Just Town, not going to talk about it.
lucca - He's prolly playing more Pro-Town than anyone in the game IMO
Maki/Vadim - I pretty much got it right in my first post on Maki. Slow to start and looks to be really trying to solve.

Lean Town
Lalendra
Epic Fial
North/Thomas of the Tiels

Null
Chisa
Aubrey
Flavor Leaf/Assemblerotws

Lean Scum
Awoo - They are just giving a lot of false info.
Flubber/Cheeky - IDK why you would rather lynch Comm over me, but I find it weird that you have the opposite stance than Cheeky had. Cheeky was just like ObvScum to me. They OMGUSed and then said it was a reaction test. I don't buy that line. Besides that Cheeky didn't really do much.
Comm - I don't think I have seen a single reason stated for why this guy is Town, but he goes on and on about how he should be a Town read. His whole narrative is completely fucked up and amounts to "I'm good at this game which is why you shouldn't lynch me." Fuck that noise.

[Quick]

Why would you post that, quick? You should know RVS wagons are for gathering information, not for quicklynching.

I am going to VOTE: Awoo for piling onto an easy wagon formed during the shitposting phase. Scum love easy lynches.

Nice, looks like the game is on, baby

VOTE: Quick

I hopped off of a random wagon onto a serious vote. Got a problem with that, collegeboy?

Not to mention jamiett has a towny vote on me. Even though he's completely wrong about the site meta, it's a town thought process.

I didn't see a reason attached to this vote.

why would something be less or more scummy at the start of the game?


--- I've come to expect naked votes early in the game as a way to end RVS and gain reactions. A naked vote at this point in the game could mean any number of things, some of which may be scummy. As an example.

This is just a bit too convenient for my liking.

I'll take this opportunity to make a triple post and call you out, maki, what I'm seeing from your post is a long list of items that independently, when all context is removed, are scummy. I don't see the drive to actually find scum in this post, since you're not digging past anything but the surface level and trying to find motivations, rather, you are looking for excuses.

VOTE: Maki

And why should we strip away all the context? That makes no sense to do that.

Quick, you're doing a lot of defending/townreading, do you have any other scumreads besides cheeky?

This is the first thing that Awoo did that was just blatantly false. I talk about it in this post:

Quick, you're doing a lot of defending/townreading, do you have any other scumreads besides cheeky?

IDK where you are getting this from. In my last few posts I have pointed out things I didn't like from North, Epic, and Jamie as well. So no, I don't think all I am doing is defending/Townreading people.

Depends on the game, but this one is exceptionally slow. A week in and only 13 pages.

Hey maki? This is what complaining about slowness and not doing anything looks like.

oh shit I did it again, that quote is from lalendra

Depending on how you look at these two posts, they can look either Scummy or confusing AF.

Lalendra is playing exactly like a scum IC in a newbie game LOL

Wut? No, Lalendra is not playing ANYTHING like an IC would in a newbie game. This is the second time Awoo has said something that is just not true at all.

This game is for the most part an exception, jamie, pretend all the people that never posted once and replaced out don't exist. Noobs that signed up then left the website.

...379 holy shit you just described my scumgame wtf?

I thought that strategy was foolproof

I thought you said you had no meta at this point in time. If that's the case, why even say this? It looks like you are just trying to get participation points here for "joining in the fun" or whatever.

If he's flat out saying he's VT and he's scum then how does that help scum narrow the pool?

Jamie NEVER said they were VT, so this is false info #3.

Jamie is becoming a policy lynch.
A policy lynch that I support.
VOTE: jamiet99uk
Because otherwise it's too obvious who's getting mason'd, and that's bad. At least when we remove this from the game there is a good layer of ambiguity who the copshot lands on.

Is it bad if I think this slot isn't reaaaaaaly going to flip scum? I don't think this lynch is terrible for town as we also get some info on who's on wagons and stuff, who pushed him throughout the day, etc. But I don't reaaaly think it's going to flip scum.

A lot of my scumreads are on this wagon and I feel bad in that regard but read above.

I THINK THIS IS L-1

This is by far the WORST vote of the game. I don't even think I need to say why because it is so bad. And I'm not inclined to think this is just "too Scummy to be Scum" because I think Awoo is the type of player that could def mess up big time like this.

You know, I just taking a shower and I was thinking to myself "Wait a minute, in hindsight that post I just made was antitown as hell. How did no one vote me for it?"


[unv][/unv] let me read for a sec before I vote again

You don't say. Chance #1 to vote me.

UNVOTE: oof

Chance #2 to vote me that you don't

VOTE: Quick Nope, votes on my wagon look good. Except for quick. 344 was just a wagon building vote. Your vote on me is just a wagon building vote. 352 is weak reasoning for joining the wagon. Like the other guy said, it's a weak hypothetical that relies on... what? I like him for scum here.

You vote him since his content is not deep enough but he's pretty town though? voting, pressuring for good reasons. I was just despairing in my post over jamie being doomed not to live to endgame because of silly/annoying things he does and that town won't look past that. But we can though, you know? So I'm happy I made that post.

Oh, hey look, a wagon on me has started to build steam. NOW you vote me on chance #3.

Okay, but really cheeky,

I said that post was scummy as hell not you're scum. That's a suicide post if you are. Main reason I townread you is because of your response to my meta argument. Scum don't say "don't townread me" lol. Yes I am all over the place I'm in too many games :/ but I don't want to replace and be that guy. I think 3 should be my limit.

Do scum really not say "don't townread me"? That's reaaaaly not that hard to fake, considering the result I got out of it.

When you say my post is scummy as hell, ok you're not wrong, but what do you really mean by it if you're townreading me? What does this add to the game? This just reads like you have are looking at the game through an informed point of view to me. See this post in here for an example of what I mean. (taken from my scumgame, you were there )

For the record my vote on jamie wasn't supposed to be a reaction test, just a classic LapseInJudgement (TM)

VOTE: Cheeky

I've got no grudge against you if that's what you want to believe, cheeky. But maybe I do have some issues with your play.

I just called your read on me weak and I explained why. You respond with "ehh, i'll just troll you, you're town btw". Believe me, I'm trying to find some reason to townread you so you aren't just a wasted day 1 lynch like you say you usually are, but if you're just going to give up what's the point?

Your read on me reads like it comes from an informed perspective. Your post about me reads flippantly. Can't you do anything remotely town-motivated?

And now quick is onto questioning you, getting ready for a hop on himself, so maybe I am off the mark on voting you. But shit man, it's not town's job to act high and mighty "don't question my reading methods" "i'll just troll you, you're so stupid cant you see im town?" then blame town for mislynching them when it inevitably happens, and you need to get that through your towngame's head. Yes you are antitown. I don't know what you look like as scum.

VOTE: Quick

Why do this? Why change votes like this from me to cheeky to me? I do not understand why Town would do this, someone explain it to me.

Instead of looking for scummy posts I am looking for scum.

You don't say. And This is represented... how?

Yeah. Whatever's popular, you're on it. This is my observation.

And you are NOT doing this?

Because a new opportunity arose and the jamie wagon was collapsing? Why did you even ask this?

Sigh. I really don't want to townread Jamie after all that, but UNVOTE:

I already had some doubt, and his last few posts felt very Towny to me. And now I'm back at square one.

Was it you before who didn't want to unvote and kept their vote on someone because you didn't know where else to stick it? Why unvote now? What changed?

SvS

Completely and utterly 100% baseless. Pre-Fip #1 that Lalendra and I are Teamed.

CHOO CHOO

This is something I said in my post. Why is it OK for you to do this and not me? Like, I am pretty sure I actually made the intention to see who was going to resist the wagon. You don't even do that tho. Instead you just add this in to look like you are doing something.

Lalendra & quick both premium lynches 2day

Pre-Flip #2 that Lalendra and I are Teamed.

It's not impossible, jamie. They've done nothing to convince me otherwise.

Pre-Flip #3 that Lalendra and I are Teamed. None of it is backed up by anything ofc, just a blanket shading with no reasoning attached whatsoever.

Now, face my ultimate technique! 542

Half your post has been invalidated. *strikes pose*

If this only happened one time, it would be one thing. But this is the 4th time you have dones something like this. It's a clear pattern at this point.

If we don't lynch quick today I am going to deathtunnel him

Good for you, I welcome it.

[Quick]

Will do Cheeky/Flub and Comm tomorrow.

[Quick]

On to Cheeky.

If you just click on my ISO and Search "cheeky" that should give you my reasons for why I am Sus of Cheeky. If that's not good enough, then I'll do a full blown ISO case out of it.

[Quick]

I'm starting to wonder if lalendra is town since all the scummy players are suspecting her

Deadline is coming up boys, don't forget to submit your quick vote in the next ~30 hours

I have her as a town lean...

[Quick]

For Comm, I don't think he ever really says he should be town read, but I can totally see him using like some kinda subliminal messaging which is trying to push the agenda that he is Town.

Go ahead and ISO him and search "Town".

[Quick]

For Comm, I don't think he ever really says he should be town read, but I can totally see him using like some kinda subliminal messaging which is trying to push the agenda that he is Town.

Go ahead and ISO him and search "Town".

On that argument, ISO me and search "Scum". It comes up more often... But you know. Don't want to tell the FULL story to yet another shitty push on me.

this checks out actually.

There's 83 times Town is in your ISO and 87 times Scum shows up.

Still a lot for both with an ISO of 40 posts, but that's prolly NAI.

Can you answer my question I directed at you 3 times now?

[Quick]

For Comm, I don't think he ever really says he should be town read, but I can totally see him using like some kinda subliminal messaging which is trying to push the agenda that he is Town.

Go ahead and ISO him and search "Town".

I dislike this.

Yeah, that was bad, admittedly.

[Quick]

Screw you all.

[Quick]

Until the mod locks the thread we can post. Come on Quick, where are you at?

I thought I would update my Wiki.

[Quick]

That was really bad if that was the hammer and Aubry didn't wait for a claim.

[Quick]

UNVOTE: Hansel
VOTE: Gretel

In case I am nightkilled...

What are you even doing?

[Quick]

Just Lynch me. I don't see Comm getting enough votes to get lynched and prolly no way in hell anyone else gets a sizable wagon in time before EOD.

[Quick]

Why am I not dead? I am shocked actually.

Now that I think about it, I could prolly try and flesh out my progression on North better.

Its was kinda a quick thought process. It just kinda clicked that North was playing far more Pro-Town than I was giving them credit for. That's the long and short of it.

[Quick]

I would love a Jamie lynch today. In fact, I won't be here in the deadline, so this is probably my last post today:

VOTE: Jamie. vote it, quick, there are no reason whatsoever you can think it's a town slot. no reason.

look at this reaction to the fake hammer. look at how he wants to be excused for the hammer he was about to do. he knew quick was flipping town. his 790 is just making that not so obvious.

Pretty much this exactly:

Of the 4 people currently voting me, Lalendra thinks I might be town and is basically policy lynching me for being "rude". Jeebus, don't be such a petal.

The other three I ask this question: Did you see my post about my gambit to draw the NK (which you have all now fucked) and if you did see it, doesn't my behaviour make more sense now? Was such a gambit just too complex for the regimented "you-must-play-our-way" attitude some of you seem to have? Because I don't care about your site meta.

seconding this point - i read what you said you were trying to do and had an instant moment of "oh, that makes sense". if there are people who believe jamie's behavior earlier this game is due to incompetence or to scum awkwardness, to reconcile that view and this claimed strategy you would have to believe that in the time period between then and now jamie gained enough knowledge of the game or experience to both realize how awkard what he was saying sounded and to come up with a believable explanation for it. i think the far simpler and more likely answer is that it was a planned strategy, as claimed. it just makes a lot of sense looking back that it was a deliberate attempt to put forward a newbie image. of course, it's not as if this strategy couldn't have come from scum, but again - i'd say the far more likely answer is that it shows a town thought process / motivation.

relevant quotes:

Excellent.

The reaction to my challenge to CommKnight was very interesting. Everyone who said it was a bad idea is entirely correct. Of course I don't want CommKnight to commit to suiciding if he's town and gets his D1 read wrong. That would be a waste.

My intention in proposing this apparently mad idea was twofold. First of all, to dissuade CommKnight from being too cocky about his gut, and anyone else from just slavishly following him. Secondly, I wanted too see people's reactions. I'm going to spend some time assessing those later today.

For the record I do stand by my assertion that a VT should not be afraid to die. A VT dying is not as good as scum dying, for sure - but it's way better than a PR dying. Plus, flips are informative. A lot of people have interacted with me today and if I died, those interactions could provide many clues.

That said, all things considered I'd prefer to stay alive, and I'm definitely town, so if you've got a good scumread, go for them - and tell us why. It's time to start bringing this phase home, my fellow townsfolk.

1) Not sure if I believe this was all a ploy, or if this is backpedaling and "I MEANT TO DO THAT."
2) Remember how we were trying not to out the masons? Saying you're VT is narrowing the pool. We already talked about this. Stahp.
3) "I'm definitely town, fellow townsfolk" is the most LAMIST post I've ever seen.

I'm not trying to out the Masons or narrow the pool. Maybe you are.

@Lalendra: You're mistaken about what I'm trying to do. I'm not scum.

It's easy to say you're not scum, but you didn't refute my points.

If I did that, I would have to explain myself. That would be counter-productive at this time. Don't vote for me tho. Thanks.

Who is claiming VT? Me? Nonono.

(Aubrey I am using a computer)

Yes, my continuing to push you on things you've said and refuse to defend, and calling you out on your unwillingness to explain yourself, is obviously just unfounded tunneling.

Perhaps your intention is well-founded and you just have no idea what I might be doing, but it's still tunnelling and it's not very helpful at this point. It's just becoming repetitious.

[Quick]

we're really going to need people to get on soon if today isn't going to end in a no-lynch.

I'll hammer any of the three wagons just to get a lynch, but ofc I prefer Comm.

[Quick]

2 hours what's the VC

Its 4 a piece on Comm and Jamie.

[Quick]

North was literally the worst mason target what the fuck?

Why?

[Quick]

VOTE: Quick

Naked vote, love.

[Quick]

VOTE: quick

I bet a speedwagon here will make awoo jump off again

Another naked vote.

Let's see how many of these we get.

[Quick]

VOTE: quick

I bet a speedwagon here will make awoo jump off again

Another naked vote.

Let's see how many of these we get.

It wasn't a naked vote. He voted to see if Awoo would have the courage of her convictions. It says so right there in Flubber's post.

And why is that a good reason to vote for me?

Typically people vote the people that they are Sus of as opposed to voting the person that they find Sus votes.

[Quick]

VOTE: Flubber

Why are you voting Flubber?

[Quick]

VOTE: Quick

Hey look, another naked vote on me.

[Quick]

Chisa Yukizome replaces Chisa Yukizome. Please welcome her. :clap:

Best mod is best.

[Quick]

why am I being voted again? doesn't matter, it's not happening.

let's go where we should've gone last day:

VOTE: Lalendra

---

I love how Lalendra and Awoo immediately accepted Comm sugestion, of lynching outside of the potential mislynches, never once stopping to think that Comm could've scum intentions to post that. That, combined with my prior suspicions about Lalendra, makes me sure that she should be the vote for today. And North was a probable member on a Lalendra wagon today, even if people does not associate this fact with North. If I'm suddenly not lazy, I might very well make a big case on her. But for this point, this is enough.

---

hey, Jamie, where's all your content? and was that a naked vote? a naked vote, jamie? we had discussions about that.

I'm not completely sold on Lalendra. I need more of a case than this. I will say that she isn't really explaining... well, anything really, but that's here meta IIRC. So give me something good and maybe I will consider it. I will say that I think Comm is either Scum or full of himself so there is no way I am going to sheep him on you.

[Quick]

So the Lucca wagon is kinda garbage right now. I have yet to hear one valid reason for his lynch. VOTE: Lalednra

Why is Lalendra Sus?

[Quick]

Lucca

I'd be willing to start an awoo wagon with you

Y/N

Hell yes.

[Quick]

VOTE: Awoo

[Quick]

why am I being voted again? doesn't matter, it's not happening.

let's go where we should've gone last day:

VOTE: Lalendra

---

I love how Lalendra and Awoo immediately accepted Comm sugestion, of lynching outside of the potential mislynches, never once stopping to think that Comm could've scum intentions to post that. That, combined with my prior suspicions about Lalendra, makes me sure that she should be the vote for today. And North was a probable member on a Lalendra wagon today, even if people does not associate this fact with North. If I'm suddenly not lazy, I might very well make a big case on her. But for this point, this is enough.

---

hey, Jamie, where's all your content? and was that a naked vote? a naked vote, jamie? we had discussions about that.

I'm not completely sold on Lalendra. I need more of a case than this. I will say that she isn't really explaining... well, anything really, but that's here meta IIRC. So give me something good and maybe I will consider it. I will say that I think Comm is either Scum or full of himself so there is no way I am going to sheep him on you.

Real talk, you say explaining/doing little to nothing is Lalendra's meta (which is lynch-able regardless IMO). I tell you Comm being egotistical, loud mouthed, proud about his reads, and uses grouping/associatives to solve the game is his meta. Do you suddenly believe me that he is maybe town based on that? Prob, not. So if you want me to believe him scum, you'll need to give me something good and maybe I'll consider it.

OK.

He hasn't Scum hunted. Like, at all. That should be reason enough IMO.

Besides that, his whole theory on who is Scum is pretty much a shot in the dark because it doesn't really point to anyone specific except who he chose out of a hat if you are to believe he is being truthful when he voted for Lucca. Beyond that, pretty much everything he says is baseless and we shouldn't really just take him at his word because if you start just trusting gut then you lose every time you play against a decent Scum player who uses gut. It just does not make sense to listen to anything Comm says really.

[Quick]

Besides that, his whole theory on who is Scum is pretty much a shot in the dark because it doesn't really point to anyone specific except who he chose out of a hat if you are to believe he is being truthful when he voted for Lucca. Beyond that, pretty much everything he says is baseless and we shouldn't really just take him at his word because if you start just trusting gut then you lose every time you play against a decent Scum player who uses gut. It just does not make sense to listen to anything Comm says really.

I'll agree he could do some more frontal work with explaining, even if he were to say something like "tonal read," but having played with him, I'm not overly shocked. Ask and he'll usually be glad to explain deeper, but you need to be specific. I never said we should take him at his word, nor blindly follow him, but he is a somewhat competent player. I think I've said this once in a round about way, but it's best to hold him to a certain degree of standards regarding those reads, and just watch how they are pushed. I'd say more, but should he actually be scum, I'd rather him not know any more than what I've already said.

--

This is probably a topic for another thread, but I'd argue gut is better than logical analysis. It's just harder to push those cases, and even harder to have self belief in those gut feelings at times.

That's all fine and well, but I can't really trust you at your word either. So just to cover my bases I'd like to ask others who have played with him if this is accurate or not.

[Quick]

Kayyyy, still town.

Completely pointless comment.

Lalendra, do you remember what I went over last game? If you thought I didn't have a point that would be one thing. I would like to know where you stand on the issue currently.

[Quick]

Kayyyy, still town.

Completely pointless comment.

Lalendra, do you remember what I went over last game? If you thought I didn't have a point that would be one thing. I would like to know where you stand on the issue currently.

Hey, you need to answer this.

[Quick]

I'm not sure what issue you're referring to. Last game I had with you as Quick or as your alt?

The game that just ended with me as LicketyQuickety.

[Quick]

So what do you mean when you say "what you went over"? You went over a lot of things during the course of the game.

This:

It wasn't that I didn't see your point, it was that I had already stated that it was a gut read, so fishing for more concrete reasons is fruitless when I already admitted that I didn't have them. I was pretty transparent when I said that it was a gut read so your digging is pointless. Blood and turnips and what-have-you.

Yeah, and that is YOUR fault for not having good enough reasons that I can't counter. The burden of proof is on you. I say this as a matter of speaking and not literally, but the point is the same. YOU claimed I was Scum so YOU have to show WHY I am Scum otherwise your read means nothing because as I earlier stated, anyone can claim any gut read on anyone and it shouldn't convince anyone of anything. What is stopping Scum from giving a gut read like this that you have given? A: Nothing.

[Quick]

let's re-read this D1.

I tried to do that. Didn't get that far, but I got far enough that I still think Awoo is Scum.

[Quick]

I'd like to know who is Town reading Epic.

[Quick]

Dead game is dead X_X

Also note: The resistance to voting Maki. Sure some town won't want them dead, but why so much resistance? Surely scum would want them dead if I were wrong.

I wouldn't be shocked if a lot of people tr me or are scared to vote me. But this way of thinking is interesting tell me more.

This way of thinking nabs me scum that other people TR for stupid reasons that can be faked more than a... I'm not going to finish that sentence because it's not appropriate.

But it's effective. It's unorthodox and it works.

If you got time to question it, you got time to look at the names and figure it out. I'd be actually impressed if someone figured out my thought here without me explaining it when it's over. Like they'd need some serious detective work.

It's 100% possible I'm wrong but it's 99% probable I'm not.

Fastposted by Quick. I don't know. He's being stupid enough to be town. I don't think he realizes there's a pretty solid town bloc forming and it's not going to be long before scum are left out of it. I could see him flipping either alignment though.

What Town block are you talking about?

[Quick]

@Quick, how do you read me right now on town/scum scale. Fuck what you think about my play, what do you think of my alignment?

I can tell you it would prolly be a can of worms that you most likely don't want to hear. If you insist, I'll let you know what I think of your play.

[Quick]

@Quick, how do you read me right now on town/scum scale. Fuck what you think about my play, what do you think of my alignment?

I can tell you it would prolly be a can of worms that you most likely don't want to hear. If you insist, I'll let you know what I think of your play.

10/10, would suggest reading again. My play might be different from what you're use to, but your reading comprehension isn't different than what I'm use to in these situations. We can do this again from D1, where I re-quote myself and narrow down the sentences so that you see what you missed.

If you insist.... we can do this all day long, I know I ain't gonna get tired.

I can't talk about your alignment without talking about your playstyle. If you don't know the arguments I would use regarding this, then clearly you are not experienced enough with the playstyle you have.

[Quick]

Comm: "What do you think of my alignment"
Quick: "I'll tell you what I think of your play"
Comm: "A-L-I-G-N-M-E-N-T"
Quick: "Well I can't talk about your alignment without mentioning your play."

Upcoming Comm Post: "Town-Neutral-Scum... YEP, VERY HARD TO TALK ABOUT WITHOUT TALKING ABOUT PLAY".

The only thing stopping you from you saying what you think my alignment is, is yourself. Stop bullshitting people and say it for fuck sake.

Where's Flavor and Awoo by the way? Been over 2 days for both of them. Out of 11 of us, only 5 have posted within the past 24 hours. It is only going stale because some people are completely missing from these conversations and only pop in to mention how dead it is. How about having something to say and saying it fully and help the game get going instead of being part of the problem?

I can't read you as Town because you are not Scum hunting. Your whole game, IIRC, revolves around Pre-Flip which I take issue with. The reason I have issues with Pre-Flip is because it's a lot easier for Scum to manipulate things via Pre-Flip than what Town gets out of talking about Pre-Flip. This is exactly why your Scum game is better than your Town game. Besides the fact that you do Pre-Flip, which I take issue with as a matter of principle, you also don't even explain your reasoning in what associations you are even making, which I take issue with as a matter of principle. These two things pretty much make it impossible to give a read on you one way or another.

[Quick]

Well from your perspective you should have seen yourself as a counterwagon to comm at the very least. If you know your alignment is town, you should be able to formulate some sort of read on comm from that.

Also weren't you voting him yesterday?

This argument already relies on knowing Comm is Town.

VOTE: Flubber

[Quick]

Well from your perspective you should have seen yourself as a counterwagon to comm at the very least. If you know your alignment is town, you should be able to formulate some sort of read on comm from that.

Also weren't you voting him yesterday?

This argument already relies on knowing Comm is Town.

VOTE: Flubber

Because you are assuming that Comm's method already works - that we should just believe him on blind faith.

[Quick]

... what

Because your theory also relies on Pre-Flip in a very similar way that Comm has said things. It's kinda like you are sheeping his methods.

[Quick]

There's no associatives in my push. It's a description of how town would be thinking, which is different from how you're thinking.

You are doing Pre-Flip based on Comm's Pre-Flip play. That is what I am seeing. I already gave my read on Comm. I don't think its correct to give any kind of read on Comm at all. Comms whole way of playing is pretty much fodder.

[Quick]

Quick, I'm not assuming comm pre flipped.

If you're going to be so adamant about that paradigm, I'm saying you should be able to use yourself as a pre-flip to make some sort of attempt to read comm since you should know your own alignment.

What? I am not going to do Pre-Flip in any regard.

[Quick]

@Flubber, I'm just going to let you deal with Quick. I already got my opinion of him, I townread him, I'm leaving it at that. If I begin digging into him, it's going to be a back-and-forth toxic fight and I'm not putting up with that this game.

@Aubrey, well, we both seem to agree on Chisa mostly there. (Also Flubber and Awoo for being among the least scummy). If we get a scum flip from my list, I'll explain it out tomorrow of why I think it's highly unprobable of 2 scum being in any one pairings I made. But some of it is relying a bit on a gambler's fallacy. Except, unlike a regular gambler, I'm usually in the ballpark of being spot on.

I see Maki is not quite your scum read, but isn't quite your town read. Which I'll give you points for, for being honest there. I'd be willing to compromsie onto Chisa for today. If Chisa flips scum, in my mind it'd clear both Awoo's slot and Epic. Plus Chisa hasn't been a big help as of late even if we end up mislynching this. I'm sorta hoping scum fear kills me or kills outside of my suspect pool in hopes to not make this easier, when in fact I'm already processing possible motives for multiple kills tonight.

If we're in a chess game, right now I have the mafia in Check with 3 moves to Check-Mate. I can almost guarantee not killing me would be the biggest mistake they make tonight.

I'm not sure I understand the reason behind posting this. I understand that you're confident and that's cool but why are you baiting the NK?

I could still be down for a Quick lynch.

VOTE: Quick

Lalendra, you never answered my question directed to you, why not?

[Quick]

@Flubber, I'm just going to let you deal with Quick. I already got my opinion of him, I townread him, I'm leaving it at that. If I begin digging into him, it's going to be a back-and-forth toxic fight and I'm not putting up with that this game.

@Aubrey, well, we both seem to agree on Chisa mostly there. (Also Flubber and Awoo for being among the least scummy). If we get a scum flip from my list, I'll explain it out tomorrow of why I think it's highly unprobable of 2 scum being in any one pairings I made. But some of it is relying a bit on a gambler's fallacy. Except, unlike a regular gambler, I'm usually in the ballpark of being spot on.

I see Maki is not quite your scum read, but isn't quite your town read. Which I'll give you points for, for being honest there. I'd be willing to compromsie onto Chisa for today. If Chisa flips scum, in my mind it'd clear both Awoo's slot and Epic. Plus Chisa hasn't been a big help as of late even if we end up mislynching this. I'm sorta hoping scum fear kills me or kills outside of my suspect pool in hopes to not make this easier, when in fact I'm already processing possible motives for multiple kills tonight.

If we're in a chess game, right now I have the mafia in Check with 3 moves to Check-Mate. I can almost guarantee not killing me would be the biggest mistake they make tonight.

I'm not sure I understand the reason behind posting this. I understand that you're confident and that's cool but why are you baiting the NK?

I could still be down for a Quick lynch.

VOTE: Quick

Lalendra, you never answered my question directed to you, why not?

Also, why are you voting for me?

[Quick]

@Lalendra

So what do you mean when you say "what you went over"? You went over a lot of things during the course of the game.

This:

It wasn't that I didn't see your point, it was that I had already stated that it was a gut read, so fishing for more concrete reasons is fruitless when I already admitted that I didn't have them. I was pretty transparent when I said that it was a gut read so your digging is pointless. Blood and turnips and what-have-you.

Yeah, and that is YOUR fault for not having good enough reasons that I can't counter. The burden of proof is on you. I say this as a matter of speaking and not literally, but the point is the same. YOU claimed I was Scum so YOU have to show WHY I am Scum otherwise your read means nothing because as I earlier stated, anyone can claim any gut read on anyone and it shouldn't convince anyone of anything. What is stopping Scum from giving a gut read like this that you have given? A: Nothing.

[Quick]

@Lalendra,

Kayyyy, still town.

Completely pointless comment.

Lalendra, do you remember what I went over last game? If you thought I didn't have a point that would be one thing. I would like to know where you stand on the issue currently.

Hey, you need to answer this.

[Quick]

I am going to

VOTE: Lalendra

Because I think Lalendra is purposefully avoiding answering me and I don't buy the whole "I didn't get what I wanted" thing. I think its an excuse not to vote me because no one else followed her on me.

[Quick]

I don’t follow your logic at all with that, but I think you’re town, so I’ll let it slide.

What are you confused about?

[Quick]

Votecount 2.5

Quick (1): Flubbernugget,
Flubbernugget (1): Maki Harukawa
Lalendra (3): lucca261, Aubrey, Quick
CommKnight (1): Epic Fial
Chisa Yukizome (2): Flavor Leaf, CommKnight
Aubrey (1): Not Known 15

Not voting: Chisa Yukizome, Lalendra

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch!

You forgot to add when day ends.

[Quick]

Quick, you keep telling me to respond to your question when I already did. As I said before, if my answer wasn't enough for you, please rephrase the question because I answered it as I understood it.

And since I'm probably getting lynched anyway I'm just going to VOTE: Awoo

I don't remember you replying to me. Could you quote it?

[Quick]

boon: agree

however

compromise Lynch >>>>>>> no Lynch

and i don't think this game is organized enough for a good lynch

Reasonable view
VOTE: Lalendra: Best option
Now L-1?

This is scum trying to push a counter-wagon.
Horrid reasoning and excuse from both.
VOTE: Chisa Yukizome
Epic Fial and Chisa Yukizome are scum.

For Christs sake, why is everyone doing Pre-Flip this game. Stop its embarrassing.

[Quick]

Like every time Quick posts, he has this aura around him like he thinks he's the smartest thing since sliced bread, then his post just keeps showing that to be wrong.

Where have I posted like I have this aura of superiority? I don't actually think I am the best player, I just think it's stupid to do Pre-Flip. IDK why that makes me arrogant. Have you tried looking in the mirror? Like I said earlier, a point which you fail to grasp, talking about Pre-Flip helps Scum influence the game more than it helps Town sort people.

[Quick]

oh okay it makes since with the edit

also if I wanted to just push someone I could just push


say

fial

like that's a really really surface level "frame while actually killing"

So who are you feeling you want to push if not Epic?

[Quick]

Lol I'm bored with haiku technique. Obv frame is obv. On the other hand, unless there is scum on NK's scumlist then he would presumably have been more valuable alive to scum. Killing him seems to indicate he was onto something. At the moment I don't have a clear picture of who that might be. To be honest, though, I have reason to believe both he and scum have been quite unobservant this game. My reason for saying that is something I don't want to disclose right now. Even now i remain suspicious of Comm. I notice on his colour-coded VC he doesn't even notice I have two votes recorded. My votes on him and Lalendra. So if he is really looking for scum that is quite a thing to miss. Obviously it's not damning in itself, but it's not nothing. That's about all i have right now. One thing i urgently need to do is reread. When i have some time today I will. Now I'm going to be busy for a few hours at least.

This is prolly your best post of the game fwiw.

[Quick]

It’s a frame kill.

VOTE: Quick

I imagine it was expected of me to tunnel onto Chisa, tbh all while keeping everyone on the Lalendra wagon alive, which means multiple scum are on the wagon, which was known due to the obvious nature of it being a compromise wagon.

Interesting perspective considering Awoo wanted me dead.

[Quick]

It’s a frame kill.

VOTE: Quick

I imagine it was expected of me to tunnel onto Chisa, tbh all while keeping everyone on the Lalendra wagon alive, which means multiple scum are on the wagon, which was known due to the obvious nature of it being a compromise wagon.

Interesting perspective considering Awoo wanted me dead.

?? Awoo was one of the biggest reasons D1 was a no lynch

Well, Awoo was around D2, so there is that. And IIRC they still wanted me dead.

[Quick]

I think it was Epic who made an excellent point on Flubber.

Let's see what happens when I do this:

VOTE: Flubber

[Quick]

I think it was Epic who made an excellent point on Flubber.

Let's see what happens when I do this:

VOTE: Flubber

That's L-2 btw.

[Quick]

Vote quick

wtf is this?

[Quick]

Pretty sure flub is town.

Why?

[Quick]

Pretty sure flub is town.

Why?

Because I think he isn’t scum.

Top kek, really

[Quick]

I think it was Epic who made an excellent point on Flubber.

Let's see what happens when I do this:

VOTE: Flubber

I did? What was it?

This is what I was talking about:

Top tr flips town? Shocked.

I will have to make time to ISO you and Lalendra.

Please not to forget
To make time for these ISOs
I will try also

Just did lalendra iso

Focuses way too much on Jamie, who we now know was a very convenient slot for scum to target

Also meh

Lalendra is a compromise lynch and will flip town.

Yep

Flubber, can you explain how you got from the first quote to the second please?

D1 was a no lynch
D2 was a compromise lynch

I see a perfect reason for scum to kill someone that wasn't making much of a difference in the game

Can you explain this? Why would scum kill someone who hasn't made mych impact?

You'll notice that Flubber never answers you.

[Quick]

Btw, I'm experimenting with lucidity technique this game Day...

I have not idea wtf that is...

[Quick]

Sure, I’ll bus.

VOTE: Flubber

I wouldn't doubt it based on how low impact you have been this game.

[Quick]

I wasn't hard sold on lalendra being scum (I listed my scum team later that day too) and compromise lynches are for the sake of flips, making them likely to land on town

This town is very uncooperative with each other. Scum doesn't want that to change, so it's in their interest to kill someone who wasn't changing the state of the game much.

Hey look at that it's the answers to the questions I didn't answer

Great, than you lynched town because ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Quick]

Btw, I'm experimenting with lucidity technique this game Day...

I have not idea wtf that is...

I get that a lot, believe it or not.

LOL. Oh, I def believe it.

[Quick]

(Whoops, posted before I finished).

Anyway, I early townread Chisa. So I'm going to go with the guy that has been constantly pushing bad pushes and has contributed very little.

VOTE: Epic

Group A? Check. 50% followed by a 33-66% chance? Check. Low grade content and voting? Double check.

He's scum.

Actually, this is not a bad point at all. Prolly Comm's best post of the game IMO.

[Quick]

Epic's reaction isn't great either.

[Quick]

Still happy with my vote tho.

[Quick]

I wasn't hard sold on lalendra being scum (I listed my scum team later that day too) and compromise lynches are for the sake of flips, making them likely to land on town

This town is very uncooperative with each other. Scum doesn't want that to change, so it's in their interest to kill someone who wasn't changing the state of the game much.

Hey look at that it's the answers to the questions I didn't answer

Great, than you lynched town because ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Why is there no wagon on a player trying to promote two back to back no lynches

I have no fucking idea what you are talking about...

[Quick]

I am liking Epic a lot more for Town recently.

[Quick]

@Flavor, I'm sorta mixed on you. One hand, there's a high likelyhood you're scum (but if Flubber were to flip sucm then I'd reverse that read), but what do you think of Epic? Is he town in your eyes?

Unlike Quick, I think his case he is building on me is scum taking advantage of my lack of attentiveness to this game. I’m a reaction test player, so I knew eventually if I kept doing pointless nonsensical things (i felt it was pretty obvious I was disassociated from this game) that scum somewhere would try to take advantage of it. I just had to sift through town seeing it as scummy, and scum taking the opportunity. People voting me gets me invested in the game, so now I’m here, and starting to see things.

So on what basis are you doing this sorting? Sounds like an excuse to sort any way that helps your (probably scum) wincon...

So this is actually a Freudian slip. The way he phrased it, the helps my “probably scum” wincon means that in doing so, there’s the possibility of doing what I did to help out my town wincon as well, but that makes his entire argument moot and NAI in that sense because if you can see it being done either alignment, which the word, that one word probably, means he sees/knows that it is happening from a town perspective. He pushes it completely as scum reasoning yet contradicts himself directly due to having insider knowledge.

I don’t think most people would notice this, but for me that locks it in.

LOL, no.

I didn't think you were a reaction test player with this account fwiw. We had a discussion about this stating that you play different on different accounts. This still hold? What's different about your play from one account to another?

[Quick]

Comm + Epic + ???

Pretty sure you know what I have to say to this Math.

[Quick]

Comm + Epic + ???

Pretty sure you know what I have to say to this Math.

You hate that i team hunt every game and hate my playstyle soooo I am gonna say you hate it?

Pre-Flip. It doesn't work.

[Quick]

Comm + Epic + ???

Pretty sure you know what I have to say to this Math.

You hate that i team hunt every game and hate my playstyle soooo I am gonna say you hate it?

Pre-Flip. It doesn't work.

Then help me lynch Comm. And yeah I was right you hate my playstyle.

It's nothing personal. I have just seen Pre-Flip thrown around so much being wrong it loses all meaning.

I prolly want to see if Comm's reads are any good before I lynch him tbh. People are saying his gut is good. I can't see it myself except he has me as Town and he had Lalendra as Town. At this point (because its a key part of the game) If he's off at this point, I'd be down for a lynch on him. But he's actually been kinda right up to this point from my perspective. He has some reads I disagree with but kinda want to test him out.

@Comm, would you put your ass on the line at this point in the game? Who is Scum, and more importantly, why are they Scum based on play.

[Quick]

1 scum in: <Flavor, Flubber>
1 scum in: <Maki, Lale>
1 scum in: <Chisa, Awoo, Epic>

I'm going to keep this list fresh, because I think it's dead on and if I'm killed, it might be worth considering exactly why.

<Falvor, Flubber>
<Maki>
<Chisa, Epic>

^ Still betting this is right.

Have you even voted Maki all game?

[Quick]

2.3-2.4 vote counts do have me on Maki.

Votecount 2.4

Quick (1): Flubbernugget
lucca261 (1): Lalendra
Flubbernugget (1): Quick
Lalendra (3): lucca261, Aubrey, Maki Harukawa
CommKnight (2): Epic Fial, Chisa Yukizome
Maki Harukawa (1): CommKnight
Chisa Yukizome (1): Flavor Leaf
Epic Fial (1): Not Known 15

Not voting:

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch!

Day ends in (expired on 2017-11-19 11:00:00)

I was reading Maki as Town early, but I expected them to pick up some better content. I was thinking that they were just feeling things out. That better solvay content never really came, which is a disappointment.

VOTE: Maki

YOLO.

[Quick]

2.3-2.4 vote counts do have me on Maki.

Votecount 2.4

Quick (1): Flubbernugget
lucca261 (1): Lalendra
Flubbernugget (1): Quick
Lalendra (3): lucca261, Aubrey, Maki Harukawa
CommKnight (2): Epic Fial, Chisa Yukizome
Maki Harukawa (1): CommKnight
Chisa Yukizome (1): Flavor Leaf
Epic Fial (1): Not Known 15

Not voting:

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch!

Day ends in (expired on 2017-11-19 11:00:00)

I was reading Maki as Town early, but I expected them to pick up some better content. I was thinking that they were just feeling things out. That better solvay content never really came, which is a disappointment.

VOTE: Maki

YOLO.

Comm Epic Quick

Damn was waaay too fast to rule that Quick was Town holy fuck that is a bad post.

Game over, Math wins.

[Quick]

Quick why didn't you push Comm for dodging your question?

Because I am sleep deprived and am in too many game atm. Sorry that's the reason.

[Quick]

Quick why didn't you push Comm for dodging your question?

Because I am sleep deprived and am in too many game atm. Sorry that's the reason.

Okay so you didn't push him.

This also means you admit it is fishy.

So then why are you voting with him?

Want to know a secret?

I can see Scum motive in pretty much every post.

[Quick]

Quick why didn't you push Comm for dodging your question?

Because I am sleep deprived and am in too many game atm. Sorry that's the reason.

Okay so you didn't push him.

This also means you admit it is fishy.

So then why are you voting with him?

Want to know a secret?

I can see Scum motive in pretty much every post.

Want to know a secret?

That doesn't answer my question.

You know the answer to this question.

[Quick]

Like, Math, think about this.. Am I really going to sheep my Scum buddy? IDK tho, maybe you don't know my Scum game.

[Quick]

Hell, I'll 1v1 Maki. If only for the fact that if town doesn't listen to me today, they sure as hell won't listen to me tomorrow when we will need 3 correct lynches in a row.

Also if this was LYLO Math, with you saying you're off to work, you'd leave a big window open for scum to hammer without much resistance.

It's not LyLo so this hypothetical serves no purpose.

[Quick]

I came in expecting to read a comment or two on break only to be greeted by pages. Will read in depth later. Scrolling quickly seems to be a Comm and Math bicker battle that I doubt will be overly enjoyable to read.

It's not enjoyable. Feel free to skip it. Summary is Math makes up bullshit that can be answered if he reads the thread and I get annoyed with it and call him out on it.

Vote Maki.

It is very enjoyable. Please read it first. Summary is Comm Knight can't take being pressured so anyone who pushes Comm Knight "sucks". He gets annoyed by me pointing out contradictions in his "consistency".

Voting Maki doesn't end well. Back off. Now.

Why are you arguing with your SR?

[Quick]

Math is really hit of miss for me.

[Quick]

Math is really hit of miss for me.

Ditto for you.

I find whoever I push you instantly townread then compromise on the person I scumread and then they flip scum.

I was talking about this game.

[Quick]

So? I don't see anything scum wouldn't do. Or that I haven't done as scum.

He is showing emotion. So what?

Telling what you believe to be the truth (or just the truth in the case of scum) is not alignment indicative else every game I have I would be Town.

Hit

Help me to see what you see. What this reads as to me is desperate scum and the fact neither of the two were lynched to me is suspicious.

Miss.

Stuff like that.

[Quick]

So? I don't see anything scum wouldn't do. Or that I haven't done as scum.

He is showing emotion. So what?

Telling what you believe to be the truth (or just the truth in the case of scum) is not alignment indicative else every game I have I would be Town.

Hit

Help me to see what you see. What this reads as to me is desperate scum and the fact neither of the two were lynched to me is suspicious.

Miss.

Stuff like that.

Okay...Let's assume that the consensus is I am a shitty Town player.

Instead of saying "I suck" help me better. Don't just say "Miss" or "Its math" tell me what I can do better. Connect the dots.

"Help me see what you see." Terrible tone. Far fetched reasoning with more bad tone.

[Quick]

My read on Lucca's slot (Math) is wavering. Lucca was almost lock-town for me. I mean I know Math can tunnel people and push town, he regularly does this. But this just feels fake. It doesn't even seem like he's trying to look at people. There's 3 scum and he's so dead-set on me being scum that he's failing to reason out who would have to be my two partners.

Even in Maki's quote I was looking at Maki and Epic since D1. I'm beginning to see a Maki, Epic, and Math team potential.

Not true. Hes said it was you me and Epic.

[Quick]

So? I don't see anything scum wouldn't do. Or that I haven't done as scum.

He is showing emotion. So what?

Telling what you believe to be the truth (or just the truth in the case of scum) is not alignment indicative else every game I have I would be Town.

Hit

Help me to see what you see. What this reads as to me is desperate scum and the fact neither of the two were lynched to me is suspicious.

Miss.

Stuff like that.

Okay...Let's assume that the consensus is I am a shitty Town player.

Instead of saying "I suck" help me better. Don't just say "Miss" or "Its math" tell me what I can do better. Connect the dots.

"Help me see what you see." Terrible tone. Far fetched reasoning with more bad tone.

Tone can't be good or bad. That is emotion. Reasoning far fetched << Why do you think this? If you feel my reasoning is bad tell me why.

Lack of doubt.

[Quick]

So? I don't see anything scum wouldn't do. Or that I haven't done as scum.

He is showing emotion. So what?

Telling what you believe to be the truth (or just the truth in the case of scum) is not alignment indicative else every game I have I would be Town.

Hit

Help me to see what you see. What this reads as to me is desperate scum and the fact neither of the two were lynched to me is suspicious.

Miss.

Stuff like that.

Okay...Let's assume that the consensus is I am a shitty Town player.

Instead of saying "I suck" help me better. Don't just say "Miss" or "Its math" tell me what I can do better. Connect the dots.

"Help me see what you see." Terrible tone. Far fetched reasoning with more bad tone.

Tone can't be good or bad. That is emotion. Reasoning far fetched << Why do you think this? If you feel my reasoning is bad tell me why.

Lack of doubt.

That isn't a logical flaw.
It can be argued I am arrogant fine. That doesn't mean wrong or far fetched.

I am damn sure 2+2 is 4.
Should I doubt that?
Get specific.
Tell me what on my read is wrong. Show me what specifically I am doing wrong.

Logical reasoning and deduction isn't my thing. I didn't make the argument you made a logical error.. That was you putting words in my mouth. I am playing the game of Mafia, IDK if you are playing math or not, but I am not.

[Quick]

Obviously you disagree with my scumread of you.

Obviously you disagree with my scumread of Comm and still haven't followed up with Comm despite my insistence that you should have with your question. Instead you sheep him. What specifically in your reads, not math, am I missing? What makes you not push him?

What specifically makes you not talk about Epic?

What specifically is "Miss" about my play/style here?

I have been pushing him.

He doesn't respond. That is for Town to figure out.

[Quick]

Obviously you disagree with my scumread of you.

Obviously you disagree with my scumread of Comm and still haven't followed up with Comm despite my insistence that you should have with your question. Instead you sheep him. What specifically in your reads, not math, am I missing? What makes you not push him?

What specifically makes you not talk about Epic?

What specifically is "Miss" about my play/style here?

I have been pushing him.

He doesn't respond. That is for Town to figure out.

If you're Town (again I doubt this) you have an opinion on this. Elaborate on your opinion. When I am trying to read you saying it's Town's problem to read Comm Knight and therefore not yours that is bad. Tell me what YOU think of Comm Knight's play since YOU are sheeping and pushing him two differing reads.

I think Comm has done hardly anything AI at all. He's just spouted Pre-Flip all game based on "gut." Seriously, How do you read that shit?

[Quick]

So, the flood gates shall continue to pour.

--

Just know you've entered a relatively lazy game. If you continue flooding like you are, you'll drown out what little voice some people have. Not only that, but can also add to the general laziness that is already occurring. Basically activity is good, but over-activity is bad.

--

Play as you wish, but consider the above. Personally I'm still way behind, and having been designing behind a computer screen since early in the morning, I really don't care nor look forward to critically reading this mass of info. You'll be lucky if I read half or 3/4ths tonight.

Uhm...

I don't think discouraging content is a good thing to do...

[Quick]

K. *doesn't feel like overly explaining a simple concept*

It is simple tho.. Content is good for the game, yeah? Like especially when the game has been starved for content?

[Quick]

VOTE: Flavor

He isn't doing anything Pro-Town. He's just saying he would lynch certain people or not lynch certain people. No Scum hunting.

[Quick]

VOTE: Flavor

He isn't doing anything Pro-Town. He's just saying he would lynch certain people or not lynch certain people. No Scum hunting.

Neither are you. Otherwise you'd either answer my question about your read on Comm Knight or admit you don't and then quit sheeping him as people don't sheep null reads.

There is a lot of context that you are not getting. I am at this point, independently SRing Maki. It's based on that slot not doing much solving. Also, everyone who has played with Comm has said his gut is good, so I kinda want to test that out. It's selfish of me to do, but he is either going to show that he is legit a master at this game or that he is a schmuck and I kinda want to figure out which it is.

[Quick]

Let's all do this:

Not lynching:
Epic
Chisa
Comm
Math

Would Lynch:
Aubrey
Flavor
Flubber
Maki

Pick 4 you would lynch and 4 you would not.

[Quick]

And those aren't reasons Flavor is scum.

They could be you don't buy that Flavor spent time offline on the case which is NAI.

Why do you scumread Flavor enough to be your top scumread?

I could buy into being busy in RL for a window in time. I could buy into not being motivated for a window of time. Your window of time though has been a major portion of the game. furthermore, I don't buy that it was a planned decision to actively lurk in order to help you place players through reaction testing. Like the annoying math teachers in my old high school days, you need to show the work, and I'm not seeing it. The only thing I see, is you going after the first person to really call you out on anything for survival. <--- aka this reads more as "Oh shit time to push back on the fly" rather than "I've been collecting data on how people recieve me, and here are my results now that my wagon is generated"

These seem like legit reasons to me, Math.

[Quick]

It's absolutely absurd to assume anyone would push Maki for town cred

Why?

[Quick]

Maki is in the nether regions for me.

If Maki is scum, and on flubber, that would make Math be pushing a town Flubber, meaning Comm and Flubber probably are on the correct path. I can’t really tell who on my wagon is scum from the low hanging fruit, because Quick can always just be poor town.

Well, Math, I’m town.

VOTE: Maki

I hope you guys see why there is no scenario where ScumFlavor votes Maki here....it puts us in a direct counterwagon at best, if Math goes along side with me, and Maki is the deciding factor.

The fuck?

[Quick]

Just finished page 54. Whiskey and Coke sound great right about now.

So where is your head at this point? Are you thinking a Maki lynch or what? I actually might switch back to Maki actually because Flavors stream of consciousness wasn't bad. That said, I do think Boonskies at least is capable of that as Scum. Also, Like I said early game, I expected Maki to pick up with the solving, but it never really came, so that is leaving me with a huge 'wut?' for that slot.