Open 705: Polygamist - Game Over

[Mathdino]

Kop has been prodded

fuck i didn't see this, sorry mod

request replacement if he doesn't respond in good faith (outside of prod dodge) but that's obvious

[Sky_Paladin]

"who should we lynch tomorrow"

phone post

knowing my alignment when Diamond/Sky flips I would say the votes that are the most suspicious on my wagon are Cy/Lalendra followed by Red/whoever red is team with. Cy most suspicious because natural progression should have been a vote on sheep to stay alive but the vote on dia suggests he knew he wasn't in any danger aka scum were already on the cy wagon and he was confident that he would get ~2 votes shifted wherever. Lalendra ambivalent about voting also concerning.

Second place is Sheep/Tora.

Third place is afk slot - possibly scum is super unmotivated this game due to giant walls and killing a blank slot probably just as good or better than random lynch or scumhunting

my preference is hyung because despite promising to catch up they never did. and also iric they are buddies with red who as mentioned above has troubling votes

cut by hyhung lol

[Sky_Paladin]

inb4 why i didn't vote cylendra

like i said before

half the game hadn't checked in. I was not at all confident that scum had even posted yet. I was reluctant to put a player within hammer range that early in the phase when claims mean nothing.

why change vote back to Dino

because the Cy wagon didn't exist and I realised that the best way for town to get out of this mess is for sky to 1v1 dino because you only truly get to know somebody when you fight them

i was super salty last night when all those votes appeared on me and cy was a knee-jerk reaction vote

but you should be aware that it can't be Cy/Sky scum team with Cy's votes there eh.

I was considering posing this challenge to maths-
you vote sheep
I'll vote cy
that takes us out of the voting equation. then we can see what the rest of the town does. ought to be interesting.

but i'm not real sure if that has merit.

[Mathdino]

Okay cool last words of one townie is good to me. Now that that's settled:

@Mathblade

: Couple things.

1. How are you reading this?

2. What exactly does Diamond/Sky/cy/Lalendra do in this situation to not get lynched?

3. What exactly does Diamond/Sky-scum who's pairs with someone else, do in this situation?

4. Should we just lynch cy instead? Why did the cy and momo wagons stay grounded while the Sky wagon has taken off?

5. So they're townreading us now (I think), which fucks the policy side of my argument. What does that mean?

Edit: @Sky: "Letting the town do what it will" will just result in mafia doing a shitton of distancing. You know very well that scum would and should temporarily bus to distance in this setup. High stakes mean bluffs often work. It's like going all-in.

Luckily I'm in the business of calling all-ins when the odds are in my favour.

[MathBlade]

Okay cool last words of one townie is good to me. Now that that's settled:

@Mathblade

: Couple things.

1. How are you reading this? On my phone

2. What exactly does Diamond/Sky/cy/Lalendra do in this situation to not get lynched? Why would I answer this when I already did before?

3. What exactly does Diamond/Sky-scum who's pairs with someone else, do in this situation? Already answered and I am not telling scum.

4. Should we just lynch cy instead? Why did the cy and momo wagons stay grounded while the Sky wagon has taken off? That is another option. I am okay either way. Mainly I need to do some comparisons and contrasts of the wagon for benefit of the doubt but it looks to be the majority of the same people.

5. So they're townreading us now (I think), which fucks the policy side of my argument. What does that mean? Nothing? Who scum scumread/townread is irrelevant once exposed. The reads help to see if fuvkups occur.

Edit: @Sky: "Letting the town do what it will" will just result in mafia doing a shitton of distancing. You know very well that scum would and should temporarily bus to distance in this setup. High stakes mean bluffs often work. It's like going all-in.

Luckily I'm in the business of calling all-ins when the odds are in my favour.

I really think this is just a good wagon but I wanna study it to be sure. And that means not when I am cooking dinner.

[Sky_Paladin]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Cylendra

I think this is all I can do at this point until Im back from work.

Im not townreading you per say but I will accept that your votes at least have a natural logical progression and you have been following/active in the game. Cy literally had no reason to vote me once Dia/Sky had voted Dino if we were all one big scum team. It looks like they simply aligned with the bigger townblock. I can't argue from VCA that you are scum. OTOH cy/Red look like baddies purely from vca

well gotta go :/

[sheepsaysmeep]

it's cy and lalendra

[Sky_Paladin]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: cytheflyguy

[LlamaFluff]

Vote Count

DiamondSentinel (5) - sheepsaysmeep, cytheflyguy, Mathdino, Mathblade, RedFlavor
cytheflyguy (2) - Toranaga, Sky_Paladin
Mathdino (1) - DiamondSentinel
RedFlavor (1) - momo
momo (1) - Lalendra

Not Voting (2) - Kop, hyung

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline for day one is January 25th 7PM PST in (expired on 2018-01-25 19:00:00)

[DiamondSentinel]

I guess what we are looking for is the set of interactions between declared groups that seem suspicious. If you think of every player group as a hydra, we're looking for the two hydra's that have shady interactions.

So with that in mind I think that the mass claim is probably for the best, and in flagrant disregard of what my lover said earlier, I'll go ahead and declare that I'm paired with DiamonSentinel. Interestingly we both independently hated on the dice routine.

In our topic we basically discussed what the setup was because apparently neither of us read it before signing up, then freaking out when we realised that we had no idea how to scumhunt in this scenario, and then to claim or not claim. We decided we'd just go with the flow, so, here I am, flowing away.

That kinda sounds gross :V

You mean here?

Why did you claim despite your claim that your lover suggesting you hide it?

I told Sky to hide it because Sky was an unknown in my strategy. If I could control what they did, then that would remove a wild-card from my "team's" actions.

Then why not explain the entire plan to your partner?

That’s what I am not following.

It feels like Sky just made up something and y’all are scrambling to justify it.

Furthermore do you have a townread on Lalendra or cytheflyguy?

I didn't explain everything to my partner because I just came out of Perpetual MyLo, where, for the most part, everyone else in the scum team was incompetent and screwed everything up. This is roughly the same deal: I'm teamed with someone, and we have to work together to win the game. I came in not trusting anyone, especially my own partner.

I do have a null!town on Lalendra. Cy hasn't done anything noteworthy.

[DiamondSentinel]

You could just not lynch me. I mean, you admit here that you think I'd say the exact same thing town or scum. So why are you attempting to lynch me? Is it because I've been at odds with your 2 biggest efforts here?

This current conversation you've been having with me, and the last 5 billion convos you've been having with me about theory, are not why I or my partner is scumreading you.

It's kind of a utility lynch. I don't believe, at this point, that you'll vote with the townbloc I'm personally relying on for LyLo. I believe your read on me has been too set in stone for that. So assuming you're town, if I don't lynch you today, then I have to 100% find the scumteam today. And my strategy doesn't have any way to reliably find scum on D1. The point is to aggregate D1 and D2.

Yes, it's lowkey OMGUS, but here's an analogy.
You're a townie with 1 scum left. 5 players. One player who is a little scummy by association has been gunning for you the whole game. You have little reason to believe they'll change their mind in LyLo. Furthermore, you know for sure that if they're town, scum will leave them alive and let them lynch you in LyLo.

You can't lynch scum if they're alive tomorrow unless scum happens to be them and you can convince the remaining townie. But the player has a chance at convincing that townie.

So you prepare yourself for LyLo by lynching that player, praying to god they're scum (and they are scummy) and then saying, well, I had to lynch someone only for them to flip town, I'd rather it be them. This at least puts you in an okay spot later on.

I'm honestly not sure any of the above is even town indicative. I haven't thought through it but it's possibly also scum's ideal strategy if they were in my slot.

We're at a really really weird impasse.

I assume you want me to lynch sheep/Tora today.

You realize that you don't have to win every battle in order to get a lynch. Your "utility" lynch is a shitty reason. If you don't believe that I would work with you, then you could go for my partner.

But regardless.

Your analogy just doesn't make sense to me. Nobody's reads are unshakable. I thrive on reversing peoples reads. Or at least delaying it as long as possible. Kinda my trademark. The only thing that I would ever suggest a policy/utility lynch for would be just straight-up bad play; someone [

cough sheep cough

refusing to actually try in the game. To say "this person disagrees with me so we should lynch them" is almost exactly like a scum telling their buddies "this person is on to us, so kill them".

As for the sheep/tora lynch? Yes. It's definitely my strongest read. Sheep is blatantly scum, and also is just playing (if you can even call it that) shittily. He's not even trying. Regular lynch + policy lynch = yes please lynch

[DiamondSentinel]

I am just curious. Diamond Sentinel has played with me enough to read me.

Yet he only talks Dino. Why? Because Diamond is scum.

Since you replaced in, I've been keeping up almost none at all. I'm just in an extended conversation with Dino. That's why I'm essentially jsut responding to him, aside from a couple posts here and there.

RL's a bitch. I'm just catching up real fast before I go to bed. Which is to say, in about 10 minutes.

Kindly don't lynch me while I'm asleep. Bitch move. And the rest of the town, if someone does hammer me overnight, please lynch them with fire tomorrow. kthanks

[sheepsaysmeep]

yo

[DiamondSentinel]

In other news, Sky, stop fucking wagon hopping. It's hard enough for me to deal with this wagon without you floundering here and there.

Anyways, VOTE: sheep. This is where my vote stays for the rest of the day.

(Oh, also, Math, would you stop sucking at reading me? This is 3 games in a row you've misread me completely)

[DiamondSentinel]

(talking to MathBlade)

[Mathdino]

The only thing that I would ever suggest a policy/utility lynch for would be just straight-up bad play; someone [cough sheep cough refusing to actually try in the game. To say "this person disagrees with me so we should lynch them" is almost exactly like a scum telling their buddies "this person is on to us, so kill them".

As for the sheep/tora lynch? Yes. It's definitely my strongest read. Sheep is blatantly scum, and also is just playing (if you can even call it that) shittily. He's not even trying. Regular lynch + policy lynch = yes please lynch

You seem not only unaware of sheep's meta of being shitty but also not willing to consider it.

@Sky/Diamond:

I'll give you guys a chance here.

I need you to do 2 things to shake my sheep read.

1.

sheep

: This looks strongly like policy territory. I need you to do a case that points out scum motivation in his posts and gets me a scumpartner set. I'm obviously personally disinclined to lynch someone who's at least willing to follow my logic. And don't give me the general "oh sheep skates along and does nothing all game" because you know, I replaced into his townslot once, I know this. Literally a shitposting middle schooler.

2.

Tora

: The reason I'm not shaking this read is the repeated townslips. I need you to get me evidence (ideally based on meta) that "townslips" are NAI and are faked by Tora. Also need evidence for open buddying of town. That part less so.

Do this and I'll strongly consider voting either sheep/Tora, or whomever you think is their partner (I would be more comfortable with this).

[Mathdino]

I do have a null!town on Lalendra. Cy hasn't done anything noteworthy.

Also how the fuck are you nulltowning Lalendra?

I asked her for a Last Will set of reads and she completely ignored it. Wtf in her ISO indicates town?

Talk to me as if you believe I'm town. I'm obviously unwilling to listen to "she pushed against the scum in you/sheep/Tora".

[sheepsaysmeep]

you replaced me in rvs ;-;

[Mathdino]

You used I think 3/10 of your limited number of posts to spam.

[DiamondSentinel]

The only thing that I would ever suggest a policy/utility lynch for would be just straight-up bad play; someone [cough sheep cough refusing to actually try in the game. To say "this person disagrees with me so we should lynch them" is almost exactly like a scum telling their buddies "this person is on to us, so kill them".

As for the sheep/tora lynch? Yes. It's definitely my strongest read. Sheep is blatantly scum, and also is just playing (if you can even call it that) shittily. He's not even trying. Regular lynch + policy lynch = yes please lynch

You seem not only unaware of sheep's meta of being shitty but also not willing to consider it.

@Sky/Diamond:

I'll give you guys a chance here.

I need you to do 2 things to shake my sheep read.

1.

sheep

: This looks strongly like policy territory. I need you to do a case that points out scum motivation in his posts and gets me a scumpartner set. I'm obviously personally disinclined to lynch someone who's at least willing to follow my logic. And don't give me the general "oh sheep skates along and does nothing all game" because you know, I replaced into his townslot once, I know this. Literally a shitposting middle schooler.

2.

Tora

: The reason I'm not shaking this read is the repeated townslips. I need you to get me evidence (ideally based on meta) that "townslips" are NAI and are faked by Tora. Also need evidence for open buddying of town. That part less so.

Do this and I'll strongly consider voting either sheep/Tora, or whomever you think is their partner (I would be more comfortable with this).

Get me the supposed townslips, and I'll start delving into Tora's meta. But as it is right now, I haven't seen any townslips (also, do note that I likely won't believe any of them are truly townslips. Neither town, nor scumslips happen and are caught. The only ones I personally know about are slips that happen and just skirt by because nobody thinks about them. Blatant ones seemingly never happen.

I do have a null!town on Lalendra. Cy hasn't done anything noteworthy.

Also how the fuck are you nulltowning Lalendra?

I asked her for a Last Will set of reads and she completely ignored it. Wtf in her ISO indicates town?

Talk to me as if you believe I'm town. I'm obviously unwilling to listen to "she pushed against the scum in you/sheep/Tora".

It's a gut read, kiddo. Just like I've got you in a gut-town read, despite everything, she's in the same boat right here.

(Also, what was that second part? I don't quite understand it)

[Mathdino]

Almost your entire ISO consists of voting obvtown for "rolefishing" and trying to cast doubt on the one town PR (when the mod already said there would be just one PR, and otherwise it's 2v7).

Edit: I'm just gonna start linking 625 as much as possible. Read it. (If that's not the right link it's still on the same page)

I'm saying that I offered Lalendra a deal: If she flips town, I can trust that she won't arbitrarily scumread town on purpose. So I'd be tentatively willing to just lynch who she wanted me to tomorrow. Being Nightless there's no danger in full reads listing. She wasn't exactly forthcoming. Giving up reads scum.

[Mathdino]

smh i meant 623

[Sky_Paladin]

I am here and going through my response for Dino. Before I start I am just going to berate my partner a little bit.

I do have a null!town on Lalendra. Cy hasn't done anything noteworthy

Lalendra also hasn't done anything noteworthy but Cy posted a garbage post that was a copy/paste wall and voted us for the most trivial of reasons. Lalendra looks like they are sitting on the sidelines and waiting to see which way the wind is blowing before voting.
I kind of feel that warrants a bit more than 'null!town' tbh.

In other news, Sky, stop fucking wagon hopping. It's hard enough for me to deal with this wagon without you floundering here and there.

There is no Dino wagon, nor a Cytheflyguy wagon

. We've spent nearly 30 pages trying to make some heat on Sheep/Dino appear and there doesn't really appear to have worked. I think face it, nobody cares what we're doing, so we have to care about what they're doing if we still want to impact the game. I'm fine with a Sheep lynch but is it realistic at this point? Without Dino/Blade stepping away from this position, I don't think so.

@Dino

now responding to your 665.

[Sky_Paladin]

Never mind, my wife has asked me to call it a night. I'll try very hard to get a proper response in tomorrow midday (around 12 hours from this post).

[Sky_Paladin]

In the mean time, if Naga/Sheep could be so kind as to provide me with samples of some of their scum/town games I would appreciate it. I see Sheep has 57 threads active but many of them are games they replaced into recently or are not actually games at all.

Also if you (Dino) know of any alts that sheep plays under to help me look for some common scum/town tells I would appreciate it. If you've dived my meta as you claimed you have then you will know what I'm going to do, but it does take a significant amount of time.