Open 705: Polygamist - Game Over

[sheepsaysmeep]

like i wouldnt be able to come up with good reasons to argue against it

pagetop

[Mathdino]

STOP SPAMPOSTING

and i'm ignoring punctuation, but don't even respond to this post honestly

Edit:

@Mod, request action spamposts e.g. "pagetop".

[sheepsaysmeep]

it just happened to be a pagetop so i wrote "pagetop"
i didnt post that solely for getting the pagetop :/

[Mathdino]

2. So you, as scum, would let me roll the dice knowing it would give you a maybe 30-40% winrate? What?

arguing against it would be a scumclaim for me
i cant come up with good reasons

So you're saying that, as potential scum, you thought the town would coalesce against my random lynch idea (due to force of personality I guess) and would go along with it so you wouldn't end up getting lynched for not agreeing to it?

Would you continue agreeing to it if it became clear that the town didn't like it?

Keep in mind I'm only asking what scum-you would do in this situation.

Edit: ok fair

[Toranaga]

Welp, if I die here, I'm gonna assume it's auto-lose for town. I've seen nothing to the contrary to suggest that the town isn't going to let scum lead them straight off a cliff.

wait lol this is scum
town would be more interested in last words and directing tomorrow's lynch
but anyway

@Tora:

1. So you only semi-agreed to it ("random lynch GOAT") as a reaction test? Did you intend to lynch cytheflyguy when you sheeped sheep? Also did you even believe I believed it

well random lynching is a >rand town win so I didn't mind us doing. I think by the time I voted cy I already had some sort of POE in my head and I was letting that lynch go through. I thought you believed it sure.

2. I don't know what not giving a fuck as scum entails. Like not caring if we random lynch?

yeah look, I joined this to play with amrochora. if she was playing and I was scum, I'd absolutely play it out with effort to win. otherwise I think...
yeah I'd probably just agree with random lynching and then say i'm townreading whoever scum is so we could lynch somewhere else. but I wouldn't put any effort to it, I'm barely making anything as town already and I love playing town.

3. I meant on the 2nd page, not the beginning, sorry. Did you, after I suggested the random lynch idea, think town might actually agree to it?

oh yeah it was really sound, I see no reason not to go through other than having a strong scumread or, ofc, being the one to get lynched. I wouldn't let myself get lynched over it that's for sure...

Lord do I agree this is an awful setup.

that's probably why amrochora bounced...

Edit: no sheep fuck you please answer in complete sentences or you're getting lynched one of these days

[sheepsaysmeep]

like i honestly dont know what i would have done as scum cause i havent thought about it
im psure i would start out agreeing with it and if town argued against it
a) if there was no way they would let the lynch end up being randomized i would just keep sheeping you i guess
b) if there was just barely majority, if you were lynching town i would sheep
if there was just barely majority and you were lynching scum for obvious reasons i would suddenly "reconsider"

[Toranaga]

STOP SPAMPOSTING

and i'm ignoring punctuation, but don't even respond to this post honestly

Edit:

@Mod, request action spamposts e.g. "pagetop".

MODKILL SHEEP

wait

[sheepsaysmeep]

my response doesnt look good for me lol

[Toranaga]

my response doesnt look good for me lol

just send him that hydra game so he can see how scummy your posting is as scum

[sheepsaysmeep]

lmao here you go

[Toranaga]

getting deathtunneled for days by jean was an experience.

[DiamondSentinel]

Welp, if I die here, I'm gonna assume it's auto-lose for town. I've seen nothing to the contrary to suggest that the town isn't going to let scum lead them straight off a cliff.

wait lol this is scum
town would be more interested in last words and directing tomorrow's lynch
but anyway

Read (as much as it pains me) The Mod is Mafia. That was my exact sentiment there, kiddo. Don't act like you can case me like you can everyone else on-site. I'm convinced that a town that would mislynch me is just laying down and letting the mafia walk all over them.

[sheepsaysmeep]

I'm convinced that a town that would mislynch me is just laying down and letting the mafia walk all over them.

e g o

[Sky_Paladin]

I'm convinced that a town that would mislynch me is just laying down and letting the mafia walk all over them.

I would like to unconvince you. There is some value in self voting and putting ourselves at L-1 in this setup and I have been considering it.

Seeing Dino put some pressure on Sheep/Tora has greatly improved my opinion of the slot (Math).

@Dino re meta - you made some comment earlier that you had been looking at my meta and said that I was not 'playing to my town meta' iirc. I agreed that was likely as my last completed town game (at that time) was over three years ago.

[Mathdino]

I see no value in self-voting as town tbh. Aren't you interested in who else is willing to vote you?

Also I made that comment to Tora, underneath a Tora quote. I at no point meta'd you. You seem like the type of player who's able to just do what you'd do as town anyway. Same with Diamond. I only meta players when looking for a specific behaviour that I suspect could be different.

Also lol at how this pair is completely falling apart. If they actually chose to be "partners" with each other as scum, bad decision xD

For the record, Diamond, I read everything you're doing much more as flailing than what Sky's doing . Sky's been nonstop townposting for a while now. Problem is I can't townread that shit because of course he's gonna do what's necessary to be townread when there's a lot of pressure (sorry Sky).

[Sky_Paladin]

We also need to consider that even if we are super right in all caps about Dino/Sheep from the beginning we have categorically failed to convince anybody of that. We need to avoid this tone of 'I am right and you are wrong' from influencing our posts, because when I go back and read yours I'm like "I would lynch that off the face of the planet" and judging by your comments, you're thinking the same of mine.

The thing is we don't know Math's alignment. Assuming we're lynched this phase (Dia) that means the only active players in LYLO are likely to be Sheep/Tora and Math/Math. If that is in fact the scum team then it is likely gg. Also if that is the case, then there is literally no point in arguing because none of the other players are active enough to read what we say and make an informed opinion, and Dino is never going to agree that Dino is scum/sheep is never going to agree that sheep is scum.

So we need to live in a world where at least one of those slots are town if we are to salvage this game because if both of them are not then it is probably game over already, and of those two slots, which one do you think is most likely going to be town? Judging by your vote on sheep I'd suggest Dino; but if you're going to townread any of those players at all then you have to actively engage with them and not treat them like idiots. Because players can absolutely disagree with us without being fools, bad, or wrong, and they can absolutely want to lynch slots (ours included) for reasons that we don't understand/agree with, and town can (and probably will) vote in LYLO completely differently from what is speculated in this day phase because once a flip has appeared, suddenly all those tools - vote count analysis, interactions, reads list etc etc - go from hypothetical to concrete. And that will be game changing.

[DiamondSentinel]

Whatever. I'm kinda done dealing with this. When/if you lynch me, I hope for your sake you're scum, or else you need to never play mafia again, considering you're making up reasons to lynch me, and are now going back and forth on your reads on me and your partner.

First it's Sky's wagon hopping. Now they're being super townie. And this is all in the span of under a day.

PEdit: Sky, it's useless. This town hasn't been willing to believe us/townread us since we both took offense at Math's rando-lynch strat. It's not a matter of "I'm right/you're wrong'. It's a matter of "Nobody even bothers trying to listen to what I have to say" at this point. Every god damned game a scum starts a wagon on me and the rest of the town is just like "omg yeah they don't fit current meta lynch with fire" and lo and behold, I flip town. Can't remember the last time I got lynched as scum. Probably SaGa Frontier, when I was unlynchable.
At this point it's just me pissed off, as I am every town game because nobody bothers to try and read me.

[Sky_Paladin]

I see no value in self-voting as town tbh. Aren't you interested in who else is willing to vote you?

Tora has already indicated intent to hammer and, Sheep temporarily getting off the wagon notwithstanding, my countervote on Cy has no real value to distinguish that we're not partnered together if there's no other votes there - something Blade has pointed out.

Late the-day-before when I was salty I was thinking about a tactical modkill to force LYLO this dayphase but I felt that was a bit dirty. But the thought of "Is there some way that I can show I am prepared to kill myself to save the game" stuck with me and then I considered, there is no reality where scum would deliberately put themselves at L-1 with some players willing to vote and at least one threatening to hammer.

Whether that is actually a real/good thing to do is something I'd have to put more thought into before ever committing to it because anybody can go 'Self vote is a scum vote' and hammer, and that would be non AI and therefore useless in LYLO.

[Sky_Paladin]

@Diamond

Then take a break. Go call your mom and tell her you love her or something. It's just a game of mafia and the results never really matter. If we die, we die. The world still turns.

[Mathdino]

Mathblade, I don't know about you but this is weirdly working on me. Diamond's self-meta is correct. I'm having trouble figuring out who Dia/Sky are scum with if not cy/Lalendra.

I honestly really want that to be the scumteam because "La/cy in the Sky with DiamondS" is fucking perfect.

VOTE: cytheflyguy

So yeah gimme thoughts. I also need thoughts on sheep/Tora's responses ASAP. And when you're on I wanna talk about the sheep/Tora/Red theory.

Sky, besides that team (for which I'm seeing both tells for and against), what team are you gunning for?

[sheepsaysmeep]

i respond.

[sheepsaysmeep]

k now i read like the last few pages

[Sky_Paladin]

I honestly really want that to be the scumteam because "La/cy in the Sky with DiamondS" is fucking perfect.

Holy shit

Sky, besides that team (for which I'm seeing both tells for and against), what team are you gunning for?

At the moment I am honestly not sure. Seeing you take shots at Sheep has dissolved a fair chunk of my concern for your slot and the marked change in our conversations since the day-before means I think I need to take a step back and re-evaluate the situation.

My main concerns right now are the super casual and super convenient votes on my wagon from RedFlavor and Cy. However those slots voted pretty much at the same time and I am struggling to see a world where scum would be so careless. Well I guess it could happen if I greatly overestimate the scum players abilities but what do.

I'm also raising eyebrows at Momo because just about every single post he has made this game has been from another planet. I'm not even sure if that is AI.

Well I have a lot of work to do including this deep dive on Sheep so I guess I'll get to it.

[sheepsaysmeep]

heep temporarily getting off the wagon

2 seconds yes

[Mathdino]

Lol I thought of the scumteam name from the moment I saw you guys were paired.

My main concerns right now are the super casual and super convenient votes on my wagon from RedFlavor and Cy. However those slots voted pretty much at the same time and I am struggling to see a world where scum would be so careless. Well I guess it could happen if I greatly overestimate the scum players abilities but what do.

I'm also raising eyebrows at Momo because just about every single post he has made this game has been from another planet. I'm not even sure if that is AI.

I also have thoughts on Red/cy/Lalendra that I can't get to quite yet.

momo is weird. I think we can assume that sheep/Tora/momo/Kop aren't the team because sheep was actively trying to strongarm people into that speedlynch. He had no reason to believe that wagon wouldn't take off.