Mini Normal 1984: Big Brother is watching.. [END GAME]

[Dunkerdoodles]

At this stage I'm happy to vote for Eth0s or Lallendra.

I don't know what Eth0s is aiming to achieve from his apparent homework over the entire sauce wagon. The only thing we have achieved with it, it's a bad wagon.

Eth0s if you believed it was a stupid lynch, why weren't you vocal about it at the time? I looked through your ISO and you only said that sauce isn't scum but if he is he is terrible at it. But then go on to say your glad he's getting lynched. If you genuinely believed it was a bad lynch, surely you would actually be actively trying to show it was a bad wagon, rather than doing it the next day in a scenario of I told you so, because your homework is going to do jackshit unless you can actually pin point who the possible scum were on the wagon. But we are still waiting a day later so I guess we'll have to wait a bit longer to actually see what this homework is going to do.

VOTE: Eht0s

hard agree and those are also my top 2 scumreads

[rb]

So I'm curious, now that you want to lynch Kop - is this a standalone scumread on Hyung/Kop, and if so or if not - how did the Sauce flip affect it?

The Sauce flip affected it in the way I already described, wherein I don't think both scum were needed to lynch Sauce.
Am I losing you on that description somehow?

Your Eth0s vote, now, by your own admission, is intrinsic upon a theory expection of an analysis he hasn't done yet. That's thin.
WHat's your take on Kop slot?

Huh, that's not what my vote is. Eth0s has been my top scumread most of the game and I've given numerous reasons. On the other hand, every reason for a townread on him is pithy.

[rb]

Iffy* not pithy

[rb]

Thor you're now playing mental gymnastics like Sauce was. Are you okay?

[acryon]

On the other hand, every reason for a townread on him is pithy.

I won't disagree with you on this. However, I don't have enough of a reason to think he is scum to overcome my very strong gut read on him.

[rb]

Gut read in what way though? Tone?

Which posts make your gut feel good? Because when I get gut reads there's still certain posts or interactions that I can't fully explain but I can reference for others to think about.

[acryon]

Gut read in what way though? Tone?

Which posts make your gut feel good? Because when I get gut reads there's still certain posts or interactions that I can't fully explain but I can reference for others to think about.

Yes, tone. Posts like 163 specifically felt town to me (I know there's no reason to think a post like that is AI at all). The general demeanor just feels unlikely to come from scum to me. He doesn't seem to care that much about certain things. That may be to the detriment of the town, but it just doesn't feel like scum to me.

[rb]

I think that's player specific. I appear to care less when I'm scum - what do you think about Dunkers saying eth0s is playing similar to a recent scum game?

If you think eth0s is town and we're getting this wrong, you need to mobilize sooner rather than later. Especially since Dunker is a top scumread of yours? You seem oddly infifferent to a lynch on someone you think is town, being pushed by someone you think is scum.

[acryon]

I think that's player specific. I appear to care less when I'm scum - what do you think about Dunkers saying eth0s is playing similar to a recent scum game?

If you think eth0s is town and we're getting this wrong, you need to mobilize sooner rather than later. Especially since Dunker is a top scumread of yours? You seem oddly infifferent to a lynch on someone you think is town, being pushed by someone you think is scum.

I generally give very little stock to meta reads. I know some disagree with that stance, but I think they can do more to tie people down to a specific read on a player than they can to actually help find scum.

One issue with dunker is that my other scumread is voting for him. The other issue is regarding meta (which aids me in my prior point). Dunker's lead reason to vote for eth0s is meta, which you can't really argue with. It's a slight step above a gutread to me.

[eth0s]

> dunker and lalendra are my top2 scumreads
*doesnt vote either of them*

dkskdkskkakdgjshhahwhdjkfkskzjflekddl

yeahhhhh

> dunker and lalendra are my top2 scumreads
*doesnt vote either of them*

dkskdkskkakdgjshhahwhdjkfkskzjflekddl

Let me phrase it like this. Dunker and Lalendra are my top 2 scumreads. Kop as a priority supersedes that because it's impossible to have a read one way or the other on him right now.

noooo.... we can get more info on kop as time goes by... you should definitely be voting your top scumreads here...

Well since neither are suspecting each other:

- eth0s how is Dunkers town this game, and why?
- Dunkers, same about eth0s

Dunker is playing the exact same he did last game. Average post is 5 words long and contributes basically nothing to the town.

Well since neither are suspecting each other:

- eth0s how is Dunkers town this game, and why?
- Dunkers, same about eth0s

eth0s is playing similar to a scumgame i just played with him
VOTE: eth0s

No, I'm not... Not even close.
VOTE: dunkerdoodles
FoS: acryon

I'm okay with lynching either of those today, or lalendra.

[eth0s]

@profii am I playing similarly to either of our last games (where I was scum)?

If not, what do you think about Dunkers saying I am?

[eth0s]

Me thinks There's 2 evil in dunker/lale/acyron

[acryon]

noooo.... we can get more info on kop as time goes by... you should definitely be voting your top scumreads here...

I'm not too proud to admit that I might be playing wrong. And Kop's entry hasn't pinged really.

VOTE: Dunker

[eth0s]

noooo.... we can get more info on kop as time goes by... you should definitely be voting your top scumreads here...

I'm not too proud to admit that I might be playing wrong. And Kop's entry hasn't pinged really.

VOTE: Dunker

wait wut. Just realized Kop just replaced in. This is setting off more red flags.
VOTE: acryon

[acryon]

noooo.... we can get more info on kop as time goes by... you should definitely be voting your top scumreads here...

I'm not too proud to admit that I might be playing wrong. And Kop's entry hasn't pinged really.

VOTE: Dunker

wait wut. Just realized Kop just replaced in. This is setting off more red flags.
VOTE: acryon

What does Kop replacing in have to do with anything?

[eth0s]

Also you guys are right about sauce. I can't really say anything to progress conversation about that at this point. I was just disappointed that we lynched the toxic guy on that basis.

[eth0s]

noooo.... we can get more info on kop as time goes by... you should definitely be voting your top scumreads here...

I'm not too proud to admit that I might be playing wrong. And Kop's entry hasn't pinged really.

VOTE: Dunker

wait wut. Just realized Kop just replaced in. This is setting off more red flags.
VOTE: acryon

What does Kop replacing in have to do with anything?

So you were voting the guy who just replaced in because you couldn't read him? right..

[profii]

Eth0s - I can see the short sentences for myself. I am more interested in the behind the scenes stuff that happened in the private thread, such as my theory that Dunkers said that he was weary of FL, then FL was NK’d - this could be a setup by someone else or a distancing tactic by Dunkers. Do you think he would attempt such a gambit?


Also, for you - I misread you every game so no idea. Will read your iso later

[acryon]

So you were voting the guy who just replaced in because you couldn't read him? right.

Yes? Up to that point, we hadn't gotten a real post from him and no real assurance that he would provide us any. Votes generally help bring out the lurkers. Seems like he's not going to lurk so the pressure vote isn't necessary now.

[Archwing]

Doublethink means the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them.

VOTECOUNT 2.02

Kop(1):

Thor665

acryon(2):

profii, eth0s

eth0s(3):

Kop, rb, Dunkerdoodles

Dunkerdoodles(2):

Lalendra, acryon

With 8 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

The deadline for Day 2 is in (expired on 2018-02-11 09:52:34)

Mod Notes: Have fun!

[Thor665]

@RB - you're saying a lot at me without saying much while accussing me of making the conversation hard, while I'm thinking it's you.
So let's reset;

1. Please in a short version, state why you scumread Eth0s

2. State your read on Kop.

Feel free to ask me anything you are being confused by.

[profii]

Acryon- i promised a re-read, there were some posts where you were quite involved in Sauce and called him weird or scummy without any reasons, but in your ISO there is plenty of reads so I'll retract.

I think Lalendra summed up my point more succinctly than i can in 253

UNVOTE: Acryon



I did give some thought to Thor's suggestion that the scum split their votes on and off the lynch and I'm not sure I'm on board. I think scum NKs fall in to 3 categories:
1. Vote conservatively where it makes it hard for town to associate the kill with any player - usually this is very town read players.
2. Vote to try and direct a mis lynch. So, someone mentioned Lalendra scum read FL - maybe the scum want us to go there given Lalendra is getting a lot of lynchbait reads anyway and we just lynched someone for being toxic.
3. Vote someone who is a threat to scum. High risk because the link might be there, but the player must have either read the scum correctly or given away a PR breadcrumb or something like that.



Now, considering the game has 10 people, we know we needed 6 to lynch. Discount the victim, we need 6 of 9 players to be in agreement. Discount both scum and that's 6/7 players to mislynch. This would be tough for scum, so for me 1 scum is likely on the lynch. Now, that puts the math at 5/7 townsfolk to mislynch... still a bit of an ask, but they were helped by Saucy's toxicity, saying that a few players were suggesting he wasn't scum despite this, so to drive that lynch through do I think it was possible that scum went all in on the scum lynch? I do, actually.

This means 4/7 mislynching towns folk, a much more palatable proposition for scum to accomplish imo.


Now, we look at the lynch, scum picked a player not on the lynch. I think this is the least risky thing for them to do because if someone looks at the maths as per above and comes to the conclusion that 2 scum on the 6, if they kill there, its 2 out of 5, if the person who comes up with the theory is on the lynch, it then becomes 2v4 - a 50-50 chance of hitting scum, that would be great.


So i can see why the kill was kept off the lynch.


This strongly incriminates thor for suggesting 1on 1off and rushing Kop. Also, he was heavily involved in Sauce lynching, but that can't be given huge amounts of weight due to sauces own play, but never the less, i think it's a contribution.


VOTE: Thor665

[rb]

@RB - you're saying a lot at me without saying much while accussing me of making the conversation hard, while I'm thinking it's you.
So let's reset;

1. Please in a short version, state why you scumread Eth0s

2. State your read on Kop.

Feel free to ask me anything you are being confused by.

1. Read my iso. I'm not in the habit of restating things for everyone who doesn't choose to read.
2. Townread, hyung seemed genuinely overwhelmed and Kop is playing town from my pov

Not confused by anything really, other than how you seem to not be following my thoughts on eth0s.

[rb]

Interesting profii. So do you think maybe Thor is acting a bit slow in this conversation and it might be similar to thor/sauce. I don't really see Thor as being all that scummy, despite disagreeing.

[profii]

Well I'd say your reasons for voting eth0s are clear. I will get round to his ISO at some point but I am yet to play a town game with him so I am going to have to concentrate to eliminate bias.

I think there are a number of posts particularly earlier on in the Thor ISO where he seems to be encouraging people to lynch when they didn't particularly want to. E.g. when I'm saying my dunk read isn't 10/10 lock town, it's just a point to highlight. I can get if people are just slightly leaning scum but not confident enough to follow it up with a vote - that seems natural to me, whereas, pushing everyone to vote at every turn just seems like encouraging wagons to see if something sticks and a mislynch suddenly happens.