Team Mafia 2018: Game 3 - Random GIFs Game Over

[Radja]

How about an icebreaker question.

How much are you going to let your teams reads influence you or do you plan on going more solo?

I have no or very little experience playing mafia with most people on this playerlist so I'm definitely going to listen to my teammates. Additionally they are all better at mafia than I am.

@mathdino: if it takes one day to sort UCV, wouldnt you know his alignment by the end of day 1? Why does he have to survive a nightphase ?

[Radja]

So what you were saying was UCV needs to be active for a day in order for you to be able to read him? That makes more sense. I was informed about him being lynchbait but I have no experience with him.

[Radja]

I think people would expect me to prefer town but I don't think that's very true.

Skirt skirt. Which game are you referring to?
Mathdino: what are you basing my preference on? We havent played together, have we?

[Radja]

I think people would expect me to prefer town but I don't think that's very true.

Skirt skirt. Which game are you referring to?
Mathdino: what are you basing my preference on? We havent played together, have we?

I don't want to say because it isn't on an alt I have released. Sorry. It was an open.

Is this your main or not?

[Radja]

I'm currently toying with the idea that going out of your way to tell people "My team got all 5 town PMs" without being prompted to answer this kind of question is a scumclaim.

Can you explain this to me? That makes no sense to me at all.

[Radja]

@Radja: Nah. Another day.

I also don't want to accidentally bait people tournament-wide into breaking the rules.

Radja if you're here give thoughts on skirt vs LLD.

Edit: lol I seriously doubt Transcend is reading too deeply but I appreciate it

I'm not feeling a skirt scumread right now. I don't really see it and the tone thing I'm not feeling. LLD's entrance felt a bit rehearsed to me, but obv she has to post something like that. I've only played Survivor with LLD, so I'm hoping my teammates can help me sort her, if she really is as good at playing scum as she says she is. I'm curious to know why you have her as town so early.

[Radja]

I would take scum if we rolled scum (lol we all rolled town I stg not that you know that) if we valued winning over everything because I have a significantly better scum wr than my team afaik, but I wouldn't if we were playing more socially and for fun.

I adamantly believe Keychain and Dunker are town off of this game, Radja I guess I agree. Bins from what I remember hates scum so yea that's fine too. Don't know CDB or T-Bone play-wise at all so no comment.

UCV... I guess. No clue for bulba. LLD, A50, Smoke, definitely realistic for scum. I haven't actually seen A50s scum game I don't think, but iirc Chara said A50 is their scummer?

There are others in the string of posts that are kind of in the same offensive vein, but this is the post that is most damning to me.

Can you walk me through what's wrong with this? I am seriously not feeling it(and I feel like it's keeping me from getting involved in the game)

[Radja]

Happy to reiterate.

As explained earlier, the difference that startled me between Mathdino and SkirtSkirt is CONVICTION. You can tell that whether Mathdino puts much stock in these early game meta reads or not, this is what he believes and he stands behind it. This is what I expect town to do in this position, in this game, with that post.

SkirtSkirt does NOT hold that same tonal conviction. He doesn't show that same kind of presentation of his reads, he won't live or die by them and that's reasonable given they're early meta reads but it strikes me that despite being "Reasonable" this is how I would expect scum to handle that particular position. They would play safer, and not get locked down in those meta reads. It gives them something to point back to, to say "I have a progression of reads, starting with some early suspicion here" but not actually commiting anything.

Whether anyone would actually call them out for commiting to something they felt was wrong is irrelevant here. It is whether scum would be concerned this would happen. Scum are far more paranoid than town with this kind of action, especially early.

That's the problem. That'[s why Math is town and Skirt isn't, in my mind.

Okay I found this post now so scratch that last question. Where do you see the difference in conviction here? Skirt skirt's "I adamantly believe Keychain and Dunker are town off of this game" seems pretty lock-town to me? I mean, he's going to have a tough time backtracking from reads like that? Or am I missing something here?

[Radja]

LLD, Bulbazak, Smoke, UCV, A50, skirt skirt are the most likely players to take scum in my mind.

Much less likely players are Keychain, T-Bone, CDB, Bins, Dunker, guessing Radja rn but I have to check who his teammates are.

Your turn in the game.

How about we stop this kind of assessment and try to develop reads from within this thread? I want a wagon to sheep that eventually leads to a lynch on Scum, me giving correct reads and getting shot on N1!

why would you make this comment about post 17 of this game, when there was hardly anything to read?

[Radja]

Radja, I have LLD as town right now because her posts seem town-motivated and she seems to think her reads are an objective thing that people will pick up on (they're not but whatever). We're probably gonna have to PR-clear her or paranoia-lynch her at some point, but it's a bad D1 lynch.

I agree about her being a bad D1 lynch, but I was wondering about your post 44:

Don't know if I'm mad sad or glad that LLD's town.

Did you get to this point just by her "town motivated posts" here? LLD had basically just posted her opening at this point, so I was wondering why you were so quick to put her in your townpool.

[Radja]

@MathDino why did you unvote A50?

[Radja]

@Radja: Strategic explanation checks out.

Like, scum in all-vanilla won't get checked, but this is a normal, and probably has some kind of investigative. A50 understands that the differential between him and his teammates is high, but it also seems like he knows that literally everyone else knows that too. Honestly just a bad D1 lynch.

Edit: honestly i have no reason to put any sort of faith in transcend's reads

Why do you think he went from this:

LLD, Bulbazak, Smoke, UCV, A50, skirt skirt are the most likely players to take scum in my mind.

Much less likely players are Keychain, T-Bone, CDB, Bins, Dunker, guessing Radja rn but I have to check who his teammates are.

Your turn in the game.

How about we stop this kind of assessment and try to develop reads from within this thread? I want a wagon to sheep that eventually leads to a lynch on Scum, me giving correct reads and getting shot on N1!

to explaining why he wouldn't pick a scum role?
He spent multiple posts complaining about setup spec and then joined in on it

[Radja]

because my scumread on him was literally entirely based around the idea that he'd pick a scum role

he's directly responding to my logic lol

don't play "gotcha" with me, hypocrisy isn't a scumtell

Fair enough. Just wanted to hear your thoughts on it because A50 is the only scumread I have right now and it seemed like a weird time to get off that wagon to me.

[Radja]

LLD, Bulbazak, Smoke, UCV, A50, skirt skirt are the most likely players to take scum in my mind.

Much less likely players are Keychain, T-Bone, CDB, Bins, Dunker, guessing Radja rn but I have to check who his teammates are.

Your turn in the game.

How about we stop this kind of assessment and try to develop reads from within this thread? I want a wagon to sheep that eventually leads to a lynch on Scum, me giving correct reads and getting shot on N1!

why would you make this comment about post 17 of this game, when there was hardly anything to read?

A50 can you get to this?

[Radja]

Radja, talk to me about why you’re not voting for A50 right now.

Cause I was waiting for a VC.

VOTE: Almost50

There you go

[Radja]

T-Bone silently wonders whether Mathdino actually cares about the answers to the questions he asks of everyone...because he doesn't appear to actually do...and in fact when T-Bone made sure to answer the very first question Mathdino asked in this game, Mathdino no sold him...leading T-Bone to conclude he is just asking questions to look busy.

I thought Shea told me the exact same thing about Dino, but I can't find it anywhere. If I could find it, that would make me feel pretty good about you.
Additionally, Shea thinks Dino is pushing UCV for reasons UCV usually gets mislynched for. Do you have any thoughts about that?

I was townreading Dino, but now I'm starting to doubt that read.

[Radja]

@Radja:

I ignored your question the first time I saw it bc I assumed you'd be reading the thread and will find the answer yourself.

But since you turned out to be no less a disappointment than most, here's the answer you missed:

Like, even if X does something that screams Scum, people are going to try and see it as a "bad Town" move because you already told them this player is likely to pick Town. When Y is trying to town-gambit it'd be seen as a scummy move regardless bc you convinced everybody they are likely to pick Scum 9or chosen by their team to play Scum). This not only affects dat Scum hunting but also PR targets at night. I'm starting to second guess my Town lean on you for continuing to press this subject over actually Scum hunting within the thread itself.

What I think is really weird is that you specifically made a post about it really late. But then you went out of your way to convince us why you wouldn't pick a scum role. If you didn't want that discussion to take place, why would you get into your own situation like that.

To me, it looks like you don't want people to assume you took a scum role and you also don't want people to assume others may have taken a town role.
I mean, that play only makes sense if you actually did take a scum role to me.

Feel free to tell me how I'm wrong though, because I am not seeing it.

[Radja]

The fuck? I'm trying to AVOID mislynching UCV. Shea doesn't understand exactly what I'm looking for right now. I expected a towntell from him and got a scumtell.

Tell the most site active during 2017 player on your team to take a look. My read has nothing to do with UCVs actions themselves (avoiding the thread which he gets lynched for).

what towntell are you looking for and what scumtell did you get?

[Radja]

VOTE: T-Bone

Sort sort.

There any reason for this?

[Radja]

Read between the lines, youre capable of seeing my trajectory on UCV's slot

I'm not seeing it. I've also never played with UCV so I'm not sure what I should be looking for.

[Radja]

@Radja:

I ignored your question the first time I saw it bc I assumed you'd be reading the thread and will find the answer yourself.

But since you turned out to be no less a disappointment than most, here's the answer you missed:

Like, even if X does something that screams Scum, people are going to try and see it as a "bad Town" move because you already told them this player is likely to pick Town. When Y is trying to town-gambit it'd be seen as a scummy move regardless bc you convinced everybody they are likely to pick Scum 9or chosen by their team to play Scum). This not only affects dat Scum hunting but also PR targets at night. I'm starting to second guess my Town lean on you for continuing to press this subject over actually Scum hunting within the thread itself.

What I think is really weird is that you specifically made a post about it really late. But then you went out of your way to convince us why you wouldn't pick a scum role. If you didn't want that discussion to take place, why would you get into your own situation like that.

To me, it looks like you don't want people to assume you took a scum role and you also don't want people to assume others may have taken a town role.
I mean, that play only makes sense if you actually did take a scum role to me.

Feel free to tell me how I'm wrong though, because I am not seeing it.

This followed by A50s terrible ATE is why he needs rope today. There is no way this is flipping town.

[Radja]

Also I will read up from there tomorrow but I need sleep now. There's just no way I can let this go.

[Radja]

I've got quite a lot on my plate today so not sure if I can get to this. Just letting you guys know.

[Radja]

Aaaaaaaand now I'm 20 pages behind. Whyyyyy

anyway, I'll do what I can to catch up today because I'll have no access tomorrow

V/LA until Saturday

[Radja]

Dino, can you give me the short version of what went down since A50 pulled the ATE card?

[Radja]

Radja is solidly town

Transcend, can you explain this read? I mean, I don't feel like I did that much to warrant such a huge townread.

[Radja]

Bud

Ur obvtown

Deal with it

That doesn't answer my question. Can you just tell me why so I don't have to be paranoid about you?

[Radja]

Muscle memory dude

I'm not home I've literally made every single post in this game on my phone

well my team(Shea in particular) has some issues with your reads list here. Your read on me in particular and also they feel like it might be a fabricated list because that's a LOT of reads to have so early.

Spoiler: reads list

Just to reiterate

Radja is solidly town
Keychain is very town
Math i lean as town but has pingy posts.
It is a gamble but i think a50 is town
Ucv is town

Still don't like channel at all. Tbone my team collectively srs. Bins i kinda sr. Elena i kinda sr

Lld nullish

Was leaning town on smoc but need more

Bulbashit prob town but my mates disagree.

Who else is in the game

The only reason I haven't moved skirt to my townpile is because multiple people (my teammates included) seemed to have problems with his gameplay. So anything you can give me would help me sort you. I don't really want to give up my read and then end up being wrong.

Also my catchup isn't going very well so I have literally only read your readslist.

[Radja]

Well that's how i play dude

I get reads fast, i don't go in depth

Don't worry about me I'm not a concern

Well not answering my question is not the way to convince me of that. But if that's the way you want it, that's fine...for now.

[Radja]

Serious question: why aren't we having an A50 wagon anymore? That seemed like a solid wagon to me.

[Radja]

I have a terrible hangover so I'm not sure I can process any of this today.

[Radja]

Yeah reading isn't really doing me any good. I will make time for this tomorrow. Promise.

[Radja]

okay, time to catch up. This is going to be a long ride.

[Radja]

Spoiler: catchup

In fact, this being an event that most players will follow I would love to set an example for all how NOT to play around me.

UNVOTE:

I will wait until I'm put to L-1. point out where I crumbed and instantly hammer myself. It should serve to teach many of you how A50 plays his game (and yet I WILL change my playstyle, so it will only be an end of an era).

Terrible posting. FYI I have played a game with you not too long ago where I thought you were obvtown and I never really thought you were scum for the entire game. In this game you've done nothing to make me think you are town, which is a huge concern to me. If you are in fact town your threat to selfhammer are pretty terrible. Especially in a team game like this.

Can I ask you (in good faith) why you feel it's problematic? This might be more for postgame but postgame is a long way away.

Basically, what you're doing (and what Skirt is doing on a 10x worse level) is creating interactions that are easily faked. I understand why you might do these as town, as you might legitimately grasp for these things...but...knowing this, you can easily fake this as scum. And I know meta-players like to use the 'but I wouldn't do this as scum defense'...and I'm not interested in would/wouldn't of someone's playstyle. You did initially sort me because I would probably take a town role, for example.

I haven't decided yet whether I feel his tone is hollow or not. I'm leaning towards genuine, because Skirt is trying to do a lot of the same things, and he is way more hollow in his convictions. So, I don't know if that is comparison bias or what.

But like, you're feeling off about Dino. Does it bother you that Skirt is mimicking his approach in a lot of ways? Let's back up...do you see that at all?

I wasn't bothered by Skirt at all until my teammates pointed out they were scumreading him. I have not read back on him, which is kinda useless right now too, because he got replaced. Just wanted to give you this answer anyway.

He doesn't have a reputation for being a quality player, and his playstyle is going to make people not want to listen to him initially. Of all the strong personalities in this game...

I was actually told that Skirt was a very good player. Don't want to debate this but wanted to point that out.

Radja

: I don't understand 190's

LLD's entrance felt a bit rehearsed to me, but obv she has to post something like that.

comment, like at all. Why does she have to?

What I meant is everyone expects LLD to take a scum PM, so she has to make a post about that immediately, regardless of whether she took it or not. I felt like it was rehearsed, but I guess it's probably not AI. Makes sense?

Also, you don't think I'd do this as Town, but you think I'd do it as Scum?? So it's more likely -from your point of view- that SCUM would "throw the game" in Day bloody one??

OMG YES OF COURSE. Scum uses ATE and threats to selfhammer all the time. Especially the way you did it: Put me at L-1 and I'll selfhammer. That's a threat to NOT put you at L-1.

we're not flipping anyone until bulbazak/mastina come back on monday

and until aero, CDB, and LLD catch up

Rude

i have no idea anymore

i've repeatedly asked for people to hit up their teammates and look through a few people in this game and give reasons

either no one has done this, or no one can read A50 out of all 70 people in this tournament

i'm waiting on a read from chara

We could just flip him, you know? His VT claim is going to keep PR's away from him probably, so why bother keeping him around right now?

Notes:

#393: no longer questioning townread on MathDino
Page 17: confirming townread on T-Bone
Page 19: Very confused as to why MathDino pulls out CDB as a lynch candidate.
page 19: I can buy UCV town from reading MathDino's point, for now at least.
page 22: surprised at the amount of T-Bone votes
page 23: WHY ARE WE NOT LYNCHING A50???
page 24: Bulba gets it.
page 25: A50 claims VT without being under pressure. Lynch with fire.
page 27: concerned about Transcend having me as his top TR.
page 30: Elena asking about T-Bone scumreading is what I just did to my team. I like that.

Okay I read until page 35 and taking a break.
Current reads:

town

: Doodles, Dino

lean town

: CDB, T-Bone, UCV, Bulba, Elena
null: LLD, Aero, Keychain, Bins, Smocaine

lean scum

: Transcend

scum

: A50

The plan is to be caught up today.

[Radja]

omg that took me 2 hours.

[Radja]

Serious question: why aren't we having an A50 wagon anymore? That seemed like a solid wagon to me.

okay guys. great news! i am in health and we have a sub. aka: i have a lot of time to do nothing but mafiascum in class!

now
radja, why does any other wagon die out in your opinion?

Because the teams are causing players to doubt their town/scumreads. This is my first time on Team Mafia so not sure that's an annual problem. I know it's affecting my reads, at least.
Additionally, we've been getting most activity from the same small amount of players who are having very different opinions so there's no unity in what's supposed to be 'the town'.

I really wanna go back to being V/LA and giving up.

I'd also like to have competent players in my game at all.

Oh, Reck might be able to read me? It's been a while, so maybe not but, hey, he's better than most of these fuckos.

I'll ask him but I think he's behind quite a lot right now.

I want to know why radja is town

I'm really happy someone questions this too.

Does anything think A50 could be scum or is he just a policy lynch (important)

I do!

MORE NOTES

Page 41: Not lynching LLD on day 1. I think LLD will get sorted by either PR results or POE later on. If LLD is actually town, she can definitely be an asset.
The only problem is I don't share any of her scumreads. So that's an issue we'll have to get through.
pages after that: wtf is going on.


Okay so the last 10 pages or so gave me pretty much nothing.
I'm all caught up and my reads list hasn't changed in comparison to the one I posted earlier.

[Radja]

I'm going to give Titus a chance to make some content, but consider my vote there for now, since I'm the only one voting A50 right now.

[Radja]

Hey man, I already embarrassed myself by asking Reck for his LLD read. Don't rub it in

[Radja]

Actually, THANK YOU KMD! Now that you reminded me, EVERY SINGLE PERSON who calls for my lynch "based on self-voting" I'm going to accuse them of being Scum, and I do have reason to .. precisely from that game, where NO TOWNIE voted Joda "because she self-voted", while 75% of the total Scum count in that game did. THANK YOU AGAIN.

you're not serious are you?

[Radja]

Does someone want to try to earn a locktown read by posting a summary of the game which I will compare to my read and if you're on the money you get the prize

I caught up from page 15 not too long ago, feel free to compare

[Radja]

@Radja: Check that game for yourself

I don't need to. I hope you do realize the people who call for your lynch aren't basing it on JUST your self-voting right?

[Radja]

you're missing the point. Do you think people want you dead just because you self-voted?
Do you think every situation where a person self-votes is the same, for that matter?

The fact that you're trying to use this to make yourself look good its pretty terrible tbh.
Thank you for confirming you're scum.

[Radja]

you're missing the point. Do you think people want you dead just because you self-voted?
Do you think every situation where a person self-votes is the same, for that matter?

The fact that you're trying to use this to make yourself look good its pretty terrible tbh.
Thank you for confirming you're scum.

what the fuck even is this post

calling bins/LLD/radja tbh

maybe bins/elena/radja

disclaimer: i am saying this not to base reads around it but rather to be incredibly baller if i'm right

most of you are not voting scummy people and it's annoying me
VOTE: Elena
VOTE: fitz
VOTE: Bins

Wtf dude. That's a pretty weird read progression coming from the who laughed at me when I said I would definitely consider taking a scum pm

[Radja]

The fact that you're trying to use this to make yourself look good its pretty terrible tbh.
Thank you for confirming you're scum.

it is possible i am overreacting to your overreaction

that said i'm not interested in lynching you probably until we have scumflips

can someone confirm that this is something radja usually says because this A50 argument is ridiculous and reads predatory

Can you not do that? I can't read your intentions on an internet forum...

I don't see how I'm overreacting. A50 has been my biggest scumread all game. You're making zero sense to me right now.

Are you seriously considering I'm scum right now?

[Radja]

Currently talking to my team about the game. I'll make a post about it later

[Radja]

@Dino: people have been scumreading A50 since the beginning of the game. How the hell can you say that read is opportunistic and bad?

Your attack on me makes no sense. Your callout of my A50 read makes no sense. Your scumteam with me in it makes no sense. And you havent given any reasoning.

I need an explanation on all of that with solid reasoning. I'm not going to take this shit from you.

[Radja]

@chesskid: Reck wants to punch you somewhere unpleasant for handwaiving MathDino. He wants you to take a good hard look at his iso

[Radja]

My team disagrees on A50. Crumbing that you're town doesn't actually means you're town man. I mean wtf. You should know better than that. Try again.

So you have no explanation for why nyou're linking me to Bins/LLD/Elena? Noted.

Also no real explanation to scumread me either? Okay..

P-edit.

Was going to vote you but I'll read your new stuff first

[Radja]

@Dino you can disagree with my reads bit calling them dumb is uncalled for and just a way to handwaive my arguments. Looks bad.

Also did you just call yourself town because of effort????

And again you handwaive my scumread on Transcend for no reason.

Wtf dude...

@A50 I don't think anyone is scumreading you because of your selfvote. Feel free to correct me.

P-edit

@Dino you cant just say "scumteam is 1-2-3" and don't expect those people to give you shit about it. That's not how this Works. And don't threaten me to pursue you because that doesn't work on me. Feel free to continue discrediting my ability to read. The more you do it, the more convinced I become that you're scum

[Radja]

If you're trying to piss me off, you're getting there dino. You don't get to handwaive everything I say without any reasoning and then tell me I'm too stupid too understand whats going on.

I need a break...

[Radja]

I wasnt talking about you. I'm already voting you. I was talking about Dino.

[Radja]

Okay since Reck is dead in his game, he's going to help me sort this game out. He hadn't been paying attention to this game much, so here are his thoughts. I figured this might help move this game forward even though I'm not really in the mood to read anything yet. So just posting Recks thoughts, I'll add my own later(probably tomorrow). There's some stuff I already mentioned but these are just Reck's thoughts.

Here goes:

Recks reads:

Town

:
- A50 (Reck thinks A50 is frustrated by me scumreading him and he's seen some signs that A50 is actively trying to sort that out
- LLD-slot: her reaching out to Reck seemed town as heck
- Titus(Skirt/Transcend): Skirt/Transcend were townreads for Reck and Titus hasn't really done anything
- UCV: gut town from early in the game when he got pushed by certain people

Null:(could be scum if they don't make content any time soon)
- CDB: post more!
- T-Bone: Reck thinks it's fishy you tried to stall votes 2 days ago to wait for something "really important"
- Aeronaut: post more!
- chesskid3: Smocaine wasn't really doing anything and chesskid hasn't contributed much yet

Scum

:
- Mathdino: kmd thoughts seem fake, empty questioning, terrible posting and reacting to Bins/LLD/Radja/Elena scumteam,
- Keychain: prodding and questioning seems pretty fake, posts like 692 are just pointless noisemaking that look inquisitive but aren't, interactions feel generally disingenuous

Reck hasn't read up on Dunker, Bulba, Elena and UCV and will reread them when he finds more time.

Here's some specific stuff on Mathdino:

1. You think there's a potential LLD/me scum connection. Do you seriously think that, as scum, LLD would reach out to me to ask Reck for a read on her? That doesn't seem like scumbuddies interacting, or do you think differently?
2. the kmd thoughts don't feel like kmd thoughts. Phrasing seems off as kmd tends to be more reserved about saying things as strongly as Dino is presenting them. He also has a hard time believing you were talking to kmd in real time on discord because of kmd's work schedule. Feels like you faked some of those team reads.
3. The attack on UCV is exactly what UCV gets mislynched for as town frequently.
4. The flip on my alignment looks incredibly opportunistic. Reck also thinks A50 is town turned into mislynch fodder and Dino's white knighting him to appear town by defending what he considers to be an inevitable mislynch.
5. The flip on my alignment is also a complete 180 from early Dino declaring there's no way I would have taken a scum pm because of the composition of my team(Reck/Shea/hiplop/Cheet)

[Radja]

VOTE: Mathdino

You're right, I did go 180 on you, I had you as solid town until you started doing weird shit, like adding me to your scumteam for no reason and my teammates also had me reconsider my read on you. You went 180 on me too though, so the fact that you're scumreading me for that makes absolutely zero sense. As a reminder, here's your reaction to me posting that I would consider taking scum.

@Radja: On a team with shea, Reck, hiplop, and Cheet, while you self-proclaim as one of the weakest mafia players? Hell yes I think you chose town, lol.

[Radja]

VOTE: Mathdino

You're right, I did go 180 on you, I had you as solid town until you started doing weird shit, like adding me to your scumteam for no reason and my teammates also had me reconsider my read on you. You went 180 on me too though, so the fact that you're scumreading me for that makes absolutely zero sense. As a reminder, here's your reaction to me posting that I would consider taking scum.

@Radja: On a team with shea, Reck, hiplop, and Cheet, while you self-proclaim as one of the weakest mafia players? Hell yes I think you chose town, lol.

I just addressed this.

You have GOT to be kidding me.

You seriously expect me to stay 100% true to my page fucking 1 reads after you went AWOL all game and caught up in a way I consider scummy?

This is a political scumread if I've ever seen one. If I kept you as a townread, this entire situation wouldn't have happened and you know it.

What is my motivation for 180ing you as scum?

So you can go 180 on me, but I can't go 180 on you? Good talk.

[Radja]

tbh reck's townread on LLD makes me doubt this lynch on fitz even more

Tbh Reck saying that Mathdino/Keychain are scum and then getting at least 4 things wrong about my ISO makes me doubt Reck is reading this game very closely at all.

That in itself doesn't mean Radja is scum. But it loses a shitton of credibility if he wants me to answer questions that I've answered 3 times already. Each.

Edit: Radja, I've explained my reasons for questioning my townread on you. I've also explained how your flip-flop has clear scum motivation.

You haven't explained scum motivation for MY reads changing.

you pegged me as a scumteam with other people for no fucking reason. I've told you this a million times.

[Radja]

I was scumreading those other 2 people, and started lowkey scumreading you at the time. Your interaction around LLD was consistent with scumbuddies.

That's not what I asked though.

I asked you what my scum motivation is for changing my read on you.

are you serious about this? What is the scum motivation to start scumreading someone you had as solid town before?

1. add me to your lynchpool
2. throw shade at a town slot, there was not a single person scumreading me as far as I know.
3. get towncredit for defending A50 when he gets lynched


@Bins: Reck says he's unable to read you so he's going to look at people who have more experience with you and are more comfortable reading you. His gut says town because he has too many other people he's worried about but Shea has a meta scumread on you. FYI

[Radja]

1. You're not in my lynchpool, I said that multiple times.

2. You weren't even around. Of course no one was scumreading you.

3. A50 isn't getting lynched while I'm alive so it doesn't matter anyway.

This is the most basic of OMGUSes.

You asked for the reasons scum you would have to go 180 on me, I gave them.

1. so I'm scum, but you're not going to lynch me? Okay...

2. That doesn't change the fact that you threw shade at a town slot, whether I was around or not. Plenty of people were townreading me for my early game.

3. You're not alone in this game and you alone cannot stop a lynch from happening. This is exactly what point 3 is about.

[Radja]

Shea has meta on me? hMMMM
OK I don't read this as fake tho

He metadove(is that a word?) you pretty extensively because of fortnight.

[Radja]

Shea has meta on me? hMMMM
OK I don't read this as fake tho

He metadove(is that a word?) you pretty extensively because of fortnight.

He was even so kind as to link you to the post: Fortnight

[Radja]

Bonus points from singer: also has townpings from Dino, also picked up on some Keychain stuff that seems like low-effort scumposting, call me back when you’re ready to take her seriously as a lynch target y’all!

Reck is telling me to take you up on this offer. He's more confident in Keychain-scum than Mathdino-scum

[Radja]

Fell asleep before I could find the motivation to read up. Oops
Will do so today

[Radja]

My team has some things to point out which I will get to when I'm actually awake and stuff. I was going to post this last night but then the falling asleep happened...

[Radja]

Shea/Keely/Reck aren't using the full tournament yet, they should be

Can you explain this? Reck is up to date and so is Shea. Shea in particular thinks the posts you and A50 made about positioning reads based on it being a team competition is nonsense.
Scum teams are generated independantly of one another so suggesting a player is town/scum based on team flips is gamblers fallacy. momos partners have the same probability of being scum regardless of momo taking scum.

This was a comment from Shea from last thursday, but he asked me earlier today to make sure I posted that. My timezone makes it harder for me to talk to my team live.

[Radja]

More thoughts from Shea regarding MathDino's attempt to solve the tournament holistically:

There's two ways of doing it:
- honestly: by accurately including his own team in tournament solving. This pretty much screws his own team in a situation where his team did not draw all town roles. Because of that, it's borderline against the rules to do this. If you're doing it honestly and you have scum on your team, you're going to be forced to conclude they're scum, or it won't work.
- dishonestly: if you're accurately analyzing all teams except for your own(because there's scum on your team), then whatever you're doing is wifom and doesn't lead anywhere good.


From my point of view, the whole discussion about who would take scum and who wouldn't, is really distracting and hurts the game a lot.


@MathDino: Reck asks for your read on fitz, not based on your LLD read.
Reck is flip-flopping on his early townread on LLD because he hates fitz's ISO.
Reck thinks Dino is town for what doing the "solve the entire thing, not just one game"

[Radja]

ftr, I haven't caught up entirely, but I've been skimming a bit from my phone but not posting since phone posting on a dutch autocorrecting phone is painful.

[Radja]

Radja is no longer hard town but null/scum read. No strong SRs but TBone is pretty scummy.

Titus, can you explain your read on me? Transcend said I was town as fuck for no reason and there was no way he was going to let me get lynched ever.
I'm assuming he talked to his team about this? What changed??

[Radja]

#yolo

vote havingfitz

[Radja]

morning y'all. This kill is... very weird.

[Radja]

really? You'd kill a claimed VT on night 1? Especially someone who got wagoned a LOT during day 1?

[Radja]

wtf is going on. Dino, find your brain and make sense please.

[Radja]

as far as I know the only claim out there was A50's VT claim.

[Radja]

I'm alive because I hardcrumbed that I would 1v1 Bins today. See my end of day. This gambit was planned from the moment I decided to try to dodge the NK by reverse pocketing Bins.

A50 was likely killed because
1. He was my hardest defender
2. Brings suspicion onto Bins (A50 being alive wouldn't actually successfully push Bins so)
3. I would never have let him get lynched

Other than that, I don't see any obvious NKA suspects.

I'm working with the assumption that there was a token busser and a token counterwagoner. I had a ton of sitechat with KMD about this but he's not online so I can't pull up his fkin chatlog -_-

Brb recreating that VCA

can you stop with #3 already, you're not the only one playing this game. And wtf does #1 even mean as a reason to kill A50?

[Radja]

as far as I know the only claim out there was A50's VT claim.

Ah, OK, cheers; the fast-paced nature of this daystart may have made me think I saw some prior context that apparently wasn't there.

well that and MathDino's claim at the start of this day obviously

[Radja]

you realize there's no way to prove that you're actually town right.

So your "you overestimate how easy i'll be to get me lynched" is a terrible way to softclaim fruit vendor.

Ahhhh why do you do this

[Radja]

I didn't crumb, because I'm self-confirming. If I were an investigative (or an actual Loyal Fruit Vendor) I would have.

In hindsight it was stupid of me to not realise that the nightkill would be for sure me or A50, but I couldn't think of anyone else that would've handled the gambit well.

I'll fruit vend someone who's obviously not getting NK'd tonight like UCV or Dunker to prove myself (if I don't get killed or jailkept).

I still have 0 meta for fakeclaiming (even though I have a large meta for gambits).

Edit: Dunker are you going to continually come up with new reasons that your gutreads are right no matter what?

I would never in a million years shoot you or A50 as scum. Why do you think that's so obvious?
also stop the selfmeta it is useless information.

[Radja]

If this is the truth, then slow your roll a bit, ya?

I don't know what you mean.

Edit: The people suspecting me AFTER I revealed the gambit who were townreading me beforehand are legit mindboggling to me.

That implies that me gambiting was enough to 180 a TR on me.

I'm assuming that's either out of annoyance or opportunism.

Edit2: It's absolutely useful. People like Mulch or Firebringer lose all credibility with the claims they make because they fakeclaim as town. I'm making it clear that that's not me.

it's not because you haven't fakeclaimed a role before that you're not going to start doing it at some point. It's useless information unless you're trying to use a trust tell in which case you'll get banned for it. So STOP it already.

[Radja]

tbh LLD also faked her reaching out to Reck through me, so I'm not sure what LLD isn't capable of as scum. I wouldn't rule anything out tbh

P-edit: yes that

[Radja]

I can't shake the thought that Titus is the only one who would shoot A50.

Then again LLD-Transcend both being scum? That seems weird.

[Radja]

Mathdino, I want to believe you're town but I think I just have issues with the way you play the game.

p-edit: well A50 flipped town and he was most likely to pick scum too.

[Radja]

The way I play this game got LLD lynched, wrecked the A50/Titus wagons, and called Boonscum and Katsukitown.

I welcome criticism on what I could be doing to win more games as town.

A50 was also so obvtown it hurt. Remember that I backed off A50 pretty quickly after he actually started getting involved.

The only thing that hurt was reading this game tbh.

[Radja]

I'm claiming a role that self-confirms. Supposing I were lying scum, why would I do this? Do you expect me to just say "WHELP I GUESS I WAS ROLEBLOCKED" every night until LyLo?

Nobody's doubting your role claim(I think?), but since there's no way you can confirm your alignment, your role doesn't matter at this point.

P-Edit: I said A50 was most likely to pick scum. This was discussed on day 1.

[Radja]

I didn't use it as an argument, I mentioned it a couple of posts ago as a reaction to your claim that people who were most likely to pick scum were all flipping scum.

link

[Radja]

Radja is no longer hard town but null/scum read. No strong SRs but TBone is pretty scummy.

Titus, can you explain your read on me? Transcend said I was town as fuck for no reason and there was no way he was going to let me get lynched ever.
I'm assuming he talked to his team about this? What changed??

Titus, I don't think you ever got to this. I still want an answer.

[Radja]

Just wanted to make it clear that I have no interest in voting T-Bone because he said what I was thinking a bunch of times and I heavily townread him for it.

I'm waiting for some Titus content. Other than that I don't really have much to add at this point.

[Radja]

Reck told me to. Then Cheet said I shouldn't. Then Kilby said I should.
So I did. We spent the next hours complaining about there being no flip after the thread got locked.

Reck didnt want to deal with a claim and as we were a day from deadline that made sense to me. I don't think I've ever lynched someone without a claim so it was definitely not a lolhammer. I was shitting myself thinking I would get under huge pressure if fitz flipped town. And I'm terrible at dealing with pressure in mafia.

[Radja]

If his thoughts are his own and not Creature's, and he makes it clear that both he and Creature know nothing about the gamestate, I'm treating that as a scumclaim.

I don't understand this.

[Radja]

I mean, I have no experience with UCV, but if you're wanting him to participate, shooting down his case before he even makes it is probably not the best way to approach this.

[Radja]

Please do not discuss other ongoing games and hypothesizing/pretending to hypothesize who is and is not scum in this game because of it.

Please do not discuss other ongoing games and hypothesizing/pretending to hypothesize who is and is not scum in other games because of it.

Please also do not discuss what moderator actions should or should not take place or comment on this post or similar posts.

Please treat this game as a self contained unit as much as possible.

Thank you.

Quoting this because people seem to have forgotten it one page later.

[Radja]

Not talking about you, Bins

[Radja]

If you keep breaking the rules and the spirit of team mafia, then fuck yes I'm going to mention it. Don't tell me what what I should and shouldn't do. I could also report every post that crosses the line, but getting a player modkilled isn't something I'd want to happen. Even if the player is a huge distraction from the actual game itself.

[Radja]

VOTE: Mathdino

I'll kill the distraction and work out the rest of the game without it. That seems to match with my win condition.

[Radja]

bro
you have a flip
you just choose to inexplicably ignore that flip and continue to go with "mathdino scum because fuck his play"

what happened to "mathdino was right about fitz and a50 and i'll follow him"
did everything change for you when i also nailed bins as town by loudly claiming fruit vendor xD

I didn't say you were scum. I said you were a distraction. But you're not anywhere near lock-town for me either.

On the other hand your gambit was terrible. You have in no way nailed Bins as town. You had pretty good reasons to shoot A50. You discredit people on a regular basis. You insist on breaking the rules. You're a pretty good vote right now. Regardless of your alignment, even.

[Radja]

Chesskid please explain Elena townread

idk how u ppl think that was a bus and identity faking episode

You know LLD flipped scum after faking her angry posting right? How is this different?

[Radja]

Titus, I still need answers

[Radja]

LLD is an angry person

So only angry people can fake rage?

[Radja]

I mean you clearly don't agree with me?

which is fine

but if there's anyone in that 4 you DO want to exterminate if we could focus that'd be good.

That list of 4 looks like you picked random names out of a hat. So not really no

[Radja]

Try and sell me either of them and I'll consider it.

[Radja]

Just give me one reason why each of those four are in your scumpool

[Radja]

Stfu with "I thought your whole team had me as obv town".

no, I won't. Transcend had me as locktown for no reason and that's what bothered me most about him. He said I was obvtown the whole time. After you replaced in, you went 180 on that read. So I'd like to know how Transcend got to that read. Did he not give you any information about that? He literally said he would never want me to get lynched.

Sorry busy weekend.

[Radja]

VOTE: Elena Fisher

[Radja]

I did read that yet. I've just had Bulbazak as solid town on day 1 and I tend to not reconsider my reads much unless I have a big reason to.

[Radja]

EBWOP
*did not

[Radja]

idk, I don't really see a lot of problems with Bulba's posts. I'd still lynch Elena over Bulba

[Radja]

VOTE: Elena Fisher

Another Sketchy vote on Elena.

As if we needed another reason never to vote there.

You've done nothing but avoid me for the entire time you've been in this thread so good luck with whatever you're trying to pull.

[Radja]

VOTE: Elena Fisher

Another Sketchy vote on Elena.

As if we needed another reason never to vote there.

... are you not also scumreading elena or did you forget

VOTE: Elena Fisher

Another Sketchy vote on Elena.

As if we needed another reason never to vote there.

You've done nothing but avoid me for the entire time you've been in this thread so good luck with whatever you're trying to pull.

I don't scumread Elena anymore with this wagon activity and her replies today.

Radja, I addressed my concerns in my wall before. My whole team does not care for you at all. You are a hollow grandstander, just like TBone.

And you continue to avoid talking about Skirt and Transcends reads.

[Radja]

VOTE: Titus

Might as well vote here

[Radja]

my lynchpool is Titus/Mathdino/Elena/chesskid. I'm assuming everyone else is town. Except for xyzzy maybe. No idea there. But not much to be gained by lynching them either.

[Radja]

your lynchpool is literally yesterday's lynchpool plus chesskid paranoia for being almost completely site inactive

there's a solid chance all of those 4 are town

you guys can't just gutread players who ALWAYS have townish tones

bulbazak, bins, CDB, t-bone, keychain, you're fooling yourself if you don't think they can, after years of playing mafia, replicate a town style of posting and get townread as scum. LLD was able to. we got her on motivation, not on scumfuck tone

now i'm not saying those 5 players are scummy or that scum is in that set (i'm townreading keychain and CDB), but i am saying that blanket inconsideration of them is a great way to lose by only lynching scummy people

UCV/creature, dunker, these are people incapable of replicating their town style as scum, and that's why they're locktown

tl;dr: your reads should not literally be the same as yesterday when WE HAVE A SCUMFLIP YO

fyi I had no interest in lynching chesskid or elena yesterday so my lynchpool is not exactly the same.
I can read people however I want. I couldn't care less how you feel about that tbh. You've already made my entire team not care about this game anymore so I'm going to play this game however I feel like playing it. I've announced my lynchpool and that's what I'm sticking to. I'm not going to bother trying to engage you again because I'm just going to get pissed off again.

[Radja]

Transcend wagon was retalitory for pushing Tbone. Scum stalled this game out since.

THIS IS FALSE

Why does town!Titus continue to say something that is easily provable to be false, so long as you take 30 seconds to read the game? (answer: town!Titus doesn't do that DUH)

I got more, but I think it is important for me to just plain point out the false things Titus says (yesterday notwithstanding).

You know full well that I don't read on replacing in and just use the vcs to do. Show me what the skirt skirt/transcend wagon was for rather than just saying I'm wrong. If it takes 30 seconds to do, then correcting my narrative shouldn't take that long.

It's almost like you don't have a team who could update you on the gamestate when you replaced in...

[Radja]

Dunker, just vote Titus and you're good. Thx

[Radja]

Dunker, just vote Titus and you're good. Thx

^^^ Scum. He's not interested in solving the game just silencing.

I already solved part of the game by locking you in as scum.
Cheet is going to read up on the game tonight. He's also convinced you're scum. I'll post his thoughts as soon as I can.

The fact that you have never given me an answer on any of my questions bit you're trying to make a point about me not being interested in solving the game is pretty hilarious btw.

[Radja]

vc soonish

Votecount 1.10

Titus (5)

Bulbazak , T-Bone , UC Voyager , Aeronaut , Almost50 ,

Titus (4)

T-Bone , UC Voyager , Aeronaut , Almost50 ,

havingfitz (3)

Keychain , ChannelDelibird , Mathdino ,

Mathdino (3)

havingfitz , Elena Fisher , Radja ,

Elena Fisher (1)

Bins ,

Almost50 (2)

Dunkerdoodles , Titus ,

Almost50 (3)

Bulbazak , Dunkerdoodles , Titus ,

Not Voting (1)

chesskid3 ,

Day one deadline is Sunday February 4, 9 PM PST. (expired on 2018-02-04 21:00:00)

With 15 alive it takes 8 to lynch!

[/size]

Radja ties Mathdino Fitz/LLD scum and me.

Radja trying to create Dino as a viable wagon. Sucking up to TBone bonus.

Lol

[Radja]

I don't town case. Tbh I don't case much at all tbh. I'll look for the questions I asked. I'll play along

[Radja]

Stfu with "I thought your whole team had me as obv town".

no, I won't. Transcend had me as locktown for no reason and that's what bothered me most about him. He said I was obvtown the whole time. After you replaced in, you went 180 on that read. So I'd like to know how Transcend got to that read. Did he not give you any information about that? He literally said he would never want me to get lynched.

Sorry busy weekend.

Titus, I still need answers

Just wanted to make it clear that I have no interest in voting T-Bone because he said what I was thinking a bunch of times and I heavily townread him for it.

I'm waiting for some Titus content. Other than that I don't really have much to add at this point.

Radja is no longer hard town but null/scum read. No strong SRs but TBone is pretty scummy.

Titus, can you explain your read on me? Transcend said I was town as fuck for no reason and there was no way he was going to let me get lynched ever.
I'm assuming he talked to his team about this? What changed??

Titus, I don't think you ever got to this. I still want an answer.

Radja is no longer hard town but null/scum read. No strong SRs but TBone is pretty scummy.

Titus, can you explain your read on me? Transcend said I was town as fuck for no reason and there was no way he was going to let me get lynched ever.
I'm assuming he talked to his team about this? What changed??

[Radja]

Which part of it aren't your thoughts?

[Radja]

Which part of it aren't your thoughts?

Please don't forget to point at where you explained Transcends read on me.

[Radja]

Which part of it aren't your thoughts?

I agree with everything said since the point I subbed in. Underlined are specifically my addons.

So those are Eddie's thoughts and your add-on?

Baffling how both you AND Eddie completely ignore my question about Transcends read. That's the biggest issue I've had with your slot since day 1. He said I was obvtown on day 1, refused to give an explanation and proceeded to say he was never going to allow me getting lynched.

You cant just keep pretending it didnt happen

[Radja]

Which part of it aren't your thoughts?

I agree with everything said since the point I subbed in. Underlined are specifically my addons.

ATTENTION FUCKOS.

IS ANYONE PRESENTLY TOWNREADING RADJA.

IF YES PLEASE SUBMIT YOUR 3 SENTENCE MAXIMUM TOWNCASE. THANK YOU.

RADJA HIMSELF MAY RESPOND BUT IT SHANT BE RESPONDED TO

Also wtf is this garbage. You've never once tried to engage with me and now this.

[Radja]

I mean you clearly don't agree with me?

which is fine

but if there's anyone in that 4 you DO want to exterminate if we could focus that'd be good.

That list of 4 looks like you picked random names out of a hat. So not really no

[Radja]

Aeronaut, From Relaxed Nature
ChannelDelibird, From God Save the Black Goo
Radja, From Dandy Irate Hoes
UC Voyager, From Spam Squad

Lynch these 4 in any order

game solved

for the benefit of the uninitiated

Reasons why these 4 specifically?
Reasons why everyone else is off the table?

[Radja]

Which part of it aren't your thoughts?

I agree with everything said since the point I subbed in. Underlined are specifically my addons.

So those are Eddie's thoughts and your add-on?

Baffling how both you AND Eddie completely ignore my question about Transcends read. That's the biggest issue I've had with your slot since day 1. He said I was obvtown on day 1, refused to give an explanation and proceeded to say he was never going to allow me getting lynched.

You cant just keep pretending it didnt happen

I'm voteparking on Titus until I get an explanation to this. Bye

[Radja]

You did not mention Transcend in any way. Try again.

[Radja]

Then explain to me your statement where you said that your (Eddie/Transcend) wagon was a retaliation to mine...

When yours happened first.

Explain to me your comment about how my vote on Transcend was an OMGUS....when I was scumreading your slot and voting your slot well before Eddie or Transcend did. Explain to me that with the votes.

Because that is where I am accusing you of re-writing history.

I already did. Repeatedly.

We stepped through skirt skirt and Transcend iso. Skirt got votes for LLD suspicion. Transcend appears and pushes you, more heat on him. I quoted mhsmith0 posts. I quoted the tied wagons.

At this point, you are not going to convince me your early game was anything other than proscum due to the wagon ties.

This is not an explanation.

How is my vote and scumread a retaliation on Eddie/Transcend when I HAD IT FIRST?

Titus' answer of "well yours was fake until we voted you" is

Titus re-writing history to push a narrative.

She also can't explain her comment of the Eddie/Transcend wagon being a retaliation to the wagon on me...because that also happened first.

Why is she doubling down on something that everyone knows isn't true?

Classic scum Titus.

[Radja]

Todays lynch should be me or Titus. The sooner the better.

[Radja]

Aeronaut, From Relaxed Nature
ChannelDelibird, From God Save the Black Goo
Radja, From Dandy Irate Hoes
UC Voyager, From Spam Squad

Lynch these 4 in any order

game solved

for the benefit of the uninitiated

Reasons why these 4 specifically?
Reasons why everyone else is off the table?

It's about time you commit to those reads. Enlighten us.

[Radja]

You did not mention Transcend in any way. Try again.

[Radja]

Todays lynch should be me or Titus. The sooner the better.

You can just have your lurker team cede the game. Even if you mislynch me, what happens is people take a long hard look at wagons.

Me v you, me v fitz. Fitz flippedscum. The wagon on me yesterday was shouted down because people knew I was town. I don't expect that to change.

You seem to forget who hammered fitz

[Radja]

Chesskid, why specifically am I scum?

[Radja]

Titus keeps avoiding my questions.
Chesskid keeps avoiding taking a stance

Game solved?

[Radja]

Todays lynch should be me or Titus. The sooner the better.

You can just have your lurker team cede the game. Even if you mislynch me, what happens is people take a long hard look at wagons.

Me v you, me v fitz. Fitz flippedscum. The wagon on me yesterday was shouted down because people knew I was town. I don't expect that to change.

You seem to forget who hammered fitz

Not early vote. Shut off communication. Lynch inevitable.

Lynch inevitable? He hadnt even claimed. Lol try again

[Radja]

You did not mention Transcend in any way. Try again.

[Radja]

Aeronaut, From Relaxed Nature
ChannelDelibird, From God Save the Black Goo
Radja, From Dandy Irate Hoes
UC Voyager, From Spam Squad

Lynch these 4 in any order

game solved

for the benefit of the uninitiated

Reasons why these 4 specifically?
Reasons why everyone else is off the table?

It's about time you commit to those reads. Enlighten us.

[Radja]

Then explain to me your statement where you said that your (Eddie/Transcend) wagon was a retaliation to mine...

When yours happened first.

Explain to me your comment about how my vote on Transcend was an OMGUS....when I was scumreading your slot and voting your slot well before Eddie or Transcend did. Explain to me that with the votes.

Because that is where I am accusing you of re-writing history.

I already did. Repeatedly.

We stepped through skirt skirt and Transcend iso. Skirt got votes for LLD suspicion. Transcend appears and pushes you, more heat on him. I quoted mhsmith0 posts. I quoted the tied wagons.

At this point, you are not going to convince me your early game was anything other than proscum due to the wagon ties.

This is not an explanation.

How is my vote and scumread a retaliation on Eddie/Transcend when I HAD IT FIRST?

Titus' answer of "well yours was fake until we voted you" is

Titus re-writing history to push a narrative.

She also can't explain her comment of the Eddie/Transcend wagon being a retaliation to the wagon on me...because that also happened first.

Why is she doubling down on something that everyone knows isn't true?

You aren't the one retaliating. You're valuable to the scumteam. Same with LLD. The shade to protect you and your noise.

Chesskid knows I am correct and you are wrong. That's why he is with me. He was voting LLD while you've engaged in ego battles with my slot and town. Appeal to masses is a logical fallacy.

he was voting LLD

no i wasnt lol

he was voting LLD

no i wasnt lol

You are Smociane.

Lol are you serious. Chesskid is with me because his predecessor smocaine voted with me.

If that makes sense then you'd agree with Transcend I'm obvtown

[Radja]

You did not mention Transcend in any way. Try again.

Eddie's the name of my team. Second, I don't have to mention him to include his thoughts.

Transcend agrees you are scum. He agrees with the reasoning. You're not claiming scum so your last argument is to move the gosl posts and claim unanswered.

Lol I'm not buying that 180 from Transcend. Nice try though.

All aboard the Titus train

[Radja]

Titus slot for me is hard cause it's like

Eddie was a hard tr for me
transcend comes in makes it worse
titus comes in not much better
so ehhhh

Let's get this out of vague territory. What were you expecting of me? Why is my posting "not much better"?

Your entrance hardcore pinged me for !scum titus waiting for more from you hug friend

My entrance of pissing people off pinged hard for wanting to hug people. Ok... Not much I can say to that, other than it's just completely divorced from what I'm doing. So *shrug* if you're villager.

What are your other reads?

I have fitz as lock scum wanna join me?

Fitz is LLD slot who I have zero interest in voting ATM.

Also stop acting like you pushed hard for the fitz lynch when you werent interested in it until the wagon gained traction(ty cheet)

[Radja]

VOTE: Titus

It's not a bad D1 lynch and I'm for it. I agree that I don't think town!Titus comes in here guns blazing at me with such conviction before reading the game.

Man, I told you this was Scum by play and not by any other convoluted process!

Either fitz is Scum and Bins is trying to save him, or Titus is and she's distancing by voting there when the wagon is cooling off, and I can't tell for sure but I'm now leaning the former.

I initiated the Fitz wagon initially and cooled off later.

Lol nope

[Radja]

Shea found that post for me. I'm stuck to my phone rn

[Radja]

Spoiler: Event History

[/quote]

Aeronaut, From Relaxed Nature
ChannelDelibird, From God Save the Black Goo
Radja, From Dandy Irate Hoes
UC Voyager, From Spam Squad

Lynch these 4 in any order

game solved

for the benefit of the uninitiated

Reasons why these 4 specifically?
Reasons why everyone else is off the table?

It's about time you commit to those reads. Enlighten us.

Chesskid, why specifically am I scum?

[Radja]

VOTE: Titus

It's not a bad D1 lynch and I'm for it. I agree that I don't think town!Titus comes in here guns blazing at me with such conviction before reading the game.

Man, I told you this was Scum by play and not by any other convoluted process!

Either fitz is Scum and Bins is trying to save him, or Titus is and she's distancing by voting there when the wagon is cooling off, and I can't tell for sure but I'm now leaning the former.

I initiated the Fitz wagon initially and cooled off later.

Lol nope

Oh wow did she seriously claim this?

I did vote Fitz first. An ISO shows that.

Quote it

[Radja]

I cant wait

[Radja]

I'm limiting my lynchpool to Titus and chesskid

[Radja]

omg no. Titus is scum people. Seriously can you not see that?

Mathdino, my quotewalling was proving the point that both chesskid and Titus were avoiding answering my questions.

Titus has since given a bullshit 180 read from Transcend and chesskid has still failed to give any reasoning.
I'm going to keep pushing this until I'm satisfied. Which reminds me.

@Titus: What reasons did Transcend originally have for his read on me? You still haven't gotten to this
@chesskid: Reasons please.

Feel free to policy lynch me for it. I'd rather see you policy lynch Titus if you can't see she's scum though. That would make my day

[Radja]

NEWSFLASH

chesskid avoids Titus yet again.

[Radja]

no I won't. Not until you tell me why I'm scum.

[Radja]

#caseonTitus #tryhardmode #poweredbyshea

I present you my(well, mostly shea's) case on why Titus is scum
Lets start looking at previous games.

As scum, Titus tends to reach out a lot, tries to be very friendly and has a history of buddying. Here are some examples from this game:

post 1716
post 1720
post 1791
post 1821
post 2200
post 2621
-> This last one is especially terrible because of her previous statement that mathdino's activity is NAI(link here. I can't think of any reasons why she would do this, other than she's straight up buddying. Therefore: Titus flipping scum means that dino is likely to be town.
Another very alarming attempt at buddying here: post 2655


Next up, her interaction with the fitz wagon. Not only was her interaction with the fitz wagon horrible as fuck, the worst part is she's now trying to claim credit for pushing the fitz wagon, going as far as to say that she was the driving force on the wagon and attempting to take town credit for starting it. T-Bone already pointed out that it's literally the OPPOSITE of what happened.

Titus acts like the wagon on fitz happened because of her somehow, suggesting that her being the counter wagon to scum makes her completely clear. That's BULLSHIT. Wagons on 2 scum at once happen regularly and Titus knows this. It's proven here:

That's a wagonomics question for sure. LLD wagon was specifically framed as an attempted alternative to Titus. A wagon Titus never actually joined, hilariously enough. Also fitz with fitz (heh) not joining the Titus question.

I defer to those with VCA master skills.

Tbh, shading me is something villas could do not knowing I was town. I didn't vote my counter which looks bad.

The post above proves to be an understatement, if we look at the Titus-fitz interactions.

Titus's first post about the fitz wagon:

Votecount 1.08

T-Bone (2)

Bins , Titus ,

Titus (3)

Bulbazak , T-Bone , UC Voyager ,

havingfitz (4)

Smocaine , Keychain , Elena Fisher , ChannelDelibird ,

Bins (1)

Almost50 ,

Mathdino (1)

Dunkerdoodles ,

Elena Fisher (1)

Mathdino ,

Almost50 (1)

Radja ,

Not Voting (2)

Aeronaut , havingfitz ,

Day one deadline is Sunday February 4, 9 PM PST. (expired on 2018-02-04 21:00:00)

With 15 alive it takes 8 to lynch!

[/size]

Zero desire to vote fitz with this low of a wagon participation rate. I wouldn't be surprised if most of the votes on us two were town pissed at the arguments.

Titus starts off stating she's not willing to vote for the scum wagon because ... "this low of a wagon participation rate??? What does that even mean? Is it the number of wagons? Is it about the people on the wagon? Who knows??? It feels like this needs more explanation, but none is given.

This is the second time Titus mentions fitz:

This is where I am at atm based on vc and reactions


Me

fitz bulba dunker
Elena
Mathdino (his wagon pure though so that is why he is lower), Aeronaut (fits forgetful villa profile) chesskid
Null Remainder
Keychain Bins CDB (Bins not lower do to Bulba) A50




TBone

Whoa...she suddenly completely flipped from "I don't want to vote this wagon for some ridiculous reason to fitz literally being her top town read. Surely there must be some explanation for this. Sadly, there isn't...

@Titus: Can you repost the list in a way that's easier for me to parse? I'm unsure about where the line of degrees are for some of your reads.

I will try.

Lock town: Me
Strong Town: Fitz Bulba Dunker
Weak Town: Elena
Gun to my head town: Mathdino Aeronaut Chesskid
Null: Leftovers
Weak scum: Keychain CDB Bins



Needs to die: TBone (Has extremely passive voting, reacted extremely negative to me trying to get Bins to assess his read, defensive snark (what I am calling it) when interacting with Transcend. Deflects all attempts to read him with omgus.

Just what are you agreeing with Bulba?

Here's the next post about fitz. He's still her strongest town read and yet again, there is no explanation given for this read at all.

Eddie Paraphrase

1) He confirms he is reading detailfully. Ask him stuff.
2) Bulba, A50, and Keychain are town to Eddie. Dunker read wavers due to meta but still hard town. Radja is no longer hard town but null/scum read. No strong SRs but TBone is pretty scummy.
3) He doesn't hate an A50 vote enough to yell it down (same place I am at tbh) and he understands I'm doing the best, but would prefer if we could vote elsewhere.

Titus adlib: Bulba this is for you...

4) Eddie and Giga both have no idea what you're geting at, but we think its town. lol
5) Actually, Eddie gets what you're getting at with UCV but he doesn't think you're necessarily right. Can be town lean for now but their content is reallllly bad.
6) Bins is scummy.
~snip~

Then when you look at this post, Titus mentions her team's reads. You'd expect her biggest townread to at least get a mention here, but literally nothing. So not only does Titus not give any reasons to townread fitz herself, not to mention having him as her BIGGEST TOWNREAD, her team also doesn't seem to have any opinions about him at all. You'd expect skirt skirt to have some opinions about LLD-fitz at least?? But nope, nothing!

Titus slot for me is hard cause it's like

Eddie was a hard tr for me
transcend comes in makes it worse
titus comes in not much better
so ehhhh

Let's get this out of vague territory. What were you expecting of me? Why is my posting "not much better"?

Your entrance hardcore pinged me for !scum titus waiting for more from you hug friend

My entrance of pissing people off pinged hard for wanting to hug people. Ok... Not much I can say to that, other than it's just completely divorced from what I'm doing. So *shrug* if you're villager.

What are your other reads?

I have fitz as lock scum wanna join me?

Fitz is LLD slot who I have zero interest in voting ATM.

-> above post is Titus attempting to take pressure off the fitz wagon, which is directly followed by this glorious post:

Shame

Do you have interest in voting any of my other scumreads/leans?

This post was already mentioned in th buddy section, but the fact that fitz has flipped scum, how it reads to me is "hey, let's start a counter wagon to my scum buddy. You decide who we go after!"

Now we're getting to the absolutely ridiculous part:

VOTE: Titus

It's not a bad D1 lynch and I'm for it. I agree that I don't think town!Titus comes in here guns blazing at me with such conviction before reading the game.

Man, I told you this was Scum by play and not by any other convoluted process!

Either fitz is Scum and Bins is trying to save him, or Titus is and she's distancing by voting there when the wagon is cooling off, and I can't tell for sure but I'm now leaning the former.

I initiated the Fitz wagon initially and cooled off later.

LOL WHAT!! This is just a big, fat lie. I went through EVERY post that mentioned fitz(see above) and there is literally NO INTENTION to ever join the fitz wagon EVER!! Titus didn't initiate the wagon, she didn't join the wagon, she had NO INTEREST IN JOINING THE WAGON AT ALL!!!! Reminder: this post by Titus was made BEFORE fitz flipped scum. So what happened here is she was trying to make herself look good in case fitz was actually getting lynched. Which is exactly what she's being trying to do the whole time! It's just complete bullshit. She listed fitz as her highest town read THE ENTIRE TIME! The only post that doesn't list fitz as a top town read before this one is where she discredited the already existing wagon on fitz for bullshit reasons.

Hello, bear with me while I pass on more messages from RC.

RayBells (should be cross-referencing games, I haven't seen him do that yet)

He doesn't know exactly what you mean here with cross-referencing and would like a clarification. He suggests

hiplop

give an opinion on RC's Bins read, and you can check with Bins and Titus on whether his claim to be able to read them accurately is correct.


For Titus:
I'm not a reaction test player, but he is. He wanted to put you under some pressure early on because he reads you best in that context and didn't want to screw it up like Masamune, and his read on you is now very probably town.

He also doesn't agree with the larger part of your reads and says you should help us with Fitz.

Explain the gamestate to me if Fitz scum please.

Post above is one of three posts where she links fitz and bins's alignments for reasons she never really gets into properly. However, Titus is arguing with Keychain here, who is attempting to get a lynch on scum fitz and tries to get Titus to join in on it. After this SHE STARTS SCUMREADING KEYCHAIN. Like wtf? This is completely going backwards. Titus claims keychain is vote shopping and not voting scum when keychain was literally trying to get her to vote scum! And what did Titus do? SHE TRIES TO FUCKING TALK HER OUT OF IT!

Heres some posts of her attacking keychain, who should be pretty well cleared by any reasonable vca.

im actually coming around to bins!scum

i know i townread her last readlist but

I have always felt Bins might be scum and ok voting her but lately I feel there are much better options in TBone Radja and Keychain.

Titus we seem to working at crosspurposes here, it's becoming a hassle.

@Keychain

Can you please have RC clarify why he thought TBone was town and why we shouldn't turbo lynch him for trying to shout my mislynch as he argued that he knew me the best?

I gave the reasons he provided for T-Bone.

You would not be turbo lynching him, you would be turbo lynching me. Consult with your team because uh yeah nah. This push on me is weak and suggests you haven't really read the game.


Welcome xyzzy!

You still are dodging. I am asking why we shouldn't lynch your slot for RC's falsehoods about me draped in meta that you relayed.

So we're not voting TBone or Radja or Keychain? They're basically lynch shopping and stalling the game out. The only other slot I'd consider today is xxyzy because recent sub not posting.

Oh and I'm not reading d1.

Transcend wagon was retalitory for pushing Tbone. Scum stalled this game out since.

Call me when you're done chasing your tails.

#crankyTitus

VOTE: Tbone

Let's do this.

NEW WAGON! No mention of fitz but a new attempt to get a wagon going on someone who isn't Titus or fitz.

RECAP:
Titus claims she started the fitz wagon. FUCK NO
Not only was Titus never on the wagon, she worked her fucking ass off to make sure the wagon didn't go through! Additionally she is now pretending scum cannot be wagoned at the same time, which is just the biggest bullshit I've ever heard.


Let's move on the her reasons to vote me!

I already mentioned why her repeated scumpool of keychain-T-bone-me is terrible because keychain pushed the fitz wagon hard and if Titus hadn't manipulated her VCA analysis, she would have come to that exact conclusion. But obviously she had to manipulate her analysis because it would look bad on her.

Titus then moved on to repeatedly attempt to get T-Bone lynched. When literally nobody was interested in voting T-Bone, she needed a new target and concluded T-bone was "just a townie playing badly". If you're going to argue that T-bone needs to get lynched because of VCA analysis(after all, that's all she claims to have done, even though she keeps referencing things she claims to have not read at all), how can you even reconsider something like that?? How does he move from scum to town without any extra reasoning? This progession on Titus's T-bone read doesn't make sense from a town doing VCA analysis POV(and neither does her read on keychain, for that matter), but it sure as hell makes sense as scum who is unable to find support for their mislynch target.

Then suddenly she drops a chesskid vote with no explanation, which she immediately drops once chesskid sheeps her. Buddying?

Radja, UC Voyager

Need to filter

Bins TBone Aeroslot

Everyone else should be town. Max 1 scum in my clears.

Hey, guess what, UCVoyager is suddenly a part of the lynchpool! Happens to also conveniently be the lurker who's getting replaced who Titus hadn't mentioned until someone else did. I thought she was doing VCA? If UCV was scum all this time, surely your VCA would have caught him earlier. Oh wait no, that's right, your VCA was shit anyway.

Now I'm suddenly in her scum pool for the amazing reason of "he's waggon shopping" even though I hammered scum earlier while Titus was spending her days doing everything in her power to stop that lynch from happening and is even trying to get credit for starting the wagon she never supported. LOL sure. I spend the rest of the game asking Titus for more reasons, I question her about her teammates reads ans she keeps ignoring me! Transcend in particular called me obvtown for no reason whatsoever and said he'd refuse to get me lynched ever. After asking Titus a MILLION times about this, the only thing she mentions is "Transcend agrees you're scum now". Like the guy went 180 on a slot he would never consider lynching for ??? reasons. Also Titus was unable to answer this question since DAY FUCKING ONE!

I ask her why transcend lock towned us. I asked if his read changed. And if it did, what the reasons were. Why she isn't mentioning his reads at all when he actually fucking played the game. All that happens when I ask these questions is Titus ignores it or handwaives it or attempts to talk about something else. WHY? Because it doesn't make sense.

Titus is scum. If you can't see it, fucking lynch me, cause I can't make it any clearer.

[Radja]

In the meantime, Titus has attempted to flip her words around. After realizing T-Bone isn't going to shut up about it, she now suddenly claims it was Mathdino she was claiming credit for.

I mean, really? That doesn't make sense at all because she was trying to get credit for the scum flip, and the fact that she's been interacting with mathdino for the entire day, must mean that she's fully aware that he's still alive? And didn't flip scum? Like, what she was attempting to take credit for? Looking more closely, her changed(!) claim about mathdino isn't accurate either if we look at her posts. While it is true that she voted for dino on day 1, the reason for that was OMGUS. She voted math because math cast a policy vote against her until she was caught up. She was never seriously scum reading math and never tried to get a dino wagon going! She doesn't mention any read on mathdino besides this post:

it's a policy vote/wagon
not an actual policy lynch

join it because we have nothing better to do while we wait for like 8 players to get into the game

VOTE: Mathdino

Why didn't you policy me until I caught up?

and this post:

VOTE: Bins

I feel like this now.

After this, the next time she mentions mathdino, he's in the town lean pile. Take a good luck where the null line is:

This is where I am at atm based on vc and reactions


Me

fitz bulba dunker
Elena
Mathdino (his wagon pure though so that is why he is lower), Aeronaut (fits forgetful villa profile) chesskid
Null Remainder
Keychain Bins CDB (Bins not lower do to Bulba) A50




TBone

She continues to ignore mathdino until her next reads list where she puts math as "gun to my head town" which is very far from what she's trying to say here.[/quote]

[Radja]

Shout out to my team for being awesome. Powered by MATI energy drinks.

p-edit. No we can't.

[Radja]

@Dino, please look at the Keychain part specifically.

[Radja]

fuck you dino I just wasted 2 hours of my life on that case. I'm not doing it again. You don't want to hear what Shea wants me to tell you, I swear.
If you can't filter out the stuff you don't care about then fuck off. I'm done with this.

[Radja]

radja i'm also waiting on a complete paraphrasal of the conversation leading up to and after the D1 hammer

so the current things on your plate are
1. paraphrasal (tbh if you do this tomorrow i'm just gonna assume reck/shea/keely wrote it for you)
2. re-case

FUUUUUUUUUUUUCK YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

BYE

[Radja]

are you fucking kidding me

[Radja]

I'm done with this game for today. Do whatever the hell you want. I don't care. Lynch Titus or lynch me. Nobody else is getting lynched. If you lynch me, lynch Titus tomorrow.

[Radja]

My team talked me into posting the hammer conversation. I'm out now.
Had to get mod confirmation if it was okay to paraphrase from the discord channel directly. Got clearance.



Radja - Titus put me as null/scum after transcend posted that obvtownread. WEIRD
Reck - you should hammer fitz if he gets to L-1
Radja - ok
Cheet - If I reread this game, I think Titus might be my strongest scumread
Radja - I wouldn't mind fitz or Titus dying rn
Radja - fitz is at L-1
Cheet - How long before deadline?
Reck - Really?
Radja - yeah, Bulba just voted him. 1 day 9 hours left
Reck - QUICK HAMMER
Cheet - ehm
Radja - Should I?
Reck - yes!
Cheet - why? did fitz claim?
Reck - He'll get town credit if fitz flips scum and maybe gets nightkilled. Or if fitz is town can probably pin 2 scum on that wagon. Don't wanna deal with claims
Radja - Cheet, do it?
Cheet - he could be confirmable? I wouldn't...but I'm not much of a risktaker...so...
Radja - me neither. more like not at all.
Reck - If I was in the game and this was the LLD slot, I wouldn't think twice
Cheet- Up to you Radja, It'll make you really lynchable.
Radja - very
Cheet - you'll feel the effects of it for the rest of the game if fitz flips town.
Reck - If you get hear for fitz town, I can read people easier. I think math is going to gun for Radja anyway, so whatever? I know I play differently than you guys.
Cheet- LLD and Transcend are probably not both scum?
Radja - I don't know what to do.
Cheet - Titus scum means fitz is probably town?
Radja - If I knew I could talk my way out of a mislynch, I wouldn't be hesitating.
Reck - Don't think Titus is scum. She's easy to lynch. That's why I like the counterwagon
Cheet - Trancend looked like scum
Reck - LLD posts were ATE, don't like her reach out to me.
Radja - I could use more risks in my gameplay
Reck - one day left, don't want a flashwagon
Radja - hiplop, your thoughts?
hiplop - I'm behind, I thought titus was scum earlier. fitz would be my other guess. LLD looked like scum to me
Radja - ok I'll do it. I might get vigged?
Radja - I did it
Reck - ooooh
Radja - post the flip!

[Radja]

We're currently reviewing the Titus slot yet again because we may have been wrong about her.
I'm going to back off of this slot for now.

This is going to look terrible but I'd rather get lynched stating the correct information instead of trying to survive giving out the wrong information.

Cheet asks Eddie to give a read on chesskid. TY.

UNVOTE:

This game...

[Radja]

VOTE: chesskid

[Radja]

Gj GuiltyLion I like you.

Now let's all vote chesskid

[Radja]

VOTE: Elena

Think this is a mislynch but I guess it's better than no lynch at all.

[Radja]

That was L-1 btw

[Radja]

VOTE: Elena

Think this is a mislynch but I guess it's better than no lynch at all.

I do agree that this post bugs me if Elena flips town.

Don't want my vote? fine.

VOTE: chesskid

[Radja]

@Titus don't put words in my mouth.
@Bins: if you believe Elena is flipping town, stop complaining about me compromising on that lynch and vote chesskid now.

[Radja]

then why throw shade at me for joining the wagon you're considering to be on scum?

[Radja]

how does me compromising on Elena look bad to you?

[Radja]

I'm allowed to comment on things too, like how I think it's weird for you to say that about a lynch you want to happen. If you were actually campaigning against this lynch, I'd understand it.

[Radja]

Nope. Still not too late for a flashwagon on chesskid

[Radja]

If lynching me today means lynching chesskid tomorrow I encourage everyone to join my wagon.

[Radja]

nope. Offer still stands.

I don't know why exactly T-Bone decided to vote for me, but unless Elena is scum, he should never get lynched. There's literally no scum reason for him to vote me unless he is trying to save Elena.

[Radja]

Well, a couple of things.

You make a massive post where you cite meta of Titus...and then proceed to completely contradict that meta in your argument.

I also didn't like the alleged conversation you produced between yourself, Reck, and Cheery in regards to your hammer. It looks incredibly fake...which is weird, because I thought your first explanation was good. Reads to me like you felt you had to add another layer for credibility.

And I think Elena is town.

I'm not sure about that meta argument. I don't have massive knowledge on Titus meta so I can't really tell you much about that.

I was forced to reproduce(paraphrase) the conversation that lead to the hammer by mathdino. I didn't want to post that in the first place. Pretty weird that's what you took from me posting that. Maybe you should reread the events that lead to me posting it, especially mathdino's posts.

Not too late to vote chesskid btw.

[Radja]

want with Reck because he was making good points as to why I should hammer. Kilby making it 2 vs 1 on hammering was what eventually made me do it.

I don't want to get into why our team decided you were most likely town after making that big case on you earlier. It's just the way things are.

[Radja]

@Titus: I'll tell you as much as I can: we changed our minds about you after posting the case because of reasons I can't talk about. I know you'll probably not be satisfied with that answer, but that's all I can say about it.

[Radja]

VOTE: chesskid

[Radja]

Here I was about to start thinking about the implications of me still being alive and what that means for Radja

and then there is #3214

my my

Sucks people didn't go for the 1vs1 I suggested yesterday. I'm still up for it today.
You didn't seriously expect to get killed, did you?

[Radja]

If Titus ends up being scum I'm going to be really surprised

[Radja]

Then why are you making zero effort to work with me and just randomly poking town?

Keychain is town. Chesskid is scum
Not interested in wagoning myself.
If you want to sell me on the other 2 I'm listening.

[Radja]

will post tonight.

[Radja]

me, personally, I'd like to start with this
VOTE: Radja
also radja, can you give me a tldr of why chess is scum? you pushed him pretty hard yesterday.

because he has not had a proper scumread until I started pushing him for it. All he had was a poe pool with random names in it who he failed to give a reason for as to why they were scum.
I was told by my teammates chesskid pressures his scumreads hard as town which is not something I've seen him do at all.
Also I'm pretty much townreading the rest of the playerlist.

Chesskid - Bins - xyzzy to win the game.

[Radja]

I mean I think it was pretty clear I was struggling early day 2 to get scumreads on people and the way I entered this game plus how day 1 ended was not conducive to that, which is what he's pushing me on.

But it started after I put him in a pool and pointed out his interaction w/ teammates has been shit sooooo

Please tell me where my interactions with LLD-fitz are shit. You didn't point that out at all(or I haven't read it)

It's just weird that you had literally no scumreads all game until I pushed you to take a stance. That's the only reason why you eventually declared a scumread on me. Still happy with this 1vs1 today.

[Radja]

teammates as in your teammates

Then I'd like you to explain how my teammates got you to scumread me.

[Radja]

See when I played with chess, he was super aggressive af and I don't get the same vibes here, but I also don't necessarily think we have scum!chess either.

Explain this please. What makes you think chesskid is town then?

[Radja]

That's what my teammates are hard scumreading him for.

I see you missed xyzzy in your list. Would he be in the lynchpool or not?

[Radja]

Why aren't you interested in sorting him? He's in your lynchpool.

[Radja]

He is in creatures lynch pool of 5.
Radja, if not chess, who would you wanna lynch today?

I literally posted a lynchpool of 3 people before you asked others to do this.

Xyzzy/Bins

[Radja]

teammates as in your teammates

Then I'd like you to explain how my teammates got you to scumread me.

that hammer convo plus your attitude about it and the fact you hammered in general is mostly what im referring to

Mathdino pretty much forced me to post that convo.
What does me hammering in general has to do with my teammates?

[Radja]

{Key / Dunker}
{CDB / Bulba}
{Archwing / CK / Radja}
{Bins / Xyzzy}

tbf I actually agree with this until it gets to the bottom.

p-edit --
Specifically, I don't like how Radja reacted to me and I don't like how he hammered and how he felt the need to explain it. The whole super defensive thing reminded me of my read on T-Bone (when T-Bone did the whole "I'm not getting defensive" thing).

But I'm also not sure that makes him scum.
Right? Idk.

for the last time, I did not feel the need to explain it. I was asked. MULTIPLE TIMES. then FORCED to post it.

[Radja]

Oh, another I-haven't-been reading question: has the number of scum in this game been confirmed anywhere? I see Transcend/Titus talking as though there are confirmed 3 scum out of 15 and Radja (iirc?) as though there are four. I would have thought 4/15 was standard, since it used to be three Mafia for 12-13.

*goes back to reading*

Hi Mina!

So nice to play mafia with you you hate it and I'm not enjoying it much either.
Anyway: I don't think I've suggested a 4-man team, tbh I've had my mind set on this being a three man team because of this being a normal game. idk. not really a regular mafia player either

[Radja]

Okay I read until page 35 and taking a break.
Current reads:

town

: Doodles, Dino

lean town

: CDB, T-Bone, UCV, Bulba, Elena
null: LLD, Aero, Keychain, Bins, Smocaine

lean scum

: Transcend

scum

: A50

The plan is to be caught up today.

My team disagrees on A50. Crumbing that you're town doesn't actually means you're town man. I mean wtf. You should know better than that. Try again.

So you have no explanation for why nyou're linking me to Bins/LLD/Elena? Noted.

Also no real explanation to scumread me either? Okay..

P-edit.

Was going to vote you but I'll read your new stuff first

The "you" in the second post is referring to Mathdino, right? What happened to change your mind from the first post?

Also, what are your teammates' thoughts right now?

Yes it is. Dino was doing some pretty weird stuff which made me really angry and then I started scumreading him for being antitown.
My teammates agree on chesskid being scum.

Cheet shares my lynchpool of xyzzy/Bins for the remaining scum. He has solid townreads on everyone else.
Shea has Titus town, chesskid scum. He thought Bins was town earlier but thinks she's leaning more towards her scum meta lately. Also doesn't like Bins waffling our slot vs chesskid slot. So he's put her at null with strong pulls in both directions. Not really a "no information" kinda null, if you know what I mean.
No real read on xyzzy. Dunker is strong town because of tone. Keychain is town because interactions with fitz. Didn't give any opinions on the rest(Archwing/your slot/not sure I missed anyone)
Reck/hiplop haven't really been reading I think.

Shea also says hi!

While I'm at it...

Hey man, I already embarrassed myself by asking Reck for his LLD read. Don't rub it in

Can you elaborate on this? I missed the post where you said what his read was

Lmk if I should stop spamming the thread. It's just easier for me to make points as I see them rather than one giant wall at the end.

Well he didn't give his read because LLD had been force replaced at the time when I asked him. That post is my reaction to Mathdino making fun of me still posting about LLD.

[Radja]

fuck you dino I just wasted 2 hours of my life on that case. I'm not doing it again. You don't want to hear what Shea wants me to tell you, I swear.
If you can't filter out the stuff you don't care about then fuck off. I'm done with this.

radja i'm also waiting on a complete paraphrasal of the conversation leading up to and after the D1 hammer

so the current things on your plate are
1. paraphrasal (tbh if you do this tomorrow i'm just gonna assume reck/shea/keely wrote it for you)
2. re-case

FUUUUUUUUUUUUCK YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

BYE

Sorry, but this interaction made me lol so hard.

I'm assuming this is where CDB's townread started? Radja, how easily do you get frustrated about the game? Would you say it happens regardless of your alignment?

Didn't have time for the game last night, but taking a quick peek now.
I don't tend to get frustrated by a game at all. I'd say this is the first time I've ever told someone to go fuck themselves online. I'm usually pretty laid back and I can take losing pretty well. The fact that mathdino just said "nope" to my case and asked me to redo it after both me and shea spent several hours on it made me explode.

Regarding Reck's read on LLD: Reck was townreading LLD early because she reached out to him through me. But eventually concluded later that she faked it and he shouldn't have townread her for it. That's how I remember it at least.

[Radja]

Seems like Radja answered pretty quickly, no? Or am I missing how aggressively people were clamouring for the paraphrase before Mathdino's post? Half an hour seems reasonable to write a paraphrase and confirm it with a mod. Writing fake logs would probably involve a lot of team discussion and "that's so out of character for me, because I would say this" feedback.

We were clamoring for several IRL days. Radja had it done after a few hours of actually agreeing to it. The reaction seemed more of "you pestered me enough where I have to" which itself is only a little anti-town. The complete disregard of his teammates pings more.

Don't make me angry again...

Dino requested it at 3.20pm on the 14th
I posted the case on you that I had been working on for hours.
Mathdino requested it again at 3.50pm.
I posted the paraphrased convo at 4.27pm

The only mention of the hammer convo before that is Mathdino saying on the Feb 11 that he could ask for the conversation, but he doesn't actually ask for it.

Literally nobody else mentioned the hammer conversation until Dino at 3.20 on the 14th.
So stop the bullshit about asking for the conversation for several days. Either you're blatantly lying or you're misremembering, but get your shit together on it.

[Radja]

We were clamoring for several IRL days.

also fuck you. You can't even tell me why you're scumreading me without mentioning the hammer conversation which you are also completely wrong about.

[Radja]

Still nowhere near finished reading, but quick points:

@Bins: I asked you about Smocaine being iffy because this seemed to be your final impression of him (although your ISO seems to be all over the place on that slot):

actually i think this is good because

smocaine was pretty town

so like just find scum and help sort this mess

What changed?

@Radja: people who hate Mafia represent! (This game has reminded me what I miss about Mafia is that I can be waaaaay more unfiltered here than in Survivor, though, because the game rewards rather than punishes you for it.) And do you know why Reck townread LLD? It felt like a bit of a weird read to me, because a while back, I'd checked in on this game out of curiosity after the force replacements and skimmed her meltdown posts, and even I was all, "I bet LLD is scum AtE-ing." (I definitely wasn't confident in it at all, but Reck seems like he'd know what she's capable of.)

Also, I apparently misread your posts mentioning your lynch pool, but did you not realize that the number of scum was confirmed to be three in each game until day three?

(Hi, Shea!)

There's something I need to confirm with a mod I'm actually allowed to talk about, also.

About Recks read(paraphrasing):

He says he didn't put much tought into it, he just felt like it(LLD reaching out) would be a hell of a reach for LLD to make up because there was no indication Reck was even reading the game. He also thought it made sense for LLD to reach out to him when looking at the Team Mafia playerlist.

Don't know if that makes sense to you, but that's what he said.

[Radja]

Radja and Dunkerdoodles meta links might be helpful--some people seem to be saying both are absolutely godawful as scum and thus are town here? But realistically, I won't actually get around to reading all of these!

Survivormeet is the only one I can remember by name. There may have been more recent ones but I don't remember them.
Haven't played in at least 6 months so.

[Radja]

At least we were right to go 180 on Titus.

This game though...

[Radja]

Keychain, could you please give a quick tl;dr of why you think xyzzy is scum? From a very quick glance at your ISO, I could not find anything obvious.

Radja, I think you're town but I've noticed you fairly strongly thought chesskid was scum, so we probably should talk! Also hi!

Bins! In my haphazard reading of select posts of the game I noticed somewhere that you might think Radja is scum. If so, what makes you think that?

omg yes! DV!!! I don't think we've ever played mafia together.

Anyway, your predecessor had a massive scumread on me. What makes you townread me? How much of this game have you read?

I do have a strong scumread on your slot, but I'm always available for a chat.

[Radja]

@DV Can you also tell me why chesskid said he scumread us for on discord? And why you disagree with that? And can you tell me if Katsuki has some kind of read on me?

[Radja]

hi DV please be town

catch up later


but i sort of dropped the Radja scumread

What did I do to make you drop it?

[Radja]

Keychain, could you please give a quick tl;dr of why you think xyzzy is scum? From a very quick glance at your ISO, I could not find anything obvious.

Radja, I think you're town but I've noticed you fairly strongly thought chesskid was scum, so we probably should talk! Also hi!

Bins! In my haphazard reading of select posts of the game I noticed somewhere that you might think Radja is scum. If so, what makes you think that?

omg yes! DV!!! I don't think we've ever played mafia together.

Anyway, your predecessor had a massive scumread on me. What makes you townread me? How much of this game have you read?

I do have a strong scumread on your slot, but I'm always available for a chat.

Hey! It's true that we haven't played actual mafia together (and honestly you and Mina being here was the main reason I replaced in but I love everyone else here too I promise), and I'm pretty damn excited because I didn't think I was going to get to play in team mafia this year and I think that you and Mina are both probably town here so I'm all set to whambam this game together (with the occasional amount of paranoia about your alignments blah blah which I'll probably ignore). I know that my alignment is probably the most in question here but I'll work on it!

As for my townread on you, you were someone I actually skimmed through before I'd even officially joined the game, but I thought there were many moments throughout the game where your frustration felt super genuine and very unlikely to be faked. 2792 is a very good example of this in my opinion. There you seem seriously bummed that you've put work into something that is just getting ignored, while I feel scum would feel fine as long as they weren't being suspected for it.

All the fuck you stuff is pretty out of character (based on my experience at least), but imo that's even more reason to townread it because it seems very much driven by things that wouldn't bother scum.

There were other things I liked but those were the main things that stood out.

@DV Can you also tell me why chesskid said he scumread us for on discord? And why you disagree with that? And can you tell me if Katsuki has some kind of read on me?

So we don't have a discord and I actually haven't read through the private topic chat for my team yet, but the vibe I'm getting is that most of them stopped following the game closely a while ago. I think Katsuki only has reads on Mina and Bins, at least as far as what he's told me so far.

I also don't really care what Chesskid thought to be completely honest. :/ But if you think I should scumread you based on anything he said, you're free to argue with me I guess?

Cool. Thanks for explaining that. That does make sense and I'm happy to see you're reading the game. I'm pretty easy to pocket though so I'm very conflicted about this. Also because you are DV and you're charming as hell. Either way, I'm very interested to see you commit to this game and I'm really excited you replaced in.

[Radja]

I would like to say though that I am concerned about the Archwing slot and I'm concerned about the writing off of UC that seems to have happened. I have seen UC as scum, and yeah he wasn't great at it in that game, but I didn't see anything from him here that I'd say can't from scum, and there are things that as mentioned, make me feel it is perhaps more likely. And as I vaguely alluded to before if anyone has a townread I'd appreciate it being mentioned/explained. Thanks Mina for sharing your thoughts btw. I'm still waiting on more from xyzzy and am in two minds about how worried to be about his popularity as a lynch target (because sometimes the person that everybody wants to lynch is actually scum! :O ) but I do want to consider all the options to the extent that I can with limited time (I am aware that my slow catch up isn't really helping matters!)

I have 0 experience with UCV but I'm taking my teams advice on that slot. I also haven't really seen anything out of Archwing that makes me question that read.

[Radja]

tbh I don't see a scenario where xyzzy isn't scum right now. I'd lay down a vote but it looks like some people are still doing things.

[Radja]

VOTE: xyzzy

we should get a claim soon. Only 2 days left.

[Radja]

hi DV please be town

catch up later


but i sort of dropped the Radja scumread

What did I do to make you drop it?

Bins you didn't answer this. Please do

[Radja]

We have like a day left, not sure what you people are waiting for, but I'd rather not run anyone else up today.