Read Your Role Mafia - Game Over

[petroleumjelly]

Day Two

ShadowGirl, Gambler, Self-Aligned, has been shot!

Gambler

Time to press your luck. On Night One of the game (but

not

pre-game) you must submit to me a list of exactly

4 live players

in the game, not including yourself. If you fail to send me such a list, you will be modkilled if you are alive, and lose the game immediately. There is at least one other method (besides not sending in a list) for your role to be modkilled – please refer to your special notes section. Your flavor for being modkilled will always be “shot”.

You win if at the end of the game 3 of those 4 players on your list are dead

prior to “endgame” killings

.

Good luck, and have fun! Be sure to read the rules of the game. Confirm your role by PM.

ooba, Double-Dipper Doctor, Town, has been shot!

Double-Dipper Doctor

Ice cream – as you know – is delicious. Why have one serving when you can have two?!

Each night, you must target two players, and neither of those players may include yourself. If those two players are of the exact same alignment, they will both be protected from 1 nightkill each for that night only. If they are not the exact same alignment, neither player will receive that protection.

Oh, and one more thing. You can never submit the pairing (two players) for protection more than once. For example, if you protect Players G and H on Night Three, you may not protect both Players G and H on the same night ever again. Knowing that, you might want to plan ahead.

You win with the town when all Mafiates, Serial Killers, and Cultists are dead and somebody with the exact same win condition as you is alive.

Good luck, and have fun! Be sure to read the rules of the game. Confirm your role by PM.

It is now

Day Two

. With

11

alive, it takes

6

to lynch. Deadline November 10, 11:59 pm CDT. Get a move on.

[Yaw]

I'm going to try to fit in a reread.

In the meantime, while SSK is a safe lynch for today (either he's a survivor and thus his lynch doesn't hurt us, or he's lying scum), he has posted in other threads that he's V/LA until Friday. I'd advise trying to find scum among the players that are currently around in the meantime, and if we have nothing promising by then we can go with the more obvious lynch.

[wolframnhart]

I'm going to try to fit in a reread.

In the meantime, while SSK is a safe lynch for today (either he's a survivor and thus his lynch doesn't hurt us, or he's lying scum), he has posted in other threads that he's V/LA until Friday. I'd advise trying to find scum among the players that are currently around in the meantime, and if we have nothing promising by then we can go with the more obvious lynch.

Not to sure i agree here Yaw. I do agree with finding scum amongst other people while SSK is apparently V/LA, but to say he is a safe lynch..
You could be right, he could be lying scum and we get a good lynch today, but to say he is survivor and (if he wasn't lying about that) his lynch would be safe i don't quite follow unless i am thinking about this the wrong way. Lynching him if he is survivor could mean two more townies (three if there was a doc block on one person) could be dead at night and that isn't a good thing at all.

[forbiddanlight]

and if we have nothing promising by then we can go with the more obvious lynch.

Careful with this. We don't know when lylo is, and while I doubt it's now, we can't let a survivor live to lylo. I'm not sure how useful I'll be for the next few days (My sister is getting married on the 31st and things are busy up to then). However, I will try to contribute as I can, and return to full speed after that.

[Yaw]

Well, one of those deaths last night appears to have been self-inflicted, so I'm not convinced there would be two more deaths. (Read ShadowGirl's role again.)

At any rate, the main purpose in saying that was that I expected to see a big push to lynch SSK right out of the gate, and felt that was rather useless while he isn't around. Apparently I was wrong for thinking that would happen. I agree that SSK shouldn't be living until lylo (and absolutely should not be allowed to

lurk

until lylo), but if he is telling the truth about his role than lynching scum is better than lynching a survivor. That assumes we have a good lead, of course.

[forbiddanlight]

Well, one of those deaths last night appears to have been self-inflicted, so I'm not convinced there would be two more deaths. (Read ShadowGirl's role again.)

I'm aware of that. It's just multiple factions that worries me

At any rate, the main purpose in saying that was that I expected to see a big push to lynch SSK right out of the gate, and felt that was rather useless while he isn't around. Apparently I was wrong for thinking that would happen. I agree that SSK shouldn't be living until lylo (and absolutely should not be allowed to lurk until lylo), but if he is telling the truth about his role than lynching scum is better than lynching a survivor. That assumes we have a good lead, of course.

Mostly agree with this, but I kinda have a lynch all survivors attitude since mind screw. I'm willing to give him a chance to be pro town though.

[Seraphim]

I'm kinda glad that ShadowGirl is dead. She would be working to keep certain people alive to win, which might incude scum.

After deep thinking...I didn't like the Sociopath lynch. After his roleclaim, I quickly backed off. I thought his roleclaim was solid and really have no idea why people continued to vote for him. The case against him was incredibly weak.

I'm still thinking about either voting for Electra or voting for Yaw(who, I believe, started that bandwagon), so...

I want everyone who was on that bandwagon at the end of the day, sans MafiaSSK(Yaw, Caboose, forbiddanlight, SensFan, Electra) to explain their reasoning on their vote on Sociopath.

[forbiddanlight]

The claim seemed very unbelievable, and also the fact that he appeared to be pushing weak cases to get a D1 mislynch.

[SensFan]

Well, one of those deaths last night appears to have been self-inflicted, so I'm not convinced there would be two more deaths. (Read ShadowGirl's role again.)

I'm aware of that. It's just multiple factions that worries me

Four factions, right? Couldn't it be Town, Mafia, SSK, ShadowGirl?

[Seraphim]

What claim would have been believable to you, then?

[forbiddanlight]

Four factions, right? Couldn't it be Town, Mafia, SSK, ShadowGirl?

That's entirely possible. Well, at least 4. Well, long as we don't leave him alive at lylo.

[Electra]

@ Seraphim - my voting for Sociopath was first based on his assumption that townies have unique special notes, then his claim which I did not think would be in the game, since it just seemed _so_ useless. (Which I guess it was supposed to be.) If he had not claimed one shot, I might have believed him.

I feel that SSK is the correct lynch today, barring any surprising developments. There's a reason that it's not a typical survivor strategy to just claim survivor. If you're not protown, you're against us. :p

I also find charter suspicious for being very pro-Sociopath near the end of yesterday- he talked about not finding SP suspicious and agreeing with him and such - it would be a mafia thing to do since he knew that SP would turn up townie.

vote: mafiassk

[Yaw]

Four factions, right? Couldn't it be Town, Mafia, SSK, ShadowGirl?

I thought that originally too, but upon looking at the opening post, Jellymod says

at least

4. So while ShadowGirl, SSK (if truthful), town, scum does make 4, that doesn't necessarily mean those are the only win conditions in the game. Which is unfortunate -- I was also hoping to do a process of elimination thing.

After deep thinking...I didn't like the Sociopath lynch. After his roleclaim, I quickly backed off. I thought his roleclaim was solid and really have no idea why people continued to vote for him. The case against him was incredibly weak.

I'm still thinking about either voting for Electra or voting for Yaw(who, I believe, started that bandwagon), so...

I want everyone who was on that bandwagon at the end of the day, sans MafiaSSK(Yaw, Caboose, forbiddanlight, SensFan, Electra) to explain their reasoning on their vote on Sociopath.

For the record, I predicted either you or charter would pull this. The essential premise behind going after people because they were on a bandwagon that lynched town is flawed. Wrong != Scum.

As for the rest, the claim was rather weak, and I couldn't figure out a reasonable way I would apply such a thing were I a mod and that claimed role were in my game. Furthermore, a SocioPath lynch, even if wrong, gives us far more information than an SSK lynch would have. SSK just lurked around and didn't say much of anything. He just randomly joined popular bandwagons when forced to come out of the woodwork. Meanwhile, plenty of people were taking positions on SocioPath yesterday, which leaves a lot of good information for us to pick through.

I believe I explained rather thoroughly yesterday why that bandwagon was a valid one to start. If you have any specific questions regarding it, feel free to go back through my explanations and ask based on what's already there. I don't see much point in typing it all up again.

[Caboose]

I thought SP's roleclaim to be so absurd that I didn't know whether to believe it or not, so I just took it with a grain of salt. And here's Yaw's argument on SP again:

For SocioPath, there's...well, a lot of different things. The main one that clicked for me is that he inadvertently dropped some pretty strong hints about his role in the thread. Don't want to get into this too much because it's not 100% scum, but is comparable against a claim and I want to give him a chance to make a mistake when claiming.

When going back with that idea, I noticed first of all his behaviour towards Ooba. Remember that the Ooba-wagon started out right when the charter-wagon was gaining steam. This means that if the charter-wagon was on scum, there's a high probability that scum were driving the opposing wagon. Even if not, SocioPath was by far the most vehement about going after Ooba, going to absurd lengths to try to justify a lynch. His exit strategy looked really weak here, compared to the effort in trying to push the wagon in the first place.

The recent attempt on Electra is also symptomatic of the need to push a bandwagon anywhere, for any reason. Electra was pretty much forced by Seraphim's accusation to bring up WIFOM, which SocioPath jumped on without looking at the context (Electra was actually saying that bringing up no lynch was value neutral, while acknowledging that it's usually seen as scummy). And again he's pushing a wagon heavily, based on nothing.

In short, he's just looking to push a lynch for any reason. His bandwagoning lacks discernment, and he's unwilling to consider evidence that doesn't get his chosen victims lynched. Combine that with the role tells and we have scum.

[SensFan]

After

he flipped Town

...I d

o

n't like the Sociopath lynch

in hindsight

. After his roleclaim, I quickly backed off

so I would look pro-Town after he flipped.

. I thought his

self-admitted very weak

roleclaim was solid and really have no idea why people continued to vote for him

since I knew he was Town

. The case against him

is a great way to throw a bunch of suspicions

.

I'm still thinking about either voting for Electra or voting for Yaw(who, I believe, started that bandwagon), so

I think I'll wait to seen which of these wagons someone else starts, so I can use this logic on that person tomorrow!

...

I want everyone who was on that bandwagon at the end of the day

(after I unvoted, of course)

, sans MafiaSSK(Yaw, Caboose, forbiddanlight, SensFan, Electra) to explain their reasoning on their vote on Sociopath

so that I can hopefully jump on 2-3 of you or more

.

[forbiddanlight]

To be fair, townies should have no fear explaining reasonings whether they are being called to it by town or scum. Otherwise, I think you have a pretty good point there Sensfan.

[Seraphim]

I have a theory. I think that it's entirely possible that MafiaSSK and Yaw are scumbuddies. Here's the idea:

First of all, the game's first major problem is MafiaSSK's lurking. A lot of people vote for him as the deadline looms ever nearer. They put him at L-1 to put pressure on him. Once we're done waiting for his weak meta, people continue to question him. It's entirely likely that Mafia is today's lynch. Hell, we even catch him in a lie.

I'm a townie. simple as that.

Fine. I'll claim I'm a Survivor. I had basically given up on this game but I guess I shouldn't. Surior should be an easy enough win condition to fulfill

Despite this...despite MafiaSSK's scummy behavior...

Wait a second...something just clicked for me.

Unvote, Vote: SocioPath

I'm around 85% sure on this one. Just pull up all his posts and read.

What? That didn't make sense.

I'm around 85% sure SocioPath is scum. Bandwagon him.

A bandwagon that ends in a townie lynch. Steering away from the much scummier MafiaSSK in an attempt to get a new bandwagon going towards a town player. Then, you force him to roleclaim, something that looks very scummy no matter what, and continue to push for his lynch despite MafiaSSK claiming survivor.

I do believe that the scum, if MafiaSSK is indeed scum, will try to bus him today in order to throw the heat off. I'll vote for MafiaSSK today, but tomorrow...

Depending on whether or not SSK turns up town, I will either vote for Yaw or Electra.

Mod Note: Quote tags fixed.

[Seraphim]

EBWOP: The quote tags didn't work in my last post.

Also, I was cut off. I'm a man of my word. Also, I meant to see whether SSK or Electra flip scum or town.

Vote: Electra

for clear reasons I have stated numerous times.

[Yaw]

Good show. You'll note, of course, that you quoted those things completely out of order to make them look bad. SSK claimed Survivor at least

3 pages

after I first accused SocioPath. And yet you're presenting it as if I tried to deflect a wagon after SSK claimed Survivor? Bullshit.

You're also ignoring that I changed

my own bandwagon

on charter to go after SocioPath. And with only a few days to go before deadline. In order to actually get a lynch under those circumstances, I needed to have a really good case to go on.

I had one.

As for whether or not SSK was scummier than SocioPath, that's an entirely subjective argument. Clearly, I wasn't the only person who saw things differently.

[Electra]

Wow, you think SSK and Yaw are scumbuddies so you vote me? That makes a lot of sense.

[SensFan]

Yaw, can I get at least a yes/no/maybe/comical 4th option out of you in regards to my paraphrasing of Seraphim's post?

[Yaw]

I enjoyed it, if that's what you mean.

Sephiroth and Charter were twigging my scumdar along with SocioPath yesterday, so I don't necessarily disagree. However, I hadn't considered that a pro-town role would be

trying

to act like scum as much as possible, stopping just short of wearing a neon, "Lynch me, I'm scum!" sign. So I'd still rather re-read with newer eyes before coming to a more definite conclusion.

[SensFan]

Do you see it as valid and true, though?

Sephiroth, I noticed you didn't comment on it. Any particular reasons?

Vote: Sephiroth

[forbiddanlight]

umu...who's Sephiroth? This isn't FF VII Mafia y'know .

[Yaw]

...Seraphim. I have no idea what I was thinking there. I don't even play FF VII.

So replace Sephiroth with Seraphim and...yeah.