Mini 1733: Jurassic Monkey - game over

[pistachi0n]

I'm more suspicious of 3dicerolling right now. I don't like his case against Wanderer, there was plenty of discussion in anticipation of the lynch. Wnaderer made a lot more sense as scum if either of the previous two lynches had been scum.

[3dicerolling]

I'm more suspicious of 3dicerolling right now. I don't like his case against Wanderer, there was plenty of discussion in anticipation of the lynch. Wnaderer made a lot more sense as scum if either of the previous two lynches had been scum.

How could you possibly see that hammer as town?

I had just gotten in that big response and soon I was going to respond to archmage and wanderer, until wanderer decided to hammer because of what I interpret as frustrated and desperate scum. There was still plenty of discussion left in that day.

Also, why do those other people being scum imply wanderer scum?

[farside22]

vote count:

wander (1) 3dice

with 5 alive it takes 3 to lynch
Deadline: Countdown clock: (expired on 2015-12-21 08:40:00)

[The Archmage Ludicrous]

I think it's been long enough for this postulate to be safe and reasonable:

I would consider that at least one of wanderer and 3dice

must

be scum. I personally would consider them both to be, but we know at least one of them is because if this was a townie voting on a townie, scum would have likely voted and hammered, for the win. There is, strictly speaking, a chance that scum wouldn't do that anyways, due to a sense of extreme caution, but at this point in time it doesn't feel unreasonable to me. I think if there were two scum inside of the population that is not 3dice, and not wanderer, one would have had the savvy to vote for (X justifiable reason) and the other would have had the savvy to hammer.

Side note: I would really like to push All Alone to more content output so that I could feel more comfortable with my townread on him.

[Wanderer-nl]

How is All Alone town? They're not even pushing their scumreads, just blatantly buddying the one person we can all agree on ICE had an innocent on. After tunnelling her for 2 full Days. And ofcourse All Alone saw the (possible) inno on Pistachion, but they also recognized a very slim possibility that there was an inno on themselves as well so they decided to kill the cop and then jackpot when Alchemist posted his thoughts on ICE's results because besides getting free townreads, now All Alone also wouldn't stand out for recognizing the cop. All Alone is now trying to figure out already who is the best misslynch for tomorrow. And who better to ask then the one person we can all agree on is most likely innocent?

[3dicerolling]

There's no way all alone/archmage or pistacion/archmage is a team. They would've hammered by now.

@Archmage - I would also like to see more thoughts from all alone. If there is a godfather, we could easily lose if it's all alone/pistacion. They would just have to push a mislynch

@Wanderer - The only way you could be proposing all alone as scum, is by proposing it's me and all alone, except I know I'm town, so that means you must be scum.

[pistachi0n]

I'm more suspicious of 3dicerolling right now. I don't like his case against Wanderer, there was plenty of discussion in anticipation of the lynch. Wnaderer made a lot more sense as scum if either of the previous two lynches had been scum.

How could you possibly see that hammer as town?

I had just gotten in that big response and soon I was going to respond to archmage and wanderer, until wanderer decided to hammer because of what I interpret as frustrated and desperate scum. There was still plenty of discussion left in that day.

Also, why do those other people being scum imply wanderer scum?

I never said I saw the hammer as town.

Also--when I thought Scorp was scum, Wanderer voted for Scorp really adamantly and withdrew the vote. So at the time I thought Wanderer knew Scorp would flip but wanted to be on the right side, and then backed out. Then Scorp flipped town. There were also some avoidant interactions between Wanderer and Alchemist going on that I thought were fishy, I mentioned them yesterday. But then Alch flipped town as well.

[The Archmage Ludicrous]

The only way you could be proposing all alone as scum, is by proposing it's me and all alone, except I know I'm town, so that means you must be scum.

Mm... I don't think that's quite true. I think she might be trying to make a case of me and All Alone as a scumpair.

[The Archmage Ludicrous]

Hm... Comment withdrawn. I can't really say that she isn't making a 3dice/All Alone case at this point. I'm letting my suspicions leak too far into my reasoning.

[All Alone]

I wasn't nervous about that, you were. Scorpious was at L-1 BEFORE I VOTED HIM. Learn to read.

I meant; Scorpious had already been at L-1 before the first time I'm voting him. I don't mind educated scumreads on me but come on All Alone, at least try.

I was nervous about Scorp being hammered?

someone hammer already

Wow, good point, just look at all those kittens I was having! Brilliant detective work, Inspector Clouseau.

And yeah, you're right that Scorp was at L-1 before your vote. And this was your reaction to him being at L-1:

I was just counting the votes and it's a good thing you just mentioned Scorpious is at L-1 yourself. I don't have intent to hammer (yet), I want Scorpious to answer first. And ofc more people need to post their thoughts on this wagon before anyone hammers it.

It's a

sliiiiiiightly

different reaction than the one you had to Alchemist being at L-1, and the difference is easily explained: you needed to save your own ass yesterday. You didn't want town to post more thoughts yesterday because your case on Alchemist was garbage, and you didn't want to risk Pistachion or Syndesis figuring that out, so you didn't give them the chance. Your move wasn't protown, and you know it wasn't, so don't even try.

This almost feels the same as the time you blocked BBT while I was busy shooting the BP. The only difference is that in that game

I

was scum.

"Your case on me reminds me of the other time you pushed scum for something they didn't actually do." -Wanderer

How is All Alone town? They're not even pushing their scumreads, just blatantly buddying the one person we can all agree on ICE had an innocent on. After tunnelling her for 2 full Days. And ofcourse All Alone saw the (possible) inno on Pistachion, but they also recognized a very slim possibility that there was an inno on themselves as well so they decided to kill the cop and then jackpot when Alchemist posted his thoughts on ICE's results because besides getting free townreads, now All Alone also wouldn't stand out for recognizing the cop. All Alone is now trying to figure out already who is the best misslynch for tomorrow. And who better to ask then the one person we can all agree on is most likely innocent?

Weird that you're concerned that I'm trying to figure out who is the best mislynch for tomorrow, when everyone is pouncing on you

today

. That's a good indicator that you're not worried that your lynch will end the game today.

Very slim possibility that ICE had an inno on me? He grouped me and Pistachion as "would not lynch". Do you really think someone who's been around as long as ICE would do that on someone he didn't have an innocent on, knowing full well that when he flips cop it could be mistaken for a breadcrumb? I feel pretty confident that he knew damn well what he was doing there. (Remember how absta and Mario tried to cast doubt on Silverwolf's results in Mystery Mansion? You're doing the same thing, scumlord.)

[All Alone]

I'm more suspicious of 3dicerolling right now. I don't like his case against Wanderer, there was plenty of discussion in anticipation of the lynch. Wnaderer made a lot more sense as scum if either of the previous two lynches had been scum.

My gut is that 3dice/Wanderer actually makes a lot of sense as scum here, as I'd expect scum to bus hard after a play like Wanderer's. If you know your partner is going down, you want to try to get as much town cred as possible to make up for it. In the game I linked in my previous post, catboi bussed me hard while the townies expressed at least some doubt, and I feel like 3dice and Wanderer are behaving similarly here.

Of course I'm not certain of that (after all I'm not expressing any doubt about Wanderer and I know I'm town) so I'm going to look at both 3dice and Archmage in depth but that's my first impression.

[pistachi0n]

Yeah, that makes sense. I'd still rather lynch 3dice today though.

[All Alone]

Syndesis:

Seems to be tunnelling Diego a bit. I'd have to throw a light town-reading, nothing really suspicious that I saw.

Townslip or nah?

@Syndesis - It's been awhile since I've played on here. Do mafia get pregame chat?

These two posts from 3dice really bother me. He pushes Archmage's "read" on the innocent child as a townslip. But that only makes sense if you know that scum can talk about it amongst themselves, since otherwise scum would have no more awareness of the IC than town. Yet 3dice asks if scum get pregame chat. It feels like he was trying to fake a townslip by appearing not to know about pregame chat, despite making a point that only makes sense from someone who did know about it.

Archmage vs Davsto on D1 really doesn't read like a SvS interaction. 277 and 279, in particular, is a really weird time for scumbuddies to crossvote considering this was the vote count:

The Archmage Ludicrous (2) Wanderer-nl, Firebringer
pistachi0n(2): All Alone, 3dicerolling
Davesto(2): ICENinja, Syndesis
3dicerolling(2): Garmr, Alchemist21
Garmr (1) MarioManiac4
MarioManiac4(1) pistachi0n
ICENinja(1): Davesto

Not Voting(2): Scorpious, The Archmage Ludicrous

At this point Archmage and Davsto wagons are tied with Pistachion and 3dice, with several other vanity wagons they could have pushed. But then Archmage and Davsto cross vote, causing the two of them to be the leading wagons. I'm very skeptical that scum would intentionally ensure that both the leading wagons were on scum, but as a TvS interaction that makes a lot more sense.

Additionally Archmage only ever voted Davsto D1, and I don't really get the impression that it was a powerbus. Archmage is cautious, he was fairly meek towards the beginning of the game, and he's only been scum once before. I doubt he'd feel confident enough as scum to try to bus a more experienced partner D1 and radiantcowbell his way to victory.

And one more thing that makes me think Archie is town is 950, where he points out that he suspected ICEninja was an investigative on D1. I believe his rationale here was legitimate. Yet the N1 and N2 bullets went to Firebringer and Garmr, not to ICE. I

seriously

doubt that scum-Archmage would have suspected ICE was investigative, and then let him get off multiple investigations.

Therefore, scum is most likely Wanderer/3dice and I'm good with lynching either one.

VOTE: Wanderer-nl

[Wanderer-nl]

VOTE: Wanderer

[farside22]

The monkey's were more quick this time. They wasted no time in getting organized to lynch Wander-nl

What say you Wander?

Before she utters a word, she jumps off the cliff to her death.

Wanderer-nl- Mafia Neighborizer - lynched day 5

It is now night five, please have all action in by Saturday December 12, 9:30am EST

[farside22]

54little monkey's sitting in a tree
k - i - l-l-i-n-g
First comes a gun
Then comes a bazooka
Then comes 3 monkey's looking a little peeved.

Day 6
With 3 alive it will take 2 to lynch

All Alone - Vanilla Townie - killed night 5

[The Archmage Ludicrous]

pistach was the obvious kill for scum. pistach did not die. Something is afoot.

[The Archmage Ludicrous]

If pistach is godfather, pistach has an obvious reason to kill All Alone. If 3dice is or I am scum, there's the obvious confusion factor that killing All Alone creates. Hm... I don't think I could have been swayed to vote for All Alone. Scum kills All Alone because he's the harder to lynch townie doesn't make sense: I'm even less likely to lynch pistach than All Alone. Ough. Interesting.

[pistachi0n]

pistach was the obvious kill for scum. pistach did not die. Something is afoot.

All Alone and I were both speculated about being confirmed town by cop result, why is that afoot?

[3dicerolling]

A few thoughts I've been having:

Yesterday, pistacion wanted to vote me over wanderer. If I would've been lynched yesterday, the game would've been over. It could be possible pistacion is godfather who was trying to flip the lynch around to win the game the previous day.

If Archmage is scum, he is playing it very safe. He could have easily hopped on my wagon today because it is obvious pistacion wants to lynch me.

Regarding the setup, neighborizer is not that powerful of a mafia role compared to cop, UB, IC, Commuter. There is definitely something powerful left and my money is on godfather, which doesn't necessarily make pistacion scum, but it's definitely something I'm considering.

I need to read back through both you two's ISOs to help me think this out.

[pistachi0n]

Keep in mind, I didn't put a vote down on you yesterday. I exercised LYLO caution.

[3dicerolling]

Keep in mind, I didn't put a vote down on you yesterday. I exercised LYLO caution.

Why were you more suspecting of me than Wanderer? So much that you would rather lynch me?

[pistachi0n]

Because I had based earlier reads on Wanderer off of associatives that didn't go through while you flew under my radar.

[3dicerolling]

Because I had based earlier reads on Wanderer off of associatives that didn't go through while you flew under my radar.

what kind of associatives? Also, how have I been flying under your radar when I've been scum reading you most of the game?

[The Archmage Ludicrous]

There's a distinct enough possibility of Godfather that pistach isn't conftown, I agree.

pistach was the obvious kill for scum. pistach did not die. Something is afoot.

All Alone and I were both speculated about being confirmed town by cop result, why is that afoot?

Yeah, but All Alone was being "suspected" by Wanderer, and there was less certainty that ICE had ever investigated him. If pistach were killed, then it would be... 3dice that was scum, and nobody would know that All Alone was town. It'd be easier to convince me to lynch All Alone, there's good setup on Wanderer scumreading him, makes it look like scum might have been trying to cover their tracks, build some last-second animosity. Plus, he'd been quiet all game long.

Overall, 3dice, as scum, had a good setup for the final day if he killed pistach.

In fact, the same argument applies to me. I would have had a fairly good setup for the final day if I killed pistach rather than All Alone.

Pistach didn't die. To me, this implies that she is the scum.

Either that, or there are mindgames going on. Totally possible.