Open 861: The Turing Test [game over]

[Vivax]

It's a bit too late in the game for the kneejerk OMGUS to look viable
Regardless, my objective is to kill Roden and end the game

[Loki Dokie]

I was also the first one on your wagon and I unvoted, because I had doubts it was you and wasn’t convinced on Kitty. Had a Greeting wagon been an option, I 100% would have voted that.

[Vivax]

But you know what, if the town votes Vulture out instead and I need to put more work in it's no biggie. I'm loving this game, the players are very motivated

[Loki Dokie]

It's a bit too late in the game for the kneejerk OMGUS to look viable
Regardless, my objective is to kill Roden and end the game

Well I honestly don’t gaf and since I know it’s not me and I don’t see how it’s GL, Ari or fire, it makes perfect sense to me and since I know you’re wrong on me if you’re town and that is wrongly factoring into your Roden vote. why should I be trusting it?

Fmpov, you’re either wrong town or scum when it comes to me, so no as long as that’s factoring into to your Roden vote, I’m 100% not trusting it.

[Vivax]

I'm just struggling to figure out how to participate without inducing WIFOM by just existing

I feel like I'm in a weird spot where anything I say is going to get interpreted as being way more layered than it actually is. Some of the votes on Dann were made because of a pre-flipped read on me and looking too deeply into my town read on him. Idk, I don't want to ruin the game by centralizing who to vote for over things that are in my ISO.

This is not a townie train of thought, but rather the thought of someone who knows that the information he gives can be used to determine the correct launch

[Loki Dokie]

But you know what, if the town votes Vulture out instead and I need to put more work in it's no biggie. I'm loving this game, the players are very motivated

I want a Roden scumcase and/or Vulture towncase that has nothing whatsoever to do with me. I’d also really like to understand why you’re tr RR and sr me, because had I not unvoted, perhaps Vulture hammers?

I think Bell never moves because he was totally focused on getting towncred with his votes on both days.

[Loki Dokie]

I'm just struggling to figure out how to participate without inducing WIFOM by just existing

I feel like I'm in a weird spot where anything I say is going to get interpreted as being way more layered than it actually is. Some of the votes on Dann were made because of a pre-flipped read on me and looking too deeply into my town read on him. Idk, I don't want to ruin the game by centralizing who to vote for over things that are in my ISO.

This is not a townie train of thought, but rather the thought of someone who knows that the information he gives can be used to determine the correct launch

Both of them look really bad here but what we need to determine is which one looks worse. Anyway. you should read through my interactions with both Roden and Vulture because I think it’s beyond obvious I’m not aligned with either.

Because if you’re town, I don’t want that to influence your Roden read.

[Loki Dokie]

My problem is also, I’m paranoiaing on both RR and you now and both of you are pushing Roden. It’s possible it’s reverse psychology to make me vote Vulture but I need to think more on this.

I want to hear what Ari and fire think.

[Loki Dokie]

If KittyTacky is scum here then I would suspect they are being actively sacrificed by scum.

There’s your answer @Vivax. Ari was not going to let Kitty escape, so Vulture if scum, would obviously bus here.

[fireisredsir]

vote count 1.11

with 13 votes in play, it takes 7 to make a decision. day 1 ends in (expired on 2022-08-11 09:45:00).

yeet

KittyTacky [6]:

Bell, Aristeia, GuiltyLion, Dannflor, Vulture, Vivax

Vivax [5]:

Radical Rat, furtiveglance, kutiplz, KittyTacky, Roden

Bell [1]:

fireisredsir

not voting [1]:

Loki Dokie

mod notes

~ this is a mod note.

Most based votecount I found

VOTE: Roden

Because either you or fire were not hammering KT
While I've had 2 flipped scum on me at minimum
And KT had one flipped on them

So either you argue both wagons were scum, or that you and fire are always a t/m combo and try to reach Rodens alignment from there

Knowing I'm town, I highly doubt Vulture wouldn't pile on me as scum there, for me it's easier to reach the conclusion that Roden is the one we lim

um you are aware that i literally did hammer like 20 posts later, right?

i think all of the scum were already on the wagons at this point and i don't think there's really much reason to doubt that

[fireisredsir]

loki im p sure this is town vivax. probably try not to let anything he says influence your votes too much

[Loki Dokie]

vote count 1.final

with 13 votes in play, it took 7 to make a decision. day 1 ended.

yeet

KittyTacky [7]:

Bell

, Aristeia, GuiltyLion,

Dannflor

, Vulture, Vivax, fireisredsir

[HAMMER]

Vivax [5]:

Radical Rat,

furtiveglance

,

kutiplz, KittyTacky

, Roden

not voting [1]:

Loki Dokie

mod notes

~ i was literally about to sleep, why do you do this to me

I think specifically because of the mech, it’s extremely unlikely that 4/5 scum were on Vivax and only one bussed.

I’m going to say it again. I don’t believe Bell was the only scum bussing Kitty. Ari was hellbent on Kitty going through and Dann was equally hellbent on Vivax not.

So Vivax, that is a seriously bad metric for tr Vulture here.

As for your fire read, in a world where he’s ever scum here, he deserves the win but I don’t see why he’d be hardpushing the correct votes on both d2 and 3 if he were scum here. Because then he’d be essentially gamethrowing if scum because scum was one down.

[Vivax]

4 scum on my wagon except Bell then?
It‘s possible tbh, but calling Loki mafia is kinda fun for the hard Omgus every time anyway

[Loki Dokie]

If KittyTacky is scum here then I would suspect they are being actively sacrificed by scum.

There’s your answer @Vivax. Ari was not going to let Kitty escape, so Vulture if scum, would obviously bus here.

All I know is that my gut reaction to the Vivax wagon is disgust

VOTE: KittyTacky

And this, so I ask you again, how this clears Vulture?

[Loki Dokie]

If KittyTacky is scum here then I would suspect they are being actively sacrificed by scum.

There’s your answer @Vivax. Ari was not going to let Kitty escape, so Vulture if scum, would obviously bus here.

All I know is that my gut reaction to the Vivax wagon is disgust

VOTE: KittyTacky

And this, so I ask you again, how this clears Vulture?

[fireisredsir]

4 scum on my wagon except Bell then?
It‘s possible tbh, but calling Loki mafia is kinda fun for the hard Omgus every time anyway

only if it's RR/roden. which is possible but not at all the only option

[Vivax]

That VC should be a Roden auto vote every time in a sane game

[Vivax]

But I sympathize with tinfoilers. The first elim is the most important for the scummers however

[fireisredsir]

this setup is not a normal game tho and scum are very aware about how people will be heavily analyzing the d1 vcs for associations and wagonomics considering multiple scum have to flip guaranteed

[fireisredsir]

also scum has a ton of wiggle room in this situation so please later be careful about assumptions that people usually make like "oh scum wouldn't all pile on a wagon together" or "scum must be the ones pushing this counterwagon to scum" because they have 5 people. we need 7 to elim. to get an elim on scum without bussing we need 7/8 town people to agree. that's just not really ever gonna happen if scum doesn't want it to

so scum is free to just mostly do whatever they want and be as unconventional as possible with their votes in order to look unpaired with each other, bc they know that multiple of them will have to flip at some point

[Loki Dokie]

4 scum on my wagon except Bell then?
It‘s possible tbh, but calling Loki mafia is kinda fun for the hard Omgus every time anyway

It’s not fun if we lose because of it and Greeting also had this weird post calling RR a deep wolf, which is what I expected today’s pairing to be.

Knowing that everyone and their uncle had pretty much already locked Roden in as scum, why was if scum, was he paired with Vulture, instead whomever was the final scum?

[fireisredsir]

also for full disclosure when i typed that d1 i was kinda thinking about the possibility that bell, GL, and ari could have just decided to all group as 3 and hard bus kitty lol

that's obviously not what happened since at least one of GL/ari is town tho

i also at the time didn't fully realize how damaging to scum it would be to have a scum death d1. i think that GL or ari probably would as scum? but id also think vulture would so idk. ig as a recent replace in they might not have fully thought through the setup

[Loki Dokie]

But I sympathize with tinfoilers. The first elim is the most important for the scummers however

If KittyTacky is scum here then I would suspect they are being actively sacrificed by scum.

There’s your answer @Vivax. Ari was not going to let Kitty escape, so Vulture if scum, would obviously bus here.

All I know is that my gut reaction to the Vivax wagon is disgust

VOTE: KittyTacky

And this, so I ask you again, how this clears Vulture?

I’m saying scum really had no choice. There was no way Kitty wasn’t going through.

[Vivax]

this setup is not a normal game tho and scum are very aware about how people will be heavily analyzing the d1 vcs for associations and wagonomics considering multiple scum have to flip guaranteed

If scum get the first elim right and ML someone, they can get a whole bunch of townies (but at least 2) that are potential victims later on for being on the wrong wagon. Plus the points system disincentivizes bussing.

There‘s also the tendency to assume that 4 scummers don‘t vote together which is somewhat of a gamblers fallacy.

The only question is if you expect them to be more vs less organized but in the average game it‘s mostly everyone for himself. If they were organized they could have hammered me when I was at L-2 and L-1.

So we‘re not dealing with a highly coordinated team fmpov

[Loki Dokie]

also for full disclosure when i typed that d1 i was kinda thinking about the possibility that bell, GL, and ari could have just decided to all group as 3 and hard bus kitty lol

that's obviously not what happened since at least one of GL/ari is town tho

i also at the time didn't fully realize how damaging to scum it would be to have a scum death d1. i think that GL or ari probably would as scum? but id also think vulture would so idk. ig as a recent replace in they might not have fully thought through the setup

Of course it was damaging to scum but if you’re scum and you know short of a last minute miracle, your buddy’s getting whacked, it’s like the making lemons out of lemonade thing, so why not jump on Kitty atp for free towncred?

And especially for Vulture, being a late day replace in, so they could vote wherever with 0 suspicion on them.