Open 279 - Rusty Guillotine Mafia - Game Over!


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Post Post #2075 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 5:31 am

Post by Equinox »

VP Baltar wrote:What do you feel is wrong about me pointing this out to you, Equi? I mean, other than it's obvious and I shouldn't have to?
It came off as mudslinging to me. Sure, scum need to check themselves to make sure they're consistent, but town would check themselves, too, if they've lost track of their thoughts about the game. Post 2072 looked like you pointing at a null tell and screaming, "SCUM!"

Having said that, I don't like what LuckayLuck did with his self-iso, but seeing the proclamations that he's town has me scratching my head. Urk. Self-reminder here to read LuckayLuck after Fate.

By the way, I'm pretty sure LuckayLuck-VP Baltar is not town-town. Folks on the Fate wagon, yell at me if you disagree.
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Post Post #2076 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 5:33 am

Post by GreyICE »

Equinox wrote:
VP Baltar wrote:What do you feel is wrong about me pointing this out to you, Equi? I mean, other than it's obvious and I shouldn't have to?
It came off as mudslinging to me. Sure, scum need to check themselves to make sure they're consistent, but town would check themselves, too, if they've lost track of their thoughts about the game. Post 2072 looked like you pointing at a null tell and screaming, "SCUM!"

Having said that, I don't like what LuckayLuck did with his self-iso, but seeing the proclamations that he's town has me scratching my head. Urk. Self-reminder here to read LuckayLuck after Fate.

By the way, I'm pretty sure LuckayLuck-VP Baltar is not town-town. Folks on the Fate wagon, yell at me if you disagree.
VP Baltar's interactions with me on the past two pages.

Town-Town, Town-Scum, or Scum-Scum?

And if 2, whose the scum?
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Post Post #2077 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 5:39 am

Post by VP Baltar »

Equinox wrote:
VP Baltar wrote:What do you feel is wrong about me pointing this out to you, Equi? I mean, other than it's obvious and I shouldn't have to?
It came off as mudslinging to me. Sure, scum need to check themselves to make sure they're consistent, but town would check themselves, too, if they've lost track of their thoughts about the game. Post 2072 looked like you pointing at a null tell and screaming, "SCUM!"

Having said that, I don't like what LuckayLuck did with his self-iso, but seeing the proclamations that he's town has me scratching my head. Urk. Self-reminder here to read LuckayLuck after Fate.

By the way, I'm pretty sure LuckayLuck-VP Baltar is not town-town. Folks on the Fate wagon, yell at me if you disagree.
It's not really mudslinging as it is pointing out something I actually think is scummy. I agree with you that it's fine for a town to check themselves to remind themselves of their thoughts previously in the game. What I disagree with is how he looked back and was like 'this sounds scummy sure, but it's really not'. He's concerned with how he comes off rather than what he's actually saying. Additionally, I think LL has been doing his best to keep a low-profile today. So I'm going to call him out every time he posts in thread to get him in here and talking.
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Post Post #2078 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:06 am

Post by GreyICE »

Equinox wrote: Having said that, I don't like what LuckayLuck did with his self-iso, but seeing the proclamations that he's town has me scratching my head. Urk. Self-reminder here to read LuckayLuck after Fate.
LuckayLuck wrote:Alimaster thinks I'm scum, several people I think are townies (VP Baltar, crypto, Fate) are voting for him; however, I just have to say:

I think AlimasterGM is a townie.

It's a tone read. I don't have evidence. I could make a post explaining why I think he's a townie based on specific intonations and such, but I won't. This makes this post really worth nothing, but I figured I should get my stance on that lynch out there.
LuckayLuck wrote:
Unvote. Vote: Shadow Dancer
(L-1)


I will throw caution to the winds and trust in crypto & fate. I begrudgingly give Jarti credit on having a 'note to self' on Shadow Dancer's shady activities.

Post #1048 of Shadow Dancer's actually simply makes no sense. It has no townie flow to it.
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Why I Think Concission is a Townie



Reason 1: Tone


In a nutshell, it's because of tone. She has been a suspect for the majority of the game; she was very heavily pressured on day one. I thought her responses were coming from a genuinely frustrated townie. It is a tone that I feel is difficult to fake.
Concission wrote:I'm trying to imagine how funny all of what you've been saying once I flip town.

The method works back and forth. I'm not betting everything on you-scum but I'm pretty sure, sure enough to be able to start work on looking for your buddy.
Concission wrote:Crypto needs to stop tunneling. He's been under the false impression that he caught scum and thus playing quite complacently. Please look into people other than me. Brand them my partner if you like, just DO IT.
VP clearly has no intention to find scum.
Fate's comment on Ythill bothers me. I find his tone quite off for town.
Concission wrote:Ok guys. Lynch me now or never. I hate how many people are tunneling on me and don't make a decent case. I feel it is a strong distraction for me from scum-hunt and a demotivator for my mood. So it's something we need to deal with right NOW.
Unvote.Vote:zoraster

Reason 2: A Lost Townie


I don't think it's any secret given how pretty much everyone has been changing reads that in this game, it is difficult to have a good bearing on reads. We have to rely more on our own interpretation of events, which is mostly why everybody is going in several different directions.
Concission wrote:sigh my reads are changing like wildfire after Jarti and Fate's posts. Though, I still think LL is town, I think I can go with this:
Unvote.Vote:AGM
Concission seems to genuinely have changed reads 'like wildfire' as she explains here.

Being A Lost Townie isn't an insult - hell, I'm a lost townie. I consider most townies in this game to be, at the time being, mostly lost.


Reason 3: Is Shadow Dancer Scum?


Because if Shadow Dancer is, and we lynch Concission now, then we'd lose a pretty serious piece of information in Concission being the L-1 vote.
Concission wrote:I'd prefer an SD lynch
Vote:Shadow Dancer

Come on, we need 1 more vote.
If Equinox is town, and I have no reason to disbelieve her at the moment, then that's TWO DIFFERENT town lynches LuckayLuck has opposed, in favor of a scum lynch.


ALSO LUCKAY LUCK IS TOWN.

If we lynch VP today I'll be down with a Luckay luck lynch tomorrow, if only to test whether I'm a sane cop this game, but that BRIGHT RED FLIP FROM VP is gonna nail Chesskid's hide to the wall.
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Post Post #2079 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 12:56 pm

Post by RedCoyote »

Equinox 2038 wrote:Patience, sir. The cases on Fate-town and Fate-scum are many in number, quite large, and very involved. Besides, LuckayLuck and VP Baltar look worse at the moment.
I'm beating my head against the wall for all that mental work I did to narrow this game down to four possibilities... and now it's looking like that is going to be completely pissed down the drain in favor of a choice between one person who is obvious town and one person who I have a comfortable townread on.

The weaker of the two wagons (it's looking to be the VPB voters) need to concede and get behind Fate. I'm not being stubborn here, but VPB and LL were not possibilites I wanted to consider for our lynch today way before Grey or chess came on the scene. The deadline is inching closer and a VPB lynch is totally misguided. I appreciate the work Grey has done to make his case (I'm not arguing that he isn't working hard here), but I'm convinced, based on the interaction between SD, that VPB is just not scum this game. Further, I would really not like to see an LL lynch either, certainly not when I can think of four people I'd rather see on the guillotine.
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Post Post #2080 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 1:14 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Emphatically not.

I will lynch myself before I lynch Fate.
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Post Post #2081 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 1:58 pm

Post by Equinox »

I'm sorry, RedCoyote, but that's how I feel about chesskid3 and Vigilante Ventriloquist. Your partnership possibilities involve them, and I disagree with that; crypto's play has the mark of a townie, and Vigilante Ventriloquist has since convinced me he's likely town. Fate is up in the air.

Thus, my remaining pool is {GreyICE, LuckayLuck, VP Baltar}. All three have done things that I feel are scummy; my focus now is to find out which is/are committing them because they are scum and which one is just lulzing about.

Though now I'm second-guessing myself because of the number of people saying crypto's slot must be scum, and so I'll probably have to look into him, too.

I probably shouldn't post again until I have something more concrete. Spamming the thread with waffles only makes this thread that much more unappetizing.
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Post Post #2082 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 2:11 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Actually its interesting.

Equinox:
GreyICE wrote: VP Baltar's interactions with me on the past two pages.

Town-Town, Town-Scum, or Scum-Scum?

And if 2, whose the scum?
Comments?
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Post Post #2083 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 2:19 pm

Post by Equinox »

Oh, I forgot to respond to that. Sorry.

I don't think you'd bus VP Baltar, so scum-scum is out. I haven't decided which of the other two it is; that would have to depend on my individual reads of you two. I tried reading Shadow Dancer earlier; his interactions implicated both Jarti and VP Baltar in some fashion, so that didn't work too well.
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Post Post #2084 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 2:22 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Equinox wrote:Oh, I forgot to respond to that. Sorry.

I don't think you'd bus VP Baltar, so scum-scum is out. I haven't decided which of the other two it is; that would have to depend on my individual reads of you two. I tried reading Shadow Dancer earlier; his interactions implicated both Jarti and VP Baltar in some fashion, so that didn't work too well.
Well tell me if you decide it's town-town :P
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Post Post #2085 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 4:30 pm

Post by LuckayLuck »

greyice,

thanks for posting quotes from mine which make my town-dom seem more likely
because they are pretty townish
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Post Post #2086 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 6:19 pm

Post by Fate »

GreyICE wrote:Emphatically not.

I will lynch myself before I lynch Fate.
>_>


<_<

I did claim scum you know >_>b
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Post Post #2087 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 6:36 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Yeah but you're town.

If you flip scum, enormous egg on my face, but you won't. Fuck if this were closed I'd claim you as a mason buddy and call it a gambit.
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Post Post #2088 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 6:52 pm

Post by Fate »

...do you know how long its been since I've had someone I could dual mason gambit claim with?

<3
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Post Post #2089 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 6:54 pm

Post by GreyICE »

LuckayLuck wrote:greyice,

thanks for posting quotes from mine which make my town-dom seem more likely
because they are pretty townish
My god

I haven't seen this since the newbie game where the kid posted 'eheehee' in response to me saying that he seemed very town.

He was town too :igmeou:

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Post Post #2090 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:49 am

Post by chesskid3 »

Or you know stop deluding yourself into thinking he's town k?
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Post Post #2091 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:00 am

Post by Equinox »

chesskid3, how much have you read so far?

LuckayLuck is probably town. What is really bothersome is the disparity in his early game posting and present posting. On Days 1 and 2, he took stances and outlined his reasoning behind them, and I don't see anything wrong with the steps he took to his reads. Day 3, he's all over the place. Day 4, his request that we ignore his whimsical hopping is so terrible it hurts. However, I looked into some of his games and noticed that he did go into explanations of his play style there, too, so I suspect that the defensiveness is just his personality. To sum up, Day 4 play gets somewhat of a pass, and I can see town doing all the hopping on Day 3; the thread was huge at that point, and it's easy to become lazy and less organized at that point.

I still can't get over VP Baltar's question to crypto. That screams of scum to me. I'm not really satisfied with VP Baltar's responses the two times he was asked about this. There is no way anyone can read enough of crypto's post to see that he was "earnest" and then completely miss how badly he misunderstood the setup. I don't care how town he sounds... I've been burned by letting obvtown scum go when people ignored one single very obvious scum slip. That said, I am going to reread his posts to double-check stuff.

Oh, yeah. From my first read-through, I read crypto as town partly because of his reaction to the screw-up. For one thing, I'd expect scum to put a lot of thought into how to play this setup and the (dis)advantages of delayed flips. When crypto found out that he'd misunderstood it, the posts that ensued sounded like genuine embarrassment, the town kind. Further, if I am correct about VP Baltar, crypto is unlikely to be scum given how Shadow Dancer grilled VP Baltar about specifying his question to crypto; that doesn't sound like a scum team interaction.

I'm going to finish up the reading later today when I get back and hopefully have verdicts on Fate and GreyICE. At this rate, I'll have reread the entire thread... :igmeou:
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Post Post #2092 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:02 am

Post by chesskid3 »

25ish pages
but I have a paper due tonight so I can't do any more actual reading/not posting 1 liners as a quick break until tomorrow. (and then I have a test on Monday to study for on sunday blah blah blah i will try to read some more)
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Post Post #2093 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:18 am

Post by VP Baltar »

Ok, Equinox, so you tell me that I couldn't have read crypto's responses as earnest and then in the next paragraph you say you found him town because his posts sounded like genuine embarassment. So, the same exact thing I am saying, you are saying, but I'm scum because I couldn't have seen it the way that you see it? I don't even get this game anymore.

@RC - the main reason I see for lynching Fate is that SD made a move at the end of the day that could be taken as a desperate attempt to save him from the guillotine. I keep going back and forth on this point because Fate would be a tasty mislynch to me if I was scum and he was town, so it would make some sense to pull that move. On the other hand, I wonder if SD is that aware or was simply making a last ditch effort to save a buddy. I am pretty convinced that LL is scum here (in spite of Equinox's poor meta justifications), but I do concede that it's not implausible for Fate to be scum with SD given those wagon shenanigans.
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Post Post #2094 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:26 am

Post by Fate »

KEKWEAKKAHAHAHAHAHA

AND NOW THE TIDE TURNS

AS VP SLOWLY 180S HIS READ ON ME TO SAVE HIMSELF


OH THIS IS BEAUTIFUL TO WATCH

HEAHEAHHAHAHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
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Post Post #2095 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:38 am

Post by VP Baltar »

no, bullshit. I've said the same thing since the start of the day.
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Post Post #2096 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:39 am

Post by VP Baltar »

I've said from the start that SD's move to seemingly save you stinks and is definitely a black mark on your jacket.
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Post Post #2097 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:40 am

Post by Fate »

You've said you'd lynch me just to shut up all the dumbasses on my wagon and to get it out of the way, NOW you're saying "well he could be scum >_>b"
VP Baltar wrote:Fate's still town. RC's probably dumb town. VV needs to die today. and etc.


^THIS WHAT YOU BEEN SAYIN SINCE START OF DAY


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Post Post #2098 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:41 am

Post by Fate »

VP Baltar wrote:oh hell yes, we're not lynching fate today or ever. Get over it.

^ALSO SAID AT START OF DAY
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Post Post #2099 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:42 am

Post by Fate »

VP Baltar wrote:no, Fate is town. He had no purpose to call SD town late yesterday. I actually think you're scummy for pushing his lynch Luckay. You are looking for easy blood in the water. VV looks much worse.
SHOULD I KEEP LOOKING FOR WHERE I MIGHT BE SCUM BASED ON WHAT SD DID OR SHOULD I JUST CALL YOU A SCUMBAGFUCK LIAR MCBUDDYFUCK?
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