Organic Chemistry [GAME OVER]

[Speedy Saki]

i have to admit i am kind of wanting to lynch him for the avatar partially.

but he is still scummy !!!

[Marquis]

let's lynch beast

[Titus]

VLA starting now

[Antihero]

Noted.

[vezokpiraka]

go ISO Bipolarchemist (i quite liked the guy)... he didnt crumb the role at all! why would anyone in the right mind buy this acdude's claim????

People are afraid of killing him cause he is uncced and I really think the back-up is town.

did he crumb the role prior to his claim?

scum have fake claims so i don't think "uncced" ever means anything in a theme game.

... you mean he got a fakeclaim that is mod confirmed in the first post?
Are you even reading this game?

[Antihero]

this was unintentional

of course it was.

...just like the big yellow stain on your sheets.

[Marquis]

There are four inventors and one back-up inventor in this game.

They may or may not be all of the same alignment

and there may or may not be other power roles in the setup.

[Marquis]

i notice you hinted that you know that already but i am reminding people of things

also i might be v/la? not sure but i am getting blue screens of death like every 30 minutes

[Wickedestjr]

Post coming soon

[Majiffy]

Prod dodge.

[Wickedestjr]

Marquis- maybe you could share the details of the meta search & compare.

His recent scum games: this and this
His recent town games: this and this
In the town games it seems like he tries harder, demonstrates a genuine interest, and is more open with his thoughts. Posts 1479-80 seem to resemble his town play.

With that said, instead of comparing how I play, you could read what I say.

I read what you say, but haven't noticed anything particularly telling.

Bulba-avoiding an active read of his posts. It gives me the urge to nitpick then fight with him then vote him.

This doesn't look good, especially given my proposition that you and Bulbazak are potential scum partners. Why not try to read him without fighting with him? And why is nitpicking, fighting, or voting him a bad thing?

[Wickedestjr]

ac1983fan

, why did you say that Bulbazak is scum if GG is town?

ZZZX

, who are your top four suspects?

Asked earlier but it was in my last big post so I can understand you missing it.

[PeregrineV]

@GGun

- I saw and will read that.

@Majiffy

- re:MTD, less hate and more lack of love.

[PeregrineV]

Marquis- maybe you could share the details of the meta search & compare.

His recent scum games: this and this
His recent town games: this and this
In the town games it seems like he tries harder, demonstrates a genuine interest, and is more open with his thoughts. Posts 1479-80 seem to resemble his town play.

OK, I'll look those over.

With that said, instead of comparing how I play, you could read what I say.

I read what you say, but haven't noticed anything particularly telling.

Fair enough.

Bulba-avoiding an active read of his posts. It gives me the urge to nitpick then fight with him then vote him.

This doesn't look good, especially given my proposition that you and Bulbazak are potential scum partners. Why not try to read him without fighting with him? And why is nitpicking, fighting, or voting him a bad thing?

Not really possible, but I get what your saying.
I will at some point. And they are bad things because they don't always tell you something and often create bias towards future posts. As for voting him, it may happen at some point, but not today, by me.

[Wickedestjr]

ac's claim, at this point, doesn't change his likelihood of being town or scum imo. But I agree with the unvotes.

Unvote. Vote: MTD

Doesn't seem like there's interest in a mollie bandwagon/lynch right now, even though people suspect her and I think I made a good case. This is a good alternative, though.

[ac1983fan]

go ISO Bipolarchemist (i quite liked the guy)... he didnt crumb the role at all! why would anyone in the right mind buy this acdude's claim????

People are afraid of killing him cause he is uncced and I really think the back-up is town.

did he crumb the role prior to his claim?

scum have fake claims so i don't think "uncced" ever means anything in a theme game.

this was unintentional

i am sorry antihero

There is only one backup inventor in the setup per page one.
Seriously dude have you even READ anything about this game? First you call mastin2 a doc, now this.

ac1983fan

, why did you say that Bulbazak is scum if GG is town?

Don't 100% remember but I think it had to do with GG's interactions with Bulba after Bulba's read post, and the whole "I think you're town so tough" bit.

[pirate mollie]

prod dodge

[beastcharizard]

go ISO Bipolarchemist (i quite liked the guy)... he didnt crumb the role at all! why would anyone in the right mind buy this acdude's claim????

People are afraid of killing him cause he is uncced and I really think the back-up is town.

did he crumb the role prior to his claim?

scum have fake claims so i don't think "uncced" ever means anything in a theme game.

this was unintentional

i am sorry antihero

How do you know scum have fake claims?

@Marquis:

Go home you are drunk. I am not getting lynched.

[Speedy Saki]

Because all theme games have scum fakeclaims?

[Bulbazak]

Normally when a thread closes, I don't go back to prior posts when the day opens back up again, especially when scum was spamming and I didn't have time to get back to it in the first place. But MS wants to be

that

kind of scumbutt, so here I go.

1) your argument: wicked is scum because it is difficult to push a wagon on him despite many people scum reading him

2) my argument: depends on context, your statement is not true

3) you say: 'lol you are scum'

4) I give an example on how stupid your statement is

5) you go:"LOL STRAWMAN YOU TOOK MY ARGUMENT OUT OF CONTEXT"

1.) No, that was not my argument. I gave several reasons for my Wicked scumread, none of which were related to the difficulty of the wagon. As deadline was nearing though, and as I didn't like any of the other wagon, and since I knew that a lot of people had a Wicked scumread, I tried my best to push that lynch and get people to switch. Seeing as I know that several players with a Wicked scumread were huge proponents of wagon speed theory, I used that as a means to try to bring them over to my preferred wagon. It had nothing to do with why I was scumreading Wicked.

2.) And when saying that, you ignored all of the pushing being done to try to get a Wicked wagon and the cases on him.

3.) I stated an agreement with Titus that you were likely scum with Wicked. You are misrepping what I actually said and making it sound as if I was just scumeading you for kicks and giggles.

4.) Here's what you said:

Depends on context.

Is wicked being pushed majorly?

Is there a case against wicked?

Is someone shouting in big bold letters "lets lynch wicked he is scum"?

If none of the above, it's possible that you aren't pushing enough/they aren't true scum reads, in that town does not have him pegged as scum enough to commit. Even if a player is objectively scummy, he may be town, and it appears this may be the general (unmentioned) consensus. Nobody wants/dares to commit.

This is scum with Wicked.

I agree.

Okay, so Titus is scumread by many people.

But it is difficult to get a wagon on Titus, despite majiffy's best efforts.

According to your hard and fast blanket rule, finding it difficult to push a wagon on someone who is scum read by many, is on scum

Ergo, Titus is scum.


Therefore Titus is bussing me???


See how little sense you make?

Not only was that strawmanning my original argument (on the basis that I was never scumreading Wicked for that reason), but you then twisted said argument and used it to discredit me. That's called a misrep.

4.) Again, you are misrepping what I actually said by making it sound like I had no basis for what I said:

Nice strawman. You misrepped me by taking a section where I called out a common belief (I never said it was my own.) when trying to get a wagon to move from a townread to a scumread. You then mischaracterize that argument and use it to try to discredit my scumread of you. Town MS wouldn't do this. Scum MS would.

You are trying to make it sound like I have no basis for scumreading you when I actually do. You are trying to mischaracterize and discredit my arguments for why you are scum. That is a scum move.

Please kindly quote and highlight for me the part which I said "wall war"

See, this is a subtle bit of manipulation on your part, because you never

said

wall war, but you certainly implied it:

Would you like to dance, bulba? I can entertain you is guess. Just like we did in voided mafia

Here's the game you're referencing. If anybody would go and do a dual ISO of me and your hydra, they'd find that we ended up walling on each other for close to 2 game days. Hardly anyone payed attention, and it ended up taking valuable space. Here you are suggesting that we do it again. Being at the end of day 1, where we were trying to figure out who scum was, and you were just coming under suspicion, such a suggestion couldn't come at a worse time. You were essentially suggesting that we just wall and clog up the thread, and it would benefit you, because no one would be paying attention to those arguments in the first place. And the kicker is that if you were town, you wouldn't posture dancing with me so that we might come to an understanding, you'd just do it. Here you are just doing things for appearances, which means that you are scum trying to look town, rather than actually being town.

In Voided we walled at each other for almost 2 day phases and nobody payed any attention to what either of us were saying. Sure we got townreads on each other by the end, but it didn't help anybody else much. And we both hadn't played with each other before, so I didn't know what to expect from you. That's not the case now, and due to the way you're acting, this is not your town game.

That game was 1 year ago. Firstly, using one game to judge my play is a very, very,

very

,

very

small sample size to reach any reliable conclusion. Secondly, using a one-year-past-game to just my play is very, very,

very

stale meta. Thirdly, I'm rather sure that we've improved to such a point since the past year to make our "war" more concise, readable and conclusive (this is a lie: I do not know if you have improved or not.) Lastly, I'm pretty sure this playerlist would pay attention to what we say this time, considering users Majiffy, pirate mollie, Titus, and probably more.

Don't you dare do this. YOU WERE THE ONE THAT FREAKING BROUGHT UP VOIDED IN THE FIRST PLACE! I am not using that game as a way to judge your play, as I've played with you a lot more since then, and that game is an anomaly as far as your play goes. Using far more recent games as a basis for your play here, I can say with certainty that it is off, especially the part where you are so grievously misrepping me. The one line about not knowing whether I've improved is not only a low blow, but a blatant lie, as you've played a lot with me, and I've seen evidence of you having great respect for my play. And given that we were close to deadline when you suggested this, and the fact that everyone was showing signs of apathy, they would absolutely not have been paying attention to an end of day wall war, so that last part is a lie as well, and more specifically, a justification for your wanting to spam the thread with information so that no one would look at you.

MTD and Saki are scumbuddies with Wicked probably.

I don't think Wicked is scum anymore.

go ISO Bipolarchemist (i quite liked the guy)... he didnt crumb the role at all! why would anyone in the right mind buy this acdude's claim????

People are afraid of killing him cause he is uncced and I really think the back-up is town.

did he crumb the role prior to his claim?

scum have fake claims so i don't think "uncced" ever means anything in a theme game.

this was unintentional

i am sorry antihero

How do you know scum have fake claims?

This seems rather fake.

[ZZZX]

ac1983fan

, why did you say that Bulbazak is scum if GG is town?

ZZZX

, who are your top four suspects?

Asked earlier but it was in my last big post so I can understand you missing it.

I got 3 of em. GG/Beast/Titus

[ZZZX]

Unsure about titus but thats what my memory tells me.

[Speedy Saki]

Normally when a thread closes, I don't go back to prior posts when the day opens back up again, especially when scum was spamming and I didn't have time to get back to it in the first place. But MS wants to be

that

kind of scumbutt, so here I go.

First things first, I replied to you regarding your argument against me. Firstly, if you didn't read it, it's your fault. Secondly, its false to say that I didn't call you out or explain how you're lying, because I did so and you didn't see it or conveniently ignored it.

1) your argument: wicked is scum because it is difficult to push a wagon on him despite many people scum reading him

2) my argument: depends on context, your statement is not true

3) you say: 'lol you are scum'

4) I give an example on how stupid your statement is

5) you go:"LOL STRAWMAN YOU TOOK MY ARGUMENT OUT OF CONTEXT"

1.) No, that was not my argument. I gave several reasons for my Wicked scumread, none of which were related to the difficulty of the wagon. As deadline was nearing though, and as I didn't like any of the other wagon, and since I knew that a lot of people had a Wicked scumread, I tried my best to push that lynch and get people to switch. Seeing as I know that several players with a Wicked scumread were huge proponents of wagon speed theory, I used that as a means to try to bring them over to my preferred wagon. It had nothing to do with why I was scumreading Wicked.

My deepest apologies. I should have rephrased it to "The statement which I disagree with".

1 man wagons but with "many people" (read:scum) calling someone scum is usually on town

On the contrary. For a player that everybody is supposedly scumreading, it has been incredibly difficult to get a wagon going. That generally points towards scum.

My argument still stands.

2.) And when saying that, you ignored all of the pushing being done to try to get a Wicked wagon and the cases on him.

Yes sir, there was indeed a lot of pushing on Wicked, which resulted in a successful maximum 2-man wagon. It took 9 to lynch. I hope you can forgive me when I ignored the Wicked "wagon" and "pushes".

3.) I stated an agreement with Titus that you were likely scum with Wicked. You are misrepping what I actually said and making it sound as if I was just scumeading you for kicks and giggles.

Aren't you? *shrugs* It appears to me that way. Oh well, everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

4.) Here's what you said:

Depends on context.

Is wicked being pushed majorly?

Is there a case against wicked?

Is someone shouting in big bold letters "lets lynch wicked he is scum"?

If none of the above, it's possible that you aren't pushing enough/they aren't true scum reads, in that town does not have him pegged as scum enough to commit. Even if a player is objectively scummy, he may be town, and it appears this may be the general (unmentioned) consensus. Nobody wants/dares to commit.

This is scum with Wicked.

I agree.

Okay, so Titus is scumread by many people.

But it is difficult to get a wagon on Titus, despite majiffy's best efforts.

According to your hard and fast blanket rule, finding it difficult to push a wagon on someone who is scum read by many, is on scum

Ergo, Titus is scum.


Therefore Titus is bussing me???


See how little sense you make?

Not only was that strawmanning my original argument (on the basis that I was never scumreading Wicked for that reason), but you then twisted said argument and used it to discredit me. That's called a misrep.

First of all, you completely dismissed my argument, which I sincerely put out to attempt to reach out to you, with "This is scum with Wicked" "I Agree". Granted, it might have been Titus's fault, but by agreeing with her, the point extends to you as well: you completely ignored and dismissed my argument to prove your statement wrong, by saying "lol you're scum". No logic, no rebuttal, no dispute, just "You are scum with Wicked". Anyone would feel slighted in this position. So although you call me out for discrediting you, that was exactly my intention in retaliation. If you can call me out for "discrediting you"... just remember the pot calling kettle black.

4.) Again, you are misrepping what I actually said by making it sound like I had no basis for what I said:

Nice strawman. You misrepped me by taking a section where I called out a common belief (I never said it was my own.) when trying to get a wagon to move from a townread to a scumread. You then mischaracterize that argument and use it to try to discredit my scumread of you. Town MS wouldn't do this. Scum MS would.

You are trying to make it sound like I have no basis for scumreading you when I actually do. You are trying to mischaracterize and discredit my arguments for why you are scum. That is a scum move.

Except that it isn't valid because you didn't consider my argument which you later discovered in 1). I disagreed with/corrected your "common belief", in return you come back with "lol you're scum". So no, I did not misrep you, I was making a point. Yes, I admit to discrediting you, but I think that's okay.

Please kindly quote and highlight for me the part which I said "wall war"

See, this is a subtle bit of manipulation on your part, because you never

said

wall war, but you certainly implied it:

Well, then the words "wall war" came from your mouth, not mine. You are misrepping me. Clear cut example.

You then proceed on to describe how wall wars

potentially

limit discussion, how it is anti-town, nobody will read them, it is a scum move, etc. Basically, you misrep me and bring it on further by placing imaginary scum motivations and magical confirmation bias on the words "wall war" which I never mentioned in the entirety of this game.

Bluntly put, misrepping me then throwing shit.

Would you like to dance, bulba? I can entertain you is guess. Just like we did in voided mafia

Here's the game you're referencing. If anybody would go and do a dual ISO of me and your hydra, they'd find that we ended up walling on each other for close to 2 game days. Hardly anyone payed attention, and it ended up taking valuable space. Here you are suggesting that we do it again. Being at the end of day 1, where we were trying to figure out who scum was, and you were just coming under suspicion, such a suggestion couldn't come at a worse time. You were essentially suggesting that we just wall and clog up the thread, and it would benefit you, because no one would be paying attention to those arguments in the first place. And the kicker is that if you were town, you wouldn't posture dancing with me so that we might come to an understanding, you'd just do it. Here you are just doing things for appearances, which means that you are scum trying to look town, rather than actually being town.

I made you dance anyway Your paragraph is moot.

In Voided we walled at each other for almost 2 day phases and nobody payed any attention to what either of us were saying. Sure we got townreads on each other by the end, but it didn't help anybody else much. And we both hadn't played with each other before, so I didn't know what to expect from you. That's not the case now, and due to the way you're acting, this is not your town game.

That game was 1 year ago. Firstly, using one game to judge my play is a very, very,

very

,

very

small sample size to reach any reliable conclusion. Secondly, using a one-year-past-game to just my play is very, very,

very

stale meta. Thirdly, I'm rather sure that we've improved to such a point since the past year to make our "war" more concise, readable and conclusive (this is a lie: I do not know if you have improved or not.) Lastly, I'm pretty sure this playerlist would pay attention to what we say this time, considering users Majiffy, pirate mollie, Titus, and probably more.

Don't you dare do this. YOU WERE THE ONE THAT FREAKING BROUGHT UP VOIDED IN THE FIRST PLACE! I am not using that game as a way to judge your play, as I've played with you a lot more since then, and that game is an anomaly as far as your play goes. Using far more recent games as a basis for your play here, I can say with certainty that it is off, especially the part where you are so grievously misrepping me. The one line about not knowing whether I've improved is not only a low blow, but a blatant lie, as you've played a lot with me, and I've seen evidence of you having great respect for my play. And given that we were close to deadline when you suggested this, and the fact that everyone was showing signs of apathy, they would absolutely not have been paying attention to an end of day wall war, so that last part is a lie as well, and more specifically, a justification for your wanting to spam the thread with information so that no one would look at you.

That game was the one we interacted the most; apart from [ONGOING GAME]. In fact, I barely remember playing with you solo in any of my past games; you were either hydra-ing with EddieFenix (cool guy), or didn't make a very big impression on me if indeed we played in recent games main account-to-main account.

"

Spam

the thread with

information

"

Is this an oxymoron?

MTD and Saki are scumbuddies with Wicked probably.

I don't think Wicked is scum anymore.

Yeah, I never did.

[Majiffy]

VOTE: bulbazak

[Wickedestjr]

ZZZX

, you think Titus is mafia even given Majiffy's result?