Micro 839: Two-in-One (its over)

[Taly]

Elsa and Irrelephant current interactions give me "eh" vibes.

I'd say meh vibes for Irrelephant.

For Elsa, it read townie - natural and well-reasoned. That surprised me, because last game we played, almost every post he made pinged me, and he made blatant setup errors. I was expecting more of the same here.

OTOH, he flipped town in that last game. And I should note that I replaced in like 80 pages into that one.

Yeah, I like the reasoning he gave, but then the same type of thing I felt odd about

Irrelephant

doing, I saw in

Elsa's

post. (filtered banter, quick back and forth with an equally quick end)

I also was expecting

Elsa

to make more commentary on my thoughts toward him and

Irrelephant

, and I'm curious why he still saw

xyzzy's

post in 30 as RVS in light of his back-and-forth with

Irrelephant

(Which I read as serious)

It's interesting that his posting here is different than his town game in the one you played (are you able to link?), do you think that could be meta-alignment indicative? I think I read somewhere that

Elsa

was an alt, and if it's of the person I'm thinking, I might have played with him before.

~

Another question to

Irrelephant

Why compromise your vote onto

Elsa

when you are making a point that double-voting/double-lynching is valuable?

And why B-7? Or did you close your eyes and pick a game?

Elsa

, why vote-back

Irrelephant

in B7 and not C-14?

[Taly]

I also like the idea

Maki

mentioned about different colors for different games.

Once people fully put forth themselves, organizing posts or parts of them under a game would help reduce miscommunication.

[Taly]

(to clarify I think Pine is scum in one game and VT in one)

This post tells me that 30 wasn't RVS

What scum-motivation have you seen in

Pine's

posts so far?

@Persivul

specifically 49

Do you think double-voting/double-lynching is a valid approach with the stated discussion so far?

And does D1 WIFOM = scum here?

[Taly]

Yeah, but...Townpings from me ought to be viewed with suspicion. Just sayin'.

So why comment on people reading you and not your thoughts on them?

[Taly]

btw, just noticed im familiar with over half the playerlist in some form c:

minus

irrelephant

and maybe

elsa

, but he's replaced in on game(s) ive flaked before ;-;

[Taly]

Or did you close your eyes and pick a game?

lol this sounded much less bitchy in my head

ill stop with the post-dump for now ;-;

[xyzzy]

for day 1 we should essentially treat this as one game. once we have things like investigation results tomorrow that changes things, and obviously if someone makes an uncountered claim in one game, we should leave that person alone, but lynching two different people seems way too easy for scum in both games to manipulate. if we settle on one person, the odds that we get a hit in at least one game go up by an enormous amount. like, if a given player is scum in one game and town in the other, if it's looking like they'll get lynched in exactly one game, they'll logically want to do everything in their power to make sure it's the town game where they die. by lynching one person in both games you deny them that opportunity. yeah, there's a pretty low chance of one person being scum in both games, so statistically it's likely to be a mislynch in one, but that same math applies to lynching anyone (no matter who dies, the odds are not in our favor). sometimes you get a mislynch. you just gotta not repeat that mistake and then you win.

[Elsa Jay]

Elsa and Irrelephant current interactions give me "eh" vibes.

I'd say meh vibes for Irrelephant.

For Elsa, it read townie - natural and well-reasoned. That surprised me, because last game we played, almost every post he made pinged me, and he made blatant setup errors. I was expecting more of the same here.

OTOH, he flipped town in that last game. And I should note that I replaced in like 80 pages into that one.

I dont remember which game in particular you mean, but if it helps for Taly, I was originally known as JaythedragonKing before I left in April and came back in September now as this account. This is the new Main, btw.

I have a faulty memory sometime, but it's easier to remember in a micro. So I'm focusing on what I have in front of me now.

Too Taly's question on my voting him back in Bird 7p, we might as well focus on 1 game, right? Switching between talking about Bird and Carbon will be distracting.

For the next 3-5. Irl days, I'm going to mainly focus on voting in Bird 7p.

If I ignored a question, I picked the ones that caught my attention the most just now.

[Irrelephant11]

Elsa

and

Irrelephant

current interactions give me "eh" vibes.

How someone thinks they should vote here is not 100% AI.

The votes and responses like:
Irrelephant: "teach me like im dub" |||||||| "duh - 'insert subjective idea we should all know here' "
and
Elsa: "why are you throwing shade at me?" |||||||| "votes back for the same game"

feels a bit forced.

Irrelephant, you seem confident on how a scum and/or town mindset would think in this situation...

Elsa, what do you think about

xyzzy's

voting?

What that I’ve said makes you feel the bolded?
Unless you’re just referring to my reason to scumread Elsa’s entrance to the thread? Do you disagree that there could be scum motivation to lynching different people in each game?
I’ve tried to think about how someone would play as s/s, s/t, or t/t and i think FA’s suggestion is very fitting for s/t

I don’t feel as strongly as FA about what “ideal play” is here but I think Pine makes good points about how separating the lynches will make it harder to hit scum

I voted Elsa with a random one of my two votes to try to show her how silly it is to only half vote (/I was kinda trying to be funny)
I do think the idea of using aritificial deadlines to play just one game at a time might be interesting

[Irrelephant11]

Or did you close your eyes and pick a game?

lol this sounded much less bitchy in my head

ill stop with the post-dump for now ;-;

I didn’t read it that way; I literally did indeed use a random vote

[Irrelephant11]

Let’s say you’re 100% certain that xyzzy/Pine is a scumteam, and you’re also 100% sure Taly/maki are a scumteam.

How did you reach that conclusion?

You're probably scum reading them for pushing low hanging fruit, making opportunistic votes, etc. Those things are specific to particular games. xyzzy/pine are probably doing those things in their scum game, but not doing them in their town game.

??
I was talking about hypothetical teams for a hypothetical scenario

[Irrelephant11]

Elsa and Irrelephant current interactions give me "eh" vibes.

I'd say meh vibes for Irrelephant.

For Elsa, it read townie - natural and well-reasoned. That surprised me, because last game we played, almost every post he made pinged me, and he made blatant setup errors. I was expecting more of the same here.

OTOH, he flipped town in that last game. And I should note that I replaced in like 80 pages into that one.

Why meh vibes for me?

[Maki Harukawa]

I think it's best to focus on one game at a time and time to break them up as clearly as we can. If someone has a town pm and a scum pt (and that's very likely odds) It should be easier to tell tone apart from game to game and we can look at someones flip from game 1 to see if we should flip them in game 2

[Elsa Jay]

Atleast it seems my "1 game at a time" idea worked out. Funally enough, we get 2 weeks total, so the first week is with the ever so slightly more complicated Bird 7p. We'll have next week to lynch in Carbon.

[Errantparabola]

Votecount 1.2

C14

Pine

(2): xyzzy, Persivul

Maki Harukawa

(1): Irrelephant11

No Lynch

(1): Maki Harukawa

Not Voting

(3): Pine, Taly, Elsa Jay

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to achieve majority.

--

B7

Pine

(2): xyzzy, Persivul

Elsa Jay

(1): Irrelephant11

Irrelephant11

(1): Elsa Jay

Not Voting

(3): Pine, Taly, Maki Harukawa

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to achieve majority.

Deadline in (expired on 2019-01-02 17:37:00)

[Taly]

@xyzzy's 56

I agree uncountered claims should be a pass, especially since this is D1, and different topics/games/lynches going on at once would be easier to create dichotomies and division within town.

But still, having one voice next game phase is less useful if we look at two games at once and try to find the interconnections.
I do understand your thought process more now, though.

[Taly]

What that I’ve said makes you feel the bolded?
Unless you’re just referring to my reason to scumread Elsa’s entrance to the thread?

Do you disagree that there could be scum motivation to lynching different people in each game?

I’ve tried to think about how someone would play as s/s, s/t, or t/t and i think FA’s suggestion is very fitting for s/t

Yeah, I was meaning your interaction with

Elsa

.

And no, I do see potential scum motivation in lynching different people. But I also see town. (For reasons why I think double-lynching wasn't a good option in my opening posts) 34 I think someone's idea on

"ideal play"

here is NAI to some degree. Which was why I felt off about you/

Elsa's

interaction, as if it were a forced dichotomy.

I voted Elsa with a random one of my two votes to try to show her how silly it is to only half vote (/I was kinda trying to be funny)
I do think the idea of using aritificial deadlines to play just one game at a time might be interesting

But I feel better about your intentions now with this.

In that case; just think if this were one game for a moment; what are your reads?

[Taly]

I think it's best to focus on one game at a time and time to break them up as clearly as we can. If someone has a town pm and a scum pt (and that's very likely odds) It should be easier to tell tone apart from game to game and we can look at someones flip from game 1 to see if we should flip them in game 2

I do like this idea the best thus far, it takes into account what everyone has thought about double-lynches/votes and how to interpret them.

This pushes everyone to be on the same page, and could reduce the muddling of information between games, and mislynches/misleading arguments.

I want to clarify something, first. (But despite mod's answer, I favor this idea.)

@Mod

Say, one lynch for D1 happens, but the other game hasn't lynched yet.

Would we get the results of that lynch immediately? Before D1 ends for the other game? Or do we get 2 lynch-flips at once, at the end of both dayphases?

[Taly]

Forgot to mention this in last 3 posts.

I'm OK with double-lynching/double-voting if we do it the way

Maki

introduced for reasons I just stated.

(Also, I typed up the previous 3 posts before I sent them so people can see my chronological line of thought.)

This game is becoming a quick thrill and I didn't quite expect it.

[Elsa Jay]

Tfw you mention the idea of focusing on 1 game but Maki comes in and sweeps up the credit.

[Pine]

So hey y'all. I'm doing a new thing this game. I'm a VT/VT. Discuss.

The only town motivation to declare that would be to play D1 wifom bullshit like A50 does.

I like lynching A50 early.

VOTE: 1 Pine
VOTE: 2 Pine

Nope, not the only reason

Yeah, but...Townpings from me ought to be viewed with suspicion. Just sayin'.

So why comment on people reading you and not your thoughts on them?

Keeping it light so far. *thumbsup*

for day 1 we should essentially treat this as one game. once we have things like investigation results tomorrow that changes things

, and obviously if someone makes an uncountered claim in one game, we should leave that person alone, but lynching two different people seems way too easy for scum in both games to manipulate. if we settle on one person, the odds that we get a hit in at least one game go up by an enormous amount. like, if a given player is scum in one game and town in the other, if it's looking like they'll get lynched in exactly one game, they'll logically want to do everything in their power to make sure it's the town game where they die. by lynching one person in both games you deny them that opportunity. yeah, there's a pretty low chance of one person being scum in both games, so statistically it's likely to be a mislynch in one, but that same math applies to lynching anyone (no matter who dies, the odds are not in our favor). sometimes you get a mislynch. you just gotta not repeat that mistake and then you win.

That said, this feels scummy, especially bolded. Sounds like bad faith gamesolving.

[Elsa Jay]

Pine, how do you feel about xyzzy and persival putting you at L-2 in both games at once for you claiming early?

Who is more scummy? For consistancy, we're focused on Bird right now, not Carbon.

[Pine]

I feel like prettt much anyone who votes in a Micro this small is reckless, but paradoxically I find it hard to fault them for it, given prevailing culture regarding RVS/early game votes. It’s pretty null.

I don’t have a problem with Persivul yet, and xyzzy’s vote isn’t why I’m suspicious of them.

[Persivul]

Pine, how do you feel about xyzzy and persival putting you at L-2 in both games at once for you claiming early?

How do

you

feel about it?

[Elsa Jay]

Pine, how do you feel about xyzzy and persival putting you at L-2 in both games at once for you claiming early?

How do

you

feel about it?

Ahh, the old "I know you are but what am I?" Trick. Amazing skillset to have.