Open 707 - JK9++ [Endgame]

sheepsaysmeep · Post Post #500 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 2:58 pm

pagetop

momo · Post Post #501 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 2:59 pm

In post 497, sheepsaysmeep wrote:i am strongly against walls

You can be against walls but if you wanna support town, you have to post or mention multiple quotes, synthesize that evidence, and then go on to analyze it...

You can't just make offhand comments and expect that to sit well with people, forget benefit the town

You have to make your own reads, dive through the text...

Almost50 · Post Post #502 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:08 pm

In post 489, JaydragonKing wrote:Bonus if you want to include your top 3 town reads/leans as well.

That would be giving scum a road map on whom to shoot, since almost everybody looks lynchable as of now, so I'd rather not give any TRs at this time.

Honestly, my TOP SR is still UnaBombaH. I just can't get over my initial read on him and he's not helping me improve that read at all.

It is hard to see who's scummier than whom elsewhere. I mean, I could say Creature, but that's probably me conf!biased. Fitz posp to say Townie things then disappears like a sea lion popping up to take a breath before they dive back in the big blue ocean. Kop could also be included, but I forgot how he plays in general (it's been a really long while since we last played together).

Probably SRing Redflavor more than I do Impede now, but it doesn't mean I TR Impede either.

Shall I go on??

Almost50 · Post Post #503 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:09 pm

Forgo to add Assembler for his awkward vote on Jay. Probably me 2nd strongest SR after Una.

Almost50 · Post Post #504 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:17 pm

In post 496, momo wrote:ugh VOTE: Creature

What is happening to me

I can do that.

VOTE: Creature

momo · Post Post #505 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:19 pm

I feel like there were surprisingly few (none I believe) reactions to my 492

I implore that all of you go an read it as it contains my full restructured views of this game.....

It is my belief that it will be highly informative

(Btw, I think that the post tag is my new favorite feature. Y'all can use it instead of quoting. For those of you who do not know, it can be done like this)

Code: Select all

 [post][/post]

Pedit: A50, good to see you on the Creature wagon...i think that creature flipping red would further confirm red as scum....

JaydragonKing · Post Post #506 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:22 pm

This has suddenly turned around quite a bit, from intent to hammer on me too the wagon I started on Creature to finally pick up momentum.

Jesus, If I was only a Vanilla Townie, I would have been fucked.

Mathdino · Post Post #507 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:31 pm

Spoiler: List of Votes

Spoiler: Only the Jay wagon

Players who were on the wagon:

Mathdino (RVS and serious)
UnaBombaH (only RVS, twice)
havingfitz (RVS and serious)
Creature (only RVS)
RedFlavor (only RVS)
sheep (serious)
Impede (serious)
momo (serious)
Assemble (serious)

Players who weren't on the wagon:

UnaBombaH (only RVS, seems to think Jay is wrong town, willing to policy lynch him, but seems to think he's town in 390)
Almost50 (claims to have known he was vig)
Hawk (wasn't here for basically any of the wagon)
Creature (no comment)
RedFlavor ("If jay was wolf he probably would not say something about survivor challange so please do not vote him")
Kop (feels like Jay is easy mislynch and is low-info, says we can just lynch him later, prefers voting Impede)

Mathdino · Post Post #508 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:42 pm

So my best guess is... 2 scum off the wagon and 1 scum (Assemble) on the wagon. Something like that.

This reflects badly on Una, I'll concede that. His behaviour around Jay is really weird.
Giving A50 the benefit of the doubt. That's not a lynch that's happening today.
Hawk is null in relation to the wagon.
Creature hasn't contributed shit, so of course he wasn't on the wagon.
RedFlavor had kind of a random reason to strong townread Jay. Might be confbias but this counts as the "scum who suspiciously knows Jay is town".
Kop had really good reasons for being off the wagon I think. However, the Kop-scum situation I can think of is "Jay might be SK, so let's wait til tomorrow to see if we should lynch him". Paranoia.

Of those on the wagon:
I'm town. ISO me if you wanna do my blurb.
havingfitz had a whole bunch of reasons. His vote seemed to have purpose.
sheep's vote was explicitly for pressure. Says he got a bad OMGUS afterward. I believe this.
Impede voted in response to Jay's case on Creature, says it was full of OMGUS. Didn't like the survival play. Impede is a controversial topic. Not gonna go too far into this until I have something more readable.
momo fucking clearly believed he was onto something.
Assemble's vote was obviously the most opportunistic point to jump on.

momo · Post Post #509 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:58 pm

In post 508, Mathdino wrote:So my best guess is... 2 scum off the wagon and 1 scum (Assemble) on the wagon. Something like that.

This reflects badly on Una, I'll concede that. His behaviour around Jay is really weird.
Giving A50 the benefit of the doubt. That's not a lynch that's happening today.
Hawk is null in relation to the wagon.
Creature hasn't contributed shit, so of course he wasn't on the wagon.
RedFlavor had kind of a random reason to strong townread Jay. Might be confbias but this counts as the "scum who suspiciously knows Jay is town".
Kop had really good reasons for being off the wagon I think. However, the Kop-scum situation I can think of is "Jay might be SK, so let's wait til tomorrow to see if we should lynch him". Paranoia.

Of those on the wagon:
I'm town. ISO me if you wanna do my blurb.
havingfitz had a whole bunch of reasons. His vote seemed to have purpose.
sheep's vote was explicitly for pressure. Says he got a bad OMGUS afterward. I believe this.
Impede voted in response to Jay's case on Creature, says it was full of OMGUS. Didn't like the survival play. Impede is a controversial topic. Not gonna go too far into this until I have something more readable.
momo fucking clearly believed he was onto something.
Assemble's vote was obviously the most opportunistic point to jump on.

I too SR both Assemble and Creature but I am surprised that you are putting Assmeble in your top 3. While it is suspicious, Assemble is a known lurker. Like 100% of the time.

Creature · Post Post #510 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:58 pm

In post 508, Mathdino wrote:Creature hasn't contributed shit

I did contribute, just not the way you want.

Sometimes I don't gather scumreads, but rather I eliminate townreads and see who's left.

momo · Post Post #511 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:00 pm

In post 510, Creature wrote:
In post 508, Mathdino wrote:Creature hasn't contributed shit
I did contribute, just not the way you want.

Sometimes I don't gather scumreads, but rather I eliminate townreads and see who's left.

Creature, your iso is the scumiest in the game...you are pushing ish but you are not truly contributing, not truly committing....that's classic scum and you know it

Creature · Post Post #512 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:01 pm

Well, I could have contributed to scum by voting Jay or Red.

Creature · Post Post #513 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:01 pm

If not Jay or Red, who do we wagon then?

Creature · Post Post #514 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:06 pm

Gotta sleep now.

sheepsaysmeep · Post Post #515 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:13 pm

In post 513, Creature wrote:If not Jay or Red, who do we wagon then?

who do you want to wagon

Mathdino · Post Post #516 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:23 pm

In post 492, momo wrote:For a townbloc I have me, mathdino, a50, and even Impede. He was the first to post his thoughts in support of my attempt to catch Jay but also the first to point out the flaws..But even when a50 made a strong towny post against me (which I maintain as false) he didn't do what scum would do an move with the changing tides. He quoted the post and picked it apart. That's what town would do. They would stay to what they believe.

This is somewhat of a self-centred read (I do this all the time). The tide wasn't changing or turning against you. People were EXTREMELY clear on you being town. Scum, if they wanted to fit in, would continue to "townread" you.

I agree with most of the rest of your post but I don't agree on outright townreading Impede yet.

I can grudgingly accept the A50 argument.

Sounds like today's gonna end up Creature vs RedFlavor vs Assemble (all lynches I'm okay with, thankfully). I disagree with whoever claimed that Assemble is always a lurker and is thus a bad vote. I'm not voting him for lurking. I was townreading him before his Jay vote. The Jay vote was scummy; you can read low-activity players all the same as high-activity.

Hawk · Post Post #517 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:51 pm

Omg finally caught up y'all like to wall post too much.

So jay is town.
I'm glad I wasn't here cause I would have voted him after momo' s remarkable display of out there logic that I wouldn't expect from scum ever.

Creatures lurking but usually at least puts forth things like forming his townlist. In the one scum game where I was scum with Momo and we had a hard distance created between the two of us Creature was just as quiet and Lurky but put forth a different kind of effort maybe he's turned off by all the walls. Idk.

Fitz I'll wait to evaluate further but I think he has a scumtell that I've noticed about his meta but don't want to say until I'm more certain...

Almost50 seems townish... not sure what to take on him. Up until his reaction to sheep voting Red I thought it was fine. All of that emotion in saying things are bad and players are playing bad felt fake on first read. Thus Townish? Maybe more null... idk that was the main scummy thing I saw maybe I'm just reading too much into it.

Sheep is a weak poster but I to disdain these walls. Makes quoting hard and analysis harder

Una is forgettable even when I read their posts so that feels scummy.

Assemble is probably scum. The vote post is super forced and bad.

VOTE: Assemble

Impede I need to look over again. And I could also do Creature.

Mathdino · Post Post #518 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 6:02 pm

Feels bad. I think Kop and I are the only players you didn't mention in your catchup.

Having trouble reading Kop through the new lens of Jay being town. Thoughts on us?

Hawk · Post Post #519 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 6:12 pm

Your ISO is very extensive and I've been townleaning you since you suggested the Hider thing. I didn't see a reason for scum to post something like that and be beneficial unless you were fishing for role info. It seemed very not scummy. But WIFOM you could have done it to make us think that..

I'll ISO Kop. I would have caught up sooner but everytime I tried to at work y'all would have huge fucking walls that I needed to read.

JaydragonKing · Post Post #520 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 6:16 pm

Time stands still for no Man, my friend.

sheepsaysmeep · Post Post #521 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 6:24 pm

i wouldnt lock jay town, just out of the lynch pile
dont think there is wifom to the hider thing
i will actually do smth productive later but im busy as hell today and tmrw with the start of the soccer season and schoolwork

Hawk · Post Post #522 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 6:27 pm

In post 322, Kop wrote:VOTE: Impede

This is a wagon outside of Jay/red that I'd like to take off. I don't necessarily scum read Jay, but I just feel he's being hard pressed into a mislynch, I just don't think scum would be that stupid to focus all of the attention onto themselves in the manner he has done since gamestart. I obviously wouldn't like to think that we could possibly go into LYLO with him but I'm wanting to go into different areas rather than focus on him for days on end.

Impede on the other hand, has given me nothing to note that I could town read him for, and I do like the case Fitz has put out against Impede. Last few pages that I have been reading, his name was popping out quite a bit. His vote on Jay doesn't make any sense to me at all, I wouldn't call it opportunistic, it felt more of a let go vote. If this wagon takes off and Impede flips scum, I would 100% go back for Jay because of how that vote felt to me.

Another point I didn't quite work out, he stated that he would hide behind Momo, why would you hide behind Momo considering he had him in his town read in post #152? Why would you not hide behind Fitz, or Una who you were scum reading? I understand hiding behind your town reads would give you a better chance of living, but also confirming your reads, doesn't give anything to gamestate because you don't really confirm anything, because you could be scum lying about being the hider and the hider might not even be in the game.

Ignoring stuff before this for now as I'm not sure how AI it was but it did feel fairly forced I remember his response to your readlist felt weak in terms of generating discussion but maybe the effort was there.

This is fairly decent. I feel like the last points about where impede chose to hide is fine but more along the lines I would bet Impede just wasn't thinking about it since he's not the hider or just didn't see the role working as a pseudo investigative the way the hypoclaims work.

I think you mentioned that later dino.

In post 327, Kop wrote:
In post 323, Mathdino wrote:Quick thing, I picked fitz first and I encouraged everyone to pick different hider targets so it wouldn't draw the NK to any one person in particular.

Impede case isn't bad. It's convinced me out of a townread. Hasn't convinced me into a scumread. I see a lot of flak for his interaction with Jay, which I actually like. Seems natural to me.
I understand that point on what your trying to make, but from my understanding, it would be useful if they went with there feels, rather than 'oh he's took him, I'll take someone else'. That way I can see what they are feeling and not going with the flow of the game.

I chose mine, without even looking at others, and went with what I feel I would have done if this were the real case.

I feel like impede should have responded to this and I'll need to go look and see if he did shortly.

In post 330, Kop wrote:
In post 323, Mathdino wrote:Quick thing, I picked fitz first and I encouraged everyone to pick different hider targets so it wouldn't draw the NK to any one person in particular.

Impede case isn't bad. It's convinced me out of a townread. Hasn't convinced me into a scumread. I see a lot of flak for his interaction with Jay, which I actually like. Seems natural to me.
How do you read Impede right now?

I understand you have your sights set on Jay, and I do agree with you with what you are saying, but personally I'd rather go for someone who can give us more information going into day two so we can get a stronger read on others, I feel lynching Jay on day one, isn't going to give us anything and reads won't be as strong as they would by lynching someone who gives us more. Jay will never be shot, so that is going to obviously be in the back of everyones mind and someone we don't want in LYLO, but he can easily be done on day 2 or 3 if we aren't further forward in lynching scum.

This feels very good considering Jay claimed after this. (I think need to double check) No reason for scum to defend a potential mislynch like this and push towards another. Kop has been low activity so he would naturally look null to scummy for me so I don't see why his few posts would show as much effort towards finding something to talk about.

Pretty null but I could give it a town lean.

Pedit: That it does not Jay. but I would literally read a few quotes look at an ISO and come back to a new page and have to reread so forgive me. I finally gave up and am getting ready to sleep now. Had dinner watched some TV figured I'd catch up when everyone had calmed down a bit hopefully and I had more time for read.

PPedit: Reasonable Sheep. I mean it's a stretchy Wifom. But I would town read that shit 99 times out of a 100.

Well I meant for today. He's locked out of my lynch pool today. He could always be SK so there's that.

Mathdino · Post Post #523 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:13 pm

Impede's meta is failing to respond to accusations/questions/hypotheses directed at/about him. I'm guessing you're gonna find that he didn't respond. I'm guessing he just doesn't care about discussions about him.

And yeah there's really no point in acting as if we'll later have to lynch Jay. If the moment comes, we will, but in the meantime, acting like he's conftown is the way to go.

Thanks for the Kop analysis. You also mentioned Red offhand but not your actual thoughts on his alignment. It seems like he's everyone's 2nd or 3rd scummiest candidate but his wagon is on the backburner. As per Kop's analysis, his alignment (like Jay's) is gonna be a centerpiece in VCA/associatives going forward IMO. Thoughts?

sheepsaysmeep · Post Post #524 (ISO) » Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:22 pm

i want to do shit but i need to do homework