Mini 1454 - GAME OVER

[Amrun]

Aj I haven't read the spoiler but fucking lol

This entire game is new players. Literally. The whole game. Was I just supposed to self vote and hope for the best?

Fucking kill this scum. Lol


Also ns is town and he's totally right about kthxbye but obviously aj is the common denominator so let's kill him till he's dead.

[Aj The Epic]

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Amrun

This slot needs more attention.

Typical Fuzzy vote. To be noted, he finally took off his own Bubbajack vote, long after bubba was town. Also, Notscience would vote later and Fuzzy's next post is the post where he switches to Notscience.

Fuzzy, do you still think bubba is scum?

Yes.

And yet you would vote for the same person he is?

Amrun, you probably should read it. I have this game, imo, locked.

More reason Marc is town.

Aw fuck. Hookerpunch isn't scum.

Unvote

Notacience is surface making a lot of scum noise, but he also seems to not be reading very deeply, so perhaps it is just noise. Still, I do not object to this lynch.

Fuzzybutternut, while it is questionable if he thinks about much at all, is still reading town ish to me.

Vote: JKMathews

I really disliked his recent post/entrance. As much as I appreciate him for not saying anything horrendous, his post is a lot of IoA and does absolutely nothing to advance the game. He's active lurking and not allowing himself to be read.

VLA until Tuesday

Work related. This will be most weekends, fyi. I may pop in if I have the time but it's a big weekend.

Fyi to everyone: noob is not an insult and I never intended it as such. Saying I am more experienced is not having an ego. It is being factual. Anyone with eyes can see it. I am not saying I am some amazingly skilled player, but I have a LOT of games and experience. Somehow saying so and correcting people about serious gaffes in theory is condescending. Sorry if you think so but idc really. Know that I am not trying to insult or imply you're terrible or whatever.

yeah, VOTE: notscience

still interested in what the replacement says.

And really. What kind of reaction was this? From what I had seen with Amrun, I expected SOMETHING to come of it. Nothing, again.

Throwing shit on the wall and hoping it sticks is usually indicative of scum.

Hmm... So, what have you been doing all of day 1 if not exactly that?


This was well shorter because Amrun's one long post, I responded to that day. Also, she went off to that Balto meet and has been a lot quieter the second half of the day. But still, there seems to be a definitive connection between Fuzzy's movements and her own.

This is why I would rather take someone legitimately scummy than NS. The last game I played with him, we had to work to avoid lynching him because he was 'incredibly anti-town'. I think a couple of players even refuse to play games with him right now because of his style so I hold firm that this is just general NS, anti-town and proud of it.

[Aj The Epic]

And I forgot to spoiler that.

[Rob14]

Vote Count #2.1:

Nobody Special:

kthxbye, JuanJuan, jon_h61 (3)

Aj The Epic:

Amrun, marcmann2, notscience (3)

JuanJuan:

fuzzybutternut (1)

Amrun:

Aj The Epic (1)

Not Voting:

bubbajack8, Nobody Special, AngelInFreezer

With 11 alive, it takes 6 players to reach a lynch.

V/LA:

None

Deadline:

(expired on 2013-06-18 11:00:00)

[bubbajack8]

Aj's town.

Nobody Special's hammer without a claim concerns me.

Aj pointed out Amrun's "KBW" tell. Which intrigued me, I hadn't thought of that.

I could see Amrun being scum still.

I could see Nobody Special being scum as well.

I don't understand why the replacement was killed? I understand no one was really after him, so it's rather.... interesting. I guess scum chose a safe kill? I don't really know....

I'm voting Amrun simply for being on my largest town read, and being one of my biggest scumspects, but I will be looking at Nobody Special.

VOTE: Amrun

I mean honesty Amrun's contributed jack squat. And look at hi9s reaction to AJ's spoiler.

Aj I haven't read the spoiler but fucking lol

This entire game is new players. Literally. The whole game. Was I just supposed to self vote and hope for the best?

Fucking kill this scum. Lol


Also ns is town and he's totally right about kthxbye but obviously aj is the common denominator so let's kill him till he's dead.

Instead of BITCHING and MOANING about it being all new players either get the FUCK out, or actually contribute. /end soapbox.

Also I find it interesting how Amruns "didn't read it" but knew AJ was bringing up his attack on new players. KBW tell.

Also Hoopla was on Juan's ass like the whole game. I'm beginning to think scum killed Hoopla to frame Juan or to cover Juan's ass. Or it could just be because no one was really looking at him, and he was on Juan's butt. Fuzzy's vote is either really scummy, or reallly towny..... xD

[Kthxbye]

I really don't think NS is scum. His hammer was too anti-town to be actual scum.

And this is the problem with townies lately. No, if you're town, you shouldn't do anti-town shit and just expect people to think ^that. Guess what, that sets up scum to do the exact same. 'His actions were way too scummy to be from scum' is just a fucking dumb way to think.

[Amrun]

I should read the wall because you have the game locked? Are you implying you will convince me to vote for myself?

Thanks for treating me as town. Lol. This is literally one of the funniest pushes I've ever read.

I will read your wall probably at some point. I'm on my way home from balto meet now. Though after tomorrow I go out of town again for the weekend (as usual).

I'm hoping by the time I get around to that shit you'll be dead because its actually sad and I can't see any combination of scum team that does not involve you.

P-edit: bubba jack you are town but legitimately retarded if you think I have not "contributed" to this game. I would ask if you are on crack but you seem too genuinely convinced.

I'm not complaining that the game is full of newbies. That's fine. I'm saying that criticizing me for voting newbies on this game full of newbies is the most hilariously bad push so far on this game and considering this game contains a push that is "my rvs votes are always on scum" that's fucking saying a lot.


Hahahahahahahjdidnsksnsisj

This game is the best

Pedit 2: ns' hammer wasn't actually scummy at all lololololol

[fuzzybutternut]

Aj, you say you have this game locked. Who then, is scum?

UNVOTE:
Amrun is town.

Btw, AJ, that doesn't make Marc town, like, at all.

Hmm. Aj scum seems plausible.

[fuzzybutternut]

Also, AJ, you realize I've been in more games than you just about, right?

[Aj The Epic]

Yes, but this is five together. I doubt anyone here has been in every game with someone else. Meta is a general overview, not a post-by-post 'what happened here' deal.

I also stated who was scum. Or did you avoid reading as well?

[fuzzybutternut]

Nope. Didn't avoid reading. Weird. I think Meta is the exact opposite.

[Kthxbye]

Amrun, let me guess, NS's hammer wasn't scummy because it was too scummy to be scum? If not, explain how his play yesterday is pro town exactly.

[Amrun]

"Not scummy" = "pro-town." That's just not how the game works.

I don't want to discuss theory because it isn't relative to anyone's alignment except kthxbye for trying to draw me into such a pointless discussion. I don't think NS' hammer in any way indicates that he is scum rather than town. Not only is that not how ns plays as scum, it is not how anyone would play as scum. Action that is more likely to originate from town rather than scum can never be scummy, even if you deem that particular action to have harmed the town in some way (which I don't really in this case, for the record).

[Kthxbye]

My vote isn't coming off NS till he's dead.

[Amrun]

Yeah, because you're not scumhunting. I get it.

[bubbajack8]

I'm not complaining that the game is full of newbies. That's fine. I'm saying that criticizing me for voting newbies on this game full of newbies is the most hilariously bad push so far on this game and considering this game contains a push that is "my rvs votes are always on scum" that's fucking saying a lot.

Don't even try to BS and say "I haven't complained"

i think

i think i accidentally walked into a newbie game

Sorry if it OFFENDS anyone to say that this game is filled almost exclusively with people who are noobs relative to me. When I say people are incompetent, I only mean that they are incompetent due to being noobs as far as I know, btw.

I don't find "noob" offensive. It means that you are inexperienced on MS and therefore don't follow norms and meta and must be read very differently. Everyone is a noob for a while. I was. I still am, compared to many players on this site. But in the context of this game? No. And I didn't realize I was signing up for this.

Go on pretending "I'm not contributing" when I'm one of the very few people actually doing anything in this game and posting and doing shit. (You're another, so thanks for that.)

I'm so frustrated with this game. I don't know how to play with people that VOTING IS SCUMMY and don't know what RVS is but are ALSO too arrogant to understand that they are relatively inexperienced. One or two is different, but when it's literally everyone that's like... what the hell. That's why there are SEs and ICs in newbie games. You need a mix of experience levels to keep a game moving, ideally.

^Juan, that's fine and there's nothing shameful about that. I don't mind playing with noobs usually but uh, some people in this game trying to insist INDIGNANTLY that basic tenets of theory are wrong, or scummy, is grating on my nerves. I'll try to get a handle on it a little better... Blegh.

Fyi to everyone: noob is not an insult and I never intended it as such. Saying I am more experienced is not having an ego. It is being factual. Anyone with eyes can see it. I am not saying I am some amazingly skilled player, but I have a LOT of games and experience. Somehow saying so and correcting people about serious gaffes in theory is condescending. Sorry if you think so but idc really. Know that I am not trying to insult or imply you're terrible or whatever.

Also Who the fuck criticized you for voting newbies?

Read the spoiler here. I've snipped out a lot of it, he's not attacking you for "voting new players" he's attacking you for attacking new players, and yet ignoring fuzzy.

Spoiler:

bubbajack

serious question

have you ever played this game before

KBW tell. (Actually, this tell probably has someone else termed to it, but this is my personal name for it: Attacking experience. Could be used specifically for people on Bubba) I'll go into this later and explain why this isn't null.

Angel, so he's not terrible, so him using OMGUS as a serious accusation means he's scum and not just dumb?

--Knows about the vote.

Follow on bubba. Not so much on notscience.

Whiteknight the noob is MORE COMMON in town, though not unheard of in scum.

VOTE: Hookerpunch

For not voting your suspects.

Lol nope. All of this work on Bubba and this jump? Someone's wagon is slowing down too much.

I don't like Amrun trying to get who he thinks the noob is lynched. I think he's saying I'm a noob as an excuse to lynch me for voting him. Which is an epic OMGUS. And pretty damn scummy.

Look, you're legitimately terrible at this game and also inexperienced.

a) I didn't even know you were voting me for me and I will never, ever care.

b) OMGUS is not even remotely a scum tell.

c) being noob isn't a reason to lynch someone. It's actually a reason not to vote for you if you just have no fucking clue what you are doing. You're insisting that you're competent, but your actions don't even approach competent. So why is that? Is it because you are just mistaken, and are incompetent? Or is it because you are still too new to know how to fake town competence as scum? In other words, are you just always terrible, or are you terrible because you're scum? So it's really quite important to ascertain your level of experience and other's opinions of your general play -- because I actually care about determining your alignment and reading other people's posts, which you either can't or don't.

A. I don't believe one word of that bullshit.

B. (I didn't even know you were voting me, but OMGUS isn't a scumtell anyway.)

C. If being a noob isn't a reason to vote me, why the fuck are you still on me? You say I'm incompetent at this game, yet you keep voting me. Now you say people who are incompatant shouldn't be voted. So which one is it?

I read other people's post, I derped up once. Whoopdy fucking doo.

Read my games. I hate using it, but read my fucking games.

-snip games-

I'm not incompetent, I think you are the incompatant one, What real reason have you given for voting me? Absolutely none.

VOTE: Hookerpunch

For not voting your suspects.

Yo bro, you should read.

These points are beautiful. Especially the A and B contradiction. Amrun was DISCUSSING the vote earlier in the thread. (Post 38). Now, let's talk about this KBW tell I am working on. (It's a definite truth, fyi, I just need it to catch on).

Amrun has attacked Bubba mainly for inexperience/newness, even if she says she hadn't. As stated in many of these posts, she thinks this is a legitimate reason to lynch, apparently. One of the funniest posts in this thread is where she attacked Notscience for advocating a policy lynch, even though notscience probably has never heard of it and Amrun's reasoning is policy lynching.

Now, why is this scummy? Because the correct play by 'experienced town' is if you think a player is that bad, get a replacement. Notice, though, how Amrun never questions Fuzzy for it, though his play is perhaps worse than Bubba's. This is what really strikes me as weird: You might lynch scum if you knew Bubba was scum, but he was reading frustrated townie, and after this post, very much town. You don't advocate policy lynches on slots that are town and can just replace out. You're also supposed to be unbiased with this approach, which means Fuzzy should've been under the same pressure. As with Notscience, but I think that comes later.

Bubba, scum can be incompetent too. And PS I'm not even voting you anymore and I wasn't at the time of your reply.

Here's the justification for no replacement request? Scum can be incompetent. Sure, anyone can be.Her last sentence reads that she wants nothing to do with him.

While bubba's wagon is probably more advanced than it should be on page 2, equating it to an RVS wagon is really unrepresentative.

Notscience, how carefully have you read

?

Enough to see that he has done nothing that seems extremely scummy. Not to mention, I don't take much of RVS seriously.

ANYTHING with a reason, however tenuous, is not RVS.

Lrn2RVS

.

Oh thank you, you have revealed to me how rude people can truly be. It feels like RVS to me, show me some solid reasoning and you can prove your point there.

I qualify RVS until people start to tunnel and ACTUALLY get answers. Js.

Well, unfortunately, RVS is a term with a discrete meaning that is not this.

Commence attack on notscience for newness.

Yep yep.
Problems?

Yes. I like your reasoning for an early wagon. It's good to get the game going. It's not something you take to the bank.

You're not even bothering to engage your page 4 lynch target.

Even if we lynch bubba AND he flips red, a page 4 lynch is STILL a suboptimal lynch for town because it's low content.

This is coaching. I can tell that amrun really, really hates this post. It's pretty obvious, but she's got to stop fuzzy. Notice instead of the standard attack on inexperience and snide comments, this is a teaching, not a sarcastic remark. The tone is way too different.

I didn't mean that one should never vote for noobs. I meant saying that you shouldn't vote a noob simply for noobish behavior (ie don't vote someone for not knowing what RVS is).

And YES, I was saying that people should vote, and that isn't scummy and the fact that you think it is...

Sorry if it OFFENDS anyone to say that this game is filled almost exclusively with people who are noobs relative to me. When I say people are incompetent, I only mean that they are incompetent due to being noobs as far as I know, btw.

I don't find "noob" offensive. It means that you are inexperienced on MS and therefore don't follow norms and meta and must be read very differently. Everyone is a noob for a while. I was. I still am, compared to many players on this site. But in the context of this game? No. And I didn't realize I was signing up for this.

Go on pretending "I'm not contributing" when I'm one of the very few people actually doing anything in this game and posting and doing shit. (You're another, so thanks for that.)

I'm so frustrated with this game. I don't know how to play with people that VOTING IS SCUMMY and don't know what RVS is but are ALSO too arrogant to understand that they are relatively inexperienced. One or two is different, but when it's literally everyone that's like... what the hell. That's why there are SEs and ICs in newbie games. You need a mix of experience levels to keep a game moving, ideally.

Look at this massive post dedicated to subtly gain power over new players. Whether stated or not, she's taking an IC slot here. Even though GIF, myself, NS all currently exist in this game at that time.

And the AtE feels really weak. Surprisingly, she tries to appease Bubba, who just voted for her.

Vote:Amrun

So, through 8 pages, the majority of your posts go after new players. Let's continue this epic story.

I'm voting Amrun simply for being on my largest town read, and being one of my biggest scumspects, but I will be looking at Nobody Special.

VOTE: Amrun

I mean honesty Amrun's contributed jack squat. And look at hi9s reaction to AJ's spoiler.

Aj I haven't read the spoiler but fucking lol

This entire game is new players. Literally. The whole game. Was I just supposed to self vote and hope for the best?

Fucking kill this scum. Lol


Also ns is town and he's totally right about kthxbye but obviously aj is the common denominator so let's kill him till he's dead.

Instead of BITCHING and MOANING about it being all new players either get the FUCK out, or actually contribute. /end soapbox.

Also I find it interesting how Amruns "didn't read it" but knew AJ was bringing up his attack on new players. KBW tell.

I also followed Aj's tell. And said it was a vote for you being on my largest town read, and being my biggest scumspect.

Both arguments that

1. You haven't complained

and

2. That we are "criticizing you for voting newbies" is utter bullshit.

I don't understand why you act like everyone in this game doesn't know what's going on. But let me just point out your mistakes to you, and the town players who WILL understand your total bullshit is scummy. Some will see you are trying to say I'm a "newb" or "incompetent" so that YOU don't look scummy. So that people will just brush me off.

Person A: ____ is scum.

Person B: Person A is a newb and incompetent.

Person B is essentially saying "DON'T LISTEN TO HIM. I'M SO TOWN OMG. HE'S JUST INCOMPETENT DON'T LISTEN TO HIM."

In short Amrun needs to be lynched.

Seeing if this works...

[bubbajack8]

Rob, if you could try to fix that, that'd be great. I'll PM you a fixed one and we'll see if it works.

Fixed. ~Rob

[Kthxbye]

Yeah, because you're not scumhunting. I get it.

Obviously you do not in fact "get it"

[fuzzybutternut]

Hey, Bubba, that case there that you just made against Amrun, yeah. It's shit.
Js.

95% of my games on site i've been called "newb" or "incompetent." I was town and they were town.

[Aj The Epic]

Seem to remember JasonWazza pushing the newb card.

[bubbajack8]

Hey fuzzy, Read this game.

Spoiler:

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... er_sort=Go

More of KBW's attack on me as I call her scum, and TELL me that she was town.

Spoiler:

VOTE: Bubba

He's doing really bad right now.

I called you squarely before everyone else you numbskull.

@Bubba: Your transition from party mafia to forum mafia is not going well. You should probably have tried the newbie queue first. Nothing wrong with being tough on a newbie. If you can get yourself in a mess you can get yourself out. Now I've stated my reasons ad am keeping my vote on you for the time being. Get it?

It's pretty obvious bubba isn't listening, so we should just
A) Lynch him now
Or
B) Just Stop talking to him and let him live in his own little world where everyone is scummy but him because they post actual content but he sees it as filler.

I think bubba just needs a high five



















In the face.

P-edit OY MY GOD. stop posting bubba. You are acting like a dumbass here.

Can we please just replace this guy or something?

Slightly, but I agree with him (for the most part)
He's definitely and experienced player IMO.

Bubba. LEAVE. PLEASE. Your posts are makin my eyes bleed and making me getter dumber by the minute.

Bubba:


TAKE A LESSON FROM IT AND THINK BEFORE YOU POST

Pedit: Ninja'd by Super

You went from saying he's hardbuddying me to I'm hardbuddying him. Make up your damn mind, scumBubba.

Bubba:
1: I have a reason. Im not gonna have Internet till Friday or Saturday.
2: I want you to leave because you are being an idiot who's acting like he doesn't know how to play.


I may post today. But put me on VLA starting tomorrow, please

AJ is an idiot already.

keybladewielder: mafia goon

If I need to literally point out the similarities... then wow you guys are blind.

[Kthxbye]

Ffs, it's called a preview button...

[bubbajack8]

It's called laziness. I swear I hit the /. But I guess not.

[Amrun]

Bubba, in case you have recently learned to read but don't quite have the hang of it as is evidently the case, none of the things you quoted are actually complaining. Furthermore, I HAVE complained/needled a few people earlier on in order to get better reads. The most notable result of this is deciding you're probably town. Even further, complaining of any sort is not a scum tell. You literally have no idea what a scum tell is, unfortunately. You ARE the person who said, "What's scummy about IIoA?" earlier this game, which is baffling in and of itself because you recognize the term but don't understand that it's a term because it is in the wiki as a classic scum tell. Lol

Even FURTHER, you have somehow failed to comprehend that the person whose case you are sheeping/agreeing with said that one of the main things that makes me scummy is that I've gone after "mostly newer players" in a game full of exclusively new players, which is illogical to the point of absurdity. And yet you have not read carefully enough to understand this, SOMEHOW, even when I re-iterated it.

Why can't you be scum so I can lynch you? WHY? It would be so easy to do if I wanted to.

You're town. And it is so, so painful for me.

[fuzzybutternut]

Seem to remember JasonWazza pushing the newb card.

That'd be one of the 5%