VARSOON VARIETY HOUR : GAME SCRAPPED

[Bronya Zaychik]

RR, Shall we have our obligatory fight? Mark ruined the pressure on Iconeum.

@Mark, Your rapid votes pressure none of your targets atm. :/

I am not looking to bring pressure.

I am looking to be memorable.

? You want to be remembered as the dude who pressured no one and spammed? The best way to be remembered...drive a wagon.

[Reasonably Rational]

Here's another, similar question, that relates the previous one to this game:

What is the most important thing about *this* game to know more about, excluding anything related to specific players.

Is it knowing how mana can be generated?
Is it knowing what different cards can do?
Is it knowing what factionals scum have?
Is it knowing what abilities players might have?


Etc. Purely mechnical knowledge, untied to specific players.

-Cerb

pedit: Naw micc, I'm not in any hurry to wagon anyone, I'm getting plenty of data with the way things are right now, I just found it interesting that you didn't move your vote elsewhere.

It's very useful for both alignments to predict behavior. Which is more useful varies from card to card and player to player. Knowledge explains behavior. Therefore, if a player has a role that impacts other players behavior

and they are aware of it

transparency is best. This applies in mana stealers, millers, and other anti-town things.

Knowing what scum can do creates a box of therefore what they likely cannot do. This allows for coordination without outing our roles.

Mana generation is very low tier for knowledge until late game, assuming not player specific here. Both alignments (unless a planet picker exists) would view it as random chance.

Cards and abilities is your standard rolefish and I can't see how it applies generally but only to certain slots.

So out of the four, I'd pick scum ability knowledge

knowing what I know now anyway.

~Titus

Let me elaborate: That question wasn't meant to LIMIT the options, those were just examples. Any sort of mechanical thing you could think of is an acceptable answer.

-Cerb

[OnTheMark]

I think Taly should copy Chara to see if the miller thing is fake.
Not really show how useful that is though since Chara could just be a scum miller

~B

Not a chance in hell.

Taly is in my I am not sure they are town list.

If they are scum they could easily lie.

[Reasonably Rational]

I think Taly should copy Chara to see if the miller thing is fake.
Not really show how useful that is though since Chara could just be a scum miller

~B

A scum miller, as in, a role aligned with The End that explicitly has text in their role card stating that they will always be investigated as being part of The End?

-Cerb

[Reasonably Rational]

Taly check, lynch Taly tomorrow? Boom! Or even today, if their ability can copy them today(which I actually imagine it can).

-Cerb

[OnTheMark]

RR, Shall we have our obligatory fight? Mark ruined the pressure on Iconeum.

@Mark, Your rapid votes pressure none of your targets atm. :/

I am not looking to bring pressure.

I am looking to be memorable.

? You want to be remembered as the dude who pressured no one and spammed? The best way to be remembered...drive a wagon.

The pressure is working to get reactions I want. Remember I am doing what works on MU to draw out scum. Give me a chance please. If I feel sure enough I will drive but I wanna find the strings first

And so much I wanna say but can’t.

[OnTheMark]

Taly check, lynch Taly tomorrow? Boom! Or even today, if their ability can copy them today(which I actually imagine it can).

-Cerb

We’re not lynching someone just because they are a claimed investigative to confirm/deny someone widely townread.

[Maid Cafe]

Not a chance in hell.

Taly is in my I am not sure they are town list.

If they are scum they could easily lie.

I mean let's run down the situations

Taly is scum:
Fakes a guilty - Oh no we caught scum what are we ever going to do
Fakes an "inno" - Roles were randed before alignment anyway and now Chara and taly are tied together
Truthful inno - Non issue

Taly is town:
Non Issue

~B

[Bronya Zaychik]

I think Taly should copy Chara to see if the miller thing is fake.
Not really show how useful that is though since Chara could just be a scum miller

~B

+1 it is a decent option but may be better. I missed where Chara mentioned copying. Can you quote?

[Maid Cafe]

2) I target someone with my Planeswalker ability. For 2 phases, I gain Mana the same way they would, and I gain their abilities. I can only do this once per dayphase.

"And I gain there abilities"

~B

[Bronya Zaychik]

2) I target someone with my Planeswalker ability. For 2 phases, I gain Mana the same way they would, and I gain their abilities. I can only do this once per dayphase.

"And I gain there abilities"

~B

Is Miller an ability or a label?

[Maid Cafe]

Passive abilities are still abilities.
The sample role pm shows one actually.

~B

[Chara]

@Chara: I just want to make sure it's firmly on the record exactly what abilities etc should return a negative result on you, so in case you are actually scum fake claiming miller because you know in Varsoon games there can be multiple millers and therefore the fake claim isn't particularly risky, people know *what*, if any, results they can trust on you.

-Cerb

pedit:@MC: You probably have the coolest spells.

tracker and watcher types shouldn't get any sort of fabricated result from me. you can trust those. but if you're unsure, better to be safe. i remember Undertale where a miller returned as having a killing ability because a hider would have died on them.
come to think of it, i haven't asked if i would kill a hider. i'll do that, but right now i would assume i would, seeing as i'm treated as scum.

pedit: i'd call it a passive ability. if Taly copied all my abilities, Taly would also be a miller.

[OnTheMark]

Not a chance in hell.

Taly is in my I am not sure they are town list.

If they are scum they could easily lie.

I mean let's run down the situations

Taly is scum:
Fakes a guilty - Oh no we caught scum what are we ever going to do
Fakes an "inno" - Roles were randed before alignment anyway and now Chara and taly are tied together
Truthful inno - Non issue

Taly is town:
Non Issue

~B

It’s more like assuming Chara is truthtellkng
Taly is town, mislynch town << This is an issue
Taly is scum, we learn nothing
Taly is town yet Miller doesn’t copy for some reason << we learn nothing and have mislynched town
A) Taly is blocked somehow
B) Chara is scum
C) Ability doesn’t copy passives learn nothing

Taly scum case it’s wine we ignore.

[Maid Cafe]

Taly is town, mislynch town << This is an issue

What?

[Chara]

and no, there's no explicit label to my role. it's worded how i stated it before. my role PM doesn't say "miller".

[Bronya Zaychik]

@Chara: I just want to make sure it's firmly on the record exactly what abilities etc should return a negative result on you, so in case you are actually scum fake claiming miller because you know in Varsoon games there can be multiple millers and therefore the fake claim isn't particularly risky, people know *what*, if any, results they can trust on you.

-Cerb

pedit:@MC: You probably have the coolest spells.

tracker and watcher types shouldn't get any sort of fabricated result from me. you can trust those. but if you're unsure, better to be safe. i remember Undertale where a miller returned as having a killing ability because a hider would have died on them.
come to think of it, i haven't asked if i would kill a hider. i'll do that, but right now i would assume i would, seeing as i'm treated as scum.

pedit: i'd call it a passive ability. if Taly copied all my abilities, Taly would also be a miller.

Ask Varsoon. No assumptions here.

[Chara]

post you quoted literally says "i'll do that."

[OnTheMark]

Taly is town, mislynch town << This is an issue

What?

Cerb says Taly checks we Lynch Taly.

So if Taly is town that is a problem.

If we don’t Lynch Taly and someone checks Taly
We have no idea if Taly was scum or if the check is genuine or Chara is a Miller.

[Bronya Zaychik]

I'm not on board with planning lynches.

Second, I think we should consider tracking all possible uses not the first good one. We shouldn't be chaining lynches based off any investigation. We are fully capable of logical deduction based on any investigation.

@Mark, who would you have Taly copy?

@Cerb, let me get back to you. Any limiting parameters besides not specific player targeting?

[Maid Cafe]

Taly is town, mislynch town << This is an issue

What?

Taly is scum, we learn nothing

Nothing happening isn't a negative result.
It's a neutral result.

Taly is town yet Miller doesn’t copy for some reason << we learn nothing and have mislynched town

This would be a moderator lie if Taly is told he copies passive abilities.

A) Taly is blocked somehow

We move on.

B) Chara is scum

We catch scum or learn the miller claim is legit and roles were made before alignment rands.
Nothing bad occurs in this situation.

C) Ability doesn’t copy passives learn nothing

I have faith in our fellow players abilities to ask Varsoon simple questions about there role pm.

[Bronya Zaychik]

Taly is town, mislynch town << This is an issue

What?

Cerb says Taly checks we Lynch Taly.

So if Taly is town that is a problem.

If we don’t Lynch Taly and someone checks Taly
We have no idea if Taly was scum or if the check is genuine or Chara is a Miller.

In the immediate short term yes, but in order to keep the massive unknowns, there is a pool scum cannot kill. This helps our protectives and later in the game. It's how RR was finally boxed in for SU2.

[Chara]

why are we sacrificing Taly to check me in the first place? i don't need to be towncleared, i don't get mislynched. sure, it works if i'm lying, and lynching Taly to catch scum me would be fine, but if Taly claims i'm lying, you should lynch

me

.

or we could simply play the game.

[Maid Cafe]

Cerb says Taly checks we Lynch Taly.

We don't do this unless a guilty result appears.

~B

[Maid Cafe]

I have at 0 points in time have ever suggested that we lynch anyone without a guilty.

0 points in time.

~B