Newbie 694 (over)

[Xtoxm]

Asking someone else to create discussion strikes me as silly. I'm not sure if it's scummy.

I will

Vote Militant

.

I think that last post sounds kind of like he's forcing himself to say something.

[militant]

Asking someone else to create discussion strikes me as silly. I'm not sure if it's scummy.

I will

Vote Militant

.

I think that last post sounds kind of like he's forcing himself to say something.

I am not sure I understand the reasoning behind your vote. In Clockwork's post, he said discuss, that is what I was doing, I was posting my thoughts on Clockwork's actions. As I stated in the post I didn't really get why Clockwork did what he did which is why my post was kinda short.

[urielzyx]

Asking someone else to create discussion strikes me as silly. I'm not sure if it's scummy.

I will

Vote Militant

.

I think that last post sounds kind of like he's forcing himself to say something.

I am not sure I understand the reasoning behind your vote. In Clockwork's post, he said discuss, that is what I was doing, I was posting my thoughts on Clockwork's actions. As I stated in the post I didn't really get why Clockwork did what he did which is why my post was kinda short.

I don't think he spoke about the length, I believe he ment that it looked like u had nothing to say and just posted something that was pretty obvious.

as to Xtoxm: I don't consider what militant did very scummy.
First of all, we were triyng to open a conversation and he may have simply been triyng to contribute even though he didn't have a lot to say.
Second of all, u should remember, this is a newbie game, and thus u can assume that militant is a newbie, that may be one of the reasons that he discussed the suggested discussion topic even with barely anything to say...

[Xtoxm]

Well, i'm not sure about the validity of your second point, but it is discounted anyway by the fact Militant has already played in several games, and is ranked goon.

[ClockworkRuse]

Vote: ClockworkRuse

Discuss.

Well, you are voting yourself. At any rate you are trying to create discussion which I understand as a protown behaviour. What your possible motives for you to vote yourself still escape me though.

And why did you feel the urge to say this? Just because I said discuss?

[GIEFF]

Are the ranks under our handles based solely on post count? Or do the number of games played or won have an affect also?

And regarding our ealier discussion - no, the mafia do NOT use logic when deciding who is town and who is mafia. The mafia are already 100% sure of who the town and scum are. As you said, the "logic" they use is false logic; they make their decision and then try to cover it up with logic. It seems to me the best way to uncover scum is to find faulty logic.

The "emotion" aspect may comes with experience, but it isn't something I can rely on right now.

[Xtoxm]

Post count solely.

Townsperson: 0-50
Goon: 50-100
Mafia Scum: 100+
Anything Else: 100+

[hambargarz]

I agree, active lurking is scummy behaviour (as I learned in my last game)

Unvote

Vote: militant

[ClockworkRuse]

Unvote

Vote hambargarz

He isn't the only one actively lurking, so why Militant?

[Elennaro]

Vote: RealityFan

I'm all for lynching lurkers. If we don't allow people to lurk, they'll post more, providing more information, and making the game more fun.

That's not to say I'd do a lynch right now, I just want to drive the lurkers out of lurking.

[Xtoxm]

I agree with Elen there as policy. However what I find in most games is whenever I attack someone for lurking, I get lynched for it. Aparantly it's scummy. Imo it's just piss annoying and adds to the problems of games before more inactive...

[ClockworkRuse]

I agree with Elen there as policy. However what I find in most games is whenever I attack someone for lurking, I get lynched for it. Aparantly it's scummy. Imo it's just piss annoying and adds to the problems of games before more inactive...

Policy lynches only hurt the town. That could be why.

Also, it's only been about two or three days. Not everyone has the access that we do, so sometimes it just takes some patience.

[Xtoxm]

*Games becoming more inactive

No, that is a false statement.

[infamousace2]

Are we ever gonna lynch someone?

[hambargarz]

@infamousace2: It's a bit early to call lynches. Longer days are better for the town. In my experiences a day can last for about a couple of weeks.

@ClockworkRuse: His post gives a certain vibe. So I'll do my best to explain. Here's the quote..

Well, you are voting yourself. At any rate you are trying to create discussion which I understand as a protown behaviour. What your possible motives for you to vote yourself still escape me though.

He is explaining that the move to encourage discussion is pro-town. Which kind of goes without saying. Mentioning the word pro-town just strikes a chord with me. As a suspicious way to word it. He could have said, "good idea, lets discuss blah blah" or simply, "he's encouraging discussion" not something like "you are trying to create discussion which I understand as a protown behaviour". That just sounds unnatural to me. Immediately following is a fence sitting sentence.

[ClockworkRuse]

@infamousace2: It's a bit early to call lynches. Longer days are better for the town. In my experiences a day can last for about a couple of weeks.

@ClockworkRuse: His post gives a certain vibe. So I'll do my best to explain. Here's the quote..

Well, you are voting yourself. At any rate you are trying to create discussion which I understand as a protown behaviour. What your possible motives for you to vote yourself still escape me though.

He is explaining that the move to encourage discussion is pro-town. Which kind of goes without saying. Mentioning the word pro-town just strikes a chord with me. As a suspicious way to word it. He could have said, "good idea, lets discuss blah blah" or simply, "he's encouraging discussion" not something like "you are trying to create discussion which I understand as a protown behaviour". That just sounds unnatural to me. Immediately following is a fence sitting sentence.

That's not what you called him on though. You said that he was actively lurking. It helps if you try to explain what you find scummy as clearly as you can the first time, rather then just saying something simple like active lurking or something of the sort.

[infamousace2]

Oh...so there is no set time limit for days...

gotcha

[militant]

Vote: ClockworkRuse

Discuss.

Well, you are voting yourself. At any rate you are trying to create discussion which I understand as a protown behaviour. What your possible motives for you to vote yourself still escape me though.

And why did you feel the urge to say this? Just because I said discuss?

Yes that is why I posted what I did.

@ClockworkRuse: His post gives a certain vibe. So I'll do my best to explain. Here's the quote..

Well, you are voting yourself. At any rate you are trying to create discussion which I understand as a protown behaviour. What your possible motives for you to vote yourself still escape me though.

He is explaining that the move to encourage discussion is pro-town. Which kind of goes without saying. Mentioning the word pro-town just strikes a chord with me. As a suspicious way to word it. He could have said, "good idea, lets discuss blah blah" or simply, "he's encouraging discussion" not something like "you are trying to create discussion which I understand as a protown behaviour". That just sounds unnatural to me. Immediately following is a fence sitting sentence.

You are voting me because of the way I speak?

I am not lurking and just because I phrase things in a different manner.

Would one of the ICs elaborate on the meaning of the term "lurking", as I understand it, it means that a player is not contributing or is trying to "fly unerneath the rader". If I am correct in my understanding then I do not think I was lurking due to the fact taht I was posting and contributing to discussion.

[hasdgfas]

VOTE COUNT:

GIEFF(2): militant, RealityFan
militant(2): Xtoxm, hambargarz
hambargarz(1): ClockworkRuse
RealityFan(1): Elennaro
Xtoxm(1): infamousace2

Not Voting: GIEFF, urielzyx

9 alive, 5 to lynch


*if you want someone prodded, just let me know.*

[ClockworkRuse]

You are being accused of actively lurking though, Mil. Basically, that boils down to posting to appear active but not really giving any content. Saying that my self-vote was an attempt to stimulate discussion is just stating the blatant facts without adding anything to it.

At anyone who isn't an IC; Is self-voting pro-town? Or is it the opposite?

[militant]

You are being accused of actively lurking though, Mil. Basically, that boils down to posting to appear active but not really giving any content. Saying that my self-vote was an attempt to stimulate discussion is just stating the blatant facts without adding anything to it.

At anyone who isn't an IC; Is self-voting pro-town? Or is it the opposite?

Oh right. Something quite different. Posting to appear like I am contributing but not actually adding anything of substance. I was in a bit of a pickle in that situation, I thought creating discussion was protown as I mentioned but I could not quite get my head around why you were doing it.

Clockwork, I don't like you question because it is leading, it is asking whether something is one or the other. I am not sure whether it is pro town or not; the concept of self voting had not occured to me before. But it depends on the context entirely or more importantly the motives for the self vote. As I previously stated though it creates discussion which leads to scumhunting like in this case with me being voted, in that sense I see it as good but otherwise I don't know.

[ClockworkRuse]

I'd like everyone who isn't an IC to answer that question. I'm not really sure how Xtoxm feels about it but I want to show everyone some things about it.

[hambargarz]

self voting, to me at least, is generally an anti-town play.
There are some instances where it is good though (ie. gambiting).
At this point in the game, I see you're self vote as neither one or the other because it doesn't escalate much.

In my last game 2 people self voted. The context was much more significant than here however. (Though the behaviour was seen as anti-town rather than scummy).

Asking stuff like this strikes me as a bit scummy. You want the town's position on your behaviour? That only helps you if you're scum in my opinion.

FOS: ClockworkRuse

[Elennaro]

Clockworkruse, I challenge your statement. I think it's a reasonably good policy (though exceptions are always possible). The only thing the mafia can do to avoid getting lynched is post, which increases the chances of them slipping up. Of course we should lynch clear targets (like false claimers) before we lynch lurkers, but in case of doubt, lynching a lurker seems like a good idea to me. At best, you lynch a scum member that was not going to give you information, at worst, an unhelpful townie (or power role, that would be unfortunate, but it's easily avoided).

That being said, I don't advocate lynching right now, but my vote stays where it is, because a little pressure will do the town no harm.

Please explain why policy lynches only hurt the town.

[Elennaro]

EBWOP: that was a reply to your post at the end of the previous page, I hadn't seen this page yet.