Cyclic Experimentation Set x02 - [Game Over]


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Post Post #1500 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 12:25 pm

Post by PeregrineV »

In post 1320, Ghostlin wrote:
In post 1301, PeregrineV wrote:
No, my ability allowed the user to target a player at night.
If that player died
, and had an ability, you would get it.


Lemme highlight my problem area there. Done. Nowhere do you acutally mention that
you kill
the player. As the ability reads, you target the player and if the player dies, instead of going to Inactive Zone, you would get that ability. No one in that grammar does it indicate to me that you acutally KILL the player you target. In other words it could be used as a backup. In the first case, it's a oneshot Vig that could be used to rip the ability from an antitown player (Stringer Bell would be an excellent example here). In no universe would it be completely useless.


No, I gain the ability of the person who dies.

So I have to know who is going to be killed at night. Please explain how town would ever know this?
But, with recent developments, we could have passed thw ability to the SK who could kill and rip the power from his victims, and then send the powert back to town. Right? :roll:

In post 1320, Ghostlin wrote:Let's play example time here. MoI and a number of Town believed Stringer was Scum but he had the Hiding ability, which is excellent in the hands of Town. If your ability acutally killed Stringer, you would get a protown ability that was valuble to town. This...is not what happened. You targeted DGB and didn't pass the ability...
How can I kill the hider, again? And if you read DGB's ability, his ability destroyed mine, so maybe I didn't have it to pass? (But yes, my intention was to not pass it).

In post 1320, Ghostlin wrote:Here's my problem. You're either scum or dumb. I mean, dumber than me when I didn't understand what Void did. I'm getting strange feelings from ML and PV at the moment, and since PV admitted he didn't pass..

Probably just dumb, since I got a town role. :P

But seriously,
can you see how the role I dumped benefits scum more than it benefits town?
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Post Post #1501 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 12:30 pm

Post by Junpei »

No I don't. Someone claimed Hider; anyone should have seen that your role should have targeted the person with Hider because they are the most high profile targets as it has a very protown ability.

Either you're scum, or you messed up.
The melody of logic always plays the notes of truth.

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Post Post #1502 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:03 pm

Post by PeregrineV »

In post 1348, RedCoyote wrote:
I have no intention of accusing you of "making the whole thing up". You probably did have an ability. You probably did not pass it.

I do have an intention of accusing you of lying about the rationale behind not passing it. It wasn't to help the town, as you claim, but to prevent the town from tracking
where
you passed the ability. The scum know that, especially in the early game, it's not worth the risk of passing it to a fellow scum member. If they do, then one of them is dying. If they pass it to a townie, then it helps the town gain that much more valuable information. So, what's the solution? Come up with a plan to get rid of the ability. The problem is the scum team (which I was apart of) went through those same motions during the last game. It was a different situation, but the intention was exactly the same.

The problem I see is that I'm either scum, which means you shouldn't believe anything I say, since who knows what is true and what shit I might try to throw town's way,
or you think I'm town, in which case you believe I did what I did for the reasons I did.
Trying to have it both ways doesn't work.

In post 1348, RedCoyote wrote:
Pere 1311 wrote:And you seem more upset that I scrapped it than would be normal. And you never mentioned who was town enough to pass it onto.


Well, it isn't my responsibility to give you your townreads, and it certainly isn't my fault that you haven't been able to secure any for your own yet. You could always ask if you need advice. You certainly could have passed it to me for a guaranteed town pass, but also MoI, Ghost, Bunny, Toog, and DGB would've been passes I would've considered at the time in question.

No, and the power night1 was my responsibility. I don't consider it useful for town, since town consists of me and dead people. If, in my mind, I had someone I could confirm, I might have passed to them (if the vig had plugged scum, for example, I'd probably have sent it to him).
In post 1348, RedCoyote wrote:
Additionally, I love how you cannot retort to my statement that most every ability will eventually end up in scum hands (which is a good thing, btw, because it will help us track this game), so, instead, you just try and besmirch my intentions.

Your intention is to call me a liar, but only about why I did or didn't do anything. And to lynch me.

In post 1348, RedCoyote wrote:
Kdub 1345 wrote:although I'm not so sure scum-Peregrine would have volunteered the information in that case.


Because it's WIFOM, Kdub.

I would have not mentioned it until the next day when we declared our targets, except for the fact in Post 1284 MoI had Toog's "pass to the Void." Since I did the same, I went ahead and claimed it.

In post 1284, MagnaofIllusion wrote:
Pass / Not Passed List


Passed an Ability
– MoI, Kdub, Toog (claims pass to Void), Junpei, chkflip, warriormode

Did not Pass an Ability
– Magister, Implosion, Fourseen, Projectmatt, Bunnylover, SlySly, RedCoyote, Ghostlin, PeregrineV, wazzatron, Sinestro

Those not on record (and still alive)
–Springlullaby, EtherealCookie
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Post Post #1503 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:29 pm

Post by The Eruci »

:: VoteCount 2x10 ::


Sinestro (8) -
warriormode, Junpei, Ghostlin, FourseenCircumstance, Kdub, SlySly, Magister Ludi, RedCoyote

RedCoyote (4) -
MagnaofIllusion, PeregrineV, projectmatt, springlullaby

PeregrineV (1) -
Toogeloo

I Am Innocent (1) -
Sinestro

FourseenCircumstance (1) -
chkflip

MagnaofIllusion (1) -
popsofctown



Not Voting (3) -
EtherealCookie, Bunnylover, I Am Innocent


With 19 alive, it takes 10 to lynch.


Deadline for Day Two is in (expired on 2011-11-30 21:41:47).


Under Replacement: EtherealCookie.
Last edited by The Eruci on Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Cyclic Experimentation Set x02.


Equality is a perversion of the natural order!It binds the strong to the weak. They [the weak] become anchors that drag the exceptional down to mediocrity. Individuals destined and deserving of greatness have it denied them. They [the strong] suffer for the sake of keeping them even with their inferiors.
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Post Post #1504 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:55 pm

Post by SlySly »

In post 1478, Magister Ludi wrote:
Wait, what? Why would I need to be lynched at all under any circumstances regarding what happened here?


Your initial reluctance to support the lynch of a guilty lead me to iso you looking for a connection to Sinestro. You completely avoided discussing him all game other than giving him a reasonless town pass in your summary post.

However, Peregrine has stepped up and passed you on my suspect list. Anyone supporting a leashing of Sinestro is scummy to me. After a mislynch, 2 misvig's and 2 NK's, it is a no brainer to lynch an outted non-Eruci Sinestro. I don't see the town benefit in chancing another mislynch and leaving Sinestro alive to possibly kill more townies. I also don't believe Sinestro is 3rd party, it's already confirmed he is a liar and more than willing to gambit.

In post 1483, Toogeloo wrote:
Stringer flipped Termiati. Therefore, scum team is Termiati. Why would I think any differently? And where is Daevori ever mentioned anywhere?


Why would the flavor of the scum team change from game 1 (Daevori) and the flavor of the 3rd party remain the same (The Asxtori)? It makes no sense to me. If the setup is the same as game one, which I highly doubt, SB would have flipped Daevori. I get the sense that Sinestro has borrowed 3rd party flavor from game one attempting to prolong his life and to keep his scum buddies hidden and unsuspected for as long as possible. When Sinestro flips as not The Asxtori, it will be obvious he isn't 3rd party and it will be curtains for you Toog.
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Post Post #1505 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:55 pm

Post by PeregrineV »

In post 1501, Junpei wrote:No I don't. Someone claimed Hider; anyone should have seen that your role should have targeted the person with Hider because they are the most high profile targets as it has a very protown ability.

Either you're scum, or you messed up.


Hider
While Hiding, the Hider itself is considered an ineligible target for actions - all actions that target the Hider specifically will fail. This applies even to otherwise "piercing" abilities like Strongman kills.


It makes no sense for me to target the hider.
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Post Post #1506 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:03 pm

Post by PeregrineV »

In post 1504, SlySly wrote:
In post 1478, Magister Ludi wrote:
Wait, what? Why would I need to be lynched at all under any circumstances regarding what happened here?


Your initial reluctance to support the lynch of a guilty lead me to iso you looking for a connection to Sinestro. You completely avoided discussing him all game other than giving him a reasonless town pass in your summary post.

However, Peregrine has stepped up and passed you on my suspect list. Anyone supporting a leashing of Sinestro is scummy to me. After a mislynch, 2 misvig's and 2 NK's, it is a no brainer to lynch an outted non-Eruci Sinestro. I don't see the town benefit in chancing another mislynch and leaving Sinestro alive to possibly kill more townies. I also don't believe Sinestro is 3rd party, it's already confirmed he is a liar and more than willing to gambit.


Too bad. I still maintain town can leash the SK under normal circumstances.

However, A thread search for Daevori returns this:

In post 949, Junpei wrote:
Mod wrote:Welcome, MS1775305, [Callsign Playername.]. You've realized what they are doing. The rest of the test group doesn't understand, but you are more insightful than all of them. It makes sense, you are The Asxtori. They don't deserve to make it out of here alive, they fell for the lies too easily, they're just a detriment to society. Its up to you to purge this group, then expose this "experiment" for its true darkness. They made the wrong choice letting you in on this one.

Ability Cycling: You are not necessarily a part of the ability cycle. You will receive an Ability Message at the start of each Day Phase, and will be able to select who to pass the abilities to, but you will not be able to use any of the abilities within your designated Ability Message.

Factional Ability: You have the ability to terminate one person from the simulation each Night. Failure to submit the kill by the end of the Night will be considered a No Kill. Your removal method is: purged.

Ability Hoarder: Any abilities that you remove from the game through either killing a player with your factional ability or by being the hammer on their lynch become a permanent part of your ability list. You may use one of the abilities available to you each Night, in conjunction with your factional kill.

Secrecy Pays: You will survive the first attempt made on your life during a Night Phase.

The Asxtori Win Condition: You win if only you are alive (or if nothing can prevent the same).
[Standard Serial Killer Win Condition.]

Game Topic is here: Cyclic Experimentation Set x01.

Reply by PM to confirm you understand your role and win condition.



Besides its factional kill, the Serial Killer had a special ability known as Ability Hoarder. Upon hammering or killing a player with the factional kill, they would receive any ability the dying player had, and could select one of the available collected abilities to use in conjunction with their kill. This was why DGB was extremely hammerhappy this game. Now, DrippingGoofball discovered an interaction I had not considered, and very nearly won her the game. After purging q21, she received the Treestump as an option. Had she been left alive till Night 5, she could have then selected the Treestump as a secondary ability, making her effectively unlynchable and unkillable, and with only one Daevori alive, she would have at that point won the game. So lynching DGB the day you did was the best (and truthfully the only option) you had that day. If you review Day 5 with this situation in mind you can see that DGB's desire to live only one more day became quite apparent, and something that I reflected in the lynch flavor of that day.


Please explain the correlation between Furcolow's claim and yours, I'm not sure I see it.

pedit:I'm thinking that we have a "no one give any abilities of any worth to furcolow or FC" and then we kill them tomorrow. Yes I know lining up lynches is bad, but this is what I think is a good idea.


This is no mere SK. You would also get the abilities of the person you kill (like the ability I tossed), but permanently. You forgot to mention that.

Also, in one post you say you are full bulletproof, then next you're saying you'll probably be nightkilled anyway.
So, now it looks like you are faking it all.

Unvote.
Vote: Sinestro
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Post Post #1507 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:18 pm

Post by Toogeloo »

In post 1504, SlySly wrote:Why would the flavor of the scum team change from game 1 (Daevori) and the flavor of the 3rd party remain the same (The Asxtori)? It makes no sense to me.

I don't know, why don't you WIFOM on it a little bit more?
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Post Post #1508 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:30 pm

Post by projectmatt »

@Mod, Semi V\LA until Monday


We're lynching Sinestro today. There's no second guesses on this, alright? The only reason I haven't given a vote yet is to confirm every replacement slot is filled.
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Post Post #1509 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:50 pm

Post by RedCoyote »

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Post Post #1510 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:14 pm

Post by popsofctown »

please stall the lynch until i have time to read the thread, yes.

As a matter of fact, if you must lynch before I'm caught up then don't lynch the SK I wouldn't want to miss that much excitement.
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"What? Nothing? You would make the prince suffer over... nothing?"
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Post Post #1511 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:16 pm

Post by Junpei »

unvote
for replacements
The melody of logic always plays the notes of truth.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iA41ggsdeXE
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Post Post #1512 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:19 pm

Post by I Am Innocent »

In post 638, Magister Ludi wrote:I may have missed. To see why you are so confident that nopoint is scum.The melody of logic always plays the notes of truth.


Yeah, this guy is definitely shady.
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Post Post #1513 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:21 pm

Post by I Am Innocent »

In post 638, Magister Ludi wrote:Kdub, if you are implying you are a day vig or something similar, I highly recommend using it on nopoint. I don't really care if Stringer Bell is alive, but I do have a town read on Junpei right now, so nothing on him.


Hmmm, why did it quote a different post 638 before... :?
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Post Post #1514 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:22 pm

Post by Magister Ludi »

What post are you referring to? I never said that
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Post Post #1515 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:22 pm

Post by Magister Ludi »

Oh I see. Why do you think kdub is shady? He looks fine to me
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Post Post #1516 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:24 pm

Post by MagnaofIllusion »

Hey Ludi, while you are busy doing nothing in particular why don't you explain why you are Town via your game efforts ...
"I am a leaf on the wind ... watch how I soar!"

Pretty much Geriatric game restricted at this point ... unless there are players I REALLY want to play with.
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Post Post #1517 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:27 pm

Post by Junpei »

I am Innocent, we have a week left including the US holiday weekend (I see you will be celebrating that), and you are at post ~650. Any way you can pick up the pace? You aren't going to finish in a timely fashion and you won't be able to discuss with town much at all before nightfall.
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Post Post #1518 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:28 pm

Post by I Am Innocent »

In post 666, Toogeloo wrote:Shooting nopoint and then lynching Stringer would give us a ton of discussion for tomorrow.


Interesting, one would think that you'd want to see Nopoint's flip before settling on candidate #2... :?
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Post Post #1519 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:29 pm

Post by Magister Ludi »

I am in the middle of studying for some midterms here before thanksgiving, busy doing things my friend!

Your question seems silly. I will indulge. I am town because I have shown a town independent mindset in trying to determine who are the scum in this game. That is probably the biggest way you can tell if someone is town or not, regardless of the results and I've been all right so far on that front too. I've gotten correct town reads on several players, and have tried to stop silly wagons on people I percieve are town as well. Hitting a scum or two by lynching would be nice as well.
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Post Post #1520 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:34 pm

Post by I Am Innocent »

In post 1517, Junpei wrote:I am Innocent, we have a week left including the US holiday weekend (I see you will be celebrating that), and you are at post ~650. Any way you can pick up the pace? You aren't going to finish in a timely fashion and you won't be able to discuss with town much at all before nightfall.


From the last few pages, it sounds like we got a bad guy to lynch, so I don't think I'll be much more help than he has been. I of course would like the group to hold off until we get closer to the deadline to allow us replacements to catch up as much as possible. I am trying to catch up as quick as I can, but if I don't have much time before nightfall to discuss, note that I am trying to leave a trail of my thoughts behind if I don't survive N2. :]
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Post Post #1521 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:40 pm

Post by I Am Innocent »

In post 676, Magister Ludi wrote:I didn't realize deadline was so soon. kdub, maybe you need to expedite your shot.

Meh, Everytime 'public daykill' has happened, the person has turned out to be town. I actually like it instead of hero vig's ( a la maruchan in pyp5 which helped scum [me] rampage town).


lol, last three posts

stringer bell: town here, and I have a power
MoI: sigh, unfortunately he lives
ML: oh in that case, shoot away kdub

Or something like that.
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Post Post #1522 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:54 pm

Post by MagnaofIllusion »

@Everyone slowly pushing up the Sinestro Vote Count
– if you think you are going to get Town cred at this stage please stop. We are waiting for EC to be replaced so the replacement can at least confirm Pass / No Pass and have the Night to read the thread. Now if you are scum wanting to stymie this process continue mindlessly voting Sinestro before said replacement … it will make the successive Days lynches easier to decide upon.

and show that something is amiss with the quoting feature currently.

--

Magister wrote:Your question seems silly. I will indulge. I am town because I have shown a town independent mindset in trying to determine who are the scum in this game. That is probably the biggest way you can tell if someone is town or not, regardless of the results and I've been all right so far on that front too. I've gotten correct town reads on several players, and have tried to stop silly wagons on people I percieve are town as well. Hitting a scum or two by lynching would be nice as well.


Really? Given that your scum reads really haven’t developed beyond Warrior and Projectmatt (when you don't call someone scum and then retreat fairly quickly to calling them Town, that is) and that I’m not seeing any evidence at all of drive to find scum via inquiry I find this explanation a little hard to buy. That said – please explain what correct Town reads you have gotten. As a note – listing NoPoint isn’t going to help since your back-off from him was timed quite scummily. Thanks again!

--

Sinestro wrote:If you don't want us to shoot, we won't. Only when you guys want someone vig'd, whether it's a lurker, or someone scummy. We will listen. We don't want to die yet And honestly we'll probably get nk'd soon, we are against mafia, and we would be working like a town vig - essentially a shield for you guys.


That’s a good one Hiplop – the claimed Bulletproof will be Nightkilled soon. I got a good chuckle … thanks for bringing some levity to your impending roping.

--

Pops wrote:guys what's a good post reading quota for today before i relapse and play dominion. Page 4? 5? 6? 12? 15?


You will have 60+ pages to read by the time the day ends. Here’s your equation –

You have Time = (Time in Days to replace EC) + (Time to hammer scum Sinestro and have Kunkstar show the flip) + (3 days for Night) to get caught up.

Whatever schedule allows for that to happen by the Dawn of Day 3 is what you need to use.

--

Toog wrote:Why would I make that assumption? Stringer said "I guess that includes the SK." So why would I think there is multiple teams as opposed to one team and an SK?


And ding you hit the bullseye. Why are you making any assumptions at all about the set-up? We know there is a Temaiti (or proper spelling) faction and we have a claimed Serial Killer. That’s all Town should know at this stage.

Yet your posting betrays that you may in fact know that there is only a Single Mafia faction. It’s subtle but it’s there and means if we determine down the line that only a single faction is likely you absolutely need rope if you are still among the living.

--

Junpei wrote:Hm? Scum would know whether or not we're in a game with multiple scum teams?.


Yes, Mafia scum probably do have a solid idea whether we are in Single or Multi-scum. Simply based on their starting number of members compared to the game size.

Even if they aren’t absolutely sure the idea of bussing in a 25ish person game Day 1 / Day 2 is pretty hard to swallow I imagine, especially if via the Pass mechanics they can effectively be forced to kill off partners later on.

--

Peregrine wrote: No, I gain the ability of the person who dies.

So I have to know who is going to be killed at night. Please explain how town would ever know this?
But, with recent developments, we could have passed thw ability to the SK who could kill and rip the power from his victims, and then send the powert back to town. Right?


Town should be able to make a pretty good read of who they think might die at Night and take their best educated guess. And down the line it’s would have been great defense when a Player has to claim a strong passed ability to survive lynch.

Your little Appeal to Fear is noted for coming days.

Peregrine wrote:But seriously, can you see how the role I dumped benefits scum more than it benefits town?


But seriously, how can you continue to not see that the strength of cycling powers isn’t just in their usefulness as roles but in the many PoE eliminations they can create over the course of days?

Peregrine wrote:No, and the power night1 was my responsibility. I don't consider it useful for town, since town consists of me and dead people. If, in my mind, I had someone I could confirm, I might have passed to them (if the vig had plugged scum, for example, I'd probably have sent it to him).


WTF did you sign up for this game if your attitude is “I can only pass to confirmed Town and I’m too stubbornly stupid to understand that passing is good long term”? This question is null and void, of course, if you are scum. Then you are doing a great job looking the part.
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Pretty much Geriatric game restricted at this point ... unless there are players I REALLY want to play with.
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Post Post #1523 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:58 pm

Post by Junpei »

"13. If at deadline there is no majority, No Lynch will occur. If there is a tie at deadline, No Lynch will occur."

From the opening post; so we need to hammer on Sinestro before the deadline, as it doesn't look like we have plurality voting at deadline to determine a lynch in this game.

pedit: I think that Peregrine is trying to use the "I did what was best and I am suffering the consequences of my independent actions" which you, MoI, said was a towntell regarding the vig shot.
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Post Post #1524 (ISO) » Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:05 pm

Post by I Am Innocent »

In post 739, Magister Ludi wrote:Nopoint is two fold good shot. one, he is legitimately posting anti-town. Two, he was lurking hard (seven posts through the entire day) until kdub announced his vig, and chance to shoot him. Since then, he has posted three times, increasing his post count by a whopping 42%!

He is the scummy lurker we have been looking for.


This is probably my #1 suspect at this point.
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