In post 800, MagnaofIllusion wrote:
What answer are you waiting on? Seriously. Of course I didn’t ‘forget’ my fitz read. The question is clearly stated in such a way that only one answer comes regardless of my aligment.
So my question to you is – should I not have had more than 1 scum read?
Do you always make a habit of selective reading? I followed up my did you forget this with this question: "Why didn't you pick this back up on day 4 if you thought he was scum?" (I got the day wrong, I meant day 5.)
MoI wrote:
Jason was lynched Day 4. On Day 5 the day started with Darth (who was a scum read of mine – you may want to discount it based on his later flip but I found his play suspect Day 1 and Day 2 and the Town PR spread indicated he could easily have been faking the FBI Agent as the safest information role-claim) having failed to make his agreed upon scan and another Night of 1 kill only in the books. The fact that fitz was a scum-read doesn’t obligate me to attack him only. Darth was a bigger scum read at the time.
Fine. He was a scum read even though you discounted the track to DV. This doesn't change the fact that the day prior you said to fitz that you would be pushing on fitz just the day before, but never do. Sure you call him scum, but you cannot now expect not to be questioned for this. What it certainly looks like is that you were nominally indicating that you believed fitz was scum but not actually backing it up by pushing it. And from where I'm standing, where I'm trying to figure out who fitz's last partner is, this looks damn suspicious.
MoI wrote:
Snake returned with yet more play that didn’t given any indication of Town perspective so I voted him as explained above. Soon after Magua replaces in and leads further pressure on the slot. Here are some of the QT posts we made back and forth after that to remind you –
MoI at 83 wrote: Ok, feel free to think that. I'm not going to argue this with you since you can just read my response to Darth in thread when he floated the same things.
Scum is 1 of - Darth / redFF
Scum is 1 to 2 of - Snake / Having / NS with an outside shot at Jon.
Alice is as Mod confirmed Town as you can get barring some major fuckcluster where we have two Mafia factions yet have only had 1 kill a Night.
You are about 95% Town. Ghostlin's play was solid and Pro-Town and the proven claim means you are likely only scum if we are in 13-5.
Magua at 86 wrote: So, I don't think you're mafia.
But I'm still like 25% that you're the SK. Which I do think exists.
Still, even if you're the SK, you want to help lynch the Mafia. So let's do that.
I don't see how a 5-man scumteam is balanced in 18 player. Town would lose after 4 mislynches but would have to lynch correctly 5 times to win -- 10v3 is town loses after 4 mislynches and needs 3 correct to win, so it would essentially be 10v3 but *harder*.
4-man scumteam+SK or 3-man scumteam+SK both seem possible and are what I'm looking at.
havingfitz actually fits, from the vote counts, in being a scum-member, but I totally don't get that from reading his posts. Maybe he simply is scum and I don't give him enough credit, treating him too much like a newbie. The other top scumreads tend to have problems because it involves them bussing in situations that already look bad for them -- redFF, DeasVail are both on IaI D3 in a position where it looks pretty much exactly like jason is going to get lynched D4. Really have a hard time seeing redFF in that position; maybe DeasVail could do it.
So Magua I find Town. And he has clearly no interest in pushing having as he had a Town read on the slot. But he didn’t on Darth (as much as he thought the possibility of a Scum FBI Agent was viable). So once I followed his lead to it’s conclusion on your slot I went back to my most viable candidate … Darth.
And Deas ends up taking the rope. Are you suggesting I wasn’t working in a Town fashion in working with my strongest Town read (outside of Alice, who also supported Darth as scum) to lynch Darth (incorrectly, but for valid reasons IMO).
So then Day 6 dawns and clearly redFF is the Serial Killer. Should I have not voted for him that day?
That leads us to yesterday where Having takes the rope.
I’d really like you to summarize why you find my behavior suspect. Also please keep it independent of NS’s behavior.
First, I have no idea what you mean about me keeping it independent of NS's behavior.
I'm not going to debate with you over Darth Yoshi being a bad lynch anyway. I've made mistakes and pushed bad lynches myself. I don't understand where you got the scum read but that's not part of the problem. Although, how you can fault people for being on the wrong side of the Palisade lynch day two when you pushed a Yoshi lynch day five reads a bit disingenuous.
You had a scum read, fine. But, do you not get where I'm telling you it looks suspicious. It looks like you wanted to make sure you had it out there that fitz was a scum read of yours but not actually do anything about it.
You are going to have to point out for me where Magua stated that he believed Darth was scum and was willing to help get him lynched.
In fact, here happens to be his post in which he changes the vote from me to Jon:
In post 459, Magua wrote:Ok. Well, that changes things in regards to how I feel about Tammy.
Also, her actually getting the cached pages and looking through them gives me the warm fuzzies.
We have two days to make this happen. I'll take Nobody Special as a consolation lynch if necessary, but of all the VTs I'd prefer to lynch Jon.
UNVOTE: Tammy
VOTE: Jon_H61
Nobody Special and Jon are pretty much the same in terms of contribution to the thread, but Jon's got a worse place in terms of his positioning on the vote counts.
I am not lynching redFF, DarthYoshi, DeasVail or havingfitz.
redFF needs to protect Alice no matter what happens.
Alice, if whoever we lynch flips Mafia, for the love of Christ track MagnaofIllusion (and don't typo). If we don't lynch Mafia, then whomever. (Since if we don't lynch Mafia, there's likely two, and if they know who's being tracked that person won't kill, etc)
Yoshi should investigate MagnaofIllusion, IMO.
It looks to me like he wasn't interested in lynching EITHER Darth Yoshi or Fitz. So, if you were working with your fellow strong town read, why were you voting Yoshi again? He clearly states he's not interested in lynching him. You voted for Yoshi in the very next post after this one I just posted. So, your reasoning for why you go to Yoshi is flawed.
You'll have to do better than that.
I'd like to know why you would defer to Magua anyway for who you want to lynch on day 5. You've been in the game from the start. Are you telling me that a replacement, no matter how strong the player, who doesn't have as much information you do about the game, is enough to deter you from lynching someone you claimed the previous day was scum that you would be pushing hard on if another person hadn't claimed scum? You obviously didn't defer to him for Yoshi, so why is fitz the exception?
Are you honestly telling me that if you had a strong scum read on someone, you decided to drop it because Magua replaced in and you thought he was town and Magua thought fitz was town? Especially when he said it wasn't a super strong town read? I mean you did say that you believed fitz and I were the two best bets for mafia, but you don't really push it.
Of course day 6 there was no other lynch besides redff. I never suggested that he was. I'm wondering why on day 5, fitz was not an option.
You have to understand why this looks suspicious to me. I don't know why I have to spell it out for you. Your interaction with fitz, your telling him you believe him to be scum but not doing anything about it in any real way, points so strongly to distancing.
I mean look at the vote counts. You vote for fitz and IaI on day three and then Jason on day four. Exactly what I would expect from a partner. IaI gets lynched on day 3, Jason gets lynched on day 4. Day five you try to lynch me or Yoshi. Why not fitz? You could have lynched fitz without Magua's ok. DV got lynched that day and Magua didn't want that to happen, and DV was a much stronger town read for Magua then fitz was. The only reason why I can see why you wouldn't want fitz lynched on day 5 even though you thought he was scum was because he was your partner, and you had a much better chance of winning if he lived another couple days.
Day 7, you didn't even come out hard against fitz. Yes, I know you wanted to push on CES and make a determination and see how fitz and NS responded to that, but you didn't vote fitz until the second week. And, I can't get past you deciding to vote him after I posted several posts in which I told you that I thought you might be partners and would you be willing to vote him.
What surprises me is that you need me to summarize why this looks suspicious. If the positions were reversed, you'd be pointing out how suspicious the behavior is as well.
Mod Note: Quote tags fixed.
