Open 496: Ryuk is the protagonist

[Titus]

No. I was saying you were delaying the inevitable to get your biggest critic mislynched while you were in no danger of being lynched yourself.

Vote Count
Titus-2-Elyse, Tajun
Elyse-1-Titus


Not Voting: Prophylaxis

[Prophylaxis]

Going to put ~2-3 hours of work into this game tomorrow morning.

[Prophylaxis]

Tajun, I've reread and I think I'm ready to lynch Titus.

I'm buying the fact that Rubicon did the same thing and ran the megabus on his buddies, and I've looked at meta. Also, the language slip by Titus just makes her look awful.

I still have some reservations about this lynch, though. Can you assuage my fears by looking at these posts:

Oooweeee, that's a long post. But hey, at least there aren't any HTML errors. (For some reason I have a knack for that.)

Current reads (in no particular order):

Town

JasonWazza
Elyse
Keybladewielder
Rubicon

Null

(not enough info to read)
Autti
ArcAngel9

Neutral

(enough info to read, but not enough to place in a town or scum column)
Tajun
Blue Yoshi*

Scum

RachMarie (previously Apozzle)
JacobSavage
Chenoan
Paschendale**

*I'd rather not explain Blue Yoshi's situation.
**If there's a serial killer in this setup, he's the one. Otherwise, least-likely scum in the group tied with Jacob, so not worth lynching today.

VOTE: RachMarie for obvscum.

Rach is still L-2 though.

Can we get another vote on Rach, please? <3

Where's Rach wagon-wise?

Elyse: any other reasons for Rach-scum? I don't remember you taking much of a stance regarding Apozzle. Or maybe you did and I don't remember.

Yeah, just ISO'd, you actually claim Apozzle was a scum read without explaining anything. Only interaction with Apozzle is telling him to replace out if he couldn't take it and that you don't post walls of text like he does.

I still have a hard time believing that DBK ran the mega-bus on Apozzle/Rach D1.

[Titus]

Prophy, really, the language thing makes me loom awful? It was a god damn slip. You know I look at language. Hell you had the quote I had about dehumanizing language being a scumtell. You thought that sucked too but I was right. Cmg was scum.

You should have a hard time with believing DBK ran a mega bus. He did not. You may just want this game over. In three days, night comes again. Force Elyse to give you more information by killing. Then, the game willlikely end in a day or two. However, if we wait, we can win. Lynch me, we lose.

[Elyse]

Apozzle/Rach was useless and there was no point NOT to bus her.

Now she's just AtE'ing. Don't buy into it.

[Tajun]

It makes me a bit uncomfortable as well, but I am also reminded that a big part of the reason I wanted to lynch Apozzle was his continued pushing on this point:

@orozorro, do not discriminate against me

@Tajun, "pretty blatantly bad"? A fair few people would argue that wrt getting out of RVS. Not something I agree with, obviously, but something that people do accept. A pretty weak reason to jump on that wagon.

@Chenoan, you went from "three is too many votes" to "I know three is not too many but I actually think you are town"? That was a pretty big leap there. Why not just say that you think DBK is town to start with?

which in retrospect was based on defending a comment originally from DBK. I'd buy that he was bussing hard because he was worried his teammate would take him into the ground with him otherwise. Also, when you start a bus and it begins to pick up steam, you do

not

want to jump off, otherwise the two of you get linked in everyones eyes. Your best guess at that point is to keep it up and hope someone else screws up to the level of being a better lynch. TBH, I was more uncomfortable about Rubicon putting up both his buddies as scum. Do you have a meta link for that that is worth looking at?

[Prophylaxis]

Prophy, really, the language thing makes me loom awful? It was a god damn slip. You know I look at language. Hell you had the quote I had about dehumanizing language being a scumtell. You thought that sucked too but I was right. Cmg was scum.

You should have a hard time with believing DBK ran a mega bus. He did not. You may just want this game over. In three days, night comes again. Force Elyse to give you more information by killing. Then, the game willlikely end in a day or two. However, if we wait, we can win. Lynch me, we lose.

Yeah, I know about your position re: language tells and your tendency to push on them. I'm moving that back to null.

Still unconvinced it was a slip though.

You're also right about wanting this game to end - I'm sick of this game and I want it to end also. We'll see.

It makes me a bit uncomfortable as well, but I am also reminded that a big part of the reason I wanted to lynch Apozzle was his continued pushing on this point:

@orozorro, do not discriminate against me

@Tajun, "pretty blatantly bad"? A fair few people would argue that wrt getting out of RVS. Not something I agree with, obviously, but something that people do accept. A pretty weak reason to jump on that wagon.

@Chenoan, you went from "three is too many votes" to "I know three is not too many but I actually think you are town"? That was a pretty big leap there. Why not just say that you think DBK is town to start with?

which in retrospect was based on defending a comment originally from DBK. I'd buy that he was bussing hard because he was worried his teammate would take him into the ground with him otherwise. Also, when you start a bus and it begins to pick up steam, you do

not

want to jump off, otherwise the two of you get linked in everyones eyes. Your best guess at that point is to keep it up and hope someone else screws up to the level of being a better lynch. TBH, I was more uncomfortable about Rubicon putting up both his buddies as scum. Do you have a meta link for that that is worth looking at?

I know that Rubicon loves to scummily interact with his scumbuddies - pressuring them a bit then backing off.

https://forums.darklordpotter.net/showt ... hp?t=23824
https://forums.darklordpotter.net/showt ... hp?t=24369

Read his posts - Battle School might be better based on how short his appearance was. His scumbuddy that he pushed on early in the first game was Bill Door. The second was SmileOfTheKill and Typhon.

[Elyse]

Just because you want the game to end does not mean Titus isn't scum. She's scum regardless. Don't let her try to twist the two together.

We can win AND end the game.

[Tajun]

Ugh, off site meta... Okay, decided I don't care. I'd recommend reading Apozzle's interactions with Elyse and DBK. I don't get too much from them, but I'd be a bit surprised if obviously new-ish scum Apozzle put one of his buddies (Elyse) down as his only town read. Never know though, and Elyse's entrance to that wagon was probably sketchier than DBK's.

I dunno. I'm about 85% sure on this, so if you are completely convinced Elyse is the scum then let me know. Otherwise, I see some evidence both ways, but the balance of it (and my gut) are telling me to stay where I am.

[Titus]

Tajun, the last post by Elyse should set off alarm bells. It seemed at the point where you wanted information. Yet, Elyse is pressuring to end the day and cut off the conversation. Also, why are you supposing Apozzle was new? He could just be new to the site. After all, I have/had some "new player" tendencies but I'm used to 24 hour days before posting on here.

[Elyse]

I'm not pressuring to end the day at all. Reread my post.

I'm saying that voting for you doesn't mean he wants to end the day. They aren't mutual. They're separate.

[Titus]

I read it fine. It's saying, end the day. We'll win. Don't let Titus convince you rational discussion is the way to go.

[Elyse]

I read it fine. It's saying, end the day. We'll win.

Don't let Titus convince you rational discussion is the way to go.

Please show me where I say the bolded.

Come on Proph. This is awful and made up.

[Titus]

All that stuff about ending the game. That is an attempt to cut off discussion. I'm hardly making it up. You're basically artfully saying, end the damn game already.

[Prophylaxis]

Working at this bit by bit.

Apozzle Interactions

Apozzle votes DBK, which, as I previously said, scum like to vote their buddies for subconscious distancing.

DBK
Does he always post this much? I always wonder about this because the first time I ever played the most prolific player was scum. He seems to be scumhunting. He also seems to be pretty quick to draw, and just as quick to change his target, which concerns me slightly.

Elyse
What was up before this week? You posted twice: once at the start, then one where you just changed your vote for "gut". Were you just prod dodging up until now? Avoiding that period of the game where there was not much to focus on?

Fencesitty opinions. Elyse comment looks like coaching.

As for town reads? Still too early. Elyse might be close.

Puts Elyse in his town list prematurely.

If you can't deal with Jason, then I would replace out.

He's not even being that aggressive.

There is a difference between aggressively pursuing someone as a suspect, and being unpleasant and unreasoning. I found the tone of his first response to me to be unpleasant. In the following responses he is literally accusing me of being scum because I asked him to tone down his responses so that I could discuss things with him rationally and avoid future emotional bias (a concept which he seems to refuse to try and understand). The discussion is clearly alignment neutral and based on my personal response to his behaviour, but he persists with the idea that it makes me scum. There is no logic or evidence in any of his responses.

Your posts are starting to look dodgy, Elyse. Single line posts, no detailed discussion. It seems like you dropped your activity after managing to break the wagon on KBW and achieving a town read for yourself from a few people. Do you have anything to say about that?

Switches back on Elyse again.

Is this interaction genuine, Tajun? If it is, then I have no qualms voting Titus.

It reads fairly genuine to me.

RachMarie Interactions

Talks to DBK about going after low-hanging fruit. Could be distancing?

Overall think Elyse is town but a couple things: Why defending Key so much? I realize he is good vig bait in games that have one. and that he is more likely to be town and just VI, but you can't rule out that he could be scum as well. How can you be so sure? Also how can you be sure we have an SK and why are you so sure that it is BY? So still leaning Town but with those concerns.

Elsye how am I a counter wagon to Chen? I just started playing and there were already votes on my pred, I presume cause of his play. Let me get the link to the game where I played with Appozle might give you all a better idea of how he plays.

Hm.

I will place my vote by the end of today.

Tags fixed. ~Zaicon

[Titus]

Prophy, that statement about 251 makes no sense. Scum don't have legitimate FoSes. He was distancing. Those are buddy interactions. Town read. Distance. Fenceshitty. It is practically a guide for scum FoSing of a buddy. Weak reason in a spot where Elyse is not likely to get lynched.

[Elyse]

Prophy, that statement about 251 makes no sense. Scum don't have legitimate FoSes. He was distancing. Those are buddy interactions. Town read. Distance. Fenceshitty. It is practically a guide for scum FoSing of a buddy. Weak reason in a spot where Elyse is not likely to get lynched.

That is most definitely NOT textbook scum FoSing.

It's scummy to fluctuate on a read so often. Why would be do that with a buddy? It makes no sense.

[Tajun]

I got the feeling he was trying to buddy Elyse, and switched to attacking her when she didn't start to buddy back. Definitely not scum scum interactions in that interpretation. Could always be that he didn't know how to treat a buddy though. DBK views are wishy washy, not saying much to him, which reads better as buddy buddy to me. Then again, everything I am seeing is probably through the eyes of conf bias, so make your own decisions.

It was more these comments from DBK that interest me:

258: Noting because this could be associative if Apozzle flips scum; I don’t see why Jason needs to even tone it down, and Jacob takes Apozzle’s side?

261 through 263 is even worse. Jacob may have the meta to say he doesn’t read back into games he’s replaced, but Blue Yoshi’s been here since the start and all he mentions at this point is game theory.

(and a line in 262…I feel like it’s obvious what I’m talking about so I’ll just shut up now.)

as scum like to tie their buddies to townies. This, and the fact that Apozzle was defending DBK while disagreeing with him early on (post 61). I think on balance these interactions favour a DBK scumbuddy over Elyse.

[Prophylaxis]

Rubicon Interactions

Rubicon labels DBK scum without real reasoning.

He mostly focuses on Bacde and sorta-responds to RBD D2. I see it as Rubicon's classic bad distancing.

He then clears RBD of having no gun.

Think that's all of the interactions between them, I think. Rubicon sorta-pressures RBD but never votes her.

Let's end this.

Unvote, vote Titus

Elyse, if you're scum, congratulations. I'll remember to trust my gut better next time.

[Elyse]

YAY!!!

You made the right choice!!!

I'm town. We won!!! Finally this marathon of a game is OVER.

[Prophylaxis]

High five.

I need to work better on my endgame.

[Light-kun]

Titus has been lynched. Flavor is dead, but he was the last mafia.

"Well Ryuk, I guess even the insane can get lucky and kill the right people. Even if most of the normal individuals had to die first."

Prophylaxis: Townie
Elyse: Townie
Tajun: Townie
Titus: JoT Mafia

Mafia discussion: http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/bLqw7kidujQNB
No dead topic.
Night actions by role:
I don't have access to game notes. I will post this when my personal laptop is operational.


Sorry that this game has been one giant ball of what can ruin L-K's life and by proxy this game. Still, I hope someone had a good time. Congratulations town.

[Titus]

Damn it. So close. I did the best I could.

[Elyse]

You did well Titus, seriously. It was a shame that the length of this game drove me to apathy, but you had spunk the whole time.

[goodmorning]

So it's finally over? That was a long one. Nice play from Titus there.