Fallout Mafia - Commonwealth Edition (Day 8)

[ManWithNoName]

I have not stopped sorting using the general posting of people.

For instance, I am going to keep an eye on Maria's votes throughout the game because of what she is posting. She is on my list of never lynch until after some flips, though.

[Ouroboros]

when "shade" is a pointless buzzword that means nothing other than "having more than one scumread and saying you lean scum on a player that you aren't voting when someone says you should give an opinion on said player" yes, what I did was shade.

No.

Shade in the fact that you both some them as scummy, but didn't push or try to figure your reads out on either slot.

Ghost

[Ankamius]

Hey Ghost, while you're here:

I'm hard-townreading your slot due to RC, but why do the posts in

your

half of the hydra feel so weird to me? Is there something about your combined play that I'm missing or am I sensing playstyle clashes?

[Ouroboros]

i could hop on wilky wagon but i want to resolve tchill first

This is basically hedging your bets on one or the other if or when a flip occurs and that is what I'm referring to as shade. Admittedly, your lack of a push could be because you've been absent, but your TChill vote came from page one, which was obviously before TChill claimed hider.

So, what is there left to resolve about TChill?

Ghost

Pedit:

Hmm?

I don't necessarily agree with all of RC's lynch pool, if that's what you're referring to?

[Ouroboros]

I'll do this but I don't feel like efforting so the efforting can wait.

It's a lot less mentally strenuous to push things than it is to talk about them.

[Ouroboros]

FWIW I hold the opposite opinion of RC on 654.

Ghost

[REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE]

@Ouro:

I don't know if appeal to fear is a thing.

Subject: Twin Trap (Game Over) [TM2015]

confirmed wrong post game.

I fucking invented this trick.

Screaming about how I'm going to shove a player's ineptitude down their throat in end game. All the while I was scum trying to stir paranoia.

Talk about an appeal to fear. It's fucking classic.

MAN says otherwise

[REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE]

see i don't want to push ETL anymore because she's doing the exact thing that RC does as town (and sometimes as scum) which is literally

"you are scumreading me and you are trying to piss me off and I can't stand a push on me and im so mad so if you push me i will powerlynch you"

I don't want to deal with this then end up having ETL town


i'm still down to MANwagon verylazy

[REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE]

MANread of the day:

ankamius is town

[REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE]

keep those MANreads jotted down in your notebooks, kids, because when you review them postgame they're usually correct

[Impossibear]

Jungle, talk to me a minute. How well do you know me? How well do you know ETL? Do you have a reason to believe you can read ETL?

[Impossibear]

see i don't want to push ETL anymore because she's doing the exact thing that RC does as town (and sometimes as scum) which is literally

"you are scumreading me and you are trying to piss me off and I can't stand a push on me and im so mad so if you push me i will powerlynch you"

I don't want to deal with this then end up having ETL town


i'm still down to MANwagon verylazy

Scared. Scum.

If you actually knew me at all and knew how to read me, you'd be doing more than this cautious bullshit, and if you were actually town, you'd be trying to figure me out instead of just pissing me off.

And stop fucking comparing me to RC. We're not the same person and using his tells to read me is utter fucking bullshit. Not to mention the cowardice of hiding behind this lame alt and claiming some kind of knowledge of me in order to gain the confidence of other people in the thread. You clearly know nothing at all.

And for the record, I'm not pissed because I'm being scumread, that comes with the territory. I'm pissed because you're a jackass who is deliberately seeking to irritate me.

ETL

[Wraith]

Really don't understand the players fixated on a D1 lurker lynch

[REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE]

Jungle, talk to me a minute. How well do you know me? How well do you know ETL? Do you have a reason to believe you can read ETL?

was about to leave for work but i'll answer this last question because i saw it last minute on my phone

unfortunately i no longer have time to engage live with you but we'll find another session

i'll give you the following statements and you draw your own conclusions. these statements are confirmed to be true on my MAN's word and honor, even if it risks outing my MAN's secret identity. I have to balance the two
---

of the following group of three: sthar8/Jingle/ETL, I am least familiar with Jingle.

I was considering making this meme alt dedicated to ETL instead of RC pre-game, but decided not to, because of the fact that ETL would probably be even less receptive to the idea than she currently is now, even though this meme alt is meant to troll RC and not ETL, although ETL believes otherwise.

I am deliberately meme alting and not revealing my identity to ETL as well as RC for the purposes of this game. I may or may not do so postgame.

[REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE]

4. the decision to meme alt for the purposes of this game was decided pre-game, and is therefore not indicative of alignment

5. i'm town

[REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE]

see i don't want to push ETL anymore because she's doing the exact thing that RC does as town (and sometimes as scum) which is literally

"you are scumreading me and you are trying to piss me off and I can't stand a push on me and im so mad so if you push me i will powerlynch you"

I don't want to deal with this then end up having ETL town


i'm still down to MANwagon verylazy

Scared. Scum.

If you actually knew me at all and knew how to read me, you'd be doing more than this cautious bullshit, and if you were actually town, you'd be trying to figure me out instead of just pissing me off.

And stop fucking comparing me to RC. We're not the same person and using his tells to read me is utter fucking bullshit. Not to mention the cowardice of hiding behind this lame alt and claiming some kind of knowledge of me in order to gain the confidence of other people in the thread. You clearly know nothing at all.

And for the record, I'm not pissed because I'm being scumread, that comes with the territory. I'm pissed because you're a jackass who is deliberately seeking to irritate me.

ETL

i just dont want to shit up the thread playing cat and mouse with you when you can be easily sorted with an investigative action. you said it yourself. and the last thing i want is for you to replace out. please understand, thanks.

[REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE]

half of me is curious to see how far I can progress with ETL in this game without showing/having to bring out my "Badge of ETL's Approval"

clearly a rough start but the MAN will make this work out

[Ankamius]

Happy Scumday Ank!

While I appreciate the long-overdue attempt at content, there wasn't actually much "content" there, tbh. I'm gonna need more explanation on those reads, not just how strong they are.

I'm actually not willing to go into every single read I have here right now, but I'm open to discussing specific ones if you have a preference.

Also, ETL, just as a quick note because this is directly relevant to me: how do you generally get your reads? I remember you being a fairly strong player but I want to get an idea as to why our general thoughts have been polar opposites this game.

I've actually posted about this in mafia discussion, but basically I prefer to townhunt first as scumreads take much longer for me to develop. The other reason is because being able to work together with your town reads makes for a very strong town that is tough to breakup outside of straight killing the members of the townblock, and can spell doom for the scumteam.

Which thoughts in particular are we "polar opposites" on? Let's talk about them.

Reference Post

Early Alchemist Posts: A big source of my scumread on Alchemist came from these posts, actually. I'm not liking the way he came out onto the miller point so fast after the game started; I especially do not like his answer to Ghost regarding davesaz' play since I don't remember him ever being particularly active or a big player in the game he's in; him specifically focusing on him not being scum pings in light of that. I really didn't like #21 either.

Early Kaede+MariaR Interactions: Opposite reaction here too; this is where my MariaR townread started, specifically #35; something about the early miller talks feels way off and I liked the attempt to push discussion away from that.

Alchemist #63: This is a big one; Alchemist hit a huge scumvibe with this post, although primarily combined with his #55 (which I independently found scummy). Alchemist hasn't felt genuine in these posts at all, I've been getting posturing vibes off these posts if anything.

Ouroboros #71: This is the beginning of the Ouroboros townread for me; this happens a

lot

throughout the game so far, but there's been a lot of instances where I have a reaction to a specific post and see an RC post detailing that exact same thought 1/3 down the page. In this particular instance, RC misspoke; he was referring to the multitude of people having him claim first after the second miller claim, and the post RC is referring to looks like a huge backpedal, like he's realizing he just fucked up.

What the shit is this...: This is a playstyle quirk I use; it has a very specific purpose that pays off very well when I get the reaction I want from it. It mostly didn't this game, sadly. There's another subpoint in here that achieves the same thing, but I don't want to reveal exactly what it is because then it won't work anymore.

Post 101 VC: Up to this point, of the four people on the wagon that aren't me, one is conftown and the other two are the people I have strong townreads on. As an aside, I wasn't scumreading Wilky at that time.

Post 163: I 100% agreed with RC here. The votes weren't necessarily there, but MWWN's trajectory onto the wagon, Ramcius' one-liner shading the claim, and davesaz suddenly hopping on all within a very short window raised some eyebrows with me too.

Overall, I think the issue you're having with RC is the same one I'm having with you; I think the analysis looks townish because I don't really see any scum motivation from it... but I don't understand the points you're making themselves.

Post 171: I agree with this assessment, all I can really add is that I think all of Ramcius' posts around this spot look really bad.

MariaR 259: I agree here too, but I actually think it's just her falling into the Nero-is-wrong-therefore-scum trap. I can't follow like 80% of what Nero posts in every game we play and I've probably fallen into that same trap before. I've mostly learned to read him through other ways but I'm suspecting MariaR doesn't have a whole lot of experience with him.

Post 266: I think this entire exchange between the two has been pretty pointless. I don't see why Nero's posting there is any more sensical than MariaR's, honestly.

Post 301: One of the instances where I disagreed with RC; I've generally agreed with his scumreads and not his townreads this game.

[hebichan]

I'm not scum reading manwithnoname that hard right now, he seems to be scumhunting, which I don't think many scum players try to play up this early day one.

I dunno, I feel vent more at the moment, but you could case him if you like. I could probably be swayed.

Hebi, who specifically are you referring to here?

Anyone who is scumreading him, specifically REALMAN

[Ankamius]

Also, thank you ETL!

[Impossibear]

Aight. I'll work on reading you. FWIW, I'm not sure that we're worth the investigate, but I'll take conftown status if someone wants to give it to us. You should know that ETL will obvtown eventually if town. It's how she do. I'd far prefer they use it on RC or an actually unreadable slot. You clearly don't have the experience to get her to rage read level, so your best bet is going to be to leave her to her devices and see what falls out when she's got her feet under her.

I think I've got her calmed down enough to the point that she's not hatebonering for your lynch, but I'd REALLY suggest against making a meme alt to mess with her. She despises alts who try to meta read her and will not respond well. I think I have enough information to figure out your identity. I will do so over the weekend, and decide whether your progression makes sense for the level of knowledge you actually have on her. I don't out secret alts without permission as a rule, so you have my word that whatever I come up with will remain a secret, but I WILL use the information to read you if I can. At the moment, assuming my read of your familiarity with ETL is correct you're probably town. If you're either FAR more familiar or FAR less, that's pretty much the opposite.

I think I've also talked her out of running to your house tonight with pitchforks and torches for the lols of it.

Tchill is pretty much lockscum, imo. I'm genuinely considering proxying our vote to RC in exchange for that wagon today. In either case,

@RC: First, I'm sorry for inning despite saying I wouldn't. ETL asked me to hydra and I didn't notice you on the playerlist. I'm actively going to try to prevent this game from being toxic because I respect you as a person and I REALLY don't want to have to deal with the emotional rollercoaster that was KH. I'd like to ask you to let me know if I do anything to piss you off, and I will afford you the same courtesy. Who knows, maybe we can prove to each other that we CAN be civil in a game for once.

Haven't had the time to go over ETL's wraith case, but she seems really confident and is concerned that no one's voting there with her, so I need to check for dogthoughts and get back to her on that.

People who think ETL is an asshole are hilarious, and clearly haven't ever played with a real asshole.

RC has a not a case on a player, to the surprise of literally no one, and a pile of sheeps following. I'll ISO and figure that shit out ASAP.

Anything else I need to actually give a shit about while I have the time?

~Jingle

[GuyInFreezer]

VC 1.04

Tchill13 (2):

verylazy, davesaz

wilky (1):

Tchill13

Ramcius (3):

wilky, Ventriloquist, Alchemist21

Nero Cain (2):

Dunnstral, Ramcius

MariaR (1):

Nero Cain

Ventriloquist (6):

Ouroboros, hebichan, REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE, ManWithNoName, MariaR, Wraith

verylazy (1):

Kaede Akamatsu

ManWithNoName (1):

Ankamius

Wraith (1):

Impossibear

Not Voting:

None

With

18

alive,

10

to lynch

Deadline: (expired on 2018-05-20 12:33:41)

@GIF, A VC PLEASE?

Morning shift is a terrible thing.

Let me know if I missed anything. That was a lot of pages to count.

[Ankamius]

And how exactly do you play the game?? You asked me about my process, I think it's only fair you discuss yours.

My playstyle is really difficult to explain, but I'll try my best.

If I can generally grasp what scum is trying to do pretty easily, then I try to pair people's actions against that and see who most consistently matches it.
If I am seeing scum influence throughout the game but can't piece it together very well, then I do the same, but it's a lot more jagged and my reads usually shift around a lot.
If I can't tell what scum are doing at all (or there's so much noise that it's completely hidden), then I'm probably either deathtunneling random slots or lurking for weeks on end.

I don't want to go into too much more detail; I have a lot of tricks I use to help brute force people to give me more of the above, but they're the types of things that become a lot more difficult to use once they're directly known.

Generally though, I withhold information because it's a lot easier to fit actions into a narrative if you know what the narrative is. I've found that I tend to get the lynches I want much more often when I dance around the perimeter of my reads and prod at it; I don't usually make cases or go into scumreads too often outside of gut or similar because generally that's all I have; anything more than that just gives them more possibilities to find an out.

[Ankamius]

Alright, I think the huge 1v1fest starts shortly after that. I skimmed it before, but is it worth reading through again? I don't want to spend all day reading through this if it's going to result in a lot of nothing.

[Ramcius]

GiF

my vote should be on Nero